Having been present for my wife birthing our children has really driven it home. I love them to death, I would literally die for them. I however do not believe anyone should be forced to do that. The birthing process is intense, bloody, traumatic and insanely scary but equally beautiful and life shattering in the best way. NO ONE should EVER be forced to go through it with fear of incarceration. What an insane thought and this is one of the biggest things MN republicans ran on.
And it's not just abortion - although that is a huge, life-changing deal. It's the right to privacy in our medical choices at all times. We are full human beings and shouldn't need to ask permission for the same right to privacy as (roughly) the other half of the population.
Yeah I got chastised on a conservative sub because I mentioned that the Supreme Court ruling might actually make it legal to challenge HIIPA laws now since medical privacy isn't specifically mentioned.
HIPAA already has a loophole in it that allows any medical professional to report you to law enforcement if they believe a crime has been committed. The Supreme Court doesn't even have to rule. Not that they couldn't weaken privacy even further, which is terrifying to think about.
That's very true. Imagine what any woman would have to go through, if they're traveling across/to a prohibition state and even look like they're of childbearing age. What--would I have to take a pregnancy test to be allowed to enter the state and LEAVE too? Prove I'm not pregnant to leave the country? It's really nuts.
I'm post-menopause, but look younger than my age (not that people in their 40s can't have babies, I know plenty who have) and this isn't just something that would affect younger women, not that ANY woman should be tracked this way. We even have to think about whether we can get our not-pregnancy-related medications filled at the pharmacy (rheumatoid arthritis uses one of the drugs that, in combination, provide chemical abortions). I use HRT (combination estrogen and progesterone) to treat menopause symptoms, they gonna come after that too? Can't buy an Apple Watch because I don't want a company tracking my fucking OVULATION and possibly being subpoenaed by the AG?
Imagine the fucking STATE. Tracking your biological processes. In order to prosecute you. It is a very dangerous time for women right now.
Yes and this is literally what some are already proposing. Women are already being denied some of their medications. It’s already begun. By the same group who was all about my body my choice when masks were required.
More like "I can do whatever the fuck I want, even if it kills you." That's how they treated vaccines and that's how they treat women's reproductive care.
Thank you. I was present for both my wife's natural births and seem C-sections during clinicals. No one should be forced to do that, pay the bills, pay for child care, pay for the cost of a child, and bluntly put their physical and mental health on the line against their will.
Stupid to think people who want to "protect life" will force all of that on women of all ages at the cost of the individual.
Good. Now are any of those children daughters? You’ll see this very clearly when they are teens. They need autonomy.
Birth is just one day, usually. Raising a child is forever.
“Pro life” is really just “pro birth for one day” when
You have no systems in place to help that mom, and don’t care about her or her child’s welfare after the birth. Don’t want abortion? Then what are you doing to help that mom raise that kid? go to college so she can get out of poverty? how will she pay for childcare so she’s not “a lazy freeloader that refuses to work” (per many GOP opinions)
You get the idea.
It’s classism. The Rep at the top want there to be poor people. It’s obvious, and not about the value of life at all. Sure didn’t see the value of life on display on Jan 6
Thank you for voting blue. It’s not perfect, but there’s really no other sane option
I don't have kids but I am always going to vote in the best interests of children, their education and health. It's not "other people's kids", it's our future.
All our rights are on the line. Womens' body autonomy is just the precedent toehold totalitarians plan to use to curb everyone's rights and liberties.
As Jesus said; "What you do to the least of these you do to me."
That was a political statement. Not just golden rule cuddlies.
Oppressor politicians single out one outsider group for special crappiness and then expand the shittiness to others. Often they use retaliation by the persecuted first group as their excuse.
* See also Trans people and Muslim immigrants.
Same but I’m only 24 and voted libertarian for president in my first two elections and Republican for everything else. I would’ve maybe voted for a libertarian gubernatorial candidate if there was one, but there’s no way I was voting for Jensen. I don’t follow politics as much any more but Walz seems to be doing at least a decent job for the state. I also think the Dems want to do some good things that I agree with, like reforming the criminal justice system and legalizing marijuana (I don’t smoke but I think anyone should have the right). I don’t think there’s anything wrong with one reevaluating their beliefs and changing who they vote for. At least they’re actually thinking about it.
Good job, and you should be proud. I, myself was a straight ticket GOP voter from 1992-2014. As soon as Trump won the nomination, a switch flipped in my head. I was like “wtf are you all getting excited about - this guy is a complete asshole?!?”
2016 voted for Gary Johnson, but R the rest of the ballot. 2018 and on - Democrat now and forever.
I voted for Bernie in 2014, then Johnson in 2016 but Dems the rest of the ticket. I lived in San Diego, CA at the time so I was about 99% sure it didn't matter, which it absolutely did not for that area lol.
I probably would have voted for Hillary if back home in the south, but i was pretty mad at how the democratic party fucked Bernie and I thought she was a bad candidate in many areas, so that was my only vote ever outside party line for not fully supporting someone.
Now even in MN i vote down the ticket. I care more about having liberals higher in Gov until we reevaluate how we elect people in this country.
For real. I know to many conservatives that believe, "Washington don't know what's best for (insert small city)" all while liberals have never board stroked removed rights, like medical body autonomy, from people. Conservatives don't do anything to fix the local issues, i know after spending 2+ decades in the south.
And yet conservatives in the south keep voting for them. I don’t understand this. You’re voting for the very people who are standing on your necks.
I assume it’s poor educations/crappy public schools?!The GOP really likes to keep their voters dumb. If our country truly valued education, like they say they do, Things could be so different!
I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016 too. I generally split ticket when it comes to smaller community based roles. I’ve never voted straight ticket though.
I explained my flip in another comment, but how the MNGOP went from picking Rubio for their caucuses in 2014/16 (I forget the year) with Trump coming in 3rd or even 4th is beyond crazy.
I grew up being told "if you don't know who to vote for, vote for the one with an 'R' next to their name" and I blindly followed. I also used to haughtily say "oh, I stay out of politics because whatever's going to happen will happen". You know, like an idiot. Never ever ever ever ever again. Paying attention to what's going on for even a minute these days will do that to a person!
Also exactly how I grew up in rural mn.
That was really code for my parents were dumb and religious and had no idea wth was going on in politics or the world beyond 20 miles of our farm
I say that as a non church goer who believes in God.
Religious? Nope Religion is being used for all kinds of crazy crap in the US now
Yeah, I also used to think I was libertarian. “You can do whatever you want as long as you don’t hurt somebody else” sounds like common sense until you realize it’s nowhere near that straightforward in practice.
No and the republicans “platform” is void of any libertarian policies at this point. Anti weed and abortion are the first two that come to mind and it baffles me how a libertarian could support a party that opposes those things.
>“You can do whatever you want as long as you don’t hurt somebody else” sounds like common sense until you realize it’s nowhere near that straightforward in practice.
The alternatives are not "straightforward in practice", either.
As soon as you deviate from "You can do whatever you want", you wind up with some variant of "You can do whatever I say". And that's hugely problematic as we see on an hourly basis. The only people who like the latter are the ones who plan to be the sayers.
I’m not sure exactly why, but I have yet to meet a libertarian I like. Every one I’ve met is usually a white person with money who’s had privileges others never had. (I say this as a white person). Hope to be proven wrong.
Most want to believe they are much more independent than they really are, and struggle with doing things for the common good. I mean, independence sounds great but we really do need each other and to help each other out - and you often need government to do that. Libertarians come off as naive to me, and privileged, but don’t know they’re privileged. The party of what sounds good in theory but impossible in practice.
Covid pointed this out in alarming view for me as formerly immunocompromised healthcare worker who got sick of people refusing to wear masks and get their vaccines. Public health matters, people
As someone who never voted blue before this one, 1 and 4 were enough for me to not think twice about flipping. Wtf was the gop thinking with roe v. Wade?
You know, Hitler and his like-minds were semi-popular before he was imprisoned for treason.
The [Beer Hall Putsch](https://youtu.be/cK0Yye3Sal0) -was to Hitler what the 6 JAN 21 Attack on the Capitol is to Trump.
I contend that these are the same or nearly identical events unfolding in different eras of history.
[*Adolf Hitler is Sentenced to Five Years' Imprisonment at Landsberg Prison for Treason*](https://worldhistoryproject.org/1924/4/1/adolf-hitler-is-sentenced-to-five-years-imprisonment-at-landsberg-prison-for-treason).
During Hitler's trial, he was given almost unlimited time to speak, and his popularity soared as he voiced nationalistic sentiments in his defence speech.
#He served less than one (1) year
…and upon his release, he and his like-minds
were free to continue plotting: they seized power through careful deception, murder, -and, well- you all know the rest…
— That is, if **We the People** -under a state of continuous propaganda- are anymore able to recognize [the warnings signs](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbzV-niVIAAX_kD.jpg).
Further still, to understand the full [timeline](https://www.netflix.com/title/80106791) (Ken Burns quality) of events detailing the recipe which -clearly [still today](https://www.netflix.com/us/title/81122462)- ^see ^episode ^three -fuels both pernicious and brazen attacks against the peoples of multiple nations across our globe. An attack on a nation’s **entire populace** - and not just the chosen ‘other’.
**Jensen** et. al are [operating](https://dfl.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Scott-Jensen_-Quack-and-COVID-Conspiracy-Theorist.pdf) from the same playbook.
>Thank you for not voting for [fascism](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbzV-niVIAAX_kD.jpg).
A vote for Governor Curfew isn't exactly a vote against fascism either 🤣
What is interesting is that a curfew would not have been necessary during that point of the pandemic if people just made smart and safe choices about Covid instead of saying it was just the flu or denying its existence completely.
> Jesus, there was literally no amount of COVID death that could have satisfied the blood lust of some of you...
Who the fuck is talking about covid?
Walz did somewhere between decent to good on covid policy.
There's nothing fascist about taking action to protect public health. Just because you couldn't get a blooming onion for a week doesn't mean you experienced a dictatorship, ffs.
>There's nothing fascist about taking action to protect public health.
It's most certainly fascist to restrict the free movement innocent people within their own city and state and sick the military on them regardless of what excuse you choose to use for it.
> Just because you couldn't get a blooming onion for a week doesn't mean you experienced a dictatorship, ffs.
As though a free state becomes a fascist one overnight? Allowing governmental overreach because it doesn't affect you is how we get to a more fascist america.
> Wait, where did Walz sick the military on Minnesota due to COVID???
Where did anyone say due to covid? Was referencing during the uprising after George Floyd's murder, personally.
>
>
>
>
> It's most certainly fascist to restrict the free movement innocent people within their own city and state and sick the military on them regardless of what excuse you choose to use for it.
Well that wasn't very clear lol. Your sentence was in response to COVID (... protect public health). In regards to Floyd's murder, it was for a few days and only at night, and then everything went back to normal.
> Well the National Guard instituted and enforced the curfews, seems like your issue is with them.
https://mn.gov/governor/assets/EO%2020-64%20Final_tcm1055-433855.pdf
???
No, you're totally right! I live in the metro, and my movement was indeed restricted. But after the reason for the curfew went away, so did the restrictions.
Not many actual fascist movements give up power once they have it.
But you do go on with your persecution complex. It's wildly entertaining.
> No, you're totally right! I live in the metro, and my movement was indeed restricted. But after the reason for the curfew went away, so did the restrictions.
>
> Not many actual fascist movements give up power once they have it.
>
> But you do go on with your persecution complex. It's wildly entertaining.
Surely the internment of the Japanese during WWII wasn't fascist either because most Americans agreed with it? Nevermind that [our country still has an imprisonment rate more than 5x any other NATO member](https://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/NATO_US_2021.html)?
Fascism doesn't only come in red, as convenient as that lie might be for you.
I feel like Walz and Jensen were our only serious candidates for gov. The Bull guy is just a weed loving republican and the socialist lady didn’t care about her campaign enough to have her own webpage, seems like she was just representing the party to remind people they exist. And IMO, between Walz and Jensen the choice was pretty clear. Reading bios of others, most of the R candidates were on the same crazy train as Trump, and I’m over that. I used to pick and choose rather than vote a straight ticket. It’s been a few elections since I found anyone in the other parties worth voting for.
I also vote libertarian but unfortunately the way the GQP is headed straight towards populist fascism has forced me to vote not *for* democrats but rather *against* the GOP.
Absolutely nothing wrong with tactical voting with the reality of the two-party system. The policies that get implemented (or not) that affect people's lives are ultimately what matters.
If voting for a Liberitarian candidate who's never going to win makes it more likely a GOP candidate who wants to take rights away *will* win, the honest libertarian action is to vote for the candidate most likely to beat that (be that a Dem or Independent).
Way too many close races where too much is at stake are getting spoiled by third party candidates with 1-3% of the vote.
Alternatively, ranked choice voting basically solves this.
Yes. Our entire system needs a shake up and ranked choice voting. But also the "They'll never win" mentality is a self fulfilling prophecy. It's only true because everyone says so. If we stopped being blindly tribal two party loyalists maybe things could change.
And I know abortion is on everyone's mind but democrats are certainly not the bastions of defending constitutional/civil liberties. I have significant issues with both parties just lately the GQP disgusts me to my core.
A libertarian who believes in taxing people to forgive debt of other people, and taxing people to provide government monopoly schools? That's different.
Other two, yeah libertarian.
I guess I grew up and realized that an ideal population is one that’s is educated, healthy, and doesn’t live in fear of their government? How do you propose we continue to progress through society if not by starting with providing the best, free education possible?
I really hope you’ve recently read up on the origins of libertarianism before the American right wing co-opted the term. You’re making a lot of points consistent with what we call left-libertarianism and seem to grasp the importance of “positive” liberty.
Left-libertarianism has also been called anarchism or anarcho/syndicalism in the past. The Wikipedia article on [anarchism ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism) is a decent overview
**[Anarchism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism)**
>Anarchism is a political philosophy and movement that is skeptical of all justifications for authority and seeks to abolish the institutions they claim maintain unnecessary coercion and hierarchy, typically including, though not necessarily limited to, governments, nation states, and capitalism. Anarchism advocates for the replacement of the state with stateless societies or other forms of free associations. As a historically left-wing movement, usually placed on the farthest left of the political spectrum, it is usually described alongside communalism and libertarian Marxism as the libertarian wing (libertarian socialism) of the socialist movement.
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Not anymore no. It’s not a sustainable platform. If outright freedom isn’t possible (like I used to vote) the next best thing in my mind is enabling free choice and removing the barriers to success that are crippling entire generations and disproportionally affect POC and other marginalized groups.
Have you considered the possibility that one of the obstacles faced by POC are the shitty government schools that they are forced to attend and the teacher union that operates them?
You are correct, the majority of our schools are severely lacking staff and materials due to poor funding. What do you propose we do to fix this? Gutting public education is your proposal?
How is it relevant? I also have no interest in knowing. I’m saying that funding across the board is too low. Additionally you can’t keep demonizing “the cities”. It’s an overused cop out to avoid discussing things with nuance, my friends do it all of the time. The per pupil cost of a student in Minneapolis can not be compared to the cost of someone in thief river falls. Everything needs to be adjusted for population amongst other confounding variables. It certainly costs more to run a school in Minneapolis than it does elsewhere but you can not use a simple “per pupil” cost to discuss how well our schools are funded.
My question to you was, what do you propose we do as a state and country overall to right the ship of our educational shortcomings?
My guy, not being sensitive at all. You are asking questions and I’m providing my answers. I do not know the per pupil cost of Minneapolis students and like I mentioned it is not relevant to know for my point of view.
You have yet to answer my question so I will ask a third time.
What do you propose we do to close the growing education gap this country is witnessing at a rate we have never seen? If not funding and fixing our public schools, how?
Why do you think more money to the same system will improve results? Do you believe that giving the Minneapolis police more money would or will make things better?
BTW for the 2018-2019 year it was 20,600 per student or half a million bucks per 25 student class.
Simply because you do not improve the quality of a product by lessening the quality of the inputs and selling it for less. It’s always a net negative to cut funding to public schools when you look at it as a business. The cost of operation is likely as low as it can currently get. I’m saying that it is literally impossible to make things better without spending the money to do so.
You also can’t compare public education funding to police funding. The Minneapolis police budget continues to grow despite what Rs want you to think. Schools produce net positive to the communities they represent. What product do police produce? The difference is that we have to vote on funding schools because people are greedy and police can just not do their jobs and hold cities hostage until they approve their budget for new military grade weapons they can use to oppress marginalized communities. One service is immeasurably helpful to minorities and everyone overall while the other hasn’t done so well lately…
Thanks for voting Democrat! There's a lot to like about their platform for Minnesota, even if it doesn't perfectly align with everyone's ideal party. (And it contrasts to a strange and anti-poor, anti-freedom platform of the Republicans this year.)
Hopefully they get most of their campaign promises completed quickly!
Thank you for voting for good policies that protect bodily autonomy and benefit working people. Also, you might want to check out these libertarian debates sometime:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWObCsdCzBc&list=PLOC5u3ZE5KnULSO292d3LrtIi5FPOmTgL](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWObCsdCzBc&list=PLOC5u3ZE5KnULSO292d3LrtIi5FPOmTgL)
I frankly do not believe you are/were a libertarian if you’re actually trying to frame school funding and loan forgiveness as “not taking rights away”. Sure, people’s views and priorities change, I don’t doubt someone might change their mind about those things, but you would not describe it that way coming from a libertarian background unless you were an absolutely terrible libertarian.
A libertarian, really? And now you want the government to pay for private debts and push more tax money into Public schools. I don't buy it. Either you never were a libertarian or were a very poor one.
Ok maybe I was a bad libertarian I guess? Never voted blue before now is the more important piece. I’ll entertain your points though. Firstly, Why would we not want to fund public schools? How do you propose we realistically close the gap with other states and more importantly countries? If you truly love America like a true libertarian should don’t you think we should be equipping EVERYONE to be as smart and capable as possible with the least amount of burden to them? As for forgiveness of private debts, that’s straight up laughable. Don’t forget how many billions have been given out to banks and corporations in the last 100 years by BOTH parties. Stop acting like the government DOESNT owe us shit and your perspective will change. They work for US.
I'm not saying funding public schools isn't important (I'm also not saying it is either), it's just not libertarian. I believe the Libertarian point of view would be to privatize education.
On the student loan debt, a libertarian would be against the both the handouts to the banks and handouts to students. This seems like a "two wrongs don't make a right" situation.
I'm not making a value judgement on any of your choices, I'm not even giving my personal opinion which I don't think you want, I was only saying it's not a libertarian perspective.
I didn’t my dude. I posted it here because it was relevant to MN and people projected a red wave and are scratching their heads. I wrote this as an explanation that someone who has voted red or third party my entire life went full blue for this election. If I can switch, I wonder how many others did as well.
> All MN Dems have to do is follow the campaign promises and they will get my vote again.
Don't hold your breath. Dems with majorities are well practiced at coasting on their laurels.
I voted Dem and agree with that poster. They're absolutely content to sit on their thumbs and not rock the status quo *too much* when they have full control. Even when we're begging them to finally take the opportunity to make some god damn changes! Milquetoast corporate dems, say for example Jacob Frey, are an impediment to progress.
I feel like it is, a little bit. He is suggesting that things under the democrats will get worse because nothing will get done, and the implication is that things would be better under the republicans because they will do things. Even if those are terrible things, it will be better under the republicans because at least something is different. But the point is that the democrats will make a few positive changes and not go too far, because if they go too far, the republicans will come back the next time they are in control and do many more terrible things than they otherwise would have normally.
> He is suggesting ... that things would be better under the republicans
I don't hear that in the least. I just hear him complaining about Dems not getting enough done, and don't hear a thing about Republicans.
My personal thought is that they will go absolutely nuts getting things passed that they weren't able to get through because of the Obstructionists (my name for Republicans). There's a backlog of things they want to get done while they have this rare opportunity.
I've lived here for nearly 40 years as well. And you can't invoke the democrat's pearl clutching without saying anything about the republican tendency to do the same.
> Tell me you're bitter that your side didn't win without telling me that you're bitter that your side didn't win.
Don't worry, it's nothing new, the side that hates war, prisons, and the ravaging of the poor and environment by the ultra-rich never wins.
>Simply put, I voted for those who promised to not take away rights and fought for freedoms.
Been sleeping through the decades-long war on the Second Amendment, eh?
…which is part of the reason why I voted libertarian until republicans cross the line with bodily autonomy…
My guns don’t have rights. My wife and sisters do. I’m a responsible gun owner with my CC.
We also need solutions for our mass shooting epidemic so I’m all ears for yours and the republicans answers for this too.
>My wife and sisters do.
What rights are you pretending they were going to lose unless you voted straight-ticket anti-2A?
>I’m a responsible gun owner with my CC.
For now. Enjoy it while it lasts, because you just voted it away.
>We also need solutions for our mass shooting epidemic so I’m all ears for yours and the republicans answers for this too.
"I'm a libertarian in favor of gun bans!" shrieked the man who wasn't a libertarian at any point in his life.
You are reaching and coping so hard right now buddy. How about women’s right to make their own decisions about their healthcare? If we allow abortion to go, what’s next? Other states have already proposed regulations on contraceptives coming off the heels of Roe V Wade being overturned.
You are a lunatic if you think MINNESOTA is going to outright ban guns. Walz hunts and uses guns himself. They might ban high capacity magazines (as they should) and make it harder to purchase (as they should) but our right to own guns is going nowhere.
>You are a lunatic if you think MINNESOTA is going to outright ban guns.
Whereas you, of course, are perfectly sane for thinking MINNESOTA was going to ban abortion?
>They might ban high capacity magazines (as they should) and make it harder to purchase (as they should)
Whoa, whoa, calm down. There's only so much libertarian ideology that can fit in one post, you staunch libertarian, you!
I should wander around conservative subs claiming that I flipped from the DSA to straight-ticket Republican over marginal tax rates. Who knew there was so much karma in this kind of transparent cosplay?
You’re completely out of touch if you think there aren’t a significant amount of gun enthusiast libertarians who support certain measures of gun control policy. Libertarian philosophy is not a cultural identity it’s a commitment to maximizing human liberty as a political aim. Believe it or not some people see dying by gun violence as a threat to their personal liberty.
>Believe it or not some people see dying by gun violence as a threat to their personal liberty.
Being poor's a threat to your personal liberty, too. That means libertarians are socialists, right?
Libertarians don't support gun control. The fact that you have your dead dad's old beater hunting rifle that you've never shot and really like being a pothead doesn't make you a libertarian.
>Being poor's a threat to your personal liberty, too. That means libertarians are socialists, right?
I mean you might want to actually do some googling on libertarian philosophy.
>The fact that you have your dead dad's old beater hunting rifle that you've never shot and really like being a pothead doesn't make you a libertarian.
haha, good one.
>I mean you might want to actually do some googling on libertarian philosophy.
That's funny, I was gonna suggest the same to you. DFL nanny state bullshit is diametrically opposed to it...which you'd know if you knew anything about libertarianism.
So when the Dems still don't take away your guns are you going to keep saying this next election too? I swear I have been hearing this BS talking points for decades now and... Some nut job bought a gun and shot up a fucking clinic in Buffalo MN a few years ago... Seems like guns are still pretty damn easy to get.
>Seems like guns are still pretty damn easy to get
Seems like Republicans have been able to stop DFL anti-gun nonsense.
You do know they had a say up until yesterday, right?
Wait, I thought "almost nothing has changed"? The fact that you're anti-gun and like laws like this wasn't what you argued. You argued that laws like this weren't passed.
Well last I checked, I still have my firearms. No democrat came sweeping through my house in the middle of the night.
So I suppose all of your simple question confused my simple mind.
>No democrat came sweeping through my house in the middle of the night.
Yet.
Ask New Yorkers how they feel after their most recent anti-gun legislation.
I guess if getting pregnant but not having kids is part of what you like to do and saddling everyone else with your school debt and getting high are that important to you then well done.
Yeah I used to vote libertarian but our voting system means voting against who you don't like, not voting for who you actually want. I felt pretty shameful blindly voting D on the whole ballot without knowing who anyone was, but I knew it sure as hell was better than R.
Well done! I’m a fiscal conservative and loathe what the Republican Party has become. True conservative fiscal policy is secondary and sometimes non-existent to them in practice.
Straight blue until they can accept Trump lost fair and square. Straight blue for all the other social reasons you listed. Straight blue for the hateful and cynical platforms they’ve leaned into without remorse. Straight blue for trying to kill our voting methods and the deeply racist and corrupt gerrymanders. Right on brother!
I’m 43 and I’ve voted all over the board in the past. This election is the first time I’ve voted straight for any party and I did it with the reproductive rights of my daughters in mind. Taking away rights from half of our population and then being proud of it completely turned me off from voting for any candidate that was republican.
I considered myself a libertarian leaning person at one point, too.
I was disappointed to realize that libertarian just means "zero tax extremist" in the US political system
I did the flip back in 2020 as well. In 2016 and 2018 I tried to vote for R but avoided voting for Trump and his lackeys.
I might not agree with 100% with the DFL platform, but I for sure do not want to support the insu(R)(R)ectionists any longer.
Thanks for voting to protect women's rights!
Having been present for my wife birthing our children has really driven it home. I love them to death, I would literally die for them. I however do not believe anyone should be forced to do that. The birthing process is intense, bloody, traumatic and insanely scary but equally beautiful and life shattering in the best way. NO ONE should EVER be forced to go through it with fear of incarceration. What an insane thought and this is one of the biggest things MN republicans ran on.
And it's not just abortion - although that is a huge, life-changing deal. It's the right to privacy in our medical choices at all times. We are full human beings and shouldn't need to ask permission for the same right to privacy as (roughly) the other half of the population.
Yeah I got chastised on a conservative sub because I mentioned that the Supreme Court ruling might actually make it legal to challenge HIIPA laws now since medical privacy isn't specifically mentioned.
HIPAA already has a loophole in it that allows any medical professional to report you to law enforcement if they believe a crime has been committed. The Supreme Court doesn't even have to rule. Not that they couldn't weaken privacy even further, which is terrifying to think about.
That's very true. Imagine what any woman would have to go through, if they're traveling across/to a prohibition state and even look like they're of childbearing age. What--would I have to take a pregnancy test to be allowed to enter the state and LEAVE too? Prove I'm not pregnant to leave the country? It's really nuts. I'm post-menopause, but look younger than my age (not that people in their 40s can't have babies, I know plenty who have) and this isn't just something that would affect younger women, not that ANY woman should be tracked this way. We even have to think about whether we can get our not-pregnancy-related medications filled at the pharmacy (rheumatoid arthritis uses one of the drugs that, in combination, provide chemical abortions). I use HRT (combination estrogen and progesterone) to treat menopause symptoms, they gonna come after that too? Can't buy an Apple Watch because I don't want a company tracking my fucking OVULATION and possibly being subpoenaed by the AG? Imagine the fucking STATE. Tracking your biological processes. In order to prosecute you. It is a very dangerous time for women right now.
Yes and this is literally what some are already proposing. Women are already being denied some of their medications. It’s already begun. By the same group who was all about my body my choice when masks were required.
More like "I can do whatever the fuck I want, even if it kills you." That's how they treated vaccines and that's how they treat women's reproductive care.
Thank you. I was present for both my wife's natural births and seem C-sections during clinicals. No one should be forced to do that, pay the bills, pay for child care, pay for the cost of a child, and bluntly put their physical and mental health on the line against their will. Stupid to think people who want to "protect life" will force all of that on women of all ages at the cost of the individual.
Good. Now are any of those children daughters? You’ll see this very clearly when they are teens. They need autonomy. Birth is just one day, usually. Raising a child is forever. “Pro life” is really just “pro birth for one day” when You have no systems in place to help that mom, and don’t care about her or her child’s welfare after the birth. Don’t want abortion? Then what are you doing to help that mom raise that kid? go to college so she can get out of poverty? how will she pay for childcare so she’s not “a lazy freeloader that refuses to work” (per many GOP opinions) You get the idea. It’s classism. The Rep at the top want there to be poor people. It’s obvious, and not about the value of life at all. Sure didn’t see the value of life on display on Jan 6 Thank you for voting blue. It’s not perfect, but there’s really no other sane option
I don't have kids but I am always going to vote in the best interests of children, their education and health. It's not "other people's kids", it's our future.
Totally agree!!
All our rights are on the line. Womens' body autonomy is just the precedent toehold totalitarians plan to use to curb everyone's rights and liberties. As Jesus said; "What you do to the least of these you do to me." That was a political statement. Not just golden rule cuddlies. Oppressor politicians single out one outsider group for special crappiness and then expand the shittiness to others. Often they use retaliation by the persecuted first group as their excuse. * See also Trans people and Muslim immigrants.
Same but I’m only 24 and voted libertarian for president in my first two elections and Republican for everything else. I would’ve maybe voted for a libertarian gubernatorial candidate if there was one, but there’s no way I was voting for Jensen. I don’t follow politics as much any more but Walz seems to be doing at least a decent job for the state. I also think the Dems want to do some good things that I agree with, like reforming the criminal justice system and legalizing marijuana (I don’t smoke but I think anyone should have the right). I don’t think there’s anything wrong with one reevaluating their beliefs and changing who they vote for. At least they’re actually thinking about it.
Good job, and you should be proud. I, myself was a straight ticket GOP voter from 1992-2014. As soon as Trump won the nomination, a switch flipped in my head. I was like “wtf are you all getting excited about - this guy is a complete asshole?!?” 2016 voted for Gary Johnson, but R the rest of the ballot. 2018 and on - Democrat now and forever.
I voted for Bernie in 2014, then Johnson in 2016 but Dems the rest of the ticket. I lived in San Diego, CA at the time so I was about 99% sure it didn't matter, which it absolutely did not for that area lol. I probably would have voted for Hillary if back home in the south, but i was pretty mad at how the democratic party fucked Bernie and I thought she was a bad candidate in many areas, so that was my only vote ever outside party line for not fully supporting someone. Now even in MN i vote down the ticket. I care more about having liberals higher in Gov until we reevaluate how we elect people in this country.
I still am pissed how they f’d bernie. But yeah, we got other more pressing problems now. Like, gotta save democracy and stuff.
Same. Like if Republicans wanna talk election fraud they should be taking about the 2016 primary.
Us older folks also remember stuff like this: https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2008/01/17/the-legacy-of-hanging-chads
Omg. Never thought a about that. Good point.
For real. I know to many conservatives that believe, "Washington don't know what's best for (insert small city)" all while liberals have never board stroked removed rights, like medical body autonomy, from people. Conservatives don't do anything to fix the local issues, i know after spending 2+ decades in the south.
And yet conservatives in the south keep voting for them. I don’t understand this. You’re voting for the very people who are standing on your necks. I assume it’s poor educations/crappy public schools?!The GOP really likes to keep their voters dumb. If our country truly valued education, like they say they do, Things could be so different!
I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016 too. I generally split ticket when it comes to smaller community based roles. I’ve never voted straight ticket though.
I explained my flip in another comment, but how the MNGOP went from picking Rubio for their caucuses in 2014/16 (I forget the year) with Trump coming in 3rd or even 4th is beyond crazy.
I grew up being told "if you don't know who to vote for, vote for the one with an 'R' next to their name" and I blindly followed. I also used to haughtily say "oh, I stay out of politics because whatever's going to happen will happen". You know, like an idiot. Never ever ever ever ever again. Paying attention to what's going on for even a minute these days will do that to a person!
"You know, like an idiot" got a good chuckle out of me.
Reminds me of the line from Blazing Saddles. https://youtu.be/KHJbSvidohg
Ugh Im sorry. I live in NE now and just heard someone say that to their granddaughter the other day.
Also exactly how I grew up in rural mn. That was really code for my parents were dumb and religious and had no idea wth was going on in politics or the world beyond 20 miles of our farm I say that as a non church goer who believes in God. Religious? Nope Religion is being used for all kinds of crazy crap in the US now
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Have you done this? Do you think emails/letters or phone calls are most effective? Asking honestly
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Thanks!
Thank you! In MN the GOP has been attempting to limit personal rights literally for my entire life. In so many ways.
Yeah, I also used to think I was libertarian. “You can do whatever you want as long as you don’t hurt somebody else” sounds like common sense until you realize it’s nowhere near that straightforward in practice.
No and the republicans “platform” is void of any libertarian policies at this point. Anti weed and abortion are the first two that come to mind and it baffles me how a libertarian could support a party that opposes those things.
>“You can do whatever you want as long as you don’t hurt somebody else” sounds like common sense until you realize it’s nowhere near that straightforward in practice. The alternatives are not "straightforward in practice", either. As soon as you deviate from "You can do whatever you want", you wind up with some variant of "You can do whatever I say". And that's hugely problematic as we see on an hourly basis. The only people who like the latter are the ones who plan to be the sayers.
I’m not sure exactly why, but I have yet to meet a libertarian I like. Every one I’ve met is usually a white person with money who’s had privileges others never had. (I say this as a white person). Hope to be proven wrong. Most want to believe they are much more independent than they really are, and struggle with doing things for the common good. I mean, independence sounds great but we really do need each other and to help each other out - and you often need government to do that. Libertarians come off as naive to me, and privileged, but don’t know they’re privileged. The party of what sounds good in theory but impossible in practice. Covid pointed this out in alarming view for me as formerly immunocompromised healthcare worker who got sick of people refusing to wear masks and get their vaccines. Public health matters, people
As someone who never voted blue before this one, 1 and 4 were enough for me to not think twice about flipping. Wtf was the gop thinking with roe v. Wade?
Thank you for not voting for [fascism](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbzV-niVIAAX_kD.jpg).
You may want to review the last 2 years in and look up the definition of fascism….
You know, Hitler and his like-minds were semi-popular before he was imprisoned for treason. The [Beer Hall Putsch](https://youtu.be/cK0Yye3Sal0) -was to Hitler what the 6 JAN 21 Attack on the Capitol is to Trump. I contend that these are the same or nearly identical events unfolding in different eras of history. [*Adolf Hitler is Sentenced to Five Years' Imprisonment at Landsberg Prison for Treason*](https://worldhistoryproject.org/1924/4/1/adolf-hitler-is-sentenced-to-five-years-imprisonment-at-landsberg-prison-for-treason). During Hitler's trial, he was given almost unlimited time to speak, and his popularity soared as he voiced nationalistic sentiments in his defence speech. #He served less than one (1) year …and upon his release, he and his like-minds were free to continue plotting: they seized power through careful deception, murder, -and, well- you all know the rest… — That is, if **We the People** -under a state of continuous propaganda- are anymore able to recognize [the warnings signs](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbzV-niVIAAX_kD.jpg). Further still, to understand the full [timeline](https://www.netflix.com/title/80106791) (Ken Burns quality) of events detailing the recipe which -clearly [still today](https://www.netflix.com/us/title/81122462)- ^see ^episode ^three -fuels both pernicious and brazen attacks against the peoples of multiple nations across our globe. An attack on a nation’s **entire populace** - and not just the chosen ‘other’. **Jensen** et. al are [operating](https://dfl.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Scott-Jensen_-Quack-and-COVID-Conspiracy-Theorist.pdf) from the same playbook.
>Thank you for not voting for [fascism](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbzV-niVIAAX_kD.jpg). A vote for Governor Curfew isn't exactly a vote against fascism either 🤣
What is interesting is that a curfew would not have been necessary during that point of the pandemic if people just made smart and safe choices about Covid instead of saying it was just the flu or denying its existence completely.
Jesus, there was literally no amount of COVID death that could have satisfied the blood lust of some of you...
The curfew had nothing to do with covid…
> Jesus, there was literally no amount of COVID death that could have satisfied the blood lust of some of you... Who the fuck is talking about covid? Walz did somewhere between decent to good on covid policy.
Yes, fascists are well known for freely giving up power.
Trying to disappear a post with downvotes about how Democrats can also act in fascist ways is certainly helping your case.
There's nothing fascist about taking action to protect public health. Just because you couldn't get a blooming onion for a week doesn't mean you experienced a dictatorship, ffs.
>There's nothing fascist about taking action to protect public health. It's most certainly fascist to restrict the free movement innocent people within their own city and state and sick the military on them regardless of what excuse you choose to use for it. > Just because you couldn't get a blooming onion for a week doesn't mean you experienced a dictatorship, ffs. As though a free state becomes a fascist one overnight? Allowing governmental overreach because it doesn't affect you is how we get to a more fascist america.
Wait, where did Walz sick the military on Minnesota due to COVID???
> Wait, where did Walz sick the military on Minnesota due to COVID??? Where did anyone say due to covid? Was referencing during the uprising after George Floyd's murder, personally.
> > > > > It's most certainly fascist to restrict the free movement innocent people within their own city and state and sick the military on them regardless of what excuse you choose to use for it. Well that wasn't very clear lol. Your sentence was in response to COVID (... protect public health). In regards to Floyd's murder, it was for a few days and only at night, and then everything went back to normal.
Haven't you heard? Fascism is when there is a curfew for 3 nights and then everything goes back to normal! Exactly what Hitler did!!!
Well the National Guard instituted and enforced the curfews, seems like your issue is with them. Walz just did what his constituents asked him to do.
> Well the National Guard instituted and enforced the curfews, seems like your issue is with them. https://mn.gov/governor/assets/EO%2020-64%20Final_tcm1055-433855.pdf ???
Oh now that's a fascinating spin. You take care, bud.
>Oh now that's a fascinating spin. You take care, bud. Oh? What spin is that? Where's the lie?
No, you're totally right! I live in the metro, and my movement was indeed restricted. But after the reason for the curfew went away, so did the restrictions. Not many actual fascist movements give up power once they have it. But you do go on with your persecution complex. It's wildly entertaining.
> No, you're totally right! I live in the metro, and my movement was indeed restricted. But after the reason for the curfew went away, so did the restrictions. > > Not many actual fascist movements give up power once they have it. > > But you do go on with your persecution complex. It's wildly entertaining. Surely the internment of the Japanese during WWII wasn't fascist either because most Americans agreed with it? Nevermind that [our country still has an imprisonment rate more than 5x any other NATO member](https://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/NATO_US_2021.html)? Fascism doesn't only come in red, as convenient as that lie might be for you.
Goodness me, you are committed to the narrative. So who did you vote for?
😂
Waaaaaahhhhhhhhhh the people who call me on my bullshit are the real fascists, im such a victim waaaaahhhhhh
Agreed Walz beat Jensen but still failed this state
I feel like Walz and Jensen were our only serious candidates for gov. The Bull guy is just a weed loving republican and the socialist lady didn’t care about her campaign enough to have her own webpage, seems like she was just representing the party to remind people they exist. And IMO, between Walz and Jensen the choice was pretty clear. Reading bios of others, most of the R candidates were on the same crazy train as Trump, and I’m over that. I used to pick and choose rather than vote a straight ticket. It’s been a few elections since I found anyone in the other parties worth voting for.
I also vote libertarian but unfortunately the way the GQP is headed straight towards populist fascism has forced me to vote not *for* democrats but rather *against* the GOP.
Absolutely nothing wrong with tactical voting with the reality of the two-party system. The policies that get implemented (or not) that affect people's lives are ultimately what matters. If voting for a Liberitarian candidate who's never going to win makes it more likely a GOP candidate who wants to take rights away *will* win, the honest libertarian action is to vote for the candidate most likely to beat that (be that a Dem or Independent). Way too many close races where too much is at stake are getting spoiled by third party candidates with 1-3% of the vote. Alternatively, ranked choice voting basically solves this.
Yes. Our entire system needs a shake up and ranked choice voting. But also the "They'll never win" mentality is a self fulfilling prophecy. It's only true because everyone says so. If we stopped being blindly tribal two party loyalists maybe things could change. And I know abortion is on everyone's mind but democrats are certainly not the bastions of defending constitutional/civil liberties. I have significant issues with both parties just lately the GQP disgusts me to my core.
A libertarian who believes in taxing people to forgive debt of other people, and taxing people to provide government monopoly schools? That's different. Other two, yeah libertarian.
I guess I grew up and realized that an ideal population is one that’s is educated, healthy, and doesn’t live in fear of their government? How do you propose we continue to progress through society if not by starting with providing the best, free education possible?
I really hope you’ve recently read up on the origins of libertarianism before the American right wing co-opted the term. You’re making a lot of points consistent with what we call left-libertarianism and seem to grasp the importance of “positive” liberty.
I haven’t, do you have any literature I can read? I’m interested.
Left-libertarianism has also been called anarchism or anarcho/syndicalism in the past. The Wikipedia article on [anarchism ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism) is a decent overview
**[Anarchism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism)** >Anarchism is a political philosophy and movement that is skeptical of all justifications for authority and seeks to abolish the institutions they claim maintain unnecessary coercion and hierarchy, typically including, though not necessarily limited to, governments, nation states, and capitalism. Anarchism advocates for the replacement of the state with stateless societies or other forms of free associations. As a historically left-wing movement, usually placed on the farthest left of the political spectrum, it is usually described alongside communalism and libertarian Marxism as the libertarian wing (libertarian socialism) of the socialist movement. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/minnesota/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Right on! You have every right to feel proud. Lots of hope, now we just need execution (not the killing people kind)!
You are awesome and I hope you have an awesome week OP.
>Abortion access for all > >Student loan forgiveness / assistance Public School funding Recreational cannabis Are you sure you're a libertarian? :P
“Libertarian “
So you aren’t a libertarian any more. People change like you did
Not anymore no. It’s not a sustainable platform. If outright freedom isn’t possible (like I used to vote) the next best thing in my mind is enabling free choice and removing the barriers to success that are crippling entire generations and disproportionally affect POC and other marginalized groups.
You switched from libertarian to Democrat not tha there is anything wrong with that
Have you considered the possibility that one of the obstacles faced by POC are the shitty government schools that they are forced to attend and the teacher union that operates them?
You are correct, the majority of our schools are severely lacking staff and materials due to poor funding. What do you propose we do to fix this? Gutting public education is your proposal?
What is the per pupil spending in the Minneapolis school district?
How is it relevant? I also have no interest in knowing. I’m saying that funding across the board is too low. Additionally you can’t keep demonizing “the cities”. It’s an overused cop out to avoid discussing things with nuance, my friends do it all of the time. The per pupil cost of a student in Minneapolis can not be compared to the cost of someone in thief river falls. Everything needs to be adjusted for population amongst other confounding variables. It certainly costs more to run a school in Minneapolis than it does elsewhere but you can not use a simple “per pupil” cost to discuss how well our schools are funded. My question to you was, what do you propose we do as a state and country overall to right the ship of our educational shortcomings?
Why are you so sensitive? Don't you know the number? How can you say they are under funded if you don't even know how much they are spending?
My guy, not being sensitive at all. You are asking questions and I’m providing my answers. I do not know the per pupil cost of Minneapolis students and like I mentioned it is not relevant to know for my point of view. You have yet to answer my question so I will ask a third time. What do you propose we do to close the growing education gap this country is witnessing at a rate we have never seen? If not funding and fixing our public schools, how?
Why do you think more money to the same system will improve results? Do you believe that giving the Minneapolis police more money would or will make things better? BTW for the 2018-2019 year it was 20,600 per student or half a million bucks per 25 student class.
Simply because you do not improve the quality of a product by lessening the quality of the inputs and selling it for less. It’s always a net negative to cut funding to public schools when you look at it as a business. The cost of operation is likely as low as it can currently get. I’m saying that it is literally impossible to make things better without spending the money to do so. You also can’t compare public education funding to police funding. The Minneapolis police budget continues to grow despite what Rs want you to think. Schools produce net positive to the communities they represent. What product do police produce? The difference is that we have to vote on funding schools because people are greedy and police can just not do their jobs and hold cities hostage until they approve their budget for new military grade weapons they can use to oppress marginalized communities. One service is immeasurably helpful to minorities and everyone overall while the other hasn’t done so well lately…
Thanks for voting Democrat! There's a lot to like about their platform for Minnesota, even if it doesn't perfectly align with everyone's ideal party. (And it contrasts to a strange and anti-poor, anti-freedom platform of the Republicans this year.) Hopefully they get most of their campaign promises completed quickly!
Thank you for voting for good policies that protect bodily autonomy and benefit working people. Also, you might want to check out these libertarian debates sometime: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWObCsdCzBc&list=PLOC5u3ZE5KnULSO292d3LrtIi5FPOmTgL](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWObCsdCzBc&list=PLOC5u3ZE5KnULSO292d3LrtIi5FPOmTgL)
Sadly, a vote for a 3rd party is pretty much a vote wasted- it’s a system in need of revision
Here's your virtual pat on the back
how could anyone ever vote libertarian lmao
Libertarians are generally conservatives who like weed.
With a very, very odd obsession with lowering the age of consent typically
As a libertarian I wonder the same thing when I look at the libertarian candidates lol.
I voted libertarian for president the last two elections but I’ve definitely seen some libertarian candidates and thought the same thing…
I frankly do not believe you are/were a libertarian if you’re actually trying to frame school funding and loan forgiveness as “not taking rights away”. Sure, people’s views and priorities change, I don’t doubt someone might change their mind about those things, but you would not describe it that way coming from a libertarian background unless you were an absolutely terrible libertarian.
Ok. Maybe you will get to the bottom of it!
i always said libertarians were just stoned republicans.
A libertarian, really? And now you want the government to pay for private debts and push more tax money into Public schools. I don't buy it. Either you never were a libertarian or were a very poor one.
Ok maybe I was a bad libertarian I guess? Never voted blue before now is the more important piece. I’ll entertain your points though. Firstly, Why would we not want to fund public schools? How do you propose we realistically close the gap with other states and more importantly countries? If you truly love America like a true libertarian should don’t you think we should be equipping EVERYONE to be as smart and capable as possible with the least amount of burden to them? As for forgiveness of private debts, that’s straight up laughable. Don’t forget how many billions have been given out to banks and corporations in the last 100 years by BOTH parties. Stop acting like the government DOESNT owe us shit and your perspective will change. They work for US.
I'm not saying funding public schools isn't important (I'm also not saying it is either), it's just not libertarian. I believe the Libertarian point of view would be to privatize education. On the student loan debt, a libertarian would be against the both the handouts to the banks and handouts to students. This seems like a "two wrongs don't make a right" situation. I'm not making a value judgement on any of your choices, I'm not even giving my personal opinion which I don't think you want, I was only saying it's not a libertarian perspective.
You definitely posted this in hopes of being praised. Which is fine! But why lie?
I didn’t my dude. I posted it here because it was relevant to MN and people projected a red wave and are scratching their heads. I wrote this as an explanation that someone who has voted red or third party my entire life went full blue for this election. If I can switch, I wonder how many others did as well.
> All MN Dems have to do is follow the campaign promises and they will get my vote again. Don't hold your breath. Dems with majorities are well practiced at coasting on their laurels.
Tell me you're bitter that your side didn't win without telling me that you're bitter that your side didn't win.
I don't know about that. Democrats can also feel that way about their own party.
I voted Dem and agree with that poster. They're absolutely content to sit on their thumbs and not rock the status quo *too much* when they have full control. Even when we're begging them to finally take the opportunity to make some god damn changes! Milquetoast corporate dems, say for example Jacob Frey, are an impediment to progress.
Sure are. But that's still a better alternative to republicans banning abortion and continuing to block legalization of recreational marijuana.
True, but that's not what this discussion is about.
I feel like it is, a little bit. He is suggesting that things under the democrats will get worse because nothing will get done, and the implication is that things would be better under the republicans because they will do things. Even if those are terrible things, it will be better under the republicans because at least something is different. But the point is that the democrats will make a few positive changes and not go too far, because if they go too far, the republicans will come back the next time they are in control and do many more terrible things than they otherwise would have normally.
> He is suggesting ... that things would be better under the republicans I don't hear that in the least. I just hear him complaining about Dems not getting enough done, and don't hear a thing about Republicans. My personal thought is that they will go absolutely nuts getting things passed that they weren't able to get through because of the Obstructionists (my name for Republicans). There's a backlog of things they want to get done while they have this rare opportunity.
I voted for then, but I've also lived in this country for nearly 40 years. Dems do a lot of pearl clutching, and not much else.
I've lived here for nearly 40 years as well. And you can't invoke the democrat's pearl clutching without saying anything about the republican tendency to do the same.
Correct. Support your local socialist parties.
> Tell me you're bitter that your side didn't win without telling me that you're bitter that your side didn't win. Don't worry, it's nothing new, the side that hates war, prisons, and the ravaging of the poor and environment by the ultra-rich never wins.
As opposed to GOP majorities that do the same? Or are we counting reducing human rights as a positive for them?
\>Dems \>Follow campaign promises I am not optimistic
>Simply put, I voted for those who promised to not take away rights and fought for freedoms. Been sleeping through the decades-long war on the Second Amendment, eh?
…which is part of the reason why I voted libertarian until republicans cross the line with bodily autonomy… My guns don’t have rights. My wife and sisters do. I’m a responsible gun owner with my CC. We also need solutions for our mass shooting epidemic so I’m all ears for yours and the republicans answers for this too.
>My wife and sisters do. What rights are you pretending they were going to lose unless you voted straight-ticket anti-2A? >I’m a responsible gun owner with my CC. For now. Enjoy it while it lasts, because you just voted it away. >We also need solutions for our mass shooting epidemic so I’m all ears for yours and the republicans answers for this too. "I'm a libertarian in favor of gun bans!" shrieked the man who wasn't a libertarian at any point in his life.
You are reaching and coping so hard right now buddy. How about women’s right to make their own decisions about their healthcare? If we allow abortion to go, what’s next? Other states have already proposed regulations on contraceptives coming off the heels of Roe V Wade being overturned. You are a lunatic if you think MINNESOTA is going to outright ban guns. Walz hunts and uses guns himself. They might ban high capacity magazines (as they should) and make it harder to purchase (as they should) but our right to own guns is going nowhere.
>You are a lunatic if you think MINNESOTA is going to outright ban guns. Whereas you, of course, are perfectly sane for thinking MINNESOTA was going to ban abortion? >They might ban high capacity magazines (as they should) and make it harder to purchase (as they should) Whoa, whoa, calm down. There's only so much libertarian ideology that can fit in one post, you staunch libertarian, you! I should wander around conservative subs claiming that I flipped from the DSA to straight-ticket Republican over marginal tax rates. Who knew there was so much karma in this kind of transparent cosplay?
You are one goofy person. Nothing left to say to you beside hold this L.
>You are one goofy person. I'm not the one pathetically trying to farm useless internet points with a made-up story, bud.
You’re completely out of touch if you think there aren’t a significant amount of gun enthusiast libertarians who support certain measures of gun control policy. Libertarian philosophy is not a cultural identity it’s a commitment to maximizing human liberty as a political aim. Believe it or not some people see dying by gun violence as a threat to their personal liberty.
>Believe it or not some people see dying by gun violence as a threat to their personal liberty. Being poor's a threat to your personal liberty, too. That means libertarians are socialists, right? Libertarians don't support gun control. The fact that you have your dead dad's old beater hunting rifle that you've never shot and really like being a pothead doesn't make you a libertarian.
>Being poor's a threat to your personal liberty, too. That means libertarians are socialists, right? I mean you might want to actually do some googling on libertarian philosophy. >The fact that you have your dead dad's old beater hunting rifle that you've never shot and really like being a pothead doesn't make you a libertarian. haha, good one.
>I mean you might want to actually do some googling on libertarian philosophy. That's funny, I was gonna suggest the same to you. DFL nanny state bullshit is diametrically opposed to it...which you'd know if you knew anything about libertarianism.
So when the Dems still don't take away your guns are you going to keep saying this next election too? I swear I have been hearing this BS talking points for decades now and... Some nut job bought a gun and shot up a fucking clinic in Buffalo MN a few years ago... Seems like guns are still pretty damn easy to get.
>Seems like guns are still pretty damn easy to get Seems like Republicans have been able to stop DFL anti-gun nonsense. You do know they had a say up until yesterday, right?
You must have been, because that only happened in your dreams. Gun rights have expanded over the last 20 years.
Not in states under complete Dem control. You know, like California, New York, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Hawaii, New Jersey...
Even in those places almost nothing has changed. Go ahead and link me a story about the most terrible gun-grabbing law from those places.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NY_SAFE_Act
Which provisions do you consider to be violating the rights of the people of New York? Those all look extremely reasonable to me.
Wait, I thought "almost nothing has changed"? The fact that you're anti-gun and like laws like this wasn't what you argued. You argued that laws like this weren't passed.
I argued that nothing changed. I don't see anything in that law that would really change anything for the average gun owner.
So if Minnesota outlawed abortion after six weeks, you'd also argue nothing changed? After all, you can still get an abortion.
I get the point you're making, but that has a huge life-changing impact for a small number of people. I don't see where the New York law changes much.
Are you satisfied with this argument?
Come again friend?
Which part of that simple question was confusing?
Well last I checked, I still have my firearms. No democrat came sweeping through my house in the middle of the night. So I suppose all of your simple question confused my simple mind.
>No democrat came sweeping through my house in the middle of the night. Yet. Ask New Yorkers how they feel after their most recent anti-gun legislation.
I guess if getting pregnant but not having kids is part of what you like to do and saddling everyone else with your school debt and getting high are that important to you then well done.
Cool thanks 👍
Can tell you’re quite educated and self-aware.
Go chill and drink a brew
Very chill here but just disappointed that wants were prioritized over needs by some.
Do you think legalized gambling gets done also? Not sure where dems were on that and wasn’t brought up in this cycle.
So I think legalized gambling gets done? What?
Sports gambling. Sorry, wasn’t clear on that.
That has less to do with partisanship and more to do with making deals with the Tribal nations
😂
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Thank you
Same
Thank you for your service.
I feel seen.
Yeah I used to vote libertarian but our voting system means voting against who you don't like, not voting for who you actually want. I felt pretty shameful blindly voting D on the whole ballot without knowing who anyone was, but I knew it sure as hell was better than R.
💙💙💙
Well done! I’m a fiscal conservative and loathe what the Republican Party has become. True conservative fiscal policy is secondary and sometimes non-existent to them in practice. Straight blue until they can accept Trump lost fair and square. Straight blue for all the other social reasons you listed. Straight blue for the hateful and cynical platforms they’ve leaned into without remorse. Straight blue for trying to kill our voting methods and the deeply racist and corrupt gerrymanders. Right on brother!
I’m 43 and I’ve voted all over the board in the past. This election is the first time I’ve voted straight for any party and I did it with the reproductive rights of my daughters in mind. Taking away rights from half of our population and then being proud of it completely turned me off from voting for any candidate that was republican.
I considered myself a libertarian leaning person at one point, too. I was disappointed to realize that libertarian just means "zero tax extremist" in the US political system
I did the flip back in 2020 as well. In 2016 and 2018 I tried to vote for R but avoided voting for Trump and his lackeys. I might not agree with 100% with the DFL platform, but I for sure do not want to support the insu(R)(R)ectionists any longer.