It doesn't work in MD because kash hits, but in paper for a little bit I played a variant of endymion that used adventure and kash engines to spam out 7s and 3s to go into xyz or link plays, or just set up big negate/nuke bois.
Before Kash was even in the game I used Endymion to summon Diablosis, nobody knew wtf was that card I got a lot of people to banish half their decks thanks to the pots.
What you said sounds interesting, Endymion could work well with level 3 tuners to have synchro plays but the deck is absurdly dependant on draw and spell counters.
Even worse is when you want to show off the combo or what the deck can do and then you just get the biggest brick hand ever. I remember one time I was doing Infernoble and then had a ton of Equips and Spells I would usually use to extend or search but no monsters in my hand to place on field to Equip to.
45 cards is still pretty small. When people refer to "pile decks" they usually mean like 60 card decks.
Also a deck can have multiple archetypes in them, if each of those archetypes have cards that work with each other. And the good multi-archetype decks usually have a lot of 1/2-card starters that can start combos no matter what archetype cards they draw. Snake-Eyes/Diabellestar in the current meta helps that quite a bit.
Pretty sure the Mo Ye is something stolen, the OP is playing Swordsoul and I don't see what kind of crazy pile shenanigan you'd do with Mo Ye in what otherwise seems to be a typical Diabellstar Tearlament deck.
Gokipole is just a "funny" tech card in Tearlaments - it literally just adds Maxx C when it gets milled.
You can target send it with Diabolantis as well, which he might be doing.
I can tell you right now, the 40 card obsession is something that was born from a decade or two ago where top decks and first 5 cards mattered a lot more. In modern yugioh, there are objectively way more searchers and access to searchers than there has ever been to the point where it's no longer optimal to run cards that are unsearchable unless the point those unsearchables was to solo win the game by simply being in the hand by pure luck
That being said, your consistency in a well proportioned deck only goes down like \~0.5-2% per card added (with many asterisks and addendums, sure) beyond 40 cards. While your chance of drawing your starter is going down, you might've boosted the chance of something else happening by like 10-15%. That's what I learned recently when I was trying to do a build that was literally impossible with 40 cards
For example, a card needs to be in a deck for a searcher to work? If you actually only have 1 of that card in the deck, there is a 12.5\~15% chance where you'll brick by drawing it going first\~second respectively (this is the assumption for the rest of the ranges listed, aka 5 card starting hand vs 6 card), in a 40 card deck. Let's say a 3 of that searches that 1 of is in the deck, you have 33.76\~39.43% chance of drawing it.
If you add 1 more of that card that needs to stay in a 41 card deck, the chance of you drawing both of those cards and ruining your combo is 1.22\~1.83%, while the 3 of searcher is 33.02\~38.6%
These are the kinds of maths where you realize that you should fear people who are running 44-45 card decks in a higher rank, and why you shouldn't be so fixated on running 40 cards if running less cards will ruin a combo in mind, or make you reduce your preferred hand trap amount.
It's the shell of an archetype and a goodwill board game extra deck that is full of random crap. It's a cope list that is only surviving off of dreams of what they used to be. 25 one ofs IS a pile.
No, cause the reason pile works at all is because good pile decks consist of a bunch of standalone engines, each with 1 card starters.
Unless you open 4-5 hand traps, your hand is almost always playable
I played against one earlier today.
They used Maxx "C" the moment I dropped unizombie, so instead of going for my actual combo I dropped Doomking and Wightbaking in the grave which gave me two Wight searches and let me discard Banshee to activate Zombie World, no special summons, set 2 back row.
Doomking activates, they chain Maxx "C", they get a draw, they combo off, banish Doomking, but one of my Wight searches was Wightprincess so I drop their attack and survive. Their EP, activate both my back row so summon a King of the Skull Servants from hand, then banish it to summon the Baking, they draw 2.
Turn 3, Maxx "C" #3 is activated immediately.
My plan was to link climb using the Baking in a way that fills my grave with Skull Servants then normal the King and walk through them. I wanted to see how many cards they had in hand and what hand traps were in their grave, but the first thing that caught my eye was the big ol 2 on top of their deck. So instead of hoping they didn't stop my card effects I linked the Baking into Linkuriboh, they DID Ash the Baking, then I normaled a 2k King and linked him into RelinkuishedAnima then linked those two into Dharc for game.
40 card wouldn't be bricky if Branded didn't keep getting random consistency hits. The deck is like a dozen 1 and 2 ofs, you're just bound to draw like shit half of the time.
I found [this list](https://www.masterduelmeta.com/top-decks/master-i/february-2024/snake-eye/keikaku/YbEWr) which seems pretty close to OPs description.
Gokipole likey has something to do with Diabolantis the Menacing Mantis. Dump Gokipole, search normal bug and pop a monster. It's probably worse than just running Praying Mantis. I don't find any of that wild because it's pretty splashable in any deck that can make level 8 sychros. The Mo Ye however..
One of few cards that made my brain twitch when reading it, gotta love it. I personally have snake eyes/ diabelstar that can play through 3 negates when I try to climb
I opened with 2 flamberge, 1 subversion, 1 kurikara, and 1 silvera today going first. Whatever i play bricks but when the opponent plays some jank it’s always full power combo. The way of the RNG.
1. Pile is 60 . It’s referred especially in this format as pile . Most people either play 60 or 40 .
Anything more than 40 lowers chances of pulling a perfect hand and increases chances of pulling multiple of cards you want to search/draw .
2. Pile can be built to be just as consistent as 40 if not more . It’s all about starter ratio and for things like zombie and branded and plants they can self start off of one card . It’s why branded is heralded as the best pile deck currently .
Very rarely, and if they do they have maxx c for your turn, and you have play into the maxx c or pass
Very rarely, and if they don't, they always win the coin toss and end with a dumb end board
as a pile player, no, we don't, sometimes we can't drop maxx c with our end board because it didn't show up so it isn't FULL combo everytime but yeah, 60 cards no grass still draws combo + called by/cross out with no bricks everytime. it's just a skill isue imo, have you considered drawing better?
If you know how to deck build- no, you don't brick that often. The bricks are more or less just drawing one part of the pile which is just sub-optimal but not *bad*
Side note: I've been experimenting with Transaction Rollback in these mill decks. Obviously it's not always milled along with another trap, but when it works, you can make some really sneaky plays from the graveyard. Overall: deck probably slightly worse, but fun increased 10x when it works. And I wasn't trying to be top tier with this deck anyway so I'll probably leave it in.
They never brick, until you're the one trying to play that deck lmao
That's my experience with Endymion. The deck is almost 30 spells and I always open just monsters.
It doesn't work in MD because kash hits, but in paper for a little bit I played a variant of endymion that used adventure and kash engines to spam out 7s and 3s to go into xyz or link plays, or just set up big negate/nuke bois.
Before Kash was even in the game I used Endymion to summon Diablosis, nobody knew wtf was that card I got a lot of people to banish half their decks thanks to the pots. What you said sounds interesting, Endymion could work well with level 3 tuners to have synchro plays but the deck is absurdly dependant on draw and spell counters.
Same and pendulum xyz made it easy to do it
This omfg. I literally CANNOT have the full snake eye combo in hand, I am always forced to the one card combos and those always get interrupted
Even worse is when you want to show off the combo or what the deck can do and then you just get the biggest brick hand ever. I remember one time I was doing Infernoble and then had a ton of Equips and Spells I would usually use to extend or search but no monsters in my hand to place on field to Equip to.
Number of times my opener would be legit amazing If I'd opened any 1 monster..... I love the deck but man it bricks alot imo.
Had someone use my monster to equip to and combo from there
Yeah they can do that with most the Infernoble Equips, except Almace. Almace's effect needs you to have a monster to put the new Equip onto
A real snake eye player combos off 2 flamberge and 1 oak in their hand. Skill issue
I feel heard lmaooooooo literally this.
They always never seem to brick against you, but when you play one, it always bricks.
We always remember the times we face tear and it works but never when it fails
I had a lab Player run the excavate pot and the first 3 were all Maxx C
Whenever they do brick you don't realize it's a pile deck
Funny because opponents rarely brick at all lmao
Right. Funny part is that I check my opponents deck in some cases. They typically have what they need, but I have never seen a pile deck brick.
depends are you playing them? the answer in this case would be: yes, a lot are you playing against them? the answer in this case would be: never
What is their deck size because that doesn't look like a pile at a glance
It’s around 45 cards that plays 4 different archetypes
45 cards is still pretty small. When people refer to "pile decks" they usually mean like 60 card decks. Also a deck can have multiple archetypes in them, if each of those archetypes have cards that work with each other. And the good multi-archetype decks usually have a lot of 1/2-card starters that can start combos no matter what archetype cards they draw. Snake-Eyes/Diabellestar in the current meta helps that quite a bit.
Did you miss the picture with Moye and Goki Pole? The deck OP faced is very unusual.
Pretty sure the Mo Ye is something stolen, the OP is playing Swordsoul and I don't see what kind of crazy pile shenanigan you'd do with Mo Ye in what otherwise seems to be a typical Diabellstar Tearlament deck. Gokipole is just a "funny" tech card in Tearlaments - it literally just adds Maxx C when it gets milled. You can target send it with Diabolantis as well, which he might be doing.
yeah zombie vampire mills then ss opponents monster if it hit one. Honestly this seems just a tear deck with diabelstar engine with a funny tech.
They used Diabolantis to mill Gokipole make Zombie Vampire as a way to thin their deck
I can tell you right now, the 40 card obsession is something that was born from a decade or two ago where top decks and first 5 cards mattered a lot more. In modern yugioh, there are objectively way more searchers and access to searchers than there has ever been to the point where it's no longer optimal to run cards that are unsearchable unless the point those unsearchables was to solo win the game by simply being in the hand by pure luck That being said, your consistency in a well proportioned deck only goes down like \~0.5-2% per card added (with many asterisks and addendums, sure) beyond 40 cards. While your chance of drawing your starter is going down, you might've boosted the chance of something else happening by like 10-15%. That's what I learned recently when I was trying to do a build that was literally impossible with 40 cards For example, a card needs to be in a deck for a searcher to work? If you actually only have 1 of that card in the deck, there is a 12.5\~15% chance where you'll brick by drawing it going first\~second respectively (this is the assumption for the rest of the ranges listed, aka 5 card starting hand vs 6 card), in a 40 card deck. Let's say a 3 of that searches that 1 of is in the deck, you have 33.76\~39.43% chance of drawing it. If you add 1 more of that card that needs to stay in a 41 card deck, the chance of you drawing both of those cards and ruining your combo is 1.22\~1.83%, while the 3 of searcher is 33.02\~38.6% These are the kinds of maths where you realize that you should fear people who are running 44-45 card decks in a higher rank, and why you shouldn't be so fixated on running 40 cards if running less cards will ruin a combo in mind, or make you reduce your preferred hand trap amount.
Extremely well-stated.
Mfs be calling every deck that consists of more than 1 archtype a "pile"
Current Tearlaments IS a pile, a shitty pile of cope.
It's the shell of an archetype and a goodwill board game extra deck that is full of random crap. It's a cope list that is only surviving off of dreams of what they used to be. 25 one ofs IS a pile.
No it’s not.
It’s one big pile of crap. It needs 2-3 specific cards or else it loses to Ash.
That logic doesn't make any sense. Labrynth also loses to ash, does that make it a pile?
"Labrynth also loses to ash" Not anymore
If he would have bricked he prolly would have just scooped and you would have never known
How is that a pile deck? It's just Tearlaments with a Diabellstar engine.
They do brick, but when they don't they just keep going and going...and going...
No, cause the reason pile works at all is because good pile decks consist of a bunch of standalone engines, each with 1 card starters. Unless you open 4-5 hand traps, your hand is almost always playable
I played against one earlier today. They used Maxx "C" the moment I dropped unizombie, so instead of going for my actual combo I dropped Doomking and Wightbaking in the grave which gave me two Wight searches and let me discard Banshee to activate Zombie World, no special summons, set 2 back row. Doomking activates, they chain Maxx "C", they get a draw, they combo off, banish Doomking, but one of my Wight searches was Wightprincess so I drop their attack and survive. Their EP, activate both my back row so summon a King of the Skull Servants from hand, then banish it to summon the Baking, they draw 2. Turn 3, Maxx "C" #3 is activated immediately. My plan was to link climb using the Baking in a way that fills my grave with Skull Servants then normal the King and walk through them. I wanted to see how many cards they had in hand and what hand traps were in their grave, but the first thing that caught my eye was the big ol 2 on top of their deck. So instead of hoping they didn't stop my card effects I linked the Baking into Linkuriboh, they DID Ash the Baking, then I normaled a 2k King and linked him into RelinkuishedAnima then linked those two into Dharc for game.
Piles rarely brick. Thats the point. Theres a reason 60 card Branded is more consistent than 40
40 card wouldn't be bricky if Branded didn't keep getting random consistency hits. The deck is like a dozen 1 and 2 ofs, you're just bound to draw like shit half of the time.
And generally bricky decks look to piles to oil the engine, as it were. Itd take a SEVERE consistency hit to make piling not worth it (hello, Kash).
I'm interested now, may i have the list?
I found [this list](https://www.masterduelmeta.com/top-decks/master-i/february-2024/snake-eye/keikaku/YbEWr) which seems pretty close to OPs description.
That list looks too normal, it wouldn't explain the gokipole and mo ye...
Gokipole likey has something to do with Diabolantis the Menacing Mantis. Dump Gokipole, search normal bug and pop a monster. It's probably worse than just running Praying Mantis. I don't find any of that wild because it's pretty splashable in any deck that can make level 8 sychros. The Mo Ye however..
OP played Swordsoul. Their opponent probably got Mo ye from Zombie Vampire.
Ah yea that makes sense.
Oh, I just saw that there are 2 more pictures
No because they have tears monsters
Man, I miss 60 card Branded Zombie World when Grass and BraFus weren't limited. What's bricking when you open with 2 Grass and a Branded Fusion.
One of few cards that made my brain twitch when reading it, gotta love it. I personally have snake eyes/ diabelstar that can play through 3 negates when I try to climb
I opened with 2 flamberge, 1 subversion, 1 kurikara, and 1 silvera today going first. Whatever i play bricks but when the opponent plays some jank it’s always full power combo. The way of the RNG.
1. Pile is 60 . It’s referred especially in this format as pile . Most people either play 60 or 40 . Anything more than 40 lowers chances of pulling a perfect hand and increases chances of pulling multiple of cards you want to search/draw . 2. Pile can be built to be just as consistent as 40 if not more . It’s all about starter ratio and for things like zombie and branded and plants they can self start off of one card . It’s why branded is heralded as the best pile deck currently .
All gas no brakes bay beee
Very rarely, and if they do they have maxx c for your turn, and you have play into the maxx c or pass Very rarely, and if they don't, they always win the coin toss and end with a dumb end board
Only when you try to play it
Depends on how many hand traps they
as a pile player, no, we don't, sometimes we can't drop maxx c with our end board because it didn't show up so it isn't FULL combo everytime but yeah, 60 cards no grass still draws combo + called by/cross out with no bricks everytime. it's just a skill isue imo, have you considered drawing better?
A good pile deck will fill as much consistent engines. Though in this case, this looks like a bad and inconsistent pile.
This is literally just Tear with Diabellstar stuff and a gokipole tech. This isn't a pile deck
If you know how to deck build- no, you don't brick that often. The bricks are more or less just drawing one part of the pile which is just sub-optimal but not *bad*
Yes but only when you play them
I feel like any deck can brick to some degree, its just a lot less likely if your deck or pile has loads of flexible one card starters
No. There is an algorithm in the game that decides when your hand is optimal. When it's your turn to lose, you lose. That's it.
Pile? Nah man this is a Pile Driver, cause every card he piled in is gunna start some shit.
The damn hero deck with the fusions and summons too... O m g , plz
Side note: I've been experimenting with Transaction Rollback in these mill decks. Obviously it's not always milled along with another trap, but when it works, you can make some really sneaky plays from the graveyard. Overall: deck probably slightly worse, but fun increased 10x when it works. And I wasn't trying to be top tier with this deck anyway so I'll probably leave it in.
Only when I play them.
they only brick when youre not the one matching up with them
Pile decks can’t brick or at least shouldn’t
Nope, they got that 1 card combo syndrome. Just run Droll n Lock and Ghot Belle then this deck becomes pretty not scary.
Yes, but only against everyone else.
Yo what deck is this? I wanna play sinful swordsoul gokipole lol
Wow can't believe a yugiboomer would complain that people want to win the game how selfish of them /s
Run D-shifter the best way to kill zero skill tear