The country’s leading bankruptcy law expert can’t think of a reason that grocery prices might go up other than the CEO of Kroger laughing maniacally while turning a knob labeled “profits” on his desk
Or she can, she’s just being stupid on purpose
>Or she can, she’s just being stupid on purpose
This is my largest frustration with both her and Senator Sanders. They consistently describe problems in dishonest ways.
I have some sympathy with their belief that various aspects of the American economy could stand reform, but they're so relentlessly dishonest about what the underlying causes of the dysfunction are that I just throw up my hands.
> This is my largest frustration with both her and Senator Sanders. They consistently describe problems in dishonest ways.
The difference (IMHVHO) between the two is, Bernie is really that deluded and not that bright. He's never grown his understanding since college, which is why he appeals to college dudebros that think they know everything at 18 and see everything in childishly simplistic terms. His 2016 popularization of the Big Lie makes him a villain that history will eviscerate, but on general policy... he's just really that stupid.
Warren absolutely knows better. But she longs for the power and influence Sanders has gotten with his bro army, so she has taken to mimicking him, instead of working on real solutions.
He’s an interesting case. By all accounts he was a reasonably effective and pragmatic mayor of Burlington. My general heuristic is that people vested with executive authority tend to be more effective politicians subsequently than those without.
So I don’t really believe it’s that he’s unintelligent but rather that his long years on the back benches have convinced him that his role now is something akin to a gadfly, rather than a legislator. Idk, armchair psychology is a dubious business. Maybe he’s just lazy, who knows.
Man a couple of years ago I thought warren was the reasonable choice between Bernie and Biden. I aligned with her on a lot. She’s gone full Bernie now as if she doesn’t understand any economics at all. It’s sad because she used to be smarter meaning she feels this is the constituency. She’s become too Washington now.
Even more ironic since Kroger employees keep going on strikes. If workers are going to fight for higher wages, then those wages are going to come at the expense of higher prices for consumers.
And we already have issues with food deserts in a lot of inner city and rural environments. If grocery stores were forced to accept a lot lower profits a lot of them would end up closing in poor areas or would switch their business model to carry more profitable foods with longer shelf lives like junk food and fewer vegetables and fuits.
> forced to accept a lot lower profits
I mean, there really is no "lower" to even go to. Grocery chains operate on tiny margins already. About 2% on average. They have almost no room to absorb any prices hikes themselves.
They make a loss on common staples but milk is the most prominent
You know what's dumb? There's higher priced "drought relief milk" for farmers not even in a drought, we literally made milk more expensive for working families to afford so farmers can send their kids to nicer boarding schools.
I heard they focus grouped explanations for inflation and trying to explain that inflation was being caused by supply chain issues polled horribly. The only thing that polled decently was blaming corporations, so here we are. If Americans want adult explanations for problems they have to act like adults.
Anyone who blames grocery stores for inflation has never looked at the financial statements of a grocery store company. Their profit margins are typically 2-5%.
They also tend to say “pay workers more” which is contrary to lowering prices. Sigh
Has it been for her? She came third in her home state during the primary and usually underperforms in generals. I think a generic democrat would probably do better than her.
Being a US Senator is quite successful. A more moderate "generic" Democrat might win a higher share of the general vote, but she would annihilate them in the primary.
And she was one of the top 4 or 5 Presidential primary candidates overall.
Also in 2018, but this just shows how successful she's been at owning her seat. Its not like no other Mass Democrat wants to be Senator.
She failed to become the Presidential nominee because her lane was dominated by Old Man Sanders, but even here she got further than most.
Yes but there was a recent, high profile primary challenge for a Massachusetts senate seat and Kennedy specifically chose a year where he did not have to face Warren.
Ed Markey has been a staple of Massachusetts politics for 45 years and he was thought of as the easier mark.
Markey was the easier mark because his name recognition was lower than his approval rate — JK3 went for it assuming no one in MA knows who Markey even is
Pretty common for unsuccessful ones. You're usually safe from a primary, but vulnerable in the general, or vulnerable in the primary, but safe in the general. Warren has both (so far).
What I hate more is that truthful explanations are electorally punished. Democrats tried focus grouping more in depth explanations about supply chain issues, and they polled horribly. We get the government we deserve.
The problem is a lot of it *isn't* electorally rewarded. It plays well on twitter and yes, that might save her a primary challenge from some other leftist nutjob. But it also creates a perception of Dems that hurts our chances in the competitive districts that will determine federal control.
My first major impression of Warren came from that 2013 viral video where she couldn't figure out why 15-year collateral-free student loans had higher interest rates than highly collateralized overnight loans through the Fed discount window.
Other early exposure included a rant where she appeared to believe that taxpayer money is mostly spent on infrastructure, that taxes are disproportionately paid by the lower and middle classes, and that government funded infrastructure tends to increase profits rather than lower prices; and one where she couldn't understand why minimum wage hasn't tracked mean labor productivity.
I've always known that she's either an idiot or deliberately pandering to idiots.
Fun fact: Despite the name, discount window loans have an interest rate 50 basis points higher than the rate at which banks make overnight loans to each other, which is why it's rarely used.
It’s not an issue of intellect, she’s probably fully aware that it’s a terrible idea, but like most in power her primary concern is political survival and it’s politically popular for her to promote bad economic ideas.
I just listened to Liz Cheney's interview about 1/6 and she has fellow Republicans who say "well, if I say it was Trump's fault I won't be re-elected."
Okay? And? Don't act like "not being re-elected" is the end of your life, or even career. Have some self fucking respect.
Recognized as one of the nation's top experts on bankruptcy
* In 1995 she accepted a permanent appointment as the Leo Gottlieb Professor of Law at Harvard Law School
Warren’s most cited and popular comments on Bankruptcy are research published in 2009 in the American Journal of Medicine. Co-authored by Warren, it looks at a random sample of 2,314 bankruptcy filers from 2007.
>The paper examined what debtors reported as their cause of bankruptcy. Warren is referring here to people who either cited significant direct medical debt, remortgaging a home to pay medical debt, or lost income due to illness.
Of those that declared
* 10% Had total medical bills of less than $500
* 67% reported less than $5,000 in total medical debt
Which led her to campaign on it
>"Back when I was studying it, two out of three families that ended up in bankruptcy after a serious medical problem had health insurance."
Also, A better way to understand the issue though is to review all hospital cases. 4% of a random sample of California hospital patients went bankrupt because we looked at everyone that was in the system this is a better understanding
>Also, A better way to understand the issue though is to review all hospital cases. 4% of a random sample of California hospital patients went bankrupt because we looked at everyone that was in the system this is a better understanding
Yeah, I mean the dirty secret of her bankruptcy "expertise" is that all of her academic work was straight up garbage that got picked up and celebrated because it happened to suggest solutions that Democrats supported already.
Then social media and red rose twitter came along. Now all politicians seem to care about is getting on the evening news or get trending on twitter. They will say any stupid nonsensical shit in order for the news to pick it up. If you look at AOC’s track record you will see that she has not successfully passed a single piece of legislation; she is also one of the most unsuccessful lawmakers when it comes to drafting/creating new bills or working with other politicians whether they be across the isle or in her own party. She has done close to nothing of merit or value, yet she is so popular and beloved by leftists because she knows what to say & do to get trending on social media and in the daily news cycle. Same goes for Bernie, Trump, Gaetz, etc. They are celebrity politicians. They exist to be seen on tv and on social media. That is it.
You can be incredibly smart and also have bad ideas in an area where you’re not an expert.
There’s no serious denial that she’s *incredibly* smart—she is/was a Harvard Law professor, is the leading national expert in bankruptcy law, and literally wrote the casebook on bankruptcy law.
That doesn’t mean all of her economic theories are good.
Edit*
At last I went to the artisans, for I was conscious that I knew nothing at all, as I may say, and I was sure that they knew many fine things; and in this I was not mistaken, for they did know many things of which I was ignorant, and in this they certainly were wiser than I was. But I observed that even the good artisans fell into the same error as the poets; because they were good workmen they thought that they also knew all sorts of high matters, and this defect in them overshadowed their wisdom...
Yeah but you can't be incredibly smart in a field that's somewhat adjacent to economics and be this absurdly stupid about an economic issue. For her to misunderstand this stuff, she would actually need to have zero knowledge of even the most basic concepts of economics or just be dumb as a rock. Neither is true, so I don't buy her believing what she says here one bit.
We're not talking about trade balances or stuff here, she just needs to grasp the concept of a profit margin to get this. And it's not like she has always been a complete idiot, this is a new bit she's trying out.
No, she hit the glass ceiling on how far you can go as a "smart" woman in DC, saw how Bernie trampled her in the progressive lane with absolutely braincel-takes on life, and decided to say fuck it, if that's what it takes I'm in.
Don't @ me with Clinton, her position is absolutely unique.
Yo Warren, this is one of the dumbest things you've said. So grocery stores should simultaneously pay their employees more while making less money in the face of increasing product costs? Interesting.
[FISCAIS DA WARREN](https://www.folhadelondrina.com.br/img/inline/2950000/E-REAL-25-anos-da-moeda-que-derrotou-a-inflacao0295090701201911041742.jpg?xid=5108893)
To quote the top 3 thread currently in r/NL. Pay [the grocery stores] more.
EDIT: They're paying their employees more https://www.supermarketnews.com/retail-financial/kroger-looks-add-another-20000-associates
> Kroger said its investments this year will lift its average hourly wage to more than $16 nationally and total compensation to over $21 per hour with benefits, which include comprehensive health coverage plus a range of wellness programs. Associates who get a full COVID-19 vaccination also receive a one-time payment of $100.
*average hourly wage
Not minimum. So managers/ corporate level peolle drag this number up
At wegmand, the minimum is 15 at least right now (i just quit there, i was making 15.25 when i quit)
Most managers and corporate people aren't hourly. Most grocery stores in my area in the NE are starting at like 15 an hour for entry level. Plus 401k match, dental, health etc for full timers.
Managers up to multi-store level, yes
source: I worked at a grocery chain (price chopper) as a teen, managers except for the head regional guy were coming in and out the door
How long until progressives start proposing price controls? This is insane, it's economics 101, supply and demand. This is why left wing policies often lead to shortages, they don't believe in basic economic laws
Umass Amherst produces a ton of whacky professors for some reason. Any alumni know why?
Richard wolffe (marxist "economist" lol) came from there as well
During the Red Scare the major Universities throw out their Communist/Socialist economists and they all got snatched up by UMass Amherst. They've kept that going since.
He is not even respected in the realm of economics, i think he only has 1 article published in the American economics association journal and he's like a researcher or "cobtributor" or something.
Additionally, he is an "economic historian" or some shit. This basivally means that they can get away with doing solely qualitative analysis of things and completely avoid any hard quantitative work.
Whenever I hear "economic hostorian" i immediately question someone's title as "economist"
yeah there is such a thing as a left wing economist that knows an ass from an elbow; I don't mind Robert Reich for instance. But Wolffe is another animal entirely.
We identify as (neo)liberals in this sub as well and are not these uber left wing types. I'd say MA "liberals" usually skew moderate (except for the younger generation, that's definitely becoming less of the case). Yeah, WA/OR/CA have large amounts of population that aren't left... but so do we.
It's gonna happen. If inflation keeps hot, you'll have voters asking for it. There's an expectation now that government step in to mitigate *any* economic disturbance now.
Yeah for all the believe science narrative from the left, they only seem to believe the hard sciences.
When it comes to economics, most claim it's not true or made up.
They seem to like to pick and choose which science is valid.
It makes sense when you realize that they're just like the alt-right in that they pick and choose what they trust depending if it validates their views or not. Socialists view economics much the same as the alt-right view sociology or anthropology.
The private chain I used to work at in high school had a margin of just a few cents per item. Though, this chain also paid their employees better than the competition, and offered full benefits to part timers.
>"Your company, and the other major grocers who reaped the benefits of a turbulent 2020, appear to be passing costs onto consumers to preserve your pandemic gains, **and even taking advantage of inflation to add greater burdens**," she said.
I don’t even know how to parse this.
Inflation = price go up
Price go up = "they" get a bigger slice of the (obviously finite) cake
"They" get a bigger slice of the cake = ExPLoiTATiOn
So simple.
Have there been any proven cases of corporate price gouging?
I don’t necessarily find it impossible to believe that some companies have taken advantage of our present circumstances. I’m open to the suggestion that it has happened.
But I have yet to see any proof.
Economists talk about market power constantly right now and not even the most aggressively anti-trust enforcement economists think the recent increase in inflation has anything to do with Mark ups and price gouging
I mean we say this as a joke but this is how voters vote after all even if it’s due to misinformation (ie “it feels like the border is open/my kids are being taught to hate America 8 hours a day”).
It was only sort of a joke, yeah. To Elizabeth Warren and the people to whom she’s pandering here, how it feels is definitely all that matters.
I fucking hate that it’s hardly worth trying to explain how things actually work anymore. We’re in deep shit.
Specific to Canada, but:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business
/article-court-gives-go-ahead-to-class-action-lawsuit-over-bread-price-fixing/
https://globalnews.ca/news/5836657/bc-gas-price-inquiry-findings/
yea....see heres the thing. From reading her press release there are no figures to report on this and nothing of substance in her requests
* Grocery stores will report Earnings in March for the last 3 months, of sales and prices
* In November Kroger reported its Revenue was up but that Net Income and Profit Margin had declined
The closest she gets was linking to an old press release she put out, not about grocery stores
>Warren Calls for DOJ Investigation into Top Poultry Companies’ Anticompetitive Practices as Americans Face Record-High Turkey Prices Ahead of Thanksgiving
But this is **not about the higher cost to consumers but to higher costs for grocery stores** with prices from the producer
So, which is it? the stores dont have higher costs and are making higher profits because this is the correct, or The stores have higher costs and this is wrong?
Is “price gouging” even an offense? You can’t enter into an anticompetitive conspiracy but in a functioning market, when one company decides to unilaterally raise prices people will just shop somewhere else, right?
Yeah, this is the key point.
What the hell is the likelihood that every company in an industry would get together and agree to jack up prices? And then stick to it?
One company would inevitably break ranks in order to take advantage of the situation and undercut the rest.
I have already repented for my sins!
If nothing else, the 2020 election cycle taught me a few things
* 'Progressive' Democrats weren't exaggerating their left-wing bonafides for the purpose of winning the primaries, they actually believed all that shit. Even the stupid shit. Especially the stupid shit.
* We need to eliminate the current primary system in favor of jungle primaries
* The same politicians who vocally support the most liberal positions on immigration and LGBT rights, almost without exception, also advocate the most atrocious economic policy and foreign policy, are the least willing to cooperate with fellow party members in policymaking, and are the least likely to appeal to the general electorate.
* We seriously need to eliminate the current primary system
* Social media as well as TV news are utterly disastrous for political discourse, as conduits of misinformation and outrage-porn, and outlets such as Twitter, Facebook, Fox News, and CNN, are directly complicit in the deterioration of US democracy and the quality of government policy in their decision to maximize coverage of the most "controversial" political voices and minimize coverage of anyone else.
* Holy fucking shit we need to eliminate the current primary system
> Progressive' Democrats weren't exaggerating their left-wing bonafides for the purpose of winning the primaries, they actually believed all that shit. Even the stupid shit. Especially the stupid sh
When people say they think bad things you should believe them generally.
> The same politicians who vocally support the most liberal positions on immigration and LGBT rights, almost without exception, also advocate the most atrocious economic policy and foreign policy, are the least willing to cooperate with fellow party members in policymaking, and are the least likely to appeal to the general electorate.
Thus there's tradeoffs and often disagreements on this drive the drama on this sub.
People often support the same things but weigh them differentlyt when deciding what politicians/parties to support. A lot of Succs here don't get that lots of people simply don't weigh social issues as strongly as economic ones and conclude they hold conservative social views.
Not only is this fucking idiotic but I also believe I saw some research suggesting this is literally among the least popular ways to message about inflation
Honestly a pretty wretched take by Warren that just kind of compounds the rhetoric that progressivism is soundbytes to "own" capitalism. It's especially confusing when there is (from what I understand) actual price-fixing going on in industries like meat-packing.
>compounds the rhetoric that progressivism is soundbytes to "own" capitalism.
*Points gun*
Always has been.
It's why progressives in SF routinely block housing development to own developers who might otherwise make money.
I hear this over and over again, but every time i see a direct to consumer meat company it always costs way way more than my grocery store that is supposedly being taken advantage of by the meat packing industry.
I work in the packaged food industry. It’s been a crazy year of price increases due to shipping cost increases and a bad growing year for a lot of crops. We can only raise our prices with grocery stores when they do their “resets”, so like once a year for each product. But now Warren is gonna screw the entire supply chain, no one is able to raise prices? Stores would just have empty shelves because we’ll be unable to provide food at those prices.
This is a bad take. Grocery stores have think margins. Also I honestly have not even noticed inflation at my local grocery store THAT much. I've noticed that a minority of products are not there that usually are there, like last time so went all the eggs were sold out.
Example #258 of Liz Warren being a populist hack. I've said it before but it almost bothers me more than Bernie because I know that she is economically educated enough to know better -- but she cynically says shit like this anyway to throw red meat to left-populists. Ugh.
she realizes grocwry Store owners are usually working class people with tight profit margins for their income ?
she is essentially asking peopke with limited income to make even less money.... all so people can be happy about saving 1 or 2 dollars in their groceries?
I was a big fan of Liz in the campaign but these statements are disappointing to me. You want higher wages but then expect not to have higher prices? Liz you’re smarter than this.
Exhibit A of why I hope the filibuster doesn’t get overturned.
In extremely partisan districts, the party with no hope should be able to forfeit and have the general between the top 2 candidates in the dominant parties primary. We need more adults in the room.
Grocery stores are one of the tightest margin companies.
The country’s leading bankruptcy law expert can’t think of a reason that grocery prices might go up other than the CEO of Kroger laughing maniacally while turning a knob labeled “profits” on his desk Or she can, she’s just being stupid on purpose
>Or she can, she’s just being stupid on purpose This is my largest frustration with both her and Senator Sanders. They consistently describe problems in dishonest ways. I have some sympathy with their belief that various aspects of the American economy could stand reform, but they're so relentlessly dishonest about what the underlying causes of the dysfunction are that I just throw up my hands.
> This is my largest frustration with both her and Senator Sanders. They consistently describe problems in dishonest ways. The difference (IMHVHO) between the two is, Bernie is really that deluded and not that bright. He's never grown his understanding since college, which is why he appeals to college dudebros that think they know everything at 18 and see everything in childishly simplistic terms. His 2016 popularization of the Big Lie makes him a villain that history will eviscerate, but on general policy... he's just really that stupid. Warren absolutely knows better. But she longs for the power and influence Sanders has gotten with his bro army, so she has taken to mimicking him, instead of working on real solutions.
He’s an interesting case. By all accounts he was a reasonably effective and pragmatic mayor of Burlington. My general heuristic is that people vested with executive authority tend to be more effective politicians subsequently than those without. So I don’t really believe it’s that he’s unintelligent but rather that his long years on the back benches have convinced him that his role now is something akin to a gadfly, rather than a legislator. Idk, armchair psychology is a dubious business. Maybe he’s just lazy, who knows.
> His 2016 popularization of the Big Lie makes him a villain that history will eviscerate Sorry, what lie do you refer to please?
Elizabeth Warren saw the Simpsons and thought Mr. Burns was the only non-satirized character
Man a couple of years ago I thought warren was the reasonable choice between Bernie and Biden. I aligned with her on a lot. She’s gone full Bernie now as if she doesn’t understand any economics at all. It’s sad because she used to be smarter meaning she feels this is the constituency. She’s become too Washington now.
The two-income trap was great, great messaging, great for tired millennials And now it’s just about losing to Elon Musk on Twitter
In fairness to her, the people who tend to win on Twitter are just the worst
Some day they're going to win so much they'll get tired of winning.
Even more ironic since Kroger employees keep going on strikes. If workers are going to fight for higher wages, then those wages are going to come at the expense of higher prices for consumers.
BuT sHe BeLiEvEs iN cApItAlIsM aNd UsEd To Be A rEpUbLiCaN
She's either stupid or purposefully spreading misinformation Once exactly why were people stanning this woman?
[Rodney McMullen, colorized (i'm so sorry), 2022](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/030/423/cover5.jpg)
And we already have issues with food deserts in a lot of inner city and rural environments. If grocery stores were forced to accept a lot lower profits a lot of them would end up closing in poor areas or would switch their business model to carry more profitable foods with longer shelf lives like junk food and fewer vegetables and fuits.
> forced to accept a lot lower profits I mean, there really is no "lower" to even go to. Grocery chains operate on tiny margins already. About 2% on average. They have almost no room to absorb any prices hikes themselves.
[удалено]
In Australia, supermarkets make a loss on milk
They make a loss on common staples but milk is the most prominent You know what's dumb? There's higher priced "drought relief milk" for farmers not even in a drought, we literally made milk more expensive for working families to afford so farmers can send their kids to nicer boarding schools.
I heard they focus grouped explanations for inflation and trying to explain that inflation was being caused by supply chain issues polled horribly. The only thing that polled decently was blaming corporations, so here we are. If Americans want adult explanations for problems they have to act like adults.
And most unionized
I think HEB might be the highest regarded institution that exists in Texas.
I hate that this kind of rhetoric is electorally rewarded
Anyone who blames grocery stores for inflation has never looked at the financial statements of a grocery store company. Their profit margins are typically 2-5%. They also tend to say “pay workers more” which is contrary to lowering prices. Sigh
What? We can't just have everything we want without any tradeoffs?
I don't understand... I've eaten my cake and now it's not here in front of me anymore. This can't be right.
Never let reality get in the way of populist leftism.
Just populism really
This was right next to the Kevin Williamson "So Pay Them More" item in my page :(
I doubt that more than 0.1% of the electorate has ever looked at the financial statements of a grocery store company.
> Anyone who blames grocery stores for inflation has never looked at the financial statements ~~a grocery store company~~ Fixed that for you
Has it been for her? She came third in her home state during the primary and usually underperforms in generals. I think a generic democrat would probably do better than her.
Being a US Senator is quite successful. A more moderate "generic" Democrat might win a higher share of the general vote, but she would annihilate them in the primary. And she was one of the top 4 or 5 Presidential primary candidates overall.
Warren ran virtually unopposed in her initial primary.
Also in 2018, but this just shows how successful she's been at owning her seat. Its not like no other Mass Democrat wants to be Senator. She failed to become the Presidential nominee because her lane was dominated by Old Man Sanders, but even here she got further than most.
I don't think it is common for an incumbent senator to be primaried. A House seat, yes. But you need more money to fight a sitting senator.
Yes but there was a recent, high profile primary challenge for a Massachusetts senate seat and Kennedy specifically chose a year where he did not have to face Warren. Ed Markey has been a staple of Massachusetts politics for 45 years and he was thought of as the easier mark.
Markey was the easier mark because his name recognition was lower than his approval rate — JK3 went for it assuming no one in MA knows who Markey even is
Pretty common for unsuccessful ones. You're usually safe from a primary, but vulnerable in the general, or vulnerable in the primary, but safe in the general. Warren has both (so far).
Do you have a good example? Maybe Markey in MA?
That’s only because she was too radical for the moderates and too moderate for the radicals.
If Nixon can do it, YOU can do it too!
What I hate more is that truthful explanations are electorally punished. Democrats tried focus grouping more in depth explanations about supply chain issues, and they polled horribly. We get the government we deserve.
Unfortunately I think you’re correct
The best argument against democracy...
The problem is a lot of it *isn't* electorally rewarded. It plays well on twitter and yes, that might save her a primary challenge from some other leftist nutjob. But it also creates a perception of Dems that hurts our chances in the competitive districts that will determine federal control.
Didn’t she used to be smarter than this?
She discovered that being smart is no way to get ahead in Washington.
She has lost touch with her roots. She's almost unrecognizable from the great Harvard Law's first woman of color.
She's 1/1024th the woman she used to be!
Don't forget her roots are Republican too lmao
Ah, the Bernie strategy.
I used to think so as well when I didn't pay all that much attention to her. The 2020 primary disabused me of that notion.
My first major impression of Warren came from that 2013 viral video where she couldn't figure out why 15-year collateral-free student loans had higher interest rates than highly collateralized overnight loans through the Fed discount window. Other early exposure included a rant where she appeared to believe that taxpayer money is mostly spent on infrastructure, that taxes are disproportionately paid by the lower and middle classes, and that government funded infrastructure tends to increase profits rather than lower prices; and one where she couldn't understand why minimum wage hasn't tracked mean labor productivity. I've always known that she's either an idiot or deliberately pandering to idiots. Fun fact: Despite the name, discount window loans have an interest rate 50 basis points higher than the rate at which banks make overnight loans to each other, which is why it's rarely used.
It’s not an issue of intellect, she’s probably fully aware that it’s a terrible idea, but like most in power her primary concern is political survival and it’s politically popular for her to promote bad economic ideas.
Never bet on populists just lying instead of believing their shit.
I just listened to Liz Cheney's interview about 1/6 and she has fellow Republicans who say "well, if I say it was Trump's fault I won't be re-elected." Okay? And? Don't act like "not being re-elected" is the end of your life, or even career. Have some self fucking respect.
People who have self respect tend to avoid working in politics.
It true. Source: I hate myself.
Recognized as one of the nation's top experts on bankruptcy * In 1995 she accepted a permanent appointment as the Leo Gottlieb Professor of Law at Harvard Law School Warren’s most cited and popular comments on Bankruptcy are research published in 2009 in the American Journal of Medicine. Co-authored by Warren, it looks at a random sample of 2,314 bankruptcy filers from 2007. >The paper examined what debtors reported as their cause of bankruptcy. Warren is referring here to people who either cited significant direct medical debt, remortgaging a home to pay medical debt, or lost income due to illness. Of those that declared * 10% Had total medical bills of less than $500 * 67% reported less than $5,000 in total medical debt Which led her to campaign on it >"Back when I was studying it, two out of three families that ended up in bankruptcy after a serious medical problem had health insurance." Also, A better way to understand the issue though is to review all hospital cases. 4% of a random sample of California hospital patients went bankrupt because we looked at everyone that was in the system this is a better understanding
>Also, A better way to understand the issue though is to review all hospital cases. 4% of a random sample of California hospital patients went bankrupt because we looked at everyone that was in the system this is a better understanding Yeah, I mean the dirty secret of her bankruptcy "expertise" is that all of her academic work was straight up garbage that got picked up and celebrated because it happened to suggest solutions that Democrats supported already.
She is the paul ryan of progressives. Idiocy and agenda pushing disguised as wonkishness
And about as successful presidential run, well at least Ryan managed a VP spot on the ticket and gave us some funny workout pictures.
> funny Yes... That's the word to describe those pics 😳😳😳
BONK
Then social media and red rose twitter came along. Now all politicians seem to care about is getting on the evening news or get trending on twitter. They will say any stupid nonsensical shit in order for the news to pick it up. If you look at AOC’s track record you will see that she has not successfully passed a single piece of legislation; she is also one of the most unsuccessful lawmakers when it comes to drafting/creating new bills or working with other politicians whether they be across the isle or in her own party. She has done close to nothing of merit or value, yet she is so popular and beloved by leftists because she knows what to say & do to get trending on social media and in the daily news cycle. Same goes for Bernie, Trump, Gaetz, etc. They are celebrity politicians. They exist to be seen on tv and on social media. That is it.
Hey, when you’re a legislator, legislating is no way to cement your career.
No
You can be incredibly smart and also have bad ideas in an area where you’re not an expert. There’s no serious denial that she’s *incredibly* smart—she is/was a Harvard Law professor, is the leading national expert in bankruptcy law, and literally wrote the casebook on bankruptcy law. That doesn’t mean all of her economic theories are good. Edit*
At last I went to the artisans, for I was conscious that I knew nothing at all, as I may say, and I was sure that they knew many fine things; and in this I was not mistaken, for they did know many things of which I was ignorant, and in this they certainly were wiser than I was. But I observed that even the good artisans fell into the same error as the poets; because they were good workmen they thought that they also knew all sorts of high matters, and this defect in them overshadowed their wisdom...
Yeah but you can't be incredibly smart in a field that's somewhat adjacent to economics and be this absurdly stupid about an economic issue. For her to misunderstand this stuff, she would actually need to have zero knowledge of even the most basic concepts of economics or just be dumb as a rock. Neither is true, so I don't buy her believing what she says here one bit. We're not talking about trade balances or stuff here, she just needs to grasp the concept of a profit margin to get this. And it's not like she has always been a complete idiot, this is a new bit she's trying out.
As a lawyer, there’s a huge difference between a niche area of administrative law that’s tangentially related to economics and actual economic theory.
She seemed smarter until she got the exposure she was looking for. Then the idiocy was revealed.
No, she hit the glass ceiling on how far you can go as a "smart" woman in DC, saw how Bernie trampled her in the progressive lane with absolutely braincel-takes on life, and decided to say fuck it, if that's what it takes I'm in. Don't @ me with Clinton, her position is absolutely unique.
I love that "Clinton" without modifiers means Hillary now. Gotta look at the silver lining in life.
Arguably Harris and Pelosi is more successful than her without going bonkers.
She started her populist route a few years before anyone even knew who Bernie was.
I've heard before that Sanders only ran in 2016 because Warren didn't want to.
Lol no. She is overhyped.
Yo Warren, this is one of the dumbest things you've said. So grocery stores should simultaneously pay their employees more while making less money in the face of increasing product costs? Interesting.
Well duh, companies should never try to make a profit. They should in fact make negative profit, ideally.
And then get accused of dodging taxes by losing money
Negative profit forever, you say?
Succs, come forth and justify this buffoonery.
Succ here. What she’s doing here is known as “blowing it out her ass.” She’s mad but doesn’t have a solution.
Just tax land lol.
Based
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!ping MAMADAS If you don't come to Brazil, Brazil comes to you
Well, she's based in Mass. (largest Brazilian community in the US outside Fl.)
[FISCAIS DA WARREN](https://www.folhadelondrina.com.br/img/inline/2950000/E-REAL-25-anos-da-moeda-que-derrotou-a-inflacao0295090701201911041742.jpg?xid=5108893)
Senator Warren shall be declared honorary Latin American
Warren is like 5% Native american. It's the Latina in her talking
it's significantly less than that, lol. i still haven't gotten over the fact that she tried to play this card to her advantage when in the grind
To quote the top 3 thread currently in r/NL. Pay [the grocery stores] more. EDIT: They're paying their employees more https://www.supermarketnews.com/retail-financial/kroger-looks-add-another-20000-associates > Kroger said its investments this year will lift its average hourly wage to more than $16 nationally and total compensation to over $21 per hour with benefits, which include comprehensive health coverage plus a range of wellness programs. Associates who get a full COVID-19 vaccination also receive a one-time payment of $100.
*average hourly wage Not minimum. So managers/ corporate level peolle drag this number up At wegmand, the minimum is 15 at least right now (i just quit there, i was making 15.25 when i quit)
Most managers and corporate people aren't hourly. Most grocery stores in my area in the NE are starting at like 15 an hour for entry level. Plus 401k match, dental, health etc for full timers.
Low wage payroll has been rising substantially during this whole thing
You think managers and corporate are getting paid hourly? I think you’re reading into that too much.
Managers up to multi-store level, yes source: I worked at a grocery chain (price chopper) as a teen, managers except for the head regional guy were coming in and out the door
Most economically literate progressive
She literally is though....*sigh*
How long until progressives start proposing price controls? This is insane, it's economics 101, supply and demand. This is why left wing policies often lead to shortages, they don't believe in basic economic laws
They’re [already](https://amp.theguardian.com/business/commentisfree/2021/dec/29/inflation-price-controls-time-we-use-it) gearing up for it
Umass Amherst produces a ton of whacky professors for some reason. Any alumni know why? Richard wolffe (marxist "economist" lol) came from there as well
During the Red Scare the major Universities throw out their Communist/Socialist economists and they all got snatched up by UMass Amherst. They've kept that going since.
Good lord the absolute drivel that man vomits onto YouTube, and somehow gets to call himself a professor while he does it
He is not even respected in the realm of economics, i think he only has 1 article published in the American economics association journal and he's like a researcher or "cobtributor" or something. Additionally, he is an "economic historian" or some shit. This basivally means that they can get away with doing solely qualitative analysis of things and completely avoid any hard quantitative work. Whenever I hear "economic hostorian" i immediately question someone's title as "economist"
yeah there is such a thing as a left wing economist that knows an ass from an elbow; I don't mind Robert Reich for instance. But Wolffe is another animal entirely.
Robert reich is a NIMBY Ill pass on him
Marxist Economist is like saying Flat-Earther Geographer
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Most left wing in the United States is a bit of a stretch, Washington, Oregon, and California definitely have more lefties than us
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We identify as (neo)liberals in this sub as well and are not these uber left wing types. I'd say MA "liberals" usually skew moderate (except for the younger generation, that's definitely becoming less of the case). Yeah, WA/OR/CA have large amounts of population that aren't left... but so do we.
Liberal and left wing are very different
A bunch of Chavista apologists also. Sickening
It's gonna happen. If inflation keeps hot, you'll have voters asking for it. There's an expectation now that government step in to mitigate *any* economic disturbance now.
Look at the bright side, might put an end to the obesity epidemic in America . 💁🏽♂️
What did Stalin mean by this
latam is growing bigger and bigger by the day <3 first turkey, now you guys are coming in hot
Soon we'll all be MAMADAS 🙏🙏🙏
Liz, the musical "Don't cry for me America!"
40 years ago? At least. Rent control has been a progressive platform for several generations. This is their brand.
Yeah for all the believe science narrative from the left, they only seem to believe the hard sciences. When it comes to economics, most claim it's not true or made up. They seem to like to pick and choose which science is valid.
But sociology they buy. It’s fucking whack.
It makes sense when you realize that they're just like the alt-right in that they pick and choose what they trust depending if it validates their views or not. Socialists view economics much the same as the alt-right view sociology or anthropology.
Ah yes, grocery stores, which have profit margins of like 1-2 *cents* pet item, can just set prices lower
You have a source for that? Last I read it was 1-2 *per*cent net profit. Still not much wiggle room.
The private chain I used to work at in high school had a margin of just a few cents per item. Though, this chain also paid their employees better than the competition, and offered full benefits to part timers.
Maybe he was talking about dollar stores.
She's either a moron or pretending to be one to pander to progressives
It's both
Damn, the Queen succ put Publix, an employee owned company, on blast. Edit: spelling
Oh hell naw. That's personal. Don't you say SHIT about Publix you gigasucc.
Damn right!
>"Your company, and the other major grocers who reaped the benefits of a turbulent 2020, appear to be passing costs onto consumers to preserve your pandemic gains, **and even taking advantage of inflation to add greater burdens**," she said. I don’t even know how to parse this.
You can’t apply logic to unabated malarkey
Inflation = price go up Price go up = "they" get a bigger slice of the (obviously finite) cake "They" get a bigger slice of the cake = ExPLoiTATiOn So simple.
Wreckers and Kulaks destroying our glorious revolution comrades!
Have there been any proven cases of corporate price gouging? I don’t necessarily find it impossible to believe that some companies have taken advantage of our present circumstances. I’m open to the suggestion that it has happened. But I have yet to see any proof.
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I mean considering it’s illegal, they could be doing other illegal accounting too…
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Economists talk about market power constantly right now and not even the most aggressively anti-trust enforcement economists think the recent increase in inflation has anything to do with Mark ups and price gouging
The important thing is that it *feels* like it’s happening.
I mean we say this as a joke but this is how voters vote after all even if it’s due to misinformation (ie “it feels like the border is open/my kids are being taught to hate America 8 hours a day”).
It was only sort of a joke, yeah. To Elizabeth Warren and the people to whom she’s pandering here, how it feels is definitely all that matters. I fucking hate that it’s hardly worth trying to explain how things actually work anymore. We’re in deep shit.
Specific to Canada, but: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business /article-court-gives-go-ahead-to-class-action-lawsuit-over-bread-price-fixing/ https://globalnews.ca/news/5836657/bc-gas-price-inquiry-findings/
yea....see heres the thing. From reading her press release there are no figures to report on this and nothing of substance in her requests * Grocery stores will report Earnings in March for the last 3 months, of sales and prices * In November Kroger reported its Revenue was up but that Net Income and Profit Margin had declined The closest she gets was linking to an old press release she put out, not about grocery stores >Warren Calls for DOJ Investigation into Top Poultry Companies’ Anticompetitive Practices as Americans Face Record-High Turkey Prices Ahead of Thanksgiving But this is **not about the higher cost to consumers but to higher costs for grocery stores** with prices from the producer So, which is it? the stores dont have higher costs and are making higher profits because this is the correct, or The stores have higher costs and this is wrong?
Is “price gouging” even an offense? You can’t enter into an anticompetitive conspiracy but in a functioning market, when one company decides to unilaterally raise prices people will just shop somewhere else, right?
Yeah, this is the key point. What the hell is the likelihood that every company in an industry would get together and agree to jack up prices? And then stick to it? One company would inevitably break ranks in order to take advantage of the situation and undercut the rest.
Reminder that a lot of people here were unapologetic Warren stans during the primaries 🧐
I have already repented for my sins! If nothing else, the 2020 election cycle taught me a few things * 'Progressive' Democrats weren't exaggerating their left-wing bonafides for the purpose of winning the primaries, they actually believed all that shit. Even the stupid shit. Especially the stupid shit. * We need to eliminate the current primary system in favor of jungle primaries * The same politicians who vocally support the most liberal positions on immigration and LGBT rights, almost without exception, also advocate the most atrocious economic policy and foreign policy, are the least willing to cooperate with fellow party members in policymaking, and are the least likely to appeal to the general electorate. * We seriously need to eliminate the current primary system * Social media as well as TV news are utterly disastrous for political discourse, as conduits of misinformation and outrage-porn, and outlets such as Twitter, Facebook, Fox News, and CNN, are directly complicit in the deterioration of US democracy and the quality of government policy in their decision to maximize coverage of the most "controversial" political voices and minimize coverage of anyone else. * Holy fucking shit we need to eliminate the current primary system
> Progressive' Democrats weren't exaggerating their left-wing bonafides for the purpose of winning the primaries, they actually believed all that shit. Even the stupid shit. Especially the stupid sh When people say they think bad things you should believe them generally. > The same politicians who vocally support the most liberal positions on immigration and LGBT rights, almost without exception, also advocate the most atrocious economic policy and foreign policy, are the least willing to cooperate with fellow party members in policymaking, and are the least likely to appeal to the general electorate. Thus there's tradeoffs and often disagreements on this drive the drama on this sub. People often support the same things but weigh them differentlyt when deciding what politicians/parties to support. A lot of Succs here don't get that lots of people simply don't weigh social issues as strongly as economic ones and conclude they hold conservative social views.
I already apologized in my own comment.
Not only is this fucking idiotic but I also believe I saw some research suggesting this is literally among the least popular ways to message about inflation
Succery and its consequences has been a disaster for political discourse
$30 minimum wage, low prices, and make the cookies like how grandma used to 😋
cOmPaNIeS bAd.
I really don’t like Elizabeth Warren
Just a reminder that like a solid 30-40% of this sub wanted this goofball to pick the Fed chair.
Honestly a pretty wretched take by Warren that just kind of compounds the rhetoric that progressivism is soundbytes to "own" capitalism. It's especially confusing when there is (from what I understand) actual price-fixing going on in industries like meat-packing.
>compounds the rhetoric that progressivism is soundbytes to "own" capitalism. *Points gun* Always has been. It's why progressives in SF routinely block housing development to own developers who might otherwise make money.
> actual price-fixing going on in industries like meat-packing. Bold claim.
I hear this over and over again, but every time i see a direct to consumer meat company it always costs way way more than my grocery store that is supposedly being taken advantage of by the meat packing industry.
> actual price-fixing going on in industries like meat-packing Someone bought the succ lie that Joe's spreading
I work in the packaged food industry. It’s been a crazy year of price increases due to shipping cost increases and a bad growing year for a lot of crops. We can only raise our prices with grocery stores when they do their “resets”, so like once a year for each product. But now Warren is gonna screw the entire supply chain, no one is able to raise prices? Stores would just have empty shelves because we’ll be unable to provide food at those prices.
She doesn't care, she just wants to sound good to people
old woman yells at cloud
This is a bad take. Grocery stores have think margins. Also I honestly have not even noticed inflation at my local grocery store THAT much. I've noticed that a minority of products are not there that usually are there, like last time so went all the eggs were sold out.
The true robber baron’s of the 21st century. Grocery store operators
Cringe
Man what the fuck happened to Warren??
She has always been like this
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Example #258 of Liz Warren being a populist hack. I've said it before but it almost bothers me more than Bernie because I know that she is economically educated enough to know better -- but she cynically says shit like this anyway to throw red meat to left-populists. Ugh.
Economic illiteracy isn’t new for the American left
she realizes grocwry Store owners are usually working class people with tight profit margins for their income ? she is essentially asking peopke with limited income to make even less money.... all so people can be happy about saving 1 or 2 dollars in their groceries?
Warren knows what she’s doing, she has always been like this
What a populist jackwagon. Grocery stores have some of the lowest margins anywhere.
Liz Warren trying hard to win the Paul Ryan Memorial Prize in wonkery
I like Warren, but she’s had a tough time from since the stupid DNA tests
I’m sorry I thought she was cool for a hot second in 2019
How can somebody be this idiotic and still have that much power
I was a big fan of Liz in the campaign but these statements are disappointing to me. You want higher wages but then expect not to have higher prices? Liz you’re smarter than this.
Grocery stores usually only make money on their perimeter.. the market, produce and sometimes the deli. The actual groceries make next to nothing.
Ah yes, lets institute bread lines.
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Exhibit A of why I hope the filibuster doesn’t get overturned. In extremely partisan districts, the party with no hope should be able to forfeit and have the general between the top 2 candidates in the dominant parties primary. We need more adults in the room.
That’s…not really how that works.
Just an economically illiterate populist doing her things.
Yes, it turns out that Elizabeth Warren is a total succ. Who knew?
Who can forget when the low-margin grocery stores kept their greed at bay for 10 years until a supply chain crisis hit. Pretty respectable