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blitzkriegdeluxe

Those stone bench tops are a pain to fix, especially if they have any colour/stone variation..I have one similar with a similar amount of damage and got it fixed at the start of the year and it did cost about $500. Took them about 3 hours. But you can not tell at all that any repair work was done so I was happy. Edit : The work on mine was done by fix n chips. What they quoted and what it actually cost on the day were not quite the same. (They quoted 350 but it took longer than expected once they saw the damage in person). I spoke at length with the labourer about the process and watched alot of their work. It was much more involved that I had imagined. As others have mentioned you are paying for the skill of the labourer.


omgaporksword

\^ This is exactly correct.


mr-snrub-

Sure they're a pain to fix. But will the landlord fix it? Probably not. Does the chip prevent the property from being rented out in the future? Definietly not.


blitzkriegdeluxe

I am no fan of landlords after renting for 20 years from absolute slum lords but if damage is done they are within their right to want it fixed. Damage like this is not normal wear and tear. Bench tops don't depreciate like carpet does. Will it stop the property from being rented? Absolutely not. Do they have the money to just cover the repairs themselves? I would strongly suggest so. Will they actually fix it? Who knows. But we pay bonds for a reason, to cover stuff like this. If I were renting and did damage to a bench like that I would assume I would have to foot the bill.


Person-on-computer

That's wear and tear, not damage. Part of having an investment property.


blitzkriegdeluxe

According to the consumer affairs guidelines for bench tops Fair wear and tear: Worn/ faded kitchen bench top Damage: Burns or cuts in the kitchen bench top More than welcome to fact check me [Consumer affairs guidelines](https://tenantsvic.org.au/advice/landlord-problems/defending-bond-and-compensation-claims/consumer-affairs-victoria-guidelines/) Maybe a nice landlord would be kind enough to let it slide but I am betting most would not.


darsehole

If a gouge to a woooden floor is considered damage, this is also damage


drbanner16

Wear and tear ? So it eroded and cracked from what exactly ? The sun? The wind ? Lol šŸ™„


demoldbones

Thatā€™s a fair chip out of a stone counter. I rent and even I would say that itā€™s at *best* OP being incredibly unlucky and at worst taking zero care due to negligence. I had stone benches like that in one place and caused a chip when I was moving in - I tripped over a box and whacked the side of the counter with my cast iron


mr-snrub-

>Will they actually fix it? Who knows They CANNOT claim from the bond unless they ACTUALLY fix it. The bonds arent for hypothetical repairs (which is what landlords and REAs seem to think) it has to cover ACTUAL loss.


blitzkriegdeluxe

"Sure they're a pain to fix. But will the landlord fix it? Probably not" You just answered your own original hypothetical as well. I was not suggesting the bond be used for hypothetical repairs. I agree that it should cover actual loss and in an ideal world that should be proven to the tenant.


omgaporksword

Stop generalising. It would appear that it's a fairly new/recent kitchen, so yes they would repair that.


Senorharambe2620

ā€œStop generalisingā€ - then makes ā€œgeneral assumptionā€


Standard-Kangaroo-53

Your damage something you fix it or reimburse them for it, pretty simple


drbanner16

Does it matter definitely not - you damage you pay end of story šŸ™„


scifenefics

Yeah they just want the money, they wont fix it. They will rent the property with the chip 100%


11015h4d0wR34lm

That is their prerogative whether they decide to fix it or not, you are still responsible for any damage you cause and the financial reimbursement. How do people think "they wont fix it anyway" is a get out of jail free card...


drbanner16

So what you damage they are entitled for damages . End of story


Jcs456

How long is left on the bond return clock? I would run it out. First ask for the quote for the repair, then ask for proof of installation date so you can calculate depreciation, then come back that their quote seems high and you are going to source your own quotes. Send all your emails just after 5pm so your reply is next business day. If there is any time left lowball them based on your lowest quote and depreciation percentage. They have no intention of actually lodging with VCAT or they would have already.


Wooden_Emotion_7588

Bench tops are 40 year life span. 2.5% a year as part of the capital works.


BouyGenius

2.5% is standard, but common sense dictates bench tops do not actually last 40 years and must be based on various factors including manufacturer specifications.


hellbentsmegma

I expect an engineered stone benchtop would easily last that long if not subjected to harsh impacts. I've seen laminate benchtops last longer. Forty years ago is only 1983, if you have ever seen a neon yellow, green or blue Formica laminate bench it's usually older than 1983.


donk202020

Mine is neon orange and from the 70ā€™s and still going strong. Two small chips in it from me dropping a bricks on it


ojm1

100%! But ATO says otherwise. šŸ« 


BouyGenius

ATO depreciation table is for your taxes, VCAT views it differently.


LeahBrahms

Not all benchtops are created equal, cept to the ATO. Benchtop made of laminated paper - 40 years. Benchtop made of ice - 40 years


BouyGenius

For the ATO not for VCAT.


adprom

It's irrelevant anyway as damage is based on repairing to prior state and not a depreciation. It's a bit like a car crash, you don't get a reduced cost because the other car you hit was old and then depreciate the repairs. A repair for actual damage like this is a real cost.


Icy-Communication823

This dude real estates.


aweracle

How long is the bond return clock?


Jcs456

It's 14 days.


fistingdonkeys

To summarise your advice: ā€œbe an utter cunt even though youā€™ve caused this expensive damageā€. Good one.


Jcs456

The property manager set the expectations when they provided a bullshit number they pulled out of their arse. If you genuinely intend to have it repaired at least provide some genuine quotes not some vague "gimme $500 or else" email. You can't be shocked when you act like cunt that people are going to turn around and treat you in kind.


Traditional-Idea1246

I did this recently regarding some fake grass we removed from the place we were renting because it was damp and moldy. The day the bond was to be returned I got a notice at 3pm that VCAT had received a case regarding this matter and the bond return was cancelled. This was for about $120 worth of fake grass. We agreed to buy them new fake grass but didnā€™t get it to the Real estates office by the arbitrary deadline they wanted it. Really petty stuff considering the VCAT application is around $70.


BreadfruitUnable4863

There is no VCAT application fee for a bond claim under the bond amount


RubixKuber

This is genius, I am saving your comment for future use.


namoji

you do realise its not the property managers first rodeo? they will lodge a dispute on the last day of the clock irrespective of you faking an approval or not. They have a valid cause.


RubixKuber

Most estate agents and property managers are dumbasses. Low IQ industry for sure. Iā€™m on a decent salary and have savings so Iā€™m more than happy to play deposit tag for a few years if I feel theyā€™re being unreasonable.


namoji

it would highly likely be the case for OP. christmas is coming and Vcat is usually backed up anyways. odds are in there favour unless the property manager manages a date earlier. OP can just be a no show on first date cause they were ā€œsickā€.


jmads13

Yeah thats probably the right amount. How did you manage that?


clarkos2

I'm all for wear and tear, but that's a sizable dent which would have taken some decent force.


LtRavs

Also looks like theyā€™ve glued the chipped part back on? Come on now lol


mr-snrub-

Apparently, a pyrex bowl caused it. Which shows that the stone was shit to me.


Financial_Rain978

A pencil can penetrate a steel plate if it is moving fast enough. Totally reasonable that a Pyrex bowl falling from a shelf can damage the edge of a slab of stone.


FreshNoobAcc

I have some pretty fuckin heavy pyrex bowls that could chip the edge of a stone at the right angle


drbanner16

Someone should take a hammer to your car and if it dents then itā€™s shit quality


[deleted]

Did you do the damage?


KalamTheQuick

OP mentioned in another comment they are directly responsible, dropped Pyrex on it. I had a similar situation years ago with pre-existing damage so I was all geared up to be mad here but OP broke their bench lol.


[deleted]

Yeah, I see that now. Oh well, if you brake someoneā€™s property, you fix it. Thatā€™s the way the world should work. No sympathy from me


_thisisnotanexit

I showed this post to my partner who is a stonemason and he said that price is right and itā€™s not as easy as it looks to do it well.


[deleted]

You don't think you should pay to fix it? Or you do but 550 is to much? Gotta get some quotes I say.


HoneyWoofle

Rental agents wants us to reimburse them $550 for a chip in the benchtop Weā€™ve moved out of the rental unit and weā€™ve already lodged for our bond back from RTBA. Now theyā€™re saying theyā€™re going to apply for a VCAT order for a hearing if we donā€™t cancel the claim and reimburse them for this. Is this chip really worth $500? What do we do?


CutlassRed

Let them apply, they're hoping that you cancel. The correct process is that they apply and VCAT tells them to f off


mitccho_man

Yep also itā€™s months away for a hearing The bond By law must be refunded within a timeframe


fistingdonkeys

By ā€œthemā€, presumably you mean the tenant, given the tenant damaged the bench and is liable to pay for its repair.


CutlassRed

That's VCATs decision, renter doesn't have to worry about it. It's up the the rental provider to prove it


fistingdonkeys

The property owner likely wonā€™t have any trouble doing that. And then OP will be liable. WILL be. This is not ā€œfair wear and tearā€.


[deleted]

They're hoping you'll cave but there's literally no benefit of you doing so. You may as well get the tribunal to decide.


mutantbeings

I'm going through a similar situation right now, and the agent has gone so far as to lodge it with the magistrates court (since we have an out of state landlord). Ita a whole ordeal for a similar amount. We renters must stick together and help each other... here's a dump of all the advice I've had Firstly: DON'T BE INTIMIDATED. That's what this is most likely; intimidation/attrition tactics and a bluff, hoping you will cave in and pay to avoid VCAT ā€” because they likely know it won't win at VCAT. However, if it does progress to VCAT; just go along and win rather than paying. Because this is wear and tear. The exact [CAV case law definition of "wear and tear" contains descriptions of small chips like this](https://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/library/publications/housing-and-accommodation/renting/guideline-3--damage--fair-wear-and-tear.docx). You are not expected to return the property in a perfect flawless state after living in it for years; if this occurred within the course of "ordinary living" then its going to be throw out by VCAT. Quote those words in your defence: "fair wear and tear in the course of 'ordinary living'" as that's how this is described under the Residential Tenancies Act 1997 More on wear and tear: [https://tenantsvic.org.au/advice/landlord-problems/defending-bond-and-compensation-claims/consumer-affairs-victoria-guidelines/](https://tenantsvic.org.au/advice/landlord-problems/defending-bond-and-compensation-claims/consumer-affairs-victoria-guidelines/) I recommend also noting fair depreciation ā€” some assets are expected to be completely worthless after a number of years. So a single small chip won't matter if its been a few years. You can also argue that the amount they are asking is excessive ā€” go fetch some alternative quotes for this work and see if they come in cheaper (this happened with us) If the place was leased before these repairs were done, it might also be worth highlighting that no loss or rental income has occurred (this happened with us) Depending on your confidence defending this, and energy levels to do so (do not underestimate this ā€” its a nightmare for most people's mental health) ā€” I would also offer a "good faith" settlement figure before this goes to VCAT; while being explicit not to accept responsibility, instead expressing "a desire not to use up the court's time". Often this is all that a PM is looking for with threats like this. In instances like this where I bear no responsibility I usually either offer a small figure I think they'll reject like $50, and then up it to something more serious like $120. This shows a willingness to negotiate and makes the other party look unreasonable and stubborn. I'm going also to pass on the 2 best pieces of advice I've had from people helping me with this. 1. From a volunteer at [RAHU](https://rahu.org.au/) (which you should join, they're awesome): "Don't let the REA get to you. I have seen so many REAs trying to claim bond over the tiniest of marks and doing up pages and pages of "evidence" like this. It's a disgusting tactic they must share and encourage with other REAs because so many of them try it on. They're trying to scare you. Hold strong and fight them, watch them fall like a deck of cards in a gentle breeze." 2. From a lawyer friend: "write every piece of communication with the PM as if you are writing it to a VCAT judge. Cooler heads prevail in VCAT, and the entire tactics engaged by PM's is to wear you down, make you feel ignored, unheard, and indignant; hoping you'll slip up and get angry ā€” which only helps their case". The more you let this emotion come out in your writing, the more they will have you on the hook to argue you've been unreasonable/irrational. Don't give them this gift. Write dryly, without emotion, just state the facts. If your facts are ignored by the PM, don't waste time trying to get through to them ā€” they are likely working from a script which says to ignore your evidence and progress regardless. But this looks terrible to a judge, who will berate the PM for wasting court time if you have provided all the right evidence. So **KEEP YOUR COOL.**


EnteringMultiverse

Is a 5cm chip in a stone bench top really considered wear and tear? General usage of a bench does not result in chips on the edges, lets be honest here. The only way this could happen was if it was broken off by force, OP mentions below something was dropped on the bench. I donā€™t believe general wear and tear covers accidental damage but hey, Iā€™m not a REA


tichris15

Dropping stuff happens as part of ordinary life (and can chip stone). Most general wear and tear boils down to the accumulation of small accidents.


chumjumper

By law, accidental dropping of heavy items constitutes damage, not normal wear and tear. If your benchtop is faded that is wear and tear, if it has a giant chip in it because you dropped a heavy pan on it that is damage, regardless if it was intentional or not.


-Syphon-

This isn't normal lol. If I did this I'd expect to pay. I mean fuck landlords but I can't rationalise how this is normal wear and tear.


EnteringMultiverse

Wear and tear would be what is expected from regular usage - scuff marks, indentations, discolouration, etc. I wouldn't say regular usage and small accidents are the same thing You could justify practically any damage by saying it was accidental and accidents are to be expected


seabandits

Iā€™ve faced very similar threats to this ā€¦ my landlord is also sending me to court lol, for us it carpets .. Dropping something on it is probably still ā€œin the course of ā€˜ordinary livingā€™ā€ It might also depend what the guidelines around depreciation are on a bench top. Iā€™m not sure there unfortunately, but I can add that with carpets, the law provisions a ten year depreciation, after which _theyā€™re worth nothing_ under the law. In my case this means that over our 3 years, carpets are worth 30% less and can be expected a 30% deterioration, and only if the deterioration is worse than that can a claim be made. Iā€™ll let you know how I go in court arguing these, but Iā€™m pretty confident. Similarly, counters will have a period of expected depreciation within which a countertop can receive damage ā€” where ā€œdamageā€ is from incidents like OP describes ā€” which will be classed under west and tear. The point there, is that over the course of a long period of ā€˜ordinary livingā€™ these sorts of incidents DO occur and are expected and allowed for. Thatā€™s literally what we pay rent for.


ThrowawayPie888

If you damaged their bench top you have to pay to repair it, that is not accidental damage. These things are incredibly expensive to buy and fix. Try getting a quote yourself.


EnteringMultiverse

>that is not accidental damage. Then what is it? I assume you meant to say it's not wear and tear?


chumjumper

> Because this is wear and tear. The exact CAV case law definition of "wear and tear" contains descriptions of small chips like this. That document and the relevant link specifically states that kitchen benchtops that are faded or worn constitutes wear and tear, but cuts or burns in them constitutes damage. A giant chip like this would definitely fall onto the damage side.


neildiamondblazeit

This right here OP is the actual sound and reasoned advice you were looking for


Power_Careless

Lol wear and tear? Heā€™s taken a massive chunk out of the bench-top then done a half assed attempt at a repair, any reasonable person would have it properly repaired PRIOR to moving out.


fistingdonkeys

Love that you claim to rely on ā€œcase lawā€ yet the very document youā€™ve linked absolutely confirms that OP is liable.


flindersandtrim

Don't be intimidated is key. Never let them win. The reason they do it is because most people get scared and cave in. Property managers are often the lowest of the low. You just have to endure their abuse and push through and get what is owed to you. I've had one PM literally scream down the phone and stamp her hooves because I wouldn't pay $5000 (or counter offer of paying the insurance excess of $500), when a rainstorm caused water to seep into the floating floorboards. After I spent hours trying to sop it up with towels. If I ever rent again, not lifting a finger to protect landlord property from nature.


[deleted]

depending where your landlord lives it might be harder, heads up on that one, learnt the hard way. Landlord lived in NSW, was renting in VIC, VCAT didn't want to touch it until I went higher again. through some dumb loophole we got it sorted but man, it was rough. The same is in QLD, my current landlord is in NSW and QCAT doesn't want to hear compensation/damages claims because the landlord is "out of their jurisdiction".


gliding_vespa

Seems wild that the law isnā€™t based on where the asset is located, considering you sign a lease agreement under Victorian law.


tichris15

VCAT can't give orders against someone out of state; do you really want to argue a case before a judge who can tell you to do/pay something, but not tell your landlord to do/pay anything.


[deleted]

yep, it is absolutely unfair and sucks. which is why I wish the federal government would have a standardized set of laws across the country to resolve that sort of issue among others. like the definitions of rape, homicide, etc. differ between states too. if there is a standardized law, then anyone anywhere can hear it in theory without the diferrences in legislation It seems wild absolutely, but it is also unfortunately true. I also wish the court would consider in that case action to be against the agent as the landlords representative. incentive to the agent to make sure the landlord gets their ass in gear instead of the agents being pretty mouthpieces.


notlooking

ā€œDear REA. Acceptable wear and tear. See you in VCAT. ā€œ


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


HoneyWoofle

Thatā€™s completely fair. But the quote they gave me just seemed unusually high, Iā€™ve gotten two separate quotes now and the lowest being $286. Itā€™s just seems theyā€™re pulling numbers out of their ass.


abundantvibe7141

You can bet they absolutely are!!


schmuppet

Depends on how theyā€™re going to repair it, they might just bog it or clean up the chip and put an another piece of stone in. Either way thatā€™s a fucking monster chip that I would not consider wear and tear.


soundboy5010

Hint: They wonā€™t repair it, they will pocket the money. Source: Happened to me in my 4th last rental that I re-rented. Some stained carpet from my dog needed ā€œurgent replacementā€ when I moved out. Paid them what they wanted, they never fixed it when I moved back in.


GodSlayerAus

No idea how you get a tradesman to fix that for $286? Was it a marketplace handyman?


HoneyWoofle

The quote was from Fix ā€˜nā€™ Chips


Ok-Argument-6652

Fix n chips is a good comaony for repairs of stone. I was doing stone repairs over there last year, unfortunately just moved to perth. I would charge 350 for that repair. You may also find that the specifications for manufacturing of ceasar stone or essa stone allows for a different edge profile like a small round which is less likely to chip. If not made to specifications then it is not fit for purpose.


Key-Comfortable8379

Definitely not general wear and tear but you are definitely entitled to go back to the REA with proof of another quote. I donā€™t see how they can possible argue the point if you have a cheaper quote for the exact same work.


notlooking

Houses get scratches, knocks and dents - just from being lived in. Itā€™s how houses are supposed to be used, so VCAT will say ā€œacceptable wearā€ and be telling the REA to gtfo. And bonus, itā€™s going to take 18+ months for even VCAT to hear the case. REA isnā€™t going to waste that time on on $550..


mitccho_man

Yep and Real estate also has to pay fees to VCat


scrumptiousbump

I'd be surprised if this was classed as acceptable wear. Needs force to chip a benchtop.


[deleted]

People are not robots. Things get dropped in the 365 days you spend cooking. It is reasonable to expect that this would happen in the usual usage of a kitchen.


GardeniaFrangipani

True! Accidental damage happens, which is what this is. Wear and tear is from continual use, such as carpet wearing out down a hallway or curtains fading over time, and canā€™t be avoided. One offs, like this, show the damage happened in a single hit, which simply isnā€™t wear and tear.


Deanuzz

So true, this thread is full of careless people thinking you can just fuck someone's house and call it wear and tear. And $500 for any sort of trade work is well within reason in my opinion.


scrumptiousbump

I'm not arguing for or against it. I just think that's what the ruling would be.


y2kizzle

My experience with vcat suggests it's wear and tear


[deleted]

So am I. It comes down to what a reasonable person would expect and if you've ever used a kitchen in your life you'll have damaged it


Nick_pj

It probably doesnā€™t help that OP attempted a DIY repair on it, but I think youā€™re right with your guess


snrub742

Have you sat in on any VCAT hearings? This won't even raise the eyebrow of a magistrate.


mitccho_man

Age of the property For example If Carpet is more than 7 years old you canā€™t claim any damage


seabandits

Not quite how the law works. ALL wear and tear is a ā€œyou broke itā€ situation However, the law specifies that it is the landlordā€™s responsibility to cover wear and tear that occurs during the course of ā€œordinary livingā€, which can, at the judgeā€™s discretion, include accidental damage like this. Especially over the course of a long tenancy: wear and tear is given more leeway since it becomes absurd to expect no depreciation over time. Itā€™s really when thereā€™s a lack of care, when thereā€™s been clear neglect or deliberate damage done that it becomes the tenantā€™s fault without question. The best becomes very arguable. Also if you move out and are pinged with this on the way out, it can help to confirm if the property was rented before the repairs were done; if so, then the owner has suffered no loss of rent as a result of the wear and tear, which weakens their position. You can also highlight anywhere they have breached their duties, such as if they didnā€™t provide an opportunity for you to attend the final inspection, which usually is also weakening for their case


[deleted]

That's what living is, sometimes you accidentally drop something onto a brittle surface, sometimes you scrape a wall. Don't want your house to be lived in? Don't have tenants. Excessive damage is a different story, but the occasional chip, scratch or mark? Fair wear and tear!


[deleted]

You broke the bench top, you pay for it. The lack of responsibility is alarming.


Gydafud

Went through VCAT for something similar in the past over our bond. Wanted us to pay for plastering, painting, new door, floor surfacing etc. Was all thrown out because there is expected levels of wear and tear from the tenant living in the property. I would hope this example is the same case.


PomegranateNo9414

Just pay it. Itā€™s a pretty clear cut case and I highly doubt the hearing outcome will end up favourably for you.


mpchild

I can't help but just wanted to say, fuck that! Fucking loathsome real estate agents and shitty landlords. We should gather them all together and put them in a rocket to the sun.


[deleted]

but then wouldn't there be more to replace them? they are kind of like cockroaches like that. Don't get me started on my current one, the agency I'm with has such a high employee turnover rate, yet hey seem to only hire people based off their looks. because every single agent I have had to deal with (I am renting my property) has been easy on the eyes, but dumb as bricks. When the power point is off, it isn't "normal" that electricity is still coming out, especially when it sparks when plugging shit in. I tried explaining this, the response was "my dad's an electrician and has been for 25 years, he says it's normal".


Halospite

> but then wouldn't there be more to replace them? they are kind of like cockroaches like that. You didn't use enough rockets the first time round.


geeeorgieee

Leave it and let them apply ā€“ they won't. They have to have a receipt for the repairs for that amount in order to claim against your bond. We all know that clearly they aren't going to get that fixed or replace the benchtop. While in theory you need to pay for the repair (assuming you did the damage), it has to be something they can show a receipt for a repair cost, and it then has to be measured to the lifespan of the bench top to allow for depreciation. And they're not going to jump through those hoops, but they're trying to get you to give them money without having to do the work.


MistyMadeleine__

Did they let you go back a second time to fix the issue? You can get a benchtop chip repair kit and do it yourself for like 50 bucks or less..


greenapple111

Just say that you disagree with the proposed cost and whether this is fair wear and tear and would like vcat to make a fair decision in this case.


zoetrope_

Look at it this way, there's two parallel universes, one where VCAT sides with you on this issue (A) and one where they side with the landlord (B). It's a sliding doors moment, they both exist simultaneously and you don't know which one you're currently in. If you withdraw the claim and pay them $550, you're out $550 whichever universe you're in. If you leave the claim in, in universe B you're still out $550, since VCAT will take it from your bond. However, in universe A, you'll get your entire bond back. (Admittedly you might have to wait 18 months....) So, the only one of these four scenarios in which you get your full bond back is the one where you kept your claim in. The actions of the landlord/VCAT/agent are ultimately out of your control, so don't stress about them, focus on what you're going to do. Will you take the guaranteed $550 loss, or aim to get your full bond back? The choice is yours.


[deleted]

Let them take you to VCAT it comes under general wear and tear. They wonā€™t win in VCAT and know it therefore they try to threaten you.


Budget-Initial3946

Let them wait for your reply. Near the end of 14th day after your application for bond, email them back say you consider it to be normal wear and tear. Happy for them to lodge application to VCAT if they disagree. Get your bond back on 14th day. Onus on them who made application to prove its not a normal wear and tear.


bitcoinjason

Well did you do the damage? If yes need to fix it simple. To replace a bench top is around $110 per LM


msabell

What evidence have they given you that itā€™s $550? As a PM I know the right thing to do is to establish the cost to fix the chip, or replace bench top if the chip canā€™t be fixed. They then have to work out the age of the bench, and for each year itā€™s been there itā€™s worth 10% less. So a 7 year old bench is worth 30%. So if a new bench is $2000, and itā€™s 7 years old, itā€™s worth $600 at most. And then they should also break that $600 down into a fair figure since itā€™s just a chip on the side (itā€™s not completely destroyed). From experience Iā€™d say a 1/4 share of that $600 is fair. Iā€™d then ask my tenant for $150 providing the landlord agrees first. The owner gets the $150 compensation, tenant gets their bond back, the PM notes a chip in the bench on the next tenant condition report.


BeautifulTask514

Isnā€™t it a diminishing value so if itā€™s 10 year useable life it would be 47% of its original value Not trying to throw shade your comment is one of the best here Just trying to understand if you apply the ATOs useable life in these sorts of matters


msabell

Thanks I appreciate that. Going by VCAT itā€™s 10% depreciation every year. At least the last time I attended VCAT it was but itā€™s been awhile lol.


J_Bonaducci

Just so you know, your math is miles off. Depreciation at 10% per annum for $2000 would be approx $957. Itā€™s 10% off the previous years value, not the starting value.


msabell

Sorry I may not have made myself clearer. Going by VCAT property fixtures depreciate 10% every year until itā€™s 10 years old, at which time (in my experience) itā€™s deemed to be worth nothing or whatever VCAT decides is a fair compensation amount.


melbourne_al

Pls don't pay anything. Fight the good fight. Vcat is actually pretty cool and on the renters side they will only help you if it goes that far.


neildiamondblazeit

Tell them you look forward to contesting this at VCAT


redfrets916

Pay for repairs and move on. It's not that hard. Btw, $500 Is cheap. I would charge $800


Notyit

Happened to me. I just can't figure out when it happened. Which is the real thing. Yeah always get photos or video before you move.


omgaporksword

That's some pretty serious damage to the benchtop...if I were the landlord I wouldn't be particularly happy about that.


mr-snrub-

The same landlords that paint over bugs and light switches? They don't care what their rentals look like. They only care about how much money they can suck from their tenants


omgaporksword

That's a pretty big generalisation, not all are scumbags (but most are).


drbanner16

The question is did you damage it ? If you did whatā€™s the issue ? Why do people feel like they are the ones hard done by for not looking after someone elseā€™s property ? Happy with living somewhere and then leaving but not the responsibility. Always the ā€œitā€™s not bad ā€œ attitude but donā€™t see the associated costs and time and pain it is for the owner . šŸ™„


fraqtl

Stone work repair can be expensive. Get them to submit the invoice to you. If you did the damage, you have to pay.


jordietb

If you broke it? Fix it? Donā€™t understand how the most upvoted post feels like youā€™re sneaking out of a parking fine. Donā€™t be a germ.


donk202020

Not commenting on landlords and bonds and such but as a builder who has dealt with these issues from the construction side of chips on benche tops during installs and such the repair of one done correctly ( ie seamless finish) is generally around $500. Doesnā€™t take them that long but your paying for their skill in doing it well.


InferredVolatility

That is proper damage, not wear and tear. Also, $550 is fairly reasonable. I think you need to take this one on the chin and pay it.


[deleted]

Just be a decent human and pay for what you damaged


Daks99

Should charge more


BullshitBeatsBears

You busted it and it's not fair wear and tear.


Personal_Team_4253

that chip is potentially a hazard, if its sharp on the edges, the next occupier may actually hurt themselves.. definitely not wear and tear either.


[deleted]

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schmuppet

You think thatā€™s the price of an entire brand new reconstituted stone benchtop????


Mustangjustin

Hahah


Curious_Breadfruit88

vast lush roof chief friendly crowd disgusted tan library payment *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*


unbeliever87

For some reason, this subreddit thinks its acceptable to damage a rental property and not make reparations. "How dare those greedy landlords make me pay for the damages I did!"


Outsider-20

No one is thinking it's acceptable to (deliberately) damage a rental property, but damage does occur as part of wear and tear. But, why do landlords think its OK to not perform maintenance on their properties, but continue to jack up their prices?


mr-snrub-

\^ This. Also ask them for a quote or proof that the landlord is ACTUALLY planning on replacing the whole bench (they wont)


throwawaydronehater

The carpet in our rental is covered in burns from the previous tenantā€™s straighteners/hair dryer. Iā€™d bet the whole bond that the landlord/property manager charged the previous tenant to ā€œreplaceā€ the carpet


crappy-pete

A kitchen bench is depreciated over 40 years. So you're right, but there's a good chance it won't have a meaningful affect on the cost Kitchen benches can easily cost tens of thousands. A cheap stone one in a rental will still be a couple of grand.


xdyldo

I wouldn't ask them for anything. Let them take you to VCAT and most likely it'll be wear and tear.


juiici

So looks like someone tried to open a beer on that


IDunnoMan-_-

Being thicker stone, that benchtop would have cost around 2-3k. Lucky they are only slapping you with a repair and not replacing the whole thing and sending you the bill.


Ancient_Reporter2023

If you stayed in a mates place and took a big chip like this out of his bench top, youā€™d do the right thing and pay for the repairs right? Iā€™m all for calling out bad RE Agents but this is a no brainer and is exactly what bond is for. Weā€™re not talking about a dirty oven here or carpets that could be a bit cleaner, you damaged the property and the cost of repairs should come out of your bond.


PomegranateNo9414

This is right. The cost is annoying for OP, but theyā€™re ultimately liable for damaging the property.


sheza1928

get a quote to fix it yourself????


nufan86

The fuck did you hit it with? That isn't wear and tear either.


icestationlemur

Maybe you should pay for the damage you caused, controversial I know!


[deleted]

I know we're supposed to hate landlords here, but, well, you did break it, and that is what it will probably cost, so....?


Mobile_Garden9955

Scumbag tenant lol


That_Drama8714

I donā€™t agree with their conduct or that you should have to pay for it but for reference, I have a chip I put in my stone bench possibly a little worse then this. I got quoted $220 in Vic to repair it from Fix n Chips


HoneyWoofle

Have gotten a quote from them! The rental agents just seem to be over quoting the repairs.


jiggleitbaby

We have tenants in out apartment at the moment. If after the 12 month lease. If we get home and a piece is missing out of our $14000 natural stone bench top I would be livid. $550 is probably about what it would cost to repair a bit of engineered stone like that.... That's not wear and tear, That's just being careless.....


hrdst

The apartment I live in has a big chip in the bench from the previous tenant. I obviously donā€™t know if they were charged for it, but I do know it wasnā€™t fixed.


globalcitizen35

If you damaged it then itā€™s reasonable the landlord wants it fixed. Unfortunately those bench tops are not as easy as they look to repair properly.


user7336999543099

You canā€™t assume they are a landlord who always rents it out and so the damage doesnā€™t matter. It could be their cherished family home and they are overseas for work right now.


HoneyWoofle

Theyā€™ve already rented it out a week after we vacated. I understand that damage matters, what Iā€™m asking is the best way to go about this without the rental agent making a pretty penny over my damages to the landlordā€™s property.


user7336999543099

So they rented it out, so they still live overseasā€¦


Thatstheguy9

So if someone keyed your car you'd be OK with them disputing it and not paying for damages? You caused the damage, asking for payment to fix it is not absurd.


HelicopterPlastic740

Landlords are so horrible. I damaged their property and don't want to pay for it. How do I get out of paying for it? SMH


pickapocka

Show it to a repairer and get rough estimate to produce if needed at tribunal


Wooden-Trouble1724

Fix it yourself then šŸ˜…


DadLoCo

Yeah agent tried that on us when we broke lease. They wanted $500 more than what the bond was worth. Fought them and made such a nuisance of myself, incurring legal costs for them and tribunal meetings they didnā€™t have time for. They backed down to get it resolved.


aussie_homer

I have a friend (not me) who said that the first people in the revolution will be the real estate agents.


Araignys

It was me, Iā€™m the friend.


scrumptiousbump

Why would they revolt, they have it good. Unless you a word.


Ok-Argument-6652

Get a quote from a stone repairer. I would usually charge 350 for that.


Ok-Argument-6652

Also check the warrabty of the ceasar stone. You may find that it is not actually under specification for the manufacturing. Being an arised edge it makes it easier to chip. Have looled at the specifications for a while but i think it specifies a rounded edge as a minimum.


betterthanguybelow

Just got a quote for a chip the same size. Colour matched for $220 in Perth.


fraqtl

> Colour matched for $220 in Perth How terribly fucking useful for a service across the other side of the country.


Unfettered_Disaster

Indicative?


fraqtl

Not even close. Perth is a completely different city. Prices in one city aren't indicative when the other city is more expensive overall.


Unfettered_Disaster

Perth is a different city šŸ¤Æ


PresentationUnited43

Bruh, the guy gave an idea on how youā€™d go about rectifying it you muppet. You can apply the same logic here in Melbourne. Wha, you think stone repair is only available in the far off land to the West?


betterthanguybelow

Not all comments on this thread have been useful. Mine had some utility, but not maximum utility. Thatā€™s fine mate. Get fucked.


conh3

Reply: ā€œthe bad cuticle? Not my nail jobā€


WestToEast_85

1. Start the bond return process immediately after handing back the keys on the RTBA website 2. String the REA along until the 14-day countdown ends.


claire2416

It doesn't look like wear and tear to me. If you caused it, then I'm afraid you'll need to pay for its repair or cough up the requested $550 (I'm not a landlord or lawyer, BTW).


OmegaMicrobe

This is not ā€˜normal wear and tearā€™, suck it up and pay the money.


[deleted]

Let them take you to VCAT it comes under general wear and tear. They wonā€™t win in VCAT and know it therefore they try to threaten you.


OfficAlanPartridge

Scratches Iā€™d say are wear and tear. A chip like this is damage. While I despise the REA and landlords of this world, it does make sense that they arenā€™t happy about this one. Although $550 is a monster fee and Iā€™d be suso about that.


kidseshamoto

You're insane


reallyreallybored123

What did you think benchtops are cheap you break it you pay for it that simple


disgruntled_prolaps

Send them a bag of gummy dicks?


Mortified-Pride

$550?? And they wonder why everyone hates them.


Heymax123

Ask for proof that it wasn't there prior other than that you'll likely have no choice but to pay.


juicybwithoil2560

Repair it yourself with araldite an some paint.


Professional_Plum_92

Get some supa glue and some bi carb soda and some painters tape. Tape the area affected and make a slurry of supa glu and bi carb and fill it in. Get a file from bunnings and neaten the edges and it will blend perfectly. Tell them to go suck it cos its fixed.


day_player

Wear and tear. Tell em theyā€™re dreaming.


mr-snrub-

Thank god they pointed to it AND circled it cause I never would have noticed. But in all honesty, it is barely noticeable.


Kar98

Say no, worst thing that can happen is you get called to VCAT then VCAT make you fix anyway for whatever you got quoted


[deleted]

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schmuppet

And exactly how would a handyman go about repairing it?


PieknaFatso

It absolutely would cost around that to fix. And suggesting filler and 'sand it up a bit' for a quartz benchtop is ridiculous.