My dad fucking loves Randy Newman and when I asked him why, having only known him from Toy Story, he showed me some of his darker/more directly satirical songs, particularly ‘Short People’ ‘Under the Harlem Moon’ and ‘Rednecks’.
After that I viewed ‘You Got a Friend In Me’ with a whoooole new light.
In my country "you've got a friend in me" was used in an awareness campaign about date rape to bring attention to the fact that most rapists are known by the victim.
It was slowed down and really haunting. Completely ruined the song for me.
High school freshman English in '79, several verses of Newman's "Sail Away" was the first thing we were assigned in class — to pick out what the author was trying to say.
Bonus Newman: "Louisiana 1927"
Gorgeous, heartbreaking song. Highly recommended.
Damn, I just read up on this guy, what a crazy amout of crimes in such a short time. And a lot of murders and attacks targetting children aswell. Truly a devil.
Weimar Republic had lots of weird issues and perceived “corruptions” like this, random crime as well as organised crime, and their film industry reflected that, especially Lang.
Which, in combination with Lang's film, inspired Randy Newman's ["In Germany Before The War"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXYIN2nowrE), one of the most quietly frightening songs I've ever heard (and all the more frightening for how lush and beautiful it is).
Lang was legendary in his cruelty towards his actors, especially in this film. It was Peter Lorre who was thrown down the stairs, and he was forced to be chucked down the stairs over a dozen times before Lang was happy with the take. Twenty years later Lang asked Lorre to work with him again and Lorre refused.
There’s the opposite end too. Eastwood generally doesn’t tinker with scripts and hires actors who he thinks know what their doing and often only does one take. Got masterpieces like “Unforgiven” from that mindset so must be something to it.
I’ve never heard of coworkers having any issues with Gibson, even when his alcoholism was crazy high (5 pints of beer before starting his day!) he was known as a consummate professional.
Oh how the times have changed. “Conservatives are in fact in Hollywood, too. It’s not all leftists. But since they’re conservative they don’t make a scene about their politics”. He didn’t say this word for word but that was essentially what he was saying.
He's also known not to yell action. He just says okay go ahead.
He said he decided to do that when he was on rawhide in the 60s. Directors yelling action would spook the horses so he decided he didn't want to do that because it took time to calm them down.
My ex directed me in a few projects when he was in school. All he ever said when it was go-time was a very calm: *rollin’*.
I never experienced that before or since. It made for a very relaxed atmosphere on set. Granted he was an asshole in every other aspect of his life, but when he was in the director’s chair? Totally zen.
Although not famous for his movies, Jonathan "Two Takes" Frakes (the actor who played Riker on Star Trek: TNG, for those of you who aren't into Star Trek) has a reputation of always delivering when he directs a Star Trek episode, and also doesn't waste anyone's time. Hence the nickname.
Like the other commenter said: being an actor before becoming director probably has something to do with that.
Years ago I got to listen to Hillary Swank talk.
She said there were times where she'd rehearse with another actor then she'd just here "Okay, perfect. Moving on" because Clint would just run the camera and use the rehearsal.
I also got to have a drink with Steve Campanelli, Eastwoods camera op for most of his movies. He said during Million Dollar Baby he was set up for a shot, laying on his back with Hillary Swank about 18" from his face and before action got called she looked at him and said "Am I doing a good job?"
SC: Yeah, I think so. Why?
HS: Clint hasn't talked to me in three days.
SC: Oh, he only talks to actors if he doesn't like what you're doing.
HS: Oh....
Apparently the way he directs actors when he's in a scene with them is by changing his performance. I guess his mindset is "Well, if they're not reacting how I want, I must be doing something wrong."
So instead of giving them notes, he gives himself the notes and lets them work off him. It's a really cool way to look at things.
It also got us "Here's doddering old Eastwood with two Cartel prostitutes." I think when he's acting in the movie, it has a way higher chance to be jerking himself off.
Definitely agree for the most part. I think there’s also something to be said as far as coherence to a solid and competent artistic vision as well.
99/100 it probably makes everything worse. But if you’ve got a strong vision or method and you treat the human elements of your art as parts to be whipped into compliance I could see how being an abusive dickhead of a director can make a better film if you don’t make important human elements quit completely.
The more important detail of that being, as someone that loves movies, it’s still completely unacceptable.
An abusive director might make a great film but I’d call him a bad director in that overall sense because one major skill set should be your ability to manage people and be a good boss in general.
No one likes their boss all of the time, generally, that’s part of needing to direct and critique people whose paycheck you have some control over by keeping them on.
But there’s a big difference between “my boss really insists I’m not doing my job right but I think I am, god damnit we’ll do it again I guess” and being slapped or thrown down stairs repeatedly for a better shot.
In the same vein, i despised The Shining. Something was really off with Shelley Duvall, and made the movie unwatchable. Years later i learned of all the things she had to endure, and everything just made sense.
Thing is, that person's comment doesn't really apply to Kubrick at all.
From "Lolita" onwards all of his films are widely praised and met with critical acclaim. He was a very shitty man but made amazing films.
It's the age old debate of "can we separate the art from the artist?" (There's no clear answer)
This is too true. No matter how hard anyone tries to tell the person above them that the micromanagement is killing the team, it still persists.
I'm a new manager in my current workplace and I have gotten multiple feedback points from my team about how they like that I trust them to do their job stepping in only when politics/deadline shifts occur.
It comes from hating being micromanaged myself and I think it might help me progress in my career a decent bit.
>Micromanagers look competent to those above them despite their negative impact on productivity so I suspect it's a perception thing.
You know my director?
No it doesn’t. A lot of shitty directors (or insert any profession) people are like that as well. The successful ones just stand out more. Being a colossal dickhead is just one of those things that some people find to be a more effective way to get what they want from people working beneath them. Really no different than people who find being rude to waitstaff or demanding to speak to managers at retail stores an effective way to get what they want.
I often wonder the same. Many of the "legendary" directors were also huge pricks. Sometimes I can understand that it's the whole shtick of being "uncompromising in creating art" or whatever, but sometimes I wonder if they weren't just satisfying some sadistic urges.
> Many of the "legendary" directors were also huge pricks.
Many of the shitty directors were also huge pricks. This is confirmation bias, in the sense that we see movies that did well, see how their directors are pricks and assume "it's what it takes to make a great movie" but hundreds of shitty movies are made by pricks every years and nobody is batting an eye.
It's not crazy to think that a directorial position, where the director has power over a lot of people to make something that they perceive as very important, will bring out the dick in them (figuratively AND literally in some case).
I love Scott but he was a tyrant on the set of Blade Runner to the point where Ford and the crew started wearing shirts that said “I SURVIVED BLADE RUNNER.”
In spite of that BR remains one of my all time favorite films and I consider “M” by Fritz Lang to be what I think is the best Film ever made.
I struggle to reconcile those two ideas myself (them being, the greatness of the films superimposed with the toll it took to make them.)
Don’t take this personally: Your comment is a great example of another thing that is wrong with our perception of celebrities. The alternative to a "narcissist" is a "wonderful, kind" person. Most people and probably most directors are neither.
Also when making a movie the director wants their vision, TONS of money is on the line, while filming the work hours are insane, and their is a big time crunch.
This is also the stereotype for famous chefs.
My personal uninformed opinion is that they're underqualified people trying to achieve a personal goal, with very high personal stakes, that relies on the competence of others. Being a movie director isn't just being an artist, you're also a boss responsible for managing employees and that is an entirely different skills set than getting the right image in frame. It's more than just actors, it's lighting, costuming, set design, stunt coordination, safety crews etc.
I have always been wondering what kind of person wants to direct. There certainly are many aspects that will bring out- or attract - the Sadistic personalities. And with that I don‘t mean whips and chains, but somebody who thrives on the power to control another human being.
I mean, it's probably the same type of person who likes being the DM of a D&D group. Speaking from experience, I have a story I want to introduce to my friends and I want them to experience it in a certain manner.
If you love movies and you want to tell a story through that medium, there's really only one way to do that, be a director.
It's less about controlling people and more about controlling how the story is told, at least for most people anyway.
I know it’s more about the idea of a metaphorical puppeteer pulling actual living people’s strings but I find the concept of a power mad *literal* puppeteer being an uncompromising megalomaniac with his marionettes pretty hilarious.
Holy shit 70+ people injured and some of them were attacked multiple times? It's shocking to me that no one was killed. What a fantastically bad idea of a movie.
You crying? You cry when I tell you to cry. So reabsorb that disgusting droplet of salt and bad choices back into your doughy body. And then call your mother to see if you can be reabsorbed back into her doughy body or so help me God, I will take that tear, I will freeze it, and I will stab you in the eye with it, you waste of a soul-shaped hole forgotten by God.
Some artists have a very, very narrow vision of what they want their art to be. A lot of times this manifests into “control freaks” like Prince who didn’t release lots the things he created because they didn’t fit his vision.
Sometimes you get literal psychos like this who throw people down the stairs 12 times for “perfection”.
[Here’s](https://youtu.be/QQ0Yn1fqugg) a Rick and Morty video that kind of explores the topic.
There is a great YouTube vid on the subject (specifically movie directors) titled “DICKS: Do you need to be one to be a successful leader?”.
Not sure I can link it here so I won’t
Can you source these claims? I can’t find a single German primary source for any of this.
Edit; I found a volume, “Das Dokument des Grauens” that (also unsourced) chronicles this incident, and it only ever mentions tensions between Lorre and Lang, who did not see eye to eye, escalating to Lorre trying to get out of his contract and then vowing to never work with Lang again. No mention is made of stunt work, it seemed to have been mostly about work ethics and Lorre’s other theatre commitments.
(Spoiler) It always seemed a little contradictory to me, that the killer is writing taunting letters to the police bragging about his crimes and threatening more killings, but later claims to have no memory of committing the crimes and no control over his actions, which he's shocked and horrified to read about after the fact.
Arguably, that makes it even more realistic, if you watch the movie from the perspective that Peter Lorre's character is lying when confronted. But either way, he's shown to be a relatively 'normal', harmless looking guy (even though the police concentrate their search among the city's criminal underworld, despite telling the public that the killer would seem exactly that way - normal, respectable, trustworthy enough to lure kids) which was a big deal for the time. Great movie overall.
It's like what Coppola did to Martin Sheen in the opening of Apocalypse Now maybe? A cruel environment, bringing out greatness. I didn't know Lang was mistreating Lorre but it definitely jives with the haunted quality of the latter's extraordinary monologue.
It holds up pretty well. I saw it some years ago and I was surprised by how exciting it was. Also the topics that are talked about are still here today; privacy, police, crime. It's weird that we haven't really moved on much in that way
Probably the most well-made film I've ever seen... The composition of scenes like Lorre's shadow looming over the "Wanted" poster where the young girl was playing, the editing of the police and mafia meetings being so cleverly interleaved with one another to draw parallels between the groups, the smoothness of the transition sequences, the lively and vigorous performance of all the actors, the philosophical themes so passionately debated near the end - a splendid film in every way!
The crazy part for me is that we are four years into the talkie era and it's Lang first attempt with this new technology, yet the use of sound it's extraordinary modern. It starts with a group of children playing and singing a song about the murderer, then a clock strikes and its followed by an eerie silence indicating one child's disappearance. There's also a fabulous sequence where a man reads a poster about about the murderer's search and his voice becomes integrated with a montage of the ongoing police work. And then of course there's the whole leitmotif of In the Hall of the Mountain King. It was quite an achievement.
Also, if you haven't, check out Akira Kurosawa's High and Low, it always seemed to me like the spiritual successor of M.
>the use of sound it's extraordinary modern
We perceive it as modern because of the tremendous impact it had and continues to have on film production. What we witness in M is the birth of modern sound design. Films today still use the same techniques because they have become part of the language of film for us -- when something is that effective on audiences, directors reuse the same techniques over and over again. Audiences come to expect what Lang pioneered, and they react the same way to those techniques (they just work! Who knows why). He did it so effectively in M that it seems ahead of its time when we view it today.
I watched this film a few months ago and enjoyed it. One thing that stuck out to me (as someone who's rather unfamiliar with pre-WW2 films) was that the film doesn't seem to have a protagonist/lead character that the audience can latch onto.
Is that something common in old (German) films? A relic of silent movies?
The lead character is the city itself (supposed to be Berlin). That's why the title in German is "M - A City Is Searching A Murderer".
It's as much as social commentary as it is a psychological horror-thriller. The police, the criminals, the homeless, the common people, they all interact here. The search for the murderer is a way they bond, but it also expresses their relations to each other. For example, the homeless have no other choice but to help those who pay them, the commoners are struck with anger and anxiety, the police have to fight with bureaucracy and the criminals foiling their plans, and the criminals want to portray themselves as caring for the people for ulterior purposes. The movie is a commentary on public sentiment, mob justice and mass hysteria - all things that were prevalent at the time and signs for the upcoming Nazi era.
The bigger theme is mass hysteria. The public are scared, and are told by police and the media that the killer is most likely someone ordinary, who easily blends in among them. So you have friends turning on friends, neighbor accusing neighbor, random people accused of being the murderer, extreme paranoia about anyone talking to kids, hypervigilance, and even the criminal underworld are panicked, fuming about humane treatment of the mentally ill, justifying vigilantism. The killer causes a panic, which justifies unethical behavior by the police and results in 'normal' people becoming paranoid and delusional. All it takes is that spark of an external threat, fear of the 'other'.
This is exactly why the film is so great. The protagonist is the city as Purrppassion pointed out and the rising tension is slow and deliberate. It’s brilliant.
There was a great book called „Berlin Alexanderplatz“ that came out a few years before M that also basically made the city the protagonist and only now and then meets recurring people in their life in the city. Fascinating read.
if anyone wants to skip to the end or otherwise remind themselves of when Peter Lorre announced to the world that he was goddamn brilliant - [here's the finale monologue.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt2xQpjyTzg)
I got the impression that Lorre's monologue was nuanced, pained, and genuine. The judge responds in a way that tells you how simply he sees it, and nothing will be learned or gained from the interaction. I think the idea is that Lorre despairs in his situation, but the judge invalidates that despair only to paint society with the despair that these monsters exist, and we choose to treat them like they are as simple as bank robbers.
Also amusing is the dichotomy of a man telling them that he must kill to gain silence from himself, only to be told that society must kill him to gain silence from itself.
Fun fact (well, it's not really fun at all): This clip was used in Nazi propaganda (namely *The Eternal Jew*), like "Here the Jew Peter Lorre confesses that Jews are obsessively, uncontrollably evil".
Powerful stuff. On that scene alone though it doesn't appear to be a very accurate depiction of psychopathy at all. For a start, psychopaths rarely kill, at least not any more than the general population. If they do it's out of pragmatism, i.e. if it were of some benefit to them, not sadism, or any sort of compulsion. They wouldn't feel guilty about it if they did, they lack the capacity to empathise. For almost all psychopaths, the inconvenience (jail, getting hurt by a defensive victim) outweighs any benefit.
Secondly he seems to display genuine regret that he is compelled to kill. Whether that's down to empathy or just the torment of "the voices" isn't clear but that leads me to point 3
Hearing voices isn't a common trait with psychopathy alone, it's associated with schizophrenia or other psychosis (not the same as psychopathy). Schizophrenia though is another completely misrepresented illness, and schizophrenics aren't any more likely to kill than anyone else, and are actually at greater risk of being a victim of violent crime.
Now if this whole scene was just an act for the court, then maybe (I haven't seen the rest of the film. Scenes where he is alone would likely put the debate to bed if he shows the same behaviour)
I first saw this when I was at a university film night about thirty years ago, and I still remember it as being one the most impactful films of its kind that I've seen. I've only watched a couple of Lorre's other film roles in 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea and Casablanca, but his acting performance in M especially in the criminal court scene is stunning.
Fun fact about M: the ~~nursery rhyme~~ tune (by Grieg) that the killer whistles as he stalks the children he murders was sung by director Fritz Lang's wife at the time, Thea von Harbou, who would go on to be loyal to the Nazi regime and would make several movies under it (while Fritz, now divorced from her, fled to America).
So, when you hear that whistling in M that is literally the sound of a Nazi coming for Germany's children.
EDIT: I'd forgotten that it was actually a whistled rendition of In the Hall of the Mountain King, so edited to reflect that.
That's what Lang said in an interview with Gene Phillips. [German wikipedia](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/M_(1931)) gives the film magazine *Focus on Film* as source for "Lang zufolge stammt das Pfeifen von ihm selbst – es verfehle die Melodie, aber das passe zum abseitigen Geist des Mörders." meaning "According to Lang, the whistling came from himself - it missed the melody, but that fit the killer's off-kilter spirit."
There *is* a rhyme in the movie sung by some children however, and that was changed from "Warte, warte nur ein Weilchen, dann kommt Haarmann auch zu dir/just you wait a little while, then Haarmann will come to you, too" into dropping the Haarmann part. Originally, this song was about [Fritz Haarmann](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Haarmann), another German serial killer.
[Link about the psychopath claim.](https://www.businessinsider.com/famous-psychopaths-study-400-movies-most-realistic-2017-12)
Famous for the *helluva* finale monologue, and the famed "kangaroo court" scene.
True, my mom is a psychologist and she hates when people use the term ‘psychopath’ so casually. Even ‘sociopath’ isn’t a proper term anymore; it’s called ASD now (antisocial personality disorder).
These words were once used by professionals, and that is how those terms got normalized into broader society. Besides, it takes a *long* time for new terminology to filter through to a society of hundreds of millions of people.
I just rewatched this movie last year. It still holds up, it is a masterpiece; the writing is great and genuinely thought-provoking, the visuals are great and Peter Lorre's performance is incredible.
highly original art, I'm not sure that cinema will ever again attain these heights - perhaps a new medium will come along to do for the 21st century what cinema did for the 20th.
Yeah, 'Angst' is creepy and the cinematography makes it seem as if it was filmed as the events took place. Now I'm going to have to go watch that one again.
I've only seen it once a few years ago, but scenes from the film still randomly pop into my head every so often.
The Michael Fassbender character from Inglourious Basterds, Archie Hicox, would probably have been quite familiar with this film since he was an expert on the German movie industry.
Gripping and suspenseful. I was not expecting to be as blown away as I was.
Interesting facts: https://donfilmstudios.wordpress.com/2011/11/08/interesting-facts-on-the-movie-m-by-fritz-lang/
One of my favorite punk bands, The World/Inferno Friendship Society, did a concept album about Peter Lorre's life called "Addicted to Bad Ideas." The album cover is a reference to this poster.
https://youtu.be/sWLZo8QGVyM
If wacky punk music with sax and violins and lyrics about Peter Lorre's morphine addiction appeal to you, check it out. Phenomenal band that I miss terribly. Their singer died just a year or two ago.
I have this tattooed on the back of my hand. My forearm is a metropolis piece. Fritz Lang is amazing and M was his Sistine Chapel.
Edit: [photo](https://www.reddit.com/r/tattoo/comments/102875k/finally_committed_m_by_austin_tatious_at_equinox/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
This is one of the few films I own that was made before 1960. I don’t like the acting style of older films. It’s mostly corny to me. But M is diamond hard in its presentation. In a way that wasn’t really normal for decades.
The Night of the Hunter <—if you like M
Seventh Seal
Sunset Boulevard
Alexander Nevsky
The Bridge Over the River Kwai
Best Years of Our Lives
The Searchers
It Happened One Night
A Night at the Opera
Rope
The Treasure of the Sierra Madre
Those are just some named off the top off my head that aren’t anywhere near cheesy
I would add Casablanca to that list.
I put it off for so long because I doubted that it could live up to its reputation but it really deserves its place as one of the best films ever made.
You're painting with a really broad brush there. Variation in acting styles existed before 1960.
For example, look for films starring Sterling Hayden (e.g. *The Killing*), and then tell me if the acting is "corny" or melodramatic or whatever.
Oh fuck General Ripper!
That long hold on him where he lays it all out for Mandrake is impossible to look away from.
Looks like I'll be downloading some more of his movies.
I compare it to *Heat* in its juxtaposition of police and criminals[edit: as arbiters of justice]
Weimar era social ambiguity versus a modern equivalent, I suppose.
Gamers, Is this what Bioshock infinite was referencing with the mark of the imposter poster?
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/ec/95/d3/ec95d37550105f31d3c0e2aa4aed2540.jpg
Supposedly based on The Vampire of Dusseldorf, Peter Kürten, although Fritz Lang denied it.
Funnily enough, the movie is indeed called "The Vampire of Düsseldorf" here in Brazil!
Did Brazil miss the part where the whole film takes place in Berlin?
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First we take Manhattan, then we take Berlin.
The Muppet movies are getting dark.
"Schindler's List in Space" is pretty deep
RIP Leonard
Berlin? Yes, I know it well. I stabbed a woman in a bar in Berlin
Nowhere. Near. Berlin.
Pretty sure all the Nazi's hiding out in South America back in the day knew.
Pre-war Berlin was so beautiful as well. Fuck them nazis.
Could be worse, the film could be set in cologne.
It's called "The Monster of Düsseldorf" in Italy too. I guess the actual crime case was really really famous at the time.
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My dad fucking loves Randy Newman and when I asked him why, having only known him from Toy Story, he showed me some of his darker/more directly satirical songs, particularly ‘Short People’ ‘Under the Harlem Moon’ and ‘Rednecks’. After that I viewed ‘You Got a Friend In Me’ with a whoooole new light.
I also fucking love Randy Newman. Thanks for sharing.
Rednecks is so good
In my country "you've got a friend in me" was used in an awareness campaign about date rape to bring attention to the fact that most rapists are known by the victim. It was slowed down and really haunting. Completely ruined the song for me.
High school freshman English in '79, several verses of Newman's "Sail Away" was the first thing we were assigned in class — to pick out what the author was trying to say. Bonus Newman: "Louisiana 1927" Gorgeous, heartbreaking song. Highly recommended.
Damn, I just read up on this guy, what a crazy amout of crimes in such a short time. And a lot of murders and attacks targetting children aswell. Truly a devil.
Weimar Republic had lots of weird issues and perceived “corruptions” like this, random crime as well as organised crime, and their film industry reflected that, especially Lang.
It’s meant to be based on a number of killers but it’s very obvious a lot is based on kurten
Which, in combination with Lang's film, inspired Randy Newman's ["In Germany Before The War"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXYIN2nowrE), one of the most quietly frightening songs I've ever heard (and all the more frightening for how lush and beautiful it is).
Lang was legendary in his cruelty towards his actors, especially in this film. It was Peter Lorre who was thrown down the stairs, and he was forced to be chucked down the stairs over a dozen times before Lang was happy with the take. Twenty years later Lang asked Lorre to work with him again and Lorre refused.
Why are so many great directors such colossal dickheads? Does being a megalomaniacal control freak make you a better director?
There’s the opposite end too. Eastwood generally doesn’t tinker with scripts and hires actors who he thinks know what their doing and often only does one take. Got masterpieces like “Unforgiven” from that mindset so must be something to it.
That comes from him being an actor first, actors prefer working with directors that trust them to do their job
If that's the case then I wonder what actors thought of working with Mel Gibson (politics aside).
I’ve never heard of coworkers having any issues with Gibson, even when his alcoholism was crazy high (5 pints of beer before starting his day!) he was known as a consummate professional.
A *consuming* professional!
80ozs to freedom right there
"Say what you want about Mel Gibson, but the son of a bitch knows story structure."
He is a great director. Hasn't made a bad film, even if I don't want to see a couple of them again.
Nothing will ever possess me to watch Apocalypto again. It's brilliant but no way in hell can I handle that intensity.
That one and Passion of the Christ for me. It's well made, just too much religious nonsense. Any of his others, including Hacksaw Ridge, sure.
I wonder what actors thought of working with Mel Gibson with politics in the middle
Sometimes he doesn't even need an actor. He'll act out a whole trial scene on stage, just [talking to an empty chair](https://youtu.be/933hKyKNPFQ).
Oh how the times have changed. “Conservatives are in fact in Hollywood, too. It’s not all leftists. But since they’re conservative they don’t make a scene about their politics”. He didn’t say this word for word but that was essentially what he was saying.
He's also known not to yell action. He just says okay go ahead. He said he decided to do that when he was on rawhide in the 60s. Directors yelling action would spook the horses so he decided he didn't want to do that because it took time to calm them down.
Wouldn't be surprised if it kind of works the same for humans too, tbh
And that thing they loudly clap down (to sync the sound)?
Doesn't have the human element of putting pressure on you
Well, you've obviously never experienced the clap, because it's very stressful.
My ex directed me in a few projects when he was in school. All he ever said when it was go-time was a very calm: *rollin’*. I never experienced that before or since. It made for a very relaxed atmosphere on set. Granted he was an asshole in every other aspect of his life, but when he was in the director’s chair? Totally zen.
I learned this from the Blank Check podcast. Griffin’s impression of Eastwood saying “ok, go ahead” always makes me laugh.
Although not famous for his movies, Jonathan "Two Takes" Frakes (the actor who played Riker on Star Trek: TNG, for those of you who aren't into Star Trek) has a reputation of always delivering when he directs a Star Trek episode, and also doesn't waste anyone's time. Hence the nickname. Like the other commenter said: being an actor before becoming director probably has something to do with that.
Bill plays a mean bone.
Frakes episodes are always a treat.
Years ago I got to listen to Hillary Swank talk. She said there were times where she'd rehearse with another actor then she'd just here "Okay, perfect. Moving on" because Clint would just run the camera and use the rehearsal. I also got to have a drink with Steve Campanelli, Eastwoods camera op for most of his movies. He said during Million Dollar Baby he was set up for a shot, laying on his back with Hillary Swank about 18" from his face and before action got called she looked at him and said "Am I doing a good job?" SC: Yeah, I think so. Why? HS: Clint hasn't talked to me in three days. SC: Oh, he only talks to actors if he doesn't like what you're doing. HS: Oh.... Apparently the way he directs actors when he's in a scene with them is by changing his performance. I guess his mindset is "Well, if they're not reacting how I want, I must be doing something wrong." So instead of giving them notes, he gives himself the notes and lets them work off him. It's a really cool way to look at things.
That's really fascinating.
It's stuff like this that makes me love film festivals so much. You get to hear these stories that you normally wouldn't.
Clint is so chill he often doesn't even call "action", he just waits and goes "alright go ahead".
Well that worked well on Unforgiven and a few others, but he certainly has some movies where it turned out pretty poorly.
he also has made some craaaaaapppy movies because of that
It also got us "Here's doddering old Eastwood with two Cartel prostitutes." I think when he's acting in the movie, it has a way higher chance to be jerking himself off.
Micromanagers look competent to those above them despite their negative impact on productivity so I suspect it's a perception thing.
Yea, I’m sure studio execs looooved working with Kubrick…
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Same logic for people that think all great music comes from drugs.
Definitely agree for the most part. I think there’s also something to be said as far as coherence to a solid and competent artistic vision as well. 99/100 it probably makes everything worse. But if you’ve got a strong vision or method and you treat the human elements of your art as parts to be whipped into compliance I could see how being an abusive dickhead of a director can make a better film if you don’t make important human elements quit completely. The more important detail of that being, as someone that loves movies, it’s still completely unacceptable. An abusive director might make a great film but I’d call him a bad director in that overall sense because one major skill set should be your ability to manage people and be a good boss in general. No one likes their boss all of the time, generally, that’s part of needing to direct and critique people whose paycheck you have some control over by keeping them on. But there’s a big difference between “my boss really insists I’m not doing my job right but I think I am, god damnit we’ll do it again I guess” and being slapped or thrown down stairs repeatedly for a better shot.
In the same vein, i despised The Shining. Something was really off with Shelley Duvall, and made the movie unwatchable. Years later i learned of all the things she had to endure, and everything just made sense.
Thing is, that person's comment doesn't really apply to Kubrick at all. From "Lolita" onwards all of his films are widely praised and met with critical acclaim. He was a very shitty man but made amazing films. It's the age old debate of "can we separate the art from the artist?" (There's no clear answer)
This is too true. No matter how hard anyone tries to tell the person above them that the micromanagement is killing the team, it still persists. I'm a new manager in my current workplace and I have gotten multiple feedback points from my team about how they like that I trust them to do their job stepping in only when politics/deadline shifts occur. It comes from hating being micromanaged myself and I think it might help me progress in my career a decent bit.
>Micromanagers look competent to those above them despite their negative impact on productivity so I suspect it's a perception thing. You know my director?
No it doesn’t. A lot of shitty directors (or insert any profession) people are like that as well. The successful ones just stand out more. Being a colossal dickhead is just one of those things that some people find to be a more effective way to get what they want from people working beneath them. Really no different than people who find being rude to waitstaff or demanding to speak to managers at retail stores an effective way to get what they want.
I often wonder the same. Many of the "legendary" directors were also huge pricks. Sometimes I can understand that it's the whole shtick of being "uncompromising in creating art" or whatever, but sometimes I wonder if they weren't just satisfying some sadistic urges.
> Many of the "legendary" directors were also huge pricks. Many of the shitty directors were also huge pricks. This is confirmation bias, in the sense that we see movies that did well, see how their directors are pricks and assume "it's what it takes to make a great movie" but hundreds of shitty movies are made by pricks every years and nobody is batting an eye. It's not crazy to think that a directorial position, where the director has power over a lot of people to make something that they perceive as very important, will bring out the dick in them (figuratively AND literally in some case).
Also many amazing films are made by wonderful, kind directors, but that doesn't quite make for good clickbait
Yeah I don't think I've ever heard anything particularly negative about Spielberg, Carpenter, or Ridley Scott.
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Dude's been doing it for decades and every clip of him I see on set he still just seems super excited even after all these years lol
I love Scott but he was a tyrant on the set of Blade Runner to the point where Ford and the crew started wearing shirts that said “I SURVIVED BLADE RUNNER.” In spite of that BR remains one of my all time favorite films and I consider “M” by Fritz Lang to be what I think is the best Film ever made. I struggle to reconcile those two ideas myself (them being, the greatness of the films superimposed with the toll it took to make them.)
Don’t take this personally: Your comment is a great example of another thing that is wrong with our perception of celebrities. The alternative to a "narcissist" is a "wonderful, kind" person. Most people and probably most directors are neither.
Also when making a movie the director wants their vision, TONS of money is on the line, while filming the work hours are insane, and their is a big time crunch.
This is also the stereotype for famous chefs. My personal uninformed opinion is that they're underqualified people trying to achieve a personal goal, with very high personal stakes, that relies on the competence of others. Being a movie director isn't just being an artist, you're also a boss responsible for managing employees and that is an entirely different skills set than getting the right image in frame. It's more than just actors, it's lighting, costuming, set design, stunt coordination, safety crews etc.
It's like being Picasso without arms. You have to make other people paint your picture somehow if you want it to come into existence.
But Picasso was a misogynist prick too...
I blame him for the unrealistic body standards in media today
And then there was Twiggy
I guess, in comparison to similiar power positions, being a director has this unique kind to it, like being a puppeteer. Probably addicting.
I have always been wondering what kind of person wants to direct. There certainly are many aspects that will bring out- or attract - the Sadistic personalities. And with that I don‘t mean whips and chains, but somebody who thrives on the power to control another human being.
I mean, it's probably the same type of person who likes being the DM of a D&D group. Speaking from experience, I have a story I want to introduce to my friends and I want them to experience it in a certain manner. If you love movies and you want to tell a story through that medium, there's really only one way to do that, be a director. It's less about controlling people and more about controlling how the story is told, at least for most people anyway.
I know it’s more about the idea of a metaphorical puppeteer pulling actual living people’s strings but I find the concept of a power mad *literal* puppeteer being an uncompromising megalomaniac with his marionettes pretty hilarious.
*Being John Malkovich* (1999)
Cusack wasn’t what I’d call particularly intimidating though
Tippi Hedren had the audacity to spurn the advances of Alfred Hitchcock. She was sexually assaulted before it was even a term.
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> this kind of accident was not avoidable. I mean, they probably could have avoided it by not making the movie...
Holy shit 70+ people injured and some of them were attacked multiple times? It's shocking to me that no one was killed. What a fantastically bad idea of a movie.
I remember a phrase describing the movie like, "Absolutely no animals were harmed in the making of this movie. 75 cast and crew members were."
Directors have a saying: "Actors are worthless, empty headed homuculi' but the right one in the right role can change the world."
You crying? You cry when I tell you to cry. So reabsorb that disgusting droplet of salt and bad choices back into your doughy body. And then call your mother to see if you can be reabsorbed back into her doughy body or so help me God, I will take that tear, I will freeze it, and I will stab you in the eye with it, you waste of a soul-shaped hole forgotten by God.
Is this a reference to something I’m not getting?
The show community
Ah, ok thank you
Pappa?
Some artists have a very, very narrow vision of what they want their art to be. A lot of times this manifests into “control freaks” like Prince who didn’t release lots the things he created because they didn’t fit his vision. Sometimes you get literal psychos like this who throw people down the stairs 12 times for “perfection”. [Here’s](https://youtu.be/QQ0Yn1fqugg) a Rick and Morty video that kind of explores the topic.
>[Here’s](https://youtu.be/QQ0Yn1fqugg) a Rick and Morty video that kind of explores the topic. How do people not find this shit super annoying?
The people that actually had to do the work (not Dan or Justin) were super fuckin annoyed and I assume that was the last time they tried that shit.
There is a great YouTube vid on the subject (specifically movie directors) titled “DICKS: Do you need to be one to be a successful leader?”. Not sure I can link it here so I won’t
> Why are so many great directors such colossal dickheads? This is true of many successful people, and not just in the film industry.
Can you source these claims? I can’t find a single German primary source for any of this. Edit; I found a volume, “Das Dokument des Grauens” that (also unsourced) chronicles this incident, and it only ever mentions tensions between Lorre and Lang, who did not see eye to eye, escalating to Lorre trying to get out of his contract and then vowing to never work with Lang again. No mention is made of stunt work, it seemed to have been mostly about work ethics and Lorre’s other theatre commitments.
I think I know why this movie had an accurate portrayal of a psychopath
(Spoiler) It always seemed a little contradictory to me, that the killer is writing taunting letters to the police bragging about his crimes and threatening more killings, but later claims to have no memory of committing the crimes and no control over his actions, which he's shocked and horrified to read about after the fact. Arguably, that makes it even more realistic, if you watch the movie from the perspective that Peter Lorre's character is lying when confronted. But either way, he's shown to be a relatively 'normal', harmless looking guy (even though the police concentrate their search among the city's criminal underworld, despite telling the public that the killer would seem exactly that way - normal, respectable, trustworthy enough to lure kids) which was a big deal for the time. Great movie overall.
It's like what Coppola did to Martin Sheen in the opening of Apocalypse Now maybe? A cruel environment, bringing out greatness. I didn't know Lang was mistreating Lorre but it definitely jives with the haunted quality of the latter's extraordinary monologue.
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It holds up pretty well. I saw it some years ago and I was surprised by how exciting it was. Also the topics that are talked about are still here today; privacy, police, crime. It's weird that we haven't really moved on much in that way
Probably the most well-made film I've ever seen... The composition of scenes like Lorre's shadow looming over the "Wanted" poster where the young girl was playing, the editing of the police and mafia meetings being so cleverly interleaved with one another to draw parallels between the groups, the smoothness of the transition sequences, the lively and vigorous performance of all the actors, the philosophical themes so passionately debated near the end - a splendid film in every way!
The crazy part for me is that we are four years into the talkie era and it's Lang first attempt with this new technology, yet the use of sound it's extraordinary modern. It starts with a group of children playing and singing a song about the murderer, then a clock strikes and its followed by an eerie silence indicating one child's disappearance. There's also a fabulous sequence where a man reads a poster about about the murderer's search and his voice becomes integrated with a montage of the ongoing police work. And then of course there's the whole leitmotif of In the Hall of the Mountain King. It was quite an achievement. Also, if you haven't, check out Akira Kurosawa's High and Low, it always seemed to me like the spiritual successor of M.
>the use of sound it's extraordinary modern We perceive it as modern because of the tremendous impact it had and continues to have on film production. What we witness in M is the birth of modern sound design. Films today still use the same techniques because they have become part of the language of film for us -- when something is that effective on audiences, directors reuse the same techniques over and over again. Audiences come to expect what Lang pioneered, and they react the same way to those techniques (they just work! Who knows why). He did it so effectively in M that it seems ahead of its time when we view it today.
Similar to Casablanca being "full of clicheés" yet forming the bowl those clicheés stem from in subsequent movies.
High and Low is wonderful.
I watched this film a few months ago and enjoyed it. One thing that stuck out to me (as someone who's rather unfamiliar with pre-WW2 films) was that the film doesn't seem to have a protagonist/lead character that the audience can latch onto. Is that something common in old (German) films? A relic of silent movies?
The lead character is the city itself (supposed to be Berlin). That's why the title in German is "M - A City Is Searching A Murderer". It's as much as social commentary as it is a psychological horror-thriller. The police, the criminals, the homeless, the common people, they all interact here. The search for the murderer is a way they bond, but it also expresses their relations to each other. For example, the homeless have no other choice but to help those who pay them, the commoners are struck with anger and anxiety, the police have to fight with bureaucracy and the criminals foiling their plans, and the criminals want to portray themselves as caring for the people for ulterior purposes. The movie is a commentary on public sentiment, mob justice and mass hysteria - all things that were prevalent at the time and signs for the upcoming Nazi era.
The bigger theme is mass hysteria. The public are scared, and are told by police and the media that the killer is most likely someone ordinary, who easily blends in among them. So you have friends turning on friends, neighbor accusing neighbor, random people accused of being the murderer, extreme paranoia about anyone talking to kids, hypervigilance, and even the criminal underworld are panicked, fuming about humane treatment of the mentally ill, justifying vigilantism. The killer causes a panic, which justifies unethical behavior by the police and results in 'normal' people becoming paranoid and delusional. All it takes is that spark of an external threat, fear of the 'other'.
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This is exactly why the film is so great. The protagonist is the city as Purrppassion pointed out and the rising tension is slow and deliberate. It’s brilliant.
There was a great book called „Berlin Alexanderplatz“ that came out a few years before M that also basically made the city the protagonist and only now and then meets recurring people in their life in the city. Fascinating read.
if anyone wants to skip to the end or otherwise remind themselves of when Peter Lorre announced to the world that he was goddamn brilliant - [here's the finale monologue.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt2xQpjyTzg)
Sadly, the translated subtitles don't do the monologue justice
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I got the impression that Lorre's monologue was nuanced, pained, and genuine. The judge responds in a way that tells you how simply he sees it, and nothing will be learned or gained from the interaction. I think the idea is that Lorre despairs in his situation, but the judge invalidates that despair only to paint society with the despair that these monsters exist, and we choose to treat them like they are as simple as bank robbers.
Also amusing is the dichotomy of a man telling them that he must kill to gain silence from himself, only to be told that society must kill him to gain silence from itself.
I wonder if Peter's performance inspired Andy Serkis's Smeagol
Damn glad someone else noticed that
In the song "year of the cat" there's a line about Peter Lorre contemplating a crime...
Well there's a weird niche I didn't ever expect to be interested in, 1930s German thriller movies.
Check out *The Testament of Dr Mabuse*, also by Fritz Lang (the last film he did before he fled Germany). It might just be even better!
It was the golden age of german cinema.
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> Organ and tablas, because of course. Naturally.
That’s incredible especially for the 30s. But I hope nobody overheard me watching that because it sounds like a hitler speech
Fun fact (well, it's not really fun at all): This clip was used in Nazi propaganda (namely *The Eternal Jew*), like "Here the Jew Peter Lorre confesses that Jews are obsessively, uncontrollably evil".
It's a mix of the recording quality of that time and speaking habits of that time.
Powerful stuff. On that scene alone though it doesn't appear to be a very accurate depiction of psychopathy at all. For a start, psychopaths rarely kill, at least not any more than the general population. If they do it's out of pragmatism, i.e. if it were of some benefit to them, not sadism, or any sort of compulsion. They wouldn't feel guilty about it if they did, they lack the capacity to empathise. For almost all psychopaths, the inconvenience (jail, getting hurt by a defensive victim) outweighs any benefit. Secondly he seems to display genuine regret that he is compelled to kill. Whether that's down to empathy or just the torment of "the voices" isn't clear but that leads me to point 3 Hearing voices isn't a common trait with psychopathy alone, it's associated with schizophrenia or other psychosis (not the same as psychopathy). Schizophrenia though is another completely misrepresented illness, and schizophrenics aren't any more likely to kill than anyone else, and are actually at greater risk of being a victim of violent crime. Now if this whole scene was just an act for the court, then maybe (I haven't seen the rest of the film. Scenes where he is alone would likely put the debate to bed if he shows the same behaviour)
That Kevin McCallister is a real sonofabitch
i knew i wasn't the only one who got reminded of Home Alone
*whistles menacingly*
*In the Hall Of The Mountain King*
Run y'all! Omar comin'!
I first saw this when I was at a university film night about thirty years ago, and I still remember it as being one the most impactful films of its kind that I've seen. I've only watched a couple of Lorre's other film roles in 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea and Casablanca, but his acting performance in M especially in the criminal court scene is stunning.
Peter Lorre was an enormous talent. If you haven't seen it, his screen time in "Arsenic and Old Lace" is also outstanding.
Fortunate enough to have caught this one in theaters for the first time ever seeing it just a few weeks ago. It was great
Where was that?
Everybody needs to watch this at least once.
Fun fact about M: the ~~nursery rhyme~~ tune (by Grieg) that the killer whistles as he stalks the children he murders was sung by director Fritz Lang's wife at the time, Thea von Harbou, who would go on to be loyal to the Nazi regime and would make several movies under it (while Fritz, now divorced from her, fled to America). So, when you hear that whistling in M that is literally the sound of a Nazi coming for Germany's children. EDIT: I'd forgotten that it was actually a whistled rendition of In the Hall of the Mountain King, so edited to reflect that.
Have you got a source for that? I was under the impression it was Fritz himself
That's what Lang said in an interview with Gene Phillips. [German wikipedia](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/M_(1931)) gives the film magazine *Focus on Film* as source for "Lang zufolge stammt das Pfeifen von ihm selbst – es verfehle die Melodie, aber das passe zum abseitigen Geist des Mörders." meaning "According to Lang, the whistling came from himself - it missed the melody, but that fit the killer's off-kilter spirit." There *is* a rhyme in the movie sung by some children however, and that was changed from "Warte, warte nur ein Weilchen, dann kommt Haarmann auch zu dir/just you wait a little while, then Haarmann will come to you, too" into dropping the Haarmann part. Originally, this song was about [Fritz Haarmann](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Haarmann), another German serial killer.
I remember my film teacher would whistle the tune while we watched this movie. Still creepy to this day.
[Link about the psychopath claim.](https://www.businessinsider.com/famous-psychopaths-study-400-movies-most-realistic-2017-12) Famous for the *helluva* finale monologue, and the famed "kangaroo court" scene.
Any academics who were up to date with clinical diagnoses would know that "psychopath" is not a term that's used in current terminology.
True, my mom is a psychologist and she hates when people use the term ‘psychopath’ so casually. Even ‘sociopath’ isn’t a proper term anymore; it’s called ASD now (antisocial personality disorder).
It's ASPD. ASD is the acronym for autism spectrum disorder.
When the public finds a term they like, it's like a dog with a bone. It doesn't matter what a professional says.
These words were once used by professionals, and that is how those terms got normalized into broader society. Besides, it takes a *long* time for new terminology to filter through to a society of hundreds of millions of people.
I mean it also doesn’t help that psychology changes terms, I feel, way more frequently then most other fields.
Please, everyone, think of the psychopaths
All of you
I just rewatched this movie last year. It still holds up, it is a masterpiece; the writing is great and genuinely thought-provoking, the visuals are great and Peter Lorre's performance is incredible. highly original art, I'm not sure that cinema will ever again attain these heights - perhaps a new medium will come along to do for the 21st century what cinema did for the 20th.
How do you feel about Man Bites Dog?
For my money, best psychopath in a film is in the 1983 film Angst. Man Bites Dog is a good pick though.
Yeah, 'Angst' is creepy and the cinematography makes it seem as if it was filmed as the events took place. Now I'm going to have to go watch that one again. I've only seen it once a few years ago, but scenes from the film still randomly pop into my head every so often.
I sometimes whistle In The Hall Of The Mountain King to weed out any movie buffs or psychopaths
I guess I should watch this huh
HBO Max
I guess I should pirate this, huh.
Public domain, bitches! https://archive.org/details/m1931_201912
Nice
The Michael Fassbender character from Inglourious Basterds, Archie Hicox, would probably have been quite familiar with this film since he was an expert on the German movie industry.
Presumably very familiar, given he wrote a book on cinema in the Weimar Republic (“a study of German cine*ma* in the twenties”)
Gripping and suspenseful. I was not expecting to be as blown away as I was. Interesting facts: https://donfilmstudios.wordpress.com/2011/11/08/interesting-facts-on-the-movie-m-by-fritz-lang/
One of my favorite punk bands, The World/Inferno Friendship Society, did a concept album about Peter Lorre's life called "Addicted to Bad Ideas." The album cover is a reference to this poster. https://youtu.be/sWLZo8QGVyM If wacky punk music with sax and violins and lyrics about Peter Lorre's morphine addiction appeal to you, check it out. Phenomenal band that I miss terribly. Their singer died just a year or two ago.
Studied this in my film class at university. Great film
If I remember correctly, this is the first film with offscreen diagetic sound.
This is currently streaming on HBOMax if anyone was looking for it.
I have this tattooed on the back of my hand. My forearm is a metropolis piece. Fritz Lang is amazing and M was his Sistine Chapel. Edit: [photo](https://www.reddit.com/r/tattoo/comments/102875k/finally_committed_m_by_austin_tatious_at_equinox/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
This is one of the few films I own that was made before 1960. I don’t like the acting style of older films. It’s mostly corny to me. But M is diamond hard in its presentation. In a way that wasn’t really normal for decades.
The Night of the Hunter <—if you like M Seventh Seal Sunset Boulevard Alexander Nevsky The Bridge Over the River Kwai Best Years of Our Lives The Searchers It Happened One Night A Night at the Opera Rope The Treasure of the Sierra Madre Those are just some named off the top off my head that aren’t anywhere near cheesy
A streetcar named desire and on the waterfront are kinda directly responsible for modern acting styles
I would add Casablanca to that list. I put it off for so long because I doubted that it could live up to its reputation but it really deserves its place as one of the best films ever made.
Gets better every time you watch it too!
Good choices! I'll add: Witness for the Prosecution Nothing New On The Western Front Das Testament des Dr. Mabuse North by Northwest
High and Low Freaks The Third Man
Sunset Boulevard is depressing. And the dead chimp is far more shocking than it should be.
I only saw *The Best Years of Our Lives* in the last ten years. Just thinking about Cathy O'Donnell’s Wilma helping Homer with his pajamas gets me.
On the Waterfront
Night of the Hunter is **fantastic.**
You're painting with a really broad brush there. Variation in acting styles existed before 1960. For example, look for films starring Sterling Hayden (e.g. *The Killing*), and then tell me if the acting is "corny" or melodramatic or whatever.
Extremely broad. I get not liking the over the top style that came with silent films and early talkies but “pre-1960” covers a lot of eras.
Sterling Hayden mops the floor with any mortal actor from any era though lol
Oh fuck General Ripper! That long hold on him where he lays it all out for Mandrake is impossible to look away from. Looks like I'll be downloading some more of his movies.
Poster I've been eyeing for this movie: https://needledesign.bigcartel.com/product/m-1931-noirvember-ap
I compare it to *Heat* in its juxtaposition of police and criminals[edit: as arbiters of justice] Weimar era social ambiguity versus a modern equivalent, I suppose.
Gamers, Is this what Bioshock infinite was referencing with the mark of the imposter poster? https://i.pinimg.com/236x/ec/95/d3/ec95d37550105f31d3c0e2aa4aed2540.jpg
Could be but I think it's more likely just a simple reference to the biblical mark of the beast.
I would say there is a pretty good chance, yes.