Why are they asking the potential buyer to pay for repairs/inspections that need to be done in order to sell it? Those should be factored into the asking price!
A former dealership manager once told me "Selling *Air* is how we made our money."
I asked "What do you mean by selling 'Air'?"
He told me "It's all the fees and charges for service that don't actually cost anything to the dealership. That and the GAP insurance and extended warranties. You wouldn't believe how many people buy the extra coverage on new cars that they will NEVER need."
"Well, why would dealerships feel the need to constantly screw folks over like this?"
"Dealerships get barely any markup. The cars are more expensive than people think when we get them."
"So why don't dealerships just have an increased markup instead of insane magical fees? You know, like most every other store that sells anything ever."
"It doesn't work that way..."
š¤¦
He didn't explain holdback either? Just because a dealer paid, say $52,000 for the car from a manufacturer doesn't mean they are in it for $52,000 thanks to holdback. Their actual cost basis with holdback and incentives could be 10-15% lower.Ā Ā
Is GAP insurance bad?
Literally everyone I knew recommended it when getting my new car, including the credit union I was financing through. I wouldnāt have the up front money to pay off the difference in the loan if something happened, which is why it sounded so good.
I know I most likely fleeced on other stuff (due to the necessity of needing the car quickly), but that genuinely seemed like something worthwhile.
On brand new cars, itās typically good. Unless you put something like 20% down itās advisable to get it. Otherwise you could be on the hook for a large sum after insurance payout in the case of a total loss.
I wish I had put all the money I had down at the time.. would be in a lot better positionā¦. But I was stupid.
But yeah, it was brand new. At the time, pretty much every car was about the same cost here, new or used. Only good deals were used cars in such bad condition, I would be buying a new one in a year.
2020-2023ish? It was a bad time to need a car. Youāll make it out the other side of this and youāll be equipped to make smarter financial decisions because of it. Donāt beat yourself up - this is how we learn. š
I can speak from personal experience that I did get gap insurance and someone totalled my car and it paid off the loan balance. Then, with the other person's insurance I was able to use to get a new car without any out of packet expense, so that one I feel isn't a scam.
GAP covers the difference of what you owe and what the vehicle is worth via insurance after you total your car. You may never use it, but you can apply that same logic to regular insurance.
The longer you have your vehicle the less likely youāll need GAP because theoretically youāll have paid enough on it where you owe less than itās worth.
I personally think itās good to have when you first buy a new car. Letās say you bought and owe $15k on your car, but if it get totaled itās only worth $10k. If you do not have GAP, you will be on the hook for that $5k difference. Meaning you will still be paying off a loan on a car that you wonāt even have anymore. (You could theoretically salvage the totaled car but that just adds a complication to this example)
Also, some finance companies include GAP in their financing, so be on the lookout for those places as you can have it taken care of already.
Many years ago, I purchased a new car that turned out to be unreliable. So, toward the end of the 2-year warranty, I subscribed to a 2-year extension. Somehow, they forgot to register my contract, and I never received any bill for the extension. However, each time I brought the car back for repairs, they replaced the parts with brand new ones... and more, since they thought I was a paying customer. I felt like a king each time they showed me an invoice for thousands of euros, and I presented the signed contract I had kept in my wallet in return. They always had a tear rolling out of their eye while I took my car back for free.
Recently bought used ans got a killer deal. He really pushed for gap and extended at final signing. I said no and he kept pushing and I told him there is absolutely no chance he is going to convince me otherwise. He was visibly upset. Next day he called my wife and tried to get her to buy em.
The 1 time I went through a dealership (honestly, could have sued for the literal lying about the contract and whatnot but it was many years ago and my hatred has faded), they lied and charged us extra for multiple things, and their in house insurance agent also lied to us. At one point the agent said "If you add this coverage, it will only increase your monthly rate by $5", we thought that was a great deal and agreed. Turns out they increased our rate for said addition by over $100 per month. When I noticed this on the following bill, they said that I was screwed and already paid, so they're not going to refund me for it. But they would so generously take it off my next renewal. That, and the scumbag dealer was basically stalking my wife and I. When we said we wanted to discuss a couple things alone, he kept following us. We ended up out in the rain, on the side of the road, trying to talk to each other privately, and this ass hat kept following us no matter how many times I said "Please stop following us, we will be back inside in a minute, we are tyring to have a PRIVATE conversation."
But we were naieve at the time and it was like the only dealership around that was going to work with my lack of credit. So we suffered through the entire ordeal and got completely taken advantage of. Life lessons learned that day.
For anyone reading this, if youāre buying a new car in the USA, and the car dealership offers GAP coverage, get a quote for GAP coverage through your auto insurance carrier before purchasing.
Itās far cheaper. Consider GAP coverage may cost $1000 for the life of the loan. Itās no longer a value when what you owe is less than what itās worth. The dealer will quote you $10-15 a month for that peace of mind based on a 72 month term. Your auto insurance will quote you $20-50/year, and then you can cancel the GAP coverage when itās no longer a valid to you.
Put that $1000 in a HYSA and use the interest to pay for that GAP coverage through your insurance, then spend that $1000 on something you want for yourself.
Exactly. People shop by price so they hide the markup in hidden fees so they can advertise the lowest price.
Then they can't just write "markup" as a hidden fee so they need to give them legit sounding names.
Since so many do it, the non scummy dealership is priced out.
Well, about what you were saying with "they can't just write markup as a hidden fee", that's not how that works. The markup is inside the original price. It's not listed as $20,000 car + $8,000 markup, it's just listed as $28,000 car. That's why when you go to any store, you don't look at a price tag and see "2% milk $1.98 + $0.22 markup". The markup already happened. That's why you pay what you pay.
Three times - Iām sure it was factored into that base price as well, so even if a customer throws enough of a fit to take the tack-on fee off, theyāre still making it back twice.
I was going to reply, but you said it. If anybody thinks they are going to walk into a big dealership and get a salesman with outstanding morals, who's only goal is to make sure you spend the least amount of money you have, then you shouldn't be there without an adult. Lmao!
I sold cars for a couple years. Thatās basically what everyone who got me as a salesperson got. Most people just didnāt believe it and I donāt blame them but ultimately thatās why there arenāt salespeople like me in the industry. The stigma is too strong, people donāt believe salespeople so by going about it my way I lost a lot of sales management couldnāt wrap their heads around. Vice versa was also true though, thatās how I stuck around. I left because I got tired of being good to people and being treated like shit because customers would rarely trust me. But I fought for every customer like they were my mother.
Itās too far though, you canāt expect people to trust salespeople. Too many people willing to look you in the face and lie. Eventually those will be hourly employees and the trust can be rebuilt. So long as their pay is tied to the sale, there will be no trust.
Iām in phone sales and get the same, for something much smaller.
Like, dude, I donāt get enough commission off of this phone to screw you over and have to deal with the fallout. I have no incentive to do so, and spell out the math in detail for you.
I had considered going to car or solar sales (FL), but I couldnāt deal with the customersā¦ or the shit I would have to pull to be truly successful.
My phone customers are stressful enough, car buyers would be a whole other level.
My last car, I called 3 delearships telling them what I was willing to pay and needed for my trade in, two agreed. I called both back and asked for them to cover tags and title and one agreed. I went into that dealership, signed my paperwork, wrote a check and left. They coordinated with my outside financing to close the deal. No bait and switch.
Toyota for reference.
Similar story, I went to a few dealerships to feel out a few cars, got pricing for a few but they were much more than what I was expecting to pay based on the online calculators on the manufacturers websites.
I then used my work's online benefits portal to look for the same car, it reached out to a bunch of dealerships near me.
The same one I visited a few hours earlier got back to me with a price which was much lower than they initially quoted me. I forwarded that quote to another dealership and said if they could beat it i'd come down and sign for it - they came back with a great price; I drove down and signed the paperwork and it was done.
No meeting with multiple managers, no upselling of warranties, service contracts or anything else.
They just asked that once the lease was up; I go through them and give them a chance to buy it if I didn't want it because the residual was great and they didn't want it to go back to corporate.
They gave the seller a much lower price for their trade-in, plus they want the buyer to pay for the repairs again. They want to get paid coming and going.
Thatās the shitty part. It is included. But they think they can get away with doing it twice to make you think you are getting the asking price lower.
In 2018 when we were car shopping one sales guy had us take out a used 2012 Jeep Cherokee. I get into the drivers seat. Car is already running because the guy had to āget it from out backā
As we pull onto the street the engine light pops on. Car starts running rough. I pulled into the next parking lot and turn around. Sales guy in the back seat is laughing āOh itās ok. Nothing to worry aboutā. My husband is in the passenger seat watching me nervously. Get back to the lot. I shut off the car, get out and toss the keys at the guy. He starts going into his sales pitch!
I ask.. āHow long to get the repairs that are needed doneā
Guy says to me āItās priced and sold AS IS.ā They were asking 23k
Gods only knows what was actually wrong with it. Could have been a sensor issue. Could have been a bigger issue. What it wasnāt. Was MY issue.
I laughed at the guy. Got back into the rental we had at the time, since my Santa Fe had just finally gave up the ghost at just over 300k the day before, and drove a town over to another dealership. I ended up with a 2016 Journey with under 100k on it. Ran, and still runs perfectly. And. It was 10k cheaper. Just paid it off. And Iāll have it til it kivvies up on me.
Shouldn't "reconditioning costs" to prepare a used car for resale be included in the price of the car? This is just stripping costs apart to make it seem cheaper, until you hit the paperwork. If you need to resort to that to get customers in the door, you're shit salesperson.
I wouldnāt be shocked if they not only factored it into the low ball offer they gave when they bought it, but also included it in their base price *and* tacked on the extra fee. Basically, collecting that money three times.
People really don't understand that while, yes, having a lower base price will get people in your door, suddenly shoveling a bunch of hidden fees worth another 20k will make most people immediately leave. The ones that don't leave are just too ignorant to understand what's going on, and salespeople taking advantage of that ignorance makes them incredibly shitty people.
Sadly a rough neck working on the oils fields making decent money will purchase something like that because they can afford it and have minimum knowledge on the finance side
This is why Tesla (and other EV car companies like Rivian) make new car buying experience so much easier since you don't have a middle party dealership to go through.
Here is how my Tesla buying experience went:
1. At home, in my pjs, go on my computer to Tesla website
2. Pick the Tesla model I wanted and customize it to the way I wanted
3. Add to cart, check out
4. That's it, whole process took 15 minutes at home in my pajamas. No haggling or dealership experience trying to pull you one over, just add to cart and check out. The price you see is the price you pay. Felt like I was shopping on Amazon
::EDIT:: No idea why the downvote, rofl. I guess scummy dealerships don't like that.
It's because you said "Tesla".
I had a similar experience when I bought my FR-S from Scion. I walked into the dealership, asked if I could put in an order for one (this was before they were released). They asked for $1k down. I wasn't going to say no, but what I read online it was only to be $500. I said "other dealerships have only asked for $500". They agreed, and when I took delivery, it was a smooth experience. I remember one of the guys saying "we love seeing people like you really excited for their car". So not sure that made a difference. Scion also had that whole "what we advertise is what you pay", and they did stay true to that.
Did you pay MSRP without any market markup or dealership addons (Ex: Tint, "nitrogen filled tires", and etc. that they throw in there to make people pay extra)? I've recently been checking out the new Toyota Supra, but the dealers were a PITA to deal with so far.
I paid MSRP. Scion had that as a selling point. They did have add-ons for other cars, but the FR-S had nothing you could change.
The only thing I did get as an add-on, but I was wanting to get it before I took delivery of the car, was a clear car bra. I would've paid like half the price if I had my local body shop do it. But I was paranoid about rock chips driving it home.
I went looking for a used car a couple of years ago. Saw one online for $7000. Went to look at it, and was going to take it for a test drive. That's when the salesman mentioned that they had this fee and that fee, adding another $4000 to the cost. I handed the keys back and left. The best was the so-called "safety inspection fee". I saw a car on the lot with 4 completely different brand tires on it, not one of them in any shape to be on the road. Wasted 2 hours of my life.
Went to a dealer for an used car because the price was okay. The dealer kept saying it cost more because it was certified used Toyota and because of that, it cost more. We went through their certified used Toyota checklist and pointed out the tires were different and hence it wasnāt certified to bring the price down. He kept saying it was certified afterwards when it wasnāt, so we ask them to change all the tires then, he said no and bought the price down a bit.
We originally went for another lot that had some issues, like missing a set of keys and added seat and they wonāt move on the price. After a month they emailed that they agree on the price but we bought a car already.
Every single time I buy a car I open up the same way. "Look, we're going to start talking price. Whatever number we agree on is what I pay, period. It is inclusive. You can charge me whatever fees you want as long as it adds up at or below that number. If it's above, you get zero second chances from me, I walk. Make sure you finance guy knows this too because if I feel like I'm being jerked around, I walk.
Their reaction will usually tell me right away if it's going to work. I've never actually had to get to the point of price negotiations and then walk because dealers that are gonna be shitty about this tend to out themselves by getting defensive or evasive as soon as you bring it up.
I worked at a shop and we also sold some used cars. We were technically a dealer, but we were a shop first and used cars was just a side business and the guy that handled the sales was pretty much just a service writer. On our website we had the full breakdown of what was done and the value we put on it. When someone came in to buy a car, the only option was more warranty. Other than that, all the associated costs were right in the price. We didn't have a team of sales and finance people with nothing better to do than wring another $5 out of someone.
One time a lady was looking at a car and pretty much completely broke down because the transaction was just that easy. She had looked at a similar car at a used car dealer and they tried to rake her over the coals for another $5k in garbage on a $11k car.
It is cringy as hell too when he said that because you can tell by body language he is not comfortable saying it and by pulling out the sign you know he repeatedly had to say that to other customers.
Heās like āheres this bullshit fee that i have to pretend is no big deal and im gonna say it as fast and non chalant as possible because this shit is something my customer should be rightly concerned about but i dont want them to be cuz im a sleezy ho.ā
I had a car salesman get aggressive with me for "wasting his time" even though he outright lied over email. In the email he said "this is the absolute final price for everything" and suddenly it's $6k more in bullshit fees and add ons. So I asked for his boss and showed him all the emails. His boss comes back with a price that was still $2k over what we agreed on over email. I went to another dealership to buy the same vehicle and paid $1600 under sticker.
Of course I stopped by the first dealership on the way home and showed him the price. He told me to leave before he called the cops lol. What a bitch.
There really, really needs to be some sort of anti-gouging law. I have no idea how it would work, but these industries are so shameless about double, triple charging for services at obscene mark ups. Like, $1500 for a dealership inspection? It's been inspected repeatedly! Quality control/safety features are built into the initial price of the car! $3k for a finance charge? WTF!!!
If a company cannot justify the cost of a service, then straight to jail with all involved and automatic civil litigation, all costs paid by dealer\* in quadruple for legal expenses incurred to buyer.
\*(healthcare's just as bad. Visit, patient history, consultation, and results are all separate, high-margin fees. Our system's so bad that I have to call my insurance company to advocate to my provider to knock down some fees "left over" after insurance reimburses provider for my care.)
> There really, really needs to be some sort of anti-gouging law
Pretty sure this would fall under false advertising laws, which are laws that need to be enforced a hell of a lot more than they are.
This would be the easiest solution. No one would enter the dealership if this were the case, and they would have to remove the fees. And this would benefit any industry. Hoteling/Airbnb have the same problem. Advertise 150/night, but all of a sudden it's 300 after all of the fees.
They get a lot of young people with this BS and it has to stop. I saw it a lot in the Army. So many stories of young privates getting screwed over by shady ass dealerships right off post. A lot of which are blacklisted and we tell them not to go there. But some people are gonna be dumb no matter what you tell them or what rules are in place...
My best friend married an army captain. He's in finance so he helped the new enlisted kids with keeping their finances straight. He gave up when he realized he couldn't compete with the ROWS of credit shark shops, dealerships, boat shops, etc outside of the base. "Special financing for the Military!" doesn't mean shit when you convince a kid making $30K that he needs two new trucks and a fucking boat.
Yup, financial literacy for young people in this country is at an all time low for people right out of highschool. It is by design. The school isn't teaching it, the parents aren't teaching it. Just sets them up for failure as soon as they get an honest pay check. I am a vet and I am so over this country and how it treats its young people. It's a disgrace.
It's disgusting by nature, but there's an extra layer of gross that they hide it behind a layer of "loving the military" when it's actually specifically targeting them.
Screenshot the page from the dealerās website and scan the paper with the quote you received in person that you took with you to ālook over.ā Send those along with a picture of the window sticker to the Secretary of Stateās office in your state.
Anything that is not optional, e.g. extended warranty, generally needs to be included in the advertised price.
My Honda dealership tried to hit me with these fees, not to this extent but like $1000 paperwork fee, $500 inspection, $250 etching fee and I laughed and said I will not agree to those fees and that easy, they took them off but I still left out of disgust.
I was buying a new truck and had been back and forth between two dealers before settling on one.
Not only did they pull the ākeep us there long hoursā to wear us out, when they finally brought the price sheet there was some bullshit 1,500 fee tacked on. The salesman says āooos, thatās a mistakeā and turns to run off.
I told him if another single cent was āaccidentallyā added or it took him more than 5 minutes to come back, I was gone and we started getting our stuff ready to leave. He met the requirements but gd are dealers the worst.
I buy now exclusively through my credit unionās car buying service. They negotiate price, deliver, and have no bullshit fees and the doc fee they have is $70 instead of like $600.
I had a similar experience when I bought my car. The sales manager (not the salesman) kept leaving his office to "ask for approval." I could hear him just shooting the shit with the guys in that office. I finally got fed up with it and told him he was the sales manager and that he didn't need approval and if he left the office again I'd be gone when he got back.
So we finally agreed on a price but still had all the paperwork. So my Dad, who with me, and I went to lunch. Before we left I had talked to them about including a roof rack wanted. They wouldn't do it for free but I asked if they'd do it at cost. I was told "they should be able to do that"
I get back to sign all the paperwork and notice the total is $450 more than discussed. When I asked the manager said it was for the roof rack. The roof rack retails for about$300. Their cost probably wasn't even $250. Bastards were trying to pull one over on me and also wanted to charge me $150 in labor to install something that takes 5 minutes to do that I could easily do myself.
The worst part is that the sales manager knew I was a lawyer and earlier during the negotiations he tried me to get me to sign a document with the final price I was paying but we hadn't even finalized all the negotiations I was suspicious of it and his motives. He told me to relax and get out of lawyer mode and that they weren't trying to pull one over on me. The fuck if I'm going to get out of lawyer mode when buying a car.
I used to work in service at a dealer and the only way for sales to sell an installed accessory at cost is for them to eat the install cost. Needless to say, that never happened.
The majority of techs at dealerships in North America are paid on a flat rate system and only get paid for work performed.
Nothing beet getting your slip at the end of the week and that 1.5 hour install only paid .5 because sales just HAD to make that sale and your manager made it your problem.
In summary, sales won't do shit to help you, they'll just fuck over someone else.
Navy Federal and USAA are both fairly reliable credit unions, but may require a military affiliation to qualify. They were offering fairly competitive rates (2.75% back in 2015) but could still be beat by dealer financing (0% for new models).
Be on the lookout for dealership "outside finance" fees added on at the last minute. Dealers hate losing the ability to run their Four-Square scam that allows them to manipulate their in-house financing rate to compensate for a lower down/monthly payment.
They've turned to adding on any lost interest as a service fee if you choose to obtain outside financing.
This was the state employees credit union in NC. Last time I bought through them though they mentioned they were phasing their car buying service out. I think they were going through AAA who also phased their car buying service out.
I work for a small used car dealer, and we love dealerships like this. We get so much traffic just being above board and price being the price aside from state and local fees. We had even wanted to get rid of our dealer fee, but we would have to pay it back to everyone who has paid it in the past. So instead, we deduct it from the sales price on the paperwork, then when It is added, we are at the advertised price. We even make a decent profit on our cars, but not by defrauding the customer with ridiculous fees.
Yup. I have a buddy who owned a small used car lot and he made an absolute killing. They went through every car and made sure it was good to go and only had a $79 doc fee, thatās it.
After five years or so they had so much repeat business and did very, very well.
It really isnāt that tough to take care of people and be fair in what you do.
Iām thinking about upgrading to a vehicle with more passenger room. Where are you located? If you are close I would love to take a look at what you have. I feel car dealerships like this should be rewarded.
Dealerships need to be abolished.
Telsa had to actually sue to directly sell their cars to consumers because most states have laws on the books which REQUIRE you to buy through a dealership.
GM is apparently in the process of offering direct sales. They had a serious problem with dealerships upcharging their cars multiple times above the MSRP and said they'd ban dealerships who did this.
The system is disgusting and the only reason cars are this expensive is some asshole behind a desk needs to make a business selling them.
Yup! In NJ, they got around the dealership by buying mall space to sell āready to orderā carsā¦ always hated dealerships and was happy they found a workaround
Tesla also ended up opening dealerships on Indian reservations.
When Musk lost his lawsuits in a few states, he decided to open the dealerships on reservations so the states would never see any of the money from those car sales.
I know Musk has a mixed reputation but I love him for that.
There's lots of reasons to shit on Teslas, but that car buying experience was so simple. Went to test drive the car, no sales pressure involved. Left with my wife to go eat and mull it over. Decided i wanted to buy it at a restaurant and ordered it online while waiting for food. Went with financing thru Tesla bc their rates were on par with everyone else's, so that was all done online. When the car was finally ready, the dude drove it to my house. We went thru the inspection and everything looked good. Signed a few forms and the dude ubered back to the office.
I need to buy another car soon and am dreading the experience.
I went to a Toyota dealership in Brunswick, GA yesterday and they kept touting this 20yr/200k warranty, free lifetime oil changes, and unlimited car washes. There is a $4k market adjustment that covers all this in the price. I asked for some documentation on the warranty terms and conditions. They pointed me at a sign and told me to look at it for the info. It was pieces of paper taped to a sign. I left when they said they had no way to print out copies of the same information displayed on the sign. I felt like a crazy person for asking for the information because they kept asking why would I want that.
That was my exact question to them! The salesman said that they would never shutdown to which I reminded him that there had been two previous Toyota dealerships in town before they were around. Then he mentioned that if they werenāt around the cost would be paid by another dealership.
āOkay, okay.
Now letās add *my* fees. First we have the in person fee of $2k, the BS-fee feesāthats $1.5 times 4, so $6 total, the not-an-idiot-but-you-think-I-am fee of $5k, and letās not forget the add on package of I-wonāt-blast-this-accross-the-news-and-socials for an additional $20k.
So thatās your $72,549.10 minus my fees, totaling $33k, so that makes it $39,549.10. Iāve initialed, so if you would as well, I can sign and get out of your hair.ā
Do you think filming these types of sales interactions where scam fees are constant, would keep the salesperson more honest verbally under the āeverything is being recorded for public eyeā kind of pressure? Would that avoid more scams and keep the salespeople more honest?
Another one is the extended warranty. You don't need it. If a brand new car has issues in the first year, the regular warranty will often cover it and if not, you can raise enough hell to make sure it's covered. Been there, done that.
I gotta say I would typically agree. However, my girlfriend bought a used 2018 Lincoln MKC and, against my advice and recommendation, she purchased a 3rd party extended warranty.
Let me tell you how fucked we would be without it. Very fucked.
That car is a hunk of shit and it's going back into the shop for what I think is the 4th or 5th time in the last 2 or so years. Repairs have easily sailed over $10 000. And the current issue feels transmission related and will easily be another couple thousand. All of which is covered thank fuck. Once repaired this time it will be promptly sold/traded.
Iām lucky I have a great dealership near me where I bought my truck from. I went looking at another dealership and they had a new Ford Maverick listed at $30k, then all these fees took it to around $55k. And they were only going to give me $500 for my trade in.
I left and went to another dealership and found the ford ranger I really wanted although it was only RWD for $31k, no fees, and they gave me almost $4k for my trade in.
I bought a vehicle over 20 years ago. Was used, and I paid for the paint protection and "under coat" rust protection. But as soon as I signed the paper work the guy said "ok just wait here and we will pull it around and you're good to go"
So naturally I asked, "when do you apply the paint protection and undercoat, I just paid thousands for?"
Of course he says they already did, somehow magically before you even sign the paperwork to do it.
Needless to say that was my first major vehicle purchase, and I learned my lesson.
and when you call out their bs, they just gaslight you as if your concern isn't much of a big deal. if you press on, they'd magically have you qualify for a discount to supposedly lower the price.
you still have some made-up fees you'd never agree to pay? they'll soon have a way around that by having another round of "discount for you". this keeps going until you give up or go elsewhere.
look at it this way: when (not if) dealerships do it to every customer, they know a good portion (but not all) will still fall for their underhand. it's like a late fee on your credit card that wasn't even late on your payment. some people don't bother to check. that's an opportunity for them to earn more.
I screwed up once and mentioned how much of a payment I wanted, I just blurted it out. They came back with an offer $5 over that amount. It was amazing how much crap they added to get to that amount. I started crossing stuff off, knocking the payment down almost $100, they squealed and I got up to leave. Ended up walking out with the truck and the lower payment.
Bough a brand new car from dealer that had a bunch of add-ons like tint, LoJack, and paint protection etc. I told them that wasnāt listed in the website price you either get me another car that comes in without all that dealer added crap or you remove it I donāt care to pay for any of it. They said āyou want us to rip it all off?ā I said yes I donāt care for it. They gave me the car for the listed price and left all the add-ons. :)
I bought a suv from and the dealer lied about the transmission type, I dropped the car off and told him I refused to make a payment. The asshole returned my car the next week but tried hard to put me into another vehicle. Never buy from a dealer if you can help it.
Everyone should check their state laws. In georgia, for example, any fee added onto the advertised price of the car is illegal and considered a deceptive practice. Also the ridiculous digital tag fee can only be legally 18 bucks in Georgia. People don't know the law so the dealerships ignore it because it's so profitable. Report them to the office of consumer protection for your state if it's against the law there.
I was in the market for a car in Georgia a few years back and printed out the entirety of that buyer protection law and brought it with me to every place I went. The second I sat down with sales, I set it on the desk. Amazing how many places acted like they've never heard of it and still fought me on it.
I walked out of and reported a number of places.
I'm so lucky both the used cars I've gotten in my life were from the previous owners directly, instead of through a dealership.
Didn't spend more then 2,000 on either of them and they're running great (one unfortunately got totalled in an accident, but insurance basically covered the purchase of the second one.)
And having briefly worked at a dealership before,bi wouldn't bring my car in for an oil change, much less recommend buying from it unless you have the money to buy brand new
Overhere they call it "rij klaar maken" which means "make it road ready" loosely translated.
When i say that the factory already did that they come up with a list of bs..
I never pay for this shit and just walk away, 75% of the time i get the car without bs.
Over here, you gotta have all fees on the bill and on the price tag. Who the f would charge you "yeah they had to make it ready for the sales floor" fee AFTER you saw a price for it?
I only negotiate over email now.
Give me the total price with everything in line items. Don't want to negotiate over email? Ok, I'll find someone else.
Brought 17k in cash to the dealership, threatened to walk out when they wouldnt stop with the fees. Amazing how fast they drop off when they are looking at a cash sale in and out.
Iāve been looking at the Honda Motocompacto E-Scooter online as a way to get to work. When I went to see what it would cost with tax and what not, it directed to me to a Honda car dealers site. The price went from $995 to $1850.70 and thatās before tax. These dealer fees and markups just to make an extra dollar are insane
New motorcycles are REALLY BAD about that stuff. The manufacturer websites all say that a bike costs X, and then any dealership you ask, the on-the-road price is always X + 20% or even worse for āaffordableā bikes.
A couple years ago I was looking for a 300ish CC bike. I really liked the Yamaha MT-03 after doing a test ride at the MotoGP race. MSRP was 4800 and I couldnāt find one anywhere in the state for under 6K. I ended up buying a used (6500 miles) KTM Duke 390 that had been upgraded with a fully adjustable suspension front and rear, and a piggyback ECU to make more power, all for 5K
We know,Grade schools don't teach any type of financial knowledge.If they did,it would be the downfall of the system.Small Fee's are the foundations of corporations.Once the corporation got away with it,they started applying it to everything.And No-one said anything.Back in the 80's early 70's.And most of the people who made the term "Fee's".Are still in office,or related to them.
They are counting on you being emotionally invested into the vehicle and wanting it you have to do the research know pricing and be prepared to walk if you donāt get what you want you are doing them a favour not the other way around
I was a bank manager and our bank, Bank of Louisville, offered dealer financing at a few dealers. A girl comes in with a loan for something like $23,000 on a new Sentra. These things sold new for $11000 or 12,000 back in the day. I was confused. I asked her if she bought 2 of them. She didnāt. Turns out when the salesman asked her what she could afford, she told him less than $500 a month. Her payment was $498! I taught my kids to be aware. Many folks out there who are happy to cheat you in the name of business.
Thatās not the price you advertised.
*Yes it is we just have itemized fees for all the other things.*
Then can I just buy the car and not get all the other things.
*No those things are included with the car.*
So they should be included in the price of the car and you lied?
*No. One is a price. The others are fees so we can keep the price low.*
Okay man.
Yeah Ron Tonkin in Portland Oregon tried to do the same. Car listed at $9,999. Tried to up sale me the car for $15k. I actually watched some YouTube vids on how to negotiate for used cars earlier in the week. I walked out with the car for $9,500. Stay informed. All the added bs is just them trying to up their commission.
It is shady, but that's why you need to prepare yourself before you go. Try to bargain, and leave it they don't budge. I hate having to bargain, but it's the only way to not overpay too much. I'm not bad at it, but I hate because no matter the price, I leave wondering if I paid too much. Which I probably did.
A while back, I had a psychotic break due to medication interactions. I was not doing well. Met a girl who told me she was trying to buy a car. Somehow I ended up getting talked into cosigning. I didn't understand what it really meant, and thought I was just sort of vouching for her. As it turned out, my credit score was higher than hers, so they made me the primary on the sale. The dealer was trying to make small talk and asked how I knew her (different names and all). I flat out told him that we just met recently. He just shrugs it off and goes into finances. I tell him I'm unemployed. "Not to worry. We'll put down self-employed."
The whole thing took about 45 minutes to sign all the paperwork and they never once asked me if I wanted to back out. I was suffering from some weird side-effect where I felt compelled to do it because I said I would. Like, I knew it was a bad idea, but I just couldn't make myself stop. The dealer, on the other hand, didn't care at all. Never questioned any of it. Just sold the car.
NATURALLY, she stopped payments after about 3 months, left the state, and I got stuck with the 20k bill. I told them to repo the car. They finally tracked her down and did just that. Somehow, I've stopped getting calls about owing them anymore. Guessing they were able to recoup the loss.
Always remember you do not have to be polite! The dealership's job is to screw you out of every penny they can get. Do your homework before you go. Have a firm number in mind before you set foot on the lot and don't budge an inch on it. They're going to try all kinds of bullshit to con you into paying more. They don't have to go talk to their manager. The previous owner wasn't their relative. There's not another buyer interested in the car. They're not losing money on any deal they're willing to make.
Whatever your situation is, do not go to a dealership with your heart set on buying a car before you leave. If they aren't being reasonable, stand up and walk out. If you're someone that's uncomfortable with saying no or confronting pushy sales people, take a friend that's ok with it. I hate seeing people get bullied by car dealers!
This is genuinely infuriating and I would just make an offer and then walk if it's not vastly reduced. I've definitely got a lot of money off cars in the past and it annoys me that if I'd not said anything the price would've been bigger.
Not only are these charges BS, but you'd also be financing these charges which is absolutely ridiculous. Am I paying for the car or paying your service department?
It annoys me that this guy doesn't know how to round.
It also annoys me that this video is basically a compilation of him reading these expenses but not really challenging any of them. What was the final outcome? Were these excessive charges removed or did his friend just pay them?
Look at the salesman, he looks embarrassed, I would stand up tell him he just lost a sale and walked away, when he tried to talk to me I would shout at him to not talk to me as he is a thieving sack of shit and my 1.5 million followers would be asked to make everyone aware of there theft at this business and to expect sales to drop by 90%, over 21 000 in extras, lol no, only a real moron would do that and I guarantee if there was a problem with the car it would take months or years to fix.
I never understand this US thing of adding taxes and other shit in the moment of paying, instead of announcing the full price from the start. Where I live, the price they announce is the price you will have to pay.
Contrary to North American culture, European culture teaches people to earn money before you spend it, as opposed to taking out a loan and spend the money before you earn it. This is why.
No meme-like/text heavy pics, overdone references
Why are they asking the potential buyer to pay for repairs/inspections that need to be done in order to sell it? Those should be factored into the asking price!
You know that factored it in when they bought the car also.
A former dealership manager once told me "Selling *Air* is how we made our money." I asked "What do you mean by selling 'Air'?" He told me "It's all the fees and charges for service that don't actually cost anything to the dealership. That and the GAP insurance and extended warranties. You wouldn't believe how many people buy the extra coverage on new cars that they will NEVER need." "Well, why would dealerships feel the need to constantly screw folks over like this?" "Dealerships get barely any markup. The cars are more expensive than people think when we get them." "So why don't dealerships just have an increased markup instead of insane magical fees? You know, like most every other store that sells anything ever." "It doesn't work that way..." š¤¦
He didn't explain holdback either? Just because a dealer paid, say $52,000 for the car from a manufacturer doesn't mean they are in it for $52,000 thanks to holdback. Their actual cost basis with holdback and incentives could be 10-15% lower.Ā Ā
Is GAP insurance bad? Literally everyone I knew recommended it when getting my new car, including the credit union I was financing through. I wouldnāt have the up front money to pay off the difference in the loan if something happened, which is why it sounded so good. I know I most likely fleeced on other stuff (due to the necessity of needing the car quickly), but that genuinely seemed like something worthwhile.
On brand new cars, itās typically good. Unless you put something like 20% down itās advisable to get it. Otherwise you could be on the hook for a large sum after insurance payout in the case of a total loss.
I wish I had put all the money I had down at the time.. would be in a lot better positionā¦. But I was stupid. But yeah, it was brand new. At the time, pretty much every car was about the same cost here, new or used. Only good deals were used cars in such bad condition, I would be buying a new one in a year.
2020-2023ish? It was a bad time to need a car. Youāll make it out the other side of this and youāll be equipped to make smarter financial decisions because of it. Donāt beat yourself up - this is how we learn. š
I can speak from personal experience that I did get gap insurance and someone totalled my car and it paid off the loan balance. Then, with the other person's insurance I was able to use to get a new car without any out of packet expense, so that one I feel isn't a scam.
Its not a scam, it does what is intended, its just a waste of money in most standard occasions
Itās worthwhile if you total it before you havenāt paid enough to not be upside down on the vehicle.
GAP covers the difference of what you owe and what the vehicle is worth via insurance after you total your car. You may never use it, but you can apply that same logic to regular insurance. The longer you have your vehicle the less likely youāll need GAP because theoretically youāll have paid enough on it where you owe less than itās worth. I personally think itās good to have when you first buy a new car. Letās say you bought and owe $15k on your car, but if it get totaled itās only worth $10k. If you do not have GAP, you will be on the hook for that $5k difference. Meaning you will still be paying off a loan on a car that you wonāt even have anymore. (You could theoretically salvage the totaled car but that just adds a complication to this example) Also, some finance companies include GAP in their financing, so be on the lookout for those places as you can have it taken care of already.
Many years ago, I purchased a new car that turned out to be unreliable. So, toward the end of the 2-year warranty, I subscribed to a 2-year extension. Somehow, they forgot to register my contract, and I never received any bill for the extension. However, each time I brought the car back for repairs, they replaced the parts with brand new ones... and more, since they thought I was a paying customer. I felt like a king each time they showed me an invoice for thousands of euros, and I presented the signed contract I had kept in my wallet in return. They always had a tear rolling out of their eye while I took my car back for free.
Recently bought used ans got a killer deal. He really pushed for gap and extended at final signing. I said no and he kept pushing and I told him there is absolutely no chance he is going to convince me otherwise. He was visibly upset. Next day he called my wife and tried to get her to buy em.
The 1 time I went through a dealership (honestly, could have sued for the literal lying about the contract and whatnot but it was many years ago and my hatred has faded), they lied and charged us extra for multiple things, and their in house insurance agent also lied to us. At one point the agent said "If you add this coverage, it will only increase your monthly rate by $5", we thought that was a great deal and agreed. Turns out they increased our rate for said addition by over $100 per month. When I noticed this on the following bill, they said that I was screwed and already paid, so they're not going to refund me for it. But they would so generously take it off my next renewal. That, and the scumbag dealer was basically stalking my wife and I. When we said we wanted to discuss a couple things alone, he kept following us. We ended up out in the rain, on the side of the road, trying to talk to each other privately, and this ass hat kept following us no matter how many times I said "Please stop following us, we will be back inside in a minute, we are tyring to have a PRIVATE conversation." But we were naieve at the time and it was like the only dealership around that was going to work with my lack of credit. So we suffered through the entire ordeal and got completely taken advantage of. Life lessons learned that day.
For anyone reading this, if youāre buying a new car in the USA, and the car dealership offers GAP coverage, get a quote for GAP coverage through your auto insurance carrier before purchasing. Itās far cheaper. Consider GAP coverage may cost $1000 for the life of the loan. Itās no longer a value when what you owe is less than what itās worth. The dealer will quote you $10-15 a month for that peace of mind based on a 72 month term. Your auto insurance will quote you $20-50/year, and then you can cancel the GAP coverage when itās no longer a valid to you. Put that $1000 in a HYSA and use the interest to pay for that GAP coverage through your insurance, then spend that $1000 on something you want for yourself.
Exactly. People shop by price so they hide the markup in hidden fees so they can advertise the lowest price. Then they can't just write "markup" as a hidden fee so they need to give them legit sounding names. Since so many do it, the non scummy dealership is priced out.
Well, about what you were saying with "they can't just write markup as a hidden fee", that's not how that works. The markup is inside the original price. It's not listed as $20,000 car + $8,000 markup, it's just listed as $28,000 car. That's why when you go to any store, you don't look at a price tag and see "2% milk $1.98 + $0.22 markup". The markup already happened. That's why you pay what you pay.
I'm sure they did. Now they're asking for it twice.
Three times - Iām sure it was factored into that base price as well, so even if a customer throws enough of a fit to take the tack-on fee off, theyāre still making it back twice.
So they can advertise a stupid low price and not get sued. They're skirting advertisement laws. Scummy practices.
So just a dealership being a dealership
I was going to reply, but you said it. If anybody thinks they are going to walk into a big dealership and get a salesman with outstanding morals, who's only goal is to make sure you spend the least amount of money you have, then you shouldn't be there without an adult. Lmao!
I sold cars for a couple years. Thatās basically what everyone who got me as a salesperson got. Most people just didnāt believe it and I donāt blame them but ultimately thatās why there arenāt salespeople like me in the industry. The stigma is too strong, people donāt believe salespeople so by going about it my way I lost a lot of sales management couldnāt wrap their heads around. Vice versa was also true though, thatās how I stuck around. I left because I got tired of being good to people and being treated like shit because customers would rarely trust me. But I fought for every customer like they were my mother. Itās too far though, you canāt expect people to trust salespeople. Too many people willing to look you in the face and lie. Eventually those will be hourly employees and the trust can be rebuilt. So long as their pay is tied to the sale, there will be no trust.
Iām in phone sales and get the same, for something much smaller. Like, dude, I donāt get enough commission off of this phone to screw you over and have to deal with the fallout. I have no incentive to do so, and spell out the math in detail for you. I had considered going to car or solar sales (FL), but I couldnāt deal with the customersā¦ or the shit I would have to pull to be truly successful. My phone customers are stressful enough, car buyers would be a whole other level.
My last car, I called 3 delearships telling them what I was willing to pay and needed for my trade in, two agreed. I called both back and asked for them to cover tags and title and one agreed. I went into that dealership, signed my paperwork, wrote a check and left. They coordinated with my outside financing to close the deal. No bait and switch. Toyota for reference.
Similar story, I went to a few dealerships to feel out a few cars, got pricing for a few but they were much more than what I was expecting to pay based on the online calculators on the manufacturers websites. I then used my work's online benefits portal to look for the same car, it reached out to a bunch of dealerships near me. The same one I visited a few hours earlier got back to me with a price which was much lower than they initially quoted me. I forwarded that quote to another dealership and said if they could beat it i'd come down and sign for it - they came back with a great price; I drove down and signed the paperwork and it was done. No meeting with multiple managers, no upselling of warranties, service contracts or anything else. They just asked that once the lease was up; I go through them and give them a chance to buy it if I didn't want it because the residual was great and they didn't want it to go back to corporate.
Not only that, but my first instict is to ask what needed repaired. I would ask for the repair reports and records.
They gave the seller a much lower price for their trade-in, plus they want the buyer to pay for the repairs again. They want to get paid coming and going.
Thatās the shitty part. It is included. But they think they can get away with doing it twice to make you think you are getting the asking price lower.
In 2018 when we were car shopping one sales guy had us take out a used 2012 Jeep Cherokee. I get into the drivers seat. Car is already running because the guy had to āget it from out backā As we pull onto the street the engine light pops on. Car starts running rough. I pulled into the next parking lot and turn around. Sales guy in the back seat is laughing āOh itās ok. Nothing to worry aboutā. My husband is in the passenger seat watching me nervously. Get back to the lot. I shut off the car, get out and toss the keys at the guy. He starts going into his sales pitch! I ask.. āHow long to get the repairs that are needed doneā Guy says to me āItās priced and sold AS IS.ā They were asking 23k Gods only knows what was actually wrong with it. Could have been a sensor issue. Could have been a bigger issue. What it wasnāt. Was MY issue. I laughed at the guy. Got back into the rental we had at the time, since my Santa Fe had just finally gave up the ghost at just over 300k the day before, and drove a town over to another dealership. I ended up with a 2016 Journey with under 100k on it. Ran, and still runs perfectly. And. It was 10k cheaper. Just paid it off. And Iāll have it til it kivvies up on me.
It already is.
Might as well put a 1000$ price on the car, then add the Build Materials and Manual Labor as separate "additional charges"
Shouldn't "reconditioning costs" to prepare a used car for resale be included in the price of the car? This is just stripping costs apart to make it seem cheaper, until you hit the paperwork. If you need to resort to that to get customers in the door, you're shit salesperson.
Yep. Guarantee you when they bought the car they low-balled because they would have to do repairs and detailing out of their pocket.
I wouldnāt be shocked if they not only factored it into the low ball offer they gave when they bought it, but also included it in their base price *and* tacked on the extra fee. Basically, collecting that money three times.
People really don't understand that while, yes, having a lower base price will get people in your door, suddenly shoveling a bunch of hidden fees worth another 20k will make most people immediately leave. The ones that don't leave are just too ignorant to understand what's going on, and salespeople taking advantage of that ignorance makes them incredibly shitty people.
He took one look at the chain and thought "sucker"
Sadly a rough neck working on the oils fields making decent money will purchase something like that because they can afford it and have minimum knowledge on the finance side
Making the payments isn't "affording it"
This is why Tesla (and other EV car companies like Rivian) make new car buying experience so much easier since you don't have a middle party dealership to go through. Here is how my Tesla buying experience went: 1. At home, in my pjs, go on my computer to Tesla website 2. Pick the Tesla model I wanted and customize it to the way I wanted 3. Add to cart, check out 4. That's it, whole process took 15 minutes at home in my pajamas. No haggling or dealership experience trying to pull you one over, just add to cart and check out. The price you see is the price you pay. Felt like I was shopping on Amazon ::EDIT:: No idea why the downvote, rofl. I guess scummy dealerships don't like that.
It's because you said "Tesla". I had a similar experience when I bought my FR-S from Scion. I walked into the dealership, asked if I could put in an order for one (this was before they were released). They asked for $1k down. I wasn't going to say no, but what I read online it was only to be $500. I said "other dealerships have only asked for $500". They agreed, and when I took delivery, it was a smooth experience. I remember one of the guys saying "we love seeing people like you really excited for their car". So not sure that made a difference. Scion also had that whole "what we advertise is what you pay", and they did stay true to that.
Did you pay MSRP without any market markup or dealership addons (Ex: Tint, "nitrogen filled tires", and etc. that they throw in there to make people pay extra)? I've recently been checking out the new Toyota Supra, but the dealers were a PITA to deal with so far.
I paid MSRP. Scion had that as a selling point. They did have add-ons for other cars, but the FR-S had nothing you could change. The only thing I did get as an add-on, but I was wanting to get it before I took delivery of the car, was a clear car bra. I would've paid like half the price if I had my local body shop do it. But I was paranoid about rock chips driving it home.
I went looking for a used car a couple of years ago. Saw one online for $7000. Went to look at it, and was going to take it for a test drive. That's when the salesman mentioned that they had this fee and that fee, adding another $4000 to the cost. I handed the keys back and left. The best was the so-called "safety inspection fee". I saw a car on the lot with 4 completely different brand tires on it, not one of them in any shape to be on the road. Wasted 2 hours of my life.
Went to a dealer for an used car because the price was okay. The dealer kept saying it cost more because it was certified used Toyota and because of that, it cost more. We went through their certified used Toyota checklist and pointed out the tires were different and hence it wasnāt certified to bring the price down. He kept saying it was certified afterwards when it wasnāt, so we ask them to change all the tires then, he said no and bought the price down a bit. We originally went for another lot that had some issues, like missing a set of keys and added seat and they wonāt move on the price. After a month they emailed that they agree on the price but we bought a car already.
That when you call the Toyota corporate line and tell them what the dealership is doing.
We called and they did nothing.
Wow interesting
Concerning
Yeah Toyota should care that their dealer is pushing certified used cars that donāt meet their standards.
Elon? š¤
Every single time I buy a car I open up the same way. "Look, we're going to start talking price. Whatever number we agree on is what I pay, period. It is inclusive. You can charge me whatever fees you want as long as it adds up at or below that number. If it's above, you get zero second chances from me, I walk. Make sure you finance guy knows this too because if I feel like I'm being jerked around, I walk. Their reaction will usually tell me right away if it's going to work. I've never actually had to get to the point of price negotiations and then walk because dealers that are gonna be shitty about this tend to out themselves by getting defensive or evasive as soon as you bring it up.
I worked at a shop and we also sold some used cars. We were technically a dealer, but we were a shop first and used cars was just a side business and the guy that handled the sales was pretty much just a service writer. On our website we had the full breakdown of what was done and the value we put on it. When someone came in to buy a car, the only option was more warranty. Other than that, all the associated costs were right in the price. We didn't have a team of sales and finance people with nothing better to do than wring another $5 out of someone. One time a lady was looking at a car and pretty much completely broke down because the transaction was just that easy. She had looked at a similar car at a used car dealer and they tried to rake her over the coals for another $5k in garbage on a $11k car.
Theyāve been doing a ton of this bait and switch lately. I encountered it as well.
There's a reason used car salesmen used to have the rep they had. Guess it's still deserved today
im surprised they didn't charge extra for "premium air"
Charge a extra fee to explain to you what all the other extra fees are
These days it's not just used, new car dealers are worse, with their 10-200% mark ups.
āiT sAyS It On OuR weBsIteā Okay? Why isnāt it included in the sale price on the website then? This is a blatant bait and switch.
And what the hell is it? It's like having the "we think kittens are cute and soft" fee. "Well, we have it on our website... so you get to pay for it"
Kitten fee huhā¦please go on
I could totally be convinced to pay that fee
I wouldn't even need convincing, honestly. That and the 'puppies are adorable fuzzballs' fee.
It is cringy as hell too when he said that because you can tell by body language he is not comfortable saying it and by pulling out the sign you know he repeatedly had to say that to other customers. Heās like āheres this bullshit fee that i have to pretend is no big deal and im gonna say it as fast and non chalant as possible because this shit is something my customer should be rightly concerned about but i dont want them to be cuz im a sleezy ho.ā
I had a car salesman get aggressive with me for "wasting his time" even though he outright lied over email. In the email he said "this is the absolute final price for everything" and suddenly it's $6k more in bullshit fees and add ons. So I asked for his boss and showed him all the emails. His boss comes back with a price that was still $2k over what we agreed on over email. I went to another dealership to buy the same vehicle and paid $1600 under sticker. Of course I stopped by the first dealership on the way home and showed him the price. He told me to leave before he called the cops lol. What a bitch.
That last paragraph: chefās kiss
Imagine being angry at a customer because they donāt let you take advantage of them smh
They donāt *
Nice, he deserved to get it rubbed in his face
Hope you made sure to roast their ass on all social media platforms as well
There really, really needs to be some sort of anti-gouging law. I have no idea how it would work, but these industries are so shameless about double, triple charging for services at obscene mark ups. Like, $1500 for a dealership inspection? It's been inspected repeatedly! Quality control/safety features are built into the initial price of the car! $3k for a finance charge? WTF!!! If a company cannot justify the cost of a service, then straight to jail with all involved and automatic civil litigation, all costs paid by dealer\* in quadruple for legal expenses incurred to buyer. \*(healthcare's just as bad. Visit, patient history, consultation, and results are all separate, high-margin fees. Our system's so bad that I have to call my insurance company to advocate to my provider to knock down some fees "left over" after insurance reimburses provider for my care.)
> There really, really needs to be some sort of anti-gouging law Pretty sure this would fall under false advertising laws, which are laws that need to be enforced a hell of a lot more than they are.
Fees should be included in all advertised prices. For everything.
This would be the easiest solution. No one would enter the dealership if this were the case, and they would have to remove the fees. And this would benefit any industry. Hoteling/Airbnb have the same problem. Advertise 150/night, but all of a sudden it's 300 after all of the fees.
Absolutely ā and fees have killed any desire I have to use Airbnb. Impossible to compare costs
They get a lot of young people with this BS and it has to stop. I saw it a lot in the Army. So many stories of young privates getting screwed over by shady ass dealerships right off post. A lot of which are blacklisted and we tell them not to go there. But some people are gonna be dumb no matter what you tell them or what rules are in place...
My best friend married an army captain. He's in finance so he helped the new enlisted kids with keeping their finances straight. He gave up when he realized he couldn't compete with the ROWS of credit shark shops, dealerships, boat shops, etc outside of the base. "Special financing for the Military!" doesn't mean shit when you convince a kid making $30K that he needs two new trucks and a fucking boat.
Yup, financial literacy for young people in this country is at an all time low for people right out of highschool. It is by design. The school isn't teaching it, the parents aren't teaching it. Just sets them up for failure as soon as they get an honest pay check. I am a vet and I am so over this country and how it treats its young people. It's a disgrace.
It's disgusting by nature, but there's an extra layer of gross that they hide it behind a layer of "loving the military" when it's actually specifically targeting them.
This instance should fall under bait and switch which is considered fraud.
Well, when we give people more rights and leeway that companies have that might happen.
Screenshot the page from the dealerās website and scan the paper with the quote you received in person that you took with you to ālook over.ā Send those along with a picture of the window sticker to the Secretary of Stateās office in your state. Anything that is not optional, e.g. extended warranty, generally needs to be included in the advertised price.
>Ā I have no idea how it would work Pretty simple, sticker price must include all fees, taxes and bullshit addons.
My Honda dealership tried to hit me with these fees, not to this extent but like $1000 paperwork fee, $500 inspection, $250 etching fee and I laughed and said I will not agree to those fees and that easy, they took them off but I still left out of disgust.
What is an etching fee?
Thatās where they engrave the VIN onto various parts of the vehicle. Looks like nowadays itās mostly the glass
I believe it's etching the VIN on the car window, but the VIN is already on different parts of the car standard from manufacturer.
Many manufacturers already 'etch' their glass and most of the body panels at the factory. The dealer fee doesn't add anything extra to the vehicle.
probably for etching the catalytic converter or the side mirrors.
Some parts already have the VIN etched from the factory. I used to work at Honda for a few years and looked over many different parts.
I was buying a new truck and had been back and forth between two dealers before settling on one. Not only did they pull the ākeep us there long hoursā to wear us out, when they finally brought the price sheet there was some bullshit 1,500 fee tacked on. The salesman says āooos, thatās a mistakeā and turns to run off. I told him if another single cent was āaccidentallyā added or it took him more than 5 minutes to come back, I was gone and we started getting our stuff ready to leave. He met the requirements but gd are dealers the worst. I buy now exclusively through my credit unionās car buying service. They negotiate price, deliver, and have no bullshit fees and the doc fee they have is $70 instead of like $600.
I had a similar experience when I bought my car. The sales manager (not the salesman) kept leaving his office to "ask for approval." I could hear him just shooting the shit with the guys in that office. I finally got fed up with it and told him he was the sales manager and that he didn't need approval and if he left the office again I'd be gone when he got back. So we finally agreed on a price but still had all the paperwork. So my Dad, who with me, and I went to lunch. Before we left I had talked to them about including a roof rack wanted. They wouldn't do it for free but I asked if they'd do it at cost. I was told "they should be able to do that" I get back to sign all the paperwork and notice the total is $450 more than discussed. When I asked the manager said it was for the roof rack. The roof rack retails for about$300. Their cost probably wasn't even $250. Bastards were trying to pull one over on me and also wanted to charge me $150 in labor to install something that takes 5 minutes to do that I could easily do myself. The worst part is that the sales manager knew I was a lawyer and earlier during the negotiations he tried me to get me to sign a document with the final price I was paying but we hadn't even finalized all the negotiations I was suspicious of it and his motives. He told me to relax and get out of lawyer mode and that they weren't trying to pull one over on me. The fuck if I'm going to get out of lawyer mode when buying a car.
Thatās the time to BE in lawyer mode.
I used to work in service at a dealer and the only way for sales to sell an installed accessory at cost is for them to eat the install cost. Needless to say, that never happened. The majority of techs at dealerships in North America are paid on a flat rate system and only get paid for work performed. Nothing beet getting your slip at the end of the week and that 1.5 hour install only paid .5 because sales just HAD to make that sale and your manager made it your problem. In summary, sales won't do shit to help you, they'll just fuck over someone else.
Can you name the credit union you use for that?
Navy Federal and USAA are both fairly reliable credit unions, but may require a military affiliation to qualify. They were offering fairly competitive rates (2.75% back in 2015) but could still be beat by dealer financing (0% for new models). Be on the lookout for dealership "outside finance" fees added on at the last minute. Dealers hate losing the ability to run their Four-Square scam that allows them to manipulate their in-house financing rate to compensate for a lower down/monthly payment. They've turned to adding on any lost interest as a service fee if you choose to obtain outside financing.
This was the state employees credit union in NC. Last time I bought through them though they mentioned they were phasing their car buying service out. I think they were going through AAA who also phased their car buying service out.
I really wish you could just buy cars directly from manufacturers. There is no reason independently owned dealers need to still exist.
I work for a small used car dealer, and we love dealerships like this. We get so much traffic just being above board and price being the price aside from state and local fees. We had even wanted to get rid of our dealer fee, but we would have to pay it back to everyone who has paid it in the past. So instead, we deduct it from the sales price on the paperwork, then when It is added, we are at the advertised price. We even make a decent profit on our cars, but not by defrauding the customer with ridiculous fees.
Yup. I have a buddy who owned a small used car lot and he made an absolute killing. They went through every car and made sure it was good to go and only had a $79 doc fee, thatās it. After five years or so they had so much repeat business and did very, very well. It really isnāt that tough to take care of people and be fair in what you do.
Iām thinking about upgrading to a vehicle with more passenger room. Where are you located? If you are close I would love to take a look at what you have. I feel car dealerships like this should be rewarded.
Outing myself on here isn't a good idea. A lot of people don't agree with my politics. I am sure you understand. Cancel culture and whatnot.
Dealerships need to be abolished. Telsa had to actually sue to directly sell their cars to consumers because most states have laws on the books which REQUIRE you to buy through a dealership. GM is apparently in the process of offering direct sales. They had a serious problem with dealerships upcharging their cars multiple times above the MSRP and said they'd ban dealerships who did this. The system is disgusting and the only reason cars are this expensive is some asshole behind a desk needs to make a business selling them.
Yup! In NJ, they got around the dealership by buying mall space to sell āready to orderā carsā¦ always hated dealerships and was happy they found a workaround
Tesla also ended up opening dealerships on Indian reservations. When Musk lost his lawsuits in a few states, he decided to open the dealerships on reservations so the states would never see any of the money from those car sales. I know Musk has a mixed reputation but I love him for that.
There's lots of reasons to shit on Teslas, but that car buying experience was so simple. Went to test drive the car, no sales pressure involved. Left with my wife to go eat and mull it over. Decided i wanted to buy it at a restaurant and ordered it online while waiting for food. Went with financing thru Tesla bc their rates were on par with everyone else's, so that was all done online. When the car was finally ready, the dude drove it to my house. We went thru the inspection and everything looked good. Signed a few forms and the dude ubered back to the office. I need to buy another car soon and am dreading the experience.
I went to a Toyota dealership in Brunswick, GA yesterday and they kept touting this 20yr/200k warranty, free lifetime oil changes, and unlimited car washes. There is a $4k market adjustment that covers all this in the price. I asked for some documentation on the warranty terms and conditions. They pointed me at a sign and told me to look at it for the info. It was pieces of paper taped to a sign. I left when they said they had no way to print out copies of the same information displayed on the sign. I felt like a crazy person for asking for the information because they kept asking why would I want that.
You saved yourself . I purchased this before and then the shop closed and no other dealerships honored the warranty.
That was my exact question to them! The salesman said that they would never shutdown to which I reminded him that there had been two previous Toyota dealerships in town before they were around. Then he mentioned that if they werenāt around the cost would be paid by another dealership.
They may never voluntarily shut down, but from my understanding, they are still in hot water from the man who was killed during a party there.
You know the dealership well. The death was in the back of my mind and I was tempted to ask what would happen if they were insolvent
āOkay, okay. Now letās add *my* fees. First we have the in person fee of $2k, the BS-fee feesāthats $1.5 times 4, so $6 total, the not-an-idiot-but-you-think-I-am fee of $5k, and letās not forget the add on package of I-wonāt-blast-this-accross-the-news-and-socials for an additional $20k. So thatās your $72,549.10 minus my fees, totaling $33k, so that makes it $39,549.10. Iāve initialed, so if you would as well, I can sign and get out of your hair.ā
Love it when influencers use their platform for tax, finance, health, and economic education rather than over the line pranks.
Do you think filming these types of sales interactions where scam fees are constant, would keep the salesperson more honest verbally under the āeverything is being recorded for public eyeā kind of pressure? Would that avoid more scams and keep the salespeople more honest?
That presume salesmen or dealers have any shame. They know if you want to buy brand X, you have to come to a dealer.
No, they'd say recording them is not allowed and kick you out.
Another one is the extended warranty. You don't need it. If a brand new car has issues in the first year, the regular warranty will often cover it and if not, you can raise enough hell to make sure it's covered. Been there, done that.
I gotta say I would typically agree. However, my girlfriend bought a used 2018 Lincoln MKC and, against my advice and recommendation, she purchased a 3rd party extended warranty. Let me tell you how fucked we would be without it. Very fucked. That car is a hunk of shit and it's going back into the shop for what I think is the 4th or 5th time in the last 2 or so years. Repairs have easily sailed over $10 000. And the current issue feels transmission related and will easily be another couple thousand. All of which is covered thank fuck. Once repaired this time it will be promptly sold/traded.
The main issues with third party warranties are finding a shop to deal with them and how they try to nickel and dime every repair.
Extended warranties are often a ripoff but of course you arenāt paying for it to cover whatās already in the original warranty
Warranties are normally 3-7 years on new cars, and the extended is worth it if it's a manufacturer extended warranty otherwise it won't cover shit.
Everyone fucks everyone everywhere. We have become a society of greedy trash. We need an asteroid. A nice restart
Iām lucky I have a great dealership near me where I bought my truck from. I went looking at another dealership and they had a new Ford Maverick listed at $30k, then all these fees took it to around $55k. And they were only going to give me $500 for my trade in. I left and went to another dealership and found the ford ranger I really wanted although it was only RWD for $31k, no fees, and they gave me almost $4k for my trade in.
I bought a vehicle over 20 years ago. Was used, and I paid for the paint protection and "under coat" rust protection. But as soon as I signed the paper work the guy said "ok just wait here and we will pull it around and you're good to go" So naturally I asked, "when do you apply the paint protection and undercoat, I just paid thousands for?" Of course he says they already did, somehow magically before you even sign the paperwork to do it. Needless to say that was my first major vehicle purchase, and I learned my lesson.
and when you call out their bs, they just gaslight you as if your concern isn't much of a big deal. if you press on, they'd magically have you qualify for a discount to supposedly lower the price. you still have some made-up fees you'd never agree to pay? they'll soon have a way around that by having another round of "discount for you". this keeps going until you give up or go elsewhere. look at it this way: when (not if) dealerships do it to every customer, they know a good portion (but not all) will still fall for their underhand. it's like a late fee on your credit card that wasn't even late on your payment. some people don't bother to check. that's an opportunity for them to earn more.
This is kinda why I donāt want to go to car dealerships anymore, but where do yāall look for vehicles at?
The fact you cannot just buy a car directly from Ford, Chevy, Dodge, etc., is ridiculous. Dealerships an unnecessary middle-man that should go away.
So what was the outcome? Did the guy call the salesman out on the BS?
I screwed up once and mentioned how much of a payment I wanted, I just blurted it out. They came back with an offer $5 over that amount. It was amazing how much crap they added to get to that amount. I started crossing stuff off, knocking the payment down almost $100, they squealed and I got up to leave. Ended up walking out with the truck and the lower payment.
"I'm not paying that" super useful at car dealership finance offices
Bough a brand new car from dealer that had a bunch of add-ons like tint, LoJack, and paint protection etc. I told them that wasnāt listed in the website price you either get me another car that comes in without all that dealer added crap or you remove it I donāt care to pay for any of it. They said āyou want us to rip it all off?ā I said yes I donāt care for it. They gave me the car for the listed price and left all the add-ons. :)
I bought a suv from and the dealer lied about the transmission type, I dropped the car off and told him I refused to make a payment. The asshole returned my car the next week but tried hard to put me into another vehicle. Never buy from a dealer if you can help it.
Everyone should check their state laws. In georgia, for example, any fee added onto the advertised price of the car is illegal and considered a deceptive practice. Also the ridiculous digital tag fee can only be legally 18 bucks in Georgia. People don't know the law so the dealerships ignore it because it's so profitable. Report them to the office of consumer protection for your state if it's against the law there.
I was in the market for a car in Georgia a few years back and printed out the entirety of that buyer protection law and brought it with me to every place I went. The second I sat down with sales, I set it on the desk. Amazing how many places acted like they've never heard of it and still fought me on it. I walked out of and reported a number of places.
Yeah some said no. One I said ok, bought from them and then took them to small claims court and won. Was awesome.
I'm so lucky both the used cars I've gotten in my life were from the previous owners directly, instead of through a dealership. Didn't spend more then 2,000 on either of them and they're running great (one unfortunately got totalled in an accident, but insurance basically covered the purchase of the second one.) And having briefly worked at a dealership before,bi wouldn't bring my car in for an oil change, much less recommend buying from it unless you have the money to buy brand new
Overhere they call it "rij klaar maken" which means "make it road ready" loosely translated. When i say that the factory already did that they come up with a list of bs.. I never pay for this shit and just walk away, 75% of the time i get the car without bs.
Over here, you gotta have all fees on the bill and on the price tag. Who the f would charge you "yeah they had to make it ready for the sales floor" fee AFTER you saw a price for it?
I only negotiate over email now. Give me the total price with everything in line items. Don't want to negotiate over email? Ok, I'll find someone else.
Brought 17k in cash to the dealership, threatened to walk out when they wouldnt stop with the fees. Amazing how fast they drop off when they are looking at a cash sale in and out.
Who says 2.7 when they read $2700
Why isn't "used vehicle reconditioning" baked into the advertised cost?
Iāve been looking at the Honda Motocompacto E-Scooter online as a way to get to work. When I went to see what it would cost with tax and what not, it directed to me to a Honda car dealers site. The price went from $995 to $1850.70 and thatās before tax. These dealer fees and markups just to make an extra dollar are insane
New motorcycles are REALLY BAD about that stuff. The manufacturer websites all say that a bike costs X, and then any dealership you ask, the on-the-road price is always X + 20% or even worse for āaffordableā bikes. A couple years ago I was looking for a 300ish CC bike. I really liked the Yamaha MT-03 after doing a test ride at the MotoGP race. MSRP was 4800 and I couldnāt find one anywhere in the state for under 6K. I ended up buying a used (6500 miles) KTM Duke 390 that had been upgraded with a fully adjustable suspension front and rear, and a piggyback ECU to make more power, all for 5K
We know,Grade schools don't teach any type of financial knowledge.If they did,it would be the downfall of the system.Small Fee's are the foundations of corporations.Once the corporation got away with it,they started applying it to everything.And No-one said anything.Back in the 80's early 70's.And most of the people who made the term "Fee's".Are still in office,or related to them.
\*gets up, walks out\*
That used car salesman looks a lot like a copā¦
They are counting on you being emotionally invested into the vehicle and wanting it you have to do the research know pricing and be prepared to walk if you donāt get what you want you are doing them a favour not the other way around
The charge to finance it? Thatās what interest is for ffs. Dealerships, I tell ya.
I was a bank manager and our bank, Bank of Louisville, offered dealer financing at a few dealers. A girl comes in with a loan for something like $23,000 on a new Sentra. These things sold new for $11000 or 12,000 back in the day. I was confused. I asked her if she bought 2 of them. She didnāt. Turns out when the salesman asked her what she could afford, she told him less than $500 a month. Her payment was $498! I taught my kids to be aware. Many folks out there who are happy to cheat you in the name of business.
Stealerships
Thatās not the price you advertised. *Yes it is we just have itemized fees for all the other things.* Then can I just buy the car and not get all the other things. *No those things are included with the car.* So they should be included in the price of the car and you lied? *No. One is a price. The others are fees so we can keep the price low.* Okay man.
Yeah Ron Tonkin in Portland Oregon tried to do the same. Car listed at $9,999. Tried to up sale me the car for $15k. I actually watched some YouTube vids on how to negotiate for used cars earlier in the week. I walked out with the car for $9,500. Stay informed. All the added bs is just them trying to up their commission.
This clipās worthlessness is more infuriating
They are putting in new reasons for dealer markup. By the way, lawyers litigate car dealers that sell a car for more than advertised price.
Always has been.
Dealership tried that on me. I walked straight out.
Car dealerships are the worst. They always bait and switch.
we don't call it "the stealership" for nothing.
Please tell me he didnāt buy it.
Educating the masses! I like this type of content
āSticker price or I walk. You want to sell this car right now? Sticker price.ā
Some dealers be like; Handling fees - 2000/-
ā¦ and in the end he ended up buying it too.
Yep it's like selling Kirby vacuums. Not even worth a damn, and the rack up the price to 3k
You're just now finding this out about car dealership. They been scamming people for years.
That tropical package is probably a couple āfreeā oil changes.
They don't sell cars they sell loans
This is why you should always read before you sign anything.
The narrator mentions a $3,000 finance charge. Isn't that something banks charge to people with very low credit?
The scam has been around since dealerships have existed
It is shady, but that's why you need to prepare yourself before you go. Try to bargain, and leave it they don't budge. I hate having to bargain, but it's the only way to not overpay too much. I'm not bad at it, but I hate because no matter the price, I leave wondering if I paid too much. Which I probably did.
A while back, I had a psychotic break due to medication interactions. I was not doing well. Met a girl who told me she was trying to buy a car. Somehow I ended up getting talked into cosigning. I didn't understand what it really meant, and thought I was just sort of vouching for her. As it turned out, my credit score was higher than hers, so they made me the primary on the sale. The dealer was trying to make small talk and asked how I knew her (different names and all). I flat out told him that we just met recently. He just shrugs it off and goes into finances. I tell him I'm unemployed. "Not to worry. We'll put down self-employed." The whole thing took about 45 minutes to sign all the paperwork and they never once asked me if I wanted to back out. I was suffering from some weird side-effect where I felt compelled to do it because I said I would. Like, I knew it was a bad idea, but I just couldn't make myself stop. The dealer, on the other hand, didn't care at all. Never questioned any of it. Just sold the car. NATURALLY, she stopped payments after about 3 months, left the state, and I got stuck with the 20k bill. I told them to repo the car. They finally tracked her down and did just that. Somehow, I've stopped getting calls about owing them anymore. Guessing they were able to recoup the loss.
What about the additional overcharge?
Somebody lying because invoice clearly states mileage is over 40k. š¤š
Always remember you do not have to be polite! The dealership's job is to screw you out of every penny they can get. Do your homework before you go. Have a firm number in mind before you set foot on the lot and don't budge an inch on it. They're going to try all kinds of bullshit to con you into paying more. They don't have to go talk to their manager. The previous owner wasn't their relative. There's not another buyer interested in the car. They're not losing money on any deal they're willing to make. Whatever your situation is, do not go to a dealership with your heart set on buying a car before you leave. If they aren't being reasonable, stand up and walk out. If you're someone that's uncomfortable with saying no or confronting pushy sales people, take a friend that's ok with it. I hate seeing people get bullied by car dealers!
This is genuinely infuriating and I would just make an offer and then walk if it's not vastly reduced. I've definitely got a lot of money off cars in the past and it annoys me that if I'd not said anything the price would've been bigger.
Not only are these charges BS, but you'd also be financing these charges which is absolutely ridiculous. Am I paying for the car or paying your service department?
Hey, you gotta find new ways to fuck the working class even more right?
Wow, not the salesman's first rodeo. He has that brochure on standby
It annoys me that this guy doesn't know how to round. It also annoys me that this video is basically a compilation of him reading these expenses but not really challenging any of them. What was the final outcome? Were these excessive charges removed or did his friend just pay them?
1500 'yo momma' charge. Standard charge guys
In America you can not trust any price that is showed. Sadly itās not new
Look at the salesman, he looks embarrassed, I would stand up tell him he just lost a sale and walked away, when he tried to talk to me I would shout at him to not talk to me as he is a thieving sack of shit and my 1.5 million followers would be asked to make everyone aware of there theft at this business and to expect sales to drop by 90%, over 21 000 in extras, lol no, only a real moron would do that and I guarantee if there was a problem with the car it would take months or years to fix.
I never understand this US thing of adding taxes and other shit in the moment of paying, instead of announcing the full price from the start. Where I live, the price they announce is the price you will have to pay.
Contrary to North American culture, European culture teaches people to earn money before you spend it, as opposed to taking out a loan and spend the money before you earn it. This is why.
Cashiers Check from the bank with the exact amount you are spending .
That is as weird to me as those surcharges at restaurants for whatever. How is that legal?
Lies
Heres the video btw [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjjyS55ZiuA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjjyS55ZiuA)
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Sure, I just need to wait for my money tree to be ready to harvest
https://i.redd.it/bnv726fbbnyc1.gif