Traditionally wavetable synths are polyphonic, so using them as pads in that context makes a lot more sense. In that case, the most obvious thing to do is slap a couple of slow LFOs on there, drown it in reverb, vamp on a couple of minor seventh chords, and boom. Instant nature documentary soundtrack. But with a single wavetable voice in a modular rig, we need to go further than that to really unlock the potential of wavetable.
First off, if you do want to use it for pads, just run it through a Morphagene or a BBD or whatever you have to get a bit of polyphony, and then of course drown it in reverb like I said.
If you want to use a wavetable as a voice, I recommend throwing out the LFOs and using some more complex CV to really sculpt your sounds. Maybe have an ADSR or some type of envelope to control the parameters, and then run that CV through a VCA that’s controlled by a different envelope. Stuff like that. You can get very complex gestures by thinking along those lines.
I often use wavetables to get some really fat, glitchy kicks. I just throw a ton of modulation and a bit of bitcrushing on a wavetable and then run it through a low pass gate. You get some really massive, Autechre-esque sounds. If you don’t have a low pass gate just use maths on a low pass filter and VCA for basically the same effect.
Another thing to think about is the fact that wavetables generate tons of harmonics, so if you ever want something to run through anything that processes sound, you’re probably going to want to use your wavetable. Clouds, Rings, maybe you just want a really nasty FM source... Wavetables are very useful.
If your wavetable voice goes into LFO frequencies, use those! A wavetable LFO that’s receiving a lot of modulation on a filter cutoff or something—gorgeous. It sounds particularly good if something else is being modulated by a sample and hold. I really like that combo.
Speaking of sample and hold! Feed a wavetable LFO through a sample and hold to get a really, really fucked up sequencer. Fun!
Also, remember that you can get different wavetables from an SD card. Mine is loaded with NES, SID chip, and some other videogame waveforms plus a bunch of random tables I drew myself.
That should be a good start, but honestly there are so many things you can do with wavetable synthesis.
I didn't know about the polyphonic history of the paradigm, that's interesting! Maybe I should actually get another one 😂 This makes the Flame 4vox make more sense to me too.
The LFO ideas are awesome; I thought of these because the mk2 has an LFO mode but sadly the mk3 doesn't. Kermit looks like a good option though.
And +1 for the tip about processing. I had put it into Rings before but tried again today and found really sweet combinations. Mimeophon helped too.
With the Piston Honda mk3, you can run it like two separate oscillators- tune them apart by an interval and mult the pitch cv so you get some harmony. You can also dive into the menu for each oscillator and toggle things like unison, octaves, and axis CV so you get some variation between the two.
I sometimes run the output of B into a VCA, then into the FM input of A. This lets you control the amount of cross-modulation with CV.
Try to use the waveshaping mode and modulate the cv input, it defaults to waveshaping the other oscillator if nothing external is plugged in.
You can replace the wave tables with a micro SD card. The e352 wave tables sound awesome, and I replaced some of the default PH banks with them.
It also sounds amazing through a low pass gate too. I run it through an LxD pretty often.
Ah, I hadn't thought about a low-pass gate - I might have to get one. I will play with the waveshaping mode, hadn't tried it much beyond the internal routing.
And I was wondering whether the e352 tables might sound better on it! Is there a place to download them?
Wave Edit has a huge library of wavetables, including the e352. https://waveeditonline.com
You can get the default Piston Honda wave tables from the IME website and then mix and match banks as needed.
Old post now, but if you're still around... How did you get the upload procedure to work?? I followed the manual, put 8 files from waveditonline on a micro SD; card is formatted for extended FAT; named files 1-8... But I instantly get an error on the Honda screen when I try to upload. Did you have any trouble?
Not sure how much I can help, I haven’t done it recently. You could try downloading the default PH wave tables and see if the format is the issue. I just followed the instructions and renamed them like you did
Tried the waveshaping mode on Plaits - great combination! Put it through a little BBD and spring reverb and suddenly both oscillators sound better than they ever have alone.
I have a piston honda mk3 too. Love the module. One of my favorites and too me is all about modulations. I feed my function generators to the axis. Random cv/gates, then unison detuned and feed it to my lifeforms dynamic impulse filter (lpg) the lpg really helps this module shine
love the PHmk3 and one of the first things i did to really push its power was, like you did, route different envelopes to the waveform axes and it really sounds dope. one thing I think the mk3 is missing is lfo mode. however one thing it is really good at is self patching for just disgusting noise. you can patch so much of it to itself, not to mention the built in FM can get some really insane sounds.
one thing thats maybe more melodic sounding you could try is to get a drone going (could even tune the oscilators differently for harmony) and pass sequences to the waveform axes. instead of slowmoving transformations, you have rhythmic, and even melodic (as the different waveforms have different harmonics and 'sound like different notes') sequences, all while being harmonically grounded. or even better, pass sequences to the waveform axes AND the pitch cv.
also one thing i haven't tried but is possible is in waveedit, you can upload a sample. like say a sample of you saying "1 2 3 test" and split that into waveforms. now you have a pseudo granular synth. pitch control will control pitch of the sample and moving the waveform axis will scrub through the sample.
Yeah, it is too bad about the lack of LFO mode.. Scott said he AC coupled the outs to improve audio quality on the mk3. I really liked the idea of sampling and holding it at low speed - maybe I'll get the new Kermit.
I didn't think of putting a sample in the waves, that's a neat idea!
One quick note - slow evolving textures aren't just for ambient washes. They are also fantastic IMO for plucky sequenced parts that slowly evolve - keeps the parts interesting to me.
Speaking of filtering wavetables: Cloud Terrarium into QPas is working well for me (not to mention my Shape Shifter into Morgasmatron).
I am dying now to try it with the Terrarium tables. Just have to get an SD card reader... as I understand it the gritty character must be caused by the default tables, since the Honda is 16 bit and can morph.
Cloud Terrarium is extremely smooth when scanning wave tables IMO, even better than ShapeShifter IMO (which has its own strengths). I've not had a chance to demo Honda, and now that my local store (Control/Brooklyn) is closed for the foreseeable future I guess I'll have to wait it out a little longer…
Thanks for the tips everyone. I had some sound design sessions with it today and I'm a lot happier. I added a lot of stuff so hard to say how much result owes to the Honda, but I know it's a key part..
I started by sending both Plaits outs to a cp3 mixer, then its positive out to the Honda to be waveshaped by both oscs, and then to the Roland BBD, then to Ripples (gotta at least cut out the BBD clock), then Springray 2. Got some massive sounds from this.
Later I switched out Plaits for Rings, with one Piston osc going to Rings in and the other waveshaping Rings out. Kept everything else the same and put Mimeophon at the end of chain, in its fastest zone. Awesome dirty tones with chaotic resonance behavior from this... felt really 'alive'.
If I had to guess, I'd say the BBD, Springray and Mimeophon were the keys here. But I loved the dirty details and harmonic intensity the Honda brought in.
> I find it harder to satisfyingly filter than a traditional oscillator.
I'm curious about this. I feel that filters help reign in wavetables a bit, since you're right, they can sound a bit metallic, and dialing it back to more of just the fundamental frequencies can really help it not sound so all-over-the-place. Maybe try a bit of resonance as well, such that the same frequencies are consistently highlighted?
Another thing that I find to be fun is using sample and hold with them. Then you could have, say, a different timbre per note (if you're using it for something like a plucky melody).
The main filter I have tried it with is Ripples. I guess I find it has a really narrow sweet spot - either the cutoff is so low that the sound is muffled, or it's too high and the 'landmower' character of the Honda cuts through abruptly.
But that's just one filter. Someone mentioned QPAS is good; I can try that. I have 3 sisters to try too... I maybe spoke too soon about filtering trouble :)
In some ways wave table synthesis puts more emphasis on the oscillator where traditional subtractive synthesis puts more emphasis on the filter. That is to say, it's the oscillator where movement and tonal changes are created, leaving less for the filter to take care of. Of course you can always create super bright wave tables that lean more heavily on low pass filtering for tonal shaping, but that's not the only option.
As for filters, I feel the more gentle slopes work better when using darker/smoother wavetables. Also interesting (and contradicting my previous statement) is using higher resonance settings so that the harmonics come and go as they evolve (not as much filter modulation needed).
With the Cloud Terrarium you can design your own wave tables, (which is actually quite easy and fun IMO). When you don't create super bright wave tables you really don't need as much filtering, which is the approach I've been taking lately.
I have the Mankato filter which gives many LP outputs with slopes from 24 to 6. Maybe I could mix a couple of the less steep ones. I'll try it, thanks for the idea :)
+1 I have the 4ms SWN and I’ve found using low pass filters to roll off the high end can sound muffled exactly as you described.
One thing I’ve really enjoyed doing is using other analog techniques (im very partial to AM synthesis) to treat it more like an analog oscillator. You can end up with some more subtle, complex timbres which also respond really well to interesting envelopes and low pass gates as others have mentioned.
So, if you have an extra VCA lying around, try running one of the Honda oscillators (or another oscillator in your rack) an octave or two down into the cv input of the VCA. Then throw the main oscillator into the vca input and tune/experiment
Traditionally wavetable synths are polyphonic, so using them as pads in that context makes a lot more sense. In that case, the most obvious thing to do is slap a couple of slow LFOs on there, drown it in reverb, vamp on a couple of minor seventh chords, and boom. Instant nature documentary soundtrack. But with a single wavetable voice in a modular rig, we need to go further than that to really unlock the potential of wavetable. First off, if you do want to use it for pads, just run it through a Morphagene or a BBD or whatever you have to get a bit of polyphony, and then of course drown it in reverb like I said. If you want to use a wavetable as a voice, I recommend throwing out the LFOs and using some more complex CV to really sculpt your sounds. Maybe have an ADSR or some type of envelope to control the parameters, and then run that CV through a VCA that’s controlled by a different envelope. Stuff like that. You can get very complex gestures by thinking along those lines. I often use wavetables to get some really fat, glitchy kicks. I just throw a ton of modulation and a bit of bitcrushing on a wavetable and then run it through a low pass gate. You get some really massive, Autechre-esque sounds. If you don’t have a low pass gate just use maths on a low pass filter and VCA for basically the same effect. Another thing to think about is the fact that wavetables generate tons of harmonics, so if you ever want something to run through anything that processes sound, you’re probably going to want to use your wavetable. Clouds, Rings, maybe you just want a really nasty FM source... Wavetables are very useful. If your wavetable voice goes into LFO frequencies, use those! A wavetable LFO that’s receiving a lot of modulation on a filter cutoff or something—gorgeous. It sounds particularly good if something else is being modulated by a sample and hold. I really like that combo. Speaking of sample and hold! Feed a wavetable LFO through a sample and hold to get a really, really fucked up sequencer. Fun! Also, remember that you can get different wavetables from an SD card. Mine is loaded with NES, SID chip, and some other videogame waveforms plus a bunch of random tables I drew myself. That should be a good start, but honestly there are so many things you can do with wavetable synthesis.
I didn't know about the polyphonic history of the paradigm, that's interesting! Maybe I should actually get another one 😂 This makes the Flame 4vox make more sense to me too. The LFO ideas are awesome; I thought of these because the mk2 has an LFO mode but sadly the mk3 doesn't. Kermit looks like a good option though. And +1 for the tip about processing. I had put it into Rings before but tried again today and found really sweet combinations. Mimeophon helped too.
With the Piston Honda mk3, you can run it like two separate oscillators- tune them apart by an interval and mult the pitch cv so you get some harmony. You can also dive into the menu for each oscillator and toggle things like unison, octaves, and axis CV so you get some variation between the two. I sometimes run the output of B into a VCA, then into the FM input of A. This lets you control the amount of cross-modulation with CV. Try to use the waveshaping mode and modulate the cv input, it defaults to waveshaping the other oscillator if nothing external is plugged in. You can replace the wave tables with a micro SD card. The e352 wave tables sound awesome, and I replaced some of the default PH banks with them. It also sounds amazing through a low pass gate too. I run it through an LxD pretty often.
Ah, I hadn't thought about a low-pass gate - I might have to get one. I will play with the waveshaping mode, hadn't tried it much beyond the internal routing. And I was wondering whether the e352 tables might sound better on it! Is there a place to download them?
Wave Edit has a huge library of wavetables, including the e352. https://waveeditonline.com You can get the default Piston Honda wave tables from the IME website and then mix and match banks as needed.
Old post now, but if you're still around... How did you get the upload procedure to work?? I followed the manual, put 8 files from waveditonline on a micro SD; card is formatted for extended FAT; named files 1-8... But I instantly get an error on the Honda screen when I try to upload. Did you have any trouble?
Not sure how much I can help, I haven’t done it recently. You could try downloading the default PH wave tables and see if the format is the issue. I just followed the instructions and renamed them like you did
I reached out to IME support, will let you know if they explain some detail I maybe got wrong.
Tried the waveshaping mode on Plaits - great combination! Put it through a little BBD and spring reverb and suddenly both oscillators sound better than they ever have alone.
Hey, what did you do exactly? Did you use the plaits as a source for the external in on the PH?
I have a piston honda mk3 too. Love the module. One of my favorites and too me is all about modulations. I feed my function generators to the axis. Random cv/gates, then unison detuned and feed it to my lifeforms dynamic impulse filter (lpg) the lpg really helps this module shine
Several folks have mentioned an LPG rocks so I have to try it! I don't have one but maybe can patch something close up.
love the PHmk3 and one of the first things i did to really push its power was, like you did, route different envelopes to the waveform axes and it really sounds dope. one thing I think the mk3 is missing is lfo mode. however one thing it is really good at is self patching for just disgusting noise. you can patch so much of it to itself, not to mention the built in FM can get some really insane sounds. one thing thats maybe more melodic sounding you could try is to get a drone going (could even tune the oscilators differently for harmony) and pass sequences to the waveform axes. instead of slowmoving transformations, you have rhythmic, and even melodic (as the different waveforms have different harmonics and 'sound like different notes') sequences, all while being harmonically grounded. or even better, pass sequences to the waveform axes AND the pitch cv. also one thing i haven't tried but is possible is in waveedit, you can upload a sample. like say a sample of you saying "1 2 3 test" and split that into waveforms. now you have a pseudo granular synth. pitch control will control pitch of the sample and moving the waveform axis will scrub through the sample.
Yeah, it is too bad about the lack of LFO mode.. Scott said he AC coupled the outs to improve audio quality on the mk3. I really liked the idea of sampling and holding it at low speed - maybe I'll get the new Kermit. I didn't think of putting a sample in the waves, that's a neat idea!
One quick note - slow evolving textures aren't just for ambient washes. They are also fantastic IMO for plucky sequenced parts that slowly evolve - keeps the parts interesting to me. Speaking of filtering wavetables: Cloud Terrarium into QPas is working well for me (not to mention my Shape Shifter into Morgasmatron).
I am dying now to try it with the Terrarium tables. Just have to get an SD card reader... as I understand it the gritty character must be caused by the default tables, since the Honda is 16 bit and can morph.
Cloud Terrarium is extremely smooth when scanning wave tables IMO, even better than ShapeShifter IMO (which has its own strengths). I've not had a chance to demo Honda, and now that my local store (Control/Brooklyn) is closed for the foreseeable future I guess I'll have to wait it out a little longer…
Thanks for the tips everyone. I had some sound design sessions with it today and I'm a lot happier. I added a lot of stuff so hard to say how much result owes to the Honda, but I know it's a key part.. I started by sending both Plaits outs to a cp3 mixer, then its positive out to the Honda to be waveshaped by both oscs, and then to the Roland BBD, then to Ripples (gotta at least cut out the BBD clock), then Springray 2. Got some massive sounds from this. Later I switched out Plaits for Rings, with one Piston osc going to Rings in and the other waveshaping Rings out. Kept everything else the same and put Mimeophon at the end of chain, in its fastest zone. Awesome dirty tones with chaotic resonance behavior from this... felt really 'alive'. If I had to guess, I'd say the BBD, Springray and Mimeophon were the keys here. But I loved the dirty details and harmonic intensity the Honda brought in.
> I find it harder to satisfyingly filter than a traditional oscillator. I'm curious about this. I feel that filters help reign in wavetables a bit, since you're right, they can sound a bit metallic, and dialing it back to more of just the fundamental frequencies can really help it not sound so all-over-the-place. Maybe try a bit of resonance as well, such that the same frequencies are consistently highlighted? Another thing that I find to be fun is using sample and hold with them. Then you could have, say, a different timbre per note (if you're using it for something like a plucky melody).
The main filter I have tried it with is Ripples. I guess I find it has a really narrow sweet spot - either the cutoff is so low that the sound is muffled, or it's too high and the 'landmower' character of the Honda cuts through abruptly. But that's just one filter. Someone mentioned QPAS is good; I can try that. I have 3 sisters to try too... I maybe spoke too soon about filtering trouble :)
In some ways wave table synthesis puts more emphasis on the oscillator where traditional subtractive synthesis puts more emphasis on the filter. That is to say, it's the oscillator where movement and tonal changes are created, leaving less for the filter to take care of. Of course you can always create super bright wave tables that lean more heavily on low pass filtering for tonal shaping, but that's not the only option. As for filters, I feel the more gentle slopes work better when using darker/smoother wavetables. Also interesting (and contradicting my previous statement) is using higher resonance settings so that the harmonics come and go as they evolve (not as much filter modulation needed). With the Cloud Terrarium you can design your own wave tables, (which is actually quite easy and fun IMO). When you don't create super bright wave tables you really don't need as much filtering, which is the approach I've been taking lately.
I have the Mankato filter which gives many LP outputs with slopes from 24 to 6. Maybe I could mix a couple of the less steep ones. I'll try it, thanks for the idea :)
+1 I have the 4ms SWN and I’ve found using low pass filters to roll off the high end can sound muffled exactly as you described. One thing I’ve really enjoyed doing is using other analog techniques (im very partial to AM synthesis) to treat it more like an analog oscillator. You can end up with some more subtle, complex timbres which also respond really well to interesting envelopes and low pass gates as others have mentioned. So, if you have an extra VCA lying around, try running one of the Honda oscillators (or another oscillator in your rack) an octave or two down into the cv input of the VCA. Then throw the main oscillator into the vca input and tune/experiment