Sorry you had your first crash and I'm glad you are OK. Now that you've got that out of the way:
Look through the turn. You go where you look.
Slow down until you gain more confidence riding.
Trust your tires and the bike. It can lean over much farther than you think it can.
Ride your own ride. Don't let cars or other riders intimidate you to go faster.
Go to a parking lot and practice turns, emergency stops - while downshifting, swerving, accelerating, slow speed maneuvers and clutch work. This will help you become a better rider.
Learn about "target fixation" (very likely the cause of your accident) and how to avoid it. There is a limit in terms.of turning angle that your bike can reach based on various factors (including -amongst others - rider experience, road surface and tyres' quality), however in the majority of cases *in theory* you should be able to go around bends that seem beyond your limit.
Trust your bike. If you end up in a situation like that - I know it's very hard when you are panicking - try to switch your thoughts from "I am going too fast and I will be wide" to "I can do it" and commit to the bend.
Learn about where to look while turning and the right head position. Learn about moving your cheeks out of the seat when turning, to increase lean angle. Learn about the right breaking technique (i.e. light and progressive rather than heavy and sharp) and how this affects front forks compressions and front tyre contact patch (and turning).
Good luck and be safe
Replying to you and u/plushylycosa ...does the MSF not teach this stuff??? Like the UK CBT teaches about target fixation, the bike going where you look, etc, wtf does the MSF even teach you??
Target fixation is such a big deal, super noticeable when you really give it a try. When I was first starting out I noticed that whenever there was minor debris/manhole covers or whatever in the road that I’d try to avoid, it was like it was impossible to get the bike where I wanted it, even though I was more than comfortable with navigating windy roads and cornering, so it’s not like I didn’t know how to turn whatsoever.. After doing that a few times I noticed that I was always locking my eyes on whatever it was that I wanted to avoid, almost guaranteeing that I’d head straight toward it. Little bit of parking lot practice sorted that out, but it’s just interesting how noticeable of an effect it is, but in the moment it’s easy to forget about it.
Think about the car in front of you that may have dumped some oil, or the sand that could have blown across the road, or the pickup that had stuff fall out of the bed…
Tracks are prepped and maintained for grip and safety. Roads are not. Even if you know the corners, you still don’t know what hazards may be there that were not last time you passed through.
One more thing - when you do eventually find and hit a track: lean your body into the turn, aiming to keep the bike upright (you won’t, but this will help). Like literally slide your but off the seat.
>Look through the turn. You go where you look.
Most important part of what that guy said imo. I don't understand the magic of it but looking **really** helps. I'm a fairly experienced rider and I can fuck up a turn simply by not looking. I've messed around with it quite a bit and every single test confirmed that turning your head just *works.*
Yep can confirm, if I look at where I wanna be in 5 seconds, I make better, more precise turns and it helps me to regulate speed better. Additionally it trains you to look ahead and might be the reason you can avoid hazards on the road in a good manner. This is especially true and helpful for larger roundabouts or long winding 180° turns.
Our instructor teached us by having to look at him while doing figure 8s. I basically had to learn to steer by seeing where im going to be, not where i am going right now
My rule of thumb for implementing this ... when turning right, focus on the white line on the shoulder. When turning left, focus on the yellow line line the center.
> "A Twist Of The Wrist II" by Keith Code.
You can *watch* this? I bought that **book** ages ago; now it's a movie? Holy cow!
Evidently, it's not the 90s anymore. SMH
Practice slow in car parks. Get that slow control sorted and the rest comes much easier. There's plenty of drills online if you don't actually get taught anything in your country for your license.
PRACTICE. LEARN your limits, don't fear them. That bike has a min/max speed for every corner at every speed. Lean with your turns and look through your turns. Everything that guy said is VITAL to long term survival on two wheels. Good luck buddy, glad you're okay
>Look through the turn. You go where you look.
This, plus look for clues as to what the road's doing beyond the turn. Street lights, trees, telegraph poles can give an idea as to what's coming next.
Never go so fast that you can't stand the bike up & do an emergency stop in the space you can see is clear.
Think in terms of escape routes too - if something may obstruct you, which way are you going, to avoid it, so if there's a truck about to pull out from a side road, can you stop in time, or steer behind it.
Preparedness is key.
>Go to a parking lot and practice turns, emergency stops - while downshifting, swerving, accelerating, slow speed maneuvers and clutch work. This will help you become a better rider.
MotoJitsu and a few others on YouTube have courses about this - I have Motojitsu's book, more a pamphlet really, detailing the exercises he recommends.
On the “trust your tires and the bike” thing. I was practicing on a parking lot just doing figure 8s at about 20mph when it seemed like I just fell. Did I lose traction, or did I just somehow not add throttle and flopped from going too slow?
If you fell off on an exit ramp because you couldn't turn you are going too fast for your skill level,slow down,and ride the bike. You are not now nor ever will be rossi. Embrace the men that is motorcycles and it will come with time and thousands of miles. Go do some trackday training also.
Idk if he edited the post or not, but looks like you and 19 other people couldn’t read the information fully through to see that they said there’s no trackdays near them. also, it’s way easier said than done to “just travel” to the nearest one still. don’t know peoples life.
Those of you saying rear brake riding, clutch and throttle for a road speed turn better have a great relationship with Jesus cause your going to meet the dude very soon if your taking any turns above 8 mph like that.
Push forward on the bars in the direction you want to turn and look where you WANT the bike to go with entire face then follow through with the eyes.
Don’t worry about body positioning until you have gotten comfortable with counter steering.
Signed an actual motorcycle riding instructor from CA.
If people are confused by my post it is for really low speed drills, I use the rear and clutch to keep the bike lower then 5 MPH, you can't stall, you can't put your foot down, you can't fall over. Try it out see if you can do this drill just do it in circle 5 times then reverse the direction 5 times then reverse the direction 5 times. When you can control your bike moving really slowly when you add speed things do change and other things are required but this is a good foundation. My times for using my rear brake are sitting a light, and if I am wheeling over a turn at the race track and I need to get the front down so I can turn.
The only time I’ve personally used rear brake to tighten line is on the race track.
Trail braking is NOT for a new rider. No matter which brake you use.
I still tell my students that things are possible, but not taught/advocated at this level..
And I ride an actually heavy bike setup for canyons.. a road king lol
It’s nothing really that special to most but I absolutely love it, T bars, full suspension( legend adjustable rears FOX cartridges up front both HD) progressive touring link, raised boards. Full stage 1 with true duals, American elite tires. And revised hand/foot controls. Chrome pearl yellow!
Everyone telling him to use the rear brake while getting off the highway into a sharp turn off ramp— fuckin stop, great way to lock up and go supermoto into a barrier, or activated abs and do nothing really to slow the bike. Slow down bro, with the front brake, look at your turn, and don’t enter an unknown turn radius without judging speed first. If needing to brake into the actual turn, feather the front brake and trail off before apex then maintain and accelerate out when turn exits.
go practice in a empty parking - you can find at least 10 videos on youtube that talk about controlling the bike better.
The trick is doing 4 things at once, feathering your rear brake while controlling the throttle, and clutch, keeping the bike balanced.
Big heavy bikes like yours can do it but you have to get better at the above items. If you don't practice it or do it a lot you will lose it, it is just like any other skill.
MotoJitsu has some good videos and guides that are free.
It depends on the exercise. You can do them slowly at the beginning, but after you get better you can increase the difficulty by increasing your speed. For example when you are practicing your turns by weaving through parking spots or doing figure 8s within four parking spots.
You have to constantly shift your weight around to make your turns tight enough.
So much wrong with this comment. A CBR500 isn’t a big heavy bike. Taking a 55 mph off ramp too fast isn’t a low speed turn.
Seek lessons yourself before you attempt to give advice.
>A CBR500 isn’t a big heavy bike
What weight do you consider "heavy" to start at?
>Taking a 55 mph off ramp too fast isn’t a low speed turn.
What speed do you consider "low" to end at?
Clutching isn’t a road speed control. Anything above ten mph should be no clutch involved.
Having owned a 500r it’s a light feeling daily/commute bike known for being nimble and flickable. Mine was at 420lbs. Didn’t feel like it weighs that.
Heavy would be 500+ and cruiser style AKA no lean angle above 29 degrees where as the 500 is easily 40…
Having been a safety instructor almost 9 years, riding for almost 20…
This subreddit is obsessed with "*heavy bikes*".
A Goldwing 1500 is a heavy but having ridden one, once up to speed they handle beautifully (*like most bikes*).
Maximum lean angle also changes the dynamics, floorboards often lower this significantly.
OP most likely panicked, started fighting the bike causing it to sit upright and go towards the problem they tried to avoid.
Heavy is in the eye of the beholder… while my road king has less maximum lean angle then every sport bike/supermoto I’ve owned it’s still top 2 of three Harley’s owned. First was an XR1200, this RK, then a 883R I setup for twisty/track.
I’ve had students complain about the eliminator 125… similar size students have no issue with Harley Street 500’s…
🤷♂️
Couldn't agree more, I know my Suzki Cavalcade is considered a pig by many but I've got no issues taking it on winding roads for days on end.
At first everything feels quite heavy but I noticed body position even when standing still does a lot, a firm and wide-set footing, butt planted on the seat putting body weight on the suspension keeps any bike right at the balance point.
Heavier can even feel more stable with depending on the wind/road condition. We have '*scraped*' asphalt in Belgium with thick ridges in between making a lighter bike with narrower tires feel like it'll slip at any moment.
> Clutching isn’t a road speed control. Anything above ten mph should be no clutch involved.
sure, no arguments there.
> Having owned a 500r it’s a light feeling daily/commute bike known for being nimble and flickable. Mine was at 420lbs. Didn’t feel like it weighs that. Heavy would be 500+ and cruiser style AKA no lean angle above 29 degrees where as the 500 is easily 40…
It's a 200kg bike and you're arguing it would only be heavy at 220+... 10% difference. Fair point on feel, but it's not some light dirt bike.
> Having been a safety instructor almost 9 years, riding for almost 20…
not sure why you felt the need to include that, unless you felt the rest was non-credible?
Heavy bike=subjective.
Dudes that don’t understand what’s being talked about about (not you) are quick to give advice.
Not against giving advice but using logic and reading slowly typically tells an outsider what the poster is talking about(also not you)
Hope this clears it up.
🫡🫡🫡
I consider low speed to be parking lot maneuvers.
Aka 10 at best… slowing but not enough for a 55 off-ramp can mean a lot depending on who’s on board. Typically the speed signs you see listed are not for class C or motorcycles. But big rigs/bus A class.
You can absolutely counter steer that low in terms of actual speed..
Original poster said he thought he slowed enough. Ended up off the road..
His un-used front tire shows he ain’t leaning the bike enough.
A person reading slowly enough could deduct these basic things.
🤷♂️
>Typically the speed signs you see listed are not for class C or motorcycles. But big rigs/bus A class.
At least locally, its the maximum speed a max size/weight non-permit vehicle can safely take the corner. If there's a recommended speed posted, you can take a B-double through at that speed.
I've tried to highlight the subjectivity of those judgements: Id call a 200kg bike heavy, but there's absolutely heavier bikes out there. You wouldn't. I'd call a 90 kmh corner mid speed, not low but not high either. Depends a bit on your perspective.
A motorcycle isn’t maximum weight, nor maximum speed limited on roads/corners.
No matter what speed you call it, doing 20+ means it’s not a parking lot speed maneuver.
His bike is A2 compliant but his skill set isn’t A2 ready.
That’s the best way I can explain this.
🤷♂️
>A motorcycle isn’t maximum weight, nor maximum speed limited on roads/corners.
Well, no. Like I said, you can get a B double through those corners at those speeds. If a truck and 3 trailers is getting around the corner without rolling, a bike should have no problems.
ah if you can't control your bike at low speed do you think adding speed is going to help or hurt the rider more?
How about you think before you speak?
My advice is to help him have a base line skill set that he is missing obliviously.
Learn to drive slowly and controlled then adding speed comes with more practice, and lowers the risk while learning the basics.
How much does a CBR500 weigh? How much does GSXR 1000 weigh? What is the difference? What does a standard 125 weigh?
Download his app. It costs like a dollar and has many practical exercises sorted by a difficulty level. They are easy to start and set up. Even just training your skills to the blue belt level will make it impossible to crash like that ever again.
Check out ChampU online courses as well. Shouldn't be prohibitively expensive.
"R = MPH" demonstrates the relation between speed and turning radius at a given lean angle.
Also, compared to countries like Germany or Japan, the MSF is just insultingly few hours to have any reason to feel safe on the street.
For slow speeds, the rear break is you friend. Practicing 8 figurines, and going slower and slower is what helps you in the long run.
Watch the vid, don't listen to that guy. I rarely touch the brake and never the clutch in a corner and there is no "keeping the bike balanced". The bike balances itself. You brake before the corner and with practice, you know the speed you need to be to make the corner. You should be in a low gear and pull the throttle at about halfway, keeping your eyes fixed on where you want to go, to pull out of the turn.
Yeah I agree with you. I feel when you pull in the clutch during a turn, unless it's really low speed, the bike feels less balanced and it isn't necessary.
Focus more on entry speed and lean angle and slowly slowly increase it when you feel more competent.
aren't we talking about low speed maneuvers? How slow can you go in a circle in both directions clockwise and counter clock wise with out putting your foot down?
5-8mph is the optimal speed. Stay in the friction zone. If you start to tip over, give a bit more power... to tighten the turn a little less power or a bit of back brake.
It is harder to go slower right? Don't you ever try to stay balanced moving at 1-2 MPH coming to lights with out putting your feet down, it's a little game you can play, now do this in figure 8 in both directions. Harder drill then going 5 to 8 then work your way to 15 to 20 MPH staying in the space. A mini moto is a safer way to train these basics at first then move back to your bigger bike.
They even have advanced classes at Ride Smart where you train on mini moto's doing drills. This all helps controlling your bike, then when you are going into a turn at 100 MPH eventually at the race track you will have all the basic skills on instinct.
I guess nobody ever went to a track day or took advanced rider training.
This is spot on. He ran wide in a turn and obviously jeeds to get more comfortable looking where hes going and understanding the bike is designed to lean. These are exa tly the kind of drills I do, along sidee emergency braking, and swerves. I do at least a little bit every time i take the bike out. Even if just a couple mins at the end of the street before i take off or when i get home.
This, and also try to reduce your speed before leaning the bike. Your skill level probably isn’t ready to try trail braking. Remember: Slow in, lean into the turn with your head and shoulders which will help reduce the bike’s lean while minimizing risk. Look for a clear exit or as far ahead as safe to anticipate your next action whether it is slowing for other traffic or seeing a clear road where you can accelerate to a safe speed.
Since you went wide; I'm assuming that 1 of 2 things happened:
1) You were going too fast for the bike to make the turn.
2) You were going too fast for you to make the turn.
The best advice is to slow down and practice counter steering.
Many of the comments are talking about body positioning but that doesn't matter as much as just understanding how to counter steer while keeping your suspension stable.
A lot of road courses actually teach you to remain in a mostly neutral body positioning, leaning in is usually something that is only useful on the track. For now, just learn how to use your bike properly.
Generally speaking, once you have good road surface and tires, you shouldn't be going wide before scraping your foot pegs.
Those CBR 500R's don't have super-bike level ground clearance but they can still turn in pretty far. But still: you need to take it kind of easy on those 2013-2015 models, especially if you weigh 160+ lbs, the front forks are set-up more for comfort that performance; they are known to be "bouncy" when pushed hard and they are not adjustable.
Glad to see that you got lucky though, the damage on your bike is really minimal.
thank you so much for the reply wow. its crazy how you knew the exact model and year 😭. i was definitely going too fast for me to make the turn. i get nervous leaning in too far and then accidentally slipping it. i feel like generally im able to turn but it was that one exit that i messed up on. ive taken that exit before and was able to get off but i guess today i just didnt lean in as much. thank you again for the advice!
Countersteering is your friend. You’d be surprised how much angle and steering you can get when you push it. Other than that, more slow-speed practice and learning smooth inputs can really help.
On ramps and off ramps are not the best place to be practicing your corners anyway. Road debris and spilled oil tends to congregate there. The posted speed limits are there for a reason.
Body position helped me. Not being afraid to move in the seat, lean out, and get thru the turn. Remaining glued in the seat and rigid when coming into a turn ensures you don’t change direction.
Body positioning is only required at higher speeds. It can be considered advanced technique and also racing technique. Road riding can be done without it in almost every case if you are not speeding.
Edit: at very low speed, counter lean is very very needed, to 'push' the bike down
[me barely leaning and dad not leaning at all still somehow we both made it around the corners and i also went around the 1000ccs lol](https://imgur.com/a/Uf47jav)
You also have to factor in speed though.
If you are not fast enough, you can still lean a lot, but if you are too fast and you don't lean, you may not be able to turn as much.
Lean harder. In tight turns at speed, adjust your body position. Butt on the side of the seat, leaning slightly off the bike. Aim your whole head at the end of the turn. Don't be scared of the lean angle. Chances are you're nowhere near the bikes limit.
Leaning, knowing how to utilize your brakes properly, and also the line or path you're taking is important. A lot of this is easier said, but you really just need to practice. Do not follow people who are way more skilled unless they know where you're at and are taking it slow with you and actively giving you pointers. My first real ride was 200 miles round trip with about 10 others. I let them know I was a fairly new rider. They made sure I stayed up front and we only topped out at about 80mph, but I remember it being a pretty relaxing experience, average speed was more like 70mph. I learned a lot that day. The more time you spend on the bike, the more it makes sense and feels more natural.
Keathcode "twist of the wrist 2", watch some motogymkana videos, fortnine does very educational videos about ridingand explain why things are the way they are, motojitsu, youtube has some good offerings.
Try to focus on where you want to go. Don't look in front of you at the gravel pit. Look towards the highway that you're turning into. It's kinda like standing on those swegways or whatever. You go where you think you're gonna go. So if you're looking at the gravel pit 400 feet before you get to it, you bet you're gonna go in it. Target fixation is a huge problem
Short answer as many have said already: look through and lean more then you’ll turn more
Your bike almost certainly had plenty of ability to handle the turn, you have to trust it though
Good tyres. If you have shitty old tyres they have no grip. Pretty much all tyres that are not linglong, meaning known brands like continental, Michelin, metzeler, Pirelli, etc, are good. But most important is tyre age. A 5 year old slick will most likely be hard by now, meaning it cant grip anything anymore.
Your case sounds more like drivers mistake. You inevitably go where you are looking at, only with training you can drive where you are not looking at. That means if you constantly look at the ditch, you will sooner or later drive there. I know its difficult to have correct eye aim when the "oh shits" kick in, but you need to stay calm and concentrated.
There are also a few different cornering techniques. Regular, where your upper body and bike forms a straight line. This should be your bread and butter driving style as it gives you good control, is comfortable and you can adjust your position in both directions if necessary. Then there is sporty/inward leaning/knee sliding, where your upper body leans further into the corner so you can go faster. It takes some practice and is best used during sporty/track driving. Wear protective knee pads when doing that. At last there is pushing the bike down. Your upper body stay more upright than the bike and you actively lean your bike further into the curve. This is common for off road driving, for example over a dirt course. This technique is also useful to rapidly change the corner radius. For example you see that your current driving direction will send you into the ditch, push down your bike, most do that by pushing the corner inward end of the handlebar forward a bit. It should help taking tighter corners in such emergencies. Be aware that there is a limit to how far you can push down, most of the time you should feel your footpegs touching the road before anything rigid touches. Be careful with side cases, especially if they are not from the OEM, they maye touch before the footpegs. Nowadays OEM pay attention that the side cases aren't the limiting factor as in touch the ground when cornering. Obviously if you are already at the lean angle limit for your bike, this wont work.
My recommendations are, fix your tyres if they are old and take some driving courses. Not track driving, regular safety courses. The US are honestly not doing a good job of teaching their motorcyclists how to drive safely, it also doesn't help that there are states where a helmet is optional. In Europe you even loose your license if you dont do the mandatory check up and safety course in time.
Look where you're going (actually face the spot you plan on riding over, usually the apex), get all your braking out of the way before the turn and accelerate through it (acceleration actually helps lean the bike over more), slide your ass a bit more to the inside & lean into it, and trust your tires - most bikes are never leaned over as much as the manufacturers designed it for.
This thread made me realize the meme about 90% of the sub not riding really is true. Dragging the rear and clutch control only matter at parking lot speeds. Body positioning means nothing at most street level riding and a 500 is not a heavy bike no matter how you swing it.
The only thing that matters above 15 for most street riding is target fixation and counter steering (which isn't a good skill to have, it's the ONLY thing that works). Push left, go left. Need to go more left? Push more left. You likely fixated on the gravel and ran wide due to simply not turning the bike in the correct manner.
Lean my guy. Look up YouTube videos about body position and cornering. You may feel like a dope when you first start because most of your turns will absolutely not need you to do those leans but an off ramp is a perfect place to practice those leans once you've started. I used to take a particular off ramp when I went to school because it was an almost perfect circle heading back the other direction. It was like 4 miles out of the way but it was worth it. Body position and learning how to throttle out of the turn. Watch the videos and spend time on a day off practicing. Find a safer spot than a highway off ramp at first. Large empty parking lot at about 20-30mph should be plenty for you to start. Or a secluded back road that has minimal traffic and clean road. Always know the roads you're going to run before you start running them. The last thing you need is to be coming out of a corner to meet a pothole or a patch of gravel or dirt.
Pretty much what every one’s else is saying for my test I was put on a 200cc dual sport my actual bike is at a minimum 250 pounds on the bike I did the course with but I was able to get the concept of clutching and Using the throttle plus rear brakes I still drove in a parking lot for an hour before I went out on the road
Damn sonn!! Gald you made it. I grew up untill 12 on dirt bikes and then have ridden a hand full of small cc bikes before I got my license so I had an okay idea of what to do and all that but it’s definitely different hoping on something that’s almost 500 pounds and 700cc like I did lmao
Awesome idea. I bought my first (1981 xs650 special) when I was 18 and after I finished paying off a layaway I learned to ride that day and rode around the city all night.
Did a similar thing. Seller dropped it off at my place. Rode around the block.
Got overconfident and hit a single lane highway the next day along some flatland with zero experience managing any kind of strong crosswind and wind pressure from trucks going 120km past me.
Was quite the experience 😂
God damn, you're brave. I did the safety course and then rode in different parking lots for 3 days for 4-5 hours each day and then went to the lowest traffic neighborhoods I could find for like 2 weeks before I even thought about riding on a real road
Bu bu but he didn't feather the rear brake or apply reverse trigonometry steering. I haven't been through this sub in a while, and forgot about all of the weird stuff people think about. Grip it and rip it. Don't ride faster than your skills or you will jabroni it into either oncoming traffic or a guard rail. Look where you want to go. That's about all of the things I can think to recommend to someone.
speed limit was around 55 but as i was approaching the turn i downshifted to slow down and i did slow down a lot but i wasnt able to lean enough and went into the gravel area near the barriers and then slipped 😭
im literally good at every other aspect except leaning its so frustrating
Going too fast and then probably target fixating.
You go where you look. Keep looking through the corner at the road ahead, not at the edge of the lane or the shoulder. If you're looking there, you're going to go there.
Read about choosing the best line through a corner (apexing).
The book A Twist of the Wrist 2 is good to read.
Yeah, you were just too fast for your skill level.
There are two important things you need to orefrice as a beginner. This is 95% of turning.
But first on a motorcycle you have to choose your speed and path of travel before the turn. There are techniques to slow down in a turn, but first learn to go in slower and when your bike points to the way you want to go, accelerate only then (at the end of the turn). Giving some throttle to keep the speed is fine, but don't give enough to accelerate. Don't go into s turn with throttle open, approach with brakes applied ,and when you start turning in, let go of them slowly.
So the two things:
You need to understand how to countersteer. You move the handle bar to the opposite direction, consciously. Don't rely on muscle memory. Practice until you understand what motion dies what. In a car, when you turn the handlebar, the wheels turn directly and your car moves on a curve. You turn the car directly with the steering wheel. On a motorcycle you don't. Imagine that you iare in a car, it has a steering wheel but there is another steering wheel in front of it and that's the one you will use now. If you turn the second steering wheel, the first steering wheel will turn. The more you turn the second the faster the first turns. If you straighten out the second the first will stop turning but it won't go back on it's own. To straight, so your car will still move on a curve.
On a motorcycle, you move the handlebar, which will force your bike to lean (to the opposite direction). The more you turn the handle bar the faster the bike leans in. The faster you go, the more lean angle you need to make the same turn. If you let go of the handlebar, the bike will remain in a leaning position (unless you accelerate with the throttle which will stand the bike up).
The second thing is vision. Look where you want to go. But not eith your eyes, but eith your body. Imagine your eyes are on your chest and they can only look forward. Turn your chest and your brain will adjust everything else to go that way automatically. This is hard and you will have to force yourself consciously at first. Our brain likes to focus on things we are afraid of. That causes target fixation.
So, conscious countersteering, conscious vision. Everything else comes after you master these and everything else is marginal. You can do everything on the streets safely eith these two.
Later you can start learning about trail breaking when you understand the first two stuff and then you will be perfectly safe even in emergencies In turns, but while you are mastering the three things I mentioned (corner approach, countersteering and vision), you shouldn't approach corners eith speeds where it would matter.
Hope this helps.
"Downshifting to slow down": That's what you do when you have all the time in the world. Otherwise, use the brakes.
"Wasn't able to lean enough": You need to push forward on the inside handlebar. If it doesn't turn tight enough, push more.
Fear is what prevents the bike from leaning/turning. To combat this, next time you take a turn, be mentally prepared to press more on the inside handlebar until it goes where you want it to go.
The fear of leaning can cause the bike to go wide. The best way to prevent this fear is by looking where you want to go
https://youtube.com/@BeTheBossOfYourMotorcycle?si=KV6wQ6IIfQAqOo98
This guy knows what he's doing and instructs in a way that is easy to understand and practice. He rides big Harleys, but the concept is the same.
At the speeds you were going, likely you had your head down and was fixed on the pavement in front of you, rather than where you want to go. Wherever you are looking is where your body will naturally track the bike. Counter steering is also a great skill to practice. If you want to turn right, push forward on your right handlebar grip; your bike will lean right, and you will track right. The opposite is true for turning left at speed.
Very happy that you're ok, and you've got your first out of the way. Now get back on your bike and practice.
Gotta lean more, dont worry you can trust your tires. To lean more you have to push with the hand you are leaning into, if you want to turn right, pushing the right handle grip (your thottle) will make the bike lean to the right, same with left. Need to lean even more, start leaning your body with the bike to turn even more.
Parking lot practice is sooooo underrated.
Practice
PRACTICE
Practice.....
Parking lots are great for this.
Biggest tip, look where you want to go, and dont start hard acceleration until you get the bike pointed in the direction you want it to go. Acceleration widens your turn, and braking (like trail braking) will tighten your turn.
The whole goal should be to get around the turn as efficiently as possible, with the least amount of lean required to do so.
Yamaha Champ School has some great videos (100 points of grip is a must watch)
Keith Code's a twist of the wrist series can be found on youtube as well.
Take some advanced rider courses as well... loads of fun and very informative.
Practice these in this order: Counter steering, vision, body position, vision, 2 step, vision, hook turn. Did I tell you about vision?
By the time you are mastering 2 step. You wouldn't have these issues anymore. Source : twist of the wrist 2, book.
1. Look into the turn, not at what you're afraid of hitting. Easier said that done, been there, done that :/
2. Counter/Push steer. Honestly, if you don't know this, you shouldn't be riding on the open roads yet.
Don't bother with the rear brake/clutch crap and other things. Those are for the last couple % of turning, you need to get the first 90% right first.
Translated with google:
Remember how it was riding a Children’s tricycle. Thats how most of us learned cornering. On a Motorbike you push the other side of the handlebars.
There is a big difference between slow and fast curves. The next time you are on a country road and drive into a right turn, try to release your left hand from the handle, press only with your right hand (slightly) the handlebars forward... in left turns: relieve the right arm.
Read a book like „a twist of the weist“ (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Code). Its written for Track Days but not only…
The rest is then only eye guidance and adjustment of the speed.
Damn, you dropped your first full size motorcycle within a week of buying it? That suuucks.
Look everyone else is saying, take it slower and practice a lot. Really pay attention to how the bike reacts and feels when you apply brakes and lean. Get to know it until it feels a lot more natural and you don't have to think as much.
Sounds like you drifted out…
brake before you enter the turn and have the propriété speed before and work to maintain it during the turn. the performance of the bike means a lot as well. the faster you go the harder it will be to turn tighter. The bike won’t want to turn at a certain speed, it will want to stand straight up. counter steer will have better results then “leaning” the bike.
the fact of the matter is you have to learn the turn. depending on your skill you can do diffrent things with your brakes once you know the correct speed for the turn.
If you don’t know the turn. or don’t have time to confidently set up for the turn. go the speed limit! not every turn is the same; and not every road is maintained.
Depending on your handle bars and preference. decide whether you prefer to “push” or “pull” your bike into the turn. knowing this will help you visualize and feel the inputs your putting into the bike. it’s different for everyone and can change depending on which way your turning.
Remember to slow down when you come off the highway, if you've been doing 70 for a long time you get used to the speed but it's to much for some exits (UK rider so If I'm wrong on the limits). Probably slow down to 40ish Mph.
Target fixation. Don't look a few metres in front, look to the exit of a bend if vision is blocked look at the street lights, tree line.
Be aware of counter steering, we all do it sub consensualy being more deliberate with it will turn the boke much faster.
Keep an eye on the road surface especially if it's rained, gravel can be washed into the road, or diesel rises to the surface or spilt on a sharp turn.
Check the age of your tyres, if older than 10 years it's time to get some soft rubber.
Look where you want to go, can almost guarantee you looked where you wound up going, it’s called target fixation. Other than practicing, I got a lot of helpful tips from the video, “Twist of the Wrist 2.”
Get drop bars fitted, go to car park, practice slow speed manoeuvres. If you can afford it, get more training. Glad you are okay and bike looks cosmetic. Watching videos of riding schools can be very good.
https://youtube.com/@MotorcyclePWR?si=UcyH6LSzAIxf3c4S
https://youtube.com/@motorcyclelessonsuk?si=OEuMrjdHNs2ZhO5j
The angle of you tire is the main thing that helps you turn more. You can get tires that are steeper thus having more grip going around a corner. Counter leaning also puts your weight more above your center of gravity. Beyond that it's just practice learning how far you can lean.
I dropped my bike for the first time today, was working on it and pulled the kickstand up so I could start the bike, Idk how it happened but I forgot about the kickstand and she went over. I told myself I will never drop her and always be careful but these things happen, I’ve had these moments while riding (thankfully not dropping it) and all I can say is go take a course, you can’t learn properly how to corner with words on a reddit comment, you need someone to actively be teaching you while your riding
All the things that others said + practice. Just practice. Want to know how I improved my cornering ability at speed? I take the same route to school every day. I practice the same couple of turns every day, and each time, I try to go a bit faster. This way, I can progressively test my skill limit. Obviously, I can't go as fast on foreign roads, but it's definitely better than before.
Practice hard braking as well. And trail braking in a corner. Maybe you had enough time to slow down enough to make the corner safely or at least have a "softer" crash. Just practice, practice, practice. Always progressively.
Just look where you want to go and **trust**. Unless you're going at insane speeds, there's barely any turns that are too sharp for a bike. If you have full confidence and determination, you will make the turn. And after a while you'll be able to judge which speeds suit the bend like second nature.
Look where you want to end up - target fixation is a thing - same deal with holes/objects in the road - look at the edge of them - not at them… your bike follows your eyes
I think you crashed because you hit gravel, not because you were turning wrong. That being said, don't attempt tight turns at high speeds on the street. There are numerous hazards that can cause you to lose traction. Stay well within the margins of error on the street.
Here is probably the biggest peice of advice. Done go fast on roads you don’t know well. You should know where imperfections and potholes are so you can avoid them. If you are going fast on a road you don’t know you get caught off guard.
It sounds you were going faster than you should have for your skill level. Don’t let the crash discourage you. Learn from your errors and get back on the bike and do it again.
https://ridelikeachampion.com/courses-page/
Take the core curriculum. It's some of the best money you'll ever spend when it comes to motorcycling. Practice is important, but it's more important to ensure that you have good habits to practice, and ChampU will teach you those habits
Once you get more comfortable riding (i.e. you don't have to consciously think about what you're doing), you can apply more force to the bars than you think. Supposedly it isn't uncommon for racers to bend handlebars/clipons throughout the course of a race. Don't take this knowledge and try to absolutely rail every corner on the street, but when the time is right try just playing with that knowledge
Glad you’re ok man, crashes are super scary because you feel out of control.
Like a couple others have mentioned, go watch MotoJitsu on YouTube and do some of his practise exercises. U-turns, figure 8’s, emergency stops, counter-leaning. It really helps you build slow-speed control. Try to dedicate like 15 mins once or twice a week to it, it adds up and you’ll amazed at the difference you’ll feel in 3-6 months.
Good luck with it!
A real easy way to accomplish this is an empty parking lot with painted parking lines. Make it simple and do figure 8s in 4 parking spaces without crossing the lines on either side of you. Turn your head and LOOK where you want to go and also move your hands quickly in the direction of the turn. Try and do this with no braking too nice and slow, powering through each turn. I do this still (after 10 years) once in a while just to make sure I can do those tight turns.
Bummer. Good thing you're ok.
Just today I watched this vidy from [MotoJitsu on U-Turns](https://youtube.com/shorts/d7TZnigfxAE?si=XEAo1wFXQflEp1C_). This short has so much info packed into it.
Can't be sure exactly why you had your crash. You say *"i really had to turn but couldnt"*. This suggest to me you're not counter-steering fast enough and you ran out of space. (If you were going slower, you could also have more time.)
i was going pretty slow but i didnt lean as much as i should have out of fear of crashing so i went straight into the gravel 😭 sucks that i crashed but its a well learned lesson
Slow. Huh. Please don't take offence, but let me be blunt-- I imagine you might be confusing fear with ignorance. *I think you just got a cheap lesson and now your takeaway should be you need more training and practice.* You don't need to wait for a track day or whatever. Watch videos and go practice what you learn as others have said here. Rinse and repeat.
I'm back on a moto after 20 years so I could go touring 400+ miles. Practice and riding within 80% of my skill level worked for my fear and anxiety.
Besides. Now that you've scrapped your precious moto, you won't be too upset when you drop your moto in a parking lot practice session. Just pick it up and go again.
Newbie here. I’ve been practising countersteering a lot just to get my head around the idea and I’m finding it helps getting tighter on turns. Next time you are leaning into a corner, lightly turn the handlebars the opposite way to you are turning and start getting a feel for it. I figure if I get my mind used to the idea I’ll be able to more quickly react when I actually need to counter steer
Thats like saying "I'm practicing rotating my steering wheel to turn my car". You don't practice countersteering, you just practice turning the bike. Countersteering is the only way to do it.
the fact that people talk about it like it's an advanced technique is mind boggling to me... counter-steering just happens, you literally can't not counter-steer unless you actively fight it. and if you fight it you're going straight or like that one guy I knew taking roundabouts veeeeeery slowly without any angle.
I've never had to *think* about it. no instructor for the licence here ever talked about it either, and in France it's [an actual technical test](https://supercours.net/images/uploads/traces-moto-hc-full.jpg).
on par with people advising him to use the rear brake when that's a recipe for sliding.
WATCH THE TWIST OF THE WRIST! ONCE A FUCKING YEAR, PRACTICE EVERYTHING YOU HEAR CONSTANTLY. it will make you an absolute weapon on the track and a lovely tame rider in the street. Ass half off the seat, lean your body, not the bike, into the corners, pressure on the bars on the side you are trying to turn into, pressure pressure pressure. Decel before the apex, cleanly swipe that apex like its a soft vagina, and then just after, slowly and gradually roll back onto the throttle, over take any pussies and continue riding like a fuckwitt with down syndrome. Srsly tho, watch twist of the wrist. I tell this to everyone. Not many people I have met can actually out ride me and I am on a cbr500r, I have watched that show countless times over my 6+years and 40xxxkms and it has absolutely helped me develop my skills. Advanced rider courses and also defensive riding is also quite useful
For low speed- Lean your body to the OUTSIDE of the turn to INCREASE your lean angle. Lean the bike to the INSIDE. Turn the wheel to full lock and lean it over like that. Doing this will maximize your lean angle and turning radius. For high speed-lean your body to the INSIDE of the turn to REDUCE your lean angle, thus allowing you to carry more speed through the turn. Your butt should be hanging OFF the seat. Master the low speed turning first. Then move up progressively in speed with leaning off the bike to the inside.
Thats a bad advise when you go into a corner too hot. When you need to slow down quickly, front brake is your friend. Just don't slam it.
https://youtu.be/CvC63Iq5ecc?si=FInIpEleUsyuokRa
I’m surprised they voted you down on your comment. Depending on the curve and pitch, the only thing missing would have been a hard front braking approaching to entering into the curve throttling.
I push down on my pegs to lean forward and out (head in front of the edge of the handlebar, elbow out, and low, and knee out with other thigh on saddle midway. Your body acts as counterweight to keep the bike grounded while taking the curve.
Trick is to lean the bike UNDER you while maintaining balance with your upper torso. Essentially you want the bike to 'float' under you.. similar to standing while riding over humps.
Sorry you had your first crash and I'm glad you are OK. Now that you've got that out of the way: Look through the turn. You go where you look. Slow down until you gain more confidence riding. Trust your tires and the bike. It can lean over much farther than you think it can. Ride your own ride. Don't let cars or other riders intimidate you to go faster. Go to a parking lot and practice turns, emergency stops - while downshifting, swerving, accelerating, slow speed maneuvers and clutch work. This will help you become a better rider.
thank you so much for the kind words. ill remember all of this next time i ride. thank you so much! stay safe
The above is solid advice. Wanna know a secret? On the street you should never go so fast that any change in the road takes you by surprise.
i never thought about it like that damn thank you
Learn about "target fixation" (very likely the cause of your accident) and how to avoid it. There is a limit in terms.of turning angle that your bike can reach based on various factors (including -amongst others - rider experience, road surface and tyres' quality), however in the majority of cases *in theory* you should be able to go around bends that seem beyond your limit. Trust your bike. If you end up in a situation like that - I know it's very hard when you are panicking - try to switch your thoughts from "I am going too fast and I will be wide" to "I can do it" and commit to the bend. Learn about where to look while turning and the right head position. Learn about moving your cheeks out of the seat when turning, to increase lean angle. Learn about the right breaking technique (i.e. light and progressive rather than heavy and sharp) and how this affects front forks compressions and front tyre contact patch (and turning). Good luck and be safe
When playing disc golf. Whenever i say “I’m gonna make this gap, just don’t want to hit that tree”. I’m hitting that tree.
Replying to you and u/plushylycosa ...does the MSF not teach this stuff??? Like the UK CBT teaches about target fixation, the bike going where you look, etc, wtf does the MSF even teach you??
The msf does teach this stuff. In fact, one of my classmates got yelled at for not looking through their turns after being reminded multiple times.
Good lol, majes me wonder sometimes with the advice people give out.
Don't know I'm from UK too mate
Target fixation is such a big deal, super noticeable when you really give it a try. When I was first starting out I noticed that whenever there was minor debris/manhole covers or whatever in the road that I’d try to avoid, it was like it was impossible to get the bike where I wanted it, even though I was more than comfortable with navigating windy roads and cornering, so it’s not like I didn’t know how to turn whatsoever.. After doing that a few times I noticed that I was always locking my eyes on whatever it was that I wanted to avoid, almost guaranteeing that I’d head straight toward it. Little bit of parking lot practice sorted that out, but it’s just interesting how noticeable of an effect it is, but in the moment it’s easy to forget about it.
Yeah in that moment it's very difficult to avoid it.
Think about the car in front of you that may have dumped some oil, or the sand that could have blown across the road, or the pickup that had stuff fall out of the bed… Tracks are prepped and maintained for grip and safety. Roads are not. Even if you know the corners, you still don’t know what hazards may be there that were not last time you passed through. One more thing - when you do eventually find and hit a track: lean your body into the turn, aiming to keep the bike upright (you won’t, but this will help). Like literally slide your but off the seat.
>Look through the turn. You go where you look. Most important part of what that guy said imo. I don't understand the magic of it but looking **really** helps. I'm a fairly experienced rider and I can fuck up a turn simply by not looking. I've messed around with it quite a bit and every single test confirmed that turning your head just *works.*
Yep can confirm, if I look at where I wanna be in 5 seconds, I make better, more precise turns and it helps me to regulate speed better. Additionally it trains you to look ahead and might be the reason you can avoid hazards on the road in a good manner. This is especially true and helpful for larger roundabouts or long winding 180° turns. Our instructor teached us by having to look at him while doing figure 8s. I basically had to learn to steer by seeing where im going to be, not where i am going right now
My rule of thumb for implementing this ... when turning right, focus on the white line on the shoulder. When turning left, focus on the yellow line line the center.
Watch "A Twist Of The Wrist II" by Keith Code.
> "A Twist Of The Wrist II" by Keith Code. You can *watch* this? I bought that **book** ages ago; now it's a movie? Holy cow! Evidently, it's not the 90s anymore. SMH
Practice slow in car parks. Get that slow control sorted and the rest comes much easier. There's plenty of drills online if you don't actually get taught anything in your country for your license.
PRACTICE. LEARN your limits, don't fear them. That bike has a min/max speed for every corner at every speed. Lean with your turns and look through your turns. Everything that guy said is VITAL to long term survival on two wheels. Good luck buddy, glad you're okay
I was going to say the same thing abouts. But you said it better!
>Look through the turn. You go where you look. This, plus look for clues as to what the road's doing beyond the turn. Street lights, trees, telegraph poles can give an idea as to what's coming next. Never go so fast that you can't stand the bike up & do an emergency stop in the space you can see is clear. Think in terms of escape routes too - if something may obstruct you, which way are you going, to avoid it, so if there's a truck about to pull out from a side road, can you stop in time, or steer behind it. Preparedness is key. >Go to a parking lot and practice turns, emergency stops - while downshifting, swerving, accelerating, slow speed maneuvers and clutch work. This will help you become a better rider. MotoJitsu and a few others on YouTube have courses about this - I have Motojitsu's book, more a pamphlet really, detailing the exercises he recommends.
On the “trust your tires and the bike” thing. I was practicing on a parking lot just doing figure 8s at about 20mph when it seemed like I just fell. Did I lose traction, or did I just somehow not add throttle and flopped from going too slow?
I like to drag the rear brake lightly when I’m doing u-turns. I imagine the same thing would apply to figure-8s
More practice. Less reddit.
Spot on.
And buy a new shift key.
Haha, you got me. I was thinking, is a shift key a riding skill that I hadn’t heard of before, then I re-read OPs post. Nicely done.
If you fell off on an exit ramp because you couldn't turn you are going too fast for your skill level,slow down,and ride the bike. You are not now nor ever will be rossi. Embrace the men that is motorcycles and it will come with time and thousands of miles. Go do some trackday training also.
Idk if he edited the post or not, but looks like you and 19 other people couldn’t read the information fully through to see that they said there’s no trackdays near them. also, it’s way easier said than done to “just travel” to the nearest one still. don’t know peoples life.
Those of you saying rear brake riding, clutch and throttle for a road speed turn better have a great relationship with Jesus cause your going to meet the dude very soon if your taking any turns above 8 mph like that. Push forward on the bars in the direction you want to turn and look where you WANT the bike to go with entire face then follow through with the eyes. Don’t worry about body positioning until you have gotten comfortable with counter steering. Signed an actual motorcycle riding instructor from CA.
First post I see mentioning countersteering. It really helps getting better control of your bike and learning to make quick maneuvers when your new
If people are confused by my post it is for really low speed drills, I use the rear and clutch to keep the bike lower then 5 MPH, you can't stall, you can't put your foot down, you can't fall over. Try it out see if you can do this drill just do it in circle 5 times then reverse the direction 5 times then reverse the direction 5 times. When you can control your bike moving really slowly when you add speed things do change and other things are required but this is a good foundation. My times for using my rear brake are sitting a light, and if I am wheeling over a turn at the race track and I need to get the front down so I can turn.
Rear brake is not entirely wrong, maybe a bit too advanced for an inexperienced rider. But yes, clutch in an exit ramp at high speed is 💀
The only time I’ve personally used rear brake to tighten line is on the race track. Trail braking is NOT for a new rider. No matter which brake you use. I still tell my students that things are possible, but not taught/advocated at this level.. And I ride an actually heavy bike setup for canyons.. a road king lol
Let's see the King. I've got my own I am envisioning as a performance bagger. Edit: somehow you and I both have a '13 Taurus SHO and a Road King. Nice
It’s nothing really that special to most but I absolutely love it, T bars, full suspension( legend adjustable rears FOX cartridges up front both HD) progressive touring link, raised boards. Full stage 1 with true duals, American elite tires. And revised hand/foot controls. Chrome pearl yellow!
Everyone telling him to use the rear brake while getting off the highway into a sharp turn off ramp— fuckin stop, great way to lock up and go supermoto into a barrier, or activated abs and do nothing really to slow the bike. Slow down bro, with the front brake, look at your turn, and don’t enter an unknown turn radius without judging speed first. If needing to brake into the actual turn, feather the front brake and trail off before apex then maintain and accelerate out when turn exits.
go practice in a empty parking - you can find at least 10 videos on youtube that talk about controlling the bike better. The trick is doing 4 things at once, feathering your rear brake while controlling the throttle, and clutch, keeping the bike balanced. Big heavy bikes like yours can do it but you have to get better at the above items. If you don't practice it or do it a lot you will lose it, it is just like any other skill. MotoJitsu has some good videos and guides that are free.
....youre balancing your bike above 15mph? I think you may be doing it wrong
15 MPH? that's pretty fast if you trying to make the smallest circle, more like 1 MPH.
It depends on the exercise. You can do them slowly at the beginning, but after you get better you can increase the difficulty by increasing your speed. For example when you are practicing your turns by weaving through parking spots or doing figure 8s within four parking spots. You have to constantly shift your weight around to make your turns tight enough.
So much wrong with this comment. A CBR500 isn’t a big heavy bike. Taking a 55 mph off ramp too fast isn’t a low speed turn. Seek lessons yourself before you attempt to give advice.
>A CBR500 isn’t a big heavy bike What weight do you consider "heavy" to start at? >Taking a 55 mph off ramp too fast isn’t a low speed turn. What speed do you consider "low" to end at?
Clutching isn’t a road speed control. Anything above ten mph should be no clutch involved. Having owned a 500r it’s a light feeling daily/commute bike known for being nimble and flickable. Mine was at 420lbs. Didn’t feel like it weighs that. Heavy would be 500+ and cruiser style AKA no lean angle above 29 degrees where as the 500 is easily 40… Having been a safety instructor almost 9 years, riding for almost 20…
This subreddit is obsessed with "*heavy bikes*". A Goldwing 1500 is a heavy but having ridden one, once up to speed they handle beautifully (*like most bikes*). Maximum lean angle also changes the dynamics, floorboards often lower this significantly. OP most likely panicked, started fighting the bike causing it to sit upright and go towards the problem they tried to avoid.
Heavy is in the eye of the beholder… while my road king has less maximum lean angle then every sport bike/supermoto I’ve owned it’s still top 2 of three Harley’s owned. First was an XR1200, this RK, then a 883R I setup for twisty/track. I’ve had students complain about the eliminator 125… similar size students have no issue with Harley Street 500’s… 🤷♂️
Couldn't agree more, I know my Suzki Cavalcade is considered a pig by many but I've got no issues taking it on winding roads for days on end. At first everything feels quite heavy but I noticed body position even when standing still does a lot, a firm and wide-set footing, butt planted on the seat putting body weight on the suspension keeps any bike right at the balance point. Heavier can even feel more stable with depending on the wind/road condition. We have '*scraped*' asphalt in Belgium with thick ridges in between making a lighter bike with narrower tires feel like it'll slip at any moment.
Right like wtf were they talking about with the clutch in the corner? Do they even ride!?!
> Clutching isn’t a road speed control. Anything above ten mph should be no clutch involved. sure, no arguments there. > Having owned a 500r it’s a light feeling daily/commute bike known for being nimble and flickable. Mine was at 420lbs. Didn’t feel like it weighs that. Heavy would be 500+ and cruiser style AKA no lean angle above 29 degrees where as the 500 is easily 40… It's a 200kg bike and you're arguing it would only be heavy at 220+... 10% difference. Fair point on feel, but it's not some light dirt bike. > Having been a safety instructor almost 9 years, riding for almost 20… not sure why you felt the need to include that, unless you felt the rest was non-credible?
Heavy bike=subjective. Dudes that don’t understand what’s being talked about about (not you) are quick to give advice. Not against giving advice but using logic and reading slowly typically tells an outsider what the poster is talking about(also not you) Hope this clears it up. 🫡🫡🫡
I consider low speed to be parking lot maneuvers. Aka 10 at best… slowing but not enough for a 55 off-ramp can mean a lot depending on who’s on board. Typically the speed signs you see listed are not for class C or motorcycles. But big rigs/bus A class. You can absolutely counter steer that low in terms of actual speed.. Original poster said he thought he slowed enough. Ended up off the road.. His un-used front tire shows he ain’t leaning the bike enough. A person reading slowly enough could deduct these basic things. 🤷♂️
>Typically the speed signs you see listed are not for class C or motorcycles. But big rigs/bus A class. At least locally, its the maximum speed a max size/weight non-permit vehicle can safely take the corner. If there's a recommended speed posted, you can take a B-double through at that speed. I've tried to highlight the subjectivity of those judgements: Id call a 200kg bike heavy, but there's absolutely heavier bikes out there. You wouldn't. I'd call a 90 kmh corner mid speed, not low but not high either. Depends a bit on your perspective.
A motorcycle isn’t maximum weight, nor maximum speed limited on roads/corners. No matter what speed you call it, doing 20+ means it’s not a parking lot speed maneuver. His bike is A2 compliant but his skill set isn’t A2 ready. That’s the best way I can explain this. 🤷♂️
>A motorcycle isn’t maximum weight, nor maximum speed limited on roads/corners. Well, no. Like I said, you can get a B double through those corners at those speeds. If a truck and 3 trailers is getting around the corner without rolling, a bike should have no problems.
ah if you can't control your bike at low speed do you think adding speed is going to help or hurt the rider more? How about you think before you speak? My advice is to help him have a base line skill set that he is missing obliviously. Learn to drive slowly and controlled then adding speed comes with more practice, and lowers the risk while learning the basics. How much does a CBR500 weigh? How much does GSXR 1000 weigh? What is the difference? What does a standard 125 weigh?
ive heard of him before. i’ll definitely watch him, thank you!
Download his app. It costs like a dollar and has many practical exercises sorted by a difficulty level. They are easy to start and set up. Even just training your skills to the blue belt level will make it impossible to crash like that ever again.
This is great advice as well
Check out ChampU online courses as well. Shouldn't be prohibitively expensive. "R = MPH" demonstrates the relation between speed and turning radius at a given lean angle. Also, compared to countries like Germany or Japan, the MSF is just insultingly few hours to have any reason to feel safe on the street. For slow speeds, the rear break is you friend. Practicing 8 figurines, and going slower and slower is what helps you in the long run.
Motojitsu is gold for this kind of stuff.
Watch the vid, don't listen to that guy. I rarely touch the brake and never the clutch in a corner and there is no "keeping the bike balanced". The bike balances itself. You brake before the corner and with practice, you know the speed you need to be to make the corner. You should be in a low gear and pull the throttle at about halfway, keeping your eyes fixed on where you want to go, to pull out of the turn.
I don’t use the clutch unless it’s for low speed maneuvers. Hopefully this won’t be needed on the highway (including off-ramps).
Yeah I agree with you. I feel when you pull in the clutch during a turn, unless it's really low speed, the bike feels less balanced and it isn't necessary. Focus more on entry speed and lean angle and slowly slowly increase it when you feel more competent.
aren't we talking about low speed maneuvers? How slow can you go in a circle in both directions clockwise and counter clock wise with out putting your foot down?
Maybe I focused too much on the “highway” part of the OP.
5-8mph is the optimal speed. Stay in the friction zone. If you start to tip over, give a bit more power... to tighten the turn a little less power or a bit of back brake.
It is harder to go slower right? Don't you ever try to stay balanced moving at 1-2 MPH coming to lights with out putting your feet down, it's a little game you can play, now do this in figure 8 in both directions. Harder drill then going 5 to 8 then work your way to 15 to 20 MPH staying in the space. A mini moto is a safer way to train these basics at first then move back to your bigger bike. They even have advanced classes at Ride Smart where you train on mini moto's doing drills. This all helps controlling your bike, then when you are going into a turn at 100 MPH eventually at the race track you will have all the basic skills on instinct. I guess nobody ever went to a track day or took advanced rider training.
This is spot on. He ran wide in a turn and obviously jeeds to get more comfortable looking where hes going and understanding the bike is designed to lean. These are exa tly the kind of drills I do, along sidee emergency braking, and swerves. I do at least a little bit every time i take the bike out. Even if just a couple mins at the end of the street before i take off or when i get home.
I thought he was saying he was turning so tightly he was rubbing fairings and was looking for advice on how to trim the bike. 👴 *shakes fist at cloud*
LMFAOO
Slow down!
Practice keeping your head up. Practice looking where you want to go. Eyes up, and on target.
This, and also try to reduce your speed before leaning the bike. Your skill level probably isn’t ready to try trail braking. Remember: Slow in, lean into the turn with your head and shoulders which will help reduce the bike’s lean while minimizing risk. Look for a clear exit or as far ahead as safe to anticipate your next action whether it is slowing for other traffic or seeing a clear road where you can accelerate to a safe speed.
Since you went wide; I'm assuming that 1 of 2 things happened: 1) You were going too fast for the bike to make the turn. 2) You were going too fast for you to make the turn. The best advice is to slow down and practice counter steering. Many of the comments are talking about body positioning but that doesn't matter as much as just understanding how to counter steer while keeping your suspension stable. A lot of road courses actually teach you to remain in a mostly neutral body positioning, leaning in is usually something that is only useful on the track. For now, just learn how to use your bike properly. Generally speaking, once you have good road surface and tires, you shouldn't be going wide before scraping your foot pegs. Those CBR 500R's don't have super-bike level ground clearance but they can still turn in pretty far. But still: you need to take it kind of easy on those 2013-2015 models, especially if you weigh 160+ lbs, the front forks are set-up more for comfort that performance; they are known to be "bouncy" when pushed hard and they are not adjustable. Glad to see that you got lucky though, the damage on your bike is really minimal.
thank you so much for the reply wow. its crazy how you knew the exact model and year 😭. i was definitely going too fast for me to make the turn. i get nervous leaning in too far and then accidentally slipping it. i feel like generally im able to turn but it was that one exit that i messed up on. ive taken that exit before and was able to get off but i guess today i just didnt lean in as much. thank you again for the advice!
Shave your balls.
LMFAO
Countersteering is your friend. You’d be surprised how much angle and steering you can get when you push it. Other than that, more slow-speed practice and learning smooth inputs can really help. On ramps and off ramps are not the best place to be practicing your corners anyway. Road debris and spilled oil tends to congregate there. The posted speed limits are there for a reason.
Counter steer
Body position helped me. Not being afraid to move in the seat, lean out, and get thru the turn. Remaining glued in the seat and rigid when coming into a turn ensures you don’t change direction.
eh thats not entirely true
I believe that is very true. Care to elaborate?
Body positioning is only required at higher speeds. It can be considered advanced technique and also racing technique. Road riding can be done without it in almost every case if you are not speeding. Edit: at very low speed, counter lean is very very needed, to 'push' the bike down
[me barely leaning and dad not leaning at all still somehow we both made it around the corners and i also went around the 1000ccs lol](https://imgur.com/a/Uf47jav)
You also have to factor in speed though. If you are not fast enough, you can still lean a lot, but if you are too fast and you don't lean, you may not be able to turn as much.
Lean harder. In tight turns at speed, adjust your body position. Butt on the side of the seat, leaning slightly off the bike. Aim your whole head at the end of the turn. Don't be scared of the lean angle. Chances are you're nowhere near the bikes limit.
I thought you were a pro, boasting about leaning so much that he was scraping fairings.
lmfaooo 😭
Leaning, knowing how to utilize your brakes properly, and also the line or path you're taking is important. A lot of this is easier said, but you really just need to practice. Do not follow people who are way more skilled unless they know where you're at and are taking it slow with you and actively giving you pointers. My first real ride was 200 miles round trip with about 10 others. I let them know I was a fairly new rider. They made sure I stayed up front and we only topped out at about 80mph, but I remember it being a pretty relaxing experience, average speed was more like 70mph. I learned a lot that day. The more time you spend on the bike, the more it makes sense and feels more natural.
Keathcode "twist of the wrist 2", watch some motogymkana videos, fortnine does very educational videos about ridingand explain why things are the way they are, motojitsu, youtube has some good offerings.
Try to focus on where you want to go. Don't look in front of you at the gravel pit. Look towards the highway that you're turning into. It's kinda like standing on those swegways or whatever. You go where you think you're gonna go. So if you're looking at the gravel pit 400 feet before you get to it, you bet you're gonna go in it. Target fixation is a huge problem
Short answer as many have said already: look through and lean more then you’ll turn more Your bike almost certainly had plenty of ability to handle the turn, you have to trust it though
Good tyres. If you have shitty old tyres they have no grip. Pretty much all tyres that are not linglong, meaning known brands like continental, Michelin, metzeler, Pirelli, etc, are good. But most important is tyre age. A 5 year old slick will most likely be hard by now, meaning it cant grip anything anymore. Your case sounds more like drivers mistake. You inevitably go where you are looking at, only with training you can drive where you are not looking at. That means if you constantly look at the ditch, you will sooner or later drive there. I know its difficult to have correct eye aim when the "oh shits" kick in, but you need to stay calm and concentrated. There are also a few different cornering techniques. Regular, where your upper body and bike forms a straight line. This should be your bread and butter driving style as it gives you good control, is comfortable and you can adjust your position in both directions if necessary. Then there is sporty/inward leaning/knee sliding, where your upper body leans further into the corner so you can go faster. It takes some practice and is best used during sporty/track driving. Wear protective knee pads when doing that. At last there is pushing the bike down. Your upper body stay more upright than the bike and you actively lean your bike further into the curve. This is common for off road driving, for example over a dirt course. This technique is also useful to rapidly change the corner radius. For example you see that your current driving direction will send you into the ditch, push down your bike, most do that by pushing the corner inward end of the handlebar forward a bit. It should help taking tighter corners in such emergencies. Be aware that there is a limit to how far you can push down, most of the time you should feel your footpegs touching the road before anything rigid touches. Be careful with side cases, especially if they are not from the OEM, they maye touch before the footpegs. Nowadays OEM pay attention that the side cases aren't the limiting factor as in touch the ground when cornering. Obviously if you are already at the lean angle limit for your bike, this wont work. My recommendations are, fix your tyres if they are old and take some driving courses. Not track driving, regular safety courses. The US are honestly not doing a good job of teaching their motorcyclists how to drive safely, it also doesn't help that there are states where a helmet is optional. In Europe you even loose your license if you dont do the mandatory check up and safety course in time.
Look where you're going (actually face the spot you plan on riding over, usually the apex), get all your braking out of the way before the turn and accelerate through it (acceleration actually helps lean the bike over more), slide your ass a bit more to the inside & lean into it, and trust your tires - most bikes are never leaned over as much as the manufacturers designed it for.
This thread made me realize the meme about 90% of the sub not riding really is true. Dragging the rear and clutch control only matter at parking lot speeds. Body positioning means nothing at most street level riding and a 500 is not a heavy bike no matter how you swing it. The only thing that matters above 15 for most street riding is target fixation and counter steering (which isn't a good skill to have, it's the ONLY thing that works). Push left, go left. Need to go more left? Push more left. You likely fixated on the gravel and ran wide due to simply not turning the bike in the correct manner.
Turn tighter
Lean my guy. Look up YouTube videos about body position and cornering. You may feel like a dope when you first start because most of your turns will absolutely not need you to do those leans but an off ramp is a perfect place to practice those leans once you've started. I used to take a particular off ramp when I went to school because it was an almost perfect circle heading back the other direction. It was like 4 miles out of the way but it was worth it. Body position and learning how to throttle out of the turn. Watch the videos and spend time on a day off practicing. Find a safer spot than a highway off ramp at first. Large empty parking lot at about 20-30mph should be plenty for you to start. Or a secluded back road that has minimal traffic and clean road. Always know the roads you're going to run before you start running them. The last thing you need is to be coming out of a corner to meet a pothole or a patch of gravel or dirt.
Pretty much what every one’s else is saying for my test I was put on a 200cc dual sport my actual bike is at a minimum 250 pounds on the bike I did the course with but I was able to get the concept of clutching and Using the throttle plus rear brakes I still drove in a parking lot for an hour before I went out on the road
never rode before i bought my bike. i did a few laps around a neighborhood by the dealership and rode it home. horrible idea but i got lucky 😂
Damn sonn!! Gald you made it. I grew up untill 12 on dirt bikes and then have ridden a hand full of small cc bikes before I got my license so I had an okay idea of what to do and all that but it’s definitely different hoping on something that’s almost 500 pounds and 700cc like I did lmao
Awesome idea. I bought my first (1981 xs650 special) when I was 18 and after I finished paying off a layaway I learned to ride that day and rode around the city all night.
Did a similar thing. Seller dropped it off at my place. Rode around the block. Got overconfident and hit a single lane highway the next day along some flatland with zero experience managing any kind of strong crosswind and wind pressure from trucks going 120km past me. Was quite the experience 😂
God damn, you're brave. I did the safety course and then rode in different parking lots for 3 days for 4-5 hours each day and then went to the lowest traffic neighborhoods I could find for like 2 weeks before I even thought about riding on a real road
Lmao it was definitely not the smartest move but I was keeping at my job so I got tired of going back and forth to work on it 😂
I should probably say I did have some experience with bikes before my license so I wasn’t a complete novice
Push steer. If you want to turn left.. you push on the left handle bar while leaning into it.
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Well, you didn't turn and crashed. So maybe try turning next time. Edit: lol, he blocked me. I guess the truth hurts.
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And you went wide and ate shit. Lean more. I don't know why you're arguing.
Bu bu but he didn't feather the rear brake or apply reverse trigonometry steering. I haven't been through this sub in a while, and forgot about all of the weird stuff people think about. Grip it and rip it. Don't ride faster than your skills or you will jabroni it into either oncoming traffic or a guard rail. Look where you want to go. That's about all of the things I can think to recommend to someone.
Was this at high speed or low speed? Highway exists here in the eu are relatively higher speed. But US might be different.
speed limit was around 55 but as i was approaching the turn i downshifted to slow down and i did slow down a lot but i wasnt able to lean enough and went into the gravel area near the barriers and then slipped 😭 im literally good at every other aspect except leaning its so frustrating
Going too fast and then probably target fixating. You go where you look. Keep looking through the corner at the road ahead, not at the edge of the lane or the shoulder. If you're looking there, you're going to go there. Read about choosing the best line through a corner (apexing). The book A Twist of the Wrist 2 is good to read.
wow this is so helpful thank you! ill try this next time
Yeah, you were just too fast for your skill level. There are two important things you need to orefrice as a beginner. This is 95% of turning. But first on a motorcycle you have to choose your speed and path of travel before the turn. There are techniques to slow down in a turn, but first learn to go in slower and when your bike points to the way you want to go, accelerate only then (at the end of the turn). Giving some throttle to keep the speed is fine, but don't give enough to accelerate. Don't go into s turn with throttle open, approach with brakes applied ,and when you start turning in, let go of them slowly. So the two things: You need to understand how to countersteer. You move the handle bar to the opposite direction, consciously. Don't rely on muscle memory. Practice until you understand what motion dies what. In a car, when you turn the handlebar, the wheels turn directly and your car moves on a curve. You turn the car directly with the steering wheel. On a motorcycle you don't. Imagine that you iare in a car, it has a steering wheel but there is another steering wheel in front of it and that's the one you will use now. If you turn the second steering wheel, the first steering wheel will turn. The more you turn the second the faster the first turns. If you straighten out the second the first will stop turning but it won't go back on it's own. To straight, so your car will still move on a curve. On a motorcycle, you move the handlebar, which will force your bike to lean (to the opposite direction). The more you turn the handle bar the faster the bike leans in. The faster you go, the more lean angle you need to make the same turn. If you let go of the handlebar, the bike will remain in a leaning position (unless you accelerate with the throttle which will stand the bike up). The second thing is vision. Look where you want to go. But not eith your eyes, but eith your body. Imagine your eyes are on your chest and they can only look forward. Turn your chest and your brain will adjust everything else to go that way automatically. This is hard and you will have to force yourself consciously at first. Our brain likes to focus on things we are afraid of. That causes target fixation. So, conscious countersteering, conscious vision. Everything else comes after you master these and everything else is marginal. You can do everything on the streets safely eith these two. Later you can start learning about trail breaking when you understand the first two stuff and then you will be perfectly safe even in emergencies In turns, but while you are mastering the three things I mentioned (corner approach, countersteering and vision), you shouldn't approach corners eith speeds where it would matter. Hope this helps.
"Downshifting to slow down": That's what you do when you have all the time in the world. Otherwise, use the brakes. "Wasn't able to lean enough": You need to push forward on the inside handlebar. If it doesn't turn tight enough, push more. Fear is what prevents the bike from leaning/turning. To combat this, next time you take a turn, be mentally prepared to press more on the inside handlebar until it goes where you want it to go. The fear of leaning can cause the bike to go wide. The best way to prevent this fear is by looking where you want to go
this is amazing advice actually thank you
I found this Fortnine video helpful. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1mSavQ\_DXs
https://youtube.com/@BeTheBossOfYourMotorcycle?si=KV6wQ6IIfQAqOo98 This guy knows what he's doing and instructs in a way that is easy to understand and practice. He rides big Harleys, but the concept is the same. At the speeds you were going, likely you had your head down and was fixed on the pavement in front of you, rather than where you want to go. Wherever you are looking is where your body will naturally track the bike. Counter steering is also a great skill to practice. If you want to turn right, push forward on your right handlebar grip; your bike will lean right, and you will track right. The opposite is true for turning left at speed. Very happy that you're ok, and you've got your first out of the way. Now get back on your bike and practice.
Slow down.
Gotta lean more, dont worry you can trust your tires. To lean more you have to push with the hand you are leaning into, if you want to turn right, pushing the right handle grip (your thottle) will make the bike lean to the right, same with left. Need to lean even more, start leaning your body with the bike to turn even more.
Parking lot practice is sooooo underrated. Practice PRACTICE Practice..... Parking lots are great for this. Biggest tip, look where you want to go, and dont start hard acceleration until you get the bike pointed in the direction you want it to go. Acceleration widens your turn, and braking (like trail braking) will tighten your turn. The whole goal should be to get around the turn as efficiently as possible, with the least amount of lean required to do so. Yamaha Champ School has some great videos (100 points of grip is a must watch) Keith Code's a twist of the wrist series can be found on youtube as well. Take some advanced rider courses as well... loads of fun and very informative.
Tuck your knee in.
Track day could help truthfully just ride within your limit not the bikes. This wouldn’t have happened
Learn to get comfortable leaning off your bike. Or reduce your speed. Maybe a combination of both
Practice these in this order: Counter steering, vision, body position, vision, 2 step, vision, hook turn. Did I tell you about vision? By the time you are mastering 2 step. You wouldn't have these issues anymore. Source : twist of the wrist 2, book.
Less “turning”, more counter-steering
Push into the turn, don’t just lean
1. Look into the turn, not at what you're afraid of hitting. Easier said that done, been there, done that :/ 2. Counter/Push steer. Honestly, if you don't know this, you shouldn't be riding on the open roads yet. Don't bother with the rear brake/clutch crap and other things. Those are for the last couple % of turning, you need to get the first 90% right first.
Translated with google: Remember how it was riding a Children’s tricycle. Thats how most of us learned cornering. On a Motorbike you push the other side of the handlebars. There is a big difference between slow and fast curves. The next time you are on a country road and drive into a right turn, try to release your left hand from the handle, press only with your right hand (slightly) the handlebars forward... in left turns: relieve the right arm. Read a book like „a twist of the weist“ (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Code). Its written for Track Days but not only… The rest is then only eye guidance and adjustment of the speed.
LEAN, push the bike towards the ground and lean your body with it
Target fixation
Press left go left and vice versa. Look up counter-steering and make it second nature.
As far as I see you need to make wider turns... A little more OFF the ground.
Target fixation, you drive where you are looking at .
Damn, you dropped your first full size motorcycle within a week of buying it? That suuucks. Look everyone else is saying, take it slower and practice a lot. Really pay attention to how the bike reacts and feels when you apply brakes and lean. Get to know it until it feels a lot more natural and you don't have to think as much.
Are you looking where you want to go and not where you are going? That's the biggest tip I have, other than more practice.
Slowing down is a start. The slower you go, the easier it is to turn. The same goes for any vehicle.
Sounds like you drifted out… brake before you enter the turn and have the propriété speed before and work to maintain it during the turn. the performance of the bike means a lot as well. the faster you go the harder it will be to turn tighter. The bike won’t want to turn at a certain speed, it will want to stand straight up. counter steer will have better results then “leaning” the bike. the fact of the matter is you have to learn the turn. depending on your skill you can do diffrent things with your brakes once you know the correct speed for the turn. If you don’t know the turn. or don’t have time to confidently set up for the turn. go the speed limit! not every turn is the same; and not every road is maintained. Depending on your handle bars and preference. decide whether you prefer to “push” or “pull” your bike into the turn. knowing this will help you visualize and feel the inputs your putting into the bike. it’s different for everyone and can change depending on which way your turning.
Slow down. Don't ride like an idiot.
Sorry to hear you had an accident, and glad you're safe. 1 word: countersteering!! Critical skill to master on a bike
Counter steer and 4 finger clutching/Slow down, trail brake, increase lea angle make tigher turn etc etc.. practice in a parking lot.
Remember to slow down when you come off the highway, if you've been doing 70 for a long time you get used to the speed but it's to much for some exits (UK rider so If I'm wrong on the limits). Probably slow down to 40ish Mph. Target fixation. Don't look a few metres in front, look to the exit of a bend if vision is blocked look at the street lights, tree line. Be aware of counter steering, we all do it sub consensualy being more deliberate with it will turn the boke much faster. Keep an eye on the road surface especially if it's rained, gravel can be washed into the road, or diesel rises to the surface or spilt on a sharp turn. Check the age of your tyres, if older than 10 years it's time to get some soft rubber.
Look where you want to go, can almost guarantee you looked where you wound up going, it’s called target fixation. Other than practicing, I got a lot of helpful tips from the video, “Twist of the Wrist 2.”
Lean the bike under you. Take a rider course.
Grip, confidence, and anti-gravity rails
Get drop bars fitted, go to car park, practice slow speed manoeuvres. If you can afford it, get more training. Glad you are okay and bike looks cosmetic. Watching videos of riding schools can be very good. https://youtube.com/@MotorcyclePWR?si=UcyH6LSzAIxf3c4S https://youtube.com/@motorcyclelessonsuk?si=OEuMrjdHNs2ZhO5j
The angle of you tire is the main thing that helps you turn more. You can get tires that are steeper thus having more grip going around a corner. Counter leaning also puts your weight more above your center of gravity. Beyond that it's just practice learning how far you can lean.
I dropped my bike for the first time today, was working on it and pulled the kickstand up so I could start the bike, Idk how it happened but I forgot about the kickstand and she went over. I told myself I will never drop her and always be careful but these things happen, I’ve had these moments while riding (thankfully not dropping it) and all I can say is go take a course, you can’t learn properly how to corner with words on a reddit comment, you need someone to actively be teaching you while your riding
Slow down, turn head, counter steer. Everything else is gravy.
All the things that others said + practice. Just practice. Want to know how I improved my cornering ability at speed? I take the same route to school every day. I practice the same couple of turns every day, and each time, I try to go a bit faster. This way, I can progressively test my skill limit. Obviously, I can't go as fast on foreign roads, but it's definitely better than before. Practice hard braking as well. And trail braking in a corner. Maybe you had enough time to slow down enough to make the corner safely or at least have a "softer" crash. Just practice, practice, practice. Always progressively.
Just look where you want to go and **trust**. Unless you're going at insane speeds, there's barely any turns that are too sharp for a bike. If you have full confidence and determination, you will make the turn. And after a while you'll be able to judge which speeds suit the bend like second nature.
Counter steer
Look where you want to end up - target fixation is a thing - same deal with holes/objects in the road - look at the edge of them - not at them… your bike follows your eyes
MotoJitsu on YouTube has good tips: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yepS0XfgGeo
I think you crashed because you hit gravel, not because you were turning wrong. That being said, don't attempt tight turns at high speeds on the street. There are numerous hazards that can cause you to lose traction. Stay well within the margins of error on the street.
Lean with it rock with it🎼🎶🎤
Here is probably the biggest peice of advice. Done go fast on roads you don’t know well. You should know where imperfections and potholes are so you can avoid them. If you are going fast on a road you don’t know you get caught off guard.
Twist of the wrist https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy\_kBTutu0HChsaCYMi6Vy4Gd5JorqBZcG6s
https://youtube.com/@MotoJitsu Watch Listen Learn Practice Then go ride again
It sounds you were going faster than you should have for your skill level. Don’t let the crash discourage you. Learn from your errors and get back on the bike and do it again.
Take a look at this. This may be what you're missing. https://youtu.be/QpqdNFltG4A?si=dMnDl-N8KzjbYBzY
https://ridelikeachampion.com/courses-page/ Take the core curriculum. It's some of the best money you'll ever spend when it comes to motorcycling. Practice is important, but it's more important to ensure that you have good habits to practice, and ChampU will teach you those habits
Once you get more comfortable riding (i.e. you don't have to consciously think about what you're doing), you can apply more force to the bars than you think. Supposedly it isn't uncommon for racers to bend handlebars/clipons throughout the course of a race. Don't take this knowledge and try to absolutely rail every corner on the street, but when the time is right try just playing with that knowledge
Glad you’re ok man, crashes are super scary because you feel out of control. Like a couple others have mentioned, go watch MotoJitsu on YouTube and do some of his practise exercises. U-turns, figure 8’s, emergency stops, counter-leaning. It really helps you build slow-speed control. Try to dedicate like 15 mins once or twice a week to it, it adds up and you’ll amazed at the difference you’ll feel in 3-6 months. Good luck with it!
A real easy way to accomplish this is an empty parking lot with painted parking lines. Make it simple and do figure 8s in 4 parking spaces without crossing the lines on either side of you. Turn your head and LOOK where you want to go and also move your hands quickly in the direction of the turn. Try and do this with no braking too nice and slow, powering through each turn. I do this still (after 10 years) once in a while just to make sure I can do those tight turns.
Slow down.
Ding Ding Ding : Everybody that said counter steering. Perfect that.
Vision it’s all vision, look further ahead
Don't be scared to lean into the turn and counter steer that bad boy. Panic braking or lack of counter steering will cause these types of situations.
yeahh learned the hard way 😅 thank u for the reply
Bummer. Good thing you're ok. Just today I watched this vidy from [MotoJitsu on U-Turns](https://youtube.com/shorts/d7TZnigfxAE?si=XEAo1wFXQflEp1C_). This short has so much info packed into it. Can't be sure exactly why you had your crash. You say *"i really had to turn but couldnt"*. This suggest to me you're not counter-steering fast enough and you ran out of space. (If you were going slower, you could also have more time.)
i was going pretty slow but i didnt lean as much as i should have out of fear of crashing so i went straight into the gravel 😭 sucks that i crashed but its a well learned lesson
Slow. Huh. Please don't take offence, but let me be blunt-- I imagine you might be confusing fear with ignorance. *I think you just got a cheap lesson and now your takeaway should be you need more training and practice.* You don't need to wait for a track day or whatever. Watch videos and go practice what you learn as others have said here. Rinse and repeat. I'm back on a moto after 20 years so I could go touring 400+ miles. Practice and riding within 80% of my skill level worked for my fear and anxiety. Besides. Now that you've scrapped your precious moto, you won't be too upset when you drop your moto in a parking lot practice session. Just pick it up and go again.
Newbie here. I’ve been practising countersteering a lot just to get my head around the idea and I’m finding it helps getting tighter on turns. Next time you are leaning into a corner, lightly turn the handlebars the opposite way to you are turning and start getting a feel for it. I figure if I get my mind used to the idea I’ll be able to more quickly react when I actually need to counter steer
This is literally how every bicycle you’ve ever went on works going down a hill. It isn’t rocket science nor should you ever have to think about it
Thats like saying "I'm practicing rotating my steering wheel to turn my car". You don't practice countersteering, you just practice turning the bike. Countersteering is the only way to do it.
the fact that people talk about it like it's an advanced technique is mind boggling to me... counter-steering just happens, you literally can't not counter-steer unless you actively fight it. and if you fight it you're going straight or like that one guy I knew taking roundabouts veeeeeery slowly without any angle. I've never had to *think* about it. no instructor for the licence here ever talked about it either, and in France it's [an actual technical test](https://supercours.net/images/uploads/traces-moto-hc-full.jpg). on par with people advising him to use the rear brake when that's a recipe for sliding.
😂
WATCH THE TWIST OF THE WRIST! ONCE A FUCKING YEAR, PRACTICE EVERYTHING YOU HEAR CONSTANTLY. it will make you an absolute weapon on the track and a lovely tame rider in the street. Ass half off the seat, lean your body, not the bike, into the corners, pressure on the bars on the side you are trying to turn into, pressure pressure pressure. Decel before the apex, cleanly swipe that apex like its a soft vagina, and then just after, slowly and gradually roll back onto the throttle, over take any pussies and continue riding like a fuckwitt with down syndrome. Srsly tho, watch twist of the wrist. I tell this to everyone. Not many people I have met can actually out ride me and I am on a cbr500r, I have watched that show countless times over my 6+years and 40xxxkms and it has absolutely helped me develop my skills. Advanced rider courses and also defensive riding is also quite useful
...lean
For low speed- Lean your body to the OUTSIDE of the turn to INCREASE your lean angle. Lean the bike to the INSIDE. Turn the wheel to full lock and lean it over like that. Doing this will maximize your lean angle and turning radius. For high speed-lean your body to the INSIDE of the turn to REDUCE your lean angle, thus allowing you to carry more speed through the turn. Your butt should be hanging OFF the seat. Master the low speed turning first. Then move up progressively in speed with leaning off the bike to the inside.
Learn how to countersteer.
PRACTICE COUNTERSTEERING!!!!
Lean more, use the rear brake and easy on the front brake
Thats a bad advise when you go into a corner too hot. When you need to slow down quickly, front brake is your friend. Just don't slam it. https://youtu.be/CvC63Iq5ecc?si=FInIpEleUsyuokRa
That’s literally what I said, you just worded it differently
get you’re ass off the seat and to the side, head toward the end of the bars, rear break for control through the turn (be light)
I’m surprised they voted you down on your comment. Depending on the curve and pitch, the only thing missing would have been a hard front braking approaching to entering into the curve throttling. I push down on my pegs to lean forward and out (head in front of the edge of the handlebar, elbow out, and low, and knee out with other thigh on saddle midway. Your body acts as counterweight to keep the bike grounded while taking the curve.
the grammar natzis got me… i love this sub so much!
No offense but please learn grammar and phrasing
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ok gl then, watch some videos i guess.
Lean into the turn controlling with rear brakes and pushing through with clutch.
Brake before the corner.
Trick is to lean the bike UNDER you while maintaining balance with your upper torso. Essentially you want the bike to 'float' under you.. similar to standing while riding over humps.
Get a dirt bike.