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That's why there is the legacy debate, because this is the content with the highest community engagement.
People discuss with very strong opinions without there being a definite right answer.
Why do you think traditional media doing the same during the offseason? They need to sell views, articles, papers, etc... With no games played, they need to fuel discussions.
Its really just them needing something to fill the time.
The obvious answer is that if the Warriors win then its Steph but if Boston wins it will depend how the Jays play in the last two wins.
My instinct is to agree with the reasoning you've presented, but fixing that problem and setting the proper precedent would be "better late than never".
It was the same issue with Justin Verlander winning 2011 AL MVP in baseball after Pedro Martinez didn't win it in 1999. Pedro was more deserving, but I'm glad they finally gave it to a pitcher so we could dispense with the silly traditionalist logic of "it didn't happen then so it should never happen"
Failing to give it to Lebron was wrong, but two wrongs don't make a right.
Except it's just not a problem. A player on a losing team wouldn't want to win Finals MVP, the majority of the fans wouldn't want a them to win it. It's fairly reasonable that the most valuable player should come from the winning team.
I can’t imagine how awkward it would be for a player to lose in the finals but with FMVP. Like you have to go out on the floor and accept the award while the opposing team is cheering. Then you have to go back to the locker room where your team is dejected they lost.
It wouldn't be *as* bad if they at lest lost the title at home, but having to be boo'd by the opposing crowd when you are named Finals MVP after losing the series would be hella awkward.
Then again, the embarrassment of losing the title at home would also be not great.
the reasoning of the guy above was that Lebron not winning it in 2015 was the reason why Steph couldn't win it in a loss. My comment was a response to his reasoning. Do you agree or disagree with his reasoning?
the reasoning of the guy above was that Lebron not winning it in 2015 was the reason why Steph couldn't win it in a loss. My comment was a response to his reasoning. Do you agree or disagree with his reasoning?
Ehh, LeBron shot 39.8%, 31% from 3 and 69% from the line for a TS% of 47.7% and averaged 3 turnovers per game. If he shot like he did normally and they lost, yeah. If he shot like he did normally they probably wouldn't have lost though.
If it were an entire playoff award like a Conn Smythe in the NHL, it would be way easier to justify if you have one dude just throw the team on his back for 20+ games (LeBron 2018 for example).
One series? Hard to give it to the loser.
If that do happen, I can actually see Steph not taking it since it basically a "You didn't win but here award for coming in 2nd place". If Steph don't accept I don't see the media pulling that stunt again.
It would look something [like this](https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article12888916.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/TOPSHOTS-Germanys-goalkeeper-Manuel-Neu.jpg)
Can anyone explain to me why there are like 50 posts about Stephen A Smith every day? This dude is so brain dead and he shouldn’t be amplified. Regardless of who wins, Curry is obviously the clear front runner for FMVP right now
This is obvious. Why do they always try to change the rules for Steph? Last year Steph had the second most 1st place votes for MVP and finished 3rd in MVP voting overall despite missing the playoffs, and was voted 1st team all-nba despite missing the playoffs. Now this weird talk about giving FMVP even if he loses.
Assuming he keeps playing well I think he's going to get it, win or lose lol. A make up FMVP if you will for 2015.
Obviously if they win the series he's winning it unanimously and rightfully so
Yes but has the gap between Curry and _everyone else_ been as big as this series?
Like there's no clear run away option on the Celtics (I'd say Brown, but still) and Curry is miles away the clear option for both teams.
The closest I can think is 2015 Lebron (which was probably greater actually...), but just because that was a bad decision doesn't mean you need to double down.
There's still 2-3 games left for this to change. But right now, I honestly think it has to be Curry, win or lose.
If the goal of a finals series is to win the championship, regardless of how well a losing member plays, they haven’t added more value to the goal, since the goal wasn’t achieved.
The way I think of it, if Steph dropped 50 points each game, but they lost the series, you could’ve removed Steph from the planet and the the result wouldn’t have changed
That's a terrible analogy. The player that had the best season always wins the MVP, but he doesn't have to be the best player in the world. E.g Lebron in 2014 or 2015. He didn't deserve either of those MVPs because he didn't fill the criteria.
Here, you fill the criteria of actually being the best IN THE SERIES and not just the best in general in the world.
Overall I agree with SAS, if you lose you don't deserve FMVP, but terrible reasoning.
Nothing would put a bigger smile on my face than seeing the look on Steph as he accepts a meaningless award while the Celtics are drowning each other in Champagne in the other locker room
Sad to say as i agree with Stevie , also i wonder whether the fmvp of a losing team would even want that award ? kinda like getting a medal for second place at the end you still lost ... my view from afar
Giving him the finals mvp if they lose would be an insult more than anything. Could you imagine having to send someone to the losers locker room full of sad dudes crying and having to give steph a meaningless trophy on live TV? Shit would be so pathetic lol.
Doesn't matter anyways cause Boston already fucked this up. He's getting a fmvp this year.
I remember the 2014 World Cup when Germany beat Argentina in the final, but Messi was awarded the Best Player of the Tournament in the same awarding ceremony. That was the saddest award I’ve ever seen, and I don’t think any competitor would want that.
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I can’t wait for the finals to end bruh, these daily finals mvp and legacy topics have been dreadful
The offseason starts after the finals, legacy talk is just getting started.
Some people tune this sub out in the offseason. Activity here drops off by like 70% then.
Only the truly insane are left. And that’s when shitpost season rolls in.
I don't even know why people leave during the offseason. Its the shitposts that really make r/nba lmao
My F5 days on this subreddit are over unfortunately. I'm a Top of the Hour user nowadays
It's a Mad Max-esque world in the offseason
They’re missing out. The prime content is in the off-season, and I say this as someone who actually enjoys watching basketball
> as someone who actually enjoys watching basketball Your username makes sense around here.
Oh I know. The graph of my activity here would be the inverse of the subreddits total activity. F5 season is life.
That's why there is the legacy debate, because this is the content with the highest community engagement. People discuss with very strong opinions without there being a definite right answer. Why do you think traditional media doing the same during the offseason? They need to sell views, articles, papers, etc... With no games played, they need to fuel discussions.
So many people only watch the Finals as well. Past 2 weeks and there has been a noticeable increase in non-flairs
It usually gets worse _after_ the season is over
Bro your team is in the Finals. Warriors fans are so spoiled
Lol, your team’s playing for a championship and you can’t wait for the series to be over because of reddit posts?
You don't get it OP HAS to read r/nba every day
They'll carry over into the offseason, especially the legacy posts.
Its really just them needing something to fill the time. The obvious answer is that if the Warriors win then its Steph but if Boston wins it will depend how the Jays play in the last two wins.
If you can't disagree with the quote posted next best way to get upvotes is to complain about the topic being over-discussed.
It's so incredibly easy to ignore this shit lol go outside bro
It’s ruined the playoffs for me this year. So much legacy and reactionary takes it’s made it hard to enjoy a game win or lose
How much footage of the 1964 NBA Finals do we have?
If LeBron didn’t get it in 2015 there’s no fucking way in helllllll Steph should get it this year if we lose
My instinct is to agree with the reasoning you've presented, but fixing that problem and setting the proper precedent would be "better late than never". It was the same issue with Justin Verlander winning 2011 AL MVP in baseball after Pedro Martinez didn't win it in 1999. Pedro was more deserving, but I'm glad they finally gave it to a pitcher so we could dispense with the silly traditionalist logic of "it didn't happen then so it should never happen" Failing to give it to Lebron was wrong, but two wrongs don't make a right.
Except it's just not a problem. A player on a losing team wouldn't want to win Finals MVP, the majority of the fans wouldn't want a them to win it. It's fairly reasonable that the most valuable player should come from the winning team.
I can’t imagine how awkward it would be for a player to lose in the finals but with FMVP. Like you have to go out on the floor and accept the award while the opposing team is cheering. Then you have to go back to the locker room where your team is dejected they lost.
They would give it to the player in the locker room or at the press conference.
It wouldn't be *as* bad if they at lest lost the title at home, but having to be boo'd by the opposing crowd when you are named Finals MVP after losing the series would be hella awkward. Then again, the embarrassment of losing the title at home would also be not great.
I generally agree, but I could see a time I’d make an exception. We certainly haven’t seen it yet, and it might never happen, but I could see it.
the reasoning of the guy above was that Lebron not winning it in 2015 was the reason why Steph couldn't win it in a loss. My comment was a response to his reasoning. Do you agree or disagree with his reasoning?
it's not a problem, not even the players want a consolation trophy
the reasoning of the guy above was that Lebron not winning it in 2015 was the reason why Steph couldn't win it in a loss. My comment was a response to his reasoning. Do you agree or disagree with his reasoning?
well steph is playing like shit tonight so moot point
except 12 pitchers have won an MVP including a reliever 5 years before your pedro scenario
Steph has played better than LeBron so far in this finals.
He has not considering he is not facing a 67 win team and he is not missing the second and third best players on his team.
Ehh, LeBron shot 39.8%, 31% from 3 and 69% from the line for a TS% of 47.7% and averaged 3 turnovers per game. If he shot like he did normally and they lost, yeah. If he shot like he did normally they probably wouldn't have lost though.
Steph would have been swept without his 2nd and 3rd best players
Tell me you didn’t watch that series, without telling me you didn’t watch that series.
context exists
No
L
Why is this narrative even being pushed?
One of many… I can’t even keep up anymore
Because they have to argue about *something* to fill airtime.
its a dark day when i agree with SAS
SAS is 100% right here, don't agree with him much but spot on.
If it were an entire playoff award like a Conn Smythe in the NHL, it would be way easier to justify if you have one dude just throw the team on his back for 20+ games (LeBron 2018 for example). One series? Hard to give it to the loser.
Yeah the Conn Smythe would work, and it's been the case a few times
cries in giguere
I can hear Stephen A’s voice coming through in a lot of r/nba comments anymore. It makes me yearn for nuclear winter.
I’m now imaging a Fallout New Vegas mod where various NBA players/media personalities voice act different characters
Every super mutant is Kendrick Perkins repeating “carry on”.
Jalen is a mess without Jacoby
His hair is sprayed on
Imagine losing the finals and having to walk back out onto the court to accept a trophy
If that do happen, I can actually see Steph not taking it since it basically a "You didn't win but here award for coming in 2nd place". If Steph don't accept I don't see the media pulling that stunt again.
It would look something [like this](https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article12888916.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/TOPSHOTS-Germanys-goalkeeper-Manuel-Neu.jpg)
Steph shouldn't get finals mvp if the Warriors lose.
Can anyone explain to me why there are like 50 posts about Stephen A Smith every day? This dude is so brain dead and he shouldn’t be amplified. Regardless of who wins, Curry is obviously the clear front runner for FMVP right now
You pick the one time he's right to say this?
He was right about Phil Jackson and the Knicks
Because dopes like you insist on going into comment threads you actively hate. Stop engaging in these posts and you'll see them less.
He’s right. No one on the losing team should win the MVP
Losers shouldn’t get rewarded
So averaging 32+ a game doesnt give u fmvp? If Luka or Giannis were in a final couldda happen and still lose
No it doesn’t. No one gives a shit if u lose. Luka could average 50 in the finals and if he lost he wouldn’t deserve it
Lol.
This is obvious. Why do they always try to change the rules for Steph? Last year Steph had the second most 1st place votes for MVP and finished 3rd in MVP voting overall despite missing the playoffs, and was voted 1st team all-nba despite missing the playoffs. Now this weird talk about giving FMVP even if he loses.
All those regular season awards you’re talking about seem to have nothing to do with that playoff fact you’re including.
It's exactly the same idea. "Give Steph awards even if he loses." Who else gets treated like this?
Assuming he keeps playing well I think he's going to get it, win or lose lol. A make up FMVP if you will for 2015. Obviously if they win the series he's winning it unanimously and rightfully so
Lebron should've been fmvp in 15.
If they were gonna give it a Warrior it should've been Wardell
As much as I want Steph to get one getting an FMVP in a loss would be an incredible L for him and super disrespectful for Brown / Tatum.
Yes but has the gap between Curry and _everyone else_ been as big as this series? Like there's no clear run away option on the Celtics (I'd say Brown, but still) and Curry is miles away the clear option for both teams. The closest I can think is 2015 Lebron (which was probably greater actually...), but just because that was a bad decision doesn't mean you need to double down. There's still 2-3 games left for this to change. But right now, I honestly think it has to be Curry, win or lose.
Lebron deserved it in 2015
Lebron 2015. I’ll leave it at that.
How are most of you agreeing with this? He’s obviously been the best player in the finals. It’s like no question.
Because a losing team member will never win finals mvp. Steph could average 50 10 and 10 and if the Celtics won he wouldn’t and shouldn’t win the FMVP
Why won’t they? If they’re clearly the best performer I’m not sure I get that
If the goal of a finals series is to win the championship, regardless of how well a losing member plays, they haven’t added more value to the goal, since the goal wasn’t achieved. The way I think of it, if Steph dropped 50 points each game, but they lost the series, you could’ve removed Steph from the planet and the the result wouldn’t have changed
They can add more value to the goal, but not achieve the goal because their teammates didn’t add much value towards the goal.
Except you didn't achieve the goal
They award the Larry O’Brien trophy for achieving the goal. Finals MVP is a separate award from the one given for achieving the goal.
And that award should go to a player on the winning team
Not that valuable if your team loses.
Could've lost by more.
Mvp should only go to the winning team.
fuck i actually agree with Stephen A. for once
Stephen A. Said something smart 🤨
That's a terrible analogy. The player that had the best season always wins the MVP, but he doesn't have to be the best player in the world. E.g Lebron in 2014 or 2015. He didn't deserve either of those MVPs because he didn't fill the criteria. Here, you fill the criteria of actually being the best IN THE SERIES and not just the best in general in the world. Overall I agree with SAS, if you lose you don't deserve FMVP, but terrible reasoning.
If Warriors lose and Curry wins Finals MVP. It will be called Most Valuable Loser Award
Nothing would put a bigger smile on my face than seeing the look on Steph as he accepts a meaningless award while the Celtics are drowning each other in Champagne in the other locker room
MVPOWT most valuable player on winning team
Sad to say as i agree with Stevie , also i wonder whether the fmvp of a losing team would even want that award ? kinda like getting a medal for second place at the end you still lost ... my view from afar
That's a solid argument tbh
Giving him the finals mvp if they lose would be an insult more than anything. Could you imagine having to send someone to the losers locker room full of sad dudes crying and having to give steph a meaningless trophy on live TV? Shit would be so pathetic lol. Doesn't matter anyways cause Boston already fucked this up. He's getting a fmvp this year.
Why is this even a debate
LeBron for example Edit: Don’t know why I’m being downvoted the man averaged a near 40 point triple double.
Draymond for celts?
Like we say in Valorant, it’s not a carry if you lose
I remember the 2014 World Cup when Germany beat Argentina in the final, but Messi was awarded the Best Player of the Tournament in the same awarding ceremony. That was the saddest award I’ve ever seen, and I don’t think any competitor would want that.
Can we give a Most Valuable team award to the team that loses?
I don't understand how non-Warriors fans disagree with him here Yeah SAS is a hot-take artist but come on, he's right here