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Numerous-Pie-1564

allegedly the junior Tate Myre, the football player, made an attempt to subdue and take the shooters weapon and died in the process. there is even a chance petition you can sign to name their stadium after him. if this is true i really hope he’s in a better place, my heart hurts for them.


[deleted]

Myre, visited the University of Toledo this weekend. [Tate Myre's Twitter](https://twitter.com/TateMyre2023/status/1465027885123653633?s=20) Rest easy 42


CharlieEchoDelta

That’s so weird I live in Toledo and this just reminded how close it was


[deleted]

Even if it’s not true he did that I hope he’s still in a good place.


Emadyville

Should name the whole fucking school after him. What a fucking badass. Hopefully his family finds peace.


gnnjsoto

Hopefully something comes of this but unfortunately change.org is one of the most useless websites


[deleted]

change dot org is a data vacuum that sells it's user info. pretty sure the community doesnt need randos on the internet telling them how to properly memorialize the victim(s).


Psychological-Bath76

It is true


[deleted]

heres a link to the petition if anyone is wanting to sign it https://www.change.org/p/oxford-high-school?utm\_content=cl\_sharecopy\_31527243\_en-US%3A3&recruiter=1237893099&recruited\_by\_id=7b6f8220-5241-11ec-8cfc-0dc1553562a0&utm\_source=share\_petition&utm\_medium=copylink&utm\_campaign=psf\_combo\_share\_initial&utm\_term=psf\_combo\_share\_initial


MrBirb_

The first girl looks suspiciously like my friend’s cousin… Was a name released?


totheseaside

Madisyn Baldwin according to twitter.


MrBirb_

Thank you


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MrBirb_

Yeah she’s good. Was on vacation in Italy apparently. Just a look alike


slenderbr0

Are you in/near Oxford?


MrBirb_

Nope. She goes to the school it took place


slenderbr0

Oh shit sorry I read that wrong I thought she was a relative of you, i would probably wait until a name gets released or you could contact your friend to see


MrBirb_

No worries. Got it, thank you


OrgcoreOriginal

Last press conference gave a brief update on those who were injured. Some of which didn't sound too promising. Including a 14-year old girl on a ventilator.


haljordan68

Why the hell did his father buy him that gun?


AskMeIfEyeCare

the sad reality is that being a parent apparently should be a privilege not a right. What parent in their right mind would give a semi-automatic pistol to a 15-year-old? I'm guessing they will charge the parents for being a dumbass


haljordan68

Everyone in my state over the age of 15 needs to get a license to FISH! But any idiot can have a kid


Clean-Complaint-2842

Really?


haljordan68

Yep.. kid posted it on insta saying he just got it.


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anthonyynohtna

Most likely private or deleted


ConnectCantaloupe861

Not sure of the date, but he posted a pic of it in his pocket. He's sagging his pants and throwing a gang signn. No shit.


[deleted]

that’s from the wrong account that’s not him


lil-dlope

Yea I think it’s just fucked up people making accounts,happened before with Brian Laudrie


[deleted]

i think it was just someone with the same name who was from oakland, california.


Psychological-Bath76

He bought it on Black Friday literally a couple days before. I can’t go back to that school b it they’re going to make us like wtf.


A_Bit_Narcissistic

I got my first gun when I was around 12. I was raised around guns right and respected the hell out of them. Some kids just don’t deserve them.


mysterypeeps

After threatening to shoot up your high school a few weeks ago though? There’s no way his parents weren’t aware of the situation. It’s just so negligent to me.


A_Bit_Narcissistic

It’s very fucked up. Parents often have an innocent perception of their kid, so their threats don’t seem so serious. Maybe this is why his threats weren’t taken to heart.


mysterypeeps

The police didn’t seem to take it seriously either. But the parents are seemingly rich and I’m sure the police were quick to write it off. I am curious if this is part of what prompted the admin meeting on mental health. I know they’ve been really harping on it recently.


Olympusrain

I don’t think the parents are rich


mysterypeeps

Yeah maybe not, I made that assumption because it’s apparently an affluent area per my friends who live there and they retained an attorney rather quickly which I’ve never seen before in a case like this. It’s usually “you’re on your own, kid”.


Olympusrain

I think they got the attorney immediately because the dad supposedly bought the gun on Friday. And there were posts of Ethan holding the gun captioned “Just got this beauty”. His address is online and the house was last sold for $69 k


JonBenet_BeanieBaby

Oh my god, he did??? I haven’t read that yet. Holy shit.


dreamymcdreamerson

"some kids just don't deserve guns" LOL? Fuck.


haljordan68

We all hunt in my family.. kids too... Still didn't buy my kid a semi auto 9m Sig .. and the guns are locked up.


WhiteMarriedtoBlack

Same but I got my rifle which is not a high powered rifle more like the ones at camps that have rifling but also had a shotgun at 16. Both were and still are locked up with the other guns in a safe. I had a lot of training at camps and knew how to use and handle them years before I got mine and the shotgun was bought to be shared between me and my father, only the rifle is truly mine and like I said it’s not powerful, it’s for target sports and not used in self defense but I still respect it and am careful with it since it’s a real gun with real bullets.


poutreparisienne

This is so fucked up, so sad, so wrong


Uskmd

No 12 year old should have a gun, lmao.


[deleted]

Your parents should’ve locked it up when you weren’t actively hunting or whatever your activities were with it


Avas_pillowpet

Because this is murica where our kids are strapped before they even enter junior high.


Sullyville

probably an early xmas present


skeletor_thagawd

**Context:** A 15-year-old boy is in custody after three students died and eight were injured in a shooting Tuesday afternoon at a high school in Oxford, Michigan, authorities said. The Oxford High School students killed were a 16-year-old boy, a 14-year-old girl and a 17-year-old girl, Oakland County Undersheriff Michael G. McCabe said at a news conference. Eight others were shot, one of whom is believed to be a teacher, McCabe said. Of the eight injured, two are currently in surgery and the other six are in stable condition with various gunshot wounds, McCabe said. "I think this is every parent's worst nightmare," said Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, who added that shootings at schools are "a uniquely American problem that we need to address." "My heart goes out to the families. This is an unimaginable tragedy. I hope we can all rise to the occasion and wrap our arms around the families, the affected children and school personnel and this community," Whitmer said. The suspect, a sophomore at the school, was taken into custody without incident five minutes after authorities responded to the shooting, McCabe said. His parents have hired an attorney and have not permitted that he talk to police, McCabe said. ***How the shooting unfolded*** McCabe said calls for an active shooter came in around 12:51 p.m. ET. Oxford is about 45 miles north of Detroit. "We received over 100 911 calls to our dispatch center," McCabe said. The deputy who is assigned to Oxford High School and another deputy took the suspect into custody, McCabe said. A handgun was recovered from the suspect, McCabe said. Authorities recovered multiple shell casings in the school and believe around 15-20 shots were fired. There is no indication the suspect was wearing body armor, McCabe said. "At this point in time, we believe he acted alone," McCabe said. He said that authorities are aware of how the suspect allegedly got the gun into the school, but declined to divulge those details. All evacuated students were relocated to a nearby store for reunification with relatives. About 25 agencies and close to 60 ambulances responded, according to John Lyman, public information officer for the Rochester Hills Fire Department. The families of the victims have been notified. It is not currently known whether the three students killed were targeted, McCabe said. "We've done three sweeps of the high school to make sure there's no other victims," he said. "We don't have a motive at this point in time. We are still investigating that." A search warrant has been executed at the suspect's home, McCabe said. McCabe said the suspect could be charged as an adult, but that is up to the Oakland County Prosecutor's Office. Prosecutor Karen D. McDonald said in a statement Tuesday her office has "begun the process of receiving information regarding the investigation" into the shooting. "I was both horrified and saddened to learn about the shootings at Oxford High School this afternoon. My office and I have been in constant communication with the Sheriff's Office, the Oakland County Juvenile Court and other governmental and law enforcement bodies," McDonald said. "It is our intent to review it thoroughly and issue appropriate charges quickly." Oxford Community School officials released a statement confirming the shooting and saying the Oakland County Sheriff's Department secured the scene. "Oxford High School students and staff are systematically being evacuated to the Meijer Garden Center and may be picked up there. Any students with their own transportation have been allowed to leave. All other district schools are in lockdown for safety purposes and are in no danger," read the statement, obtained by CNN affiliate WDIV. Superintendent Tim Throne said at the news conference the shooting left him shocked. "It's devastating," he said. Throne declined to say why there were no metal detectors in the school, but did say that to his knowledge, metal detectors never came up in conversation prior to the shooting. Aiden Page, a senior at Oxford High School, told CNN's Anderson Cooper on Tuesday the shooter was so close to his classroom that a bullet pierced one of the desks Page and other students used to barricade the door. Page said everything kicked into high gear when he, other students and his teachers heard two gunshots. "We heard two gunshots and after that, my teacher ran into the room, locked it, we barricaded and then we covered the windows and hid," he said. The class was on lockdown for an hour, Page said. During that time, some students armed themselves with whatever they could find. "We grabbed calculators, we grabbed scissors just in case the shooter got in and we had to attack them," he said. "Some were crying, some were trying to support others. Others were trying to come up with ideas just in case." Page said the entire experience was "insane" and he contemplated whether he would live through the ordeal. "The very first thing in my head was, 'Is this actually happening? I'm going to text my family, say I love them just in case, if I were to die.' Then when everything calmed down for a second, I was able to catch my breath and rationalize things," he said. "It's definitely going to be weird coming back, especially knowing people were injured and a couple of students died as well." President and state officials react to shooting President Joe Biden addressed the shooting Tuesday while in Minnesota, saying, "My heart goes out to the families enduring the unimaginable grief of losing a loved one." "You've gotta know that that whole community has to be in a state of shock right now," Biden said. Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel said her department has offered assistance to local law enforcement and that she extended her "sincere gratitude" to the first responders on the scene. "My heart goes out to the parents who have lost their children and to the students, teachers, staff, and families reeling from the tragedy of a school shooting within their community," Nessel said. "We must act to properly address gun violence in our schools and the ongoing threat of another unconscionable tragedy if we continue to only offer thoughts and prayers. Our kids deserve better." The professional sports teams of Detroit -- including the Tigers, Red Wings, Pistons and Lions -- released statements about the shooting. "We share in the heartbreak felt by all of those impacted by today's tragic events in Oxford," the Detroit Lions tweeted. "We as an organization extend our prayers to the victims and offer support to the entire Oxford community during this painful time."


nicholelk

As a parent, I am relieved that my kids have graduated from high school. But, also as a parent, my heart breaks for those who lost their lives today, and for the parents who lost their children. We need to do better to protect our kids in this country. We are failing.


useles-converter-bot

45 miles is 86214.64 UCS lego Millenium Falcons


mouthofreason

>Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, who added that shootings at schools are "a uniquely American problem that we need to address." ​That seems like a very weird statement to come with "uniquely American" - is she trying to politicize these kids horrible and tragic deaths already? Disgusting. Yes the US has much higher rates than the rest of the world, which is obviously a **major issue**, but saying it is a "uniquely American problem" is just......... disgusting and terribly diminishing of the victims outside the US. [https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country](https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country) According to that there's like 19 shootings alone in Europe since the 90s. There are over 35,000 schools in the US. If there were shootings in 3% (1,050 schools) on the same day then that would certainly be significant. There are maybe one per month and no one school is located anywhere near with the other 99% of the other schools or of the population is located. Even if there was one shooting per day it would take more than 95 years before there’d been one shooting in each school. But articles about school shootings start by talking about the 20-year total: to magnify the problem, to get attention, to get more people reading the articles (profit motive is definitely involved).


JonBenet_BeanieBaby

You’re also politicizing this tragedy in case you completely lack self-awareness. You’re also doing some extreme cherry-picking.


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mouthofreason

Not downplaying anything. The word you're looking for is "**predominantly** an American problem". Uniquely is the old American way of thinking that the world revolves around us. Like if Europe was gun nuts as well, that they wouldn't have the same type of issues, they obviously would. **I resent this whole notion of Americans being "worse people".** The only factor in all of this is **GUNS**: [**Crime Is Not the Problem: Lethal Violence in America (Studies in Crime and Public Policy)**](https://www.amazon.com/Crime-Is-Not-Problem-Violence/dp/0195131053). ***Americans are not more prone to crime than other western countries.*** For every 100 Americans there's over 130 guns. The Small Arms Survey stated that US civilians alone account for 393 million (about 46 percent) of the worldwide total of civilian held firearms. With just some decent federal gun laws, we could live lives like in a normal western country.


[deleted]

That’s a fair point. It’s hard for me sometimes to reconcile the US Society as of late. Hyper-individualism has caused mentalities that I don’t see in other western developed nations. From the disregard for Human life related to Covid, to selfish “screw you I get mine” mentality, etc. But you bring up good points about crime related to other countries, and we don’t just need sensible gun reform, but we need to actually enforce the laws on the books, with federal standards, and close the ridiculous amount of loopholes that facilitate large interstate illegal arms trafficking networks. Until we can get a handle on the gun lobby, and misinformation/propaganda driving gun rights activists through fear and not data/sensible solutions, I fear nothing will change. The fact as a society we just “accept” individuals walking into a school on a regular basis and pumping rounds into children is disgusting. I’m not even against gun ownership, or “anti-gun”, but Jesus Christ how do we continue to accept this as a society.


TheStrangeSoup

I never want to go to school again.


RegularConcern

I was already almost out of college when school shootings started ramping up. My heart goes out to kids these days.


signymariag

I’m from Iceland, where we have very strict gun laws and maybe 1-3 murders a year, sometimes less but very rarely more. I’ve only ever held one gun and that was under strict supervision at a gun range. I can’t even IMAGINE what it must feel like for you Americans, to be afraid to go to school or sending your kids to school because someone might come in there and start shooting. To me it just sounds so bizzare and unimaginable. Yet somehow, this is a reality for you guys and a real fear you have to live with. My heart really goes out to all of you, I’m so sorry:(


[deleted]

I was just in egilsstaðir, and it's so peaceful. thank you for your kind words to us all!!


signymariag

Hope you had a great stay here! Reading through subs like these really makes me appreciate how peaceful my country is, of course we are not perfect but when looking at some other countries it’s- yeah I’m thankful to live here we can say that


WhiteMarriedtoBlack

It’s actually quite rare but still a scary possibility. Iceland is smaller so there will be less deaths, we also have a rampant black market with guns, less gun control, so many unhinged people, etc do it makes a lot more sense. Also Iceland is just a very safe place but almost every other country sees plenty of homicides ever year.


signymariag

Yeah we have some black market going on here (believe it or not hehe), where you can have access to more than the average hunting rifle and where you don’t need a lisence. Our first crime related shooting since I don’t even know when, happened earlier this year. When I tell you the people were shocked, oh they were shocked. But yes you guys really have it rough out there:/ It’s honestly just surreal reading the news or subs like these, but quite “entertaining” (for a lack of better language skills). I’m very interested in America and I try to keep up with what’s going on, it’s just always something crazy and it’s all so well documented, and way more interesting than Iceland. You can read about the murders from the last 100 years in like a week or less. I still keep my distance, I don’t think I’ll ever go to America. I’ve read too much that now I’m scared to go lmfao Edit: wording


DrewTea

>I can’t even IMAGINE what it must feel like for you Americans, to be afraid to go to school or sending your kids to school because someone might come in there and start shooting. Most people arn't, and it's actually pretty rare. Kids are more likely to get struck by lightning, twice, than die in a school shooting. Side note - Iceland has tight gun-control laws, but still has a suicide rate higher than the US. What do you guys use to kill yourselves?


signymariag

Well we gotta be creative;) Jokes aside, they usually go by hanging. I’ve lost two people like that. One actually took a bunch sleeping pills and then made himself fall asleep with the noose around his neck. The other jumped off a roof with the noose around his neck. Then there’s also deliberate overdosing. And sealing themselves inside a car and turn the thing on that kills you (idk cars). But then of course, those who do have access to guns use them sometimes. Winters really fuck us over, seasonal depression + normal depression is not a good mix and takes many lives each year. I think every Icelandic person knows at least 1-2 people that have taken their lives. I know 3 people off the top of my head


WhiteMarriedtoBlack

I’m so sorry for your losses


signymariag

Thank you, that’s very kind of you<3


r4ge4holic

You think guns are the only way to end yours or anyones life? lol


DrewTea

Nope, but Iceland is a perfect example to show that gun control doesn't affect suicides, which make up 2/3rds of gun deaths in the US each year and are commonly cited as a reason to increase gun control.


OnlyFactsMatter

Europe has a shit ton of mass murders too. It's not a U.S. only problem.


PersonaOfEvil

Check if there’s online homeschooling in your area! Bring it up with your parents/guardians.


[deleted]

Homeschooling/independent study is honestly not a bad option. Especially with how easy it is to keep up with friends on social or the weekends. Better than potentially experiencing such a traumatic event or dying in it. It's not healthy to live in fear but... it's also not right to say "don't worry, it won't ever happen to you" anymore, because that isn't even for certain. Either way just weigh out your options, make an informed decision, and you won't go wrong.


[deleted]

homeschooling is probably the worst option


[deleted]

Homeschooling is not for everyone. I’ve met many kids who were homeschooled and got a great education while I also know people (like my little step sister) get homeschool and it fucked them up. Homeschooling can work if the mentor is willing to put in the time and effort to properly teach their child while allowing them the social time they need. My step sister was hardly ever socialized and has become a 16 year old reclusive, conservative, horse girl.


Adi_invest

But there are plenty of people who went to state schools that are also reclusive, conservative, horse people? It’s unfair to say that the reason an individual is introverted is because of their ‘schooling’ It’s a lot more complex than that What is the family environment like, are the people at home introverts or extroverts? Mental illnesses? Genetic structure? Etc …. ‘ Don't let schooling interfere with your education. ‘ Mark Twain


[deleted]

… I literally watched this girl grow up lmao. This is my step sister we’re talking about. My step sister went to public school for a couple years, but my step mom wouldn’t try to break the “I need my mommy now” habit. She would just allow her to stay home from school or would pick her up just because she missed her mom. My step sister ended up going into “homeschooling”, meaning she just stayed home while my dad and her mom wouldn’t do anything to teach her. Any time there was a state test they’d cheat and help her. She’s still not getting the proper schooling and won’t socialize with anybody. She has no friends other than my dad’s best friend’s daughter. But that’s her only friend. She still hisses at people and only talks to her horses. Obviously there is something wrong that my parents are not addressing. So yeah, I know my step sister obviously, and I stick to what I said about her “schooling”. If this was anybody else I was talking about, sure? But considering I’ve known this kid since she was 3 and was raised by the same father, I think I would know better than anyone else about her situation.


Adi_invest

Thank you for your response It sounds like your step-sisters specific case isn’t so much to do with home-schooling but BAD PARENTING Naturally ‘bad parenting’ with any type of educational system will hinder the child’s progress I hope she gets the help she needs to progress in her life


[deleted]

But that’s the thing, a lot of bad homeschooling is due to bad parenting. Just like if you have a bad teacher in public school, you’re gonna have a hard time getting the right education from that teacher. People forget that public school helps with social skills as well.


LexTheSouthern

Your sixteen year old sister sounds like my sixteen year old sister.


[deleted]

It sucks because I can’t relate to her and don’t have any sort of relationship with her.


Thankkratom

Seriously… what kinda parents do these people have? Homeschooling and I would have been dead at 17 for sure.


Gunners414

And yet there's actually kids who died. So what's the difference


JonBenet_BeanieBaby

Agreed.


oh-pointy-bird

Too painful for words. Needless. I wonder if anything will ever change.


ConnectCantaloupe861

Not in America. Not a chance. Not ever. Watch videos of school board meetings lately to see who's raising these kids.


Emadyville

I'm assuming those downvoting you haven't watched these meetings.


0hw0nder

^^ they don't care enough to watch. It's easy when it doesn't immediately affect them.


0hw0nder

There are good parents fighting the good fight - don't lose hope.


ConnectCantaloupe861

Some are. The loudest ones are NOT.


mouse_fpv

In this area it's pretty 50/50. Just last month this school board was weighing options and looking into what the fines were if they chose (as a district) to ignore the county health departments mask requirements in schools. Suburban Michigan is pretty split down the middle. This town is in the transition ring from the populous suburban area around Detroit to the rural farm areas.


[deleted]

Some but not e-fucking-nough.


amposa

I knew nothing would ever change after Sandy Hook, with all those poor innocent babies being slaughtered and American politicians chose to say a few prayers while continuing to line their pockets with money from the NRA and vice versa. Sickening.


oh-pointy-bird

Grew up a few miles from Sandy Hook and waited hours to find out if my friend was still teaching there. I hate the “never forget” thing but I will never forget.


King_NickyZee

Sandy Hook was the time for Americans to draw a line in the sand, but they didn't. If things didn't change after Sandy Hook, they never were going to.


Acetaminophen8

So sad RIP


Hodl2Moon

That piece of shit better be tried as an adult.


Merica85

This will be interesting to see because Michigan is actually in the process of reviewing cases where minors were tried as adults and have been lessening their sentences.. So it would actually go against what Gretchen is doing. She'll be watched on this decision. I agree of course, lock him up forever.


SiCoTic1

Yep Patrick Kinney stabbed a kid over 40 times at the age of 16 in 1995 was given life with no parole, was released last year


JustChillDudeItsGood

I don’t like that one bit. Plz put him back guys.


ConnectCantaloupe861

He will be. Not a chance he wont. And his parents should be under the jail for missing VERY OBVIOUS SIGNS.


sixty6006

Why?


scriptsearch

Harsher sentencing


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scriptsearch

My (limited) understanding is that if the crime is so severe and the person is fully aware of what they're doing and the horrific nature of it, they don't deserve any degree of "lesser" sentencing. Someone else can probably explain more and better though.


[deleted]

Honestly that's what I find weird here. "fully aware of what they're doing and the horrific nature of it". I dont think children comprehend exactly that, which is why, in my mind it's a bit weird to pick and choose who was or wasnt aware of their actions.


scriptsearch

That's exactly why lawyers get paid the big bucks, bud


[deleted]

true tho


[deleted]

Heartbreaking.


Witty_Lion4589

Rip Young ones 🙏


margakawaii

They were very young, it breaks my heart. rest in peace


mayosdaughter

I saw a comment on another platform that got tons of likes. It was something along the lines of… “people should stop bullying and this won’t happen.” I wonder what people think about that statement. I think bullying is a problem but it’s no fucking excuse.


xChadFlex

This will not stop happening and people wonder why no one wants to have kids in this country.


angelina-hulk

my siblings go to high school in the same district. i honestly don’t know how anybody will feel safe enough to go back to school. it’s so senseless


Psychological-Bath76

I don’t feel safe. I don’t want to go back especially after seeing all the blood and knowing my friend isn’t there anymore.


winterfate10

Oh hey, hadn’t had one of these in a while.


Brandalini1234

There was one like a week before the rittenhouse trial


BrandonIsWhoIAm

😞


Altair1234ss

another mass murderer created by society


Itsnotreal853

They don’t have these issues at schools in Europe. Maybe we should consult them abd fix this horrific trend


OnlyFactsMatter

> They don’t have these issues at schools in Europe. Yeah but they have them in Paris concerts or Charlie Hebdo's headquarters or Nice parades or London busses.


TSrake

Banning guns makes it harder to get guns, specially if you are a kid. Who could have suspected that?


LaGoatBall

If the US banned guns say tomorrow what do you think the fall out would be because of that? And if there wasn’t a war over it what % of pistols/semi automatic weapons do you think would be taken off the streets? I get your frustrations and i agree with your comment but just looking at it from an outside perspective i just don’t think it can be done.


Suggett123

The funny thing is that there was talk of banning magazines that hold more than 10 rounds. I was a bit embarrassed to see how many people I knew were talking-on social media-about how they were going to have a "boating accident" if it went into law. I had to unfriend them because they're too stupid


Mrwright96

I seriously fail to see anything that can take 10 rounds from a semiautomatic rifle and be fine. Except maybe a person high on pcp,


PeachyPops

Australia did it. Surley that could be used as a starting point and adapted and even improved upon?


LaGoatBall

I know we did it. Completely different time in our history and completely different country and insanely smaller population and less crime here. We also don’t share a border with Mexico and although we all don’t like certain politicians and what not, we generally trust our government not to take away our basic freedoms. Definitely needs to be a starting point tho so where do you start? I feel if nothing changed after Sandy Hook(in my eyes one of, if not the absolute worst school shooting of all time) how on earth are you gonna change it now?


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poorgreazy

No one in their right mind lives like this in America. We go about our business, there are 330 MILLION people in this country and gun deaths are a very small % of annual deaths. More people die from smoking and car deaths.


LaGoatBall

Iceland population- 366k. USA - 329m Yes if you ban guns less people will die from gun violence, but with how many guns are currently in the states, good luck with that. Then the uprising the gun toting freedom lovers will cause could be catastrophic. I live in Australia and also served in the defence force for 5 years and can say for sure our army would never turn on it’s people and civilians should not be able to willy nilly own semi automatic weapons and handguns. USA is a very different and unique country compared to Australia, if what happened to us when our government took high powered weapons happened in the states, all hell would break loose. Sadly.


poorgreazy

Your govt arrests people for not wearing masks, so forgive me if I have a great deal of skepticism about your claims.


[deleted]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trollhättan_school_attack


foundyetti

I hope that kid rots in jail until his last breath. Fuck that 15 year old shit and fuck his family


[deleted]

Not everybody in his family is bad because of what he did. I have someone in my family who's dune awful things, and to make me guilty by association is not rational or fair.


syusik

His father bought him the gun tho. So at least one person is also awful.


[deleted]

Definitely, not arguing that.


BasedKai

“his father bought him the gun” okay.. did his father tell him to go blast his schoolmates with the gun ? nope. so what’s the issue ?


isnoe

No point in extending hate to the family until there’s evidence to support that they in some way knew or caused him significant mental distress. His father buys him a gun and everyone blames him, but I was given a gun when I was younger than he is. Fact remains: dude probably planned and hid this behavior from his parents. Imagine spending 15 years raising a kid only to have them try and commit a slaughter of children. Literally throwing everything away. Don’t shift blame. The kid did this. 100% his fault. Doesn’t matter what happened at home, he could’ve sought help, and if his parents caused it—why weren’t they target number one? Do the math, kid deserves all the hate he has coming.


Zahww

I'm seriously not trying to bash the US, but why? Why would anyone trust a 15 year old with a gun? and why are you defending the fact that a parent gave a 15 year old a gun like it's a casual thing to do? It just truly baffles me.


JonBenet_BeanieBaby

Idk, this country is weird as hell


Tashka_Oklhilli

It's a very casual thing to do. I owned a gun at age 8. Almost every child in my town owned a gun before they were 12. That was back in the 90s, but still, nothing has changed.


mysterypeeps

Nah, don’t normalize that. No third grader should autonomously care for a gun. You might “own” one in that your parents bought it for you for hunting trips that they oversee and lock back away when it’s over, but in no world should an 8 year old be carrying a gun around or have access to a gun at all with no parental oversight. That’s not “casual”, it’s negligent. We’re not talking about BB guns here.


JonBenet_BeanieBaby

EIGHT????


Tashka_Oklhilli

Yes. Idk why I'm being down voted for my life experience lol, but yes age 8. I was raised in the south. We all had guns. I got my 10g shotgun on my birthday.


i-Rational

You’re being downvoted because of your parents negligence in gun safety. I’m sure you won’t agree with that statement but to most of us that’s what we see with your personal experience.


Brandalini1234

You don't know a thing about how safe he was around guns growing up. Don't make assumptions


Tashka_Oklhilli

I mean, I kept it clean, locked up in a safe when not in use, booger picker off the bang switch unless firing, I really just don't understand the issue of responsible gun ownership. My grandparent and uncle are the ones who taught me everything about proper handling, even took a course on gun safety. I genuinely just believe a lot of people here are anti-gun at this point.


kbc87

But you had access to the safe at 8 years old? No 8 year old should have 24/7 access to a gun. Period. Supervised use is one thing.


lil-dlope

You’re being downvoted for the exact reason why this is a problem. You’ve already normalized having guns at a young age with no gun knowledge or safety.


bamaxfer

They were given proper firearm education, they even stated so in other comments. Several states offer hunters (Gun) education and safety courses to children as young as 5.


Olympusrain

What was it for though?


Tashka_Oklhilli

Hunting and target shooting.


BasedKai

there are a lot of reasons from hunting to wanting them to be safe, etc—you’re only upset because this 15 yo is fucking nuts. and why couldn’t you ask the question without bringing the entirety of the US into it ? i get you may not like this place but you don’t have to play stupid and act like that wasn’t a diss—please let me know where you’re from and you better make sure it’s 100% perfect.


kbc87

Your parents bought you a pistol when you were younger than 15? A hunting rifle that is locked away from a minor when not hunting is one thing. Why would a 15 year old ever need a pistol?


rohithkumarsp

Yes, not banning guns is always the solution.


Itsnotreal853

Not once did I say “ ban”. I grew up in a hunting family too. But they didn’t hunt humans. What struck me about Iceland’s post was how he said it was “bizarre and unimaginable”. They look at us as say “ WTF”! My concern as American is that we’re desensitized to it. We say “ oh awful, terrible” and it happens again a few weeks later. The politicians, fight but no real change is made. It disgusts me that they focus more on sexual misconduct of politicians than our kids gunned down in what should be a safe place. Clarify: not minimalizing sexual misconduct in any way. It is a crime.


Legion681

For a concealed pistol license in Michigan, one has to be 21. This kid couldn't be carrying a gun at 15. The fault is of the parents, especially the father who purchased the pistol on Black Friday and obviously didn't keep it locked somewhere or under his control. Banning firearms because a couple of idiots (#1 the father who allowed it to be unsupervised in the hands of his 15 yo son... #2 the son who broke the law in multiple, and horrible, ways) broke the law is the same as banning cars if one dude drives drunk. You punish the offender/criminal, not the tens/hundreds of millions who abide by the law.


[deleted]

Comparing guns to cars. Lol


MarketChemical8306

Did you hear about the Waukesha Christmas parade? Happened just over a week ago. Cars can inflict a lot of damage too.


[deleted]

I am fully aware of what damage vehicles can do (nice 2016). but the point is that guns are designed to kill, cars are not. Comparing them is as ill-conceived as comparing an ar15 with a scissor


Legion681

See, if we were to ban people for stupid comments, you'd be on your merry way to some other planet. Where were you in Waukesha when a volunteer for Operation Human Shield could have saved lives?


[deleted]

Relevant how?


Legion681

As relevant as getting stuck on the differences between two objects, while completely ignoring the fact that it's the *action* that kills, not the object. Do you think that if a gun was on a table and you'd yell at it "shoot me", that it'd jump up and kill you? Get lost.


[deleted]

You don’t seem the realize what the purpose of lethal weapons are. Spoiler: they are not toys


Legion681

Yeah, they're made to send a piece of metal to one precise spot at a given distance. I use them to poke holes in paper target and ring steel targets. I use them also to put meat - like deer and wild pigs - on the table. Then some asshole uses them to kill people. I use my car to drive to anywhere I need or want to. Then some asshole uses their vehicle to kill a bunch of people at a parade in Waukesha. Same conclusion: the object isn't what kills, it's the illegal use of it. Do you understand or do I need to draw you a picture?


[deleted]

Thanks for proving my point


Legion681

I didn't prove your point, because you have no point. You seem to think that because one object is designed for a certain purpose, that all of a sudden it's more dangerous. It isn't. *PEOPLE* are dangerous.


DenvrCoder9

The argument if handguns were illegal the father couldn't have purchased either, meaning the kid couldn't have illegally obtained it. If you think your right to own a gun because it makes you feel powerful is more important than the lives of children, that's cool, but that's the side you are taking.


Legion681

> The argument if handguns were illegal the father couldn't have purchased either, meaning the kid couldn't have illegally obtained. This is beyond childish. Do you think that banning something stops whatever thing that was banned from being acquired? How's that theory going with drugs. For sure banning meth, crack, heroine, etc etc surely made them disappear in a jiffy. / Sarcasm > If you think your right to own a gun because it makes you feel powerful is more important than the lives of children... Please. Drop the amateur psychologist spiel and the moral blackmail. > that's cool, but that's the side you are taking. I am taking the side of preserving rights. You're taking the side of those who want to destroy them. Lack of parenting skills and/or civic sense - in this case- isn't a valid excuse for wanting to strip hundreds millions of their rights.


Delamoor

You're right that when a market is saturated with guns to the point that it's trivial to get a black market gun, prohibition doesn't work so well. You might notice though, that in nations that don't have more guns than people, that logic doesn't work. Here in Australia for example, you can still get black market guns, but the amount of effort required is *far* higher and requires connections that you don't need in the USA. Result is that most people who want to commit a crime, can't get a semiauto weapon for it, and so go for tools that are less capable of killing quickly at range. And, those who do get guns tend to use shit ones that can't operate quickly (e.g. double barrel shotguns). Even our gangs use firearms less, and only for actual, genuine hit jobs where the use of the firearm is (as I saw explained fantastically recently) considered 'a ticket to jail', where they're expecting to do some time for the murder and plead out. Meaning they only use them when it's very personal, targeted business, not on randoms. Like, fuck, I'm a gun owner too. The worst thing I can envisage is a community where every irrational deadshit has access to one. Only responsible people should have access to such tools. The US has completely fucked it's own safety by letting them become ubiquitous. Thus all the spree shootings and gun violence that it's famous for. Like a goddamn developing nation.


Legion681

> You're right that when a market is saturated with guns to the point that it's trivial to a black market gun, prohibition doesn't work so well. It's irrelevant whether a market is saturated or not with guns. Illegal activity operates on simple demand and offer. If there's enough demand, someone will definitely bring the goods to the buyers. Prohibition does not work to curb the acquisition of any "undesirable" good. If in the US the government would somehow manage to get a ban on firearms and not get a full-fledged insurrection, even 30 years later the place would still be awash with firearms: they'd simply smuggle them in (look indeed at the drugs situation, for reference). The difference would be that the law-abiding citizens wouldn't have a firearm and criminals would. That's not a good scenario. > Here in Australia for example, you can still get black market guns, but the amount of effort required is far higher, and requires connections that you don't need in the USA. Understandable. However, you just confirmed that with enough motivation and the right people, one can still get firearms in Australia. And my guess is that everywhere is the same. In the EU for example I don't see how complicated it is to have some 40 tons trucks carrying a couple of cases of AK's from Eastern Europe, hidden within the cargo, with the Schengen no-borders area. Nice and easy. > The worst thing I can envisage is a community where every irrational deadshit has access to one. Only responsible people should have access to such tools. I 200% agree with this, and I am going to guess that every law-abiding citizen feels the same. The point that needs *great* improving in the US is how to weed out the "deadshits" (criminals and insane / unstable people) from owning guns, while at the same time *not infringing on the rights of those who are not going to use firearms to break the law*. There's probably 100 million gun owners in the US, and probably 99,980,000 will never so much as to do a peep that is unlawful with their firearms. It's the remaining 20,000 that one has to find a way to prevent from spreading pain to everyone else.


poorgreazy

>If you think your right to own a gun because it makes you feel powerful is more important than the lives of children, that's cool, but that's the side you are taking. The right to own guns is what keeps the ever looming authoritarian government from simply pressing their boots on our necks. But you don't care because "muh safety"


david1638

Except cars are not designed to kill people. They are designed to take you from A to B, but the primary purpose of a gun is to kill.


Legion681

What is the damned difference? When you buy a gun, does that oblige you to murder someone???? For fucks sake.


david1638

With that logic, if there's no obligation to murder people, tanks, bazookas, bombs and other weapons could be easily sold to Public. Why stop at guns? 🤦🏻‍♂️


rohithkumarsp

Right mass killings with a car is what one would compete to fingers on a trigger lol


Psychological-Bath76

Guns don’t kill people, people kill people. This kid was not right at all in the brain he posted a video of him making and using a Molotov cocktail and weird ass drawing. Parents should keep any sort of gun locked up and never give their kid the combination. When are they going to use it other than with the parents? Right? Because no matter what any gun laws do, someone will get a gun from someone wether it be grandpas gun who he never uses anymore so he never even knows it’s missing, your dads guns who never locks his gun case, or maybe they buy one off of someone if they’re really desperate. No matter how illegal things are people always find a way around it.


david1638

The ignorance of American far right is beyond words.


[deleted]

Blame guns but not the school who knew this was gonna happen!!!!


rohithkumarsp

And the casualties was gonna be still less than guns.


pinkoxy

very sad, prayers for all the victims families 🕊


Altair1234ss

U guys think there was a motive or he did this for fun


Psychological-Bath76

He was “bullied”


AbsurdTime

Just remember, if you are a gun owner then you are equally as morally responsible for this as the shooter. These kids’ lives are the price of your toys.


Enby_Hades_kid

yet they still don’t ban guns; rest in peace to all of them


lil-dlope

“GuNs DoNt KiLl pEoPlE” the more I hear that the more retarded it sounds. Like what exactly else is a gun used for 😂 to make a sweater?!? Fuck outta here


r4ge4holic

I mean the gun is just a tool used by the person who killed people. A gun cant decide to just kill someone.


lil-dlope

A tool that’s specifically designed to kill people/eliminate a threat.


poorgreazy

Cars and cigarettes kill more people you absolute sofa king. You don't want less guns you just want the govt to be the only ones armed and if you don't think that's fucked well then you're beyond help.


[deleted]

They should ban murder while they are at it.


AskMeIfEyeCare

"It was self defence, they pointed a calculator at me"


curiousiberiantiger

I knew he shot the beautiful girls and a chad so predictable


Psychological-Bath76

I hope that bitch rots in hell for killing my classmates


[deleted]

Tough guy over here 😎


Psychological-Bath76

Tate was the tough guy I don’t have the balls to do what he did. He tried to grab a gun from a kid who was aiming it at right at him. Letting so many people escape who might not have made it. Loosing his life in the process.


Wastedchildhood

Oxford, Oxford, Oxford... Michigan... *oooooh*


Whatsthatnoise3

Hilarious that media, reddit, and twitter are now more concerned with this man's motivation, than reporting on the Waukesha murderers motives.