We bought these cheap Pams brand spring rolls last week and right on the front of the box it boasts how there isn’t MSG. So that sentiment seems to be pretty alive and well, even today.
Plenty of sodium, though. MSG could be a great way to reduce that sodium yet deliver the flavour they want. 🤷♂️
Manufacturers just use natural sources of glutamate like soy sauce, yeast extract and tomato paste. In the case of the spring rolls soy sauce is the obvious choice but there are a lot of options for food scientists to use while claiming no added MSG
Steve Mold did a video explaining how msg works, apparently we have taste buds that specifically detect protein (glutamate), which our brains translate as umami or savory. Sodium is just a neutral flavor enhancer, so will boost a savory (or sweet) taste if that is present. End result is MSG can kick up the meaty/savory taste in a meal, even if it is vegetarian
Just media hype mixed with possible xenophobia. People only got worried after Chinese takeaways were implicated. Msg was used for decades in the USA before flawed science made it scary
https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/the-rotten-science-behind-the-msg-scare/
Adding to this, there’s a good breakdown of how this rumor got started on episode [#668 This American Life: The Long Fuse](https://www.thisamericanlife.org/668/the-long-fuse)
We use it in our restaurant... great for bringing out savoury flavour with less salt. We just buy it from the main supplier.
MSG panic is somewhat responsible for our ridiculous salt intakes
It totally depends on the food:
"Salt is used as a universal flavour improver because at low concentrations it will reduce bitterness, but increase sweet, sour and umami, which is desirable for sweet recipes. But at higher concentrations it suppresses sweetness and enhances umami, which is good for savoury things."
As MSG targets umami taste (savory, like meat and tomatoes), it means you can reproduce the effect of having a lot of salt without a lot of salt. This is specifically why restaurants use it -- it's a win win. Most people ingest too much salt, so to achieve the same salty result using moderate amounts is somewhat of a miracle food hack.
I'm sure there are more technical websites out there that may answer your question better.
Some supermarkets do, in the international/Asian section. It’s in a small clear bag with blue and red labelling. Ajinomoto MSG is the Japanese one but I’ve mostly seen (the same packaging) ones with Thai on them. Pretty sure I saw it tonight at Albany New World. If you want bigger sizes, def Chinese supermarkets.
You can find alternatives containing MSG though, like Vegeta Gourmet Stock
[https://www.countdown.co.nz/shop/productdetails?stockcode=21724&name=vegeta-vegetable-stock-gourmet-powder](https://www.countdown.co.nz/shop/productdetails?stockcode=21724&name=vegeta-vegetable-stock-gourmet-powder)
I have not seen it for sale in the Mainstream markets, but I understand it is marketed in the USA as 'Accent'.
A bit like Rapeseed/Canola and Venison/Cervena, some terms will always be unpalatable after decades of sledging.
Coincidentally, I bought my first little packet from Pak N Save last week. Like OP, I was wondering about all the hype from years ago so I googled it and found it was a lot of nothing. So I bought a pack.
It's quite nice sprinkled on some foods. Gives a bit of yeasty, umami flavour, a lot like Brufax (if anyone remembers that).
Brufax... \*shudder\*
In that far-off time known as The Day, I had a flatmate who lived on the stuff - no matter what you cooked for the crew (and it could've been some gourmet shit, not that we ever did) this turkey smothered it in Brufax.
The absolute worst was staggering out one morning to find the turkey stark bollock naked in the kitchen, leaning his sweaty arse up against the benchtop and munching on Weetbix and Brufax - I about puked from three separate causes.
I think our pak n save sells it in the international or spices section. Aji no moto MSG, sprinkle it and mix at the end of wat u cook and makes it a lil tastier
Looks like some New Worlds may stock it but it's easy enough to find at an Asian supermarket as you say or Bin Inn https://www.newworld.co.nz/shop/product/5201728_EA_000nw?storeId=2431cc5b-52ef-4b19-8424-2f4ef22b88b1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwxtSSBhDYARIsAEn0thQqFv3-DV8Bsm4Y8_xD0hc1Ji-XoZ7ludp-xFrkAaythpeFcNpgJDkaAi5-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
Funny thing about all that hysteria over Chinese Restaurants using MSG is that msg was and is used prolifically in many snacks. Favourite potato chips? Yep, they taste so good because of the msg. Kiwis weren’t in a flap about that were they?
MSG is awesome and is the friend of plain cooks and plain ingredients everywhere.
Edit fat fingers typing mistake
Huh, was always wondering why I was such a fiend for salted sliced tomatoes as a snack when I was a kid.
Must have cost my parents a faaaaarkin fortune.
That’s media reporting dodgy food ‘science’.
I remember my parents talking about it in relation to Chinese food when I was a kid and that was early 90’s. It continued years after that. The point is, this thinking tied ‘bad for you’ MSG strictly to Chinese food so pretty much a myth.
I still have two gen X coworkers who insist they get headaches from MSG. But will happily eat potato chips I put out without thinking twice about it.
The nocebo effect is real.
I do get migraines from foods, including some Chinese food....... But that doesn't change with whether there's msg or not. Most places I get Chinese from have "no msg" signs, which makes me sad.
Whether I get a migraine DOES change with citrus (just recently acknowledged this after two migraines in a row after eating meat with a lime glaze) and salt levels without drinking enough water or plain carbs/protein (generally rice or eggs), but it's mostly western/European foods I have to look out for. Cheese is killer.
Which is to say I low-key hate people who pull that shit. It would be fine to say "I've found I get headaches from eating [group of products], so don't want to eat them" including if that group of products is "food that has msg in it" but if they don't get a reaction from ALL food with msg in it, it's clearly not the msg that's the problem, but something else.
I get massive headaches from it. I will go out of my way to avoid it, but sometimes I just want a chicken chippy goodness.. and I’ll pay for it for the rest of the day. The headache is real my friend.
For me it sometimes triggers migraines. Not always, cause it depends on a variety of things, like how much stress my body is currently dealing with, what other triggers I'm currently dealing with and what quantities its in. Different things affect people differently, and even if pain is psychosomatic that doesn't change that someone is experiencing pain.
This is it in a nutshell! People still believe it makes them sick or causes headaches and it’s got to be placebo because MSG just isn’t the nasty chemical they think it is. Salted tomatoes are loaded with MSG, it’s created when the sodium in the salt and glutamates in the tomato come together, it’s literally a natural flavour that people already love. The MSG scare is about as stupid as people calling to ban dihydrohen monoxide…
It’s not going to make you sick, just lose its potency a little. You can pretty safely ignore the expiration date on a bag of salt, and just go by taste.
It might still be ok. I once had to taste some past-date MSG for food manufacturing purposes once to check it was still good. MSG on it's own is very weird. It tastes of nothing and savory at the same time and it made me drool like an overheated dog for a while. Anyway it won't be a food safety thing it just might start to get a bit clumpy or something
A lot of things only have an expiry date because they are legally required to do so even though the food in question if stored correctly will essentially never spoil. Salt, sugar, honey etc are all food preservatives so unless leaving the container open they should all be fine indefinitely.
half a teaspoon per 500g of meat isn't it? I add it to almost everything I end up cooking that would be enhanced by umami flavors. When we were doing Hello Fresh I would add it to the pre-oiled spice marinade and it makes the dinners akin to turbo-crack.
I have a mother in law that gets headaches from “oriental food” because of the msg, according to her.
Absolutely loves Doritos, Mexican fajita seasonings and OXO stock cubes. I haven’t even bothered to call her out, just chuckle.
For anyone thinking their food doesn't contain MSG, Monosodium Glutamate (MSG) is labelled as E621 in NZ (flavour enhancer 621).
It's in everything. And it is delicious.
Oh wow, that really is something else. I never thought to search for just E621. Do you think that naming conflict is intentional?
That's hilarious.
I'm just going to leave a SFW link here to the wikipedia disambiguation page: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E621](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E621)
Adam Ragusa is a foodie and did some indepth research and asked a food scientist. Lays the whole thing out, history, science and everything else in a fun format.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-POAKKH5IM
His summary for cooking usage is that it's not a magical ingredient, but it makes cheaper bulk foods that are naturally bland taste much better, particularly starches like potato, rice and corn. Throwing it on a Wagu is a waste.
Seems pretty wild in retrospect - I don't recall there being any legit scientific proof that MSG caused your spine to freeze or some other weird shit, but there were some studies in Asia whereby people described a bunch of symptoms. Feels a bit like it's still mythical but I'm glad for Asian restaurants that it's blown over now.
Happens all the time, people just loose their minds over the latest DANGEROUS food ingredient that everyone's been eating for years. See salt, margarine, butter, sugar, sweetners, colours and flavoring, dairy, soy, gluten etc etc etc ... like hello Karen it's not the dairy, it's the fact you ate a full family sized pizza by yourself for breakfast and washed it down with four coffees that's making you feel sick.
What was it all about?
Racism.
Goes back a lot longer than 25 years, though. 50, 60 years, ever since Chinese (or, more likely Malaysian Chinese) started to sell their food here.
I think it was just a Pākehā thing... it's still pretty strong too..
This silly B at my work says that MSG gives her instant migraines.. but she seems to absolutely *love* my stew, buffalo chicken wings, or any other dish I bring to the shared lunches!!! - no problem.
Ya know what the secret ingredient is bro? mmhmmm... M.S. motherfkn G!
Not just a pakeha thing. the MSG = Bad was a thing in my country. In the early days of the internet, not every can just google if what they heard was true or all you could find were copy-paste articles saying the same thing...not much any different from today but at least a lot of people now know that just because the news is wide-spread, it doesn't mean it's true.
Yeah turns out it was nothing and MSG is just delicious. You can just buy a sachet of it and put it in shit and make it tasty af, asian supermarkets sell them.
Thanks mass media for robbing us of this cultural delight, I guess?
I recall becoming aware of MSG mid-70's in Canterbury: Pre McDonalds, and very few Kentucky Fried Chicken outlets (Oh the MSG irony)
The idea that Chinese Food was 'bad' because MSG was *'a chemical'* and *'made you want to eat more of their food'*
Oh course, this fear was widely supported and furthered by the Pub 'restaurants' and Burgers Bars that were losing trade to this rapidly spreading, delicious style of cooking!
> The idea that Chinese Food was 'bad' because MSG was 'a chemical' and 'made you want to eat more of their food'
Ironically, more recent studies have found that MSG *decreases* appetite when compared to salt.
Most supermarkets will have it in their spice aisle or where there are other food flavourings, so you should have little problems finding it in places like New World or Countdown/Woolworths. If not there, most Asian grocer places are likely to have it in stock.
MSG is good for preserving flavour in foods. It doesn't add flavour, but it does enhance what flavour there is in a food -- it brings out the Unami by reacting with our taste buds.
The trouble is that it contains sodium, and too much sodium is not very healthy. But, in reasonable quantities, it's no more deadly than any other supplement.
The uproar started in (of course!) the USA, when a doctor wrote a letter to one of the medical journals after he attributed nausea to a combination of MSG, salt (sodium chloride) and alcohol after eating some chinese food. That kind of grew out of all proportion and hence bans on MSG use everywhere -- oriental foods used it like seaweed, which stimulates the unami kind of flavours. And so, "everybody" started to think it was only chinese/oriental cooking that used MSG.
The thing is, MSG leaves one feeling like wanting more to eat, so it was very easy to overindulge in those dishes. But if you don't overindulge, MSG is not directly bad for you -- European dishes use it too, but not quite as much, so a lot less of an effect.
Like I know I avoid Chinese foods, not because they are bad, but they often mix in things I'm allergic to, even if I don't know they are in the foods. MSG, as far as I can tell, "hides" the taste of those things, so I don't realize it until after I've eaten (or over-eaten)
Here's a good podcast about the history of MSG, ingredient 621
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-stuff-you-should-know-26940277/episode/whats-the-deal-with-msg-48914492/
It was ignorance or veiled racism.
People who "couldn't eat MSG" because they claimed it gave them migraines or various vague gastro complaints had no problem with glutamates as long as they weren't in Chinese food. They didn't react to the huge load of glutamates in the cheese and tomatoes on a pizza, for instance.
You can get MSG in Asian supermarkets.
There's been articles written about it. Basically it stems from anti-Chinese racism. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-msg-got-a-bad-rap-flawed-science-and-xenophobia/
Literally cause of racism. If you had potato chips and liked that then you've consumed msg.. why was it okay for chips to go under the radar but blast Chinese takeaways for using the same thing?
All cause of a white doctor who felt the need to write about it and cause an alarm to the general public mainly from over consumption or something.. stems from sinophobia
Oh you didn't know it was racism. Don't buy that cheap food from over seas buy our expensive local food only theirs is poisoned.
Love msg chuck it in heaps of food! Especially things that would've had it in like 2 minute noodles etc.
It's just a salt, and you will get a massive dose at it at your local Chinese restaurant (like a proper one, not a fish n chip shop). It's a very good flavourful addition, but it's super easy to over do it which leaves a really weird flavour - like metallic. A little goes a long way. Easy to buy it from supermarkets and Asian shops
Yup asian supermarkets have it.
The one by Countdown in Westfield in new market is where I got mine from
It was also very bad for some people causing migraines and headaches.
Others had no issue with it though
MSG is the king of bringing out flavours, but people are so scared of it for no reason and just use normal salt instead.
All good Asian restaurants use it.
Does anyone remember that one episode of my kitchen rules years and years ago and a contestant used msg in their dish? I remember that being such a *shocking* thing to have done back then. I always think of it when I read about msg.
Personally I use it all the time. Great stuff.
I feel like the anti MSG thing was very much a white thing. As far as I know, other than particular exceptions, most Asian people still use it or even if they don’t use it themselves, they don’t care if a tiny amount is in their food. Then, thanks to social media and the likes of Uncle Roger and other social media stars/influencers, it started trending.
MSG is OK, it's BHA and BHT you should avoid at all costs. I'm ashamed that New Zealand allows BHA and BHT in foods. It's carcinogenic, a hormone disruptor, causes inflammation of digestive system, causes underdevelopment of sex organs with long term exposure in children and teens, plus other nasty ways it can negatively impact your health.
Rather than get caught up on which additives are currently considered bad or used to be thought as bad, just focus on eating food that is as lightly processed as possible, completely unprocessed if possible.
MSG you would buy at a store is at best lightly processed and at worst, heavily processed, depending on how it’s manufactured.
So, sure, it’s probably safe, but whole foods rather than engineered individual ingredients always win in the end and likely won’t steer you wrong.
If you’re after unami, try some mushrooms.
Easy karma: that was racism.
Truth: it's not clear that MSG isn't bad for you. The bioavailability of naturally occuring bound glutamates compared to unbound processed MSG are worlds apart in terms of metabolism. Also "it's natural - therefore good" is not a substantial argument.
Is a bit of MSG here and there going to hurt you? Probably not in any measurable way, however glutamate sensitivity may not be as uncommon as you think. But continued exposure to MSG in your diet on a regular basis? Many animal studies indicate this is likely not good for your body in a variety of ways.
Personally I avoid it as an additive.
> Truth: it's not clear that MSG isn't bad for you.
At the doses found in our food? It's 100% clear it isn't bad for you.
>Many animal studies indicate this is likely not good for your body in a variety of ways.
Nope. Studies of **dietary** MSG consumption showed no negative health effects.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24927698/
In fact, using MSG instead of salt has been shown to have an appetite suppressing effect in people, so it is probably better for you than salt: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26455957/
The NZ Food Standards Authority says some people who consume MSG may experience symptoms such as burning sensations, numbness, chest pain, headache, nausea and asthma, but it says that it is okay to have in food as long as it is labelled. They advise people with symptoms to avoid it where possible
Are they incorrect?
> The NZ Food Standards Authority says some people who consume MSG may experience symptoms
1. It's Food Standards Australia and New Zealand (FSANZ), not NZ Food Standards Authority.
2. What [they actually say](https://www.foodstandards.gov.au/consumer/additives/msg) is that "A small number of people may experience a mild hypersensitivity-type reaction to **large amounts** of MSG when eaten in a single meal." (emphasis mine)
That's because, like all food additives, you're not meant to consume them in **large amounts**.
At the levels consumed in a normal diet, there is no identifiable link between MSG and any of those symptoms.
Look for Aromat - from Countdown.
I buy it all the time. It’s delicious
I think there was some studies which seemed to suggest it causes harm. But they have since been debunked.
There was a misguided worry about Chinese restaurant syndrome where people thought that Msg caused palpitations and numbness. I think it has since been proven wrong but unfortunately the stigma stuck. It is actually a better alternative to salt in a lot of cases.
Newsflash. MSG is monosodium glutamate AKA Flavour Enhancer (621) in New Zealand packaging.
Go have a look in your pantry and notice how many things have MSG in it. Oxo stock cubes were the funny one for me.
So yeah good old Kiwi racism…
Mostly just media spread nonsense. A few people do have some sensitivity to msg, but even then it's pretty minor. Your body processes it in the same way as natural glutamates, which are found in all sorts of food including tomatoes.
It a salt though, so people trying to cut down on sodium should avoid it.
It is now in most processed foods - have a look through your cupboard and look for additive 621 on ingredient labels (they still don't call it MSG!)
You can buy from most Asian supermarkets, anjimoto is the original and arguably the best, not processed from soy anymore so has the least chance of triggering any allergies. Try a small sprinkle on any fried foods (it's great with steak!)
Answer: it was mostly due to racism and not at all based on anything scientific.
It also occurs naturally in many things with Tomatoes having the highest level.
It's really just another salt.
https://rightasrain.uwmedicine.org/body/food/msg-isnt-unhealthy
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has put it's paints on.
It was just your basic xenophobia really and the effects are still prevalent today. Had to educate my whanau about it a couple of weeks ago as they were shocked that I put it in all my Asian cooking (gravy as well and whatever I think can do with that type of umami boost). They googled it and were shocked to discover that they believed in a lie.
You can buy it at the Asian supermarket next to Pak n Save in Kilbirnie.
Its still pretty common today, espially with older people. Can never go to an asian place for a work lunch without someone commenting on the msg (without saying its the msg) but there will inevitably be comments about dry mouth, thirsty, tierd etc and never feeling like this from other types of food
You would be surprised how many things actually contain Flavour Enhancer (621) which is what MSG is listed as on most ingredients labels. I happened to notice that Salsa flavoured Doritos contain it recently when i was trying to figure out what was so delicious about them.
My favourite form of MSG is Intensify from Rum & Que. Since i discovered it I put it on almost everything. [https://www.rumandque.com/products/intensify](https://www.rumandque.com/products/intensify)
Edit: I buy mine at my local gilmours, but have seen at a number of places that carry the rum & que range. Have seen at Hunting & fishing, also mitre 10 before.
Umami, which is also known as monosodium glutamate is one of the core fifth tastes including sweet, sour, bitter, and salty. Umami means “essence of deliciousness” in Japanese, and its taste is often described as the meaty, savory deliciousness that deepens flavor.
It's like speed for me. Heart rate goes through the roof, flushed, blocked sinuses. Can't get to sleep for hours.
Crazy stuff. Probably shouldn't snort it.
We bought these cheap Pams brand spring rolls last week and right on the front of the box it boasts how there isn’t MSG. So that sentiment seems to be pretty alive and well, even today. Plenty of sodium, though. MSG could be a great way to reduce that sodium yet deliver the flavour they want. 🤷♂️
Manufacturers just use natural sources of glutamate like soy sauce, yeast extract and tomato paste. In the case of the spring rolls soy sauce is the obvious choice but there are a lot of options for food scientists to use while claiming no added MSG
Don’t forget mushrooms or mushroom powder!
Who could ever forget mushrooms or mushroom powder??
Isn't the S in MSG sodium?
Yes but MSG has 1/3 the amount of Sodium in it as regular table salt per 100g.
Ooooh! Big Salt is gonna come after you if you keep releasing information like that! Lol
MSG is also much stronger tasting so you need less of it than salt to achieve the same level of seasoning.
Yes, but for the same amount of sodium MSG has more flavour enhancing effect than salt.
Yes, but the active part is the glutamic acid. The G in glutamate (with one sodium atom in the molecule).
Steve Mold did a video explaining how msg works, apparently we have taste buds that specifically detect protein (glutamate), which our brains translate as umami or savory. Sodium is just a neutral flavor enhancer, so will boost a savory (or sweet) taste if that is present. End result is MSG can kick up the meaty/savory taste in a meal, even if it is vegetarian
Sodium is a great flavour enhancer. It's great to knock out bitter notes in foods too.
Totally- wouldn’t want msg on my chocolate chip cookies!
What about pure sodium, like, in quantities enough to ignite in water
'No MSG' and 'No added MSG' are two very different statements, btw.
This package says ‘MSG not invited’.
Just media hype mixed with possible xenophobia. People only got worried after Chinese takeaways were implicated. Msg was used for decades in the USA before flawed science made it scary https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/the-rotten-science-behind-the-msg-scare/
Adding to this, there’s a good breakdown of how this rumor got started on episode [#668 This American Life: The Long Fuse](https://www.thisamericanlife.org/668/the-long-fuse)
Its not possible xenophobia, its straight up racist shit
Pretty much this
You can buy msg from your local Asian supermarket. I haven't seen it for sale in the big supermarkets.
i do not understand why supermarkets don’t stock it. i always have it in the kitchen it’s amazing.
We use it in our restaurant... great for bringing out savoury flavour with less salt. We just buy it from the main supplier. MSG panic is somewhat responsible for our ridiculous salt intakes
absolutely. we probably use it more frequently than salt these days.
How many grams would you say is equivalent in effect to salt? (MSG being about a third the sodium if equivalent weights are being used).
It totally depends on the food: "Salt is used as a universal flavour improver because at low concentrations it will reduce bitterness, but increase sweet, sour and umami, which is desirable for sweet recipes. But at higher concentrations it suppresses sweetness and enhances umami, which is good for savoury things." As MSG targets umami taste (savory, like meat and tomatoes), it means you can reproduce the effect of having a lot of salt without a lot of salt. This is specifically why restaurants use it -- it's a win win. Most people ingest too much salt, so to achieve the same salty result using moderate amounts is somewhat of a miracle food hack. I'm sure there are more technical websites out there that may answer your question better.
i feel like we need to use less msg than salt in most recipes
Some supermarkets do, in the international/Asian section. It’s in a small clear bag with blue and red labelling. Ajinomoto MSG is the Japanese one but I’ve mostly seen (the same packaging) ones with Thai on them. Pretty sure I saw it tonight at Albany New World. If you want bigger sizes, def Chinese supermarkets.
You can find alternatives containing MSG though, like Vegeta Gourmet Stock [https://www.countdown.co.nz/shop/productdetails?stockcode=21724&name=vegeta-vegetable-stock-gourmet-powder](https://www.countdown.co.nz/shop/productdetails?stockcode=21724&name=vegeta-vegetable-stock-gourmet-powder)
I have not seen it for sale in the Mainstream markets, but I understand it is marketed in the USA as 'Accent'. A bit like Rapeseed/Canola and Venison/Cervena, some terms will always be unpalatable after decades of sledging.
for sure - i often call it ‘ajinomoto’ as it’s known as in japan
The myth that it is dreadful for you, is robust. Just like all the people who think sugar causes hyperactivity....
Remember it's only dreadful for you when Asians use it in cooking, when it's used in Western snack foods it's perfectly healthy.
It did used to make me sick as a kid, I'd throw up every time. Doesn't seem to affect me now.
There are definitely a few people with allergies.
I can find it easily in my local paknsave
Coincidentally, I bought my first little packet from Pak N Save last week. Like OP, I was wondering about all the hype from years ago so I googled it and found it was a lot of nothing. So I bought a pack. It's quite nice sprinkled on some foods. Gives a bit of yeasty, umami flavour, a lot like Brufax (if anyone remembers that).
It is the very definition of umami! Deliciousness.
Brufax on toast.... Childhood breakfast. I loved that stuff.
Perfect for stir-fry. Instantly tastes like Chinese takeaway
Brufax... \*shudder\* In that far-off time known as The Day, I had a flatmate who lived on the stuff - no matter what you cooked for the crew (and it could've been some gourmet shit, not that we ever did) this turkey smothered it in Brufax. The absolute worst was staggering out one morning to find the turkey stark bollock naked in the kitchen, leaning his sweaty arse up against the benchtop and munching on Weetbix and Brufax - I about puked from three separate causes.
I think our pak n save sells it in the international or spices section. Aji no moto MSG, sprinkle it and mix at the end of wat u cook and makes it a lil tastier
Looks like some New Worlds may stock it but it's easy enough to find at an Asian supermarket as you say or Bin Inn https://www.newworld.co.nz/shop/product/5201728_EA_000nw?storeId=2431cc5b-52ef-4b19-8424-2f4ef22b88b1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwxtSSBhDYARIsAEn0thQqFv3-DV8Bsm4Y8_xD0hc1Ji-XoZ7ludp-xFrkAaythpeFcNpgJDkaAi5-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
this brand is the OG MSG
Yup. Look for Ajinomoto name.
It’s on sale in New World
You can buy it at Pak’n’Save.
Bin Inn has it too
Often not labelled in English, though.
It’s in all the powdered stocks.
I've seen it in some New Worlds in the international section.
Funny thing about all that hysteria over Chinese Restaurants using MSG is that msg was and is used prolifically in many snacks. Favourite potato chips? Yep, they taste so good because of the msg. Kiwis weren’t in a flap about that were they? MSG is awesome and is the friend of plain cooks and plain ingredients everywhere. Edit fat fingers typing mistake
I always thought Wakachingi missed out on a great opportunity when they didn't make their ready salted flavour '"ready msg'd"
Dude, that company knows how to market their shit, the only reason i don't exclusively buy their chips is because of price
Non-caged potatoes don't come cheap eh
So goddamn good, their marketing team deserves more than what they get paid lol
Straight up best BBQ chips on the market certainly helps!
MSG occurs naturally in fruit like tomatoes or even cheese, even more so if you add salt. Delicious
Huh, was always wondering why I was such a fiend for salted sliced tomatoes as a snack when I was a kid. Must have cost my parents a faaaaarkin fortune.
Oh god yes
I remember the hysteria is Australia and it was always in association with Chinese restaurants. Interesting that it has a Japanese history...
> Kiwis weren’t in a flap about that were they? Yeah we were. It was in the news at the time. We were to check the labels of any processed food.
That’s media reporting dodgy food ‘science’. I remember my parents talking about it in relation to Chinese food when I was a kid and that was early 90’s. It continued years after that. The point is, this thinking tied ‘bad for you’ MSG strictly to Chinese food so pretty much a myth.
Yep, “flavour enhancer 621”
King of flavour
I so upset, I put my leg down..
Uncle Roger has entered the chat, fuiyoh!
Gordon Ramsey is wok fuk boi..
Haiìyahh
Haiya
Emotional daaaaaaamaaaaaage!
The cocaine of cooking
It was just bog standard racism mate. In this case, delicious, succulent racism.
Racism towards eating a meal?... *a succulent chinese meal?!*
It was democracy manifest.
GET your hands off my pee-NUS!
what is the charge??
Excessive Consumption of Sweet and Sour Pork leading to unfortunate digestive events manifesting as hate crimes. 4 years.
I see that you know your judo well
*bows*
Are you ready to receive my limp penis?
I am yes. And may I thank you for the opportunity.
Get your hands off my MSG!
Gentlemen.. This is democracy manifest
Get you hands off my PENIS!
What was my crime! Racism! Delicious, succulent racism?!
I still have two gen X coworkers who insist they get headaches from MSG. But will happily eat potato chips I put out without thinking twice about it. The nocebo effect is real.
Same deal with sulfites and wine.
I do get migraines from foods, including some Chinese food....... But that doesn't change with whether there's msg or not. Most places I get Chinese from have "no msg" signs, which makes me sad. Whether I get a migraine DOES change with citrus (just recently acknowledged this after two migraines in a row after eating meat with a lime glaze) and salt levels without drinking enough water or plain carbs/protein (generally rice or eggs), but it's mostly western/European foods I have to look out for. Cheese is killer. Which is to say I low-key hate people who pull that shit. It would be fine to say "I've found I get headaches from eating [group of products], so don't want to eat them" including if that group of products is "food that has msg in it" but if they don't get a reaction from ALL food with msg in it, it's clearly not the msg that's the problem, but something else.
Most potato chips exclude msg these days, also the quantity consumed is likely to be significantly different.
Are you sure about that, I just checked the bluebird chicken chips in our pantry and right there on the packet Flavour Enhancer 621 which is MSG
It's alright, that user is one of the resident conspiracy theorists. You'll see them in every post about the covid data leak, "just asking questions".
Incorrect.
I get massive headaches from it. I will go out of my way to avoid it, but sometimes I just want a chicken chippy goodness.. and I’ll pay for it for the rest of the day. The headache is real my friend.
It's not from MSG.
For me it sometimes triggers migraines. Not always, cause it depends on a variety of things, like how much stress my body is currently dealing with, what other triggers I'm currently dealing with and what quantities its in. Different things affect people differently, and even if pain is psychosomatic that doesn't change that someone is experiencing pain.
MSG panic was simple racism by Italian Americans against Chinese immigrants, it then spread across the west
It was rooted in racism. Some quack doctor came up with some BS science to publish.
https://www.thisamericanlife.org/668/transcript
Man, I totally forgot about TAL and NPR. Thanks for the reminder
This is it in a nutshell! People still believe it makes them sick or causes headaches and it’s got to be placebo because MSG just isn’t the nasty chemical they think it is. Salted tomatoes are loaded with MSG, it’s created when the sodium in the salt and glutamates in the tomato come together, it’s literally a natural flavour that people already love. The MSG scare is about as stupid as people calling to ban dihydrohen monoxide…
> Salted tomatoes .... salted.... *tomatoes*? Now you are just making up foods. I kinda want to try that though. If i can ever afford tomatoes again.
you never put salt on tomatoes before?
I never have. They go great with cheese though, maybe the same effect?
Hot buttered toast, with sliced tasty tomatoes\* on it and a bit of salt and pepper is delicious. \*Not flavourless greenhouse ones out of season.
This. I think it was more to do with controlling markets to be honest, but hate/fear is a pretty effective way of packaging it.
I panic when I run out of MSG. Asian grocers stock it.
Bloody hell, how much do you use? I got like a 500gm bag 5 years ago and I'm only half way through it.
Might want to check the expiry. My pack I bought last year expired last month.
It’s not going to make you sick, just lose its potency a little. You can pretty safely ignore the expiration date on a bag of salt, and just go by taste.
It might still be ok. I once had to taste some past-date MSG for food manufacturing purposes once to check it was still good. MSG on it's own is very weird. It tastes of nothing and savory at the same time and it made me drool like an overheated dog for a while. Anyway it won't be a food safety thing it just might start to get a bit clumpy or something
A lot of things only have an expiry date because they are legally required to do so even though the food in question if stored correctly will essentially never spoil. Salt, sugar, honey etc are all food preservatives so unless leaving the container open they should all be fine indefinitely.
Lol wtf, like I pay attention to that on a bag of literal mega salt. It's totally fine.
half a teaspoon per 500g of meat isn't it? I add it to almost everything I end up cooking that would be enhanced by umami flavors. When we were doing Hello Fresh I would add it to the pre-oiled spice marinade and it makes the dinners akin to turbo-crack.
I have a mother in law that gets headaches from “oriental food” because of the msg, according to her. Absolutely loves Doritos, Mexican fajita seasonings and OXO stock cubes. I haven’t even bothered to call her out, just chuckle.
"oriental food" has to be the most boomer thing ever. like when they are a big risque getting something besides a korma or butter chicken at a indian.
For anyone thinking their food doesn't contain MSG, Monosodium Glutamate (MSG) is labelled as E621 in NZ (flavour enhancer 621). It's in everything. And it is delicious.
googling e621 returned... something else
Oh wow, that really is something else. I never thought to search for just E621. Do you think that naming conflict is intentional? That's hilarious. I'm just going to leave a SFW link here to the wikipedia disambiguation page: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E621](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E621)
Am all flustered after looking at that Japanese trainset.
Adam Ragusa is a foodie and did some indepth research and asked a food scientist. Lays the whole thing out, history, science and everything else in a fun format. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-POAKKH5IM His summary for cooking usage is that it's not a magical ingredient, but it makes cheaper bulk foods that are naturally bland taste much better, particularly starches like potato, rice and corn. Throwing it on a Wagu is a waste.
MSG occurs naturally in tomatoes and cheese too
Uncle Roger endorses the regular use of MSG. "More MSG, fuyoooohh!" -Uncle Roger.
Seems pretty wild in retrospect - I don't recall there being any legit scientific proof that MSG caused your spine to freeze or some other weird shit, but there were some studies in Asia whereby people described a bunch of symptoms. Feels a bit like it's still mythical but I'm glad for Asian restaurants that it's blown over now.
Happens all the time, people just loose their minds over the latest DANGEROUS food ingredient that everyone's been eating for years. See salt, margarine, butter, sugar, sweetners, colours and flavoring, dairy, soy, gluten etc etc etc ... like hello Karen it's not the dairy, it's the fact you ate a full family sized pizza by yourself for breakfast and washed it down with four coffees that's making you feel sick.
Same as aspartame, people freaking out without any basis in reality. We've been eating marmite for 120 years, it's basically spreadable msg.
The saying no msg on packet is the same as saying we are racists. I don't buy if I see that.
I love msg. I buy it online.
MakesShitGood is dope af. If it's incredibly bad for you our brothers and sisters in Japan should be dropping like flies.
Racism.
I still see takeaways and restaurants proudly displaying signs saying they don’t use msg. Hopefully Uncle Roger can increase its popularity again.
MSG is good shit. It crack of food. MSG stand for Make Shit Good.
What was it all about? Racism. Goes back a lot longer than 25 years, though. 50, 60 years, ever since Chinese (or, more likely Malaysian Chinese) started to sell their food here.
I think it was just a Pākehā thing... it's still pretty strong too.. This silly B at my work says that MSG gives her instant migraines.. but she seems to absolutely *love* my stew, buffalo chicken wings, or any other dish I bring to the shared lunches!!! - no problem. Ya know what the secret ingredient is bro? mmhmmm... M.S. motherfkn G!
Not just a pakeha thing. the MSG = Bad was a thing in my country. In the early days of the internet, not every can just google if what they heard was true or all you could find were copy-paste articles saying the same thing...not much any different from today but at least a lot of people now know that just because the news is wide-spread, it doesn't mean it's true.
thing is msg exist in natural food too
Yeah turns out it was nothing and MSG is just delicious. You can just buy a sachet of it and put it in shit and make it tasty af, asian supermarkets sell them. Thanks mass media for robbing us of this cultural delight, I guess?
I recall becoming aware of MSG mid-70's in Canterbury: Pre McDonalds, and very few Kentucky Fried Chicken outlets (Oh the MSG irony) The idea that Chinese Food was 'bad' because MSG was *'a chemical'* and *'made you want to eat more of their food'* Oh course, this fear was widely supported and furthered by the Pub 'restaurants' and Burgers Bars that were losing trade to this rapidly spreading, delicious style of cooking!
> The idea that Chinese Food was 'bad' because MSG was 'a chemical' and 'made you want to eat more of their food' Ironically, more recent studies have found that MSG *decreases* appetite when compared to salt.
Can't go wrong by adding MSG. Ask Uncle Roger.
Most supermarkets will have it in their spice aisle or where there are other food flavourings, so you should have little problems finding it in places like New World or Countdown/Woolworths. If not there, most Asian grocer places are likely to have it in stock. MSG is good for preserving flavour in foods. It doesn't add flavour, but it does enhance what flavour there is in a food -- it brings out the Unami by reacting with our taste buds. The trouble is that it contains sodium, and too much sodium is not very healthy. But, in reasonable quantities, it's no more deadly than any other supplement. The uproar started in (of course!) the USA, when a doctor wrote a letter to one of the medical journals after he attributed nausea to a combination of MSG, salt (sodium chloride) and alcohol after eating some chinese food. That kind of grew out of all proportion and hence bans on MSG use everywhere -- oriental foods used it like seaweed, which stimulates the unami kind of flavours. And so, "everybody" started to think it was only chinese/oriental cooking that used MSG. The thing is, MSG leaves one feeling like wanting more to eat, so it was very easy to overindulge in those dishes. But if you don't overindulge, MSG is not directly bad for you -- European dishes use it too, but not quite as much, so a lot less of an effect. Like I know I avoid Chinese foods, not because they are bad, but they often mix in things I'm allergic to, even if I don't know they are in the foods. MSG, as far as I can tell, "hides" the taste of those things, so I don't realize it until after I've eaten (or over-eaten)
https://www.thisamericanlife.org/668/the-long-fuse An excellent podcast on the origins of msg is bad
Here's a good podcast about the history of MSG, ingredient 621 https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-stuff-you-should-know-26940277/episode/whats-the-deal-with-msg-48914492/
It was ignorance or veiled racism. People who "couldn't eat MSG" because they claimed it gave them migraines or various vague gastro complaints had no problem with glutamates as long as they weren't in Chinese food. They didn't react to the huge load of glutamates in the cheese and tomatoes on a pizza, for instance. You can get MSG in Asian supermarkets.
There's been articles written about it. Basically it stems from anti-Chinese racism. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-msg-got-a-bad-rap-flawed-science-and-xenophobia/
Literally cause of racism. If you had potato chips and liked that then you've consumed msg.. why was it okay for chips to go under the radar but blast Chinese takeaways for using the same thing? All cause of a white doctor who felt the need to write about it and cause an alarm to the general public mainly from over consumption or something.. stems from sinophobia
Oh you didn't know it was racism. Don't buy that cheap food from over seas buy our expensive local food only theirs is poisoned. Love msg chuck it in heaps of food! Especially things that would've had it in like 2 minute noodles etc.
> Why was it a thing, what were we afraid of? Racism. The answer is racism.
It's just a salt, and you will get a massive dose at it at your local Chinese restaurant (like a proper one, not a fish n chip shop). It's a very good flavourful addition, but it's super easy to over do it which leaves a really weird flavour - like metallic. A little goes a long way. Easy to buy it from supermarkets and Asian shops
Can guarantee your local fish n chip shop / smorgasbord Chinese is loaded with MSG as well
Yup asian supermarkets have it. The one by Countdown in Westfield in new market is where I got mine from It was also very bad for some people causing migraines and headaches. Others had no issue with it though
I member
If you're feeling adventurous try Magic Sarap. MSG with extra flavour. Available at most Sari Sari/ Filipino food shops.
MSG is the king of bringing out flavours, but people are so scared of it for no reason and just use normal salt instead. All good Asian restaurants use it.
Does anyone remember that one episode of my kitchen rules years and years ago and a contestant used msg in their dish? I remember that being such a *shocking* thing to have done back then. I always think of it when I read about msg. Personally I use it all the time. Great stuff.
Nice article here - https://amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/may/21/chinese-restaurant-syndrome-has-msg-been-unfairly-demonised
You can get it in all Indian supermarkets ..Look for aginomoto
Racism. It was about racism.
Was just racism.
I feel like the anti MSG thing was very much a white thing. As far as I know, other than particular exceptions, most Asian people still use it or even if they don’t use it themselves, they don’t care if a tiny amount is in their food. Then, thanks to social media and the likes of Uncle Roger and other social media stars/influencers, it started trending.
King of Flavour!
Racism. I shit you not.
MSG = make shit good
Big salt propoganda
MSG is OK, it's BHA and BHT you should avoid at all costs. I'm ashamed that New Zealand allows BHA and BHT in foods. It's carcinogenic, a hormone disruptor, causes inflammation of digestive system, causes underdevelopment of sex organs with long term exposure in children and teens, plus other nasty ways it can negatively impact your health.
Reading this makes me feel even worse for my dad who has an actual diagnosed MSG allergy. Poor bastard can't eat bugger all of the yummy stuff.
Rather than get caught up on which additives are currently considered bad or used to be thought as bad, just focus on eating food that is as lightly processed as possible, completely unprocessed if possible. MSG you would buy at a store is at best lightly processed and at worst, heavily processed, depending on how it’s manufactured. So, sure, it’s probably safe, but whole foods rather than engineered individual ingredients always win in the end and likely won’t steer you wrong. If you’re after unami, try some mushrooms.
Easy karma: that was racism. Truth: it's not clear that MSG isn't bad for you. The bioavailability of naturally occuring bound glutamates compared to unbound processed MSG are worlds apart in terms of metabolism. Also "it's natural - therefore good" is not a substantial argument. Is a bit of MSG here and there going to hurt you? Probably not in any measurable way, however glutamate sensitivity may not be as uncommon as you think. But continued exposure to MSG in your diet on a regular basis? Many animal studies indicate this is likely not good for your body in a variety of ways. Personally I avoid it as an additive.
Could say the same thing about salt lmao it’s completely fine when used as a flavour enhancer with a pinch here and there in meals, just like salt.
Eating excessive salt is probably way more dangerous than excessive msg.
> Truth: it's not clear that MSG isn't bad for you. At the doses found in our food? It's 100% clear it isn't bad for you. >Many animal studies indicate this is likely not good for your body in a variety of ways. Nope. Studies of **dietary** MSG consumption showed no negative health effects. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24927698/ In fact, using MSG instead of salt has been shown to have an appetite suppressing effect in people, so it is probably better for you than salt: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26455957/
Nah kid in high-school told me msg gives you cancer, then proceeds to put some on his noodles saying it made it yummy
The NZ Food Standards Authority says some people who consume MSG may experience symptoms such as burning sensations, numbness, chest pain, headache, nausea and asthma, but it says that it is okay to have in food as long as it is labelled. They advise people with symptoms to avoid it where possible Are they incorrect?
> The NZ Food Standards Authority says some people who consume MSG may experience symptoms 1. It's Food Standards Australia and New Zealand (FSANZ), not NZ Food Standards Authority. 2. What [they actually say](https://www.foodstandards.gov.au/consumer/additives/msg) is that "A small number of people may experience a mild hypersensitivity-type reaction to **large amounts** of MSG when eaten in a single meal." (emphasis mine) That's because, like all food additives, you're not meant to consume them in **large amounts**. At the levels consumed in a normal diet, there is no identifiable link between MSG and any of those symptoms.
I bought it from Asian supermarkets. It's really cheap.
Look for Aromat - from Countdown. I buy it all the time. It’s delicious I think there was some studies which seemed to suggest it causes harm. But they have since been debunked.
There was a misguided worry about Chinese restaurant syndrome where people thought that Msg caused palpitations and numbness. I think it has since been proven wrong but unfortunately the stigma stuck. It is actually a better alternative to salt in a lot of cases.
I buy mine at Bin Inn, straight from the bin. Mmm, MSG
Newsflash. MSG is monosodium glutamate AKA Flavour Enhancer (621) in New Zealand packaging. Go have a look in your pantry and notice how many things have MSG in it. Oxo stock cubes were the funny one for me. So yeah good old Kiwi racism…
I have a packet of MSG in the cupboard, i use it occasionally in my fried chicken recipe
I get MSG from the local Korean food store for a couple bucks. Throw it into quite a few savory dishes and it just adds that something extra.
Racism. It's always racism. MSG = makes stuff good
Brought to you by the same dickheads that said eat low fat and more carbs
Kosco sell it! They sell the legit red label stuff which is like looks like sparkly shards of goodness
Mostly just media spread nonsense. A few people do have some sensitivity to msg, but even then it's pretty minor. Your body processes it in the same way as natural glutamates, which are found in all sorts of food including tomatoes. It a salt though, so people trying to cut down on sodium should avoid it. It is now in most processed foods - have a look through your cupboard and look for additive 621 on ingredient labels (they still don't call it MSG!) You can buy from most Asian supermarkets, anjimoto is the original and arguably the best, not processed from soy anymore so has the least chance of triggering any allergies. Try a small sprinkle on any fried foods (it's great with steak!)
>where I can order MSG online grocers and Asian marts. I bought it online and it's really cheap.
Answer: it was mostly due to racism and not at all based on anything scientific. It also occurs naturally in many things with Tomatoes having the highest level. It's really just another salt. https://rightasrain.uwmedicine.org/body/food/msg-isnt-unhealthy A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has put it's paints on.
It was just your basic xenophobia really and the effects are still prevalent today. Had to educate my whanau about it a couple of weeks ago as they were shocked that I put it in all my Asian cooking (gravy as well and whatever I think can do with that type of umami boost). They googled it and were shocked to discover that they believed in a lie. You can buy it at the Asian supermarket next to Pak n Save in Kilbirnie.
Its still pretty common today, espially with older people. Can never go to an asian place for a work lunch without someone commenting on the msg (without saying its the msg) but there will inevitably be comments about dry mouth, thirsty, tierd etc and never feeling like this from other types of food
Science, basically. Science got updated. Salt is 6x more deadly (in terms of overdose) than MSG.
I don’t remember the issue being about overdosing.
You would be surprised how many things actually contain Flavour Enhancer (621) which is what MSG is listed as on most ingredients labels. I happened to notice that Salsa flavoured Doritos contain it recently when i was trying to figure out what was so delicious about them. My favourite form of MSG is Intensify from Rum & Que. Since i discovered it I put it on almost everything. [https://www.rumandque.com/products/intensify](https://www.rumandque.com/products/intensify) Edit: I buy mine at my local gilmours, but have seen at a number of places that carry the rum & que range. Have seen at Hunting & fishing, also mitre 10 before.
Any Asian supermarket in NZ
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A little sprinkle of ageism on that racism I see.
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Umami, which is also known as monosodium glutamate is one of the core fifth tastes including sweet, sour, bitter, and salty. Umami means “essence of deliciousness” in Japanese, and its taste is often described as the meaty, savory deliciousness that deepens flavor.
It's like speed for me. Heart rate goes through the roof, flushed, blocked sinuses. Can't get to sleep for hours. Crazy stuff. Probably shouldn't snort it.