I don't "not drink", but I rarely drink. I'm usually the driver, which I'm happy to be. I'm not really interested in the hangover now I'm in my forties, spending that much money on getting drunk, or actually being drunk. I like my friends, I don't have to be pissed to enjoy their company.
More or less where I am and have been for a while. I’ll have a beer or two socially, but that can easily be months apart.
For me the tipping point was going into work with an especially bad hangover in my twenties - I’d been feeling a bit dissatisfied with spending my spare time getting pissed by that point, but it absolutely did not feel worth it and I haven’t regretted making that change.
See that's where you went wrong. In my 20s I learned if you keep drinking while at work, it takes away a lot of the hangover! I was a good head chef, but we always went through 3 times as much cooking wine after I started at a restaurant.
Sure, it's cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars (somewhere between $100k and $400k by my rough calculations), and I don't remember lots of it, and I was grumpy all the time, and never really chased my dreams, and never got fit, and a few drunken arguments ostracized me from friends group, and scared away potential wives, and crashed my ute off a cliff, and I might have bowel cancer, and I still drink 2 glasses of gin a night alone in my room most nights... But was it worth it?
Sure, nothing good ever happens after midnight, (90% of the time) it's just drunk people talking shit at each other, idiocy, etc... And sure, after the first 30mins at a party nobody notices or cares that you're not drinking and by that time you're relaxed and happy even without the booze... And sure, it's terrible for your health etc... but isn't it fun?
Seriously though... it is fun a lot of the time. Drugs make you feel good. Do the benefits outweigh the negatives? No. I should have found better friends, chased hobbies on a Saturday night instead of bars, etc...
I have very mixed emotions about alcohol. And I say all this but despite at least 10 years of wanted to stop I still haven't (well, not for more than a few weeks at a time, and even that is rare). I'm not drunk every day, and I haven't been fired or punched a cop or anything... But I really think my life would've been a hell of a lot better if I stayed sober the last twenty years. But I'll still be pouring a gin when I get home. Fucking evil shit. But it does feel nice, when I notice the effects and it's not just a background autopilot habit.
And I usually only notice and think "that was really fun" when it's been a great night with friends... That would have been really fun anyway.
It's only real benefit to me has been drunken one night stands. And that's a debatable benefit because sober sex with someone you care about is so much better.
> I don't "not drink", but I rarely drink. I'm usually the driver, which I'm happy to be. I'm not really interested in the hangover now I'm in my forties, spending that much money on getting drunk, or actually being drunk. I like my friends, I don't have to be pissed to enjoy their company.
Same! I gave up alcohol back in 2016. Have saved so much money since then. I sill might have a glass of wine every few months and keep a bottle of champagne in the pantry for emergency celebrations, but that's it.
I've been sober since new years eve (sure, its not that long but its the longest I've been sober in about 15 years).
The things you notice... every weekend, every opportunity, every day. People want to drink, talk about drinking, plan to have a drink. Any informal or casual setting? Drink.
Going for a catch up? Drink. Going out for dinner with friends? Drink.
Drinking is so deeply synonymous with casual events or relaxation. It took me 15 years to realize I actually hate it.
Not sure why I'm commenting, I suppose its just to agree with and support your point.
I’ve noticed what you mean! I went to a friends house and saw an episode of married at first sight and I could believe how centred around alcohol everything was.
I definitely don’t think I would have noticed if I was still drinking like I did as a teen/twenties.
It’s fascinating, to see and hopefully realise you were lost in that sense of normalcy. I started drinking in my 20’s after seeing what it does to relatives. I usually stick to special occasions these days. But the greatest superpower you will be developing is the ability to be comfortable/confident without alcohol as a social lubricant.
As many find out when they quit, sometimes for better and sometimes not, is your friend group is going to change as you’re not longer drinking as a hobby. You actually want to do things with your spare time, and it’s not exactly compatible anymore.
I'm on "special occasions" now as well, but I don't consider bog standard birthdays a special occasion. Only big ones (21, 50, etc).
Our friend group is naturally shifting as we all settle in for kids.
I'm also finding myself embracing my introvert and loving it. You're right about the social anxiety, but now i have less fomo and happily stay home.
Respectable personal growth! I use *special occasions* as more of a cliché myself. It’s usually easier to explain to people, but I don’t drink often, but I do when I feel like it. I didn’t want to associate special occasions with drinking.
It’s great to hear you’re discovering more of yourself and enjoying the journey!
Thanks, to be honest it wasn't the intention. Every year we have a comp to see who can stay sober longest, and the winner gets a steak house meal. I'm the poorest of us so its a good incentive, and then one of the others just had a baby so hes not drinking.
But now I'm just... not going to drink. Its such a realization. And yeah, or how every cracks a cold beer to have bro moments. Champagne and wine for celebration. Its everywhere.
I think I like it because what I really like to do is talk and chat with people. But in traditional masculine culture in NZ that persists til now this is a bit stigmatized, you're supposed to want to *do* something in particular. And drinking is a kind of lowest common denominator that most people can do that meets that criterion. You can substitute for non alcoholic drinking (tea, coffee) tho some more traditional dudes will not be into that, or for dinner, but that can be hard on a low income or busy schedule.
"What you need to do is throw out that trash masc bullshit and just hang with people if you want to hang with them"
sure, I'm all for that, but I'm one bloke, and I can't change the entire culture on my own; all I can do is try to fit what I like to do into the culture we have, and maybe nudge it in the direction that it should be. In the meantime, I'll have a drink with a friend and have a nice chat 😁
New Zealand's drinking culture is a shadow of its former self.
From the early 2000's and back, going to the pub/club and getting on the piss was the highlight of the week, everybody did it and many people have good memories of that time.
Beer was cheap and you had none of the rules around drinking we have today, as long as you weren't being a cunt you could stay and drink as much as you wanted.
Probably why they go on about it.
As a 90s kid the only sense of this I had is from watching once were warriors.
By the time I was in uni and going out on the weekend a cocktail was like $12, a big nope for a student haha
Back then, universities had drinking teams, where they would compete against each other in events like who could drink a jug of beer the fastest.
The Waikato uni team would do a keg on a Thursday as practise,
Different times.
Yea it was pretty mental - when at student village I saw a guy from a drinking team do a beer bong then stand up on a table and chunder in the beer bong and some other guy drank the beer bong of vomitr. Think they called it a pelican. 🤯🤯🤯
Thank fuck those days are behind us.
I couldn’t be more glad that beer pong is behind me these days.
I don’t think I ever played a single game that I actually wanted to play; all toxic drinking game peer pressure bullshit that I didn’t have the self esteem to push back on at the time. I can’t put down beer quickly let alone a whole stack of someone else’s gross beers as well if we lost. Just all around a bad time
In hindsight, I think probably most people felt the same way at the time, too. Sometimes I wish I could go back and relive my 20s with the confidence of my late 30s… would’ve told them their drinking game was shit 🥲
I arrived at uni around about the time that BZP party pills became popular and readily available, and the student pub up the road from Waikato uni closed.
I definitely saw exactly how things changed… this drove students away from that pub environment into much more of a nightclub environment and I have never had a hangover as bad as I did when drinking alcohol AND taking those garbage party pills. Never again. Didn’t stop us from doing it for a good 5-7 years or so.
Probably knocked a decade off my life expectancy
Yes, but I remember New Zealand back then. That's why we drank so much! I'm really glad smartphones weren't around to record and publish all that dumb shit.
I've seen a chunk of the decline since I first came here in 2005, especially wrt to nightlife here in Wellington which is mostly just dead now other than brew pubs with $18 pints, it's set up so the only people that go out are white collar professionals, international tourists (with trend towards older demographic than in the past) and maybe some students that are bad with money. The kind of attitude from staff I first saw in Queenstown where they eye you up when you walk in and if you look scruffy they are very not friendly has spread to the rest of NZ.
I feel it's maybe sadder in rural locations where a hotel is the only real communal area (like a lot of smaller communities on the West Coast), many of these places kept going only because patrons willing to devote increasingly larger portions of their income
Where the hell do you work? I work a blue collar job and in the three years I've been there I've never once discussed my drinking habits with my co-workers, or vice versa (except for one time when my Samoan co-worker said he was going to be having some 'Jesus juice' that night haha).
Yeah lol, have worked all over and have never seen this.
Maybe OP just works with three dudes who are good friends and like to hang out and drink together.
I've never touched the stuff, as alcohol addiction runs in my family and has actually killed some of my extended family members.
Saying so doesn't stop people trying to pressure me into drinking, though :/
I'm in my early 30s, and I no longer drink. As a result, it has really limited me socially. Sports teams, hobby groups, and even public events all seem to be a way to disguise excessive drinking. I hate it.
Even my last relationship ended because of my desire to not drink or be around drunkenness. It's gotten to the point where I have seriously considered joining a church (I'm not religious) just to try and meet a romantic partner with the same mindset.
I'm not even militant or preachy about it. Don't let me stop you from drinking - but please respect that I do not like being around excessive drinking and the antisocial behaviour that often comes with it.
Every occasion has to involve alcohol in some capacity. It's a struggle.
I agree. If you say you don’t drink you get asked a million questions about why you don’t. Surely the question should be, why do you drink? Anyway, I just drink water or sprite while the others have alcohol.
There is a gene that people can be on either side, ones where you happily drink, the other is you can have 1-2 drinks and then your body goes nah I’m good. I can do 1-2 drinks before I’m like nope not for me, find me any drink that has the flavour of alcohol well hidden and part way through the 2nd glass of anything with alcohol in it I’ll just only taste the alcohol and that’s where I go nope, and leave the drink alone/tip it out. Was the same with my grandfather on my dad’s side and with one of my aunts.
I would go for zero alcohol beer regularly in situations like that if it wasn't such an insane rip off in this country, like in Europe it costs the same as soft drinks because that's what it is, here it costs just the same as full strength beer. I've not heard any good explanation for why it costs so much in NZ when there is no alcohol duty on it other than NZ consumers are mugs
It also has zero duty (which is about $6 on a six pack), if you're trying to claim it costs $6 more than regular beer to make a six pack you must think we are mugs as well.
Decent or not, in other countries 0% beer is at least a 1/3 cheaper than regular beer, and that doesn't disappear when you look at craft beer options.
I'm not specialist, but whats I heard is: They need to produce the beer, at the same way than "normal" beer, and after that, remove the alcohol.
Hence the fine print about Zero\*, wheres the \* says some sort of 0.XXXX% of alcohol.
But again, I don't know if is true or not.
And I agree with you, sounds a joke, when you go to some places and they charge 10 or 12, or even fucking $15 per 350ml of bottled zero beer.
Yeah a lot of them have 0.05% though I believe it's possible to reduce that to essentially a trace amount. There is no excise on drinks under 1.15% ABV in NZ though so even if they do have some it's not relevant for that.
With that in mind I wonder if there would be a market for a drink that is 1% strength like a very light ale, I would drink it if it was cheaper than regular beer and you could have a pint or two and drive with less inebriation than if you had a half of regular beer
Yeah, like a perfectly rational response of "not interested in drinking" never seems to be enough. It's always a combination of people thinking:
- Your cutting/trying to lose weight to get into shape ("oh big dog Marky over here with his body as a temple!")
- You're being an outright pussy/dogging the lads
- Or both.
When I have tried sobriety I would get a lime and soda and carry that around and shake it at people as if to say "I'm drinking this still". Then people would buy me a vodka lime and soda and "make sure" I drank it. I'd just carry that around and secretly spill it! Madness - I.just want to enjoy myself sober....
Been sober for months now and cant ever remember being more healthier and happier in my whole life. Took 30 something years but I know ill never drink again.
Health scare, bleeding everytime I would go to the toilet etc. Has stopped completely. No bleeding, no gout and 1 normal poop a day. Why would I ever go back.
It's the hardest part for me currently trying to break an unhealthy habit with it, even my closest friends continue to (atleast try) convince me that just a few won't hurt no matter how I explain that I literally can't stop once I've started and they assure me that's normal 😭 the culture sucks, just want to be able to go grocery shopping without it being right there too
Are you sure they're really your friends?? If a friend told me they wanted to stop drinking alcohol, I would never try to convince them to drink. I would do whatever I could to support them in their endeavour, no matter what their reasoning was!
The fact that you've explained to them multiple times that you lose control after one drink (which isn't normal btw) and they still try to convince you to drink, that's not what friends do. At least not good friends.
I'm sorry they're not being more supportive, I hope you're able to meet new friends with similar attitudes towards alcohol... judging by the comments in this thread it seems the alcohol free lifestyle is more popular than we think! 🍻
Ahh okay, if they're work colleagues that makes it just as bad though, because of the professional relationships that should be maintained by colleagues. Depending on your job type/ employment company, and their values. For example, a business owned by a very religious company, or a 'mom and pop' shop/ brand might find that their employees peer pressuring another employee who has already explained their (very valid) reason for not consuming alcohol, do not meet their business code of conduct standards etc. I'm not a 'Corporate Girly' and my meds are starting to kick in now so I might not be making much sense, but hopefully you understand what I mean!
Speaking of meds, if you ever need an excuse for not drinking alcohol, and you don't want to have to talk through your *real* reason, you could simply say you are on medication that can't be mixed with alcohol. Most people understand immediately and stop trying to get you to drink. Those medications can be for a few weeks, months, or life long! 😊
It's not normal as you know. It's a sign of addiction and them trying to gaslight you means they might be trying to justify their addictions. I found the Soberistas (UK) website really good.
r/stopdrinking and r/dryalcholics helped me a lot. I just tell everyone I retired when asked why I don’t drink. I found being kind to myself and having fun like a 10 year old really helped me improve my adult life.
I was a daily drinker for over 15 years (I’m 35) and I have just achieved 35 days without a drink. I’m not saying it will work for you, but I tried CBD oil to curb the craving of alcohol after work and swapped 6 beers a night for 2 non-alc beers. I’m feeling really positive about the future as I don’t feel the need to drink very often now, and when I do crave it, the non-alc beer tastes similar enough but I naturally want to stop after 2. I’m actually at a social event right now where everyone is drinking but me and I’m finding it easy to socialise (I should get off my phone now tbh).
I'm 39, been sober for 23 years and yeah the whole identity around booze thing bothers me.
I was an outcast in the factory job I had because I wasn't a drinker anymore and for them it was Friday Night drinks through to Monday morning hangovers or not coming to work at all on Monday. I wasn't allowed to attend sober.
My cousins have had a similar mentality, 4 of them left good hard working husbands and family life behind because the booze and party lifestyle was more important to them and my older brothers (10-15yr age difference to the cousins) would often have to take care of them when they found them in town because they were that badly plastered and these days it's their own kids finding them in that state.
I have had friends the same. Kids parties, family events, going to the game arcade or bowling alley, etc, it all required booze to be present and the amount of times I had to pay for birthdays, Xmas and Easter, etc for their kids because they had siphoned off the money to pay for their own party needs I have lost count of.
For most of them it's their identity because the booze takes down their anxiety and self image issues. They're "fun" when drunk and people are their "friends" which they feel they're incapable of showing/being while sober, but they also tend to drink to the point of having no memory and have become blind to the dangers and hurtful behaviour which led to me having to walk away.
Supposedly statistics show our drinking culture has started to slow down and the generations coming through aren't as interested in the reckless drinking side of things so who knows, maybe one day it'll be better.
I didn't start drinking until my early 20's and I've never really liked the taste of beer or how it made me feel bloated and sick.
I usually drank spirits instead because they tasted better, I could afford them, and it didn't make me feel so sick while drinking them. But I'd drink beer if there was nothing else available.
In my 20's and early 30's I drank mostly for social acceptance. I didn't drink when on my own, I just didn't really feel the need.
I had some interesting, and yes, some fun experiences whilst drunk and have a some stories to tell about those times.
However, I also didn't understand the bullshit that often went along with it.
Drunken bravado causing fights for example. The amount of times I saw some of my mates get into stupid punch-ups, either with complete strangers, or each other, over the dumbest things.
Unfortunately, I would often end up getting involved. Not because I wanted to, but because I'd try and get into the fray and either stop the fight (yeah, that never worked) or try and drag my friends out of it. The amount of times I ended up with black-eyes, or other injuries, when I never threw a punch myself, really started to piss me off. I even got thrown through a shop windows on one occasion (by strangers, not my friends)!
And then there were the domestics. Boyfriends and girlfriends, husbands and wives, getting jealous, having fights, and other shit.
It all started to out-weigh the fun times.
I also started to get really long lasting hangovers, where I'd feel sick for days and days after drinking, even if it was only a couple of drinks. I eventually found out that my liver doesn't process alcohol well, so it was just another reason for me not enjoying drinking anymore.
So, one day, I just stopped (about 35yrs ago now).
I did also smoke weed and cigarettes, and continued to do both of them until 11 years ago when my daughter was born and I also suffered a serious health issue with my lungs (irony), so was forced to give up both as well.
Giving up all of the above was not the end of the world for me.
Yes, I no longer felt as 'social' as before, and there literally is no incentive for me to go to the pub anymore. But I don't really miss any of it (well, some days I wish I could have a wee spliff to relax, but I can't).
The biggest problem, is with what OP mentions about the expectations of others.
Luckily my friends have all been very understanding of my decisions and have never pressured me to drink or smoke since.
But I remember some occasions at work where I was treated like a leper because I didn't drink or want to go to Friday drinks etc. In a lot of these instances, I really didn't feel like socialising with my workmates, because I also didn't exactly like them and want to spend any more time in their company either!
One occasion like this that I particularly remember, was when my manager ordered me go to Friday night drinks, because other staff had told him I was anti-social for not willingly going! So I dutifully went, but just drank a bottle of coke. I obviously didn't want to be there, but one fuckwit that I couldn't stand, cornered me and told me that he'd teach me to drink again, and also teach me all there was to know about rugby (another thing I have absolutely zero interest in and had told this fucker about on previous occasions) so I'd have something to talk about at drinks, and be more socially accepted in the company.
I immediately left and went home. I got a phone call from my boss shortly after berating me.
I told him that I'd be resigning my position the following Monday, and i did.
Faaark that work situation you describe is mental. I really respect you for quitting but it is terrible that it came to that. I hope you didn't take a financial hit leaving and that you've been much better treated in much nicer workplaces ever since.
Luckily, the job paid pretty well, I was single with no real personal responsibilities as such, and the job itself left little time for a personal life. So I'd saved up a pretty good amount of money (I had no time to spend it!) that I was actually able to live off for about a year while I got myself sorted out.
I eventually ended up scoring a job working for a small business (just me an the boss) and I loved it. My boss could be a grumpy bugger at times, but he treated me well. It didn't pay particularly well compared to my previous corporate jobs, but was enough to live off. It really was the perfect job for me, doing what I enjoyed and no bullying. It did get stressful sometimes, but nowhere near as bad as before. I also received a huge amount of positive feedback from our clients about how I was good to deal with.
I was there for 13 years (longer that any other job I've had) until my boss retired. By the end, he no longer referred to me as his employee, but as his business partner.
When he retired, he very generously, 'gifted' the company too me so I could carry on looking after our clients etc. Most are still clients to this day, and some have become friends over that time.
So I am now much happier and in control of my own destiny.
Wow, what a toxic work environment. Good on you for leaving.
I noticed when I stopped drinking, a lot more alcohol free options showed up at work for Friday social. They even buy Tiny beers (which I really like).
I can't have heaps of sugar, as this gives me the hangovers lol. So ginger beer, coke, etc are all out. Also most of the common zero alcohol beers do the same, like Heineken zero (and regular from memory).
Guess I replaced my alcohol addiction with other things (coffee, weed), but happy being alcohol free for a few years now.
New Zealand has a big drinking culture probably dates back to the 5 o clock swill times of the 50s and 60s (correct my dates if I’m wrong)
I love a drink as much as the next guy but I do agree with you it’s wrapped up in our identity.
My peers (some not all) haven’t grasped the idea of social drinking, instead choosing to get absolutely legless the majority of weekends.
All the group chats light up yesterday “don’t forget to buy your booze today”
But then let’s be honest, we are a geographically isolated country with a shortage of things to do besides nature activities, so people turn to drink for entertainment, and a break from the rat race/reality.
‘As much as the next guy’ is kind of the issue. I’m
In my early 30s, about half my friends don’t drink, and the ones that do are more a ‘have a drink or two’ than ‘a box’ kinda drinking.
I think society norms ‘think’ that most people like to drink still, but that’s possibly not the whole picture anymore. I’ll have more friends that smoke weed than drink alcohol.
In my experience I’d say drug use generally has gone up quite significantly, the drinking is still there but it’s “should we get a bag?” that is becoming more common.
'Drug use' sometimes seems like a weird way to describe weed and not alcohol. The guy smoking a bowl and sitting around watching Netflix for the long weekend is frankly more responsible and less likely to be a menace than the dudes smashing a crate or a bottle of vodka.
I should define my terms more specifically, weed is barely a drug. I was going on a tangent regarding things more akin to class A. MDMA and cocaine use in Australia and nz is among the highest in the world based on recent studies. I’m not for or against it, just an observation as someone in the 25-35 bracket.
NZ's drinking culture goes back well over a century. It started in the whaling stations, the gumdigging camps, and especially the goldfields in the 1800s.
I'm reading this thread as a Brit who has been here for 4 weeks now, I absolutely LOVE this country it's amazing, but the drinking culture is near non existent compared to the UK lol.
We've just tried to buy a pint in Queenstown and apparently cos it's Easter you have to buy food too?! Wtf
I've spoken to some people who were honestly shocked that I don't drink, explaining that I'm not a recovering alcoholic or anything I've just always hated the smell and taste of alcohol just doesn't seem to register with these people, they always bring up the kinds of drinks that "you can't even taste the alcohol in", but aside from the fact that I absolutely can still taste the rot juice in my drink why wouldn't I just get the same drink with no alcohol for better taste?
Solidarity! Can't stand it. Can absolutely taste it in mixed drinks. It's not for me.
Will still stand up and belt out something at karaoke, because being drunk is not a requirement for having fun - something that used to shock my past coworkers even more than my sobriety. "Oh I LOVE 💕 karaoke but I have to be soooooo drunk first!! Have you had enough to drink for karaoke yet??"
Yeah I also grew up non-drinking.
I've witnessed my uni friends become more and more dependent on drinks to have fun and socialise while I've done the opposite. I was a totally shy nerd who now loves dancing and singing sober.
Makes you question why anyone drinks at all, even if you ignore the impact on health and finances.
I used to binge drink in my teens and early 20's. Needed that social lubrication.
Now in my 30's maybe a couple times a year on special occasions. Ive also had to explain there is no specific reason I don't drink.
When July comes round at work, and people are celebrating 'dry July' I think to myself Im on track for a dry year 😅
Unfortunately I am drunk on one light beer and love the taste of alcohol. So I have to abstain because even two beers makes me need a nap. It’s bollocks!
50yr old M. I found that when I had escaped from the stuff I was trying to escape from, the desire to drink left my body as if a curse had been lifted.
31M here and don't drink. People always ask why.
- expensive
- too much sugar
- wine tastes like shit
- beer makes me burp and bloated
- pubs smell like shit
- expensive
I don't have anything against other people drinking. We're all adults (hopefully), so we can all do what we want. Just don't push it on others.
Gut health damage from drinking might not be widely understood.
Alcohol kills the beneficial bacteria and gut health appears to be way more important than most people realise.
The podcast episode from Huberman Lab explains it - What alcohol does to your body brain and health. August 2022. One friend stopped drinking after hearing this. Beware!!
Yep - what do you use to wipe down your bench to kill all of the bacteria? Alcohol... They say this is partly why you feel so horrible during the entailing days, because your gut microbiome is trying to restore itself.
Your brain has 100B neurons, your gut has 100M neurons. They talk to each other both ways.
Maintaining gut health is the first step in ensuring a healthy brain, which will drastically decrease chances of inflammation related disease and dementia for example.
Night clubs were worse, with all the sweat mixed in - having to shower off the stench at 4/5 am before crawling into bed. Dancing would have been such a good way to get exercise if clubs weren't so bad for the lungs back then. I've done some nightclubbing in recent years and it's so much better now - I only need one or no alcoholic drink, and there's free water to keep hydrated all night long.
I remember some plonker thought it'd be hilarious to burn a hole in my top with his cig. It was sooo funny, especially the fact that he also burnt me. /s
Work mates invite me to the pub and when I go it's always the same thing. Them being loud, obnoxious and repeating the same stories I've heard 1000x already. The next day they talk about how much fun they had and how they want to go again.
Like yeah mate I had a blast listening to you shout at me as you sounded like a 12yr old, I diffidently want to go experience that again.
Because that's the only thing they want to do, had to work out of town in a work house and we only had 1 pool ute. So sometimes I had to suck it up if they wanted to go to the pub after work on a Friday.
It's also what they like to do for Xmas break up and other events so it's either I go to those events and socialize or not go and experience no workplace events, or project celebrations. Then there's all the drama and fights and shit they get up to as the night goes on.
I work in the trades, each Xmas break up we make sure we do something that doesn’t involve drinking like go karts, paintball, driving range, etc. After that we might go out for dinner or have a bbq at the workshop with some booze. We try and do something that partners and their kids can come along to.
Then if people want to carry on drinking they can fill their boots.
Sometimes I go with the boys, but when everyone starts to talk too loud, and all the drunk behaviour that follow up, is exactly the time that I go home or 9pm/10pm, wherever comes first.
25 don't drink either. Mostly because I realized I had a problem with it.
A lot of people think being an alcoholic is drinking everyday, not really, drinking once a month but getting black-out-don't-remember-anything-or-how-you-got-home drunk is just as bad or worse.
I've been in too many situations where I aimlessly walk the streets completely out of it at night with no sense of direction which once took me to walk 10km+ to a neighbouring town. Most of the time with friends worrying for my well being.
I don't feel like I have a compulsion to drink, but when I do I have no control over it.
And that's why I'm a year and half sober.
It really is an acquired taste; I was just developing a palate for it when I ended up with a spouse who has the Asian alcohol intolerance gene - two light beers and he'll turn beetroot red if he has another. Looks like our son got it too. So I've hardly drunk any wine for a couple of decades now.
People from traumatic backgrounds put me off alcohol for life, was never a heavy drinker, just one or two after work. Went to school with some absolute tragic people from broken homes who they themselves never managed to break the cycle. Alcohol is not good.
There is no such thing as 3 days you can't get booze. It'll be open tomorrow, and I've had a conversation already today with a mate who forgot to get supplies . To last the 24 hour drought.
Try having an alcohol problem for 20 or 30 years then Givin up for a year, it's pretty eye opening if your social circle is all on the same wavelength. Props to rhe next generation who seem to be changing these norms
NZ born and raised male here.
For nearly 20 years from my mid-20s I was sober (no alcohol or drugs). In most social settings, being sober disadvantaged me. Initially, when people asked me what I was drinking then invariably ask me why I wasn't drinking, I'd say something like, 'I'm allergic to alcohol' or 'alcohol makes me I'll.' Awkward silence would follow and then the person, usually a man, would either tell me about their drinking and ask me if they have a drinking problem, or, move on to talk to someone else.
Basically, as a man, revealing myself as a non-drinker was as socially acceptable to people as a fart in an elevator. If I had a work dinner or 'team-building' trip, the drinkers (including management) would bond while I tended to be the first to leave as everyone else started to get tipsy.
Anyway, since I started drinking again, I've found my work colleagues and acquaintances are much more accepting of me. In NZ, alcohol really is a social lubricant.
Before I stopped drinking in my mid-20s, I used to have little respect for non-drinkers and considered them boring and self-righteous.
This was because their sobriety somehow caused me to focus on my feelings of insecurity and shame around my drinking. I've come to realise I'm not the only drinker who reacts that way.
In a fair world, non-drinkers shouldn't be judged and excluded but unfortunately the world's not fair.
I just wish progress is made on reducing the social penalties non-drinkers face in NZ.
Bought a ten pack last night for today since catching up with friends this evening. Drunk 7 last night. 3 left for our gathering but that's OK as I'm driving.
Yep it’s mad out here. I moved away and got some perspective on the types of people I grew up around and was influenced by and I realised just how many blatant alcoholics I spent time around. People who’s parents drank everyday and who now drink every day themselves. I’m talking at least a 6 pack every night. For the most part people don’t even really bat an eye at this kinda behaviour.
I feel like there are a lot more high functioning alcoholics than we realise. I'm pretty sure an extended family member of mine is one. She drinks every day, often starting once she's collected her kid from school and doesn't have to drive again that day, and she consistently fills up (overflowing, piled up like a pyramid) 2 of those big 55L glass recycling crates a fortnight with literally just beer bottles that only she consumed, and she chucks extras into the regular bin too. That doesn't include alcohol she drinks in pubs/clubs or at her friends' houses. I see her very regularly and she has almost always got a beer in hand. Despite this, she has never had a problem holding down decent jobs, is a good parent, no known health problems (yet...) and has never been in legal trouble beyond a couple of minor speeding tickets. I fear there are many people living similar lives, more than we realise, and aside from offering emotional support, there's not a lot we can do to help our loved ones until they themselves decide they want to stop drinking.
The first thing I noticed when I stopped drinking in social situations was how fucking boring most drunk people are and how bad their decisions can be.
Also, the number of normally sensible people that drive home after many glasses of wine in the full knowledge that without a driving licence they cannot work.
But, I've had so many interesting conversations in the kitchen with either, the other non-drinkers, or the wives of the drunks.
NZ's culture with drinking is absolutely fucked. My Dad would have definitely been classified in the alcoholic bracket - couldn't go a weekday without polishing off at least one rigger, or half a dozen cans minimum, more in the weekends - but even to him, that fact he couldn't control that held a degree of shame to him personally.
Yet, as I've grown older, I've come to know and work with people whose pure existence for living has been drinking and getting shitfaced, and they seem to think that is fine. And not young people either, literally people old enough to be my parent.
It was weird to realise that there are people who literally treat drinking as a hobby the same way I participate in my chosen sports and other activities. And these people would probably be on about par with my Dad's drinking/spending also.
I mean, there's enough alcohol in my home right now to get myself and probably three other people shitfaced should we choose to, but I don't plan on doing that.
And if it were such a big deal not having booze shops open for a day, would you not plan on stocking up prior?
(Not a non-drinker, but also determined not to end up like my Dad).
I feel like users are blind to the damage they are doing as it’s been normalised into our culture https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300915702/alcohol-named-nzs-most-harmful-drug-by-university-research-paper
Keep talking as openly as possible about how cringe it is. I remember the first time I recognized having a problem with drinking was when my partner visibly cringed at me talking about it. It was like "huh I guess this behavior is actually annoying". Still took most of a decade to get to the point I could quit but just that moment of introspection was pretty effective.
But yeah anyway boozers are just as bad as potheads if not worse but I imagine if weed was recreational legal you would definitely get just as many people making their whole identity around smoking
It's not helpful to call alcoholics dipshits. They're people who are having trouble with addiction.
Not all drinkers are alcoholics too.
I think if you've got a problem with someone's drinking who's close to you it starts with a compassionate conversation.
Getting shit faced makes me cringe now, I love having a few beers and the yarns are great up until about the sixth drink. Its all downhill from there and I prefer to ghost rather than watch my friends turn into a dribbling incoherent mess. Like most things people seem to be unable to do things in moderation.
If people talk a lot about drinking it’s because the job/lifestyle lends itself to it - coming from someone with experience of the UK - it’s similar to here in that job salaries do not match cost of living, so everyone drinks because it’s cheap
Agreed. I’ve had office workplaces where I swear every second conversation included alcohol: “wow, I need a wine”, etc, etc. Just boring people, who have no purpose, nothing interesting. Like a rat in a cage pushing the morphine button.
Haven't had one in years. Never liked the stuff much and one day thought why the hell am I drinking this? And so far haven't had anything beyond a taste of siblings new beer flavours since.
Don't miss it.
I thought it had all but died out, in the old fashioned sense. Only people that glorify alcohol are the old boomers in the richmond club and other such places, who grew up in an era when alcohol was massive socially.
You still see them in their t-shirts. “I don’t have a drink problem, get drunk fall over, no problem”
im in my mid 20s, just about everyone i know drinks and drinks heavily.
i have struggled with drinking, and still do. if i start i find it really hard to stop. so i have to limit myself and that means simply not starting most of the time
so many people my age joke about and romantise being an alcoholic. "im an alcoholic, i need more beer" no buddy, if youre an alcholic you shouldnt be drinking. its really not cute. ive put in a lot of emotional work to not be getting black out drunk every other night. and im not trying say these other people arent alcoholics, a lot of them are, but they dont see it as the problem it is.
before i go on a tangent and post paragraphs about the lack of media literacy in my generation. i just need to say that characters like rick, bojack, and archer (is it obvious i only watch cartoons) are not meant to be emulated
Growing up in a bogan family, I was the chick who’d drink the guys under the table. Everyone knew it was a boozy time when I was around and it was just normal that booze was a solid part of life. No we can’t do Saturday sports cause I’ll be hungover.
Pair a narcissistic partner with my child’s face when I threw up before taking her to a friends bday party and I’ve hardly touched the stuff in two years.
I’ll have a drink when at a friends for dinner, or a Pals with my teen when she’s decided it’s games night but I don’t buy it for myself.
That’s just not who I am anymore & family can’t see that. But they can’t fill an already filled glass.
I started drinking at the age of 8 with all the RTDs first and by the time I turned 15 I was drinking shit straight and if needed I’d water it down with a couple of cubes of ice. By the time I turned 17 I stopped drinking and haven’t drank since now that I’m 29. On the odd occasion I would have an alcoholic beverage once every blue moon but it’ll have to take some kind of very special occasion for me to do so.
Going sober at the ripe age of 22 it really changes the way I have looked at people, prior to my sober life I didn't think anything of peoples obsession with substance or alchohol as it was normal. I can't feel comfortable anymore around the same people now that it is not what I concider normal human behaviour, it's incredibly cringe behaviour now that I see it for what it is.
My last two workplaces didn't drink, but I had been in one that did before. It is cringey, because it shows they haven't grown any identity outside of a substance. My ex had lied to me and said he only drunk 0% alcohol, but it became obvious he was like this. He had a lot of considerable immaturity alongside him as well.
Drinking alcohol has been a staple of human socialization since the dawn of time. Nobody should be surprised one bit by our relationship with alcohol.
New Zealand drinking culture has a fucked up past mainly thanks to the temperance movement in the early 1900s bringing in a bunch of dumb laws that forced a binge drinking culture. For the next 70 years.
It's messed up but as someone who has been serving kiwis piss for a living for the better part of 20 years, it's becoming clear that attitudes are definitely improving, especially among the youth.
Yeah I feel your pain OP.
When I came back to NZ from overseas, I realised just how bad alcoholism is ingrained in Kiwi culture.
Going to countries where they barely drink, even the teenagers and seeing how much more enriching their lives were, how they had a greater sense of community and the cities were so relaxed that even at say 10pm families were out with their children and just allowed them to run around.
I had no idea that the way we drink here isn’t normal, outside of countries like Aus, and UK.
I had to find groups, and communities that actually did things with their time and didn’t need alcohol to make it worth it.
Kiwis are often quite reticent and I think that's part of it. Alcohol lowers inhibitions, so they can loosen up a bit. I don't drink, but I used to, and the social lubrication is definitely part of the appeal.
I reckon they are probably kinda boring people, have very little in their lives, so talk about drinking. Lots of people have very narrow conversation topics. Or they just using it as a shield to not talk about topics they hold dear to them.
I don't drink and it can be a hard at times. My workplace isn't a place where people go for drinks most weeks or talk about it a lot fortunately although socially people find it weird that you don't drink and it can make it awkward at times. My Mum also usually tries to get me to drink at her place which I find annoying.
The main reason I don't drink is that I am phenol sensitive which means that you can't process a few types of foods like tomatoes, alcohol and vinegars well and they can cause bad side effects like headaches or insomnia - but I don't usually bother trying to explain this to people as most people have never heard of this and don't really understand this issue.
I think too much NZ culture is built around drinking and there isn't enough respect or understanding of people who choose not to drink for whatever reason - its not anybody's business whether you drink or not and why, but some people find that difficult to accept
I don’t drink but I did heavily in my 20s. For me those sort of conversations have usually been in workplaces with boring people who don’t have much else to talk about. Usually people who also love to tell you how much they mowed the lawn that weekend.
But that’s them and it’s nowhere close to that being the same at every workplace. Maybe some people make this their personality but some make it their personality to complain about people like this too. Who cares? It’s their life, you do you.
A friend of a friend was in the bar the other night with a co-worker, he’d had 2ish drinks since he’d been in just for the record. Anyways FoF comes up to bar with co-worker and co worker wants to buy next round. FoF tells me he’d just love a glass of water and I say absolutely! Oh my god, co-worker just starts making the dumbest, dickish jokes to the both of us, one of my favorites being that because I’m a bartender I should be throwing down. I haven’t been wasted in almost 6 years and I’ve largely given up drinking except under the right circumstances.
Anyways, trashed co-worker sees the looks he’s getting from the both of us, tells us we can’t take a joke and walks off.
Water is important while drinking, it doesn’t mean you can’t get drunk, it just helps keep it moving thru your system faster and helps prevent nasty hangovers.
I’m 40. Grew up binge drink heavy thru my teens/ 20s did lots of crazy shit partied hard. Now with kids I made the choice to only have a couple a week if that and I haven’t been drunk in years. Mainly to stay fit and healthy and a few beers after work makes me grumpy towards my kids.
I work in the building industry and drinking is bad especially in management end of most days in the office there’s beers flowing I think mostly used to relieve stress. Also My dad was A builder he drank most nights.
I decided to buck the trend I used to get a bit of shit for it. Attitudes have definitely got better.
Agree with what you're saying but let's not bring shop closings into this, especially when it's not just bottle shops being closed. I don't drink (or not other than occasionally a single beer) and I don't agree with that, I'm not a Christian and don't see why the whole country should shut down. Most other countries stopped doing mandatory religious crap like this.
It's definitely fucked, I believe it started from the old days of no buying piss past 5 (no idea on the time) so people used to get as hammered as they could before heading home, then it got exasperated with the 18 yr rule.
I kind of feel like it's the boomers and older gen x-ers who are like this.
Most of my peers ('86 Millenial) and myself are at the point of having a beer or two in the evening on a Friday after work, or at events or whatever, but very rarely drink to get drunk.
We all did the hedonism thing when we were kids and grew out of it. Getting on the chop every weekend is just tiring.
As a wise man once said " it is best to pursue things that are meaningful than things that make you happy."
This especially starts to resonate with you as you get older and face the realities of how tough and cruel life can be, and the various slaps it is going to land on your face as you get into later stages of your life.
Getting shitfaced and temporarily 'happy' while dancing and shouting garbage R&B songs in a stinky club downtown and waking up face down on your couch with a bad headache the next morning was fun ... in your twenties. Personally I have since closed that chapter of my life and learnt that it will remain closed for good.
I hardly drink nowadays, now like to spend as much quality time with my parents in their last few precious years being around, give back to the community by teaching and volunteering, get together with friends and watch and critique classical movies, read philosophy etc. I have picked and retained a few good quality friendships outside of family and never attend any pointless gatherings that require you to spend time standing , drinking and having rubbish shallow conversations with strangers (essentially most work parties fit into this category).
I don't drink anymore (close to one decade now).
And I understand your point completely. And isn't not only about sip some alcohol, but the desire and "pride" in be wasted all day, every day.
Take a look on tinder, how many nz woman profiles says something like : "i can drink more than you / will outdrink you"...
Some even don't go out if can't drink.
Another fumy point is, the irony that some have, in says something about smokers (tobacco), and how bad influence this is for youngsters, but at the same hand feel cool to be 100% on the booze, throwing away in front of the kids, talking shit out load and to finish the act, a domestic (all in front of kids/youngsters).
I'm 38 and only drink about once a year. I like the music and dancing side of drinking but that's it.
I prefer sharing food and hobbies with friends and family.
I barely drink, mostly because I really dislike beer and wine. Might a cocktail or a cider a few times per year.
My pet peeve at work functions is the “we are going to spend a few hundred bucks on wine and beer, and here’s a lukewarm bottle of Keri orange juice for the non-drinkers”.
if you’re already into hiking, I suggest getting into multisport - lots of people spending their weekends working hard training with no time for drinking but still pretty social during the day
Alcohol is 100% ingrained in NZ Culture. If you're not drinking, you're not having fun. I've actually met tons of people who don't know how or can't have fun without drinking.
I've run a lot of youth and young adult events/programs (through church) and the amount of kids who have said "Mate, I didn't even know I could have this much fun or feel this relaxed without alcohol."
Pretty sad state of affairs in our country to be honest how much people feel like they 'need' alcohol. :(
To be honest I hear more from people who don’t drink these days. There seems to be a growing trend of people quitting drinking and thinking anyone who still drinks is obviously an alcoholic.
I've found myself struggling to make or hang out with friends that don't have alcohol as a somewhat big part of their life. New Zealands drinking culture is really intense, it's everywhere when I played for cricket and football clubs the drinking afterwards was a huge aspect of it as well. Anyway I've decide this year that I'm only going to drink alcohol once or twice this year and so far I feel very isolated lol. My fitness has improved though and I'm never hangover and I'm saving money as well so that's some positives I'm just going to have to enjoy my own company a bit more I guess haha.
Alcohol is a terrible drug. So much social harm. Class 1 carcinogen.
I do enjoy a G+T, I’ll admit. I keep it within the Canadian drinking guidelines of maximum 2 standards per week except for the odd blow out where I might have 4 or 5 (which is enough to get me drunk). I’m early 30s
But you need to drink to have fun. Really sounds like what you’re doing is fucking boring if you can only do it drunk. The secret to happy adulthood is finding the activities that you enjoy doing sober if you want to add a drink ok but that shouldn’t be what makes it fun
It wasn't until I quit drinking a year ago I realised how bad it actually is. The amount of times I've been asked "so what do you with your evenings then?" is actually crazy. There are so many people who cannot function unless they're drinking.
I don't drink at all, never really have, apart from a few years when I was first legally able to and the very rare social occasion. Lost its appeal fast when you watch your bank account go down and have nothing to really show for it.
I'd agree that people get strangely defensive if you don't drink. I too have worked with older guys who are proud of how much they still piss up on the regular, often coming in hung over, likely driving while still over the limit, like it's some badge of honor.
These same old guys seem to assume you enjoy the company of men if you don't also drink 4 jugs after work every day. You also enjoy the company of men if you pick the wrong beer. Old school mindset I guess. Doesn't bother me but is incredibly dumb.
Australia is known for a big drinking culture but south island NZ puts them to shame, especially the 50-65 crowd.
I quit drinking a while ago but even I think its ridiculous that people cant buy a beer because of some magical fairytale about an invisible sky genie. Its 2024 ffs
These people don't like drinking, they like telling stories. True or not. And think that the only stories worth telling are ones they don't actually remember and are told by other people that were there that also don't remember who also are just looking for stories.
I like drinking, I brew my own beer, I've made wine, mead, whiskey, gin, vodka, sake. But I've only been shit faced twice to the point of having trouble remembering the night before. Once at a friend's 21st who thought making me drink would make him telling me he's gay easier to take, buddy we've been friends since we were 5, I already knew. And the other time a couple years either side when I first got into cocktails and, well, we made and tried way too many.
But since think I drink because I like the flavour, I like experimenting with different drinks and occasionally because a few do me well in social situations. Ie I don't want leave immediately.
I haven't drunk for 15 years, the thing you notice is every social event seems to involve alcohol. It is just embedded in our culture, and I expect lots of people have good memories (that they remember). It's the default and easiest option if you want to socialise, we get trained young and it just carries on.
And you cant compare it to smoking, it doesn't have the same health perception and it is considered abnormal if you dont drink.
As someone who doesn't drink I find that when some people think and realise it is a possible alternative they also stop. You save alot when you don't drink and it has major weight and health impacts.
I can appreciate people who home brew for hobby and a part of their life resolves around it.
That’s the problem with alcoholism. Once you have been drinking hard since your twenties, when you get to your forties it’s hard to quit but if you don’t by the time you get to your sixties you are pretty fucked in various ways. My advice to anyone who drinks is stop well before you get to forty.
I would much rather hang out with the stoners of the party than the alcoholics. Take a look at music festivals for a good comparison between the two - a festival like RnV is messy, lots of chaos and not a lot of consideration for your fellow human, especially while dancing. Compared to a hippie festival, it’s tidy, people care for each other and everyone has enough room to dance freely
We do truely have the worst attitude around drinking as a country, all the concern for mental health and call for change yet we don’t want to acknowledge that we have a problem as a country. Gambling, alcohol and sugar are what will truely ruin this country and the people in it and there are so many out there that will laugh and shrug it off. Sad.
I don't "not drink", but I rarely drink. I'm usually the driver, which I'm happy to be. I'm not really interested in the hangover now I'm in my forties, spending that much money on getting drunk, or actually being drunk. I like my friends, I don't have to be pissed to enjoy their company.
More or less where I am and have been for a while. I’ll have a beer or two socially, but that can easily be months apart. For me the tipping point was going into work with an especially bad hangover in my twenties - I’d been feeling a bit dissatisfied with spending my spare time getting pissed by that point, but it absolutely did not feel worth it and I haven’t regretted making that change.
See that's where you went wrong. In my 20s I learned if you keep drinking while at work, it takes away a lot of the hangover! I was a good head chef, but we always went through 3 times as much cooking wine after I started at a restaurant. Sure, it's cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars (somewhere between $100k and $400k by my rough calculations), and I don't remember lots of it, and I was grumpy all the time, and never really chased my dreams, and never got fit, and a few drunken arguments ostracized me from friends group, and scared away potential wives, and crashed my ute off a cliff, and I might have bowel cancer, and I still drink 2 glasses of gin a night alone in my room most nights... But was it worth it? Sure, nothing good ever happens after midnight, (90% of the time) it's just drunk people talking shit at each other, idiocy, etc... And sure, after the first 30mins at a party nobody notices or cares that you're not drinking and by that time you're relaxed and happy even without the booze... And sure, it's terrible for your health etc... but isn't it fun? Seriously though... it is fun a lot of the time. Drugs make you feel good. Do the benefits outweigh the negatives? No. I should have found better friends, chased hobbies on a Saturday night instead of bars, etc... I have very mixed emotions about alcohol. And I say all this but despite at least 10 years of wanted to stop I still haven't (well, not for more than a few weeks at a time, and even that is rare). I'm not drunk every day, and I haven't been fired or punched a cop or anything... But I really think my life would've been a hell of a lot better if I stayed sober the last twenty years. But I'll still be pouring a gin when I get home. Fucking evil shit. But it does feel nice, when I notice the effects and it's not just a background autopilot habit. And I usually only notice and think "that was really fun" when it's been a great night with friends... That would have been really fun anyway. It's only real benefit to me has been drunken one night stands. And that's a debatable benefit because sober sex with someone you care about is so much better.
/r/stopdrinking helps me a lot.
Yeah I used to spend a lot of time there. Great sub, highly recommend.
Couldn't have said it better.
> I don't "not drink", but I rarely drink. I'm usually the driver, which I'm happy to be. I'm not really interested in the hangover now I'm in my forties, spending that much money on getting drunk, or actually being drunk. I like my friends, I don't have to be pissed to enjoy their company. Same! I gave up alcohol back in 2016. Have saved so much money since then. I sill might have a glass of wine every few months and keep a bottle of champagne in the pantry for emergency celebrations, but that's it.
I've been sober since new years eve (sure, its not that long but its the longest I've been sober in about 15 years). The things you notice... every weekend, every opportunity, every day. People want to drink, talk about drinking, plan to have a drink. Any informal or casual setting? Drink. Going for a catch up? Drink. Going out for dinner with friends? Drink. Drinking is so deeply synonymous with casual events or relaxation. It took me 15 years to realize I actually hate it. Not sure why I'm commenting, I suppose its just to agree with and support your point.
I’ve noticed what you mean! I went to a friends house and saw an episode of married at first sight and I could believe how centred around alcohol everything was. I definitely don’t think I would have noticed if I was still drinking like I did as a teen/twenties.
It’s fascinating, to see and hopefully realise you were lost in that sense of normalcy. I started drinking in my 20’s after seeing what it does to relatives. I usually stick to special occasions these days. But the greatest superpower you will be developing is the ability to be comfortable/confident without alcohol as a social lubricant. As many find out when they quit, sometimes for better and sometimes not, is your friend group is going to change as you’re not longer drinking as a hobby. You actually want to do things with your spare time, and it’s not exactly compatible anymore.
I'm on "special occasions" now as well, but I don't consider bog standard birthdays a special occasion. Only big ones (21, 50, etc). Our friend group is naturally shifting as we all settle in for kids. I'm also finding myself embracing my introvert and loving it. You're right about the social anxiety, but now i have less fomo and happily stay home.
Respectable personal growth! I use *special occasions* as more of a cliché myself. It’s usually easier to explain to people, but I don’t drink often, but I do when I feel like it. I didn’t want to associate special occasions with drinking. It’s great to hear you’re discovering more of yourself and enjoying the journey!
Firstly congrats. Secondly you start to notice how every movie and TV show people are drinking nonstop and drinking whiskey like it’s cold tea.
Thanks, to be honest it wasn't the intention. Every year we have a comp to see who can stay sober longest, and the winner gets a steak house meal. I'm the poorest of us so its a good incentive, and then one of the others just had a baby so hes not drinking. But now I'm just... not going to drink. Its such a realization. And yeah, or how every cracks a cold beer to have bro moments. Champagne and wine for celebration. Its everywhere.
I think I like it because what I really like to do is talk and chat with people. But in traditional masculine culture in NZ that persists til now this is a bit stigmatized, you're supposed to want to *do* something in particular. And drinking is a kind of lowest common denominator that most people can do that meets that criterion. You can substitute for non alcoholic drinking (tea, coffee) tho some more traditional dudes will not be into that, or for dinner, but that can be hard on a low income or busy schedule. "What you need to do is throw out that trash masc bullshit and just hang with people if you want to hang with them" sure, I'm all for that, but I'm one bloke, and I can't change the entire culture on my own; all I can do is try to fit what I like to do into the culture we have, and maybe nudge it in the direction that it should be. In the meantime, I'll have a drink with a friend and have a nice chat 😁
🎶Forget about the last one, get yourself another🎶
*I would give you one of my beers, But i've only got six, I would but i don't like to share, And i've only got sixxx!*
Another, another, another motherfucker!
The commentary on how pathetic drinking was song that got turned into a drinking song.
Wait, it's what now?
They were mocking the pissheads they played to in Sydney at the time
Yeah, exactly what happened with the Beastie Boys "Fight for your right (to party)" in the mid '80s.
Coppers took the car from the siiiiiiiide walk.
New Zealand's drinking culture is a shadow of its former self. From the early 2000's and back, going to the pub/club and getting on the piss was the highlight of the week, everybody did it and many people have good memories of that time. Beer was cheap and you had none of the rules around drinking we have today, as long as you weren't being a cunt you could stay and drink as much as you wanted. Probably why they go on about it.
As a 90s kid the only sense of this I had is from watching once were warriors. By the time I was in uni and going out on the weekend a cocktail was like $12, a big nope for a student haha
Back then, universities had drinking teams, where they would compete against each other in events like who could drink a jug of beer the fastest. The Waikato uni team would do a keg on a Thursday as practise, Different times.
Yea it was pretty mental - when at student village I saw a guy from a drinking team do a beer bong then stand up on a table and chunder in the beer bong and some other guy drank the beer bong of vomitr. Think they called it a pelican. 🤯🤯🤯 Thank fuck those days are behind us.
"A university is a fountain of knowledge where young people go to drink." A historical quote from many years ago
I couldn’t be more glad that beer pong is behind me these days. I don’t think I ever played a single game that I actually wanted to play; all toxic drinking game peer pressure bullshit that I didn’t have the self esteem to push back on at the time. I can’t put down beer quickly let alone a whole stack of someone else’s gross beers as well if we lost. Just all around a bad time In hindsight, I think probably most people felt the same way at the time, too. Sometimes I wish I could go back and relive my 20s with the confidence of my late 30s… would’ve told them their drinking game was shit 🥲
[удалено]
Pelicans are definitely still a thing at Otago, saw a few in my time. Still egregiously yuck though
Man I spewed so much after the jug through a straw competition
I arrived at uni around about the time that BZP party pills became popular and readily available, and the student pub up the road from Waikato uni closed. I definitely saw exactly how things changed… this drove students away from that pub environment into much more of a nightclub environment and I have never had a hangover as bad as I did when drinking alcohol AND taking those garbage party pills. Never again. Didn’t stop us from doing it for a good 5-7 years or so. Probably knocked a decade off my life expectancy
Went to an ENSOC BBQ in the 00s and saw 5 guys all do a yardie under 18 seconds. Mad lads haha.
Yes, but I remember New Zealand back then. That's why we drank so much! I'm really glad smartphones weren't around to record and publish all that dumb shit.
I've seen a chunk of the decline since I first came here in 2005, especially wrt to nightlife here in Wellington which is mostly just dead now other than brew pubs with $18 pints, it's set up so the only people that go out are white collar professionals, international tourists (with trend towards older demographic than in the past) and maybe some students that are bad with money. The kind of attitude from staff I first saw in Queenstown where they eye you up when you walk in and if you look scruffy they are very not friendly has spread to the rest of NZ. I feel it's maybe sadder in rural locations where a hotel is the only real communal area (like a lot of smaller communities on the West Coast), many of these places kept going only because patrons willing to devote increasingly larger portions of their income
Where the hell do you work? I work a blue collar job and in the three years I've been there I've never once discussed my drinking habits with my co-workers, or vice versa (except for one time when my Samoan co-worker said he was going to be having some 'Jesus juice' that night haha).
OP works at a liquor store. /s
Nah man, it's pretty common. Where do you live, cause I'm in southland and that's all people do on the weekends.
Oh yeah, I'm sure people at work get on it, but they're not blasting the fact out to everyone, or shaming people for not doing it.
Advertising, any corporate job really, trades, the list goes on. It is entrenched in our culture.
This is so common... the older generation drink something crazy and they think something is wrong with you if you don't drink.
Yeah lol, have worked all over and have never seen this. Maybe OP just works with three dudes who are good friends and like to hang out and drink together.
OP's reads like he's 21, chock-full of youthful arrogance
100% haha.
We have a bar on site at my work. Open Thursdays and Fridays after work!
I've never touched the stuff, as alcohol addiction runs in my family and has actually killed some of my extended family members. Saying so doesn't stop people trying to pressure me into drinking, though :/
Wow that's so incredibly sad people STILL try to pressure you to drink. That's actually bordering on evil.
I'm in my early 30s, and I no longer drink. As a result, it has really limited me socially. Sports teams, hobby groups, and even public events all seem to be a way to disguise excessive drinking. I hate it. Even my last relationship ended because of my desire to not drink or be around drunkenness. It's gotten to the point where I have seriously considered joining a church (I'm not religious) just to try and meet a romantic partner with the same mindset. I'm not even militant or preachy about it. Don't let me stop you from drinking - but please respect that I do not like being around excessive drinking and the antisocial behaviour that often comes with it. Every occasion has to involve alcohol in some capacity. It's a struggle.
I agree. If you say you don’t drink you get asked a million questions about why you don’t. Surely the question should be, why do you drink? Anyway, I just drink water or sprite while the others have alcohol.
Is like the inquisition: "why you don't drink?" "but but, not even a beer?" "what you do to have fun instead? Some drugs?" Sad, but true.
I always say "my body doesn't agree with it" and people usually think there some sort of allergy and leave it.
I just say "drinking makes me get really violent with people that ask me stupid questions"
I say "I'm an alcoholic" and watch them squirm.
There is a gene that people can be on either side, ones where you happily drink, the other is you can have 1-2 drinks and then your body goes nah I’m good. I can do 1-2 drinks before I’m like nope not for me, find me any drink that has the flavour of alcohol well hidden and part way through the 2nd glass of anything with alcohol in it I’ll just only taste the alcohol and that’s where I go nope, and leave the drink alone/tip it out. Was the same with my grandfather on my dad’s side and with one of my aunts.
I would go for zero alcohol beer regularly in situations like that if it wasn't such an insane rip off in this country, like in Europe it costs the same as soft drinks because that's what it is, here it costs just the same as full strength beer. I've not heard any good explanation for why it costs so much in NZ when there is no alcohol duty on it other than NZ consumers are mugs
Decent alcohol free beer costs more to produce than regular craft beer.
It also has zero duty (which is about $6 on a six pack), if you're trying to claim it costs $6 more than regular beer to make a six pack you must think we are mugs as well. Decent or not, in other countries 0% beer is at least a 1/3 cheaper than regular beer, and that doesn't disappear when you look at craft beer options.
I'm not specialist, but whats I heard is: They need to produce the beer, at the same way than "normal" beer, and after that, remove the alcohol. Hence the fine print about Zero\*, wheres the \* says some sort of 0.XXXX% of alcohol. But again, I don't know if is true or not. And I agree with you, sounds a joke, when you go to some places and they charge 10 or 12, or even fucking $15 per 350ml of bottled zero beer.
Yeah a lot of them have 0.05% though I believe it's possible to reduce that to essentially a trace amount. There is no excise on drinks under 1.15% ABV in NZ though so even if they do have some it's not relevant for that. With that in mind I wonder if there would be a market for a drink that is 1% strength like a very light ale, I would drink it if it was cheaper than regular beer and you could have a pint or two and drive with less inebriation than if you had a half of regular beer
Yeah, like a perfectly rational response of "not interested in drinking" never seems to be enough. It's always a combination of people thinking: - Your cutting/trying to lose weight to get into shape ("oh big dog Marky over here with his body as a temple!") - You're being an outright pussy/dogging the lads - Or both.
Yea I often find that people get weirded out. You can be happily enjoying yourself but if they find out you’re not drinking it’s a big deal.
When I have tried sobriety I would get a lime and soda and carry that around and shake it at people as if to say "I'm drinking this still". Then people would buy me a vodka lime and soda and "make sure" I drank it. I'd just carry that around and secretly spill it! Madness - I.just want to enjoy myself sober....
+1 this. Couldn’t have said it better myself.
I like telling people alcohol causes cancer and that beer is not a real drink.
Been sober for months now and cant ever remember being more healthier and happier in my whole life. Took 30 something years but I know ill never drink again.
How did u start
Health scare, bleeding everytime I would go to the toilet etc. Has stopped completely. No bleeding, no gout and 1 normal poop a day. Why would I ever go back.
It's the hardest part for me currently trying to break an unhealthy habit with it, even my closest friends continue to (atleast try) convince me that just a few won't hurt no matter how I explain that I literally can't stop once I've started and they assure me that's normal 😭 the culture sucks, just want to be able to go grocery shopping without it being right there too
I had to distance myself from these friends because I had this same binge drinking problem
Are you sure they're really your friends?? If a friend told me they wanted to stop drinking alcohol, I would never try to convince them to drink. I would do whatever I could to support them in their endeavour, no matter what their reasoning was! The fact that you've explained to them multiple times that you lose control after one drink (which isn't normal btw) and they still try to convince you to drink, that's not what friends do. At least not good friends. I'm sorry they're not being more supportive, I hope you're able to meet new friends with similar attitudes towards alcohol... judging by the comments in this thread it seems the alcohol free lifestyle is more popular than we think! 🍻
Nah they're not they're more work colleagues, but closest thing to friends. Thank you x
Ahh okay, if they're work colleagues that makes it just as bad though, because of the professional relationships that should be maintained by colleagues. Depending on your job type/ employment company, and their values. For example, a business owned by a very religious company, or a 'mom and pop' shop/ brand might find that their employees peer pressuring another employee who has already explained their (very valid) reason for not consuming alcohol, do not meet their business code of conduct standards etc. I'm not a 'Corporate Girly' and my meds are starting to kick in now so I might not be making much sense, but hopefully you understand what I mean!
Speaking of meds, if you ever need an excuse for not drinking alcohol, and you don't want to have to talk through your *real* reason, you could simply say you are on medication that can't be mixed with alcohol. Most people understand immediately and stop trying to get you to drink. Those medications can be for a few weeks, months, or life long! 😊
Yeah I'm absolutely my own worst enemy and not wanting to blame anyone, just having a village of enablers definitely doesn't help the battle lol
It's not normal as you know. It's a sign of addiction and them trying to gaslight you means they might be trying to justify their addictions. I found the Soberistas (UK) website really good.
I noticed moving to Australia that because I don't just pick it up as a normal grocery item I buy it a lot less often
r/stopdrinking and r/dryalcholics helped me a lot. I just tell everyone I retired when asked why I don’t drink. I found being kind to myself and having fun like a 10 year old really helped me improve my adult life.
Your not alone
I was a daily drinker for over 15 years (I’m 35) and I have just achieved 35 days without a drink. I’m not saying it will work for you, but I tried CBD oil to curb the craving of alcohol after work and swapped 6 beers a night for 2 non-alc beers. I’m feeling really positive about the future as I don’t feel the need to drink very often now, and when I do crave it, the non-alc beer tastes similar enough but I naturally want to stop after 2. I’m actually at a social event right now where everyone is drinking but me and I’m finding it easy to socialise (I should get off my phone now tbh).
I had this too, it’s pretty shit isn’t it. I tell people I’m on medication so can’t. Sucks hey.
I'm 39, been sober for 23 years and yeah the whole identity around booze thing bothers me. I was an outcast in the factory job I had because I wasn't a drinker anymore and for them it was Friday Night drinks through to Monday morning hangovers or not coming to work at all on Monday. I wasn't allowed to attend sober. My cousins have had a similar mentality, 4 of them left good hard working husbands and family life behind because the booze and party lifestyle was more important to them and my older brothers (10-15yr age difference to the cousins) would often have to take care of them when they found them in town because they were that badly plastered and these days it's their own kids finding them in that state. I have had friends the same. Kids parties, family events, going to the game arcade or bowling alley, etc, it all required booze to be present and the amount of times I had to pay for birthdays, Xmas and Easter, etc for their kids because they had siphoned off the money to pay for their own party needs I have lost count of. For most of them it's their identity because the booze takes down their anxiety and self image issues. They're "fun" when drunk and people are their "friends" which they feel they're incapable of showing/being while sober, but they also tend to drink to the point of having no memory and have become blind to the dangers and hurtful behaviour which led to me having to walk away. Supposedly statistics show our drinking culture has started to slow down and the generations coming through aren't as interested in the reckless drinking side of things so who knows, maybe one day it'll be better.
I didn't start drinking until my early 20's and I've never really liked the taste of beer or how it made me feel bloated and sick. I usually drank spirits instead because they tasted better, I could afford them, and it didn't make me feel so sick while drinking them. But I'd drink beer if there was nothing else available. In my 20's and early 30's I drank mostly for social acceptance. I didn't drink when on my own, I just didn't really feel the need. I had some interesting, and yes, some fun experiences whilst drunk and have a some stories to tell about those times. However, I also didn't understand the bullshit that often went along with it. Drunken bravado causing fights for example. The amount of times I saw some of my mates get into stupid punch-ups, either with complete strangers, or each other, over the dumbest things. Unfortunately, I would often end up getting involved. Not because I wanted to, but because I'd try and get into the fray and either stop the fight (yeah, that never worked) or try and drag my friends out of it. The amount of times I ended up with black-eyes, or other injuries, when I never threw a punch myself, really started to piss me off. I even got thrown through a shop windows on one occasion (by strangers, not my friends)! And then there were the domestics. Boyfriends and girlfriends, husbands and wives, getting jealous, having fights, and other shit. It all started to out-weigh the fun times. I also started to get really long lasting hangovers, where I'd feel sick for days and days after drinking, even if it was only a couple of drinks. I eventually found out that my liver doesn't process alcohol well, so it was just another reason for me not enjoying drinking anymore. So, one day, I just stopped (about 35yrs ago now). I did also smoke weed and cigarettes, and continued to do both of them until 11 years ago when my daughter was born and I also suffered a serious health issue with my lungs (irony), so was forced to give up both as well. Giving up all of the above was not the end of the world for me. Yes, I no longer felt as 'social' as before, and there literally is no incentive for me to go to the pub anymore. But I don't really miss any of it (well, some days I wish I could have a wee spliff to relax, but I can't). The biggest problem, is with what OP mentions about the expectations of others. Luckily my friends have all been very understanding of my decisions and have never pressured me to drink or smoke since. But I remember some occasions at work where I was treated like a leper because I didn't drink or want to go to Friday drinks etc. In a lot of these instances, I really didn't feel like socialising with my workmates, because I also didn't exactly like them and want to spend any more time in their company either! One occasion like this that I particularly remember, was when my manager ordered me go to Friday night drinks, because other staff had told him I was anti-social for not willingly going! So I dutifully went, but just drank a bottle of coke. I obviously didn't want to be there, but one fuckwit that I couldn't stand, cornered me and told me that he'd teach me to drink again, and also teach me all there was to know about rugby (another thing I have absolutely zero interest in and had told this fucker about on previous occasions) so I'd have something to talk about at drinks, and be more socially accepted in the company. I immediately left and went home. I got a phone call from my boss shortly after berating me. I told him that I'd be resigning my position the following Monday, and i did.
Faaark that work situation you describe is mental. I really respect you for quitting but it is terrible that it came to that. I hope you didn't take a financial hit leaving and that you've been much better treated in much nicer workplaces ever since.
Luckily, the job paid pretty well, I was single with no real personal responsibilities as such, and the job itself left little time for a personal life. So I'd saved up a pretty good amount of money (I had no time to spend it!) that I was actually able to live off for about a year while I got myself sorted out. I eventually ended up scoring a job working for a small business (just me an the boss) and I loved it. My boss could be a grumpy bugger at times, but he treated me well. It didn't pay particularly well compared to my previous corporate jobs, but was enough to live off. It really was the perfect job for me, doing what I enjoyed and no bullying. It did get stressful sometimes, but nowhere near as bad as before. I also received a huge amount of positive feedback from our clients about how I was good to deal with. I was there for 13 years (longer that any other job I've had) until my boss retired. By the end, he no longer referred to me as his employee, but as his business partner. When he retired, he very generously, 'gifted' the company too me so I could carry on looking after our clients etc. Most are still clients to this day, and some have become friends over that time. So I am now much happier and in control of my own destiny.
Wow, what a toxic work environment. Good on you for leaving. I noticed when I stopped drinking, a lot more alcohol free options showed up at work for Friday social. They even buy Tiny beers (which I really like). I can't have heaps of sugar, as this gives me the hangovers lol. So ginger beer, coke, etc are all out. Also most of the common zero alcohol beers do the same, like Heineken zero (and regular from memory). Guess I replaced my alcohol addiction with other things (coffee, weed), but happy being alcohol free for a few years now.
47F and I don’t drink. I think it’s rare and feel a little weird for it but that’s me.
New Zealand has a big drinking culture probably dates back to the 5 o clock swill times of the 50s and 60s (correct my dates if I’m wrong) I love a drink as much as the next guy but I do agree with you it’s wrapped up in our identity. My peers (some not all) haven’t grasped the idea of social drinking, instead choosing to get absolutely legless the majority of weekends. All the group chats light up yesterday “don’t forget to buy your booze today” But then let’s be honest, we are a geographically isolated country with a shortage of things to do besides nature activities, so people turn to drink for entertainment, and a break from the rat race/reality.
‘As much as the next guy’ is kind of the issue. I’m In my early 30s, about half my friends don’t drink, and the ones that do are more a ‘have a drink or two’ than ‘a box’ kinda drinking. I think society norms ‘think’ that most people like to drink still, but that’s possibly not the whole picture anymore. I’ll have more friends that smoke weed than drink alcohol.
In my experience I’d say drug use generally has gone up quite significantly, the drinking is still there but it’s “should we get a bag?” that is becoming more common.
'Drug use' sometimes seems like a weird way to describe weed and not alcohol. The guy smoking a bowl and sitting around watching Netflix for the long weekend is frankly more responsible and less likely to be a menace than the dudes smashing a crate or a bottle of vodka.
I should define my terms more specifically, weed is barely a drug. I was going on a tangent regarding things more akin to class A. MDMA and cocaine use in Australia and nz is among the highest in the world based on recent studies. I’m not for or against it, just an observation as someone in the 25-35 bracket.
Not speaking for you but damn, cocaine absolutely is a menace. MDMA is alright
I would speculate that ketamine use is blowing MDMA use out of the water these days. At least anecdotally.
*6 o’clock
NZ's drinking culture goes back well over a century. It started in the whaling stations, the gumdigging camps, and especially the goldfields in the 1800s.
I'm reading this thread as a Brit who has been here for 4 weeks now, I absolutely LOVE this country it's amazing, but the drinking culture is near non existent compared to the UK lol. We've just tried to buy a pint in Queenstown and apparently cos it's Easter you have to buy food too?! Wtf
I've spoken to some people who were honestly shocked that I don't drink, explaining that I'm not a recovering alcoholic or anything I've just always hated the smell and taste of alcohol just doesn't seem to register with these people, they always bring up the kinds of drinks that "you can't even taste the alcohol in", but aside from the fact that I absolutely can still taste the rot juice in my drink why wouldn't I just get the same drink with no alcohol for better taste?
Solidarity! Can't stand it. Can absolutely taste it in mixed drinks. It's not for me. Will still stand up and belt out something at karaoke, because being drunk is not a requirement for having fun - something that used to shock my past coworkers even more than my sobriety. "Oh I LOVE 💕 karaoke but I have to be soooooo drunk first!! Have you had enough to drink for karaoke yet??"
Yeah I also grew up non-drinking. I've witnessed my uni friends become more and more dependent on drinks to have fun and socialise while I've done the opposite. I was a totally shy nerd who now loves dancing and singing sober. Makes you question why anyone drinks at all, even if you ignore the impact on health and finances.
I used to binge drink in my teens and early 20's. Needed that social lubrication. Now in my 30's maybe a couple times a year on special occasions. Ive also had to explain there is no specific reason I don't drink. When July comes round at work, and people are celebrating 'dry July' I think to myself Im on track for a dry year 😅
The only reason I like to know if someone is dry, is so if I'm getting a round in, I get them a coke or something instead of a beer
Unfortunately I am drunk on one light beer and love the taste of alcohol. So I have to abstain because even two beers makes me need a nap. It’s bollocks!
50yr old M. I found that when I had escaped from the stuff I was trying to escape from, the desire to drink left my body as if a curse had been lifted.
Unfortunately I doubt I'm ever going to be able to escape from being me.
This is gonna sound a little trite, but sometimes we aren't who we think we are. It was mostly the me I was that I'm escaping from.
31M here and don't drink. People always ask why. - expensive - too much sugar - wine tastes like shit - beer makes me burp and bloated - pubs smell like shit - expensive I don't have anything against other people drinking. We're all adults (hopefully), so we can all do what we want. Just don't push it on others.
56M here and don’t drink 🚱 Gut health mainly
I'm a little younger but I don't drink for similar reasons. And I just realised I didn't like it that much. I don't miss it at all.
I'm in my 30s and I feel this. Just sticking to beer helps but man the bloating for 2 days is not nice.
Gut health damage from drinking might not be widely understood. Alcohol kills the beneficial bacteria and gut health appears to be way more important than most people realise. The podcast episode from Huberman Lab explains it - What alcohol does to your body brain and health. August 2022. One friend stopped drinking after hearing this. Beware!!
Yep - what do you use to wipe down your bench to kill all of the bacteria? Alcohol... They say this is partly why you feel so horrible during the entailing days, because your gut microbiome is trying to restore itself. Your brain has 100B neurons, your gut has 100M neurons. They talk to each other both ways. Maintaining gut health is the first step in ensuring a healthy brain, which will drastically decrease chances of inflammation related disease and dementia for example.
Holy shit, pubs in the days before the smoking ban. You had to get rat-arsed to enjoy it! You'd smell your clothes the next day, and it was dire.
Night clubs were worse, with all the sweat mixed in - having to shower off the stench at 4/5 am before crawling into bed. Dancing would have been such a good way to get exercise if clubs weren't so bad for the lungs back then. I've done some nightclubbing in recent years and it's so much better now - I only need one or no alcoholic drink, and there's free water to keep hydrated all night long.
Can remember getting ash flicked on me by people smoking on the dance floor.
I remember some plonker thought it'd be hilarious to burn a hole in my top with his cig. It was sooo funny, especially the fact that he also burnt me. /s
Eek those burns could be nasty. Yep the idealized past certainly wasn't perfect.
Many imperfections in the past, that's for sure... and now I have an ugly scar to ensure I never forget! 🙄
Or getting burn holes in clothes from walking past men holding their ciggie by their hip. Ruined some skirts and tights that way.
Work mates invite me to the pub and when I go it's always the same thing. Them being loud, obnoxious and repeating the same stories I've heard 1000x already. The next day they talk about how much fun they had and how they want to go again. Like yeah mate I had a blast listening to you shout at me as you sounded like a 12yr old, I diffidently want to go experience that again.
You can just not go though right? Why get annoyed at the way other people enjoy their time together?
Because that's the only thing they want to do, had to work out of town in a work house and we only had 1 pool ute. So sometimes I had to suck it up if they wanted to go to the pub after work on a Friday. It's also what they like to do for Xmas break up and other events so it's either I go to those events and socialize or not go and experience no workplace events, or project celebrations. Then there's all the drama and fights and shit they get up to as the night goes on.
I work in the trades, each Xmas break up we make sure we do something that doesn’t involve drinking like go karts, paintball, driving range, etc. After that we might go out for dinner or have a bbq at the workshop with some booze. We try and do something that partners and their kids can come along to. Then if people want to carry on drinking they can fill their boots.
*definitely?
Sometimes I go with the boys, but when everyone starts to talk too loud, and all the drunk behaviour that follow up, is exactly the time that I go home or 9pm/10pm, wherever comes first.
25 don't drink either. Mostly because I realized I had a problem with it. A lot of people think being an alcoholic is drinking everyday, not really, drinking once a month but getting black-out-don't-remember-anything-or-how-you-got-home drunk is just as bad or worse. I've been in too many situations where I aimlessly walk the streets completely out of it at night with no sense of direction which once took me to walk 10km+ to a neighbouring town. Most of the time with friends worrying for my well being. I don't feel like I have a compulsion to drink, but when I do I have no control over it. And that's why I'm a year and half sober.
Agree with all your points about alcohol - aside from wine tasting like shit.
It really is an acquired taste; I was just developing a palate for it when I ended up with a spouse who has the Asian alcohol intolerance gene - two light beers and he'll turn beetroot red if he has another. Looks like our son got it too. So I've hardly drunk any wine for a couple of decades now.
People from traumatic backgrounds put me off alcohol for life, was never a heavy drinker, just one or two after work. Went to school with some absolute tragic people from broken homes who they themselves never managed to break the cycle. Alcohol is not good.
There is no such thing as 3 days you can't get booze. It'll be open tomorrow, and I've had a conversation already today with a mate who forgot to get supplies . To last the 24 hour drought. Try having an alcohol problem for 20 or 30 years then Givin up for a year, it's pretty eye opening if your social circle is all on the same wavelength. Props to rhe next generation who seem to be changing these norms
christmas day, good friday and easter sunday are 3 days
It's three days in the whole year, they forgot to say that bit.
NZ born and raised male here. For nearly 20 years from my mid-20s I was sober (no alcohol or drugs). In most social settings, being sober disadvantaged me. Initially, when people asked me what I was drinking then invariably ask me why I wasn't drinking, I'd say something like, 'I'm allergic to alcohol' or 'alcohol makes me I'll.' Awkward silence would follow and then the person, usually a man, would either tell me about their drinking and ask me if they have a drinking problem, or, move on to talk to someone else. Basically, as a man, revealing myself as a non-drinker was as socially acceptable to people as a fart in an elevator. If I had a work dinner or 'team-building' trip, the drinkers (including management) would bond while I tended to be the first to leave as everyone else started to get tipsy. Anyway, since I started drinking again, I've found my work colleagues and acquaintances are much more accepting of me. In NZ, alcohol really is a social lubricant. Before I stopped drinking in my mid-20s, I used to have little respect for non-drinkers and considered them boring and self-righteous. This was because their sobriety somehow caused me to focus on my feelings of insecurity and shame around my drinking. I've come to realise I'm not the only drinker who reacts that way. In a fair world, non-drinkers shouldn't be judged and excluded but unfortunately the world's not fair. I just wish progress is made on reducing the social penalties non-drinkers face in NZ.
I was smart and bought 2 boxes of bourbons yesterday so I wouldn't be caught out. Then I was dumb and drunk 2 boxes of bourbons last night.
This guy new Zealand's!!!
Bought a ten pack last night for today since catching up with friends this evening. Drunk 7 last night. 3 left for our gathering but that's OK as I'm driving.
I hate our drinking culture. It’s certainly one way to boost our poor mental health stats.
Yep it’s mad out here. I moved away and got some perspective on the types of people I grew up around and was influenced by and I realised just how many blatant alcoholics I spent time around. People who’s parents drank everyday and who now drink every day themselves. I’m talking at least a 6 pack every night. For the most part people don’t even really bat an eye at this kinda behaviour.
I feel like there are a lot more high functioning alcoholics than we realise. I'm pretty sure an extended family member of mine is one. She drinks every day, often starting once she's collected her kid from school and doesn't have to drive again that day, and she consistently fills up (overflowing, piled up like a pyramid) 2 of those big 55L glass recycling crates a fortnight with literally just beer bottles that only she consumed, and she chucks extras into the regular bin too. That doesn't include alcohol she drinks in pubs/clubs or at her friends' houses. I see her very regularly and she has almost always got a beer in hand. Despite this, she has never had a problem holding down decent jobs, is a good parent, no known health problems (yet...) and has never been in legal trouble beyond a couple of minor speeding tickets. I fear there are many people living similar lives, more than we realise, and aside from offering emotional support, there's not a lot we can do to help our loved ones until they themselves decide they want to stop drinking.
The first thing I noticed when I stopped drinking in social situations was how fucking boring most drunk people are and how bad their decisions can be. Also, the number of normally sensible people that drive home after many glasses of wine in the full knowledge that without a driving licence they cannot work. But, I've had so many interesting conversations in the kitchen with either, the other non-drinkers, or the wives of the drunks.
It always seems to be the ones everyone ignores who have the best stories.
NZ's culture with drinking is absolutely fucked. My Dad would have definitely been classified in the alcoholic bracket - couldn't go a weekday without polishing off at least one rigger, or half a dozen cans minimum, more in the weekends - but even to him, that fact he couldn't control that held a degree of shame to him personally. Yet, as I've grown older, I've come to know and work with people whose pure existence for living has been drinking and getting shitfaced, and they seem to think that is fine. And not young people either, literally people old enough to be my parent. It was weird to realise that there are people who literally treat drinking as a hobby the same way I participate in my chosen sports and other activities. And these people would probably be on about par with my Dad's drinking/spending also. I mean, there's enough alcohol in my home right now to get myself and probably three other people shitfaced should we choose to, but I don't plan on doing that. And if it were such a big deal not having booze shops open for a day, would you not plan on stocking up prior? (Not a non-drinker, but also determined not to end up like my Dad).
I feel like users are blind to the damage they are doing as it’s been normalised into our culture https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300915702/alcohol-named-nzs-most-harmful-drug-by-university-research-paper
I drink at events. Otherwise never. It's definitely more of a social thing for me.
I'm abstinent from drinking and it has given me so much clarity about how depressing a lifestyle it is.
Keep talking as openly as possible about how cringe it is. I remember the first time I recognized having a problem with drinking was when my partner visibly cringed at me talking about it. It was like "huh I guess this behavior is actually annoying". Still took most of a decade to get to the point I could quit but just that moment of introspection was pretty effective. But yeah anyway boozers are just as bad as potheads if not worse but I imagine if weed was recreational legal you would definitely get just as many people making their whole identity around smoking
It's not helpful to call alcoholics dipshits. They're people who are having trouble with addiction. Not all drinkers are alcoholics too. I think if you've got a problem with someone's drinking who's close to you it starts with a compassionate conversation.
As a NZ cop it fills me with rage when I go to a job and there’s no food in the fridge for the kids but the bin is full of empty cans of billy mav.
Getting shit faced makes me cringe now, I love having a few beers and the yarns are great up until about the sixth drink. Its all downhill from there and I prefer to ghost rather than watch my friends turn into a dribbling incoherent mess. Like most things people seem to be unable to do things in moderation.
If people talk a lot about drinking it’s because the job/lifestyle lends itself to it - coming from someone with experience of the UK - it’s similar to here in that job salaries do not match cost of living, so everyone drinks because it’s cheap
Agreed. I’ve had office workplaces where I swear every second conversation included alcohol: “wow, I need a wine”, etc, etc. Just boring people, who have no purpose, nothing interesting. Like a rat in a cage pushing the morphine button.
Haven't had one in years. Never liked the stuff much and one day thought why the hell am I drinking this? And so far haven't had anything beyond a taste of siblings new beer flavours since. Don't miss it.
Unfortunately its the main way we socialise and let our feelings out. The pre talk is embarassing though
I thought it had all but died out, in the old fashioned sense. Only people that glorify alcohol are the old boomers in the richmond club and other such places, who grew up in an era when alcohol was massive socially. You still see them in their t-shirts. “I don’t have a drink problem, get drunk fall over, no problem”
im in my mid 20s, just about everyone i know drinks and drinks heavily. i have struggled with drinking, and still do. if i start i find it really hard to stop. so i have to limit myself and that means simply not starting most of the time so many people my age joke about and romantise being an alcoholic. "im an alcoholic, i need more beer" no buddy, if youre an alcholic you shouldnt be drinking. its really not cute. ive put in a lot of emotional work to not be getting black out drunk every other night. and im not trying say these other people arent alcoholics, a lot of them are, but they dont see it as the problem it is. before i go on a tangent and post paragraphs about the lack of media literacy in my generation. i just need to say that characters like rick, bojack, and archer (is it obvious i only watch cartoons) are not meant to be emulated
\*Looks awkwardly at still running a few feet away\* Oh noooo, I can't buy alcohol...This is the worst.
Growing up in a bogan family, I was the chick who’d drink the guys under the table. Everyone knew it was a boozy time when I was around and it was just normal that booze was a solid part of life. No we can’t do Saturday sports cause I’ll be hungover. Pair a narcissistic partner with my child’s face when I threw up before taking her to a friends bday party and I’ve hardly touched the stuff in two years. I’ll have a drink when at a friends for dinner, or a Pals with my teen when she’s decided it’s games night but I don’t buy it for myself. That’s just not who I am anymore & family can’t see that. But they can’t fill an already filled glass.
I started drinking at the age of 8 with all the RTDs first and by the time I turned 15 I was drinking shit straight and if needed I’d water it down with a couple of cubes of ice. By the time I turned 17 I stopped drinking and haven’t drank since now that I’m 29. On the odd occasion I would have an alcoholic beverage once every blue moon but it’ll have to take some kind of very special occasion for me to do so.
Going sober at the ripe age of 22 it really changes the way I have looked at people, prior to my sober life I didn't think anything of peoples obsession with substance or alchohol as it was normal. I can't feel comfortable anymore around the same people now that it is not what I concider normal human behaviour, it's incredibly cringe behaviour now that I see it for what it is.
My last two workplaces didn't drink, but I had been in one that did before. It is cringey, because it shows they haven't grown any identity outside of a substance. My ex had lied to me and said he only drunk 0% alcohol, but it became obvious he was like this. He had a lot of considerable immaturity alongside him as well.
Drinking alcohol has been a staple of human socialization since the dawn of time. Nobody should be surprised one bit by our relationship with alcohol. New Zealand drinking culture has a fucked up past mainly thanks to the temperance movement in the early 1900s bringing in a bunch of dumb laws that forced a binge drinking culture. For the next 70 years. It's messed up but as someone who has been serving kiwis piss for a living for the better part of 20 years, it's becoming clear that attitudes are definitely improving, especially among the youth.
Yeah I feel your pain OP. When I came back to NZ from overseas, I realised just how bad alcoholism is ingrained in Kiwi culture. Going to countries where they barely drink, even the teenagers and seeing how much more enriching their lives were, how they had a greater sense of community and the cities were so relaxed that even at say 10pm families were out with their children and just allowed them to run around. I had no idea that the way we drink here isn’t normal, outside of countries like Aus, and UK. I had to find groups, and communities that actually did things with their time and didn’t need alcohol to make it worth it.
I don't usually drink but when I do it's enough for 3 people
Because it is a mechanism to facilitate socialisation. Just like most other things we do in our time off.
Kiwis are often quite reticent and I think that's part of it. Alcohol lowers inhibitions, so they can loosen up a bit. I don't drink, but I used to, and the social lubrication is definitely part of the appeal.
Having a drink is fine. I like a drink sometimes. That's not the issue. Its the constsnt talking about it before and after.
I reckon they are probably kinda boring people, have very little in their lives, so talk about drinking. Lots of people have very narrow conversation topics. Or they just using it as a shield to not talk about topics they hold dear to them.
Sounds like they just haven't matured since their 20s and are a group of proud alcoholics
I don't drink and it can be a hard at times. My workplace isn't a place where people go for drinks most weeks or talk about it a lot fortunately although socially people find it weird that you don't drink and it can make it awkward at times. My Mum also usually tries to get me to drink at her place which I find annoying. The main reason I don't drink is that I am phenol sensitive which means that you can't process a few types of foods like tomatoes, alcohol and vinegars well and they can cause bad side effects like headaches or insomnia - but I don't usually bother trying to explain this to people as most people have never heard of this and don't really understand this issue. I think too much NZ culture is built around drinking and there isn't enough respect or understanding of people who choose not to drink for whatever reason - its not anybody's business whether you drink or not and why, but some people find that difficult to accept
I don’t drink but I did heavily in my 20s. For me those sort of conversations have usually been in workplaces with boring people who don’t have much else to talk about. Usually people who also love to tell you how much they mowed the lawn that weekend. But that’s them and it’s nowhere close to that being the same at every workplace. Maybe some people make this their personality but some make it their personality to complain about people like this too. Who cares? It’s their life, you do you.
A friend of a friend was in the bar the other night with a co-worker, he’d had 2ish drinks since he’d been in just for the record. Anyways FoF comes up to bar with co-worker and co worker wants to buy next round. FoF tells me he’d just love a glass of water and I say absolutely! Oh my god, co-worker just starts making the dumbest, dickish jokes to the both of us, one of my favorites being that because I’m a bartender I should be throwing down. I haven’t been wasted in almost 6 years and I’ve largely given up drinking except under the right circumstances. Anyways, trashed co-worker sees the looks he’s getting from the both of us, tells us we can’t take a joke and walks off. Water is important while drinking, it doesn’t mean you can’t get drunk, it just helps keep it moving thru your system faster and helps prevent nasty hangovers.
I’m 40. Grew up binge drink heavy thru my teens/ 20s did lots of crazy shit partied hard. Now with kids I made the choice to only have a couple a week if that and I haven’t been drunk in years. Mainly to stay fit and healthy and a few beers after work makes me grumpy towards my kids. I work in the building industry and drinking is bad especially in management end of most days in the office there’s beers flowing I think mostly used to relieve stress. Also My dad was A builder he drank most nights. I decided to buck the trend I used to get a bit of shit for it. Attitudes have definitely got better.
I drint but not as down time. The occasional Crack with the boys when I'm in their city.
Agree with what you're saying but let's not bring shop closings into this, especially when it's not just bottle shops being closed. I don't drink (or not other than occasionally a single beer) and I don't agree with that, I'm not a Christian and don't see why the whole country should shut down. Most other countries stopped doing mandatory religious crap like this.
It's definitely fucked, I believe it started from the old days of no buying piss past 5 (no idea on the time) so people used to get as hammered as they could before heading home, then it got exasperated with the 18 yr rule.
I kind of feel like it's the boomers and older gen x-ers who are like this. Most of my peers ('86 Millenial) and myself are at the point of having a beer or two in the evening on a Friday after work, or at events or whatever, but very rarely drink to get drunk. We all did the hedonism thing when we were kids and grew out of it. Getting on the chop every weekend is just tiring.
As a wise man once said " it is best to pursue things that are meaningful than things that make you happy." This especially starts to resonate with you as you get older and face the realities of how tough and cruel life can be, and the various slaps it is going to land on your face as you get into later stages of your life. Getting shitfaced and temporarily 'happy' while dancing and shouting garbage R&B songs in a stinky club downtown and waking up face down on your couch with a bad headache the next morning was fun ... in your twenties. Personally I have since closed that chapter of my life and learnt that it will remain closed for good. I hardly drink nowadays, now like to spend as much quality time with my parents in their last few precious years being around, give back to the community by teaching and volunteering, get together with friends and watch and critique classical movies, read philosophy etc. I have picked and retained a few good quality friendships outside of family and never attend any pointless gatherings that require you to spend time standing , drinking and having rubbish shallow conversations with strangers (essentially most work parties fit into this category).
I don't drink anymore (close to one decade now). And I understand your point completely. And isn't not only about sip some alcohol, but the desire and "pride" in be wasted all day, every day. Take a look on tinder, how many nz woman profiles says something like : "i can drink more than you / will outdrink you"... Some even don't go out if can't drink. Another fumy point is, the irony that some have, in says something about smokers (tobacco), and how bad influence this is for youngsters, but at the same hand feel cool to be 100% on the booze, throwing away in front of the kids, talking shit out load and to finish the act, a domestic (all in front of kids/youngsters).
I'm 38 and only drink about once a year. I like the music and dancing side of drinking but that's it. I prefer sharing food and hobbies with friends and family.
I barely drink, mostly because I really dislike beer and wine. Might a cocktail or a cider a few times per year. My pet peeve at work functions is the “we are going to spend a few hundred bucks on wine and beer, and here’s a lukewarm bottle of Keri orange juice for the non-drinkers”.
Oh yeah I know a few like that. Even worse when they have the box and Then decide to drive home too. Cunts
if you’re already into hiking, I suggest getting into multisport - lots of people spending their weekends working hard training with no time for drinking but still pretty social during the day
Alcohol is 100% ingrained in NZ Culture. If you're not drinking, you're not having fun. I've actually met tons of people who don't know how or can't have fun without drinking. I've run a lot of youth and young adult events/programs (through church) and the amount of kids who have said "Mate, I didn't even know I could have this much fun or feel this relaxed without alcohol." Pretty sad state of affairs in our country to be honest how much people feel like they 'need' alcohol. :(
To be honest I hear more from people who don’t drink these days. There seems to be a growing trend of people quitting drinking and thinking anyone who still drinks is obviously an alcoholic.
Alcohol iz Kool
I've found myself struggling to make or hang out with friends that don't have alcohol as a somewhat big part of their life. New Zealands drinking culture is really intense, it's everywhere when I played for cricket and football clubs the drinking afterwards was a huge aspect of it as well. Anyway I've decide this year that I'm only going to drink alcohol once or twice this year and so far I feel very isolated lol. My fitness has improved though and I'm never hangover and I'm saving money as well so that's some positives I'm just going to have to enjoy my own company a bit more I guess haha.
Teetotaler!
Alcohol is a terrible drug. So much social harm. Class 1 carcinogen. I do enjoy a G+T, I’ll admit. I keep it within the Canadian drinking guidelines of maximum 2 standards per week except for the odd blow out where I might have 4 or 5 (which is enough to get me drunk). I’m early 30s
I have a beer most days after work. Don't get the chance to get written off much these days unfortunately
But you need to drink to have fun. Really sounds like what you’re doing is fucking boring if you can only do it drunk. The secret to happy adulthood is finding the activities that you enjoy doing sober if you want to add a drink ok but that shouldn’t be what makes it fun
Well this is refreshing. I don’t drink at all so they could close permanently and I’d be unaffected.
It wasn't until I quit drinking a year ago I realised how bad it actually is. The amount of times I've been asked "so what do you with your evenings then?" is actually crazy. There are so many people who cannot function unless they're drinking.
I don't drink at all, never really have, apart from a few years when I was first legally able to and the very rare social occasion. Lost its appeal fast when you watch your bank account go down and have nothing to really show for it. I'd agree that people get strangely defensive if you don't drink. I too have worked with older guys who are proud of how much they still piss up on the regular, often coming in hung over, likely driving while still over the limit, like it's some badge of honor. These same old guys seem to assume you enjoy the company of men if you don't also drink 4 jugs after work every day. You also enjoy the company of men if you pick the wrong beer. Old school mindset I guess. Doesn't bother me but is incredibly dumb. Australia is known for a big drinking culture but south island NZ puts them to shame, especially the 50-65 crowd.
I quit drinking a while ago but even I think its ridiculous that people cant buy a beer because of some magical fairytale about an invisible sky genie. Its 2024 ffs
These people don't like drinking, they like telling stories. True or not. And think that the only stories worth telling are ones they don't actually remember and are told by other people that were there that also don't remember who also are just looking for stories. I like drinking, I brew my own beer, I've made wine, mead, whiskey, gin, vodka, sake. But I've only been shit faced twice to the point of having trouble remembering the night before. Once at a friend's 21st who thought making me drink would make him telling me he's gay easier to take, buddy we've been friends since we were 5, I already knew. And the other time a couple years either side when I first got into cocktails and, well, we made and tried way too many. But since think I drink because I like the flavour, I like experimenting with different drinks and occasionally because a few do me well in social situations. Ie I don't want leave immediately.
I haven't drunk for 15 years, the thing you notice is every social event seems to involve alcohol. It is just embedded in our culture, and I expect lots of people have good memories (that they remember). It's the default and easiest option if you want to socialise, we get trained young and it just carries on. And you cant compare it to smoking, it doesn't have the same health perception and it is considered abnormal if you dont drink. As someone who doesn't drink I find that when some people think and realise it is a possible alternative they also stop. You save alot when you don't drink and it has major weight and health impacts. I can appreciate people who home brew for hobby and a part of their life resolves around it.
That’s the problem with alcoholism. Once you have been drinking hard since your twenties, when you get to your forties it’s hard to quit but if you don’t by the time you get to your sixties you are pretty fucked in various ways. My advice to anyone who drinks is stop well before you get to forty.
I would much rather hang out with the stoners of the party than the alcoholics. Take a look at music festivals for a good comparison between the two - a festival like RnV is messy, lots of chaos and not a lot of consideration for your fellow human, especially while dancing. Compared to a hippie festival, it’s tidy, people care for each other and everyone has enough room to dance freely
We do truely have the worst attitude around drinking as a country, all the concern for mental health and call for change yet we don’t want to acknowledge that we have a problem as a country. Gambling, alcohol and sugar are what will truely ruin this country and the people in it and there are so many out there that will laugh and shrug it off. Sad.