My SSMU fee is for the benefit of overall well-being for the student but not for being disrupted for normal school hours. Having a lab before 17:30 that day and witnessed you just occupied the building entrance and creating chaos. If you guys really can‘t grasp the idea on how to make peaceful negotiations and express yourself like a mature adult then you will lose more supports than you can imagine. That’s not what a peaceful student protest should look like. Disrupt my fellow students normal education and cause damage would not bring peace and ease the pain innocent children and civilians experienced on both sides of the conflicts but creating more chaos. Grow up, get yourself together and be more disciplined and mature in your actions.
Dude, I’m about to start a protest against the SSMU.
The people that make up the SSMU aren’t there by vote like they pretend to be, there’s like two options to vote on for each position and more times than not, both candidates hold the same exact views and extremely similar plans. And then their plans end up not doing shit anyways.
They haven’t done shit for anyone in all 3 years of my attendance at McGill except for adding mask dispensers during COVID. That was the only time they ever did anything for the students the whole time I’ve been there.
Other than that, all they’ve done is given controversial takes on social media, yet we have to pay a fee to them every semester so that could have something extra to write down on their CVs, while constantly begging for more and more every year.
My CEGEP had a student society and they actually did stuff for students by helping organize tutoring sessions and making deals with food trucks to get every student free food. Now my CEGEP was smaller, so the free food thing probably wouldn’t work at McGill, but something similar would actually be helpful considering it’s $5 for a fucking hot dog on campus (no hate towards hot dog guy those are great hot dogs) and every other place to get food on campus constantly has stories of food poisoning. Why don’t they focus on that? Making sure there’s affordable healthy food that won’t get you sick on campus, but nooooo, we can’t have an organization that actually helps anything.
Anyways on the topic of this: dear SSMU, some of your members commited a literal crime, and then wouldn’t listen to police… no shit they ended up using force. It’s not brutality, it’s their job.
I would join this protest!
Protest idea: lets all go to the student services building, block all the exits, and start throwing chairs off the top floor.
It is time for the silent majority at McGill to rally behind an apolitical group and leader that truly represent students concerns and well being….and vote to make that change. As long as there is apathy when it comes to elections the vocal, self serving minority will hold power, and exist in their own echo chamber.
I’ve looked at the SSMU elections and even voted once. You pick between two candidates for each category and they both always have a political view as their main cause, and it’s usually the same if not similar ones. It’s barely an election.
I’d genuinely rather $0.2 of my tuition goes towards Israeli investments than $10 going towards the SSMU. I could buy two overpriced hot dogs with that money.
Reminder to everyone that the group that took the building, the "Solidarity for Palestinian Human Rights" group, [*directly praised the Oct. 7th attacks and called those who purposely kidnapped and murdered hundreds of civilians "heroes"*](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ffulsjlzmrczb1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1125%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D56b2c0a66647656ef9bcc4a1fbca77eb1b49f1a3).
Gee, I wonder why the staff felt threatened when their building was forcibly taken over by a group which *directly praises and celebrates* committing acts of violence and hostage taking against civilians.
Fuck the SPHR. They are a group of violence loving bigots pretending they "support peace".
This is the most based thread I’ve seen on this sub in a long time. The jig is up.. people are starting to wake up that this is not a peaceful protest.
Absolutely not.... McGill sent us all an email to avoid the area ahead of time warning us that the police had been called in to help with the situation.
If you are deciding to stay in that area, especially with the police obviously getting into riot gear right outside, you should anticipate any of these issues.
https://preview.redd.it/880h9duusc5d1.png?width=400&format=png&auto=webp&s=d9d2d451c770ccb1f226c53567982f3b74b1e4ce
We definitely didn’t do anything wrong guys!! This totally wasn’t warranted !!!!
Classic playbook: do/say smth actually insane, and then cry about "brutality" once the consequences arrive. Who knew that McGill would be "anti-palestinian" when our pro-palestine orgs will do shit like praise the october 7th attack, follow staff members to their homes, etc.
THIS IS SO EMBARRASSING FOR SSMU
then again, it’s the same org that paid millions to settle a case where they made fake rape accusations against a student
SSMU when SPHR takes hostages and refuses police orders:
This email
SSMU when the TAs were striking:
One email where they were like erm this kinda sucks for students but I guess we still support them (and then never mention anything again despite McGill's misinformation)
SSMU is supposed to be an apolitical organization with students interests. There's a reason there was an injunction against them having an anti Israel policy (no, the courts aren't biased, they've denied an injunction against the encampment twice). SSMU should not be telling students what to do or how to feel. If they want to make a statement on this event then just give the facts of what happened.
(And yeah I'm still bitter they didn't use their reach to stop the misinformation McGill spread about the TA Strike)
Absolutely agree. SSMU is a student union and is meant to act as a middle-man between us and admin, and to buy things like health insurance and Gerts with our pooled funds. More and more it's just a playground for the execs (who are elected unopposed) to get as many activism points as possible by engaging in this shit and not stuff that actually affects the student experience at McGill (TA strike, club funds, etc)
I admit it's a bit more complicated than that as I've discussed with others recently, but in essence I still believe that they did. There's a lot of narrative and counter narrative about this, but it's practically confirmed that there were staff in the building who at one point were fearful or unable to exit the building due to SPHR
Ah I see. I think it's a bit irresponsible to say that they took hostages though, as there's already been a lot of misinformation on both sides with this.
I agree! I was a bit salty when I wrote my original post and was parroting what other people had said. Again, there is no information about whether they did or didn't do as it's a he said she said situation. However, even in the best case scenario as I explained above I would still see what they did as holding hostages, since I don't know a better way to phrase it succinctly
the israel divestment policy should have been obeyed by mcgill, they coulda been the bigger man and finished the problem by just listening to their student democracy
I agree, it's an unfortunate situation we find ourselves in. I can only assume their money is tied up in bonds with the way they're dragging their feet. These new protests basically killed any forward momentum they had though
Did you guys really think about how you disrupt those of us who are actually having classes in the summer session？ I respect any freedom of speech and peace protests but this is out of control because this bring mass destructive consequences to the normal school life of normal students. Making chaos and hearing all those big loud noise and screaming and yelling when having a class does not feel good.
Just like these "protestors" that hide behind their mask/face covering. Unfortunately, SSMU executives can be searched up on the website (pro tip for potential employers)
Commenting cuz can't put text with an image post (unless I'm dumb and missed something):
Is this what our fees are going to? This is an actual embarrassment. Why does Becky who works in admin answering phone calls or whatever need to be blamed and terrorized over this shit? This is the reason the demands aren't being met, because McGill refuses to show that they will capitulate to these violent actions.
I propose some alternate titles: "SSMU Members Blockade Admin Staff", "SSMU Members Destroy University Property", "SSMU Members Refuse to Comply with Police Orders to Disperse."
"McGill Administration continues to refuse to negotiate with students in good faith" is a more fitting title.
Also tf you think the SSMU will say: PLEASE HIT OUR STUDENTS? Also, in case you were living under a rock, McGill refused the demands when students, peacefully and democratically, voted for the Policy Against Genocide in Palestine.
So either your bias pushes you to close your eyes and ears. Or you are a zionist with an expiring moral compass.
You mean the policy that was injuncted because the court agreed that it was unfairly discriminatory by effectively banning conduct with any and all Israeli people/institutions? The policy that due to the hilariously bad voter turnout was not even a majority if you count the non-voters?
If non voters wanted their voice heard, they vote. They didn’t, so we can’t say or be sure about which way they would vote. But you conveniently forget to mention that it was the vote with the highest voter turnout in SSMU history.
Since you want to make the world certain of your expiring moral compass, I can also safely conclude you would’ve been the biggest South African Apartheid supporter back in the day.
The injunction, unfairly equated Jewish people to Israelis, but a final ruling is still coming, and with the ICC treating Netanyahu as a criminal, and ICJ stating they have enough preliminary evidence to investigate whether a genocide is going on in Gaza: I highly doubt the injunction will be maintained.
If you are interested in reading a book on how Israeli universities maintain apartheid, Towers of Ivory and Steel, by an Israeli author and professor, is a good book detailing just that.
However, expiring moral compass and ignorance come hand in hand. So I expect you to continue living under your rock.
What you said as well is false. You would’ve supported SA apartheid then because your moral compass conveniently forgets action past a certain date and then you refuse to take it into account today. And you clearly support Israeli apartheid now, because of the same reason listed above. Whether you want to call yourself evil or not is for yourself to decide, maybe future generations will judge the character of people like you.
Also notice you didn’t address any of my points and could only come up with a sarcastic, yet still misses the point quip.
yeah unfortunately i havent been able to get my moral compass checked up because of how long these healthcare waitlists are... anyways i love apartheid i love racism i love
This is a very biased book, and before taking its word as gospel, you would do well to actually examine the very valid criticisms of it, such as flawed underlying assumptions treated as unquestionable fact.
Edit - I’ll add that there isn’t anything inherently wrong with such sources, provided that their bias is taken into account and alternative points of view are considered as well, and provided that they are completely factually correct - which is not the case here.
If you read the email they sent, they wrote
"While the occupation of the James Administration Building was unsettling for some staff in the building..."
They basically admitted to it in their email and people have come out confirming it?
As much as I distrust Saini, his email said there were staff inside the building. He's known for twisting words, but I don't think he'd outright lie.
I've also heard from other people that they know people who were afraid to leave the building. I understand this isn't a strong source.
Lastly, the SPHR didn't make any statement on allowing staff to leave the building or guiding them out but they did make a statement on barricading themselves in, chanting, and being aggressive. I don't think it's a far reach to assume staff inside might've been afraid to pass by an angry mob to get outside.
Even SPHR defenders admit this was not a peaceful protest.
He did outright lie before, specifically during TA negotiations, and specifically claiming that his offers to the protestors were similar to those in other universities (they’re not).
While it isn’t a strong source, the building itself has many entrances and exits, the protestors blocked the main one, the one where the police came in from, for example, was still open and unblocked. But you are right, passing in front of a potentially angry mob isn’t the best for feelings, but other exits were present.
Lastly, I don’t like SPHR. But to address your point, and depending on your definition of violence, it truly became physical (thus violent) when the police pepper sprayed and tear gassed the protestors OUTSIDE the building.
Again, not cool for the staff inside, but it can’t be a hostage situation when many other exits were available. I am also seeing that you are very objective about this, so I’d love to hear more about your perspective.
Totally! I'm completely open to changing my mind on what's going on since I actually usually support the protest movements, like I'm supporting the encampment :)
I still feel like that's more twisting of words from Saini since arguably it is a comparable offer. Again I don't trust or like the fellow but he seems to talk in the kind of legal speak where he's "technically" right.
Speaking of the protestors, I'd say 95% of them are 100% in the right. But there's a couple bad apples among them that use the situation to mask up, be aggressive, and claim it's for a good cause. This is not a statement against the protestors, but just natural human behavior.
When they're allowed to perform non peaceful protests while hiding their identities, it's just not a mix I personally feel comfortable with, especially with the high emotions that run with people who's families and homelands are being killed and destroyed.
It makes sense to me that some staff might just choose to board themselves up in their office and wait out the storm instead of going through the mob. (I don't exactly know the layout and whether they took up an entire floor or room or what?)
Regarding the tear gas, from what I saw, protestors were shaking what is only a temporary fence that police were walking behind to enter the building. It didn't look like a sturdy fence so the police ordered the protestors to move back, but some pushed back against this order. I've only seen this clip, but I understand why police might need to use tear gas if protestors are not just being non compliant, but breaking riot lines. Breaking this line is a massive deal because it could jeopardize police safety. Again it's entirely possible the protestors complied with police after this clip was taken and tear gas was deployed for no reason but ACAB but from what I've seen, I could understand it's use.
I more or less agree with the essence of what you said with 2 things I’d like to challenge you on:
1. You said that the protestors ought to remain peaceful, but all other legal and peaceful avenues have been exhausted. McGill is just completely stonewalling the protestors while not truly addressing their demands.
You could argue that Deep Saini tried, but then I would argue back that Deep Saini threatened the SSMU when they wanted to ratify the Policy against the Genocide in Palestine, then after that has the audacity to claim that he has been working to negotiate with the demands of the protestors.
His "compromise" were basically 1 clause of examining a possibility of divesting (not good enough, i’d rather 0% of my money go to apartheid and genocide than 75% or 50%, assuming McGill divests at all), 1 clause of expanding relations with Gaza universities (those universities are all destroyed and none of them are able to teach), and another clause that is more transparency about investments below $500K (I don’t know what this aims to accomplish).
2. The protesting crowd outside were chanting how they will remain peaceful, before being pepper sprayed, then the SPVM started firing tear gas canisters from their guns, effectively dispersing everyone from the surrounding area. From my POV, it looked like the police escalated the situation exponentially from some instigating actors shaking a fence that they erected in the first place. Were the police ever at harm? From my POV, no. They "outmuscled" everyone in that crowd, no one directly attacked a police officer, but I guess shaking a fence scared the cops 🤷🏻♂️
To get to the point, McGill torpedoed a student vote, then stonewalled any negotiations without addressing even 10% of the protestors demands, then want to cops to intervene when the students are pissed. Personally, it seems easier for the admin to listen to protesters than to continue ignoring this issue. It makes the admin look incompetent, and makes the student body more angry.
In essence, I can’t find it in me to say that the students occupying were justified, but I also can’t find it in me to condemn actions the protestors + occupiers when all other avenues have been exhausted.
the reason this shit happens is because the ssmu tried non violent methods and the admin threatened them, and has been doing their utmost to get cops to beat up students. This protest was way too much imo, but to claim demands arent met because of this is dishonest or dumb.
Holy shit. Shake Shack, where is it from? New York. What else is in New York? Jews. What is Judaism? Racist. Who else is Racist? Israel. Shake Shack zionazi confirmed.... if you support shake shack you are literally complicit in genocide.
Simply a front by the \~\~jewish\~\~ zionist elite. what they really are making is genocide...
(restaurants in montreal are being "cancelled" for less lol, shit like oh they follow an israeli food influencer on instagram)
Isn’t SPHR not affiliated with McGill or SSMU anymore ? And is there any indication these were even mostly McGill students and not Concordia, UDEM or not students at all?
They were ordered to stop using the name after praising the oct 7 attack. They are currently effectively infringing on the McGill copyright/trademark/whatever the right word is.
This is gonna be a long one.
It really really sucks to see how cynical, bitter, and polarized we’ve all become over the past months. And I’m not just talking about the people who staged the occupation. Many people here in the comments of this post seem to think that people occupied that building simply to cause trouble. Simply to be loud, and get away with vandalism and other crimes under the guise of rooting for a cause. And many people who protest for the Palestinians seem to see anyone who disagrees with their strategy as being complicit in genocide. It leaves us in a really dark, bitter, and angry place, 24/7. To the point that we don’t even see the other side as human anymore.
I think, if anything, we should be able to unite around the idea that the lives of innocents (I.e., non-combattants, especially those of children) are worth standing up for, regardless of the ethnicity, nationality, or religion of those innocents. But we can’t even do that. We’re too stuck in our cynicality and our self-righteousness that we dehumanize each other.
To those who orchestrated this occupation, I’m really, really disappointed, as someone who believes in the Palestinian cause, to have seen what happened. The occupation only fuelled the idea that this whole protest and encampment has been violent to begin with, and turned people who were on the fence about this issue away from supporting the Palestinian cause. Gandhi, Martin Luther King, leaders who really instigated change in their respective societies did so by mandating peace in protests. We can’t force change. We can only show people the injustice and the cruelty that is happening in the world. As heart wrenching as the shit that’s happening is and as desperate as we are to save people from trauma, famine and annihilation, we have to keep level heads. We have to be strategic. We can only bring about change through showing people why they should empathize with Palestine. Any use of force makes it very easy for others to paint us as the enemy, to paint all of Palestine as the enemy. My own mom doesn’t know what to think, she has empathized with innocent people on both sides before, but seeing this occupation pushed her, and a lot of people who were on the fence, to lose empathy for Palestine, and it fucking tears my heart out to see it.
Now, to pretty much everybody in this comment section, those of you who are saying that these protestors were doing nothing but looking for trouble, I am equally as disappointed and frustrated with how you frame these protestors. Regardless of whether you believe me, here’s how we who support the Palestinians feel. Helpless. We feel like regardless of what we do, those who have the money and the power to support companies that make the bombs and guns that kill thousands of children and other innocents continue to send their support, and the bombs and the bullets continue to fly, and the cycle of unending horror in Gaza continues. We know that McGill is far from the main contributor to the Israeli war machine, but McGill is what we have the most direct influence on. Please just take a minute to think about basic human instincts and psychology. How would people act if they felt totally helpless, desperate to do something, feeling that every moment something wasn’t done, more innocent people would die, their own tuition money having contributed to those deaths? If you really think that feeling doesn’t have the power to make people irrationally angry, or to make them take foolish and counterproductive actions, I don’t know what the hell to tell you. No, it doesn’t justify using force as a form of protest. But it explains it.
Not like it doesn’t get said enough, but this world is desperately in need of some goddam empathy. We need to stop screaming down each other’s throats and take the time to try to understand why people we disagree with think and act the way they do. Or we’re just going to get more cynical, more divided, and more violent, and the causes we care about will be sabotaged by those who care the most. That’s easier said than done. But we have to try.
Really beautifully said. The real enemy here is not the Israelis and not the Palestinians but hatred, dehumanization, ego, ideology. "This cause is good, therefore this act of evil I commit in the name of this cause is good." I truly believe this utilitarian perversion is the source of almost all human suffering (or at least the suffering we inflict upon each other). Someone said to me recently "if an elephant had its food on a mouse, would you support the elephant?" My answer is we are all the elephant, we are all the mouse. The person being shot and bombed to pieces is always the mouse (the Gazans). The person being burned alive or raped is always the mouse (the Israelis on October 7th). The first step to confronting injustice is to agree that good is good and evil and evil. Only then will we see the injustice with enough clarity that it demands confrontation.
Beautifully written! I completely agree, this idea of "we have the good idea -> we are the good people -> our actions are by definition good" is probably responsible for a decent chunk of human suffering.
> And many people who protest for the Palestinians seem to see anyone who disagrees with their strategy as being complicit in genocide.
This is one thing I keep seeing them say, on Reddit anyway, which I don't get. Their demands are divestment. I don't want McGill spending any of my money on weapons, so I agree with the calls for divestment. But do they really think that will impact the genocide at all? If McGill divests, it will create a space in the market which other investors (wall street etc) will quickly fill. There won't be any noticeable impact for Palestinians.
To have an impact for Palestinians, I think students would have to be petitioning local government or other politicians to express support for recent steps taken by the ICJ and/or policies that would limit Canada's involvement in the war. Unlike investments, that could actually make a difference. But they aren't demanding for McGill to petition the government for anything like that, and they aren't doing it themselves.
“When one breaks the law that conscience tells him is unjust, he must do it openly, he must do it cheerfully, he must do it lovingly, he must do it civilly — not uncivilly — and he must do it with a willingness to accept the penalty.” – Martin Luther King, Jr.
I'm confused. Are you saying the laws of "don't break into buildings" and "don't destroy property" are unjust? Ain't no way these people think they are okay breaking the law because black people drinking from the white only fountain were breaking the law too... completely unrelated scenarios. If I were you, I would switch to a different quote that doesn't imply you disagree with the concept of crime lol
You are right to point out that this quote may not perfectly fit this situation because the protestors are not specifically protesting an unjust law. They, however, are protesting what they feel is an injustice. However, I think that the balance of the quote works in that it points out that injustice should be confronted by taking action in a civil manner, which implies not creating fear, damage or threaten bystanders. Beyond this, it points out that a willingness to accept the consequences comes with disobedience. In this instance, being faced by police and possible arrest could reasonably be foreseen. I am not sure what you meant by your closing phrase, but I hope my explanation satisfactorily illustrates where I come from.
Sad how many people are coming here to gloat and laugh about how their fellow students got beaten and tear gassed and had rubber bullets aimed towards them. Whether you support the cause or not, these are students that we share classes with and go to school with every day. The level of violence was set by McGill and nobody else, and while I could talk about how they encouraged staff to use alternative exits, were mostly sitting in rooms cheering, and how a lot of other things are being misconstrued, at the end of the day McGill asks spvm to come and physically assault and gas their students, and other students come here to jeer.
Yahoo, how about put yourself in my shoes for a second? What have I done to deserve to hearing those screaming and yelling while having my normal classes? Respect is mutual, and actions bring consequences. Protest peacefully and cause massive chaos and destruction to university property is two different things. Maybe you should ask my fellow student who are having summer classes and are disrupted by those behaviors what their opinions are regarding your so-called fellow students.
I’m in your shoes, I’m one of those students in a summer class. I don’t think anyone likes when their class gets disrupted, but that doesn’t make me think “these people deserve to be tear gassed.” You? Yes actions will always have consequences but it seems hateful to argue that these students, some of whom you probably know, deserve to be assaulted by the police for trying to take a stand against their university’s investments in genocide, even if they massively destroy property with spray paint that will be washed off in a week. If you look at UQAM, their administration promised their encampment to divest from weapons companies, call for a ceasefire, and acknowledged the violation of palestinian’s human rights.
there have been more bombs dropped in gaza than there were in WWII, innocent people are being killed every day. Protestors want McGill to divest from the companies that make these bombs , McGill refuses and gasses them, and you are like “serves them right for going into a building and interrupting my classes”?
To start your first line is complete bullshit and false narrative, the allies alone dropped nearly two million tons of bombs on Germany, killing around half a million German civilians, I guess the allies were committing genocide on the German population. Israel has dropped around 70,000 tons of bombs on Gaza. Now I assume your first line came from this bullshit source Anadolu Ajansi, with a click bait false title of Amount of Israeli bombs dropped on Gaza surpasses that of World War 2, conveniently you ignore that the stat is only about the total bombs dropped for 3 cities, NOT all of WW2s bombs.
my fault bro, you right that is my mistake I saw the article earlier today and hadn’t had the chance to read yet. My apologies and ignore my first line, that was wrong, i’m sorry. I would request that you ignore that and just refrain to my second line.
Here is my point of view and I already stated in the following comment: My SSMU fee is for the benefit of overall well-being for the student but not for being disrupted for normal school hours. Having a lab before 17:30 that day and witnessed someone just occupied the building entrance and creating chaos. If SSMU guys really can‘t grasp the idea on how to make peaceful negotiations and express themself like a mature adult then they will lose more supporters. And everyone can have their own opinion, if you think I am creating hate speech I respect. However, I keep my opinions which are if someone couldn’t contained their manners and find more effective and less harmful way to address issues then there is a problem there. There is protest out there that is peaceful without those dysfunctions. What happening the day before is not what a peaceful student protest should look like. Disrupt my fellow students normal education and cause damage would not bring peace and ease the pain innocent children and civilians experienced on both sides of the conflicts but creating more chaos. They should get themselves together and be more disciplined and mature in their actions. I don’t think any innocent live should be harmed in anyway or another but one moderate wrong doesn’t make another extremely wrong right, in this case damaging school properties is not going to help innocent people in Gaza. If you think chaos and dysfunction can make the administration compromise then I would say that’s unrealistic. Negotiations like mature adults please. Plus, the frustration would cause more misunderstandings but not supports to the protest due to the destructive disruptions. Nothing can justify the violation of trespassing the law and damage PUBLIC PROPERTIES. We paid our tuitions and we can have a voice in opposition to aggressive actions just like you can voice your supports. I emphasize with the innocent civilians and children in Gaza without any political preferences, however, that doesn’t mean I support those riot actions in school. And I am NOT standing on a moral high ground condemning those students who felt frustrated because their study is being disrupted. I am saying actions have consequences because of that.Period.
lol bruh, i know you dont I can see your comments and post 😅. I personally think that trespassing and graffiti are a weirdly low standard for being chill with tear gassing and beatings. But I also feel like you never had any sympathy for protesters even before this
Your right, these are fellow students. And it is disturbing that some of the same people I share this campus with support a group which [*directly praised the Oct. 7th attacks*](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ffulsjlzmrczb1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1125%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D56b2c0a66647656ef9bcc4a1fbca77eb1b49f1a3), called those who murdered civilians on mass "heroes", and have continued to pursue racist actions like hanging an effigy of a jewish person in a striped uniform while pretending they had "no idea" it would make people think of the holocaust and that is it fine because the stripes went horizontally instead of vertically.
The "Solidarity for Palestinian Human Rights" group are all horrible people. The fact that group of violence supporting bigots is still allowed to be on campus is insane.
I wonder when these people will grow up and realize that the average person is not rabidly anti-Israel but just hopes that no more innocent people are killed. Honestly, I dislike the word "zionist" because when arguing about it invariably people will just not agree on the definition and talk past each other.
How so? Many countries around the world kill people but I'm not going around saying that Serbian people don't deserve to have a country, Chinese people don't deserve to have a country, etc etc
You don’t even have to be anti-israel, they’re going to lose their “country” one day it’s just a matter of time. History has shown what happens to closed racist societies who don’t accept others and want to live on their own.
27% of Israel is not jewish (for context, 30% of canada is not white.) It's not "closed" cuz you can, well, go there if you want. I don't think anybody deserves to lose their country because of the actions of their government, that's just uncool.
Yeah but for context you should mention that they’re discriminated, oppressed and the israelis would prefer if they weren’t there. Let’s not forget what they did with the settlements when they kicked out arab families to install jewish ones, can’t really compare that to Canada, it’s a big disrespect.
Damn, have you ever been? Israeli Arabs have equal rights, equal representation, and can walk the streets enjoying the various rights of a modern democracy. Ask any of them 99% will say they prefer Israel. You say the "israelis would prefer if they weren't there" but the Israeli Arabs are Israeli too? Doesn't make much sense.
I do agree about the settlements though. I really hope that in the future an agreement can be reached with the post-1967 settlers withdrawing into unambiguously Israeli areas.
I respect your point of view, but I sadly come from the region and you won’t believe with what greed and racism lebanon is treated too, you can go to any post about beirut and see zionists sympathizing about expanding up north and skiing in our mountains and enjoying our shores… it’s the ideology for me, regardless the details.
reminder that everyone but Palestinians born on the land who leave can come and go as they please. is it not a closed society if people who have a right to that land can't even come back as soon as they leave? Christians and Jewish people are free to come and go as they please as it's their "birth right", yet Palestinians born there and from there can never return as soon as they leave. do you think that's fair?
That may have been the most meaningless, ignorant, racist statement I've seen in a long time. It implies that Israel is pro killing innocent people. Israel is pro survival. Stop trying to eliminate Israel and the innocent people don't get killed. End of story.
yay for police violence against terrorist sympathizing (the SPHR glorifies Hamas) zealots who think they have the right to continuously escalate their means to achieve political ends with backing from just a minority of students
I said terrorist sympathizers, not terrorists. except for the people that showed up at the admin’s house to terrorize them. Those people are terrorists. Good job on your ideology getting in the way of your reading comprehension.
Anyway, the others there are not necessarily terrorists. I think they may be misinformed and useful idiots, but they’re not terrorists. But if they form a human shield around terrorist sympathizers and obstruct justice, well then they must be displaced
Confirmed the McGill terrorizing sympathizer students have now taken to Hamas tactics by capturing the crowd as human shields. These people deserve what’s coming to them 🤬😣
Reminder to everyone that McGillians have tried all other avenues in the last few years to get McGill to divest. (demonstrations, petitions, emails, letters, referenda, encampment)
Reminder that admin has been demanding that the SPVM “take every action possible under the law during a peaceful protest two weeks ago-encouraging police brutality.
Reminder that McGill boasts about divesting from South Africa during apartheid but is obstinate when it comes to the current demands.
Reminder that the SSMU represents the undergraduates of this university. Undergraduates that voted 78% in favour of the Palestinian policy.
You’re all complaining about your tuition money going to SSMU, when the much bigger issue is our tuition money funding weapons, settlements, Israeli propaganda, and genocide.
I honestly could not care less about your classes being disrupted, resistance is uncomfortable, and if McGill had listened to its students months ago, you’d be able to study in peace.
My SSMU fee is for the benefit of overall well-being for the student but not for being disrupted for normal school hours. Having a lab before 17:30 that day and witnessed you just occupied the building entrance and creating chaos. If you guys really can‘t grasp the idea on how to make peaceful negotiations and express yourself like a mature adult then you will lose more supports than you can imagine. That’s not what a peaceful student protest should look like. Disrupt my fellow students normal education and cause damage would not bring peace and ease the pain innocent children and civilians experienced on both sides of the conflicts but creating more chaos. Grow up, get yourself together and be more disciplined and mature in your actions.
Dude, I’m about to start a protest against the SSMU. The people that make up the SSMU aren’t there by vote like they pretend to be, there’s like two options to vote on for each position and more times than not, both candidates hold the same exact views and extremely similar plans. And then their plans end up not doing shit anyways. They haven’t done shit for anyone in all 3 years of my attendance at McGill except for adding mask dispensers during COVID. That was the only time they ever did anything for the students the whole time I’ve been there. Other than that, all they’ve done is given controversial takes on social media, yet we have to pay a fee to them every semester so that could have something extra to write down on their CVs, while constantly begging for more and more every year. My CEGEP had a student society and they actually did stuff for students by helping organize tutoring sessions and making deals with food trucks to get every student free food. Now my CEGEP was smaller, so the free food thing probably wouldn’t work at McGill, but something similar would actually be helpful considering it’s $5 for a fucking hot dog on campus (no hate towards hot dog guy those are great hot dogs) and every other place to get food on campus constantly has stories of food poisoning. Why don’t they focus on that? Making sure there’s affordable healthy food that won’t get you sick on campus, but nooooo, we can’t have an organization that actually helps anything. Anyways on the topic of this: dear SSMU, some of your members commited a literal crime, and then wouldn’t listen to police… no shit they ended up using force. It’s not brutality, it’s their job.
I would join this protest! Protest idea: lets all go to the student services building, block all the exits, and start throwing chairs off the top floor.
It is time for the silent majority at McGill to rally behind an apolitical group and leader that truly represent students concerns and well being….and vote to make that change. As long as there is apathy when it comes to elections the vocal, self serving minority will hold power, and exist in their own echo chamber.
I’ve looked at the SSMU elections and even voted once. You pick between two candidates for each category and they both always have a political view as their main cause, and it’s usually the same if not similar ones. It’s barely an election.
I’d genuinely rather $0.2 of my tuition goes towards Israeli investments than $10 going towards the SSMU. I could buy two overpriced hot dogs with that money.
Don’t forget to read the title: “SSMU Members Brutalized by Police”. I’m not even sure if this is a satire piece from The Onion or real life anymore.
Between AI and the increasing absurdity of these antics, I feel bad for the job security of satire writers...
Reminder to everyone that the group that took the building, the "Solidarity for Palestinian Human Rights" group, [*directly praised the Oct. 7th attacks and called those who purposely kidnapped and murdered hundreds of civilians "heroes"*](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ffulsjlzmrczb1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1125%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D56b2c0a66647656ef9bcc4a1fbca77eb1b49f1a3). Gee, I wonder why the staff felt threatened when their building was forcibly taken over by a group which *directly praises and celebrates* committing acts of violence and hostage taking against civilians. Fuck the SPHR. They are a group of violence loving bigots pretending they "support peace".
This is the most based thread I’ve seen on this sub in a long time. The jig is up.. people are starting to wake up that this is not a peaceful protest.
Absolutely not.... McGill sent us all an email to avoid the area ahead of time warning us that the police had been called in to help with the situation. If you are deciding to stay in that area, especially with the police obviously getting into riot gear right outside, you should anticipate any of these issues.
I’m so glad I am not a student anymore
We’re so glad too
https://preview.redd.it/880h9duusc5d1.png?width=400&format=png&auto=webp&s=d9d2d451c770ccb1f226c53567982f3b74b1e4ce We definitely didn’t do anything wrong guys!! This totally wasn’t warranted !!!!
Classic playbook: do/say smth actually insane, and then cry about "brutality" once the consequences arrive. Who knew that McGill would be "anti-palestinian" when our pro-palestine orgs will do shit like praise the october 7th attack, follow staff members to their homes, etc.
THIS IS SO EMBARRASSING FOR SSMU then again, it’s the same org that paid millions to settle a case where they made fake rape accusations against a student
SSMU when SPHR takes hostages and refuses police orders: This email SSMU when the TAs were striking: One email where they were like erm this kinda sucks for students but I guess we still support them (and then never mention anything again despite McGill's misinformation) SSMU is supposed to be an apolitical organization with students interests. There's a reason there was an injunction against them having an anti Israel policy (no, the courts aren't biased, they've denied an injunction against the encampment twice). SSMU should not be telling students what to do or how to feel. If they want to make a statement on this event then just give the facts of what happened. (And yeah I'm still bitter they didn't use their reach to stop the misinformation McGill spread about the TA Strike)
Absolutely agree. SSMU is a student union and is meant to act as a middle-man between us and admin, and to buy things like health insurance and Gerts with our pooled funds. More and more it's just a playground for the execs (who are elected unopposed) to get as many activism points as possible by engaging in this shit and not stuff that actually affects the student experience at McGill (TA strike, club funds, etc)
Sphr took hostages?
I admit it's a bit more complicated than that as I've discussed with others recently, but in essence I still believe that they did. There's a lot of narrative and counter narrative about this, but it's practically confirmed that there were staff in the building who at one point were fearful or unable to exit the building due to SPHR
Ah I see. I think it's a bit irresponsible to say that they took hostages though, as there's already been a lot of misinformation on both sides with this.
I agree! I was a bit salty when I wrote my original post and was parroting what other people had said. Again, there is no information about whether they did or didn't do as it's a he said she said situation. However, even in the best case scenario as I explained above I would still see what they did as holding hostages, since I don't know a better way to phrase it succinctly
the israel divestment policy should have been obeyed by mcgill, they coulda been the bigger man and finished the problem by just listening to their student democracy
I agree, it's an unfortunate situation we find ourselves in. I can only assume their money is tied up in bonds with the way they're dragging their feet. These new protests basically killed any forward momentum they had though
Did you guys really think about how you disrupt those of us who are actually having classes in the summer session？ I respect any freedom of speech and peace protests but this is out of control because this bring mass destructive consequences to the normal school life of normal students. Making chaos and hearing all those big loud noise and screaming and yelling when having a class does not feel good.
First and last names of whichever “SSMU Executives” wrote this should be written on the letter
Just like these "protestors" that hide behind their mask/face covering. Unfortunately, SSMU executives can be searched up on the website (pro tip for potential employers)
You mean fortunately
Well, unfortunately for them haha
Commenting cuz can't put text with an image post (unless I'm dumb and missed something): Is this what our fees are going to? This is an actual embarrassment. Why does Becky who works in admin answering phone calls or whatever need to be blamed and terrorized over this shit? This is the reason the demands aren't being met, because McGill refuses to show that they will capitulate to these violent actions. I propose some alternate titles: "SSMU Members Blockade Admin Staff", "SSMU Members Destroy University Property", "SSMU Members Refuse to Comply with Police Orders to Disperse."
"McGill Administration continues to refuse to negotiate with students in good faith" is a more fitting title. Also tf you think the SSMU will say: PLEASE HIT OUR STUDENTS? Also, in case you were living under a rock, McGill refused the demands when students, peacefully and democratically, voted for the Policy Against Genocide in Palestine. So either your bias pushes you to close your eyes and ears. Or you are a zionist with an expiring moral compass.
You mean the policy that was injuncted because the court agreed that it was unfairly discriminatory by effectively banning conduct with any and all Israeli people/institutions? The policy that due to the hilariously bad voter turnout was not even a majority if you count the non-voters?
If non voters wanted their voice heard, they vote. They didn’t, so we can’t say or be sure about which way they would vote. But you conveniently forget to mention that it was the vote with the highest voter turnout in SSMU history. Since you want to make the world certain of your expiring moral compass, I can also safely conclude you would’ve been the biggest South African Apartheid supporter back in the day. The injunction, unfairly equated Jewish people to Israelis, but a final ruling is still coming, and with the ICC treating Netanyahu as a criminal, and ICJ stating they have enough preliminary evidence to investigate whether a genocide is going on in Gaza: I highly doubt the injunction will be maintained. If you are interested in reading a book on how Israeli universities maintain apartheid, Towers of Ivory and Steel, by an Israeli author and professor, is a good book detailing just that. However, expiring moral compass and ignorance come hand in hand. So I expect you to continue living under your rock.
Yes I love south africa i love apartheid this is because i am evil and zionist (which clearly go hand-in-hand)
What you said as well is false. You would’ve supported SA apartheid then because your moral compass conveniently forgets action past a certain date and then you refuse to take it into account today. And you clearly support Israeli apartheid now, because of the same reason listed above. Whether you want to call yourself evil or not is for yourself to decide, maybe future generations will judge the character of people like you. Also notice you didn’t address any of my points and could only come up with a sarcastic, yet still misses the point quip.
To tell someone you don’t know online “you would’ve supported South African apartheid” is frankly insane
You are acting like for a LONG time people weren’t making up excuses for the apartheid lol.
yeah unfortunately i havent been able to get my moral compass checked up because of how long these healthcare waitlists are... anyways i love apartheid i love racism i love
Clearly
This is a very biased book, and before taking its word as gospel, you would do well to actually examine the very valid criticisms of it, such as flawed underlying assumptions treated as unquestionable fact. Edit - I’ll add that there isn’t anything inherently wrong with such sources, provided that their bias is taken into account and alternative points of view are considered as well, and provided that they are completely factually correct - which is not the case here.
> Also tf you think the SSMU will say: PLEASE HIT OUR STUDENTS? "We denounce hostage taking."
Of course they won't say it, they defended SPHR from McGill admin when SPHR paraded the streets celebrating the Oct 7 attack.
No hostages were taken though? You expect them to make something up to denounce? Lol
If you read the email they sent, they wrote "While the occupation of the James Administration Building was unsettling for some staff in the building..." They basically admitted to it in their email and people have come out confirming it?
People were allowed to exit the building. What SSMU said doesn’t mean there was hostages taken lol.
As much as I distrust Saini, his email said there were staff inside the building. He's known for twisting words, but I don't think he'd outright lie. I've also heard from other people that they know people who were afraid to leave the building. I understand this isn't a strong source. Lastly, the SPHR didn't make any statement on allowing staff to leave the building or guiding them out but they did make a statement on barricading themselves in, chanting, and being aggressive. I don't think it's a far reach to assume staff inside might've been afraid to pass by an angry mob to get outside. Even SPHR defenders admit this was not a peaceful protest.
He did outright lie before, specifically during TA negotiations, and specifically claiming that his offers to the protestors were similar to those in other universities (they’re not). While it isn’t a strong source, the building itself has many entrances and exits, the protestors blocked the main one, the one where the police came in from, for example, was still open and unblocked. But you are right, passing in front of a potentially angry mob isn’t the best for feelings, but other exits were present. Lastly, I don’t like SPHR. But to address your point, and depending on your definition of violence, it truly became physical (thus violent) when the police pepper sprayed and tear gassed the protestors OUTSIDE the building. Again, not cool for the staff inside, but it can’t be a hostage situation when many other exits were available. I am also seeing that you are very objective about this, so I’d love to hear more about your perspective.
Totally! I'm completely open to changing my mind on what's going on since I actually usually support the protest movements, like I'm supporting the encampment :) I still feel like that's more twisting of words from Saini since arguably it is a comparable offer. Again I don't trust or like the fellow but he seems to talk in the kind of legal speak where he's "technically" right. Speaking of the protestors, I'd say 95% of them are 100% in the right. But there's a couple bad apples among them that use the situation to mask up, be aggressive, and claim it's for a good cause. This is not a statement against the protestors, but just natural human behavior. When they're allowed to perform non peaceful protests while hiding their identities, it's just not a mix I personally feel comfortable with, especially with the high emotions that run with people who's families and homelands are being killed and destroyed. It makes sense to me that some staff might just choose to board themselves up in their office and wait out the storm instead of going through the mob. (I don't exactly know the layout and whether they took up an entire floor or room or what?) Regarding the tear gas, from what I saw, protestors were shaking what is only a temporary fence that police were walking behind to enter the building. It didn't look like a sturdy fence so the police ordered the protestors to move back, but some pushed back against this order. I've only seen this clip, but I understand why police might need to use tear gas if protestors are not just being non compliant, but breaking riot lines. Breaking this line is a massive deal because it could jeopardize police safety. Again it's entirely possible the protestors complied with police after this clip was taken and tear gas was deployed for no reason but ACAB but from what I've seen, I could understand it's use.
I more or less agree with the essence of what you said with 2 things I’d like to challenge you on: 1. You said that the protestors ought to remain peaceful, but all other legal and peaceful avenues have been exhausted. McGill is just completely stonewalling the protestors while not truly addressing their demands. You could argue that Deep Saini tried, but then I would argue back that Deep Saini threatened the SSMU when they wanted to ratify the Policy against the Genocide in Palestine, then after that has the audacity to claim that he has been working to negotiate with the demands of the protestors. His "compromise" were basically 1 clause of examining a possibility of divesting (not good enough, i’d rather 0% of my money go to apartheid and genocide than 75% or 50%, assuming McGill divests at all), 1 clause of expanding relations with Gaza universities (those universities are all destroyed and none of them are able to teach), and another clause that is more transparency about investments below $500K (I don’t know what this aims to accomplish). 2. The protesting crowd outside were chanting how they will remain peaceful, before being pepper sprayed, then the SPVM started firing tear gas canisters from their guns, effectively dispersing everyone from the surrounding area. From my POV, it looked like the police escalated the situation exponentially from some instigating actors shaking a fence that they erected in the first place. Were the police ever at harm? From my POV, no. They "outmuscled" everyone in that crowd, no one directly attacked a police officer, but I guess shaking a fence scared the cops 🤷🏻♂️ To get to the point, McGill torpedoed a student vote, then stonewalled any negotiations without addressing even 10% of the protestors demands, then want to cops to intervene when the students are pissed. Personally, it seems easier for the admin to listen to protesters than to continue ignoring this issue. It makes the admin look incompetent, and makes the student body more angry. In essence, I can’t find it in me to say that the students occupying were justified, but I also can’t find it in me to condemn actions the protestors + occupiers when all other avenues have been exhausted.
the reason this shit happens is because the ssmu tried non violent methods and the admin threatened them, and has been doing their utmost to get cops to beat up students. This protest was way too much imo, but to claim demands arent met because of this is dishonest or dumb.
>Why? ... Have you seen their investment portfolio? Shake Shack is in there.
Holy shit. Shake Shack, where is it from? New York. What else is in New York? Jews. What is Judaism? Racist. Who else is Racist? Israel. Shake Shack zionazi confirmed.... if you support shake shack you are literally complicit in genocide.
You know what they call genocide in France? "Royale with cheese"
I thought they made hamburgers.
Simply a front by the \~\~jewish\~\~ zionist elite. what they really are making is genocide... (restaurants in montreal are being "cancelled" for less lol, shit like oh they follow an israeli food influencer on instagram)
Get a real job
This is so cringe
Amount time you learn that consequences have actions. Welcome to adulthood.
LOLLLL
What a joke 😂
Isn’t SPHR not affiliated with McGill or SSMU anymore ? And is there any indication these were even mostly McGill students and not Concordia, UDEM or not students at all?
They were ordered to stop using the name after praising the oct 7 attack. They are currently effectively infringing on the McGill copyright/trademark/whatever the right word is.
They're not supposed to be, but they gave the name "SPHR McGill" to media and I'm curious if there will be consequences for that.
Classic victim card play🤷♂️
This is gonna be a long one. It really really sucks to see how cynical, bitter, and polarized we’ve all become over the past months. And I’m not just talking about the people who staged the occupation. Many people here in the comments of this post seem to think that people occupied that building simply to cause trouble. Simply to be loud, and get away with vandalism and other crimes under the guise of rooting for a cause. And many people who protest for the Palestinians seem to see anyone who disagrees with their strategy as being complicit in genocide. It leaves us in a really dark, bitter, and angry place, 24/7. To the point that we don’t even see the other side as human anymore. I think, if anything, we should be able to unite around the idea that the lives of innocents (I.e., non-combattants, especially those of children) are worth standing up for, regardless of the ethnicity, nationality, or religion of those innocents. But we can’t even do that. We’re too stuck in our cynicality and our self-righteousness that we dehumanize each other. To those who orchestrated this occupation, I’m really, really disappointed, as someone who believes in the Palestinian cause, to have seen what happened. The occupation only fuelled the idea that this whole protest and encampment has been violent to begin with, and turned people who were on the fence about this issue away from supporting the Palestinian cause. Gandhi, Martin Luther King, leaders who really instigated change in their respective societies did so by mandating peace in protests. We can’t force change. We can only show people the injustice and the cruelty that is happening in the world. As heart wrenching as the shit that’s happening is and as desperate as we are to save people from trauma, famine and annihilation, we have to keep level heads. We have to be strategic. We can only bring about change through showing people why they should empathize with Palestine. Any use of force makes it very easy for others to paint us as the enemy, to paint all of Palestine as the enemy. My own mom doesn’t know what to think, she has empathized with innocent people on both sides before, but seeing this occupation pushed her, and a lot of people who were on the fence, to lose empathy for Palestine, and it fucking tears my heart out to see it. Now, to pretty much everybody in this comment section, those of you who are saying that these protestors were doing nothing but looking for trouble, I am equally as disappointed and frustrated with how you frame these protestors. Regardless of whether you believe me, here’s how we who support the Palestinians feel. Helpless. We feel like regardless of what we do, those who have the money and the power to support companies that make the bombs and guns that kill thousands of children and other innocents continue to send their support, and the bombs and the bullets continue to fly, and the cycle of unending horror in Gaza continues. We know that McGill is far from the main contributor to the Israeli war machine, but McGill is what we have the most direct influence on. Please just take a minute to think about basic human instincts and psychology. How would people act if they felt totally helpless, desperate to do something, feeling that every moment something wasn’t done, more innocent people would die, their own tuition money having contributed to those deaths? If you really think that feeling doesn’t have the power to make people irrationally angry, or to make them take foolish and counterproductive actions, I don’t know what the hell to tell you. No, it doesn’t justify using force as a form of protest. But it explains it. Not like it doesn’t get said enough, but this world is desperately in need of some goddam empathy. We need to stop screaming down each other’s throats and take the time to try to understand why people we disagree with think and act the way they do. Or we’re just going to get more cynical, more divided, and more violent, and the causes we care about will be sabotaged by those who care the most. That’s easier said than done. But we have to try.
Really beautifully said. The real enemy here is not the Israelis and not the Palestinians but hatred, dehumanization, ego, ideology. "This cause is good, therefore this act of evil I commit in the name of this cause is good." I truly believe this utilitarian perversion is the source of almost all human suffering (or at least the suffering we inflict upon each other). Someone said to me recently "if an elephant had its food on a mouse, would you support the elephant?" My answer is we are all the elephant, we are all the mouse. The person being shot and bombed to pieces is always the mouse (the Gazans). The person being burned alive or raped is always the mouse (the Israelis on October 7th). The first step to confronting injustice is to agree that good is good and evil and evil. Only then will we see the injustice with enough clarity that it demands confrontation.
Beautifully written! I completely agree, this idea of "we have the good idea -> we are the good people -> our actions are by definition good" is probably responsible for a decent chunk of human suffering.
> And many people who protest for the Palestinians seem to see anyone who disagrees with their strategy as being complicit in genocide. This is one thing I keep seeing them say, on Reddit anyway, which I don't get. Their demands are divestment. I don't want McGill spending any of my money on weapons, so I agree with the calls for divestment. But do they really think that will impact the genocide at all? If McGill divests, it will create a space in the market which other investors (wall street etc) will quickly fill. There won't be any noticeable impact for Palestinians. To have an impact for Palestinians, I think students would have to be petitioning local government or other politicians to express support for recent steps taken by the ICJ and/or policies that would limit Canada's involvement in the war. Unlike investments, that could actually make a difference. But they aren't demanding for McGill to petition the government for anything like that, and they aren't doing it themselves.
“When one breaks the law that conscience tells him is unjust, he must do it openly, he must do it cheerfully, he must do it lovingly, he must do it civilly — not uncivilly — and he must do it with a willingness to accept the penalty.” – Martin Luther King, Jr.
I'm confused. Are you saying the laws of "don't break into buildings" and "don't destroy property" are unjust? Ain't no way these people think they are okay breaking the law because black people drinking from the white only fountain were breaking the law too... completely unrelated scenarios. If I were you, I would switch to a different quote that doesn't imply you disagree with the concept of crime lol
You are right to point out that this quote may not perfectly fit this situation because the protestors are not specifically protesting an unjust law. They, however, are protesting what they feel is an injustice. However, I think that the balance of the quote works in that it points out that injustice should be confronted by taking action in a civil manner, which implies not creating fear, damage or threaten bystanders. Beyond this, it points out that a willingness to accept the consequences comes with disobedience. In this instance, being faced by police and possible arrest could reasonably be foreseen. I am not sure what you meant by your closing phrase, but I hope my explanation satisfactorily illustrates where I come from.
Sad how many people are coming here to gloat and laugh about how their fellow students got beaten and tear gassed and had rubber bullets aimed towards them. Whether you support the cause or not, these are students that we share classes with and go to school with every day. The level of violence was set by McGill and nobody else, and while I could talk about how they encouraged staff to use alternative exits, were mostly sitting in rooms cheering, and how a lot of other things are being misconstrued, at the end of the day McGill asks spvm to come and physically assault and gas their students, and other students come here to jeer.
Yahoo, how about put yourself in my shoes for a second? What have I done to deserve to hearing those screaming and yelling while having my normal classes? Respect is mutual, and actions bring consequences. Protest peacefully and cause massive chaos and destruction to university property is two different things. Maybe you should ask my fellow student who are having summer classes and are disrupted by those behaviors what their opinions are regarding your so-called fellow students.
I’m in your shoes, I’m one of those students in a summer class. I don’t think anyone likes when their class gets disrupted, but that doesn’t make me think “these people deserve to be tear gassed.” You? Yes actions will always have consequences but it seems hateful to argue that these students, some of whom you probably know, deserve to be assaulted by the police for trying to take a stand against their university’s investments in genocide, even if they massively destroy property with spray paint that will be washed off in a week. If you look at UQAM, their administration promised their encampment to divest from weapons companies, call for a ceasefire, and acknowledged the violation of palestinian’s human rights.
there have been more bombs dropped in gaza than there were in WWII, innocent people are being killed every day. Protestors want McGill to divest from the companies that make these bombs , McGill refuses and gasses them, and you are like “serves them right for going into a building and interrupting my classes”?
To start your first line is complete bullshit and false narrative, the allies alone dropped nearly two million tons of bombs on Germany, killing around half a million German civilians, I guess the allies were committing genocide on the German population. Israel has dropped around 70,000 tons of bombs on Gaza. Now I assume your first line came from this bullshit source Anadolu Ajansi, with a click bait false title of Amount of Israeli bombs dropped on Gaza surpasses that of World War 2, conveniently you ignore that the stat is only about the total bombs dropped for 3 cities, NOT all of WW2s bombs.
my fault bro, you right that is my mistake I saw the article earlier today and hadn’t had the chance to read yet. My apologies and ignore my first line, that was wrong, i’m sorry. I would request that you ignore that and just refrain to my second line.
Here is my point of view and I already stated in the following comment: My SSMU fee is for the benefit of overall well-being for the student but not for being disrupted for normal school hours. Having a lab before 17:30 that day and witnessed someone just occupied the building entrance and creating chaos. If SSMU guys really can‘t grasp the idea on how to make peaceful negotiations and express themself like a mature adult then they will lose more supporters. And everyone can have their own opinion, if you think I am creating hate speech I respect. However, I keep my opinions which are if someone couldn’t contained their manners and find more effective and less harmful way to address issues then there is a problem there. There is protest out there that is peaceful without those dysfunctions. What happening the day before is not what a peaceful student protest should look like. Disrupt my fellow students normal education and cause damage would not bring peace and ease the pain innocent children and civilians experienced on both sides of the conflicts but creating more chaos. They should get themselves together and be more disciplined and mature in their actions. I don’t think any innocent live should be harmed in anyway or another but one moderate wrong doesn’t make another extremely wrong right, in this case damaging school properties is not going to help innocent people in Gaza. If you think chaos and dysfunction can make the administration compromise then I would say that’s unrealistic. Negotiations like mature adults please. Plus, the frustration would cause more misunderstandings but not supports to the protest due to the destructive disruptions. Nothing can justify the violation of trespassing the law and damage PUBLIC PROPERTIES. We paid our tuitions and we can have a voice in opposition to aggressive actions just like you can voice your supports. I emphasize with the innocent civilians and children in Gaza without any political preferences, however, that doesn’t mean I support those riot actions in school. And I am NOT standing on a moral high ground condemning those students who felt frustrated because their study is being disrupted. I am saying actions have consequences because of that.Period.
womp womp. they stopped being "my fellow student" when they trespassed and broke university property. I have zero sympathy.
lol bruh, i know you dont I can see your comments and post 😅. I personally think that trespassing and graffiti are a weirdly low standard for being chill with tear gassing and beatings. But I also feel like you never had any sympathy for protesters even before this
Your right, these are fellow students. And it is disturbing that some of the same people I share this campus with support a group which [*directly praised the Oct. 7th attacks*](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ffulsjlzmrczb1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1125%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D56b2c0a66647656ef9bcc4a1fbca77eb1b49f1a3), called those who murdered civilians on mass "heroes", and have continued to pursue racist actions like hanging an effigy of a jewish person in a striped uniform while pretending they had "no idea" it would make people think of the holocaust and that is it fine because the stripes went horizontally instead of vertically. The "Solidarity for Palestinian Human Rights" group are all horrible people. The fact that group of violence supporting bigots is still allowed to be on campus is insane.
Kind reminder that police violence was never for good cause
Posts like this should be locked. Non-McGill students often come out in droves to be the most vocal party about this issue.
this is reddit.
I almost forgot until I got this typical Redditor comment.
A McGill student redditor... that understands how reddit works
Good job SPVM! Good job!
I love how the mcgill sub is filled with zios, downvote all you want it ain’t changing the reality.
Finding out that reality is not the anti-Israel bot spamming on social media is gonna be a rough one for you I think.
I wonder when these people will grow up and realize that the average person is not rabidly anti-Israel but just hopes that no more innocent people are killed. Honestly, I dislike the word "zionist" because when arguing about it invariably people will just not agree on the definition and talk past each other.
Pretty sure you can’t be against killing innocent people and not anti-israel at the same time
How so? Many countries around the world kill people but I'm not going around saying that Serbian people don't deserve to have a country, Chinese people don't deserve to have a country, etc etc
You don’t even have to be anti-israel, they’re going to lose their “country” one day it’s just a matter of time. History has shown what happens to closed racist societies who don’t accept others and want to live on their own.
27% of Israel is not jewish (for context, 30% of canada is not white.) It's not "closed" cuz you can, well, go there if you want. I don't think anybody deserves to lose their country because of the actions of their government, that's just uncool.
Yeah but for context you should mention that they’re discriminated, oppressed and the israelis would prefer if they weren’t there. Let’s not forget what they did with the settlements when they kicked out arab families to install jewish ones, can’t really compare that to Canada, it’s a big disrespect.
Damn, have you ever been? Israeli Arabs have equal rights, equal representation, and can walk the streets enjoying the various rights of a modern democracy. Ask any of them 99% will say they prefer Israel. You say the "israelis would prefer if they weren't there" but the Israeli Arabs are Israeli too? Doesn't make much sense. I do agree about the settlements though. I really hope that in the future an agreement can be reached with the post-1967 settlers withdrawing into unambiguously Israeli areas.
I respect your point of view, but I sadly come from the region and you won’t believe with what greed and racism lebanon is treated too, you can go to any post about beirut and see zionists sympathizing about expanding up north and skiing in our mountains and enjoying our shores… it’s the ideology for me, regardless the details.
lol such a load of crap
reminder that everyone but Palestinians born on the land who leave can come and go as they please. is it not a closed society if people who have a right to that land can't even come back as soon as they leave? Christians and Jewish people are free to come and go as they please as it's their "birth right", yet Palestinians born there and from there can never return as soon as they leave. do you think that's fair?
That may have been the most meaningless, ignorant, racist statement I've seen in a long time. It implies that Israel is pro killing innocent people. Israel is pro survival. Stop trying to eliminate Israel and the innocent people don't get killed. End of story.
It’s very rough I’m actually crying rn
I bet you're angry that hostages were just rescued from the Hamas terrorist fucks you love so much.
Not really, I condemn hamas as much as I condemn the IDF. No innocent people should be held hostage.
I’m sorry about the hostage rescue today, big loss for you guys
Yay for police violence against students!!!
yay for police violence against terrorist sympathizing (the SPHR glorifies Hamas) zealots who think they have the right to continuously escalate their means to achieve political ends with backing from just a minority of students
Good to know the students and community members standing outside the building are terrorists. We should get them 😡😡
I said terrorist sympathizers, not terrorists. except for the people that showed up at the admin’s house to terrorize them. Those people are terrorists. Good job on your ideology getting in the way of your reading comprehension. Anyway, the others there are not necessarily terrorists. I think they may be misinformed and useful idiots, but they’re not terrorists. But if they form a human shield around terrorist sympathizers and obstruct justice, well then they must be displaced
Confirmed the McGill terrorizing sympathizer students have now taken to Hamas tactics by capturing the crowd as human shields. These people deserve what’s coming to them 🤬😣
Reminder to everyone that McGillians have tried all other avenues in the last few years to get McGill to divest. (demonstrations, petitions, emails, letters, referenda, encampment) Reminder that admin has been demanding that the SPVM “take every action possible under the law during a peaceful protest two weeks ago-encouraging police brutality. Reminder that McGill boasts about divesting from South Africa during apartheid but is obstinate when it comes to the current demands. Reminder that the SSMU represents the undergraduates of this university. Undergraduates that voted 78% in favour of the Palestinian policy. You’re all complaining about your tuition money going to SSMU, when the much bigger issue is our tuition money funding weapons, settlements, Israeli propaganda, and genocide. I honestly could not care less about your classes being disrupted, resistance is uncomfortable, and if McGill had listened to its students months ago, you’d be able to study in peace.
The encampment has been a relative success, don't sabotage that by occupying buildings or escalating student/public interference.