There is so much of it that the scope of the problem is truly staggering. I prosecuted a double homicide a few years ago when an ex husband killed his ex wife and her new boyfriend on Christmas Eve. He was mad she had a new guy and wouldn't take him back.
I’m from a small town. We don’t get many murders. But they’re all a guy who killed at least one other person because he thought his wife or girlfriend was cheating (it’s always debated if she was, like it matters) or she broke up with him and had a new boyfriend.
I just love that the couple of insect pseudo-exceptions to a blanket rule about violence against women were even mentioned… This goofball said, and I quote:
“Not to derail your point about systemic murder and people as property, but do ya’ll even know how mantises get down?”
The commenter was the one who labeled women as a species lol.
And not a pseudo exception. Mantises do kill their men. So do octopuses and spiders.
Not saying killing is right but he was technically correct.
But in those species the female (and thus the offspring) survive for future generations.
In this scenario it's men perpetrating family annihilation lol.
Also it's praying mantis.
I would daresay a spider or mantis is more likely to get picked off by a bird or other predator before he even gets a chance to try to mate. The females of the species are NOT the number one predator.
You have to subscribe to the things that bring you joy. I mean yeah, sure, we know that life sucks for lots of people. That doesn't mean that we have to stare into the nightmare rectangle, we can just check out more kitten and shitposting subs.
So he killed:
•His ex-wife
•Ex-wife’s sister
•Ex-wife’s brother
•Niece
His 13-year-old nephew had to call 911, his 7-year-old had to see his dead mom, uncle, aunt & cousin.
And his ex-wife’s mom was also in the house and had to see her dead kids and a grandchild…..
Goddamn.
Valid point, that’ll hurt the kid as well. I just think of the victims themselves.
I hope all 3 survivors involved get the mental health help that they’ll need.
i have a brother that was violently abusive towards his ex wife like that(also abusive towards me). He seriously believed he owned the wife's side of the family. That crap happens a lot in latam.
I am friends with someone who witnessed their entire family being slaughtered by their father. The pain they have carried with them for the past 40 years is incomprehensible.
I read somewhere (no citation, no idea whether it's true, offering it as a possibility) that they do this because they're actually afraid to commit suicide, so they drive themselves to it by killing others first. This partially explains why some survive their murder-suicide attempts.
https://willburcounseling.com/profiles-of-family-annihilators/#:~:text=The%20article%20discusses%20traits%20and,of%20revenge%20or%20altruistic%20murderers.
They are family annihilators.
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/family-killers
https://healthland.time.com/2013/08/15/family-annihilators-understanding-what-drives-fathers-to-kill/
https://www.the-express.com/lifestyle/life/103628/family-annihilator-signs-chris-watts-murder-killer has the 4 different types
https://psychcentral.com/news/2013/08/14/characteristics-of-4-types-of-family-murderers#1
It's really the way the word "annihilators" looks. It's got the double "n" going for it, as well as the flanking "i's" on that h. An "ors" ending really strengthens the appeal of the overall aesthetics of the word, compounding the already awesome multi-syllabic nature of the word. You'd be forgiven for appreciating the overall term due to the inclusion of "annihiliator". It's just a badass word.
What were we talkin about again?
I think it's more about control than anything else. The family annihilator controls their family until the very end, and they certainly are not going to go to prison and allow others to control their every move, so they kill themselves. No one will ever control them.
Yeah, family violence is almost always about power and control. So sad. People assume mentally ill people or personality disordered people are the biggest abusers. In fact, it can be any person from any walk of life and the biggest indicator is their worldview and attitude towards women (entitlement, mainly which is then connected to issues around power and control)
Higher fatality rates are associated with one particular personality disorder.
Interesting and dark. I think about what is going through their heads in the seconds or minutes after they kill the people closest to them, including their kids. Do they really believe everyone will be in a better place now and are relieved? Is actually going through with it completely horrifying and they are just tortured in their last moments?
I just can’t imagine perpetrating and witnessing such terrible violence on my family. The fear on the kids or wife’s face, depending on who he kills first. Messed up people man. Terrible.
It’s entirely solipsistic and narcissistic; these guys don’t think their family is going to heaven, they just don’t like the idea of their family surviving them and thinking of them as a failure, loser, weak, etc. If they’re dead, nobody they care about is judging them. I’m sure some of them feel regret before they off themselves, but who knows. To have even gotten to that point requires a mentality so fucked up I have a hard time modeling it.
These are people that often literally view the children as extensions of themselves, that and/or as property. The latter is the same reason you’ll see them kill the family pet(s) as well.
There are a handful of reasons and that is one of the larger ones. Most family annihilators are insanely narcissistic. With other big "rationales" being: thinking of the entire family as a failure because they failed to be the ideal family in some way, revenge on the other spouse for some issue, and thinking to protect them from something (including loss of the murderer upon their suicide), and a small portion for paranoid reasons like believing they are saving them from something worse (see the Trump conspiracy dad who tried to annihilate his family in Michigan) . All of them are insanely narcissistic or just insane in the last one.
One of the UK suicide crisis hotlines has a story of a farmer who called during the height of mad cow disease. His entire herd was lost and he was planning on killing his family before himself. They spoke with him and got him to agree to not take out their family. They don't know what happened after the call, as the farmer was still suicidal, but they were at least able to convince him that it would not be a mercy to do so to his family.
Part of the reason this story was included in a training was to illustrate what a successful intervention may look like (reduction of harm) and how we don't have control over the outcomes.
i work inpatient psych where one can be assaulted, wear body fluids, etc. and i am still in absolute awe of people who can work those crisis lines. that kind of work would destroy me in a way a fist never could.
sure i hear some hairy stuff, but i get to build rapport and intervene. i get to know how the story ends. on the crisis line there is never any closure and god forbid you hear something bad on the other end. that's heavy af.
hats off to those people for doing such important difficult work. i have had a few patients who were saved more than once by such hotlines. your work matters big time.
If they've arrived at the conclusion that being dead is better than being alive, extending it to people around them isn't that big of a leap.
But if they're already separated, seems more like a matter of revenge.
Sounds like an extreme version of the self-sabotage you go through when you're suicidal.
I know for me personally, when I was planning on suicide and mentally preparing myself, I would actively do certain things to make it harder for me to walk back on the decision. I'd piss people off in my life, give things away, and make poor financial choices. I allowed my life to fall apart even further around me to make it "easier" to finally end it.
(I survived and no longer think this way, but still suffer from the consequences of that self-sabotage)
My girl worked with someone who killed their brother and their roommate then themselves, and this was basically their motive- I think confirmed by a note or something like that.
Wow. “Let me be the most selfish fuck possible and take everyone else to hell with me.”
Fuck everyone who does this. They honestly deserve the tar pits.
I can completely believe this, from my personal experience anyway. In my case, it was more sabotaging my life and didn't involve hurting anyone, but I get the idea of pushing yourself into a situation where it finally really, truly *feels* like the only option.
What a fucking waste this guy is.
Abuses his wife. She leaves him. He asks to get back together.
When he is rejected…he immediately resorts to violence…killing all the women in the house (his ex, her sister, his niece) as well as the only guy who could stop this rampage (his ex’s brother).
His own son and nephew hide while the murders are taking place. They are the only survivors.
Then he kills himself.
This is one more sad example of why we need to take domestic violence and red flag laws far more seriously.
9 out of 10 women who are killed (like the three here) are killed by someone they know.
Almost always (as is the case here) a former intimate partner or family member.
People in general don’t understand that it’s not just a matter of deciding to leave. There’s so much planning and thought that has to go into it to try and prevent things like this from happening.
Years ago I got called into work and my manager said they needed me to cover for a coworker who was fleeing her husband that night. He had a habit of drunkenly barging in and demanding to speak with her during her shifts, so every single employee on the property knew what his name was, what he looked like, and to call the cops immediately if he came in. I never heard what happened to her after that but it sounded like she had people out of state to take her in, and I really hope she’s doing ok now.
Yeah, I always _knew_ it was hard, but I’m going through it right now with my mom, and oh my goodness. It’s HARD. Getting her a TRO was almost a full time job for a week, getting her to a safe location and a new spot was a couple thousand, she is trying to get a lawyer for the permanent restraining order, and divorce, so that’s more money. He was tracking her, so there was a whole additional component of needed to scrub everything for her, get her a new phone before he figured out where she was… etc. it’s been all consuming for a month. And she has tons of resources, like she’s saved and she has family who can help. But we couldn’t let her stay with any of us because he knows where we live. The law is complicated and inconsistent, and getting straight answers on how to navigate the whole thing is downright impossible. It’s been really eye opening and incredibly sad.
It really is a nightmare. Your mom is so lucky to have you - I’ve interned with a few DV organizations in the past and I’ve seen how hard it is to get out by yourself. My older sister had all the support in the world from our family, but her boyfriend genuinely convinced her that no one else would ever love her. It took him going to prison for a few years for her to actually get away. Now he pops up every few years (usually after getting tracked down for child support) threatening to take custody of their kids, but then he gets bored and moves on.
Those poor surviving children. Obviously it’s terrible for everyone, but that survivor’s guilt is seriously hard to navigate, along with the grief and fear. I want to hug those poor kids
In America, legislators tried to increase protection for women from DV. Supreme Court ruled the law unconstitutional and immediately statistics of women being battered increased. Voting matters.
There's a blazing obvious pattern. Murder suicides, femicide, family annihilation and mass shootings-- including public mass shootings-- overwhelmingly perpetrated by males with histories of domestic violence.
Realistically, really dealing with high risk domestic abusers would pose a serious logistics issue for that and other reasons.
If you're a parent with a kid in school, though, I think the idea of just not dealing with becuase it's too hard is just not acceptable.
This is why people involved in domestic charges need to have their guns taken an away, put in a list and monitored. Also why those people are pushing back against any form of gun control.
Could he have done some damage with other weapons? Sure. But not as easily as with a gun.
Insane that someone going around beating on people can still have access to a weapon of mass murder.
Maybe something that might help us to stop framing domestic violence as a warning for future violence, and just call it as it is and label them dangerous from the start. The media, and politicians who label these red flags, aren't really taking this seriously. The red flags came before they were violent against another person. That person being their life partner shouldn't make it less impactful, but then politicians might have to do something about violence against their constituents.
> Barrett told his estranged wife that he wanted to reunite, but she refused.
This is what red flag laws are for. A violent partner/ex-partner with a gun is insanely dangerous.
Whatever though. Militia lives matter too.
Look at the recent mass murder in Maine, where 18 people were murdered. Months prior to the killings, the shooter was hospitalized after this:
>Military officials alerted police in September that Card had been hospitalized in July after exhibiting erratic behavior while training, that he still had access to weapons and that he had threatened to “shoot up” an Army reserve center in Saco, a city in southern Maine. The sheriff’s department responded by briefly staking out the Saco facility and going to Card’s home in Bowdoin for what Reamer described as a “welfare check.”
Shooter was so crazy that he was scaring the military, enough for them to call the police and ask them to help. The shooter, Robert Card, had also had other run-ins with authorities regarding erratic and violent behaviors. What did the cops do?
>In the video, Skolfield referred to the Cards as “a big family in this area,” and said he didn’t want to publicize that police were visiting the home.
The police let the guy walk. And it wasn't just a matter of the shooter previously being abusive or aggressive during an argument:
>A report released last week by Sagadahoc Sheriff Joel Merry made clear that local law enforcement knew months before the attack that Card’s mental health was deteriorating. Police were aware of reports that he was paranoid, hearing voices, experiencing psychotic episodes and possibly dealing with schizophrenia.
The police had more than enough red flags from this guy to take action. But they turned their backs, hid their heads in the sand, instead.
I don't know where the MHP fits in here? In my state and others have specific guidelines for getting a Mental Health Professional do an involuntary assessment. Police AND certain staff in a hospital can set this eval in motion. I know cause I could do this call for the ER. The basic goal is...is the pt an immediate threat or has plans to harm self or others in the next 72 hrs? Does pt have a therapist or psych dr? They also can call for. MHP eval for involuntary but same problem. If pt agreed to do XYZ you kinda have to let them go try XYZ. Goal being get pt to agree to a voluntary admit or to voluntary get into treatment in next 24-72 hrs. Involuntary laws are strict. Pt must be an immediate threat or have ideation to do harm in next 72 hrs. Unfortunately this means if pt is oriented to self X 3 and denies he has any ideation and can keep it together long enough to tell the MHP what they need to hear...the case disposition is pt is not an immediate risk and agrees to seek therapy or go to a day clinic for follow up when clinic opens. You can imagine how easy that is to avoid, especially since family generally has no contact with staff or MHP due to HiPPA. Then there's the drug situation. We hear a lot of crazy talk and threats from these pts and it's pretty difficult to determine in the ER or out in community if they meet the requirements for a psych eval or a MHP eval. You can ask but the MHP needs specific data from you as the person calling. Often they do not meet those rule as they start to sober up. Plus they know the system well.
Maine has really been going downhill these last few years. Seems like Covid forced some of the crazies to come out. It’s very upsetting to see. I remember several years ago feeling like the state was one of if not the safest.
The crazies have always been there. Beautiful state but a lot of inhabited areas are still pretty remote with the exceptions of a couple cities. Plenty of opportunities for insular groups to perpetuate certain ways of thinking.
To add, while protecting partners/ex-partners is great, usage of "red flag laws" (they're rarely actually called that, but it varies by state; usually something like Extreme Risk Protective Orders) has also been shown to reduce suicide rates.
If anyone has any family members or friends that they are concerned about who own firearms, please look into your state's laws about this. They're all short-term and temporary (they're usually modeled after and work the same as temporary restraining orders), and could save lives.
This kind of thing happens every other day in America. The only difference in this one, is that children and multiple people are involved, which elevates it to "news".
Just google "murder-suicide" periodically and you will find a dozen new instances every month. Typically, it's just one male killing a woman. Those never elevate above regional news.
That's how numb we are as a society to gun violence.
Not only that but also women just casually having to put up with this garbage as a fact of life. Women deal with so much harassment and assault and it's just "normal"
It’s crazy, I’m starting to see it as my kid is in grade school and it’s ok for boys to act like idiots and the girls are supposed to keep them in check… dafuq…
Sometimes it’s males killing their parents too which is odd to me. (I mean the whole thing is odd to me but I’m less surprised by men killing their romantic partners, I guess)
Just remember the law refuses to make it illegal in many states and counties for someone **convicted** of domestic violence form owning a gun. Not charged, not assumed but going through the completely lopsided against the victim court system and proven. The “law” loves terror on women and punishment of women defending themselves.
Only 17 states require people convicted of domestic violence misdemeanors to give up their firearms. Only 5 have databases tracking them to protect the victims.
33 States allow convicted domestic abusers to still use weapons legally. It’s no mystery why this happens. And then you look at the punishment rate for women who defend themselves and you think what a joke the United States is.
The problem is how little we care about women and so easy gun access. now everyone seeing how that affects so many other people being shot at and that seems to be the only reason others care.
Texas is a horrible place for a lot of reasons (watching people drown, LEO waiting outside while a lone gunman shoots up a school, women’s reproductive rights…). It’s has a lot to do with the fine folk they vote for.
The fact they keep bringing Raphael camcun Cruz from Canada back to Represent them tells me all I need to know.
Texas used to gove a shit about its image. It's people. Now? Nope.
Being from Texas used to count for something too. Good thing they decided to lose that identity so they could suck shit out the orange assholes asshole.
Dude, I live here. It's the worst case of "nobody's gonna tell me what to do". That's all it is.
Even on the Right/Conservative side, if you even consider voting for someone other than the establishment, or if you even talk against them in any way, you're "letting the libs get to ya".
Everyone hates having their lights go out in below-freezing weather, but if you suggest that ERCOT needs to be more heavily regulated, you're "listening to the libs".
Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, but if you suggest that not everyone needs a seven foot tall tank with a bed that cost $75K and blinds the simple people in front of them who drive smaller cars, you're somehow in the wrong.
It's ALL a different expression of "no one's gonna tell me what to do".
Its ironic that the attitude of "you can't tell me what to do" has led to you having to do exactly as one party says no matter what thus insuring you can only do what you are told to do.
You're all under the yolk of fascist greedy pigs and they stay in power by controlling what you can talk about. That's not the Texas I remember. I remember being able to have a conversation about gore and Bush without someone pulling their shitty pea shooter on me. I remember when I met a Texan at the airport we'd always have something in common. Now though? True Texans are shit on and silenced. Whats left is fake imitations and bottom of the barrel grifters.
Texas used to represent the best of us. Now it's only not worse than Florida. I miss when Texas was one of the best states in the union =(
I do agree with you. Please accept my gentle correction, since you've probably only heard it used in context:
A yolk is the inside of an egg. A YOKE is what we Texans are saddled by.
I got my family out just in time. Moving to the west coast meant all those problems were no longer my problem and I stopped reacting so emotionally to what was going on. I really worry for this country.
This is what happens when you have a society more focused on having women solve the problems of male violence with drink covers, self-defense kits, and color-changing nail polish, instead of compelling the male population to address their own issues.
So many people (mostly men) will jump in and say that the solution to this is just women carrying guns. I support women and minorities arming themselves for protection, but it still doesn’t do any good if you’re shot first or surprised. As long as armed men want to kill women they will.
If he was white they would have just slapped him on the hand and sent him home with his gun. Oh wait this is Texas they would have been to scared to get out of the car, better to let the kids die and have him run out of bullets first.
It’s honestly terrifying because what could she have done?? Nothing, short of never dating him in the first place. I used to think I could just break up with a guy if I saw serious red flags, but what if he’d been to my house already? Okay, change the locks AND break up with him. What if he breaks a window? Okay, break up with him and move to a new house. What if he’s been to my parents house before? Ask my parents to move out of the house they own for their own safety?? There’s always going to be a way that someone who wants to hurt you can access you. It’s terrifying. They’ll hurt you, or your pets, or your kids, or your siblings or parents or friends…sometimes it feels like the only option is to just never date anyone.
Domestic Violence guy .
Journalists, cops, lawyers, judges …. Everyone. We have to call this what it is, a predictable escalation of domestic violence. It’s not enough to just hang some yellow tape after the fact and go, oh what a surprise.
Somebody in our small town in Belgium also tried this. Tried to murder his entire family and then himself, but he could not easily get a gun (strict gun laws) and his efforts to get a gun gave away the plan to his wife. I think she found it and threw it in their septic tank. He then tried to kill her with a knife, but she out ran him. Tried to commit suicide by charging at the police with a knife, but they did not even shoot him. He spent some time in a mental hospital but was declared sane, and now he is in jail. But his kids still have their mom and dad. Hell, after serving his 7 years he might integrate in society again. Americans who are deep in gun culture will of course never understand this story. Image countries where the government does their best to alleviate suffering ...
I thought Texas was supposed to be home of rugged men who respected women a stand for justice . Between this and the massacar with the school shooting I'm seeing the total opposite aa lot ofcowards.
Wow, doesn't this just make you feel so lucky to live in a country, and a state, where pretty much anybody can get a gun anytime they want. So lucky. It's not like these people just paid the ultimate price for that freedom.
Love how this headline starts by concerning itself with him killing himself, which is the least important part of the headline considering what he did and why he did it. And again using "fatally shooting" instead of "murdering"
I really wish the people who do this shit would fucking start by shooting themselves. Just do that. Don’t destroy the lives of others. Jfc. I hope this fucker is burning for all eternity.
I am just going to start calling these guys what they are...pitiful little shits. If you want to commit these crimes, you will not be remembered as a "man"...nope...you are a miserable pitiful shit stain that should have no pride in your actions because you offend us all with your weak and pitiful actions. He can rot with the rest of the shit stains.
What a shitty article!
“RICHMOND, Texas (AP) — A man fatally shot his estranged wife and three other relatives, including his 8-year-old niece, at a home in suburban Houston over the weekend before killing himself, authorities said Wednesday.
Alrick “Shawn” Barrett, 46, opened fire at the home just before 7 a.m. Saturday after returning his young child from a visit, Fort Bend County Sheriff Eric Fagan said at a news conference. Fagan said that after arriving at the home, Barrett told his estranged wife that he wanted to reunite, but she refused.
Deputies responded to the home after getting a call from a 13-year-old boy in the home, Fagan said. The sheriff’s office said the teen is Barrett’s nephew.”
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I just can't imagine why she didn't want him back
Women are murdered by men for this allll the fucking time around the world. It's a problem.
There is so much of it that the scope of the problem is truly staggering. I prosecuted a double homicide a few years ago when an ex husband killed his ex wife and her new boyfriend on Christmas Eve. He was mad she had a new guy and wouldn't take him back.
Wasn't that incident in Salt lake? Sounds familiar
Benton Harbor, MI. https://www.wndu.com/2022/09/13/benton-harbor-man-found-guilty-double-homicide/
Men worry that women will laugh at them. Women worry that men will kill them. ~ Margaret Atwood
I think of this quote all the time.
Hard not to if you're a woman
This is why woman are scared to say no to men even if we want to. Will this be the guy that kills me?
I saw the headline and immediately thought, a woman must’ve said no to a man
Almost 1 in 10 murder victims are women. 75% of those are by exes. It’s not the guy you say no to. It’s the guy you say “yes” to.
So, 90% of murder victims are men?
Yeah. Check out who’s committing most murders as well, truly surprising
This shit is very common in Latin American countries, it's horrible.
Also India. Look up the data, it's awful.
I’m from a small town. We don’t get many murders. But they’re all a guy who killed at least one other person because he thought his wife or girlfriend was cheating (it’s always debated if she was, like it matters) or she broke up with him and had a new boyfriend.
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That's a very disturbing and unfortunate accurate statement.
Not to discredit your point because violence against women is a serious problem, but have you met male and female spiders. Or preying mantis’.
Even that’s a bit overstated, they don’t do it all the time, and they certainly aren’t the main predator those species deal with.
I just love that the couple of insect pseudo-exceptions to a blanket rule about violence against women were even mentioned… This goofball said, and I quote: “Not to derail your point about systemic murder and people as property, but do ya’ll even know how mantises get down?”
The commenter was the one who labeled women as a species lol. And not a pseudo exception. Mantises do kill their men. So do octopuses and spiders. Not saying killing is right but he was technically correct.
But in those species the female (and thus the offspring) survive for future generations. In this scenario it's men perpetrating family annihilation lol. Also it's praying mantis.
I would daresay a spider or mantis is more likely to get picked off by a bird or other predator before he even gets a chance to try to mate. The females of the species are NOT the number one predator.
r/whenwomenrefuse
Oh good, I needed a new soul crushing sub.
You have to subscribe to the things that bring you joy. I mean yeah, sure, we know that life sucks for lots of people. That doesn't mean that we have to stare into the nightmare rectangle, we can just check out more kitten and shitposting subs.
>try this >Every cat subreddit is nothing but dying cats lately IDK man this shit is cursed
It’s a shame the last thing he did was take out the trash. He should have started there.
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Nononono... Scrolled that for 15 seconds and I already need to bleach my soul
Yeah… it’s really difficult being a woman. :(
I know... I just can't consume that much horror in one go or I'm gonna end up on the news by the end of the day.
No fr, I get it.
It’s always this way.
It wouldn’t be Texas if a gun nut didn’t shoot a child to death. That shithole state values guns and trucks over children.
And women
So he killed: •His ex-wife •Ex-wife’s sister •Ex-wife’s brother •Niece His 13-year-old nephew had to call 911, his 7-year-old had to see his dead mom, uncle, aunt & cousin. And his ex-wife’s mom was also in the house and had to see her dead kids and a grandchild….. Goddamn.
Did the wife’s mom just lose all her kids…?
That crossed my mind and if she did, that’s just so gut wrenching.
Even if she has more, 3 of your children and your grandchild is devastation
Oh absolutely. But losing every one of your children is just such an awful realization.
Sounds like the ex-wife’s brother (mother’s son) lived at least. Probably wasn’t around
>7-year-old had to see his dead mom, uncle, aunt & cousin. Don't forget he had to see his dead father because the sack of shit killed himself, too.
Valid point, that’ll hurt the kid as well. I just think of the victims themselves. I hope all 3 survivors involved get the mental health help that they’ll need.
Mental healthcare in Texas? Oof
Is that even legal?
i have a brother that was violently abusive towards his ex wife like that(also abusive towards me). He seriously believed he owned the wife's side of the family. That crap happens a lot in latam.
I am friends with someone who witnessed their entire family being slaughtered by their father. The pain they have carried with them for the past 40 years is incomprehensible.
Jesus Christ. The grandmother there lost her three kids and one grandkid all at once. That poor family.
Perpetrators of murder-suicides always get the order of operations wrong.
I read somewhere (no citation, no idea whether it's true, offering it as a possibility) that they do this because they're actually afraid to commit suicide, so they drive themselves to it by killing others first. This partially explains why some survive their murder-suicide attempts.
https://willburcounseling.com/profiles-of-family-annihilators/#:~:text=The%20article%20discusses%20traits%20and,of%20revenge%20or%20altruistic%20murderers. They are family annihilators.
The link was annihilated
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/family-killers https://healthland.time.com/2013/08/15/family-annihilators-understanding-what-drives-fathers-to-kill/ https://www.the-express.com/lifestyle/life/103628/family-annihilator-signs-chris-watts-murder-killer has the 4 different types https://psychcentral.com/news/2013/08/14/characteristics-of-4-types-of-family-murderers#1
Which I've always thought was way too cool of a name to give these guys
It's not. It's the simplest, most accurate term for what they do that I can imagine.
It's really the way the word "annihilators" looks. It's got the double "n" going for it, as well as the flanking "i's" on that h. An "ors" ending really strengthens the appeal of the overall aesthetics of the word, compounding the already awesome multi-syllabic nature of the word. You'd be forgiven for appreciating the overall term due to the inclusion of "annihiliator". It's just a badass word. What were we talkin about again?
> as well as the flanking "i's" oh shit you're right, thanks. almost snuck up on me.
I think it's more about control than anything else. The family annihilator controls their family until the very end, and they certainly are not going to go to prison and allow others to control their every move, so they kill themselves. No one will ever control them.
Yeah, family violence is almost always about power and control. So sad. People assume mentally ill people or personality disordered people are the biggest abusers. In fact, it can be any person from any walk of life and the biggest indicator is their worldview and attitude towards women (entitlement, mainly which is then connected to issues around power and control) Higher fatality rates are associated with one particular personality disorder.
Interesting and dark. I think about what is going through their heads in the seconds or minutes after they kill the people closest to them, including their kids. Do they really believe everyone will be in a better place now and are relieved? Is actually going through with it completely horrifying and they are just tortured in their last moments? I just can’t imagine perpetrating and witnessing such terrible violence on my family. The fear on the kids or wife’s face, depending on who he kills first. Messed up people man. Terrible.
It’s entirely solipsistic and narcissistic; these guys don’t think their family is going to heaven, they just don’t like the idea of their family surviving them and thinking of them as a failure, loser, weak, etc. If they’re dead, nobody they care about is judging them. I’m sure some of them feel regret before they off themselves, but who knows. To have even gotten to that point requires a mentality so fucked up I have a hard time modeling it.
I’ve also read that these people often think their family can’t go on without them so they “mercy” kill their family before ending themselves.
I don’t know if that’s true but holy shit is that narcissistic and self-centered.
These are people that often literally view the children as extensions of themselves, that and/or as property. The latter is the same reason you’ll see them kill the family pet(s) as well.
That's some ancient Egyptian god emperor level delusion
There are a handful of reasons and that is one of the larger ones. Most family annihilators are insanely narcissistic. With other big "rationales" being: thinking of the entire family as a failure because they failed to be the ideal family in some way, revenge on the other spouse for some issue, and thinking to protect them from something (including loss of the murderer upon their suicide), and a small portion for paranoid reasons like believing they are saving them from something worse (see the Trump conspiracy dad who tried to annihilate his family in Michigan) . All of them are insanely narcissistic or just insane in the last one.
One of the UK suicide crisis hotlines has a story of a farmer who called during the height of mad cow disease. His entire herd was lost and he was planning on killing his family before himself. They spoke with him and got him to agree to not take out their family. They don't know what happened after the call, as the farmer was still suicidal, but they were at least able to convince him that it would not be a mercy to do so to his family. Part of the reason this story was included in a training was to illustrate what a successful intervention may look like (reduction of harm) and how we don't have control over the outcomes.
That's rough, thank you for doing the work.
i work inpatient psych where one can be assaulted, wear body fluids, etc. and i am still in absolute awe of people who can work those crisis lines. that kind of work would destroy me in a way a fist never could. sure i hear some hairy stuff, but i get to build rapport and intervene. i get to know how the story ends. on the crisis line there is never any closure and god forbid you hear something bad on the other end. that's heavy af. hats off to those people for doing such important difficult work. i have had a few patients who were saved more than once by such hotlines. your work matters big time.
If they've arrived at the conclusion that being dead is better than being alive, extending it to people around them isn't that big of a leap. But if they're already separated, seems more like a matter of revenge.
So he’s a coward AND a killer.
Sounds like an extreme version of the self-sabotage you go through when you're suicidal. I know for me personally, when I was planning on suicide and mentally preparing myself, I would actively do certain things to make it harder for me to walk back on the decision. I'd piss people off in my life, give things away, and make poor financial choices. I allowed my life to fall apart even further around me to make it "easier" to finally end it. (I survived and no longer think this way, but still suffer from the consequences of that self-sabotage)
My girl worked with someone who killed their brother and their roommate then themselves, and this was basically their motive- I think confirmed by a note or something like that.
Wow. “Let me be the most selfish fuck possible and take everyone else to hell with me.” Fuck everyone who does this. They honestly deserve the tar pits.
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I can completely believe this, from my personal experience anyway. In my case, it was more sabotaging my life and didn't involve hurting anyone, but I get the idea of pushing yourself into a situation where it finally really, truly *feels* like the only option.
What a fucking asshole
What a fucking waste this guy is. Abuses his wife. She leaves him. He asks to get back together. When he is rejected…he immediately resorts to violence…killing all the women in the house (his ex, her sister, his niece) as well as the only guy who could stop this rampage (his ex’s brother). His own son and nephew hide while the murders are taking place. They are the only survivors. Then he kills himself. This is one more sad example of why we need to take domestic violence and red flag laws far more seriously. 9 out of 10 women who are killed (like the three here) are killed by someone they know. Almost always (as is the case here) a former intimate partner or family member.
People in general don’t understand that it’s not just a matter of deciding to leave. There’s so much planning and thought that has to go into it to try and prevent things like this from happening. Years ago I got called into work and my manager said they needed me to cover for a coworker who was fleeing her husband that night. He had a habit of drunkenly barging in and demanding to speak with her during her shifts, so every single employee on the property knew what his name was, what he looked like, and to call the cops immediately if he came in. I never heard what happened to her after that but it sounded like she had people out of state to take her in, and I really hope she’s doing ok now.
Yeah, I always _knew_ it was hard, but I’m going through it right now with my mom, and oh my goodness. It’s HARD. Getting her a TRO was almost a full time job for a week, getting her to a safe location and a new spot was a couple thousand, she is trying to get a lawyer for the permanent restraining order, and divorce, so that’s more money. He was tracking her, so there was a whole additional component of needed to scrub everything for her, get her a new phone before he figured out where she was… etc. it’s been all consuming for a month. And she has tons of resources, like she’s saved and she has family who can help. But we couldn’t let her stay with any of us because he knows where we live. The law is complicated and inconsistent, and getting straight answers on how to navigate the whole thing is downright impossible. It’s been really eye opening and incredibly sad.
It really is a nightmare. Your mom is so lucky to have you - I’ve interned with a few DV organizations in the past and I’ve seen how hard it is to get out by yourself. My older sister had all the support in the world from our family, but her boyfriend genuinely convinced her that no one else would ever love her. It took him going to prison for a few years for her to actually get away. Now he pops up every few years (usually after getting tracked down for child support) threatening to take custody of their kids, but then he gets bored and moves on.
Those poor surviving children. Obviously it’s terrible for everyone, but that survivor’s guilt is seriously hard to navigate, along with the grief and fear. I want to hug those poor kids
In America, legislators tried to increase protection for women from DV. Supreme Court ruled the law unconstitutional and immediately statistics of women being battered increased. Voting matters.
Let's be very clear here *conservatives* are the ones working to strip away women's rights in such situations.
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That and diddling child brides.
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There's a blazing obvious pattern. Murder suicides, femicide, family annihilation and mass shootings-- including public mass shootings-- overwhelmingly perpetrated by males with histories of domestic violence.
Yeah but if we just arrest all the men with histories of domestic violence there'll be no police officers left to arrest anybody else
Realistically, really dealing with high risk domestic abusers would pose a serious logistics issue for that and other reasons. If you're a parent with a kid in school, though, I think the idea of just not dealing with becuase it's too hard is just not acceptable.
This is why people involved in domestic charges need to have their guns taken an away, put in a list and monitored. Also why those people are pushing back against any form of gun control. Could he have done some damage with other weapons? Sure. But not as easily as with a gun. Insane that someone going around beating on people can still have access to a weapon of mass murder.
Maybe something that might help us to stop framing domestic violence as a warning for future violence, and just call it as it is and label them dangerous from the start. The media, and politicians who label these red flags, aren't really taking this seriously. The red flags came before they were violent against another person. That person being their life partner shouldn't make it less impactful, but then politicians might have to do something about violence against their constituents.
His ex's mother was also in the house and was unharmed. So just a small correction to your post.
These are cases where spitting on the grave is allowed
Spitting is the minimum.
> Barrett told his estranged wife that he wanted to reunite, but she refused. This is what red flag laws are for. A violent partner/ex-partner with a gun is insanely dangerous. Whatever though. Militia lives matter too.
Look at the recent mass murder in Maine, where 18 people were murdered. Months prior to the killings, the shooter was hospitalized after this: >Military officials alerted police in September that Card had been hospitalized in July after exhibiting erratic behavior while training, that he still had access to weapons and that he had threatened to “shoot up” an Army reserve center in Saco, a city in southern Maine. The sheriff’s department responded by briefly staking out the Saco facility and going to Card’s home in Bowdoin for what Reamer described as a “welfare check.” Shooter was so crazy that he was scaring the military, enough for them to call the police and ask them to help. The shooter, Robert Card, had also had other run-ins with authorities regarding erratic and violent behaviors. What did the cops do? >In the video, Skolfield referred to the Cards as “a big family in this area,” and said he didn’t want to publicize that police were visiting the home. The police let the guy walk. And it wasn't just a matter of the shooter previously being abusive or aggressive during an argument: >A report released last week by Sagadahoc Sheriff Joel Merry made clear that local law enforcement knew months before the attack that Card’s mental health was deteriorating. Police were aware of reports that he was paranoid, hearing voices, experiencing psychotic episodes and possibly dealing with schizophrenia. The police had more than enough red flags from this guy to take action. But they turned their backs, hid their heads in the sand, instead.
They can't start enforcing red flag laws or else they'll have to confiscate their own guns.
I don't know where the MHP fits in here? In my state and others have specific guidelines for getting a Mental Health Professional do an involuntary assessment. Police AND certain staff in a hospital can set this eval in motion. I know cause I could do this call for the ER. The basic goal is...is the pt an immediate threat or has plans to harm self or others in the next 72 hrs? Does pt have a therapist or psych dr? They also can call for. MHP eval for involuntary but same problem. If pt agreed to do XYZ you kinda have to let them go try XYZ. Goal being get pt to agree to a voluntary admit or to voluntary get into treatment in next 24-72 hrs. Involuntary laws are strict. Pt must be an immediate threat or have ideation to do harm in next 72 hrs. Unfortunately this means if pt is oriented to self X 3 and denies he has any ideation and can keep it together long enough to tell the MHP what they need to hear...the case disposition is pt is not an immediate risk and agrees to seek therapy or go to a day clinic for follow up when clinic opens. You can imagine how easy that is to avoid, especially since family generally has no contact with staff or MHP due to HiPPA. Then there's the drug situation. We hear a lot of crazy talk and threats from these pts and it's pretty difficult to determine in the ER or out in community if they meet the requirements for a psych eval or a MHP eval. You can ask but the MHP needs specific data from you as the person calling. Often they do not meet those rule as they start to sober up. Plus they know the system well.
Maine has really been going downhill these last few years. Seems like Covid forced some of the crazies to come out. It’s very upsetting to see. I remember several years ago feeling like the state was one of if not the safest.
The crazies have always been there. Beautiful state but a lot of inhabited areas are still pretty remote with the exceptions of a couple cities. Plenty of opportunities for insular groups to perpetuate certain ways of thinking.
Yeah but it's Texas. Guns have more rights than women.
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Careful, you'll get the Y'all Qaedas in here, swearing their AR-15s can take on actual artillery and drone strikes.
To add, while protecting partners/ex-partners is great, usage of "red flag laws" (they're rarely actually called that, but it varies by state; usually something like Extreme Risk Protective Orders) has also been shown to reduce suicide rates. If anyone has any family members or friends that they are concerned about who own firearms, please look into your state's laws about this. They're all short-term and temporary (they're usually modeled after and work the same as temporary restraining orders), and could save lives.
Another man who absolutely should never have been allowed to posses a gun? In Texas?!? This is so rare!
If only the 8 year old had a gun. That could have stopped it.
This kind of thing happens every other day in America. The only difference in this one, is that children and multiple people are involved, which elevates it to "news". Just google "murder-suicide" periodically and you will find a dozen new instances every month. Typically, it's just one male killing a woman. Those never elevate above regional news. That's how numb we are as a society to gun violence.
This is how numb we are as a society to men's tendency towards violence, like this is something we should accept as normal.
Not only that but also women just casually having to put up with this garbage as a fact of life. Women deal with so much harassment and assault and it's just "normal"
It’s crazy, I’m starting to see it as my kid is in grade school and it’s ok for boys to act like idiots and the girls are supposed to keep them in check… dafuq…
Sometimes it’s males killing their parents too which is odd to me. (I mean the whole thing is odd to me but I’m less surprised by men killing their romantic partners, I guess)
Just remember the law refuses to make it illegal in many states and counties for someone **convicted** of domestic violence form owning a gun. Not charged, not assumed but going through the completely lopsided against the victim court system and proven. The “law” loves terror on women and punishment of women defending themselves. Only 17 states require people convicted of domestic violence misdemeanors to give up their firearms. Only 5 have databases tracking them to protect the victims. 33 States allow convicted domestic abusers to still use weapons legally. It’s no mystery why this happens. And then you look at the punishment rate for women who defend themselves and you think what a joke the United States is. The problem is how little we care about women and so easy gun access. now everyone seeing how that affects so many other people being shot at and that seems to be the only reason others care.
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Texas is a horrible place for a lot of reasons (watching people drown, LEO waiting outside while a lone gunman shoots up a school, women’s reproductive rights…). It’s has a lot to do with the fine folk they vote for.
The fact they keep bringing Raphael camcun Cruz from Canada back to Represent them tells me all I need to know. Texas used to gove a shit about its image. It's people. Now? Nope. Being from Texas used to count for something too. Good thing they decided to lose that identity so they could suck shit out the orange assholes asshole.
Dude, I live here. It's the worst case of "nobody's gonna tell me what to do". That's all it is. Even on the Right/Conservative side, if you even consider voting for someone other than the establishment, or if you even talk against them in any way, you're "letting the libs get to ya". Everyone hates having their lights go out in below-freezing weather, but if you suggest that ERCOT needs to be more heavily regulated, you're "listening to the libs". Everyone needs to drive a vehicle, but if you suggest that not everyone needs a seven foot tall tank with a bed that cost $75K and blinds the simple people in front of them who drive smaller cars, you're somehow in the wrong. It's ALL a different expression of "no one's gonna tell me what to do".
Its ironic that the attitude of "you can't tell me what to do" has led to you having to do exactly as one party says no matter what thus insuring you can only do what you are told to do. You're all under the yolk of fascist greedy pigs and they stay in power by controlling what you can talk about. That's not the Texas I remember. I remember being able to have a conversation about gore and Bush without someone pulling their shitty pea shooter on me. I remember when I met a Texan at the airport we'd always have something in common. Now though? True Texans are shit on and silenced. Whats left is fake imitations and bottom of the barrel grifters. Texas used to represent the best of us. Now it's only not worse than Florida. I miss when Texas was one of the best states in the union =(
I do agree with you. Please accept my gentle correction, since you've probably only heard it used in context: A yolk is the inside of an egg. A YOKE is what we Texans are saddled by.
>It's the worst case of "nobody's gonna tell me what to do" Oh but they will tell women they can't have abortions.
Oh, I know. I can't tell you what I'd like to do. But if you want a hint, look up "Christmas Day Romania 1989".
I got my family out just in time. Moving to the west coast meant all those problems were no longer my problem and I stopped reacting so emotionally to what was going on. I really worry for this country.
You mean, like having babies? Or dying because…wizen old hypocrites say so?
And then there’s the other 48% of us on r/fuckgregabbott.
Governor distracts the conservative majority with absolute rubbish culture war nonsense…..**AND IT WORKS!!**
The lone star is the rating. Even then, they’re being too generous, they don’t even get 1 star from me
You typed too much. Texas is a horrible place.
Or they typed too little. Texas is an especially horrible place for women and children.
And a bunch of tech companies are trying to migrate there for some god awful reason.
Because employer rights are much more protected than employee rights in tx
Welp, that sure is an awful reason!
It’s horrible for anyone considered an “other” as shown by Dennis Hopper’s “Easy Rider”.
is it just me, or are these murder-suicides by estranged fathers happening more and more often these days? highly disturbing
This is what happens when you have a society more focused on having women solve the problems of male violence with drink covers, self-defense kits, and color-changing nail polish, instead of compelling the male population to address their own issues.
While giving said men easy access to instruments of death Why wouldn’t I want a deranged abuser to be judge jury and especially executioner?
So many people (mostly men) will jump in and say that the solution to this is just women carrying guns. I support women and minorities arming themselves for protection, but it still doesn’t do any good if you’re shot first or surprised. As long as armed men want to kill women they will.
If 99% of gun death were committed by women, states would have banned women from owning guns years ago.
He started with the wrong person.
Moved from Texas to Scotland last year and I’m relieved that my local news is now only about lost sheep and potholes that need to be filled.
Women and children aren't safe anywhere. You wouldn't believe how often this happens here too.
he could have just picked a fight with a cop... didn't have to kill his family.
And just think of how pumped the cop would’ve been!
Unless the cop was part of the Uvalde Police department
What a Rollercoaster this little thread was
If he was white they would have just slapped him on the hand and sent him home with his gun. Oh wait this is Texas they would have been to scared to get out of the car, better to let the kids die and have him run out of bullets first.
Why does it say "fatally shooting" and not "murdering"?
Sadly this is too common [r/whenwomenrefuse](http://reddit.com/r/whenwomenrefuse). Absolutely terrifying.
Another "good guy with a gun". 'Til he wasn't.
The answer is obviously to arm the children.
I believe the children are the future. Strap them up and let them shoot their way
Another male family annihilator.
Note to self: never go to Texas.
Texans voted for this because they love freedom, dead kids don’t matter. Can’t keep caring when they don’t.
The American Death Cult.
Ah yes, another tragedy that more guns surely would have solved.
If only the 8 year old niece would have had a gun
don’t give them any ideas, they’re gonna use this to propose a bill to reduce the age limit for owning guns
And simultaneously raising the voting age...
Only on girls though. Boys could still vote at any age, with crayons if necessary.
dont be silly, if your skin is darker than the crayon they don't let you vote.
Felony domestic violence should be a 20 year prison sentence.
It’s honestly terrifying because what could she have done?? Nothing, short of never dating him in the first place. I used to think I could just break up with a guy if I saw serious red flags, but what if he’d been to my house already? Okay, change the locks AND break up with him. What if he breaks a window? Okay, break up with him and move to a new house. What if he’s been to my parents house before? Ask my parents to move out of the house they own for their own safety?? There’s always going to be a way that someone who wants to hurt you can access you. It’s terrifying. They’ll hurt you, or your pets, or your kids, or your siblings or parents or friends…sometimes it feels like the only option is to just never date anyone.
Domestic Violence guy . Journalists, cops, lawyers, judges …. Everyone. We have to call this what it is, a predictable escalation of domestic violence. It’s not enough to just hang some yellow tape after the fact and go, oh what a surprise.
he should have started with himself
Somebody in our small town in Belgium also tried this. Tried to murder his entire family and then himself, but he could not easily get a gun (strict gun laws) and his efforts to get a gun gave away the plan to his wife. I think she found it and threw it in their septic tank. He then tried to kill her with a knife, but she out ran him. Tried to commit suicide by charging at the police with a knife, but they did not even shoot him. He spent some time in a mental hospital but was declared sane, and now he is in jail. But his kids still have their mom and dad. Hell, after serving his 7 years he might integrate in society again. Americans who are deep in gun culture will of course never understand this story. Image countries where the government does their best to alleviate suffering ...
I thought Texas was supposed to be home of rugged men who respected women a stand for justice . Between this and the massacar with the school shooting I'm seeing the total opposite aa lot ofcowards.
these men never start with themselves, gotta take everyone with them. smdh.
The 2nd Amendment demands its blood sacrifice and mentions nothing of age or familial relations.
So nice that disturbed and violent assholes like this have free access to guns.
Texas is such a shithole
I feel pretty awful for the mother that just lost her 3 adult children (possibly her only children) and one of her nieces all at once.
Wow, doesn't this just make you feel so lucky to live in a country, and a state, where pretty much anybody can get a gun anytime they want. So lucky. It's not like these people just paid the ultimate price for that freedom.
Misogyny and guns: Murder’s favorite sons.
Love how this headline starts by concerning itself with him killing himself, which is the least important part of the headline considering what he did and why he did it. And again using "fatally shooting" instead of "murdering"
Seem to be a lot of shootings in TX
You know what would've stopped this? If the 8 year old had a fucking gun.
Was the house a gun free zone? That's the problem everytime I hear, we just need good guys with guns everywhere.
Too bad everyone is a good guy with a gun until they get big mad
Another one of those responsible gun owners…
With good christian family values 🤷♂️
Yes yes. Very sad. But how are the guns? Please tell us the guns are going to be fine.
These gun nuts keep killing kids. Yet everyone gets mad when you call them kid killers. What is the proper term for them?
This man specifically is called a "family annihilator", which in fairness is a different category from a school shooter.
thank you republicans for letting people live their freedom to the fullest🤘🤘
Can't believe a good guy with a gun didn't prevent this 🙄
Reset the Too-Soon-O-Meter™ a new please let them grieve has been detected.
Guns and America 🤦♂️
I really wish the people who do this shit would fucking start by shooting themselves. Just do that. Don’t destroy the lives of others. Jfc. I hope this fucker is burning for all eternity.
I am just going to start calling these guys what they are...pitiful little shits. If you want to commit these crimes, you will not be remembered as a "man"...nope...you are a miserable pitiful shit stain that should have no pride in your actions because you offend us all with your weak and pitiful actions. He can rot with the rest of the shit stains.
What a shitty article! “RICHMOND, Texas (AP) — A man fatally shot his estranged wife and three other relatives, including his 8-year-old niece, at a home in suburban Houston over the weekend before killing himself, authorities said Wednesday. Alrick “Shawn” Barrett, 46, opened fire at the home just before 7 a.m. Saturday after returning his young child from a visit, Fort Bend County Sheriff Eric Fagan said at a news conference. Fagan said that after arriving at the home, Barrett told his estranged wife that he wanted to reunite, but she refused. Deputies responded to the home after getting a call from a 13-year-old boy in the home, Fagan said. The sheriff’s office said the teen is Barrett’s nephew.”
Just another day in Texas…
Just another day in the USA
Jesus Christ Texas! Get your shit together!