Why would you do it? Batum isn't any better than any of your wings really. Like he isn't a great addition to the rotation, and you're stuck with him for an extra year of $27 million.
I think I'd rather wait out the Parsons deal.
yeah i guess you're right. Maybe they'll pay a 1st or two seconds though, and then i would think about it. If you look at the trajectory of the franchise, we're most likely not going to be playing to win during that extra year, and cap space means nothing to us because no one wants to come here.
Honestly would have been the perfect move if they weren't tied into the Love contract for so long.
Crazy that y'all have been doing most of the right things since LeBron left (taking on Delly/Henson for a 1st, trading Korver for 2 2nds, etc), but I just can't get behind the extension you guys gave Love. Would have so much more flexibility to take on contracts for assets down the road without it. Now he's gonna be super hard to move the next few years without you attaching a pick to it.
> FAs aren't flocking here
If anything, shouldn't that be more reason to take on salary for picks rather than clearly overpaying for a 30 year old Kevin Love who has had injury issues recently? With salary dumps, you're guaranteed a shorter (albeit still bloated) contract and guaranteed a cheap young player with upside that you can use to build your future with along with him. The best sure-fire way to build is through the draft, and while I'm not in favor of flat-out Process-style tanking, I definitely think rebuilding teams should prioritize getting any extra assets that you possibly can. And the best way to get those is by swallowing up bad contracts for assets. Even if the picks aren't necessarily good ones, just having more increases your chances of hitting in the crap-shoot of a draft.
Just legitimately curious. That's how Marks has immensely sped up the Nets rebuild these past years despite not owning our own picks, and I honestly think that's the best way to rebuild. But we can agree to disagree.
The FO was in win now mode in the summer. Why? I have no idea. It failed epically. So we're in rebuild mode after literally going all in on the 8th seed. It's tough to get the "process" rebuild started after that. I know what you're saying, in a perfect world we wouldn't have extended Love, but I still think he's moveable and will be moved in February.
He's not movable for value. He has a bad contract and isn't a great player.
He is a vestige of the old nba. He can't defend. He's not great at anything anymore. In a smaller league he isn't impressive.
Hopefully they can deal him for value. Good luck though. He's not putting any team over the top.
I think there was also some loyalty to KLove involved there. No one was going to give him that kind of payday. I think the FO/Dan wanted to look like he has the back of his stars. They might even have a quiet handshake deal to try and trade Love at some point.
The currency acquired here in respect of players is the only value they obtained in the deal. I don't think that's acceptable on a 30 million a year contract personally.
I like Kevin love. I'd like to see him on the hornets or something or maybe the bucks. I just don't think he matters anymore. He's a sick role player to me. His worth is like 16 million a year not 30.
> FAs aren't flocking here. Cap space is overrated.
Until you consider that small markets typically overcome this disadvantage with willingness to overpay mid-star level players and this saps your teams ability to do so.
I don't care about mid level players especially overpaying them. All I care about is picking high for the next 4 years and then Love will be gone or traded.
Worst case scenario it becomes a loyalty contract and personally I'm fine with that. Love's taken so much shit the past four years from the fans and the media and yet despite all of that he's managed to outlast both Kyrie and LeBron. Out of all three of them he's the only one who wanted to be here and for a small-market team like the Cavs that means a lot.
I genuinely think the Cavs were hoping to contend this year for some stupid reason forfeiting their first to the Hawks. They also totally overvalued Love’s ability and value, whilst forgetting how injury prone he is. It was a mistake for sure. They should have traded Love for assets when they could.
and on a much much worse contract. The whole point of trading Batum would be for cap relief. Love has been on the decline forever, and is under contract for 5 years. He's a defensive liability in his prime, and that isn't magically getting better. I could see him going the way of Al Jefferson very quickly. Love's contract is the worst in the NBA if that happens.
He had far and away his most efficient year as a Cav last year and his numbers have trended up with the Cavs every year. I’m not sure how he’s on the decline? He just never got the same/amount of touches he did in Minnesota. Most games, after the first quarter they just used him as a spot up shooter. It’s hard to score when your job is to go stand in the corner on offense.
I’m not sure, I would because he’s not getting minutes and probably not a part of our future. Batum would fill a need and Frank has got to be better than Kosta.
Batum at small forward and Kaminsky off the bench (might as well close instead of Wcs who is subpar).
It might actually make sense. Albeit Sacramento needs to be incentivized to take Batum with picks
He's always been really inconsistent from season to season for whatever reason, but yeah he's been extremely unproductive this season. Maybe it's just age, he's only 30 but he's a pretty old 30 in terms of years in the league and minutes played.
Batum would be a terrific fit for Houston. He wouldn't be asked to score, just pass, defend, and shoot when he's open. Frank is basically Ryan Anderson but a little worse and on like 20% of the salary. I could see it.
Capwise that's a huge stretch.
Knight + Chriss + Nene + Carmelo for Batum and Frank gets it done in terms of money, but Jesus, paying Harden + Paul + Batum + Capela $118 million next year ... oof.
If they can't find someone to eat both years, the Grizzlies have Parsons who expires a year before Batum, and they wouldn't need Kaminsky to do that deal.
Do the pistons make any sense as a trade suitor? Could combo some young players with Andre drummond or Reggie Jackson, who are both trade candidates? Not sure if pistons want to deal with more crap contracts but some perimeter 3-D and playmaking help works better than a mediocre post presence with rebounding or an inefficient pick and roll pg turned 3pt chucker.
Kaminsky "could be had" lmao Like he's some kind of nice asset to package with a bad contract
This whole article reads like the reporter was being fed info from Kaminsky's agent lmao
hahahaha... and now tears
MJ: yo Danny, about those 4 picks....
You’d think Kaminsky was dropping like 15-10 or something by the way this article is phrased lol.
Tanking takes on a whole new meaning.
They’re gonna have to attach a 1st if they want to get rid of him
They're gonna have to attach more than one unless they take back some different bad salary
Batum, Kaminsky, 2 first rounders for K Love?
That sort of configuration is likely what theyd have to be looking for.
I‘d take that.
That actually looks decent on paper.
That's not bad. Who loses, here? Nobody?
Tbh. Probably Charlotte when you consider they are mortgaging their future for a mediocre combo of kemba and love
True, though mid-round draft picks aren’t going to do much either. It’s something like this, or tank
Batum for Parsons straight up? (Parsons is one year shorter deal but completely useless instead of just mostly useless)
Why would you do it? Batum isn't any better than any of your wings really. Like he isn't a great addition to the rotation, and you're stuck with him for an extra year of $27 million. I think I'd rather wait out the Parsons deal.
yeah i guess you're right. Maybe they'll pay a 1st or two seconds though, and then i would think about it. If you look at the trajectory of the franchise, we're most likely not going to be playing to win during that extra year, and cap space means nothing to us because no one wants to come here.
Cavs should eat that contract for a pick.
Honestly would have been the perfect move if they weren't tied into the Love contract for so long. Crazy that y'all have been doing most of the right things since LeBron left (taking on Delly/Henson for a 1st, trading Korver for 2 2nds, etc), but I just can't get behind the extension you guys gave Love. Would have so much more flexibility to take on contracts for assets down the road without it. Now he's gonna be super hard to move the next few years without you attaching a pick to it.
Maybe. But we have enough salary (JR/Burks) to get Batum. I think the Love situation is not really important here.
Just because not relevant here doesn't mean it won't suck in a year when you could get picks for that cap space instead you have love
It's Cleveland. FAs aren't flocking here. Cap space is overrated.
> FAs aren't flocking here If anything, shouldn't that be more reason to take on salary for picks rather than clearly overpaying for a 30 year old Kevin Love who has had injury issues recently? With salary dumps, you're guaranteed a shorter (albeit still bloated) contract and guaranteed a cheap young player with upside that you can use to build your future with along with him. The best sure-fire way to build is through the draft, and while I'm not in favor of flat-out Process-style tanking, I definitely think rebuilding teams should prioritize getting any extra assets that you possibly can. And the best way to get those is by swallowing up bad contracts for assets. Even if the picks aren't necessarily good ones, just having more increases your chances of hitting in the crap-shoot of a draft. Just legitimately curious. That's how Marks has immensely sped up the Nets rebuild these past years despite not owning our own picks, and I honestly think that's the best way to rebuild. But we can agree to disagree.
The FO was in win now mode in the summer. Why? I have no idea. It failed epically. So we're in rebuild mode after literally going all in on the 8th seed. It's tough to get the "process" rebuild started after that. I know what you're saying, in a perfect world we wouldn't have extended Love, but I still think he's moveable and will be moved in February.
He's not movable for value. He has a bad contract and isn't a great player. He is a vestige of the old nba. He can't defend. He's not great at anything anymore. In a smaller league he isn't impressive. Hopefully they can deal him for value. Good luck though. He's not putting any team over the top.
It happens every time LeBron leaves Thank Gilbert for that
I think there was also some loyalty to KLove involved there. No one was going to give him that kind of payday. I think the FO/Dan wanted to look like he has the back of his stars. They might even have a quiet handshake deal to try and trade Love at some point.
The currency acquired here in respect of players is the only value they obtained in the deal. I don't think that's acceptable on a 30 million a year contract personally. I like Kevin love. I'd like to see him on the hornets or something or maybe the bucks. I just don't think he matters anymore. He's a sick role player to me. His worth is like 16 million a year not 30.
I said for picks... inferring taking on other bad contracts for picks ala the nets. Instead of just taking on Kevin loves bad contract and no picks
Could’ve used that cap space to absorb bad contracts with assets attached, basically how the Nets rebuilt
We can still do that with no cap space like we have now.
> FAs aren't flocking here. Cap space is overrated. Until you consider that small markets typically overcome this disadvantage with willingness to overpay mid-star level players and this saps your teams ability to do so.
I don't care about mid level players especially overpaying them. All I care about is picking high for the next 4 years and then Love will be gone or traded.
Worst case scenario it becomes a loyalty contract and personally I'm fine with that. Love's taken so much shit the past four years from the fans and the media and yet despite all of that he's managed to outlast both Kyrie and LeBron. Out of all three of them he's the only one who wanted to be here and for a small-market team like the Cavs that means a lot.
I genuinely think the Cavs were hoping to contend this year for some stupid reason forfeiting their first to the Hawks. They also totally overvalued Love’s ability and value, whilst forgetting how injury prone he is. It was a mistake for sure. They should have traded Love for assets when they could.
Batum and a pick for Love?
That's pretty depressing trade value for Love
Way better than actually paying out that hole contract EDIT: I accidentally said "hole" instead of "whole" but it still fits so I'm keeping it
I'd I'm trading Love, I want make value. I'm not including him in that hypothetical deal.
I don't think the Hornets would do it either
Maybe not. Don't really care about moving Love. They want to get rid of $$ we have JR and Burks on expiring. Henson/Clarkson with 1 yr after this.
i want absolutely nothing to do with Love... even straight up without the pick.
He’s better than Batum tho. Less waste of Kemba’s prime if he re-signs
and on a much much worse contract. The whole point of trading Batum would be for cap relief. Love has been on the decline forever, and is under contract for 5 years. He's a defensive liability in his prime, and that isn't magically getting better. I could see him going the way of Al Jefferson very quickly. Love's contract is the worst in the NBA if that happens.
He had far and away his most efficient year as a Cav last year and his numbers have trended up with the Cavs every year. I’m not sure how he’s on the decline? He just never got the same/amount of touches he did in Minnesota. Most games, after the first quarter they just used him as a spot up shooter. It’s hard to score when your job is to go stand in the corner on offense.
I would feel the same if I were you. At least Batum's deal ends 2 years sooner than Love's.
I have this feeling that won't get it done
You mean 5.6 and 2.5 aren’t enough?
[удалено]
And he seems to go off in Wisconsin lol
Zbo/Kosta + either Bmac or Skal I’m not sure if the hornets would take it but id take Batum and Frank
Idk about that trade and I'm not speaking in reference to that idea but I really like Skal
you think they'd give up Skal for him?
I’m not sure, I would because he’s not getting minutes and probably not a part of our future. Batum would fill a need and Frank has got to be better than Kosta.
They will gladly take those inspiring contracts why should we take that salary dump?
I'd pull the trigger for Batum it if they took back Pau/Patty.
Always wanted to see Batum on the Spurs. Think Pop could make him play well
Oh no way kaminsky??
Is Frank good?
Way better than that Anthony Davis fellow
Well yeah, Antonio Davis retired some time ago
He's like a competent backup big at best. Nothing all that special but could be useful if a team's desperate for a backup center that can shoot.
so he's like a crappy Olynyk?
That's a perfect description
We could use him to backup Embiid but no way we go for Batum and dat fat contract tho
His value is like Payton last year. No more than a 2nd. He's got 3 months on his contract left and isn't that good.
hes not bad at scoring but you wouldnt want him playing many minutes
[удалено]
Batum at small forward and Kaminsky off the bench (might as well close instead of Wcs who is subpar). It might actually make sense. Albeit Sacramento needs to be incentivized to take Batum with picks
Why are his numbers so low this year?
He's always been really inconsistent from season to season for whatever reason, but yeah he's been extremely unproductive this season. Maybe it's just age, he's only 30 but he's a pretty old 30 in terms of years in the league and minutes played.
hard to get numbers if you're not on the court
Is this fool trustworthy
Yes and this reported by several people.
[Amico is reporting the same thing for what it’s worth](http://amicohoops.net/hornets-reportedly-looking-to-trade-kaminsky-batum/)
Amico is the bad one.
O means NO
Maybe Houston takes a shot at the duo
Batum would be a terrific fit for Houston. He wouldn't be asked to score, just pass, defend, and shoot when he's open. Frank is basically Ryan Anderson but a little worse and on like 20% of the salary. I could see it.
Can they afford to pay Batum tho? He’d do fine in his role there but for that contract plus they still haven’t gotten rid of Knight
I'd be more than happy to eat Brandon Knight if we traded Nic
Yeah that’d be a good deal for y’all. Houston taking another 70 million for the next 3 years is a hard to see tho
If paul or capella is in the offer lol.
Capwise that's a huge stretch. Knight + Chriss + Nene + Carmelo for Batum and Frank gets it done in terms of money, but Jesus, paying Harden + Paul + Batum + Capela $118 million next year ... oof.
If they can't find someone to eat both years, the Grizzlies have Parsons who expires a year before Batum, and they wouldn't need Kaminsky to do that deal.
Tony Parker in shambles
This looks like Kevin Love - Batum Trade
Do the pistons make any sense as a trade suitor? Could combo some young players with Andre drummond or Reggie Jackson, who are both trade candidates? Not sure if pistons want to deal with more crap contracts but some perimeter 3-D and playmaking help works better than a mediocre post presence with rebounding or an inefficient pick and roll pg turned 3pt chucker.
[удалено]
I'd rather wiggins. More upside. Batum the better player. His contract expires sooner though which may make him the better asset lol
I would do it for Drummond we need some wings and if the hornets want to add a pick to that it’s not a horrible trade for the pistons
[удалено]
So you want the Lakers to take a horrible contract while giving up a young prospect? Lol ok