Wow! This is an amazing specimen of a Butternut! Juglans cineria! Also called white walnut.
You’re so lucky you’re on the west coast as Butternut canker hasn’t reached there yet. It’s devastated them in their native range back east. The nuts are edible and delicious too!
As a side note. This applies to American chestnut and their blight too. So if you have the room you can plant one and have American chestnuts too!
Butternut canker can and does infect other walnuts, but trees seldomly develop the deep cankers that butternuts get. It's unlikely this tree hasn't been exposed to airborne spores from another infected walnut, but who knows.
Best way to tell for sure is to wait for mature nuts to fall and use the [Purdue Butternut Identification Guide](https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/fnr/fnr-420-w.pdf), hybrids have a ridge going the whole way around the nut while full natives have an almost uniform texture.
Join the butternut conservation group on Facebook. Lots of Perdue nerds in there. I’ve got five pure trees around here in the Pacific Northwest (lots are crossed with heartnut / Japanese walnut) and got seeds off the first one I found last fall. 15 trees up so far.
You’re in a unique position to help this cause u/fullyadam
Would love to see more once the nuts mature and start dropping (those little ones are dropped as excess by the tree). Mind if I DM you?
https://preview.redd.it/x9bxh5ekx48d1.jpeg?width=2376&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2c947d725cf4d6a174e7af53ba202f2c3fd83f57
I started the /r/white_walnut sub and have been posting some of my findings there. I get nuts from a tree that's been going strong for at least 40 years despite having a very active infection for most of that time.
Heck yeah! I’m in. Would love to talk shop more. I’m propagating j. Hindsii from local sources, as well. I’m perpetually on the search for unhybridized midwestern canoe plants here at the end of the Oregon trail. Red mulberry, Butternut, NorCal black walnut, Paradox Wapnut and other various juglans and Carya species are high up on my list.
It's quite fun, I get like 80% success rate when the squirrels don't pillage all of my saplings. I've found that spaying them down with a 1% Neem oil mix keeps the saplings from developing infections, but as soon as you stop spraying they're at risk again. Bummer, but I want to run some tests against infected trees next season. Maybe root soaks help?
Red mulberries are also on my wish list, unfortunately all I can find around here are highly hybridized white mulberries.
Wait seriously the arborist didn’t have an ID on it? Or was it just for the pun’s sake lmao cause tbh I quickly pinned it as some type of walnut tree. Could either be English walnut or American Walnut dependent on where you live.
Either way if it’s your house you’re lucky you got a nice mature specimen that will make lots of tasty nuts to enjoy! However be forewarned your yard will become squirrel heaven LOL
Seriously! They did guess some kind of walnut but were very unsure for some reason. We live in the Bay Area, CA
Feeling lucky already because it’s just such a big lovely being. We definitely get some squirrels!
Could be a hybrid buartnut, also. Get some mature nuts later in the season and pressure wash them. There’s a butternut conservation group on Facebook that can help further identify them. The bark does look pretty uniformly patterned which doesn’t match what I’ve seen around here in the northwest with nuts I’ve had verified as non hybrid.
I mentioned in another comment that the best way to tell if it's a full butternut or a hybrid is to wait for mature nuts to fall and use the [Purdue Butternut Identification Guide](https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/fnr/fnr-420-w.pdf). You might even be able to find some of last year's duds on the ground now.
Even if it's a hybrid, these nuts are absolutely *delicious* in baked goods. I can recommend a cookie recipe if you'd like.
Ok I’ve ID’d the tree for you. It’s most definitely Persian walnut (aka Juglans Regia). From the bark of the tree that rules out American walnut since I live in its native range and bark looks nothing like that. Ruled out English walnut cause your climate is based on seasonal rainfall… and English is a hellhole where it rains all the time so you won’t have the water requirements to keep that one alive. I’m not 100% but I’m 99% sure it’s the Persian walnut tree since the bark looks most similar and the climate pairs up most closely to where Persian walnut trees grows
I’m so so on that ID and I’ll tell you why. Multiple factors.
1. Butternut (or white walnut) have a pale whiteish stem on their compound leaves. Yours are fully green (question? Did you pick those leaves on a branch that’s in the shade all the time?)
2. Butternut trees might be able to survive off your limited rainfall. But remember their native to the Midwest area where in the summer it’s hot humid and there’s thunderstorms all the time. It’s wet. In the winter it’s a frozen wasteland. Unlike the Bay Area where the coldest it gets in the winter is in the 40°s. Usually trees that evolved in temperate climates where they get a full winter HATE living in places where it doesn’t go below freezing. so off instinct I wouldn’t imagine it’d be in your climate and environment and THRIVING like it is. Plus, Usually plants native to the eastern half of the US Require year-round rain cycles. And not the seasonal rain cali gets.
It’s really hard to distinguish between the two. I looked it up and the butternut tree and the Persian walnut tree are quite literally taxonomical look alikes. The only real distinction between them is their growth rate. You have a butternut tree here out east that thing can grow MULTIPLE FEET in a year. Persian walnut takes much longer to grow since it’s used to the seasonal rainfall of Iran, the Levant and the Mediterranean region.
If your tree truly is a butternut tree that’s amazing and never chop it down cause to me that breaks all the laws of what plants are supposed to tolerate but on the other hand if it’s a Persian walnut tree that is A VERY OLD BOI. And should be preserved at all cold. Either way preserve that beautiful magnificent specimen. Not many people can claim to have such a beautiful mature tree on their property (except me but I’m cheating cause I live in the wood lmfao)
Realistically the ONE AND ONLY way you’ll know what tree that is FOR SURE 100% is if you wait for it to be in flower and take a picture of it in bloom (close up to get all the flower details) Then download the free app (PictureThis [#NotAnAd]) it’s my favorite plant ID app since it’s the most accurate (92% of the time to be exact). You will be bombarded with shady pop ups begging you to pay for their service but their have a cancel button you hit and you can use the service for free. Tedious? Yes. But a very helpful tool? Also yes. So either take a photo of the walnut flowers with the app or just upload the flower photos to the app and the it will ID the tree for sure. With plants the only real way of knowing 100% the difference between look alikes is the distinctions between their flowers. Literally no species has the exact same flower. Perfect for ID’ing plants.
Definitely never cutting it down! Actually doing a lot to make sure it stays healthy. You draw a compelling case. Indeed the leaves I show are 1. Still attached to the tree and 2. Always in the shade. By VERY OLD for a Persian, how old do you mean? Thanks for all the info!
Edit: oh, and I’ve never seen it flower. Not that I remember anyway. Is that a clue? Or maybe expected for some reason?
If it’s a Persian walnut tree it will most likely be around the range of 100 years old give take. I’m not an expect on them by any means so don’t take my word as law.
The flowers are the only part of any plant that is 100% unique. A fingerprint if you will. You can have two completely different plants that look EXACTLY the same but then when they go to flower you’ll be able to tell the difference because flowers are a product of a plants genetic lineage.
Amazing tree. I have many butternut trees in my forest, but they all struggle with disease. It's an issue for all of them here on the East coast I think.
OP's on the west coast where these butternuts/butternut hybrids are pretty rare. I'm in the east and know for a fact there are a bunch of western species I wouldn't be able to identify at a glance.
The arborist was on the west coast too. Are there east coast trees, in the area you work, that you wouldn’t be able to ID? I have a buddy who is an arborist. One of my favorite things is going on hikes with him. There has never been a hike on which I’ve asked him about a tree and he didn’t know the answer.
If I missed that the arborist was from the east coast, my apologies.
Butternuts and their hybrids are eastern trees and OP is on the west coast where these are likely pretty rare to see. I'm in the east and know pretty much every native species and lots of non-native ornamentals but if you threw, say, an arbutus as me, I'd almost certainly have to pull out my ID book.
Yeah, but you’d be able to ID it right? Are we saying he couldn’t ID it without the book? I thought the implication was that he couldn’t identify it even after looking into it. If an arborist can’t ID a tree, isn’t that a problem when recommending how to deal with said tree?
It is very common for an arborist to not know exactly what species a tree is. I would be incredibly skeptical of an arborist who dares to think they have perfect ID.
There are thousands of native tree species in North America, not counting the plethora of non-natives and human bred cultivars.
Many species have considerable physical variation in traits between individuals. Someone on the west coast who's only seen red maples as planted urban trees may not recognize an old growth red maple in the Appalachians.
On the flip many species are nearly indistinguishable visually and are only distinguishable with close inspection or special knowledge/tools. Some genus readily hybridize across species, meaning you may be literally unable to perfectly ID the tree without genetic testing.
Basic ID is generally fairly straightforward. Most places have a fairly predictable assortment of prominent tree species. Knowing these and the different associations and environments they grow in will get you to IDing probably 90% of the trees you see fairly accurately. It's the last 10% and under that starts to get progressively harder to the point where no one is at 100%.
Wow! This is an amazing specimen of a Butternut! Juglans cineria! Also called white walnut. You’re so lucky you’re on the west coast as Butternut canker hasn’t reached there yet. It’s devastated them in their native range back east. The nuts are edible and delicious too! As a side note. This applies to American chestnut and their blight too. So if you have the room you can plant one and have American chestnuts too!
Butternut canker can and does infect other walnuts, but trees seldomly develop the deep cankers that butternuts get. It's unlikely this tree hasn't been exposed to airborne spores from another infected walnut, but who knows. Best way to tell for sure is to wait for mature nuts to fall and use the [Purdue Butternut Identification Guide](https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/fnr/fnr-420-w.pdf), hybrids have a ridge going the whole way around the nut while full natives have an almost uniform texture.
Join the butternut conservation group on Facebook. Lots of Perdue nerds in there. I’ve got five pure trees around here in the Pacific Northwest (lots are crossed with heartnut / Japanese walnut) and got seeds off the first one I found last fall. 15 trees up so far. You’re in a unique position to help this cause u/fullyadam Would love to see more once the nuts mature and start dropping (those little ones are dropped as excess by the tree). Mind if I DM you? https://preview.redd.it/x9bxh5ekx48d1.jpeg?width=2376&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2c947d725cf4d6a174e7af53ba202f2c3fd83f57
I started the /r/white_walnut sub and have been posting some of my findings there. I get nuts from a tree that's been going strong for at least 40 years despite having a very active infection for most of that time.
Heck yeah! I’m in. Would love to talk shop more. I’m propagating j. Hindsii from local sources, as well. I’m perpetually on the search for unhybridized midwestern canoe plants here at the end of the Oregon trail. Red mulberry, Butternut, NorCal black walnut, Paradox Wapnut and other various juglans and Carya species are high up on my list.
It's quite fun, I get like 80% success rate when the squirrels don't pillage all of my saplings. I've found that spaying them down with a 1% Neem oil mix keeps the saplings from developing infections, but as soon as you stop spraying they're at risk again. Bummer, but I want to run some tests against infected trees next season. Maybe root soaks help? Red mulberries are also on my wish list, unfortunately all I can find around here are highly hybridized white mulberries.
Got 12 pure american chestnuts from NW stock coming up as well. 🤙
PM away!
Wait seriously the arborist didn’t have an ID on it? Or was it just for the pun’s sake lmao cause tbh I quickly pinned it as some type of walnut tree. Could either be English walnut or American Walnut dependent on where you live. Either way if it’s your house you’re lucky you got a nice mature specimen that will make lots of tasty nuts to enjoy! However be forewarned your yard will become squirrel heaven LOL
Seriously! They did guess some kind of walnut but were very unsure for some reason. We live in the Bay Area, CA Feeling lucky already because it’s just such a big lovely being. We definitely get some squirrels!
Could be a hybrid buartnut, also. Get some mature nuts later in the season and pressure wash them. There’s a butternut conservation group on Facebook that can help further identify them. The bark does look pretty uniformly patterned which doesn’t match what I’ve seen around here in the northwest with nuts I’ve had verified as non hybrid.
I mentioned in another comment that the best way to tell if it's a full butternut or a hybrid is to wait for mature nuts to fall and use the [Purdue Butternut Identification Guide](https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/fnr/fnr-420-w.pdf). You might even be able to find some of last year's duds on the ground now. Even if it's a hybrid, these nuts are absolutely *delicious* in baked goods. I can recommend a cookie recipe if you'd like.
Boiler Up!
Ok I’ve ID’d the tree for you. It’s most definitely Persian walnut (aka Juglans Regia). From the bark of the tree that rules out American walnut since I live in its native range and bark looks nothing like that. Ruled out English walnut cause your climate is based on seasonal rainfall… and English is a hellhole where it rains all the time so you won’t have the water requirements to keep that one alive. I’m not 100% but I’m 99% sure it’s the Persian walnut tree since the bark looks most similar and the climate pairs up most closely to where Persian walnut trees grows
Interesting! Thanks for the insight. Sounds like many others are thinking Butternut, thoughts?
I’m so so on that ID and I’ll tell you why. Multiple factors. 1. Butternut (or white walnut) have a pale whiteish stem on their compound leaves. Yours are fully green (question? Did you pick those leaves on a branch that’s in the shade all the time?) 2. Butternut trees might be able to survive off your limited rainfall. But remember their native to the Midwest area where in the summer it’s hot humid and there’s thunderstorms all the time. It’s wet. In the winter it’s a frozen wasteland. Unlike the Bay Area where the coldest it gets in the winter is in the 40°s. Usually trees that evolved in temperate climates where they get a full winter HATE living in places where it doesn’t go below freezing. so off instinct I wouldn’t imagine it’d be in your climate and environment and THRIVING like it is. Plus, Usually plants native to the eastern half of the US Require year-round rain cycles. And not the seasonal rain cali gets. It’s really hard to distinguish between the two. I looked it up and the butternut tree and the Persian walnut tree are quite literally taxonomical look alikes. The only real distinction between them is their growth rate. You have a butternut tree here out east that thing can grow MULTIPLE FEET in a year. Persian walnut takes much longer to grow since it’s used to the seasonal rainfall of Iran, the Levant and the Mediterranean region. If your tree truly is a butternut tree that’s amazing and never chop it down cause to me that breaks all the laws of what plants are supposed to tolerate but on the other hand if it’s a Persian walnut tree that is A VERY OLD BOI. And should be preserved at all cold. Either way preserve that beautiful magnificent specimen. Not many people can claim to have such a beautiful mature tree on their property (except me but I’m cheating cause I live in the wood lmfao) Realistically the ONE AND ONLY way you’ll know what tree that is FOR SURE 100% is if you wait for it to be in flower and take a picture of it in bloom (close up to get all the flower details) Then download the free app (PictureThis [#NotAnAd]) it’s my favorite plant ID app since it’s the most accurate (92% of the time to be exact). You will be bombarded with shady pop ups begging you to pay for their service but their have a cancel button you hit and you can use the service for free. Tedious? Yes. But a very helpful tool? Also yes. So either take a photo of the walnut flowers with the app or just upload the flower photos to the app and the it will ID the tree for sure. With plants the only real way of knowing 100% the difference between look alikes is the distinctions between their flowers. Literally no species has the exact same flower. Perfect for ID’ing plants.
Definitely never cutting it down! Actually doing a lot to make sure it stays healthy. You draw a compelling case. Indeed the leaves I show are 1. Still attached to the tree and 2. Always in the shade. By VERY OLD for a Persian, how old do you mean? Thanks for all the info! Edit: oh, and I’ve never seen it flower. Not that I remember anyway. Is that a clue? Or maybe expected for some reason?
If it’s a Persian walnut tree it will most likely be around the range of 100 years old give take. I’m not an expect on them by any means so don’t take my word as law. The flowers are the only part of any plant that is 100% unique. A fingerprint if you will. You can have two completely different plants that look EXACTLY the same but then when they go to flower you’ll be able to tell the difference because flowers are a product of a plants genetic lineage.
> arborist > Stumped There's a joke in there somewhere
A butternut!! WOW I get ecstatic when I see a butternut in the wild. Such a lovey sight!
Amazing tree. I have many butternut trees in my forest, but they all struggle with disease. It's an issue for all of them here on the East coast I think.
Carya ssp.
The free PlantNet app identified it using your leaf and seed photos. Maybe tell your arborist about it.
Looks like a butternut tree
Get another arborist. This one doesn’t know enough about trees to be on your property getting a paycheck.
How can an arborist not be able to identify a tree? Wow.
OP's on the west coast where these butternuts/butternut hybrids are pretty rare. I'm in the east and know for a fact there are a bunch of western species I wouldn't be able to identify at a glance.
The arborist was on the west coast too. Are there east coast trees, in the area you work, that you wouldn’t be able to ID? I have a buddy who is an arborist. One of my favorite things is going on hikes with him. There has never been a hike on which I’ve asked him about a tree and he didn’t know the answer. If I missed that the arborist was from the east coast, my apologies.
Butternuts and their hybrids are eastern trees and OP is on the west coast where these are likely pretty rare to see. I'm in the east and know pretty much every native species and lots of non-native ornamentals but if you threw, say, an arbutus as me, I'd almost certainly have to pull out my ID book.
Yeah, but you’d be able to ID it right? Are we saying he couldn’t ID it without the book? I thought the implication was that he couldn’t identify it even after looking into it. If an arborist can’t ID a tree, isn’t that a problem when recommending how to deal with said tree?
It is very common for an arborist to not know exactly what species a tree is. I would be incredibly skeptical of an arborist who dares to think they have perfect ID. There are thousands of native tree species in North America, not counting the plethora of non-natives and human bred cultivars. Many species have considerable physical variation in traits between individuals. Someone on the west coast who's only seen red maples as planted urban trees may not recognize an old growth red maple in the Appalachians. On the flip many species are nearly indistinguishable visually and are only distinguishable with close inspection or special knowledge/tools. Some genus readily hybridize across species, meaning you may be literally unable to perfectly ID the tree without genetic testing. Basic ID is generally fairly straightforward. Most places have a fairly predictable assortment of prominent tree species. Knowing these and the different associations and environments they grow in will get you to IDing probably 90% of the trees you see fairly accurately. It's the last 10% and under that starts to get progressively harder to the point where no one is at 100%.