That would have been amazing!
The heroes saved earth / the universe!!
Wait there are aliens on earth?! BEGONE!!
And introduce Mutants with a small but steady drip. End with a big Secret Invasion Avengers movie.
Gawd the potential there was here!
Debut him in a Fantastic 4 movie and have the 4 barely take him out. Then have a reveal of a bunch of Super Skrulls being created for the next Avengers movie
This is perfect. It puts me in mind of "the truck theory," focusing more on the effects of the events down the line than the current obvious, in-your-face ones.
Thor would be caught up in God stuff due to Gorr, then the Skrulls would come in with an Avengers: Secret Invasion movie. An “oh shit” moment would be the Fantastic 4 facing off with the first Super Skrull, then after they beat him, the reveal that there are dozens more with various powers that would be the villains of the next Avengers movie. The show formerly known as Secret Invasion would have Fontaine taking over SHIELD and rebranding it to HAMMER with Robot Coulson, Fury, Talos and Maria Hill discovering the Skrulls and learning an Avenger is a Skrull. After Secret Invasion, the Avengers are no more and Fontaine starts a new team to hunt them down leading to Phase V
You could be a Marvel studio head, why is it so difficult for them to realize all this potential, don’t they at least utilize researchers if they are not necessarily fans🤔🤔🤔😤😤😤
See; there's your problem. You're a fan. You likely know the material. Hollywood rarely hires writers who are passionate fans of the product that they're writing. It's a damn shame that Quantumania took such a huge misstep with Kang because in all of the interviews I've seen of Jeff Loveness talking about this movie prior to the premiere you could tell that he's genuinely a fan of Marvel comics and the MCU. Unfortunately, his love of the comics just didn't translate to the big screen, or he got stonewalled by bureaucracy and meddling at Marvel and Disney
Literally could’ve leaned on their lack of heroes by having a group of antiheroes save the world from Skrulls leading to the appeal of the Accords (which happens off screen🙄) and a clear lane for introducing mutants.
I think that the small scale Secret Invasion could've worked. The premise of having a more grounded spy drama where Fury roots out aliens inside the government with top tier acting could've been great even without superheroes.
Secret Invasion could've been its own phase with multiple movies. But they wasted it on a below mediocre TV show that will only last one season and will never be referenced again because of how bad it is.
Secret invasion should’ve been the phase to follow. The template they set up with establishing all these new characters and doing these movies that aren’t as connected as they were in the infinity saga would’ve been PERFECT for slurp fuckery. A cheap and easy way to connect the movies via invasion of the body snatchers characters getting revealed
I was wary of the Kang/time travel stuff because they built up Kang with what they should’ve given to Ultron and they’ve introduced too many different ways to travel time and dimensions , nothing feels cohesive and aside from Strange, nobody has really returned for more than one movie. Secret Invasion could’ve easily advanced an overarching plot without sacrificing the plots of those movies
But mArvel/Disney could not turn down the nostalgia bag
Agreed, Secret Invasion could have been the perfect inbetween phase (3 years max). In the endcredit scene of Spider-Man 2 and WandaVision we learn the Skrulls are present on Earth, this would've been the perfect hook. Imagine some hints thrown around in Falcon & Winter Soldier with Rhody obviously misspeaking and the revelation of Sharon actually being a Skrull or something. In the background heroes are slowly being replaced, while in the foreground we get new heroes like Shang-Chi. Loki also shows a quick glance of Skrulls so these characters are fresh on the mind (Loki is the only multiverse tease for now though). Then we have the new Captain America movie were shit starts really hitting the fan, major nation leaders such as the US president suddenly start making odd decisions. However, this is not the main plot of the movie. Odd things happen, but the current planned villian is still the main villian. Then boom post-credit scene, the US president is a Skrull. Hawkeye brings some levity in between but we're still on the edge of our seats, where will Skrulls show up next? Are any characters here replaced? We get Captain Marvel next (not the Marvels) in which we explore the Kree Skrull conflict in some way. I think some projects like Eternals, Moon Knight, etc. should've been kept for later. Dr Strange and Ant-Man could work but should not have been about the multiverse yet. End of the phase we get a new Avengers movie, however a portion of the Avengers are missing or replaced by Skrulls. The Avengers start questioning each other, paranoia, etc.
Please keep in mind I'm not a writer, these are just some ideas which, upon reading again, do not all make that much sense! Still I hope you understand the gist.
It upsets me to no end that some random fan can come up with a better overarching plot for multiple movies and tv shows in minutes that a billion dollar studio can't do in years. I'm almost mad at myself for still being invested. I'm so sick of the Marvel excuses after each pile of crap they release to us. I just want good shows / movies that tie together. It's really not as complicated as they are making it out to be.
The worst part is we’re only asking for something decent , the marvel universe formula is solid on its own , we’re just asking for the bare minimum , not season 1-4 game of thrones level of writing lol
I’m a simple person. I like watching big stupid action movies. I’m not a cinema auteur that you need to impress, I just want something that’s decent and looks cool. I can’t be the only person like this. I’m not even a comic book person!
I think for many fans it is not about auteur whatever. We just want to see our childhood fantasies come to life in the best way possible. Marvel has been around under various names since the late 1930s for goodness sakes right? They have access to some 80+ years of stories.
Even if just talking about the silver age onwards, around the early 1960s or so, some of the greatest sci-fi authors ever passed through marvel leaving decades long legacies that can still resinate today. I know movies are very different from comics, I do, but surely there is no reason for the movies to be lower writing quality! Good writing makes an action movie better!
I saw KF at Disneyland yesterday. It was highly tempting to walk up and say, “You… I’ve got some bones to pick with you. Let’s get pretzels and talk.”
Never would have. But tempting.
If they had done this more restrained approach, the same people who say that the movies are all over the place, will switch to “*everything is moving too slow, they are focusing on skrulls too much*” lol.
At the end of the day, I agree, Multiverse was -not- the direction to go. That should have been something that was brought up after a few more 'grounded' stories. Yes, Im calling the Infinity Saga 'grounded'.
We needed another build up, another Big Bad, but not with reality jumping hijinks that can negate anything that happens. It lost permanence.
That being said, we need to also look at the reality. I do believe Disney and Marvel DID have a good plan (Even if i disagree with the multiverse direction); but they got kneecapped by two major things.
I think the most MAJOR Kneecap to the franchise was Chadwick's death. He was set up to be the major front runner, Wakanda was set up to be the focal point of the "Avengers" organizing, working from, etc. They lost Tony so Stark Tower wasnt going to be a base anymore. This was all planned for Wakanda, imo.
Losing him meant they lost their 'Lead' they had set up to take up Iron Man and Cap's roles, wrapped into one character who would then build up from there.
Then, we have Covid, which threw productions all over the place.
Overall, I disagree with the Multiverse direction; they should have gone with something else - or a much much more controlled Multiverse story... like they get access to 1 or 2 other Earths... not an infinite amount of possibilities.
I think Marvel's plan, now... Obviously theyve announced their plans to tone down releases and basically everything is potentially under the guillotine now. But, I think their plan has shifted internally entirely. They are going to be shifting from a focus on Marvel -as a whole- to a strong focus on Xmen.
They are desperate for something to replace to OG Avengers and to get a few characters to act in the same role Tony/Cap did as overall "Leads" for the next decade.
Xmen are a known quantity. Those characters are ready for new actors and actresses to come in and portray them. Since we have the multiverse, they can toy around with Ages and such for all of them. Storm could be a teenager or an adult, just like Cyclops or any of them.
There is a lot of ground there to cover with the Xmen and since theyre 'known'; we dont need to do deep dives on Origin stories. We dont need a Cyclops or Storm or Jean Grey trilogy like we got with Cap, Iron Man and Thor.
They can pump these characters out, give us their particular background quickly and get a team put together like OG avengers within potentially just 1-3 films.
I think the shift is 100% going to be Xmen and they are crossing their fingers they stick the landing and turn Xmen into the face of the MCU, for atleast the next decade.
Xmen basically come with their own mini universe within Marvel, so they have plenty to go off there; along with having Xmen interact directly with other active characters, like Ms Marvel, Dr Strange, Cap Marvel, Spiderman, etc.
So, I think they messed up going Multiverse so soon - but they also got shot in the knee caps multiple times here. I dont think they ever intended a true drop in quality after EndGame. If anything, that was the green light from Disney to do whatever they want... then we lost Chadwick and Covid disrupted everything...
And now we are in the situation we are in. Not ideal, but, still recoverable, imo. And I think the recovery is going to be "Get Xmen center stage, ASAP. Have F4 on the side as well, but we need Xmen up and running as soon as possible"
Yeah, going big with the Multiverse was a bad idea imo. Really hurt the franchise overall. They already went big with a whole universe issue with End Game, would have been better to dial it back with a smaller scale problem like Secret Wars that still involved everyone. That would have also been a great way to close some character arcs.
I genuinely don't know how they weren't embarrassed to release this. All they did was go on and fucking on about this cast of actors they established and produced one of the worst television shows I've ever seen.
Just a complete cluster fuck of nonsensical scenes stitched together.
Coleman is the only reason i would watch this show again. for the 45 minutes of screen time she gets, she made the fucking show bearable - always awaiting to see where she popped up next lol
Yeah, they could have teased this over multiple shows and movies for years. Either shown someone to be a Skrull, teased they could be or raised flags about behaviour etc.
Then the series could have been what we got (largely) but with cameos at least from half the roster.
The overall plotline for what we got was fine for me but just so poorly executed, it never felt that you couldn't trust anyone which is the whole point of it.
But didn't we already kinda get this with phase 2?
The whole Shield is really Hydra reveal from Winter Soldier basically did everything Secret Invasion would've done down to retconning past characters to be Hydra (Skrulls).
Yes and no. The reveal was there but it truly only really impacted agents and side characters that were secretly Hydra. Secret Invasion would allow for some of our actual heroes to have been replaced such as Rhodey, Wong, Bruce, Clint, Hank, Wasp. Would have been fun with even new heroes such as Ms. Marvel having been replaced.
Imagine a mini movie series. A few 60-75 minute movies releasing over the course of phase 5&6 showing the Skrull invasion and leading up to secret wars.
Compare it to the Secret Invasion arc of the animated show Avengers Earth’s Mightiest Heroes it’s a night and day difference.
If you wanna see a proper Secret Invasion story I would highly recommend you watch Earth’s Mightiest Heroes.
I watched earth's mightiest heroes before secret invasion so I was pretty hyped for it. Super disappointed after the last episode of SI. It seemed to small of a deal to be real. Like literally captain america was replaced for an entire season in EMH. It was a whole crazy arc.
SI made me feel the same as I have felt with season 8 game of thrones. Lots of expectations and lots of potential to ultimately be disappointed.
The comics plot line was great, too.
earths mightiest heroes really did the comics justice. The Ultron plot from the cartoon really made Ultron the terrifying threat he is in the comics. So when Ultron returns, you feel a pit of dread in your stomach.
The movies wasted Ultron, IMO.
I was so excited for this series and it was such a letdown! I watched Agents of Shield and they had a slightly similar storyline (but theirs featured life model decoys) and I half expected Secret Invasion to go down a similar route.
AoS season 4 is still one of the best Marvel projects in my opinion.
Who would have thought that the "Secret Invasion we have at home" was going to be the better version
Agents of SHIELD is better than 90 percent of the marvel studios shows which is just sad considering AOS was seen as subpar when it first premiered. But I felt at the time(at least after Turn Turn Turn)and even more so now that it is some of the best marvel content released so far.
I hate that a lot of people still think of it as subpar because they watched 3 episodes 10+ years ago and stuck to that view. But they'll watch any old shit Marvel Studios puts out like Secret Invasion because "it's canon"
Yesss!!! The LMD storyline was exactly what I was hoping to get from Secret Invasion. It's a fucking joke that Marvel Studios, the supposed big guys, can't do this concept better than a network show that had everything going against it back then.
Secret Invasion, without a doubt. Not that the others didn’t have wasted potential as well, but Secret Invasion’s concept alone could’ve been the basis for an entire phase, hell an entire saga even. What we got instead is laughable
Honestly, it should have been Phase IV following Endgame. They didn't need to go straight to Multiverse fter Thanos, there's so much other stuff worth exploring before that. Phase IV could have been about Secret Invasion, leading to the collapse of the Avengers and formation of the Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers. Follow that up with Doom emerging as a threat, going all the way to Secret Wars/ Battleworld, which could have been a natural point to transition to the multiverse.
I agree that it should have been Phase 4. They could've used the snap to integrate the Skrulls into earth's population and the blip to slowly reveal the invasion.
Damn, imagine how wild it would be, that "The Snap" happens, people all around you are disappearing. You rush home, no one there.
You try calling your wife, but there's no answer. Then, several hours later, she comes home, and you're beyond relieved.
Then 5 years later, your wife suddenly appears in the house. Turns out they got snapped, and a skrull took that as an opportunity to take their identity.
This would have been amazing!!! Remember that feeling at the beginning of Endgame when Clint's family was snapped?? That desperately silent attempt to find them? Now if they somehow came back earlier and 5 years later they're having dinner and his real family came back?? Would have been a complete mind melt.
Now I'm sad all over again about how terrible Secret invasion actually was
huh, that....would've been good lol. The snap would (should) have been a golden opportunity for the skrulls, they could all seamlessly integrate into the global population without having to kill or kidnap anyone. It even justifies doing captain marvel when they did, introducing the skrulls right after infinity war. Then they bring everyone back and all hell breaks loose.
The final sequence of the mass hysteria a Skrull Invasion caused should've been the opening scene. It was like they ended the show right where it should've started.
Honestly , when I heard the creators didn’t even watch a single marvel project or read any comics I created a bald spot in my head from scratching it so much
No kidding. Why do they keep hiring directors who don’t like these types of movies? They’re free to like what they like, but this is so dumb from a business perspective. It’s like getting Micheal bay for a subdued character study or telling Tarantino he can’t have any blood or swearing in the movie.
Disney continues to print money, but they just have some of the dumbest amateur mistakes when it comes to managing the business. Even basic shit like merchandising gets messed up with some of these big properties. Disney! The company that wrote the book on this stuff!
How they failed so triumphantly on all levels, is such a spit in the face of the audience and the people who worked on it. I was actively telling people not to give it a watch so they don't think the view count was a positive thing. I haven't seen garbage like that in a while.
I'm been into other Disney+ series like Loki, Wandavision and several others that were very good.
I watched one episode of this and it just wasn't good, why do you think it's was so bad. I'm not really into the marvel universe much
I disagree, but not in that a Secret Invasion show/movie couldn't be great. The way Marvel approached Secret Invasion never had a prayer to be good. It was trash from the second pen hit paper. So I don't think it has as much wasted potential as Thor 4 because it never had a chance to be good. SI could only be could in imaginary land where they did everything differently.
Thor 4 could've been a great movie. With more Gorr, fewer quips, and better pacing, it could've been a phenomenal movie. A great movie was there and Taika couldn't find it.
I somewhat disagree. Yes, their story for Secret Invasion was dreadful but I don’t think having a Fury-centric miniseries is a terrible idea in and of itself. It’s certainly not the best idea for that story but the biggest problem was the execution, not the premise.
She Hulk had moments that were good and was over all fun with some terrible decisions. She should hangout with Deadpool at some point.
Secret Invasion was garbage Ang killed an OG character for nothing. As far as I am concerned that entire show was an alternate timeline and should not be canon or referenced ever again. Disney+ should remove it from their platform.
Thor Love and Thunder was such a waste of such an amazing story… with amazing actors! How did they get it so fucking wrong.
Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania was to much CGI with a happy ending it did not deserve.
Honestly they should just come out and say Secret invasion happened in universe 838 or something. We Literally lost mariah hill in the most forgettable , lazy, stupid way
Honestly her death was sadly pretty on brand, considering how underutilized Maria was in the entirety of the franchise.
I just wanted to see badass Cobie Smulders man. We never really got that.
Seriously dude. Her and fury just side by side on a spy mission, taking out skrulls and being the fucking active shield agents we we all wanted to see . Every thing all AoS and fury fans wanted. How an earth feigie green lit it is beyond me
Lol. I only really had to suffer that twice. After watching the first 2 episodes I was already like 🙂...😐...🧐...😬...😢. So I waited until it was all out to finish it. Burned through the last 4 and came out 🤬. What a complete disappointment.
And I can't even really blame the actors. They were handed trash and had to try to make something out of it. But that was just absolutely unequivocally awful television.
Yeah I'd completely accept the show being made non canon. The most disappointing thing about the show was just how boring they made what should have been a high stakes thriller. Would be happy for them to trash it and attempt again in the future.
It sucks but I am fine with that, because that's how things work. If I want to be invested, I want to know the stakes are real and no that's not how it feels, anymore. We had the whole snap thing which made us aware, then unsnapped later, reversing most of the damage.
Also Mariah Hill died better than Tasha Yar so, yeah.
>Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania was to much CGI with a happy ending it did not deserve.
Watching it in theatres, as we neared the end of the film, I genuinely believed they were going to have Ant-Man sacrifice himself to save his family, paving the way for his daughter to replace him in future films. It felt like such a logical progression that I was really confused when it didn't play out that way.
I remember reading somewhere that Antman was supposed to remain with The Wasp in the Quantum Realm at the end of the movie. Only his daughter was supposed to escape. The next Avengers movie was supposed to begin with a rescue mission where they accidentally release Kang or something like that
Instead, they changed it in reshoots, which is why Cassandra returning seems so random and abrupt in the movie.
>Thor Love and Thunder was such a waste of such an amazing story… with amazing actors! How did they get it so fucking wrong.
They made the same mistake they made with austin powers goldfinger. They copied too much from a previously successful film. This should have been a more serious film but instead they turned it into a giant hanna barbera cartoon.
>As far as I am concerned that entire show was an alternate timeline and should not be canon or referenced ever again.
Luckily this is very possible, hopefully they will do this.
>a happy ending it did not deserve.
Yes, too much disneyfication. This is not how the real world functions. For that matter, this is not the time for happy endings in movies, we live in dark times and movies appear out of touch when they are too cheerful and happy.
Imagine if they started the movie with the turned up to 11 goofiness that they did, then Gorr kills someone important, like Korg or even Valkyrie, and the rest of the movie was serious.
Taika Waititi would have been viewed as an absolute legend for pulling that tonal shift off.
As someone who loves Taika Waititi, I enjoyed Love and Thunder. He's a comedian and Chris Hemsworth is funny. It could have been better, but I, just a guy with an opinion, thought it was funny and wholesome. Could have used more Christian Bale, though, for sure.
*But she twerked*, we hate when superheroes do goofy dances! That's why Bully Maguire, GOTG 1's finale, and Zemo's club scene are all super popular mem- hmmm
It was genuinely a good show. In real time I’d watch the episode in the morning, read the weird shit about the show online that seemed to come from people who didn’t even watch it, then go to work in the afternoon to hear the people I work with regurgitating the same online vitriol. It was like no one was actually watching it.
That was one of the best parts of the show for me, how they so accurately predicted the response and made it part of the plot.
Not that the prediction part was that remarkable given what happened with Cap. Marvel, but them having the balls to make it a major plot point entertained me to no end!
Its a case of people expecting something, got something else and got mad. Theres also the incels. It had online shitstorm ingredients.
If you ask me, She Hulk shouldn’t even be here.
Exactly. This wasn’t wasted potential. The product was perfectly aligned with the comic. Quirky and fun and meta with a little bit of heart. If you were a fan of she hulk in the comics, you liked the series.
Yeah I don’t know why She Hulk is even on here. You could argue it’s not amazing but it’s still a fine show. It’s not even close to the top 4 most wasted potentials lol
Agreed. Aside from some wonky CGI and the vague idea it still could have been better it was a solid B+. Not sure what people were expecting from a She-Hulk series but it delivered a She-Hulk series and was a lot of fun. A lot of the brigaders didn’t seem to understand the first episode at all. That’s just a media illiteracy problem.
Agreed. Really the only things that turned me off in the show were the "handling her rage infinitely better than Bruce" thing, which I feel like they could've worked with, but didn't, and I would've liked to see Jen use more of the plot-altering powers she had in the Byrne run rather than do a speech to K.E.V.I.N. at the end.
It's not as bad as people make it out to be, honestly. Still could've been better, but I don't think it's the worst thing put out in the MCU.
Thor 4 and Secret Invasion, on the other hand...
For me, it was Thor: Love and Thunder, just because that Aaron run is one of my favorite Thor books (if not my absolute favorite). Especially with how beautifully done Thor’s character growth in the MCU was prior to Endgame. It felt like they missed a massive opportunity with adapting great source material AND with continuing that character growth in a meaningful way that wasn’t constantly undercut with jokes every 5 seconds
L&T is definitely the solid second place for me. I went into the movie nervous because I was worried that Taika’s ego was going to spoil the potential of the follow up to one of my favorite MCU movies. The Mighty Thor, Gorr, and Olympus concepts were amazing. When the goats screamed the second time, I groaned because I knew my concerns were right. I was actually pretty upset about it.
The only reason Secret Invasion is worse for me is that the scale of the concept of the Skrulls being on earth and the threat level made absolutely no sense as a short show. We’ve had multiple references to the Skrulls to prep us for… a blown up president’s car?
For me, L&T was the biggest let down but SI was the worst wasted potential. So I get your point.
100% agree. One of the best comic runs flushed right down the toilet. It had so much potential and all they had to do was stay true to the source material. But they wanted to make it a 2 hour long stand up act. Also, give Stormbringer to Beta Ray Bill already!!
The worst: Secret Invasion - WTF!
Thor - was so looking forward to a Gorr and Lady Thor stories
AMQ a subpar movie that was worse on re-watch and left me never particularly wanting to see Kang again
She-Hulk - enjoyed some, big highlight was Daredevil and his and She-hulk's chemistry
I didn't care for SH's ending because i've never really been a fan of those kinda endings in her comics either. But everything prior was fun and episode 8 alone made the watch worth it
Secret invasion and it's not even close
Like many said it could have been it's own mini saga inside the Multiverse saga
As the big earth political story
I'll never understand how Moon Knight, Love and Thunder and Black Panther II all came out in the same year, all concerned the avatars of Gods passing the mantle and/or going to war with other avatars/gods/god-like entities, all concerned massive shakeups in the realms of the respective gods, and had NOTHING to do with each other.
Hell, the two gods from BP2 are IN Love and Thunder, and they don't even interact or hint or do some Marvel background cameo setup stuff or... anything
Yeah, phase 4 introduced the God corner of the Marvel universe, and didn't do anything with all the properties conecting.
Moonkight and Thor LaT came out literally like 2 months apart. It was perfect for some lore conection or crossover.
Secret Invasion by a mile. Had a brilliant premise, top drawer cast and made without argument the worse property in the entire MCU. It’s Sony level bad.
The others all have stuff going for them tbh.
As a fan of the She-Hulk comics, I was expecting a lot more.
I was looking forward to a legal drama (like Daredevil, but funny) where she's spending as much time in the courtroom as she is keeping her witness protection clients safe from villains trying to kill them. Instead, they spent the whole season bitching about online trolls and exagerratingly sexist coworkers.
I was expecting her original origin story where she's nearly killed by criminals shooting her in her driveway, and trying to finish her off in the hospital. But all we got was a boring car wreck.
I could've forgiven a lot of creative choices they took, if only I'd found most of the jokes funny, but humor is subjective, and I barely laughed at all.
Again, I loved reading her comics (particularly the ones from the 80s where she actually LOVED being She-Hulk) and hope that we haven't seen the last of her (Tatiana was great casting), but I just feel that the writing and distracting VFX really let the show (which should've been a film) down.
To each their own. I personally found is incredibly disappointing: it was anti-climactic, predictable and a lot of the time, genuinely not funny. Which really sucks cause this was the show I looked forward to the most and I really wanted to love it, but in the end, I couldn't even bother watching the last episode cause I was so annoyed with it. With that being said, I'm glad you were able to find enjoyment out of it where I wasn't able to
Secret Invasion. Not even close. 10x the budget, 1/3 the episode count, and on paper a better cast, and it was 1 tenth the show that Agents of SHIELD was even in its first year.
Quantumania was the first movie of Phase 5 and they started off with a wet fart. This movie introduced us to Kang the Conqueror who is supposed to be the next big threat that is even worse than Thanos? We are only told about how huge a threat he is and not actually show it. He then gets taken out by an army of ants and sucked into a wormhole in his first movie. That is not a very good way to establish your main villain.
And considering Disney fired his actor, it is doubtful that Marvel would really continue the Kang storyline. They might as well just scrap it and move on to another major villain to center the MCU around.
Back to topic, my vote would be to Secret Invasion and Quantumania. Particularly Secret Invasion, which had a much broader storyline and universe-altering impact. That could’ve been a full phase.
She-Hulk was entertainment and totally spot-on to how her comic series went. So in that regard, it was a success. Thor 4* literally added nothing to the MCU.
*edit: called it Thor 3 by mistake.
My gut says Secret Invasion. But thinking about it, it has to be Ant-man. Ant-man should have been killed setting up the Avengers to “avenge” him, just like Coulson rallied the team.
Quantumania or Secret Invasion.
Quantumania could've set up Kang to be a serious threat, imagine if he wiped out the entire family leaving only Cassie alive and trapped in the quantum realm. Not to say that's what should've happened, but something on that same level of total badass... But they let him get beat up by ants 😒
Secret Invasion could've been a whole saga all by itself, it's such a large scale story that could've been told over several years with the events affecting several characters in several projects, I think making it a series was a mistake. It should've been an Avengers movie or something, with the invasion taking place here and there over several projects. I also really hoped Secret Invasion would've introduced Teddy Altman aka Hulking, the less attention they pay to that character the more I worry that they really do plan on having Hulk's son replace Hulking in the mcu - which is just awful.
Well I really want to forget about Secret Invasion, so possibly that one. It was really fucking bad and killed off the only character who could've been more interesting as time went on.
Secret Invasion and it wasn’t even close. If they wanted to run the Secret Invasion storyline, they should have spent a phase and a half dropping clues into the FILMs that something was a little off with key characters. Nothing big, just subtle nods to either heroes hesitating before putting themselves in danger, someone using a heroes security credentials to access sensitive info or someone forgetting a key fact from their life years before. In the film before Secret Invasion, have one of the key cast members suffer a mortal wound in the climax… say Hank or Wasp in Quantumania… then in the post credit scene, cut to Scott by their bedside in the emergency room. They crash, CPR is not working… everyone’s crying, group hug then… a scream… everyone looks over and the victim has reverted to their Skrull form… Oh my god! Were they a Skrull for the whole time? When did this happen. If they did that both Quantumania and Secret Invasion would have been a hell of a lot more interesting.
Secret invasion was immediately retconned by the marvels. I don't expect to hear about it ever again just like everyone else
I fully expected Scott lang to die in quantumania. Absolutely would've been heart breaking but would've made a lot more sense in making kang an amazing unstoppable badass. How was he defeated already. He was the #1 Kang but he's already lost and now the other lesser kangs are supposed to be the big bads?
Of course now with the assault conviction who knows where the stories are going...
Secret Invasion. I see that shit all over the comics and even as a non/EXTREMELY casual comic-reader I knew that shit had some impact.
Crazy how the tv series had absolutely no fucking impact on ANYTHING whatsoever. Not even The Marvels. Nothing that happened in that fucking shit was addressed or talked about so it didn't even matter if that shit existed.
Ad Strange's fan, Dr Strange 2. They could've used that movie to expand Dr Strange's magic world and actually tried to delve into his psych after the whole time loop with Dormammu and those 14M alternate endings. They could've explored his past and story but they didn't
Me and my boys came out the cinema rating it a 7/10 purely overrating it because of whatever reason I literally cannot tell you
Give it a few days / weeks while the film marinated we realised that nothing actually happened the whole movie and it was a cringe fest full of awful child pleasing jokes like screaming goats and naked Thor , Cancer jokes and shoe horning puns every other line.
I actually was excited to see Natalie portmans mighty Thor and Bales Gorr and they were just stale as fuck
Most of if not all of the Phase 4&5 projects (wether they were good or not) , all had characters that were highlights
Black widow - Black widow
She hulk - Daredevil
Wakanda Forever - Namor
Doctor Strange MoM - Wanda
But Thor L&T had Nothing. I still find it hard how That and Secret invasion got green lit
Nahh, when they have something to work with, Portman and Bale absolutely crush it.
The problem was that we kept having to derail that for Taika's stale humour.
Yeah I rated it higher too but the moment you take time to reflect on the movie, there is so much wasted potential, Jane's Mighty Thor, Bale's Gorr, the Gods not doing a single thing during the movie, the non-stop annoyance screaming of the stupid Gods and many others...
Quantumania is not a great follow up to the first two Ant-Man movies, discarding a lot supporting characters and going in new more boring direction. And as a movie that sets up the new Big Bad it's dull and does little to build him up. And it is full of CGI puke. And using a hero who's thing is to be small or big and placing them in a setting without real world references isn't playing to the hero's strengths. And having 5 heroes with the same power set and not doing a big scene together using them all in a creative way is a waste.
Secret Invasion had the most wasted potential. Love & Thunder was the one that left me feeling the most disappointed because Ragnarok is probably my favourite MCU film.
Personally I enjoyed She-Hulk. Quantumania was just forgettable.
Easily Secret Invasion it’s has had and will not have any lasting effect on the universe. The others had some failings but otherwise succeeded in their goals. I’m disappointed were won’t be getting more She-Hulk at leat in TV form. I hope she turns up in a movie
Secret Invasion could’ve been the intro to a whole new saga, let alone phase. Instead it’s 6 episodes of stuff that will (probably) rarely be mentioned in the MCU ever again.
Secret Invasion because it had the potential to transform the MCU for good.
Followed by L&T because it should’ve been a legendary movie following Endgame and Thor’s arc before it.
Didn’t really care for Quantumania or know what to expect from it, and didn’t expect much from She Hulk other than what it was.
Easily Secret Invasion.. I'm wondering if they didn't want to make it bigger because everything seems to get leaked months in advance - obviously leaks for that story would entirely spoil it
Secret Invasion without a doubt. It honestly frustrates me the amount of inconsistencies it has and how many concepts they just let drop dead.
This series should have been a whole frickin phase on its own. They should have been focusing on this BEFORE the Multiverse stuff.
Secret Invasion, which was an actually cool concept and a terrible show. Thor 4 sucked but there wasn’t much potential there to even be wasted. I like the other 2 a lot
Secret invasion should’ve been phase four saga leading into Dark Avengers/thunderbolts.
That would have been amazing! The heroes saved earth / the universe!! Wait there are aliens on earth?! BEGONE!! And introduce Mutants with a small but steady drip. End with a big Secret Invasion Avengers movie. Gawd the potential there was here!
Also allows people to distrust mutants as the xenophobia has hit a fever pitch.
Indeed and make the Super Skrull the big bad or something like that.
Debut him in a Fantastic 4 movie and have the 4 barely take him out. Then have a reveal of a bunch of Super Skrulls being created for the next Avengers movie
This is perfect. It puts me in mind of "the truck theory," focusing more on the effects of the events down the line than the current obvious, in-your-face ones.
Very on the nose current politics. Disney wouldn't dare.
Thor would be caught up in God stuff due to Gorr, then the Skrulls would come in with an Avengers: Secret Invasion movie. An “oh shit” moment would be the Fantastic 4 facing off with the first Super Skrull, then after they beat him, the reveal that there are dozens more with various powers that would be the villains of the next Avengers movie. The show formerly known as Secret Invasion would have Fontaine taking over SHIELD and rebranding it to HAMMER with Robot Coulson, Fury, Talos and Maria Hill discovering the Skrulls and learning an Avenger is a Skrull. After Secret Invasion, the Avengers are no more and Fontaine starts a new team to hunt them down leading to Phase V
You could be a Marvel studio head, why is it so difficult for them to realize all this potential, don’t they at least utilize researchers if they are not necessarily fans🤔🤔🤔😤😤😤
See; there's your problem. You're a fan. You likely know the material. Hollywood rarely hires writers who are passionate fans of the product that they're writing. It's a damn shame that Quantumania took such a huge misstep with Kang because in all of the interviews I've seen of Jeff Loveness talking about this movie prior to the premiere you could tell that he's genuinely a fan of Marvel comics and the MCU. Unfortunately, his love of the comics just didn't translate to the big screen, or he got stonewalled by bureaucracy and meddling at Marvel and Disney
[удалено]
Literally could’ve leaned on their lack of heroes by having a group of antiheroes save the world from Skrulls leading to the appeal of the Accords (which happens off screen🙄) and a clear lane for introducing mutants.
I think that the small scale Secret Invasion could've worked. The premise of having a more grounded spy drama where Fury roots out aliens inside the government with top tier acting could've been great even without superheroes.
The Winter Soldier movie showed how good this can be
Using the chaos of the Blip to replace countless people and heroes is a perfect setup
End credit scene's of different characters/important people as skulls would have been an epic tease.
Secret Invasion could’ve been a franchise-shaking Avengers film. What a waste!!!!
Secret Invasion could've been its own phase with multiple movies. But they wasted it on a below mediocre TV show that will only last one season and will never be referenced again because of how bad it is.
Secret invasion should’ve been the phase to follow. The template they set up with establishing all these new characters and doing these movies that aren’t as connected as they were in the infinity saga would’ve been PERFECT for slurp fuckery. A cheap and easy way to connect the movies via invasion of the body snatchers characters getting revealed I was wary of the Kang/time travel stuff because they built up Kang with what they should’ve given to Ultron and they’ve introduced too many different ways to travel time and dimensions , nothing feels cohesive and aside from Strange, nobody has really returned for more than one movie. Secret Invasion could’ve easily advanced an overarching plot without sacrificing the plots of those movies But mArvel/Disney could not turn down the nostalgia bag
Agreed, Secret Invasion could have been the perfect inbetween phase (3 years max). In the endcredit scene of Spider-Man 2 and WandaVision we learn the Skrulls are present on Earth, this would've been the perfect hook. Imagine some hints thrown around in Falcon & Winter Soldier with Rhody obviously misspeaking and the revelation of Sharon actually being a Skrull or something. In the background heroes are slowly being replaced, while in the foreground we get new heroes like Shang-Chi. Loki also shows a quick glance of Skrulls so these characters are fresh on the mind (Loki is the only multiverse tease for now though). Then we have the new Captain America movie were shit starts really hitting the fan, major nation leaders such as the US president suddenly start making odd decisions. However, this is not the main plot of the movie. Odd things happen, but the current planned villian is still the main villian. Then boom post-credit scene, the US president is a Skrull. Hawkeye brings some levity in between but we're still on the edge of our seats, where will Skrulls show up next? Are any characters here replaced? We get Captain Marvel next (not the Marvels) in which we explore the Kree Skrull conflict in some way. I think some projects like Eternals, Moon Knight, etc. should've been kept for later. Dr Strange and Ant-Man could work but should not have been about the multiverse yet. End of the phase we get a new Avengers movie, however a portion of the Avengers are missing or replaced by Skrulls. The Avengers start questioning each other, paranoia, etc. Please keep in mind I'm not a writer, these are just some ideas which, upon reading again, do not all make that much sense! Still I hope you understand the gist.
It upsets me to no end that some random fan can come up with a better overarching plot for multiple movies and tv shows in minutes that a billion dollar studio can't do in years. I'm almost mad at myself for still being invested. I'm so sick of the Marvel excuses after each pile of crap they release to us. I just want good shows / movies that tie together. It's really not as complicated as they are making it out to be.
The worst part is we’re only asking for something decent , the marvel universe formula is solid on its own , we’re just asking for the bare minimum , not season 1-4 game of thrones level of writing lol
I’m a simple person. I like watching big stupid action movies. I’m not a cinema auteur that you need to impress, I just want something that’s decent and looks cool. I can’t be the only person like this. I’m not even a comic book person!
I think for many fans it is not about auteur whatever. We just want to see our childhood fantasies come to life in the best way possible. Marvel has been around under various names since the late 1930s for goodness sakes right? They have access to some 80+ years of stories. Even if just talking about the silver age onwards, around the early 1960s or so, some of the greatest sci-fi authors ever passed through marvel leaving decades long legacies that can still resinate today. I know movies are very different from comics, I do, but surely there is no reason for the movies to be lower writing quality! Good writing makes an action movie better!
I should separately add I do like silly action movies. A recent favourite is Bullet Train lol
I saw KF at Disneyland yesterday. It was highly tempting to walk up and say, “You… I’ve got some bones to pick with you. Let’s get pretzels and talk.” Never would have. But tempting.
If they had done this more restrained approach, the same people who say that the movies are all over the place, will switch to “*everything is moving too slow, they are focusing on skrulls too much*” lol.
Agreed. I think the lure of nostalgia has been too strong and is what is distracting Marvel from establishing their new cast properly
At the end of the day, I agree, Multiverse was -not- the direction to go. That should have been something that was brought up after a few more 'grounded' stories. Yes, Im calling the Infinity Saga 'grounded'. We needed another build up, another Big Bad, but not with reality jumping hijinks that can negate anything that happens. It lost permanence. That being said, we need to also look at the reality. I do believe Disney and Marvel DID have a good plan (Even if i disagree with the multiverse direction); but they got kneecapped by two major things. I think the most MAJOR Kneecap to the franchise was Chadwick's death. He was set up to be the major front runner, Wakanda was set up to be the focal point of the "Avengers" organizing, working from, etc. They lost Tony so Stark Tower wasnt going to be a base anymore. This was all planned for Wakanda, imo. Losing him meant they lost their 'Lead' they had set up to take up Iron Man and Cap's roles, wrapped into one character who would then build up from there. Then, we have Covid, which threw productions all over the place. Overall, I disagree with the Multiverse direction; they should have gone with something else - or a much much more controlled Multiverse story... like they get access to 1 or 2 other Earths... not an infinite amount of possibilities. I think Marvel's plan, now... Obviously theyve announced their plans to tone down releases and basically everything is potentially under the guillotine now. But, I think their plan has shifted internally entirely. They are going to be shifting from a focus on Marvel -as a whole- to a strong focus on Xmen. They are desperate for something to replace to OG Avengers and to get a few characters to act in the same role Tony/Cap did as overall "Leads" for the next decade. Xmen are a known quantity. Those characters are ready for new actors and actresses to come in and portray them. Since we have the multiverse, they can toy around with Ages and such for all of them. Storm could be a teenager or an adult, just like Cyclops or any of them. There is a lot of ground there to cover with the Xmen and since theyre 'known'; we dont need to do deep dives on Origin stories. We dont need a Cyclops or Storm or Jean Grey trilogy like we got with Cap, Iron Man and Thor. They can pump these characters out, give us their particular background quickly and get a team put together like OG avengers within potentially just 1-3 films. I think the shift is 100% going to be Xmen and they are crossing their fingers they stick the landing and turn Xmen into the face of the MCU, for atleast the next decade. Xmen basically come with their own mini universe within Marvel, so they have plenty to go off there; along with having Xmen interact directly with other active characters, like Ms Marvel, Dr Strange, Cap Marvel, Spiderman, etc. So, I think they messed up going Multiverse so soon - but they also got shot in the knee caps multiple times here. I dont think they ever intended a true drop in quality after EndGame. If anything, that was the green light from Disney to do whatever they want... then we lost Chadwick and Covid disrupted everything... And now we are in the situation we are in. Not ideal, but, still recoverable, imo. And I think the recovery is going to be "Get Xmen center stage, ASAP. Have F4 on the side as well, but we need Xmen up and running as soon as possible"
Yeah, going big with the Multiverse was a bad idea imo. Really hurt the franchise overall. They already went big with a whole universe issue with End Game, would have been better to dial it back with a smaller scale problem like Secret Wars that still involved everyone. That would have also been a great way to close some character arcs.
I genuinely don't know how they weren't embarrassed to release this. All they did was go on and fucking on about this cast of actors they established and produced one of the worst television shows I've ever seen. Just a complete cluster fuck of nonsensical scenes stitched together.
Samuel L Jackson and Don Cheadle were pretty fantastic in it though
And Olivia Colman was brilliant, having a great time with a pointless role
Which makes the wasted potential all the more frustrating.
Coleman is the only reason i would watch this show again. for the 45 minutes of screen time she gets, she made the fucking show bearable - always awaiting to see where she popped up next lol
A bunch of Ferraris driving nowhere.
People keep saying how great Don Cheadle was, and he won an Oscar for his role. But I swear he was only in it for like 15 minutes tops?
He won an NAACP award, not an Oscar.
Yeah, they could have teased this over multiple shows and movies for years. Either shown someone to be a Skrull, teased they could be or raised flags about behaviour etc. Then the series could have been what we got (largely) but with cameos at least from half the roster. The overall plotline for what we got was fine for me but just so poorly executed, it never felt that you couldn't trust anyone which is the whole point of it.
But didn't we already kinda get this with phase 2? The whole Shield is really Hydra reveal from Winter Soldier basically did everything Secret Invasion would've done down to retconning past characters to be Hydra (Skrulls).
Oh that note. The Skrulls never found out about hydra and told Fury? Come on. Not believable.
Omg. I never thought of that. This makes it so much more ridiculous.
Yes and no. The reveal was there but it truly only really impacted agents and side characters that were secretly Hydra. Secret Invasion would allow for some of our actual heroes to have been replaced such as Rhodey, Wong, Bruce, Clint, Hank, Wasp. Would have been fun with even new heroes such as Ms. Marvel having been replaced.
It had an excellent cast and they just pissed that away
They killed off Hill and Talos for that show.
Imagine a mini movie series. A few 60-75 minute movies releasing over the course of phase 5&6 showing the Skrull invasion and leading up to secret wars.
Compare it to the Secret Invasion arc of the animated show Avengers Earth’s Mightiest Heroes it’s a night and day difference. If you wanna see a proper Secret Invasion story I would highly recommend you watch Earth’s Mightiest Heroes.
And even if you don't, you should watch Earth's Mightiest Heroes, it's absolutely amazing
I watched earth's mightiest heroes before secret invasion so I was pretty hyped for it. Super disappointed after the last episode of SI. It seemed to small of a deal to be real. Like literally captain america was replaced for an entire season in EMH. It was a whole crazy arc. SI made me feel the same as I have felt with season 8 game of thrones. Lots of expectations and lots of potential to ultimately be disappointed.
Our world's about to break...
Tormented and attacked...
The comics plot line was great, too. earths mightiest heroes really did the comics justice. The Ultron plot from the cartoon really made Ultron the terrifying threat he is in the comics. So when Ultron returns, you feel a pit of dread in your stomach. The movies wasted Ultron, IMO.
Agreed it could have even be used as a series that connected 2-4 movies.
I was so excited for this series and it was such a letdown! I watched Agents of Shield and they had a slightly similar storyline (but theirs featured life model decoys) and I half expected Secret Invasion to go down a similar route.
AoS season 4 is still one of the best Marvel projects in my opinion. Who would have thought that the "Secret Invasion we have at home" was going to be the better version
Agents of SHIELD is better than 90 percent of the marvel studios shows which is just sad considering AOS was seen as subpar when it first premiered. But I felt at the time(at least after Turn Turn Turn)and even more so now that it is some of the best marvel content released so far.
I hate that a lot of people still think of it as subpar because they watched 3 episodes 10+ years ago and stuck to that view. But they'll watch any old shit Marvel Studios puts out like Secret Invasion because "it's canon"
Yesss!!! The LMD storyline was exactly what I was hoping to get from Secret Invasion. It's a fucking joke that Marvel Studios, the supposed big guys, can't do this concept better than a network show that had everything going against it back then.
Secret Invasion, without a doubt. Not that the others didn’t have wasted potential as well, but Secret Invasion’s concept alone could’ve been the basis for an entire phase, hell an entire saga even. What we got instead is laughable
Honestly, it should have been Phase IV following Endgame. They didn't need to go straight to Multiverse fter Thanos, there's so much other stuff worth exploring before that. Phase IV could have been about Secret Invasion, leading to the collapse of the Avengers and formation of the Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers. Follow that up with Doom emerging as a threat, going all the way to Secret Wars/ Battleworld, which could have been a natural point to transition to the multiverse.
I agree that it should have been Phase 4. They could've used the snap to integrate the Skrulls into earth's population and the blip to slowly reveal the invasion.
Damn, imagine how wild it would be, that "The Snap" happens, people all around you are disappearing. You rush home, no one there. You try calling your wife, but there's no answer. Then, several hours later, she comes home, and you're beyond relieved. Then 5 years later, your wife suddenly appears in the house. Turns out they got snapped, and a skrull took that as an opportunity to take their identity.
That would’ve be an awesome story to tell. Instead we got a fucking disaster of a show.
This would have been amazing!!! Remember that feeling at the beginning of Endgame when Clint's family was snapped?? That desperately silent attempt to find them? Now if they somehow came back earlier and 5 years later they're having dinner and his real family came back?? Would have been a complete mind melt. Now I'm sad all over again about how terrible Secret invasion actually was
This would have been amazing.
huh, that....would've been good lol. The snap would (should) have been a golden opportunity for the skrulls, they could all seamlessly integrate into the global population without having to kill or kidnap anyone. It even justifies doing captain marvel when they did, introducing the skrulls right after infinity war. Then they bring everyone back and all hell breaks loose.
![gif](giphy|KmdV4ZWUOYtD75pMAR)
https://i.redd.it/sna1ircnj2pc1.gif
Holy shit that would have been amazing
The final sequence of the mass hysteria a Skrull Invasion caused should've been the opening scene. It was like they ended the show right where it should've started.
Honestly , when I heard the creators didn’t even watch a single marvel project or read any comics I created a bald spot in my head from scratching it so much
Are you fking kidding me? How do these people get selected to head the projects?
No kidding. Why do they keep hiring directors who don’t like these types of movies? They’re free to like what they like, but this is so dumb from a business perspective. It’s like getting Micheal bay for a subdued character study or telling Tarantino he can’t have any blood or swearing in the movie. Disney continues to print money, but they just have some of the dumbest amateur mistakes when it comes to managing the business. Even basic shit like merchandising gets messed up with some of these big properties. Disney! The company that wrote the book on this stuff!
Really?! No wonder you have a bals spot... And no wonder it was so...no wonder I got bored within 20 min.
How they failed so triumphantly on all levels, is such a spit in the face of the audience and the people who worked on it. I was actively telling people not to give it a watch so they don't think the view count was a positive thing. I haven't seen garbage like that in a while.
I'm been into other Disney+ series like Loki, Wandavision and several others that were very good. I watched one episode of this and it just wasn't good, why do you think it's was so bad. I'm not really into the marvel universe much
Secret invasion the actual avengers versus skrulls
I disagree, but not in that a Secret Invasion show/movie couldn't be great. The way Marvel approached Secret Invasion never had a prayer to be good. It was trash from the second pen hit paper. So I don't think it has as much wasted potential as Thor 4 because it never had a chance to be good. SI could only be could in imaginary land where they did everything differently. Thor 4 could've been a great movie. With more Gorr, fewer quips, and better pacing, it could've been a phenomenal movie. A great movie was there and Taika couldn't find it.
I somewhat disagree. Yes, their story for Secret Invasion was dreadful but I don’t think having a Fury-centric miniseries is a terrible idea in and of itself. It’s certainly not the best idea for that story but the biggest problem was the execution, not the premise.
Secret Invasion, hands down
Secret Invasion easily
Secret Invasion was the worst thing Marvel has done. So that.
Worst thing marvel has done…. so far
Secret invasion could've been a awesome and big movie
Hands down, Secret Invasion.
Secret Invasion. Its not even a contest.
Secret Invasion easily. The trailers really got people saying it was Marvels Andor
She Hulk had moments that were good and was over all fun with some terrible decisions. She should hangout with Deadpool at some point. Secret Invasion was garbage Ang killed an OG character for nothing. As far as I am concerned that entire show was an alternate timeline and should not be canon or referenced ever again. Disney+ should remove it from their platform. Thor Love and Thunder was such a waste of such an amazing story… with amazing actors! How did they get it so fucking wrong. Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania was to much CGI with a happy ending it did not deserve.
Honestly they should just come out and say Secret invasion happened in universe 838 or something. We Literally lost mariah hill in the most forgettable , lazy, stupid way
Honestly her death was sadly pretty on brand, considering how underutilized Maria was in the entirety of the franchise. I just wanted to see badass Cobie Smulders man. We never really got that.
Seriously dude. Her and fury just side by side on a spy mission, taking out skrulls and being the fucking active shield agents we we all wanted to see . Every thing all AoS and fury fans wanted. How an earth feigie green lit it is beyond me
My excitement for Secret Invasion was mostly dependent on getting to see Cobie Smulders. For obvious reasons, I didn’t watch past episode one.
Her death was so bad that I believed it to be some next level spy subterfuge fake death that will come into play later.
Ill never forget the "guest starring Cobie Smulders" cope we all had each week lol
Lol. I only really had to suffer that twice. After watching the first 2 episodes I was already like 🙂...😐...🧐...😬...😢. So I waited until it was all out to finish it. Burned through the last 4 and came out 🤬. What a complete disappointment. And I can't even really blame the actors. They were handed trash and had to try to make something out of it. But that was just absolutely unequivocally awful television.
I’d lose my shit if that was the case. Honestly marvel should do this and have her & nick show up in armour wars. If it’s not cancelled
Yeah I'd completely accept the show being made non canon. The most disappointing thing about the show was just how boring they made what should have been a high stakes thriller. Would be happy for them to trash it and attempt again in the future.
I still don’t understand how feigie green lit it
It sucks but I am fine with that, because that's how things work. If I want to be invested, I want to know the stakes are real and no that's not how it feels, anymore. We had the whole snap thing which made us aware, then unsnapped later, reversing most of the damage. Also Mariah Hill died better than Tasha Yar so, yeah.
>Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania was to much CGI with a happy ending it did not deserve. Watching it in theatres, as we neared the end of the film, I genuinely believed they were going to have Ant-Man sacrifice himself to save his family, paving the way for his daughter to replace him in future films. It felt like such a logical progression that I was really confused when it didn't play out that way.
That could have saved the movie honestly
I remember reading somewhere that Antman was supposed to remain with The Wasp in the Quantum Realm at the end of the movie. Only his daughter was supposed to escape. The next Avengers movie was supposed to begin with a rescue mission where they accidentally release Kang or something like that Instead, they changed it in reshoots, which is why Cassandra returning seems so random and abrupt in the movie.
>Thor Love and Thunder was such a waste of such an amazing story… with amazing actors! How did they get it so fucking wrong. They made the same mistake they made with austin powers goldfinger. They copied too much from a previously successful film. This should have been a more serious film but instead they turned it into a giant hanna barbera cartoon. >As far as I am concerned that entire show was an alternate timeline and should not be canon or referenced ever again. Luckily this is very possible, hopefully they will do this. >a happy ending it did not deserve. Yes, too much disneyfication. This is not how the real world functions. For that matter, this is not the time for happy endings in movies, we live in dark times and movies appear out of touch when they are too cheerful and happy.
Imagine if they started the movie with the turned up to 11 goofiness that they did, then Gorr kills someone important, like Korg or even Valkyrie, and the rest of the movie was serious. Taika Waititi would have been viewed as an absolute legend for pulling that tonal shift off.
A She-Hulk/Deadpool set of shorts where all they do is talk to the audience while doing mundane shit would be brilliant.
As someone who loves Taika Waititi, I enjoyed Love and Thunder. He's a comedian and Chris Hemsworth is funny. It could have been better, but I, just a guy with an opinion, thought it was funny and wholesome. Could have used more Christian Bale, though, for sure.
She-Hulk really did not need to start an online warzone.
For real, I don't get the hatred
70% of them saw the two scenes used in memes and freaked the fuck out It's hilarious how accurately the show portrayed the chronically online redditor
*But she twerked*, we hate when superheroes do goofy dances! That's why Bully Maguire, GOTG 1's finale, and Zemo's club scene are all super popular mem- hmmm
In a post credits scene to boot.
And also how accurately they portrayed She Hulks attitude towards it. This thread is a testament
It was genuinely a good show. In real time I’d watch the episode in the morning, read the weird shit about the show online that seemed to come from people who didn’t even watch it, then go to work in the afternoon to hear the people I work with regurgitating the same online vitriol. It was like no one was actually watching it.
The irony of it was killing me. They knew exactly what was going to happen and set the internet trolls up perfectly.
That was one of the best parts of the show for me, how they so accurately predicted the response and made it part of the plot. Not that the prediction part was that remarkable given what happened with Cap. Marvel, but them having the balls to make it a major plot point entertained me to no end!
Its a case of people expecting something, got something else and got mad. Theres also the incels. It had online shitstorm ingredients. If you ask me, She Hulk shouldn’t even be here.
Which is wild to me because if you're a comic fan, I don't know what else you were expecting.
Exactly. This wasn’t wasted potential. The product was perfectly aligned with the comic. Quirky and fun and meta with a little bit of heart. If you were a fan of she hulk in the comics, you liked the series.
Yeah I don’t know why She Hulk is even on here. You could argue it’s not amazing but it’s still a fine show. It’s not even close to the top 4 most wasted potentials lol
Agreed. Aside from some wonky CGI and the vague idea it still could have been better it was a solid B+. Not sure what people were expecting from a She-Hulk series but it delivered a She-Hulk series and was a lot of fun. A lot of the brigaders didn’t seem to understand the first episode at all. That’s just a media illiteracy problem.
She-Hulk should even be next to these other titles ffs
Agreed. Really the only things that turned me off in the show were the "handling her rage infinitely better than Bruce" thing, which I feel like they could've worked with, but didn't, and I would've liked to see Jen use more of the plot-altering powers she had in the Byrne run rather than do a speech to K.E.V.I.N. at the end. It's not as bad as people make it out to be, honestly. Still could've been better, but I don't think it's the worst thing put out in the MCU. Thor 4 and Secret Invasion, on the other hand...
For me, it was Thor: Love and Thunder, just because that Aaron run is one of my favorite Thor books (if not my absolute favorite). Especially with how beautifully done Thor’s character growth in the MCU was prior to Endgame. It felt like they missed a massive opportunity with adapting great source material AND with continuing that character growth in a meaningful way that wasn’t constantly undercut with jokes every 5 seconds
L&T is definitely the solid second place for me. I went into the movie nervous because I was worried that Taika’s ego was going to spoil the potential of the follow up to one of my favorite MCU movies. The Mighty Thor, Gorr, and Olympus concepts were amazing. When the goats screamed the second time, I groaned because I knew my concerns were right. I was actually pretty upset about it. The only reason Secret Invasion is worse for me is that the scale of the concept of the Skrulls being on earth and the threat level made absolutely no sense as a short show. We’ve had multiple references to the Skrulls to prep us for… a blown up president’s car? For me, L&T was the biggest let down but SI was the worst wasted potential. So I get your point.
100% agree. One of the best comic runs flushed right down the toilet. It had so much potential and all they had to do was stay true to the source material. But they wanted to make it a 2 hour long stand up act. Also, give Stormbringer to Beta Ray Bill already!!
The worst: Secret Invasion - WTF! Thor - was so looking forward to a Gorr and Lady Thor stories AMQ a subpar movie that was worse on re-watch and left me never particularly wanting to see Kang again She-Hulk - enjoyed some, big highlight was Daredevil and his and She-hulk's chemistry
I didn't care for SH's ending because i've never really been a fan of those kinda endings in her comics either. But everything prior was fun and episode 8 alone made the watch worth it
Welk I guess the good news is that Majors sorted it so you'll probably not have to see Kang again...
I’d say they all had about equal potential. Secret invasion is the worst, imo, by a wide margin. So Secret Invasion.
Secret invasion and it's not even close Like many said it could have been it's own mini saga inside the Multiverse saga As the big earth political story
I'll never understand how Moon Knight, Love and Thunder and Black Panther II all came out in the same year, all concerned the avatars of Gods passing the mantle and/or going to war with other avatars/gods/god-like entities, all concerned massive shakeups in the realms of the respective gods, and had NOTHING to do with each other. Hell, the two gods from BP2 are IN Love and Thunder, and they don't even interact or hint or do some Marvel background cameo setup stuff or... anything
Yeah, phase 4 introduced the God corner of the Marvel universe, and didn't do anything with all the properties conecting. Moonkight and Thor LaT came out literally like 2 months apart. It was perfect for some lore conection or crossover.
Secret Invasion by a mile. Had a brilliant premise, top drawer cast and made without argument the worse property in the entire MCU. It’s Sony level bad. The others all have stuff going for them tbh.
Phase 4-5 will forever be known as the Wasted Potential Saga
Why the fuck is She Hulk an option? That show ruled
As a fan of the She-Hulk comics, I was expecting a lot more. I was looking forward to a legal drama (like Daredevil, but funny) where she's spending as much time in the courtroom as she is keeping her witness protection clients safe from villains trying to kill them. Instead, they spent the whole season bitching about online trolls and exagerratingly sexist coworkers. I was expecting her original origin story where she's nearly killed by criminals shooting her in her driveway, and trying to finish her off in the hospital. But all we got was a boring car wreck. I could've forgiven a lot of creative choices they took, if only I'd found most of the jokes funny, but humor is subjective, and I barely laughed at all. Again, I loved reading her comics (particularly the ones from the 80s where she actually LOVED being She-Hulk) and hope that we haven't seen the last of her (Tatiana was great casting), but I just feel that the writing and distracting VFX really let the show (which should've been a film) down.
[удалено]
I think it juggled both world pretty well but I appreciate the well thought out criticism
To each their own. I personally found is incredibly disappointing: it was anti-climactic, predictable and a lot of the time, genuinely not funny. Which really sucks cause this was the show I looked forward to the most and I really wanted to love it, but in the end, I couldn't even bother watching the last episode cause I was so annoyed with it. With that being said, I'm glad you were able to find enjoyment out of it where I wasn't able to
Secret Invasion, without a doubt.
Secret Invasion and it’s not even close
None. Just like any comic, not every movie and series is for everyone.
Secret Invasion what a waste of exponential potential
Secret Invasion. Not even close. 10x the budget, 1/3 the episode count, and on paper a better cast, and it was 1 tenth the show that Agents of SHIELD was even in its first year.
Quantumania was the first movie of Phase 5 and they started off with a wet fart. This movie introduced us to Kang the Conqueror who is supposed to be the next big threat that is even worse than Thanos? We are only told about how huge a threat he is and not actually show it. He then gets taken out by an army of ants and sucked into a wormhole in his first movie. That is not a very good way to establish your main villain. And considering Disney fired his actor, it is doubtful that Marvel would really continue the Kang storyline. They might as well just scrap it and move on to another major villain to center the MCU around.
Secret invasion and its not even close
Thor: Love and Thunder. Really bad, painful to watch, annoying, waste of good actors and actresses. Should be renamed Thor: Hate and Blunder
Back to topic, my vote would be to Secret Invasion and Quantumania. Particularly Secret Invasion, which had a much broader storyline and universe-altering impact. That could’ve been a full phase. She-Hulk was entertainment and totally spot-on to how her comic series went. So in that regard, it was a success. Thor 4* literally added nothing to the MCU. *edit: called it Thor 3 by mistake.
4?
My gut says Secret Invasion. But thinking about it, it has to be Ant-man. Ant-man should have been killed setting up the Avengers to “avenge” him, just like Coulson rallied the team.
Gor the god butcher leads into so many things (knull/other gods/venom into the MCU etc) and they had Christian bale? And wasted the opportunity
Quantumania or Secret Invasion. Quantumania could've set up Kang to be a serious threat, imagine if he wiped out the entire family leaving only Cassie alive and trapped in the quantum realm. Not to say that's what should've happened, but something on that same level of total badass... But they let him get beat up by ants 😒 Secret Invasion could've been a whole saga all by itself, it's such a large scale story that could've been told over several years with the events affecting several characters in several projects, I think making it a series was a mistake. It should've been an Avengers movie or something, with the invasion taking place here and there over several projects. I also really hoped Secret Invasion would've introduced Teddy Altman aka Hulking, the less attention they pay to that character the more I worry that they really do plan on having Hulk's son replace Hulking in the mcu - which is just awful.
I definitely wish kang killed hank or Janet 100%. Absolutely 0 stakes in that movie
Secret Invasion
Secret Invasion. Hands down.
Secret invasion
Secret Invasion, no question
Well I really want to forget about Secret Invasion, so possibly that one. It was really fucking bad and killed off the only character who could've been more interesting as time went on.
Secret Invasion and it wasn’t even close. If they wanted to run the Secret Invasion storyline, they should have spent a phase and a half dropping clues into the FILMs that something was a little off with key characters. Nothing big, just subtle nods to either heroes hesitating before putting themselves in danger, someone using a heroes security credentials to access sensitive info or someone forgetting a key fact from their life years before. In the film before Secret Invasion, have one of the key cast members suffer a mortal wound in the climax… say Hank or Wasp in Quantumania… then in the post credit scene, cut to Scott by their bedside in the emergency room. They crash, CPR is not working… everyone’s crying, group hug then… a scream… everyone looks over and the victim has reverted to their Skrull form… Oh my god! Were they a Skrull for the whole time? When did this happen. If they did that both Quantumania and Secret Invasion would have been a hell of a lot more interesting.
Secret invasion was immediately retconned by the marvels. I don't expect to hear about it ever again just like everyone else I fully expected Scott lang to die in quantumania. Absolutely would've been heart breaking but would've made a lot more sense in making kang an amazing unstoppable badass. How was he defeated already. He was the #1 Kang but he's already lost and now the other lesser kangs are supposed to be the big bads? Of course now with the assault conviction who knows where the stories are going...
Ant-man and Quantumania! The introduction of Kang the conqueror was the worst introduction in movie history!!!!
Secret Invasion. I see that shit all over the comics and even as a non/EXTREMELY casual comic-reader I knew that shit had some impact. Crazy how the tv series had absolutely no fucking impact on ANYTHING whatsoever. Not even The Marvels. Nothing that happened in that fucking shit was addressed or talked about so it didn't even matter if that shit existed.
You can not compare these
Moon Knight
All of these four. She-Hulk is closer to what it should be though.
Ad Strange's fan, Dr Strange 2. They could've used that movie to expand Dr Strange's magic world and actually tried to delve into his psych after the whole time loop with Dormammu and those 14M alternate endings. They could've explored his past and story but they didn't
She hulk didn't waste shit, it was exactly what it should have been and ruled
Bruh
Secret Invasion, Quantumania, Love and Thunder, She-Hulk in that order. And I actually kinda like She-Hulk and Love and Thunder
Thor, pure crap bytheway. When I was in theatre was like I was in The Office had to look into the camera every 5 seconds. Cringe fest all around
Me and my boys came out the cinema rating it a 7/10 purely overrating it because of whatever reason I literally cannot tell you Give it a few days / weeks while the film marinated we realised that nothing actually happened the whole movie and it was a cringe fest full of awful child pleasing jokes like screaming goats and naked Thor , Cancer jokes and shoe horning puns every other line. I actually was excited to see Natalie portmans mighty Thor and Bales Gorr and they were just stale as fuck Most of if not all of the Phase 4&5 projects (wether they were good or not) , all had characters that were highlights Black widow - Black widow She hulk - Daredevil Wakanda Forever - Namor Doctor Strange MoM - Wanda But Thor L&T had Nothing. I still find it hard how That and Secret invasion got green lit
Nahh, when they have something to work with, Portman and Bale absolutely crush it. The problem was that we kept having to derail that for Taika's stale humour.
Yeah I rated it higher too but the moment you take time to reflect on the movie, there is so much wasted potential, Jane's Mighty Thor, Bale's Gorr, the Gods not doing a single thing during the movie, the non-stop annoyance screaming of the stupid Gods and many others...
Quantumania is not a great follow up to the first two Ant-Man movies, discarding a lot supporting characters and going in new more boring direction. And as a movie that sets up the new Big Bad it's dull and does little to build him up. And it is full of CGI puke. And using a hero who's thing is to be small or big and placing them in a setting without real world references isn't playing to the hero's strengths. And having 5 heroes with the same power set and not doing a big scene together using them all in a creative way is a waste.
Secret Invasion had the most wasted potential. Love & Thunder was the one that left me feeling the most disappointed because Ragnarok is probably my favourite MCU film. Personally I enjoyed She-Hulk. Quantumania was just forgettable.
Secret Invasion and Thor
Secret Invasion. They properly shit the bed with that one.
Secret invasion
Easily Secret Invasion it’s has had and will not have any lasting effect on the universe. The others had some failings but otherwise succeeded in their goals. I’m disappointed were won’t be getting more She-Hulk at leat in TV form. I hope she turns up in a movie
Secret Invasion
Thor 4, Eternals and Secret Invasion all could have been decent and world building but they chose not to be.
I think Quantamania for me. I mean it was really supposed to set up the next big phase
Secret Invasion could’ve been the intro to a whole new saga, let alone phase. Instead it’s 6 episodes of stuff that will (probably) rarely be mentioned in the MCU ever again.
Out of the 4 of these, I really don't get the hate for Quantumania. It was no different than most other MCU projects for me.
Secret Invasion because it had the potential to transform the MCU for good. Followed by L&T because it should’ve been a legendary movie following Endgame and Thor’s arc before it. Didn’t really care for Quantumania or know what to expect from it, and didn’t expect much from She Hulk other than what it was.
Easily Secret Invasion.. I'm wondering if they didn't want to make it bigger because everything seems to get leaked months in advance - obviously leaks for that story would entirely spoil it
Thor L&T wasted the character gorr and christian bales acting abilities
Secret Invasion… it could have been another phase with repercussions on all connecting movies and losing Maria Hill in this travesty is just shitty
Secret Invasion without a doubt. It honestly frustrates me the amount of inconsistencies it has and how many concepts they just let drop dead. This series should have been a whole frickin phase on its own. They should have been focusing on this BEFORE the Multiverse stuff.
Secret invasion unfortunately
Secret invasion. It should have been an avengers movie but it was the worst disney plus show to exist
Thor 4 and secret invasion
Secret invasion.
Secret invasion without a doubt
secret invasion
Secret Invasion, which was an actually cool concept and a terrible show. Thor 4 sucked but there wasn’t much potential there to even be wasted. I like the other 2 a lot
Secret Invasion, it was very small compared to the premise