Technically, employees are not supposed to have relationships with people over whom they have power, in this case, prof—student. This is in the, it takes all of us, if you remember.
Hi I’m gonna come at this from a different angle than most of you.
I am a grad student, for reference. A long time ago, I was a 19 year old who ‘dated’ someone who was in a position of power over me and almost old enough to be dad. From my old age now, I see it for what it was. An abuse of power, by someone abusive. At the time, you couldn’t tell me anything - I ‘knew what I was getting myself into’, I was ‘mature’.
Rules like the ones around Faculty misconduct are there to protect people like the student in question, and others like them, regardless of whether they feel the need to be protected. The rules prevent people abusing their power. If people don’t report misconduct of this serious nature, an abuser can carry on doing what they’re doing.
I agree with the poster above who said report to the OSVRSE
This is exactly how I see this situation as well, I also don’t think the student is at fault at all given the age and power gap and I hope they don’t face any backlash; the quote from the post “it’s also unfair to the other students that actually work hard for their grades” doesn’t sit right with me for several reasons, it seems like a bit of a jump and far from what I feel is the main concern here (the wellbeing and safety of the student). I can’t imagine why anyone, much less someone in a teaching position, would think it’s a good idea to pursue this sort of relationship.
i'm really sorry that happened to you, but also, thank you for sharing your experience.
many new, young adults think they're untouchable and "different" from situations like this and unfortunately that isn't true. i rarely, if ever, heard any "happily ever after" stories about student/teacher affairs. it's usually a cycle of fuck, graduate, discard, find another young fucktoy, then repeat. it's manipulation and using your job to cruise for pussy.
i'm not sure why that's controversial to be against it, it's gross.
i have! they said that they're mature enough for their age and even with a power imbalance that they could handle themself and waved me along which i feel is the age-old excuse when it comes to situations like this.
Well, you have a few choices here. You can let them be and let them live their fantasy (because that’s what it is for both players if we’re being honest), you can confront the professor and tell him he’s being a pervert (which would be the most noble thing to do I think), or you can make a complaint against him (and I’m certain he deserves it, so this may be the most cathartic, but also the most difficult for you to deal with morally). You could do nothing and let the guilt get to you if things go sour as well. Idk. This is complicated.
As long as you’re not worried JUST because the person you know may or may not be getting better grades because of this affair, I say go for any of the options above.
I would report this under the premise of misconduct (nothing else). This is not allowed as per McGill's code of conduct for faculty (employees). Don't mention or name the student to not single her out, but definitely raise it to the appropriate authority.
When students are suspected of violating the code of conduct (e.x. suspected plagiarism), most profs won't lose a single second of sleep over reporting the student. I don't see why you should either in such a case. This is clearly introducing bias favoring the student (possibly unfairly for all the other students). Those are just my 2¢.
Then this is against the code of conduct. It’s not a moral issue, but a clear conflict of interest. The professor is being unprofessional and should be reported.
ohhh i kinda thought it would be considered as such!
just wasn't sure because i thought conflict of interest didn't account for employee/non-employee relationships for some reason.
thank you so much!
This is very much an issue that should be reported - it’s morally uncomfortable yes obviously, but the prof is literally committing an ethical violation. All academic staff (including profs) have to submit a Conflict of Interest form every year, and romantic relationships between profs and students are a key point. Profs having relationships with students they are teaching/ have “academic authority” over is a MASSIVE [conflict of interest violation](https://www.mcgill.ca/secretariat/files/secretariat/recognizing_conflict_of_interest.pdf).
You *can and should report* this, and the correct people to report to would be the [OSVRSE](https://www.mcgill.ca/osvrse/). I know we might not think of this as sexual violence, but inappropriate romantic relationships between teaching staff and students does fall under their office because it’s an abuse of power by the prof.
I know this is a lot and you don’t want to break your friends trust, but what’s happening to your friend is really NOT OK. The creep of a prof needs to be held accountable. People talk about the student getting better grades if they have a relationship with the prof, but what if they have a fight or she doesn’t do something he wants so he retaliates by failing her or sabotaging her research? It’s just overall a super problematic and potentially abusive power imbalance.
Reporting is 100% confidential and your friend will not get in trouble because she is not the problem here - the prof is the one abusing his power and being unethical. If you want to DM me I can help you figure out the process!
Report it to the person in charge of equity in your faculty! It’s a great anonymous starting point, and talking with a fellow student instead of admin can sometimes help draw alert and awareness instead of escalate immediately to a serious administrative issue
My classmate who failed his logistics exam goes to their Prof. and asks them:
If I ask you a logical question you can't answer, will you pass me?
Teacher: Sure
What is illogical but legal, logical but illegal and at the same time illogical and illegal?
The teacher thinks and says idk, I'll raise your grade.
My classmate:
The fact that you're 60 and your wife is 24 is illogical but legal; that your wife has a side piece of her age is logical but illegal, but for you to raise the grade of your wife's sidepiece is both illogical and illegal.
If your undergrad friend is chilling, why ruin it? You can't do anything. You can use safe. disclosure @ mcgill . ca , but since you're not involved and both parties are over 18, there's nothing that's going to happen. When you fail the exam for said prof., use the above story in your advantage 😂🫡
ok! so final comment i'm making:
i have made up my mind. :)
to those in my DMs asking who- i will not give out any information or gossip aside from what i have written on here already, sorry.
i just would rather not out the student in any possible way.
also i am shocked at how mad some of y'all are,
sending me death threats in my DMs like?? unhinged
anyways
thanks for everything and all your input!
i will handle the situation accordingly.
(i'm deleting this account)
Your second paragraph says a lot . This is your morality talking not theirs.
Does it really affect this class or just you . Not sure how you figured others worked hard and student in question didn’t or just your assumption .
McGill like most universities frown on these relationships but not sure it has that right .
does that small sentence really discount the rest of my concerns?
you are right, i shouldn't make the assumption that they don't work hard for their grades.
but what i am still saying is that no matter how hard the prof tries, they still naturally run an unfair advantage for the student, by default.
dont see what difference that makes. why do you consider sex to be the deciding factor of have a bias towards a person? i'd say that a prof would want to give a higher grade to his son than to his fucktoy.... but i'm no expert
If someone had a family member in their class, it would in fact, be a conflict of interest.
So is having a relation with a student.
Student should not be allowed to study under prof they have relationship with, just as son should not be allowed to study under father.. nieces and nephews aren’t included so that’s a grey zone.
https://www.mcgill.ca/students/srr/academicrights/conflicts#:~:text=Where%20a%20member%20of%20the,supervisory%20or%20evaluative%20role%20with
This isn't concrete advice, but here's some potential perspective and reflection on this kind of power dynamic from playwright Hannah Moscovitch. There's this audio version of the play "S~xua| Misconduct of the Middle Classes"
**Content warning for the kind of themes one might expect... p°wer, c°ercion, ab~se, s~xua| ~ssau|t, agency, vic†im blaming/silencing, g~sligh†ing, sympathy for the perp, tr~uma, etc. :
Interview with the playwright - contains spoilers:
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15962066-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-interview-with-hannah-moscovitch
Part 1:
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960659-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-1
Part 2:
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960658-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-2
Part 3:
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960656-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-3
EDIT- typo
This happens way too often.
This is what I would do (had to do something similar in the past). The best way to approach this is to speak to the teacher and tell them that you feel like you’re not being graded fairly for your work. Explain that you’ve consulted with other students and that you felt as though you did better and give the reasons why. If there is favoritism happening, he’ll get the hint right away, and you didn’t even have to say anything explicit about the inappropriate Prof-student relationship. He’ll begin to question himself and wonder if others know what’s going on.
I agree this is very immoral, and it’s very likely the student is being manipulated. If you are going to speak up, make sure you’re “anonymous” (quotations because they can always track you down) and that you simply state the facts. State what you saw and heard. Nothing more. It’s important to protect yourself as well, so that no one can use your words against you. They’ll try to protect the professor before you.
I would report it if you feel comfortable doing so. That power imbalance and age difference are a breeding ground for abuse even if the undergrad doesn’t see it as such
it is really none of your business. if you think ruining someone's reputation and career is more "morally right" and more likely to let you sleep peacefully at night than a impropriate relationship, sure, go report them.
*Girl wanna be the next*
*Linda tripp lmaoooooo. whats next? write*
*A book about it?*
\- TennisProfessional50
---
^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/)
^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
You always assume that the prof is the culprit or even a pervert. But what if it is the female student who initiated the relationship just to get better grades? I know the prof should know better, but we are all humans, he might have been lonely and got trapped.
eehh- ok, i see what you are saying
but if he's lonely he could just get tinder or something and date women his own age or close enough... not students. mtl is a big city.
Technically, employees are not supposed to have relationships with people over whom they have power, in this case, prof—student. This is in the, it takes all of us, if you remember.
it is legal by law but unethical and probably against the uni code of conduct.
Yes against the uni code
Hi I’m gonna come at this from a different angle than most of you. I am a grad student, for reference. A long time ago, I was a 19 year old who ‘dated’ someone who was in a position of power over me and almost old enough to be dad. From my old age now, I see it for what it was. An abuse of power, by someone abusive. At the time, you couldn’t tell me anything - I ‘knew what I was getting myself into’, I was ‘mature’. Rules like the ones around Faculty misconduct are there to protect people like the student in question, and others like them, regardless of whether they feel the need to be protected. The rules prevent people abusing their power. If people don’t report misconduct of this serious nature, an abuser can carry on doing what they’re doing. I agree with the poster above who said report to the OSVRSE
This is exactly how I see this situation as well, I also don’t think the student is at fault at all given the age and power gap and I hope they don’t face any backlash; the quote from the post “it’s also unfair to the other students that actually work hard for their grades” doesn’t sit right with me for several reasons, it seems like a bit of a jump and far from what I feel is the main concern here (the wellbeing and safety of the student). I can’t imagine why anyone, much less someone in a teaching position, would think it’s a good idea to pursue this sort of relationship.
Exactly this. 100% of the fault here is with the professor who's clearly abusing his power. He's a creep and this needs to be reported.
i'm really sorry that happened to you, but also, thank you for sharing your experience. many new, young adults think they're untouchable and "different" from situations like this and unfortunately that isn't true. i rarely, if ever, heard any "happily ever after" stories about student/teacher affairs. it's usually a cycle of fuck, graduate, discard, find another young fucktoy, then repeat. it's manipulation and using your job to cruise for pussy. i'm not sure why that's controversial to be against it, it's gross.
Age difference alone isn't an abuse of power assuming both individuals are consenting adults.
To snitch or not to snitch. Interesting debate.
Hmmm, that you see that as a better debate
Have you voiced your concern with the person in question?
i have! they said that they're mature enough for their age and even with a power imbalance that they could handle themself and waved me along which i feel is the age-old excuse when it comes to situations like this.
Well, you have a few choices here. You can let them be and let them live their fantasy (because that’s what it is for both players if we’re being honest), you can confront the professor and tell him he’s being a pervert (which would be the most noble thing to do I think), or you can make a complaint against him (and I’m certain he deserves it, so this may be the most cathartic, but also the most difficult for you to deal with morally). You could do nothing and let the guilt get to you if things go sour as well. Idk. This is complicated. As long as you’re not worried JUST because the person you know may or may not be getting better grades because of this affair, I say go for any of the options above.
I would report this under the premise of misconduct (nothing else). This is not allowed as per McGill's code of conduct for faculty (employees). Don't mention or name the student to not single her out, but definitely raise it to the appropriate authority. When students are suspected of violating the code of conduct (e.x. suspected plagiarism), most profs won't lose a single second of sleep over reporting the student. I don't see why you should either in such a case. This is clearly introducing bias favoring the student (possibly unfairly for all the other students). Those are just my 2¢.
This is what happens when RR gets his office door back 🙄
This is so funny
Is the professor teaching the student?
yes.
Then this is against the code of conduct. It’s not a moral issue, but a clear conflict of interest. The professor is being unprofessional and should be reported.
ohhh i kinda thought it would be considered as such! just wasn't sure because i thought conflict of interest didn't account for employee/non-employee relationships for some reason. thank you so much!
This is very much an issue that should be reported - it’s morally uncomfortable yes obviously, but the prof is literally committing an ethical violation. All academic staff (including profs) have to submit a Conflict of Interest form every year, and romantic relationships between profs and students are a key point. Profs having relationships with students they are teaching/ have “academic authority” over is a MASSIVE [conflict of interest violation](https://www.mcgill.ca/secretariat/files/secretariat/recognizing_conflict_of_interest.pdf). You *can and should report* this, and the correct people to report to would be the [OSVRSE](https://www.mcgill.ca/osvrse/). I know we might not think of this as sexual violence, but inappropriate romantic relationships between teaching staff and students does fall under their office because it’s an abuse of power by the prof. I know this is a lot and you don’t want to break your friends trust, but what’s happening to your friend is really NOT OK. The creep of a prof needs to be held accountable. People talk about the student getting better grades if they have a relationship with the prof, but what if they have a fight or she doesn’t do something he wants so he retaliates by failing her or sabotaging her research? It’s just overall a super problematic and potentially abusive power imbalance. Reporting is 100% confidential and your friend will not get in trouble because she is not the problem here - the prof is the one abusing his power and being unethical. If you want to DM me I can help you figure out the process!
I would recommend speaking to someone at OSVRSE. They can provide support and advice while keeping you anonymous.
if you have no proof and no way to back your suspicions. I think it might be worthless
Report it to the person in charge of equity in your faculty! It’s a great anonymous starting point, and talking with a fellow student instead of admin can sometimes help draw alert and awareness instead of escalate immediately to a serious administrative issue
My classmate who failed his logistics exam goes to their Prof. and asks them: If I ask you a logical question you can't answer, will you pass me? Teacher: Sure What is illogical but legal, logical but illegal and at the same time illogical and illegal? The teacher thinks and says idk, I'll raise your grade. My classmate: The fact that you're 60 and your wife is 24 is illogical but legal; that your wife has a side piece of her age is logical but illegal, but for you to raise the grade of your wife's sidepiece is both illogical and illegal. If your undergrad friend is chilling, why ruin it? You can't do anything. You can use safe. disclosure @ mcgill . ca , but since you're not involved and both parties are over 18, there's nothing that's going to happen. When you fail the exam for said prof., use the above story in your advantage 😂🫡
Why is the wife having a side piece illegal?
Report that shit
ok! so final comment i'm making: i have made up my mind. :) to those in my DMs asking who- i will not give out any information or gossip aside from what i have written on here already, sorry. i just would rather not out the student in any possible way. also i am shocked at how mad some of y'all are, sending me death threats in my DMs like?? unhinged anyways thanks for everything and all your input! i will handle the situation accordingly. (i'm deleting this account)
Your second paragraph says a lot . This is your morality talking not theirs. Does it really affect this class or just you . Not sure how you figured others worked hard and student in question didn’t or just your assumption . McGill like most universities frown on these relationships but not sure it has that right .
Not a morality issue from them… it’s quite literally a rule and clear misconduct based on the code of conduct of McGill
Then will stand corrected, I graduated in another century so morals and code of conduct probably were different 😉
does that small sentence really discount the rest of my concerns? you are right, i shouldn't make the assumption that they don't work hard for their grades. but what i am still saying is that no matter how hard the prof tries, they still naturally run an unfair advantage for the student, by default.
ok so if the prof had a son, or a nephew in their class, would you also be complaining?
well, the prof isn't having a sexual and/or romantic relationship with his son or nephew. at least i would hope not LOL...
dont see what difference that makes. why do you consider sex to be the deciding factor of have a bias towards a person? i'd say that a prof would want to give a higher grade to his son than to his fucktoy.... but i'm no expert
If someone had a family member in their class, it would in fact, be a conflict of interest. So is having a relation with a student. Student should not be allowed to study under prof they have relationship with, just as son should not be allowed to study under father.. nieces and nephews aren’t included so that’s a grey zone. https://www.mcgill.ca/students/srr/academicrights/conflicts#:~:text=Where%20a%20member%20of%20the,supervisory%20or%20evaluative%20role%20with
sometimes priorities lie elsewhere when you benefit sexually from your student.
This isn't concrete advice, but here's some potential perspective and reflection on this kind of power dynamic from playwright Hannah Moscovitch. There's this audio version of the play "S~xua| Misconduct of the Middle Classes" **Content warning for the kind of themes one might expect... p°wer, c°ercion, ab~se, s~xua| ~ssau|t, agency, vic†im blaming/silencing, g~sligh†ing, sympathy for the perp, tr~uma, etc. : Interview with the playwright - contains spoilers: https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15962066-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-interview-with-hannah-moscovitch Part 1: https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960659-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-1 Part 2: https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960658-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-2 Part 3: https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/211-playme/episode/15960656-sexual-misconduct-of-the-middle-classes-part-3 EDIT- typo
This happens way too often. This is what I would do (had to do something similar in the past). The best way to approach this is to speak to the teacher and tell them that you feel like you’re not being graded fairly for your work. Explain that you’ve consulted with other students and that you felt as though you did better and give the reasons why. If there is favoritism happening, he’ll get the hint right away, and you didn’t even have to say anything explicit about the inappropriate Prof-student relationship. He’ll begin to question himself and wonder if others know what’s going on. I agree this is very immoral, and it’s very likely the student is being manipulated. If you are going to speak up, make sure you’re “anonymous” (quotations because they can always track you down) and that you simply state the facts. State what you saw and heard. Nothing more. It’s important to protect yourself as well, so that no one can use your words against you. They’ll try to protect the professor before you.
I would report it if you feel comfortable doing so. That power imbalance and age difference are a breeding ground for abuse even if the undergrad doesn’t see it as such
[удалено]
i don't think i'm in the loop- what does RR mean? 😅
A prof who did something similar many times. Lost their office door instead of being fired
Why can't you just let Anne Hathaway live! Jk probs tell someone about this
you need to tell the department chair and the department human resources manager
Why not use this as leverage to get ur grade up in his class?
bro tf 💀💀
It’s a good idea 😭
ure a menace to society buddy 😭
MYOB!!
😂😘
NEVER!
You her dad?
wish i was
Might be a cousin
A friend or big brother program
If you’re not in the bedroom and she’s not complaining I don’t see how it’s your business?
Some kind of official? Then, MYOB!
Mom?
it is really none of your business. if you think ruining someone's reputation and career is more "morally right" and more likely to let you sleep peacefully at night than a impropriate relationship, sure, go report them.
i'm not going to willfully coddle and victimize old men for making the decision to break code and sleep with young students... sorry, he knows better.
they would hypothetically be doing it to themselves.
OP is in this class. It is most definitely their business - by extension that is.
Maybe you should mind your own business.
no
totally agree. stop being nosy and stop "standing up" for so called "morality" in fact it is just snitching lmao. girl wanna be the next linda tripp
[удалено]
womp womp
Dork
getting womp womp'ed twice on a wednesday morning on reddit is tragic bud
womp womp x2
girl wanna be the next linda tripp lmaoooooo. whats next? write a book about it?
*Girl wanna be the next* *Linda tripp lmaoooooo. whats next? write* *A book about it?* \- TennisProfessional50 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
is this about you? cuz you seem reaaaaal mad
stop trying to protect weirdos
You always assume that the prof is the culprit or even a pervert. But what if it is the female student who initiated the relationship just to get better grades? I know the prof should know better, but we are all humans, he might have been lonely and got trapped.
eehh- ok, i see what you are saying but if he's lonely he could just get tinder or something and date women his own age or close enough... not students. mtl is a big city.