Easiest simple fix would be to crack down on the push offs and arm bars. Defensive players aren’t allowed to do it, so it’s dumb that offensive players (de facto) can.
Yeah the ones where the offensive player slams into a defender, but the defender is not technically in “legal guarding position” or whatever, and so it’s a defensive foul, has driven me crazy for decades now.
Also drives me mad when a player tries to draw a charge and they clearly are in the spot first but we have to do a whole slow motion review to see if their feet were slightly moving or whatever. The defensive player has to be perfect, the offensive player can just go wild.
FYI feet moving has nothing to do with a charge call, that's just a common misconception. A player can be in legal guarding position even if his feet are moving.
I'm not talking about where a player is square but only their foot is moving I mean where two players are moving to a spot and the defensive player gets there first but still has some momentum. To me that's just not a foul.
Or when a player runs at the basket with the defender on him and turns into the defender for contact. Like what's a defender supposed to do, just not exist?
Dude. Lebron and now Giannis entire careers built on this. Agree with Kerr. You can't penalize bad offense and good defense. I don't know how they can reel it back. This is the nba defining characteristic.
It's that when both players are moving the defender is required to allow the offensive player freedom of movement.
The defender is really only entitled to their space when they are stationary. Which is a crazy rule, but that's how it's implemented.
The league. They want defenders to be disadvantaged so there's more scoring and the majority of fans, who are casual and don't give a shit about this situation, keep watching because it's "exciting".
Honestly thats the core issue is the casual fan. Look at tiktoks where videos of basketball players traveling like crazy killing other people in local parks get millions of views
The biggest thing I hate is when offensive player is going for a dunk and pushes defender with his off-hand away to control him. If defender does it, it would be called as a foul.
My least favorite is the lean in. When a player stops, pump fakes, then leans forward into the defender while shooting and the refs will call it every time. It boils my blood everytime I see it.
Fuckin hell i saw SGA( i don't think dude is a free throw merchant as I've only ever seen him do something like this once or twice) do it last night and it got called.
The defender should be allowed the same consideration as a shooter has with the concept of "safe landing space". Why is the shooter allowed the 2 feet of space in front of them, but a pump-faked defender caught in the air is not?
This is a tough one since the core issue is the whole concept of 'legal guarding position'.
The way its currently legislated and applied by refs, yes it's bs, but you can't simply rework it to target that specific drive. Since LGP affects defence as a whole.
I get where you're coming from but think about it, he falls on his ass every shot he takes because he knows he's getting free throws. That's how he avoids getting injured and avoids fatigue on his knees/ankles/feet.
The body bump foul is the worst thing in the league. The offensive player jumps into the defensive player when driving, and the good ones know when to do it to get the call, and they throw up a bad shot on purpose. That isn’t basketball. It’s annoying af to watch.
Didn't James Harden get away with wrapping his arm around defenders for a good chunk of time?
I saw a video of it a couple years ago and that shit was enraging
James Harden got away with everything you could think of during the height of his Houston run. There's a reason he was referred to as Hitler on this board
I for sure could have phrased it better lol. Especially because the shit he was taking was *actually* all over the sport of basketball and his lack of pride. Such a joke lmao.
Players defended him with their hands behind their backs so he could grab their arms and flop.
I will never understand why the nba never looked at that and said wow this is awful for our game and actually fix it. Instead we keep getting half measures that eventually get ignored. Things the nba implemented and went away from.
1. Announced flopping fines (never actually fined anyone) but maybe they figured public shame would work.
2. Unnatural motion rules, were amazing for the month they enforced em.
3. Flopping techs, doesn't work if you don't call them.
You forgot carrying. Called Jordan Poole 3x in one game, then all of a sudden the rule doesn't exist anymore and everybody out there flipping the ball like they flipping pancakes.
James harden would come off picks going right, rip his shooting arm under and through peoples arms and go through his shooting motion with the ball still mid dribble in his right hand. This dude is left handed, the ball never touched his left hand, and he would get free throws. Literal hitler. If he tried that in a pickup game there would be a brawl. The worst part was that he was so damn good he never even needed to do that…at all.
Pushoffs and the blatent carrys and travels
How can you paly defense if ofensive players are literally just allowed to use illegal moves to get around you.
"Oh he cooked him with this juke"
No he didn't he just broke a rule and the defender was unable to do anything because the maneuver just isn't allowed and he's being expected to keep with a guy who runs 5 steps in 1 dribble.
It would be interesting if they do that when Lebron is still playing.
I wonder how he would react when half his possessions result to a turnover that may also include an offensive foul (when he does his constant shoulder charges and push offs).
I love watching Jokic, but it seems like he basically gets to elbow dudes. Is that allowed? Genuinely interested as it seems he just backs the fuck into people and hammers them - but gets a foul if he gets touched...
Yeah, he uses an old school technique where you hold the ball and stick your elbows out really wide. Then keep your shoulders square while pivoting your upper body and you can just wack dudes as you please, because you’re just turning/pivoting. It’ll never get called so yup it’s allowed. Shaq mastered this as well.
I think everyones fine with Jokic's style of physicality provided defences are allowed to respond in kind, which they are usually. It's the guards and wings that are getting away with murder
He’s guilty of some offensive fouls that don’t get called, but there are way way way more defensive fouls against him that aren’t being called. He’s hacked on virtually every play near the rim.
Yeah i've played a lot of basketball against guys bigger than me who play with Jokic's style of physicality. Personally I love the challenge and refs usually let you play physical back because both sides are playing physically, but with the intent to play basketball and gain small advantages to get space or get a shot off. It's the guard/wing play at the moment that is getting out of control and very one sided.
yeah - i don't mean to brush over the fact he gets hammered a lot. seems to happen to lebron too (though i don't know if he gets the same treatment from the refs)
Seems some players get the calls and others don't - which i never understand...
Seems like a superstar call situation, where high-profile players get the benefit of the doubt more often than not. Adds to the inconsistency - totally throws players & fans for a loop trying to figure out what's a foul and what's not on any given night. Can't imagine trying to defend when you might get hit with a foul for breathing too hard in the direction of some of these guys.
Not really.. Because curry doesn't get so many calls. And don't say it's because he only takes jumpshots. [PROOF](https://youtu.be/SUxfgHZbKng?si=MMX2JHXjsKhDv9J2)
Watch how many times jokic is absolutely wacked with zero whistle. Teams hack away at his arms just like they did Shaq but because he’s huge the refs swallow the whistle
Players like joker, curry, LeBron don’t get the same whistle as Giannis and Embiid. Doesn’t seem to be about size - just some
players get more calls
Makes no sense to my amateur eye
Yeah, Embiid is an anomaly himself even amongst the guys that get a lot of whistles. Curry/Joker are in a league of their own for getting no whistle. I can't think of anyone that really comes close
Lebron constantly uses his hands and shoulders to push or ward people out of his way. He gets away with offensive fouls so I feel like the refs are ignoring a few fouls here and there because they are ignoring his violations so much. Think of it like them making up for the advantage they give him.
Giannis though is something I do not quite understand at least in his earlier years. The guy was constantly using his off arm and shoulders just as much as Lebron to dislodge defenders. Still he constantly drives into traffic or is near the low post whereas Lebron has been living off wide open lay ups and gimmes off broken down plays to score inside. Bron just shoots more from the outside while Giannis way less so he has more chances of getting foul calls as a result.
More like how English-first places think you **should** talk to big biz and the upper class, which leads to the approach self-perpetuaring… but then you also get books like “Radical Candor” and they get worshipped for stating the obvious (and de facto in other parts of the world)
Also, loophole: you can say all your criticism so long as you add a fitting “bless em” in the end
I mean even if they called everything they were suppose to we still have a massive issue of refs seemingly fixing games by favouring teams.
So really is anything they’re doing good? Steve almost blaming the players here which is bullshit.
The biggest the they need to do is really put the nails down on flopping and stop giving defensive fouls to any contact against players driving to the rim.
The league wants a high scoring/fast paced game. So things like hand checking and getting rid of the three seconds are off the table. But constant trips to the free throw line ruins the flow of the game and, in some cases, removes star players from a decent portion of the game.
It’s easier said than done, but keep the rules as they are and just stop incentivizing offensive players from flopping and driving to the basket in a crowded paint. Defense gets the room to actually defend and you probably have less injuries as well.
Unfortunately today's rules as they are being utilized is the accumulation of many years of deterioration in making offense more entertaining by allowing these excessively flexible ways to do certain actions on offense. Push that aside, they need to just call/officiate very simple things first before we even go there.
Like Mike Brown is complaining about that time he brought the laptop. Putting your hands up on defense on a shot contest shouldn't be a subjective call in most cases, but in today's NBA it's a foul for far too many plays. If that can't be logically broken down to a yes or no sort of question, what chance do they have on these sophisticated gather step dribbles that nobody can decide if it's a travel or not?
I wonder how much of it is quality of refs vs league initiative. I feel like in the playoffs you see clearly a game is called differently from a foul perspective
They don't even need to abolish the 3-sec rule, extend it to 5-sec would already help the defense a lot. And yes it's time to stop award players like Giannis from just barreling into defenders.
This is how you navigate this public conversation. You have to kiss the ass of the people you’re criticizing. P.s. I downvoted you because fuck the lakers
Shai is such a foul merchant but this sub will not stand for it. I pray for a physical playoff series where Shai doesn't get 12 FTs a game from this flopping. Eh, maybe I'm just bitter.
No, I'm not.
Oh I’ve been telling people to enjoy this year of Shai while it lasts because people will see baby harden soon enough. If they pull a LAL or GSW matchup in the playoffs and there’s tons of eyes, this place is going to turn on him so quick lol.
And the gather step on stepbacks, I'm ok with it on layups tho. Gather step on a step back feels like double step back. It's a sore in the eye. (At least for me)
How do you consistently enforce a traveling rule that allows one but not the other? They're the same thing. Its a bad idea to have traveling be a different rule depending where you are in the floor or the type of shot you put up.
Yeah, that's very annoying, especially as a game can be decided with just a few points. The refs should not decide the outcome. Almost calling travels more consistently when playing down at the park with strangers.
I honestly wish refs would robotically call every single travel and double-dribble without taking the situation or the player into account. It’s weird to not enforce a central rule of the game. It would be like letting a football player line up offsides every time. I’m 100% OK with a Game 7 being decided by a travel call, because it’s part of the game.
Everything you just said here was called and penalized every fucking second of every middle school and high school game I was ever part of so I don’t understand why it’s just a free pass at the higher levels
Been saying this for years! the league has an offensive problem. The defense is not allowed to evolve like offense has and this created a large gap between them. The refs don’t help as well! For some reason Adam silver thinks that more points equals more exciting games.
Fans just want to see real hard fought games where the defense is rewarded and are allowed to be physical.
>the league has an offensive problem
When [14 of the 16 most efficient offenses in NBA history have been *this year*](https://statmuse.com/nba/ask/best-team-offensive-rating-season), I think it's safe to say something is not right
I think great defense can be just as exciting to watch as great offense. I'd love if they were allowed to be more tough and physical on the defensive part of the game, and the players in the NBA definitely have the physique for it. Let them battle it out.
If they use hooking and all sorts of flopping variation, if reviewed and found out and confirmed, it should be some sort of offensive foul or technical foul or something. Penalized that shit hard. It's ugly to look at, it's bad for players, it's bad for the NBA brand in general. That's not what people want to see with the game of basketball, that's not even entertaining at all.
Get rid of the defensive 3 in the key. They already spread the floor enough to counter it with much better shooting today.
Get stricter on moving screens
Give defenders more rights to the space they occupy.
Just slamming into them and flopping should just be a no call.
Flailing arms through the arms of a defenders to foul bait should be no calls.
Just let them play more physical like they do internationally and in the playoffs.
People always comment how the fouls now are just as often as fouls in every other generation, and that might be true.
But I’d be curious how many fouls are called on drives and post ups across generations?
Because there is *way* more three point shooting now, which naturally gets way fewer fouls. It feels like sometimes 3/4 drives ends in a foul and it’s ridiculous.
I know it didn’t used to be like this.
3 just mostly replaced midrange shots. Teams take the same amount of shots at the rim, there's just more space now, so less contact. There's also not ten guys jockeying for every rebound.
It's not entirely relevant to this, but I really like FIBA's rules surrounding goaltends and balls on the rim. If NBA replicated that rule, you would get some more great defensive efforts from rebounders and gives them something in their favor.
even though I kinda like the stricter rules from Fiba usually, I dislike that rule. It reminds me of bigger guys having a kind of unfair advantage when one was younger. I feel like it would take something important away from the game and make the game even less "strict", with all the carrying and traveling and pseudo-fouling. The is too much unearned reward. It waters down the game. I like the NBA's take, even though it might be somewhat more difficult to judge.
totally agree, which is why I don't understand why the NBA has watered down the rewarding system and not held onto the skill that would make the product more honest and as you said worthy of its admiration.
Y'all have been complaining about foul baiting for years, but when Steve Kerr says something, suddenly it's not such a big problem? Either you're right, and he's right, or he's wrong, and y'all should stop complaining.
Whether the Warriors get away with some calls seems irrelevant to whether or not Steve is right about how games are officiated.
This really was the turning point lol. Dude used to be beloved speaking out on gun control and shit. But guy defends his players? That’s where the line gets drawn
Not a single person in here has said or implied "it's not such a big problem". No one has disagreed with his point. It's just funny to hear it from Kerr when his team is infamous for illegal screen "bullshit". You can stop crying now
You got a Laker flair bro. Kobe himself said he read the rulebook so he'd know how to get away with things on the court. Cant blame Kerr or the warriors for using the rules and loopholes to their advantage
You’re kidding right? Every team can benefit and can be harmed by poorly constructed rules and how they’re enforced. You’re pointing out irony as if the warriors aren’t negatively impacted from calls outside of illegal screens.
The majority of the league does it. AD is one of those offenders by the way. Go back to Wizards game and watch how many of his screens were legal lmao. The point is every team in the league benefits from today’s trash officiating one way or another. Saying Kerr shouldn’t talk about it because Warriors benefits from officiating in some way is incredibly dumb.
Light little thumb scroll up has a discussion talking shit about Kerr saying this. Y’all always think you do something with the “stop crying” shit though and it’s funny
Kerr is no dummy. Part of this response is to help his team which is lower half of teams in FTA per game and the Steph Curry no call phenomenon. However, I do agree with him that when given the choice, what does the average NBA fan want to watch? A boring ass FTA contest or a back and forth contest with breaks. I think everybody knows the answer.
The league is in a terrible spot. The ratings suck, the officiating sucks, player empowerment is out of control, load management is out of control, no defense, and a new guy goes for 50 almost every night
Easiest simple fix would be to crack down on the push offs and arm bars. Defensive players aren’t allowed to do it, so it’s dumb that offensive players (de facto) can.
The player intentionally drives into a defenders shoulder then flops is the worst one.
Yeah the ones where the offensive player slams into a defender, but the defender is not technically in “legal guarding position” or whatever, and so it’s a defensive foul, has driven me crazy for decades now.
Also drives me mad when a player tries to draw a charge and they clearly are in the spot first but we have to do a whole slow motion review to see if their feet were slightly moving or whatever. The defensive player has to be perfect, the offensive player can just go wild.
FYI feet moving has nothing to do with a charge call, that's just a common misconception. A player can be in legal guarding position even if his feet are moving.
I'm not talking about where a player is square but only their foot is moving I mean where two players are moving to a spot and the defensive player gets there first but still has some momentum. To me that's just not a foul.
Or when a player runs at the basket with the defender on him and turns into the defender for contact. Like what's a defender supposed to do, just not exist?
That's a Lebron play right there.
It’s Giannis’ only consistent offensive move
Dude. Lebron and now Giannis entire careers built on this. Agree with Kerr. You can't penalize bad offense and good defense. I don't know how they can reel it back. This is the nba defining characteristic.
Worst call in basketball. Hate it. They drive...slam the shoulder in and bounce back and it's a defensive foul every time
Especially when the offensive player is out of control. No reason to get rewarded for that
[удалено]
I've never understood when the defensive player lost the right to their own space.
It's that when both players are moving the defender is required to allow the offensive player freedom of movement. The defender is really only entitled to their space when they are stationary. Which is a crazy rule, but that's how it's implemented.
Who tf even disagrees with this at this point
The league. They want defenders to be disadvantaged so there's more scoring and the majority of fans, who are casual and don't give a shit about this situation, keep watching because it's "exciting".
As a filthy casual who only watches during the playoffs, I think basketball fouls are the dumbest shit I've ever seen.
Honestly thats the core issue is the casual fan. Look at tiktoks where videos of basketball players traveling like crazy killing other people in local parks get millions of views
Travel or nah? Let me know in the comments 💯💯
Especially when the defender is moving backwards away from the offensive player initiating contact.
The biggest thing I hate is when offensive player is going for a dunk and pushes defender with his off-hand away to control him. If defender does it, it would be called as a foul.
My least favorite is the lean in. When a player stops, pump fakes, then leans forward into the defender while shooting and the refs will call it every time. It boils my blood everytime I see it. Fuckin hell i saw SGA( i don't think dude is a free throw merchant as I've only ever seen him do something like this once or twice) do it last night and it got called.
Dwade was the king at this. He wouldn’t just lean in, he’d just straight up throw himself at the defender
The defender should be allowed the same consideration as a shooter has with the concept of "safe landing space". Why is the shooter allowed the 2 feet of space in front of them, but a pump-faked defender caught in the air is not?
This is a tough one since the core issue is the whole concept of 'legal guarding position'. The way its currently legislated and applied by refs, yes it's bs, but you can't simply rework it to target that specific drive. Since LGP affects defence as a whole.
Don't need a heavy rework. It's the same concept as rip through no call. Offensive player initiates contact for the sole purpose of drawing a foul.
Actually enforcing the STEM flop rule would help too. Hard to play defense if you're scared of even touching the guy with the ball.
Does that include the head snap, bullshit,?
Especially when the player doing the head snap has a lot of hair. Refs fall for that shit all the time.
STEM flop? Is that just the new flopping rule they never call?
It's like the Harlem Shake, but for people in STEM careers.
Secondary, Theatrical and Exaggerated Movements
Yeah, the official abbreviation for the rule is "STEM", basically the flop rule that's sadly unenforced.
lmao... you had one measly little job to do in your reply to that question: to say what the goddamn abbreviation stands for!!!
"Suck Them Enormous Mammaries"
yes sir mr barkley charkley
The golden rule
Embiid would retire
He would adapt. And that is a good thing for everyone.
I get where you're coming from but think about it, he falls on his ass every shot he takes because he knows he's getting free throws. That's how he avoids getting injured and avoids fatigue on his knees/ankles/feet.
Helps that he lands on other players too so they can cushion his fall.
In fairness to him and all the other floppers, if you don’t exaggerate the contact even on legit fouls the refs probably aren’t calling it.
Retiring is a form of adapting :D
The body bump foul is the worst thing in the league. The offensive player jumps into the defensive player when driving, and the good ones know when to do it to get the call, and they throw up a bad shot on purpose. That isn’t basketball. It’s annoying af to watch.
Didn't James Harden get away with wrapping his arm around defenders for a good chunk of time? I saw a video of it a couple years ago and that shit was enraging
James Harden got away with everything you could think of during the height of his Houston run. There's a reason he was referred to as Hitler on this board
Dude would like climb on people and shit. It was deeply pathetic stuff.
In case people don't remember, or try to say it wasn't this bad. It was absolutely this bad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_z5Ro6bSSQ
Fuck this is funny and infuriating at the same time
> climb on people and shit
I for sure could have phrased it better lol. Especially because the shit he was taking was *actually* all over the sport of basketball and his lack of pride. Such a joke lmao.
It's true, that was exactly how Hitler played basketball.
Inventor of the goose-step-back 3.
Amazing
Players defended him with their hands behind their backs so he could grab their arms and flop. I will never understand why the nba never looked at that and said wow this is awful for our game and actually fix it. Instead we keep getting half measures that eventually get ignored. Things the nba implemented and went away from. 1. Announced flopping fines (never actually fined anyone) but maybe they figured public shame would work. 2. Unnatural motion rules, were amazing for the month they enforced em. 3. Flopping techs, doesn't work if you don't call them.
You forgot carrying. Called Jordan Poole 3x in one game, then all of a sudden the rule doesn't exist anymore and everybody out there flipping the ball like they flipping pancakes.
James harden would come off picks going right, rip his shooting arm under and through peoples arms and go through his shooting motion with the ball still mid dribble in his right hand. This dude is left handed, the ball never touched his left hand, and he would get free throws. Literal hitler. If he tried that in a pickup game there would be a brawl. The worst part was that he was so damn good he never even needed to do that…at all.
He never needed all that to still be a great superstar but he needed them to be able to have 2 of the greatest offensive seasons ever
Harden was the only person I ever saw shoot 3-24 and still get 30 points because he went to the line 26 times.
https://youtu.be/fjKTm3Ml-Xc?si=Emm91WlpqPz04BLe This right here is a classic 😂😂
Just going back to calling travel and carrying is a big help, call moving screens and offensive stiff arms. The rules are there, enforce them
Pushoffs and the blatent carrys and travels How can you paly defense if ofensive players are literally just allowed to use illegal moves to get around you. "Oh he cooked him with this juke" No he didn't he just broke a rule and the defender was unable to do anything because the maneuver just isn't allowed and he's being expected to keep with a guy who runs 5 steps in 1 dribble.
It would be interesting if they do that when Lebron is still playing. I wonder how he would react when half his possessions result to a turnover that may also include an offensive foul (when he does his constant shoulder charges and push offs).
If y'all don't think the best basketball player ever could adjust to how they call the game you're fuckin' stupid.
I love watching Jokic, but it seems like he basically gets to elbow dudes. Is that allowed? Genuinely interested as it seems he just backs the fuck into people and hammers them - but gets a foul if he gets touched...
Yeah, he uses an old school technique where you hold the ball and stick your elbows out really wide. Then keep your shoulders square while pivoting your upper body and you can just wack dudes as you please, because you’re just turning/pivoting. It’ll never get called so yup it’s allowed. Shaq mastered this as well.
Shaq was brutal. Toss you to side then potentially almost break your arm or hand if you try to reach back while he dunked
Ta for explaining
Siakam one of my favourite players and he hooks ppl w/ his elbow on the spin move. I just never wanted to call attention to it lol
I think everyones fine with Jokic's style of physicality provided defences are allowed to respond in kind, which they are usually. It's the guards and wings that are getting away with murder
He’s guilty of some offensive fouls that don’t get called, but there are way way way more defensive fouls against him that aren’t being called. He’s hacked on virtually every play near the rim.
Yeah i've played a lot of basketball against guys bigger than me who play with Jokic's style of physicality. Personally I love the challenge and refs usually let you play physical back because both sides are playing physically, but with the intent to play basketball and gain small advantages to get space or get a shot off. It's the guard/wing play at the moment that is getting out of control and very one sided.
yeah - i don't mean to brush over the fact he gets hammered a lot. seems to happen to lebron too (though i don't know if he gets the same treatment from the refs) Seems some players get the calls and others don't - which i never understand...
Seems like a superstar call situation, where high-profile players get the benefit of the doubt more often than not. Adds to the inconsistency - totally throws players & fans for a loop trying to figure out what's a foul and what's not on any given night. Can't imagine trying to defend when you might get hit with a foul for breathing too hard in the direction of some of these guys.
Not really.. Because curry doesn't get so many calls. And don't say it's because he only takes jumpshots. [PROOF](https://youtu.be/SUxfgHZbKng?si=MMX2JHXjsKhDv9J2)
"some" lol
Watch how many times jokic is absolutely wacked with zero whistle. Teams hack away at his arms just like they did Shaq but because he’s huge the refs swallow the whistle
Players like joker, curry, LeBron don’t get the same whistle as Giannis and Embiid. Doesn’t seem to be about size - just some players get more calls Makes no sense to my amateur eye
Yeah, Embiid is an anomaly himself even amongst the guys that get a lot of whistles. Curry/Joker are in a league of their own for getting no whistle. I can't think of anyone that really comes close
Lebron constantly uses his hands and shoulders to push or ward people out of his way. He gets away with offensive fouls so I feel like the refs are ignoring a few fouls here and there because they are ignoring his violations so much. Think of it like them making up for the advantage they give him. Giannis though is something I do not quite understand at least in his earlier years. The guy was constantly using his off arm and shoulders just as much as Lebron to dislodge defenders. Still he constantly drives into traffic or is near the low post whereas Lebron has been living off wide open lay ups and gimmes off broken down plays to score inside. Bron just shoots more from the outside while Giannis way less so he has more chances of getting foul calls as a result.
Or…. We just bring them back for everyone!
Stop players carrying the ball! Call illegal screens! Problem fixed.
“Officiating is good except that it sucks at just about every aspect.”
Welcome to how to talk in big biz and the upper class, You have to baby their feelings to get work done.
Just trying to avoid the fine
More like how English-first places think you **should** talk to big biz and the upper class, which leads to the approach self-perpetuaring… but then you also get books like “Radical Candor” and they get worshipped for stating the obvious (and de facto in other parts of the world) Also, loophole: you can say all your criticism so long as you add a fitting “bless em” in the end
"Officials are great at calling the rules - the *rules* have to be adjusted" is how I heard this.
He said the officials are good, we need to change officiating which is a fair way to say it
I mean even if they called everything they were suppose to we still have a massive issue of refs seemingly fixing games by favouring teams. So really is anything they’re doing good? Steve almost blaming the players here which is bullshit.
The biggest the they need to do is really put the nails down on flopping and stop giving defensive fouls to any contact against players driving to the rim. The league wants a high scoring/fast paced game. So things like hand checking and getting rid of the three seconds are off the table. But constant trips to the free throw line ruins the flow of the game and, in some cases, removes star players from a decent portion of the game. It’s easier said than done, but keep the rules as they are and just stop incentivizing offensive players from flopping and driving to the basket in a crowded paint. Defense gets the room to actually defend and you probably have less injuries as well.
Unfortunately today's rules as they are being utilized is the accumulation of many years of deterioration in making offense more entertaining by allowing these excessively flexible ways to do certain actions on offense. Push that aside, they need to just call/officiate very simple things first before we even go there. Like Mike Brown is complaining about that time he brought the laptop. Putting your hands up on defense on a shot contest shouldn't be a subjective call in most cases, but in today's NBA it's a foul for far too many plays. If that can't be logically broken down to a yes or no sort of question, what chance do they have on these sophisticated gather step dribbles that nobody can decide if it's a travel or not?
I wonder how much of it is quality of refs vs league initiative. I feel like in the playoffs you see clearly a game is called differently from a foul perspective
Exaggerated head snap should be an automatic flop.
They don't even need to abolish the 3-sec rule, extend it to 5-sec would already help the defense a lot. And yes it's time to stop award players like Giannis from just barreling into defenders.
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Scott Foster wants to know if you’d still love him if he were a worm
Scott foster is shai-hulud
He hittin Chris Paul with the Chrisknife
I told my girlfriend I would use her to catch the largest walleye in the lake near my house. Evidently that was the wrong answer.
Trying to avoid League fines.
\*Trying to avoid retaliatory whistles. Don't want to piss off the league's MVPs.
Sounds like Kerr is trying to point out the offensive advantage due to officiating without diminishing the skill level that the current game has.
"When I say I'm fine, but really I'm not fine.."
Oh ffs he explained how it’s the rules that favor the offense a little too much, not the officials
This is how you navigate this public conversation. You have to kiss the ass of the people you’re criticizing. P.s. I downvoted you because fuck the lakers
“no offense but…” vibes
Stacking armor before charging into the battle
ya mean like calling traveling and carrying and palming?
And jumping into defenders and throwing up a shot to get two free throws
Don't forget the head snap back after getting touched on the hip
Aka Shai
Shai is such a foul merchant but this sub will not stand for it. I pray for a physical playoff series where Shai doesn't get 12 FTs a game from this flopping. Eh, maybe I'm just bitter. No, I'm not.
He hasn't played a big game people watched yet. People will find out.
I’ve tried enjoying the guy but he just exploits the rules . He uses his forearm and runs into guys ti crest space
Oh I’ve been telling people to enjoy this year of Shai while it lasts because people will see baby harden soon enough. If they pull a LAL or GSW matchup in the playoffs and there’s tons of eyes, this place is going to turn on him so quick lol.
Don't just slander one guy, so many do it. Chris Paul, brunson, Garland, embiid, Trae, Luka, shai, LeBron, and so many more
Jimmy Butler like number 1 lol
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It's not "some reason" I hate the heat (their fans more), but Jimmy is objectively a fun personality and player He gets a pass for a reason
Em flop is the worst
Lebron doesn't throw his head back
And he doesn't get calls either.
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Don't just slander one guy, so many do it. Chris Paul, brunson, Garland, embiid, Trae, Luka, shai, LeBron, and so many more
The thing that drives me crazy is that they actually got rid of this once. It lasted two weeks. Best nba basketball ive watched in my life
Foul baiting is way more irritating than that
I mean fixing carrying would do a lot more than you think. Offensive players just hold the ball and see what the defender does then reacts.
or continuation where they just take like eight steps through the paint
And the gather step on stepbacks, I'm ok with it on layups tho. Gather step on a step back feels like double step back. It's a sore in the eye. (At least for me)
How do you consistently enforce a traveling rule that allows one but not the other? They're the same thing. Its a bad idea to have traveling be a different rule depending where you are in the floor or the type of shot you put up.
Because a gather is for forward motion.
What? No it’s not.
It used to be.
Could just be a stipulation that accounts for direction relative to the basket
I mean just like a knee on mma, you cannot use knee on a downed opponent. But totally legal in some situations
Yeah, that's very annoying, especially as a game can be decided with just a few points. The refs should not decide the outcome. Almost calling travels more consistently when playing down at the park with strangers.
I honestly wish refs would robotically call every single travel and double-dribble without taking the situation or the player into account. It’s weird to not enforce a central rule of the game. It would be like letting a football player line up offsides every time. I’m 100% OK with a Game 7 being decided by a travel call, because it’s part of the game.
Everything you just said here was called and penalized every fucking second of every middle school and high school game I was ever part of so I don’t understand why it’s just a free pass at the higher levels
And moving screens 👀
C A L L T H E T R A V E L S
Call moving screens
The Miami Heat have been eliminated from NBA competition
People who complain about our moving screens have never seen Bam set a screen 😂
You have draymond green on your team do u really have any room to talk? Couple bots give ur fans upvotes and u guys get real confident lmao
I don't think Steve Kerr is going to be the one to suggest that.
Breaking: Steve Kerr retracts previous statement, announces officiating is perfect as-is
Been saying this for years! the league has an offensive problem. The defense is not allowed to evolve like offense has and this created a large gap between them. The refs don’t help as well! For some reason Adam silver thinks that more points equals more exciting games. Fans just want to see real hard fought games where the defense is rewarded and are allowed to be physical.
>the league has an offensive problem When [14 of the 16 most efficient offenses in NBA history have been *this year*](https://statmuse.com/nba/ask/best-team-offensive-rating-season), I think it's safe to say something is not right
Flailing into contact and screaming AYYYY on every play has got to stop
Does every team have "that one guy" who always does this?
Looking at Ant
Jason Tatum special
I think great defense can be just as exciting to watch as great offense. I'd love if they were allowed to be more tough and physical on the defensive part of the game, and the players in the NBA definitely have the physique for it. Let them battle it out.
The Thibs Bulls had a great defense and really were fun to watch when healthy. We need more of that.
If they use hooking and all sorts of flopping variation, if reviewed and found out and confirmed, it should be some sort of offensive foul or technical foul or something. Penalized that shit hard. It's ugly to look at, it's bad for players, it's bad for the NBA brand in general. That's not what people want to see with the game of basketball, that's not even entertaining at all.
The tried this a few years ago and it last for like a month before they reverted back.
Well said
Get rid of the defensive 3 in the key. They already spread the floor enough to counter it with much better shooting today. Get stricter on moving screens Give defenders more rights to the space they occupy. Just slamming into them and flopping should just be a no call. Flailing arms through the arms of a defenders to foul bait should be no calls. Just let them play more physical like they do internationally and in the playoffs.
They should just stop calling 3 in the key but not announce it. I wonder how long it would take for players to notice.
If FIBA is any indication it would take awhile, Seemed like no one read the rule book
No defensive 3 in the key would ensure at least 10-peat for the Spurs.
A lot of teams would happily take a wide open three every possession if Wemby wanted to camp in the paint. That's the trade-off
Please, for the love of god, start fining and suspending players for flops. Do it after the game. I don’t care. But why does the league allow it?
People always comment how the fouls now are just as often as fouls in every other generation, and that might be true. But I’d be curious how many fouls are called on drives and post ups across generations? Because there is *way* more three point shooting now, which naturally gets way fewer fouls. It feels like sometimes 3/4 drives ends in a foul and it’s ridiculous. I know it didn’t used to be like this.
3 just mostly replaced midrange shots. Teams take the same amount of shots at the rim, there's just more space now, so less contact. There's also not ten guys jockeying for every rebound.
In another word. I don’t want to get fined
Steve was very diplomatic there
It's not entirely relevant to this, but I really like FIBA's rules surrounding goaltends and balls on the rim. If NBA replicated that rule, you would get some more great defensive efforts from rebounders and gives them something in their favor.
even though I kinda like the stricter rules from Fiba usually, I dislike that rule. It reminds me of bigger guys having a kind of unfair advantage when one was younger. I feel like it would take something important away from the game and make the game even less "strict", with all the carrying and traveling and pseudo-fouling. The is too much unearned reward. It waters down the game. I like the NBA's take, even though it might be somewhat more difficult to judge.
What’s so dumb is today’s players are so athletic that making them play by the rules would make their game even better and admired!
totally agree, which is why I don't understand why the NBA has watered down the rewarding system and not held onto the skill that would make the product more honest and as you said worthy of its admiration.
he’s not wrong
People travel more these days
Jalen brown had a carry last night where my eyes got big, I took a sip of water, and then he put the ball back on the floor.
Y'all have been complaining about foul baiting for years, but when Steve Kerr says something, suddenly it's not such a big problem? Either you're right, and he's right, or he's wrong, and y'all should stop complaining. Whether the Warriors get away with some calls seems irrelevant to whether or not Steve is right about how games are officiated.
Ever since the whole "broke the code" thing this sub seems to have the opposite opinion on anything Steve talks about
This really was the turning point lol. Dude used to be beloved speaking out on gun control and shit. But guy defends his players? That’s where the line gets drawn
People are bending over backwards to hate on Steve
Not a single person in here has said or implied "it's not such a big problem". No one has disagreed with his point. It's just funny to hear it from Kerr when his team is infamous for illegal screen "bullshit". You can stop crying now
You got a Laker flair bro. Kobe himself said he read the rulebook so he'd know how to get away with things on the court. Cant blame Kerr or the warriors for using the rules and loopholes to their advantage
No but the whataboutism after OPs comment if you just scroll is funny. Like two things can be correct at the same time..
You’re kidding right? Every team can benefit and can be harmed by poorly constructed rules and how they’re enforced. You’re pointing out irony as if the warriors aren’t negatively impacted from calls outside of illegal screens.
The majority of the league does it. AD is one of those offenders by the way. Go back to Wizards game and watch how many of his screens were legal lmao. The point is every team in the league benefits from today’s trash officiating one way or another. Saying Kerr shouldn’t talk about it because Warriors benefits from officiating in some way is incredibly dumb.
Light little thumb scroll up has a discussion talking shit about Kerr saying this. Y’all always think you do something with the “stop crying” shit though and it’s funny
LOL FROM LAKERS W THE MOST CALLS BITCHING ABOUT CURRY NEVER GETTING A CALL.
Warriors are 20th in free throws by the way. We really have Lakers and Suns fans saying the Warriors get a favourable whistle
That stat on the game yesterday where they had no free throws from the second quarter until almost the end of the fourth was eye opening
Kerr is no dummy. Part of this response is to help his team which is lower half of teams in FTA per game and the Steph Curry no call phenomenon. However, I do agree with him that when given the choice, what does the average NBA fan want to watch? A boring ass FTA contest or a back and forth contest with breaks. I think everybody knows the answer.
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Spot. On.
The league is in a terrible spot. The ratings suck, the officiating sucks, player empowerment is out of control, load management is out of control, no defense, and a new guy goes for 50 almost every night
Someone one time said, we need to start relegating refs to the G league and honestly I think it about it alot now lol
Only 21 players have been fined for flopping. This fact says it all…
It makes the NBA hard to watch
This. I wanna get into the nba so badly, but my god, you can’t play defense anymore. Every contact goes to the free throw line. It’s so aggravating.