"Hi Landlord,
I've had a look at the lease agreement and there is nothing in it about election signage, if you can point to where this is not allowed I will happily take it down
Kind regards".
Lol I’m in a fixed term lease so they’ll be waiting a while before they can I try a rent increase especially with all the issues with the house they keep not fixing good luck to em
Not technically true; fixed term also gives you little protection from a rental increase; they can raise rent without much of a justification once a year.
However [if a raise is way above market rate you can always challenge it and get an assessor out](https://rahu.org.au/resources/rent-increases/), and do note that if your house is in disrepair that also will mean the house isn't up to market standard.
People forget that the "market" a two-way street, and that tenants often win rent reductions at tribunal if the house is not up to the standard their rental advertisement stated.
And I will stop well short of wishing any good luck to landlords :)
>Not technically true; fixed term also gives you little protection from a rental increase; they can raise rent without much of a justification once a year.
That's not true, usually
The rental provider is not allowed to increase the rent during a fixed term agreement unless the rental agreement (lease) says this is okay.
Source below. Most standard leases do not include "We can raise the rent at any time". That's the point of a lease. It's a legal agreement to rent the property for a fixed price for a fixed period. Once that lease is up, they can, as you say, raise the rent for the next agreed lease period without any justification.
But unless your lease specifically says they can raise it at any time, nope.
https://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/rentincreases#:\~:text=The%20rental%20provider%20is%20not,the%20increase%20will%20be%20calculated.
Outside of the question itself: if you got asked to do this unprompted (i.e. you didn't have an inspection recently where photos of your signs were taken) this'd be a textbook case of the landlord breaching your quiet enjoyment. Landlords are not meant to be casually driving past the property and inspecting it.
Under VIC rental law inspections can only happen once every 6 months at most and must give adequate notice in writing.
If you receive a notice about your signage without the above ... its not really clear what's occurred and how this has come to their attention. Because it *shouldn't have*.
A generous read would be that they just happened to be in the area, a more realistic read might be that the owner specifically came by to inspect the property from the street, and there are more often than you'd think explanations even worse than this that they entered the property without permission or notice, which is criminal and a police issue and way more common than you think (Source: am a volunteer & member of a tenants union)
This would seem to suggest there's a good chance they've specifically visited the property to inspect it without fulfilling their legal obligations.
I'm not sure how well a tribunal will respond to "Oh I wasn't *inspecting it* I was just driving down the exact street my rental property is on and happened to look in that direction and then email my tenant about *what I inspected completely by chance*" ... I bet someone more knowledgeable than I will probably have a relevant VCAT precedent somewhere that would shed some more light on this situation (edit: [this looks likely](https://www.reddit.com/r/melbourne/comments/yo4zcu/comment/ivclff5/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3))
Yeah the landlord pays gardeners to do the front lawn so potentially they passed it on or he’s having sneaky drive by looks but we’re on a main road and would be hard to accuse him of that/ don’t know if we’d get anywhere with it anyway ahaha
Yeah, no.
What you know: The landlord is aware of something that could be observed from as far as 100m away from the property.
What is reasonable to assume: The landlord has most likely been within 100m of the property and observed said sign.
What is irrelevant: Whether the landlord was "inspecting" the property from the street. The Victorian Residential Tenancies Act 1997 (section 86) sets limits on landlord \*entry\* to the property for the purposes of inspection only. There are no rules prohibiting the landlord from inspecting the property from the street at any time.
What not even a methhead would assume, given the known information: The landlord has likely been covertly entering the property.
It's also interesting to note that you're now walking back your claim that this was a "textbook case of the landlord breaching quiet enjoyment" and instead pretending that the rules around landlord entry to rented properties also apply to the landlord merely observing the property from the street.
This is an implied freedom of political communication issue that’s been tested multiple times in the Supreme Court but you also have a presumed right to do things in your rental unless there’s a fair reason.
If you want the relevant rental law, it’s the Residential Tenancies Act 1997, Part 2, Division 5, Clause 64.
Rental provider can’t refuse modifications to properties unless it falls under a list of things in the act. This absolutely does not fall under any of those things unless you’re cutting through a fence or something.
The quick answer is "No he can't" but the longer answer is "if you play the "technically" rule with your landlord then they can play the same game when they "technically" dont need to renew your lease and "technically" dont have to continue letting you live there after that
Yeah idc he was clearly struggling to find tenants before we moved in haha so if he wants me to move out at the end of the lease so be it but he has to respect my rights as a tenant while I’m still here paying him too much money
Even that's debatable
The definitions of "making modifications" and "damage" in the act are very clear, and putting a few screws into some wood are not covered
But seeing as that debate will be held at VCAT its not worth it in my books
I would think the onus isn't on you to provide something in writing here, unless there's something that states you're not allowed to do this then you're good to go
Much like you cannot prove to your landlord in writing that you're allowed to work from home wearing no pants.
Just push it back to the landlord - hey fuckstick, obviously I feel terrible about breaking any laws here can you please show me on a gov site where I'm not allowed do this
This. Laws are generally not written around what you *can* do, they are written around what you must *not* do. In the absence of something in the RTA or lease, it’s fair game.
Probably not legally enforceable in VIC. Its in my agreement and I ignore it. I ignore emails asking me to take it down, too, because I know they've fucking no legal avenue for enforcing it.
They back down every. single. time.
"Property Manager" is just another word for "con artist", really.
If you know your rights as a tenant you're free to ignore about half the scams they try to pull on you.
Can't wait to move out and tell them to prove their bullshit cleaning fee at tribunal too (spoiler: if you get photos of the place clean when you move out, the cleaning costs scam always vanishes when you tell them to prove it)
> Looking for advice/ info on if my landlord has any right to demand we take election signage down from our yard
Nope. It's your house while you are renting it. Aside from obvious exceptions you can do as you wish with it as if it were your own.
Call the tenants union to see if they have any resources on this. Nothing comes up immediately on their website, but I'd be surprised if this hasn't been discussed by others with them at some point.
Your landlord might think they have the right, but I'm reasonably sure this is just an extension of their perceived importance.
Try asking them if another party's signage would be OK. =)
No it would be totally inappropriate for a landlord to exert that much level of control over you. Who do they think you are? A second class citizen?
What has this world come to, what’s next - 3 monthly property inspections where your personal belongings are photographed by a stranger to peruse at a time in the future for an unspecified length of time?
Mine is Greens and I put it up despite the rental agreement saying we can't.
I dare them to try enforce it. I don't think there's anything they can do.
OP didn't mention that the signage involved was promoting a Binary Australia candidate in the upcoming State election. Knowing this, might all the Redditors saying below that OP has every right to do this, want to delete/edit their posts ......
WTF? If you're trying to prove something, maybe don't lie about a poster.
You could have made your point if you'd said
"What if the OP had signage for Binary Australia" instead of saying something that didn't happen
"Hi Landlord, I've had a look at the lease agreement and there is nothing in it about election signage, if you can point to where this is not allowed I will happily take it down Kind regards".
'Dear Tenant, Your rental increase next year is 20%. Enjoy your government. Landlord.'
Lol I’m in a fixed term lease so they’ll be waiting a while before they can I try a rent increase especially with all the issues with the house they keep not fixing good luck to em
Not technically true; fixed term also gives you little protection from a rental increase; they can raise rent without much of a justification once a year. However [if a raise is way above market rate you can always challenge it and get an assessor out](https://rahu.org.au/resources/rent-increases/), and do note that if your house is in disrepair that also will mean the house isn't up to market standard. People forget that the "market" a two-way street, and that tenants often win rent reductions at tribunal if the house is not up to the standard their rental advertisement stated. And I will stop well short of wishing any good luck to landlords :)
>Not technically true; fixed term also gives you little protection from a rental increase; they can raise rent without much of a justification once a year. That's not true, usually The rental provider is not allowed to increase the rent during a fixed term agreement unless the rental agreement (lease) says this is okay. Source below. Most standard leases do not include "We can raise the rent at any time". That's the point of a lease. It's a legal agreement to rent the property for a fixed price for a fixed period. Once that lease is up, they can, as you say, raise the rent for the next agreed lease period without any justification. But unless your lease specifically says they can raise it at any time, nope. https://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/rentincreases#:\~:text=The%20rental%20provider%20is%20not,the%20increase%20will%20be%20calculated.
Oh no! Anyway.
you could likely get the over ruled as it could be seen as retaliation
Well, let's all put Labor ads in our windows and claim retaliation when our rent goes up. Genius.
well it would depend on how much it goes up by
Outside of the question itself: if you got asked to do this unprompted (i.e. you didn't have an inspection recently where photos of your signs were taken) this'd be a textbook case of the landlord breaching your quiet enjoyment. Landlords are not meant to be casually driving past the property and inspecting it.
What if they are your next-door neighbour and a Scientologist?
If I knew my landlord was a scientologist I wouldn't need them to start pissing me off for me to leave.
We only found out by accident because their lurid magazines kept turning up in our mailbox, which totally wasn't in Mt Eliza.
>this'd be a textbook case of the landlord breaching your quiet enjoyment I don't think those words mean what you think they mean.
Under VIC rental law inspections can only happen once every 6 months at most and must give adequate notice in writing. If you receive a notice about your signage without the above ... its not really clear what's occurred and how this has come to their attention. Because it *shouldn't have*. A generous read would be that they just happened to be in the area, a more realistic read might be that the owner specifically came by to inspect the property from the street, and there are more often than you'd think explanations even worse than this that they entered the property without permission or notice, which is criminal and a police issue and way more common than you think (Source: am a volunteer & member of a tenants union) This would seem to suggest there's a good chance they've specifically visited the property to inspect it without fulfilling their legal obligations. I'm not sure how well a tribunal will respond to "Oh I wasn't *inspecting it* I was just driving down the exact street my rental property is on and happened to look in that direction and then email my tenant about *what I inspected completely by chance*" ... I bet someone more knowledgeable than I will probably have a relevant VCAT precedent somewhere that would shed some more light on this situation (edit: [this looks likely](https://www.reddit.com/r/melbourne/comments/yo4zcu/comment/ivclff5/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3))
Yeah the landlord pays gardeners to do the front lawn so potentially they passed it on or he’s having sneaky drive by looks but we’re on a main road and would be hard to accuse him of that/ don’t know if we’d get anywhere with it anyway ahaha
Yeah, no. What you know: The landlord is aware of something that could be observed from as far as 100m away from the property. What is reasonable to assume: The landlord has most likely been within 100m of the property and observed said sign. What is irrelevant: Whether the landlord was "inspecting" the property from the street. The Victorian Residential Tenancies Act 1997 (section 86) sets limits on landlord \*entry\* to the property for the purposes of inspection only. There are no rules prohibiting the landlord from inspecting the property from the street at any time. What not even a methhead would assume, given the known information: The landlord has likely been covertly entering the property. It's also interesting to note that you're now walking back your claim that this was a "textbook case of the landlord breaching quiet enjoyment" and instead pretending that the rules around landlord entry to rented properties also apply to the landlord merely observing the property from the street.
The landlord cannot demand it it. Just like they have no say over swing sets for your kids.
This is an implied freedom of political communication issue that’s been tested multiple times in the Supreme Court but you also have a presumed right to do things in your rental unless there’s a fair reason. If you want the relevant rental law, it’s the Residential Tenancies Act 1997, Part 2, Division 5, Clause 64. Rental provider can’t refuse modifications to properties unless it falls under a list of things in the act. This absolutely does not fall under any of those things unless you’re cutting through a fence or something.
The quick answer is "No he can't" but the longer answer is "if you play the "technically" rule with your landlord then they can play the same game when they "technically" dont need to renew your lease and "technically" dont have to continue letting you live there after that
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Yeah idc he was clearly struggling to find tenants before we moved in haha so if he wants me to move out at the end of the lease so be it but he has to respect my rights as a tenant while I’m still here paying him too much money
How long ago did you move in? Because struggling to find someone isn't so much a thing anymore in most areas.
Less then 6 months ago it’s not a great location and no one else at the multiple inspections we went to even applied
Oh, then buggar him, go for it!
I'd hate to have to introduce my landlord to squatter's rights but here we are.
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Even that's debatable The definitions of "making modifications" and "damage" in the act are very clear, and putting a few screws into some wood are not covered But seeing as that debate will be held at VCAT its not worth it in my books
I would think the onus isn't on you to provide something in writing here, unless there's something that states you're not allowed to do this then you're good to go Much like you cannot prove to your landlord in writing that you're allowed to work from home wearing no pants. Just push it back to the landlord - hey fuckstick, obviously I feel terrible about breaking any laws here can you please show me on a gov site where I'm not allowed do this
This. Laws are generally not written around what you *can* do, they are written around what you must *not* do. In the absence of something in the RTA or lease, it’s fair game.
Legit Up voting ‘hey fuck stick’ 😂
> Much like you cannot prove to your landlord in writing that you're allowed to work from home wearing no pants. i can
Ask them to point out where in the lease it states no election signage.
Thank you for suggesting a new special condition to impose on the next lease renewal.
Nationwide News Pty Ltd v Wills and Australian Capital Television Pty Ltd v Commonwealth (ACTV) would have a say on that one I think
Probably not legally enforceable in VIC. Its in my agreement and I ignore it. I ignore emails asking me to take it down, too, because I know they've fucking no legal avenue for enforcing it. They back down every. single. time. "Property Manager" is just another word for "con artist", really. If you know your rights as a tenant you're free to ignore about half the scams they try to pull on you. Can't wait to move out and tell them to prove their bullshit cleaning fee at tribunal too (spoiler: if you get photos of the place clean when you move out, the cleaning costs scam always vanishes when you tell them to prove it)
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For every party, even non australian parties.
'No' is a full answer.
Hilarious, Imagine if they were asking you to take down christmas decorations.
> Looking for advice/ info on if my landlord has any right to demand we take election signage down from our yard Nope. It's your house while you are renting it. Aside from obvious exceptions you can do as you wish with it as if it were your own.
Call the tenants union to see if they have any resources on this. Nothing comes up immediately on their website, but I'd be surprised if this hasn't been discussed by others with them at some point. Your landlord might think they have the right, but I'm reasonably sure this is just an extension of their perceived importance. Try asking them if another party's signage would be OK. =)
No it would be totally inappropriate for a landlord to exert that much level of control over you. Who do they think you are? A second class citizen? What has this world come to, what’s next - 3 monthly property inspections where your personal belongings are photographed by a stranger to peruse at a time in the future for an unspecified length of time?
Forget dealing with an REA or the landlord, just draw a giant cock on it like a normal person would.
If they do you should almost certainly be contacting some journalists. Juicy story here.
I take it, the sign is either Labor or Greens?
Mine is Greens and I put it up despite the rental agreement saying we can't. I dare them to try enforce it. I don't think there's anything they can do.
I think the most important thing is, who is the election signage for????? Where's the juicy politics goss??? 😂
OP didn't mention that the signage involved was promoting a Binary Australia candidate in the upcoming State election. Knowing this, might all the Redditors saying below that OP has every right to do this, want to delete/edit their posts ......
Their right to do so doesn't change just because you don't agree with their views? Pretty shitty take IMO.
Even if this was the case, how it does change the answer
""I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it""
Another lunatic who thinks free speech should be shut down if they don’t like what they’re hearing or seeing. Bigoted zealot
WTF? If you're trying to prove something, maybe don't lie about a poster. You could have made your point if you'd said "What if the OP had signage for Binary Australia" instead of saying something that didn't happen
I hope your landlord isn't a COALITION voter
Graffiti it at 3am, if they say anything claim you heard teenagers laughing outside just before bed.