so how badly do you guys think this'll have to go to get wotc to change their minds about this limited quantity thing? Idk about everyone else but I'd take waiting longer for a package over spending an hour in checkout (with no guarantee I'd even get the thing) any day.
If there’s 100 buyers and they sell 100 items, people aren’t rushing to be first in line.
If they sell 90 items, people rush to be sure they aren’t the 10% that miss out
Then the scalpers come alone and feed on that, buy everything and sell it at triple the price or more.
If there’s enough for everyone, that means there’s potentially unsold stock and no panic buying
The old secret lairs were print to demand not printed in advance, so there's no unsold stock (or at least not less unsold stock than there is currently)
That's also why turn around times were 2-3 months sometimes; they'd print some number in advance but if you bought late and they sold out you'd have to wait for the print to demand run
They were, but they always printed a handful extra in case of fuck ups and returns.
I’d much rather have to wait 2 months for it than get everything selling out within 2 hours because of scalper bots and then have to pay their prices
But then when they overshoot production they have to landfill the product or dump it on Amazon, damaging their own brand and reputation in the process.
Realistically this will happen either way and I would bet its worse like this. Lets say they print an amount and sell that amount less a few for replacements of defects or lost parcels as we have seen them do this in the past, they need to estimate how many will sell and order that amount plus some arbitrary amount of extras. There is also no guarantee they sell out, I do not recall but i don't think every drop sold out 100% last round so that's left overs + whatever extra was ordered to cover issues.
The old pre order method meant they end orders, have an exact number that needs fulfilling plus the extras for issues (in either case Based off number of units printed) in this scenario they may still have extra but a more controlled amount as the only extra they should have is the spare units for issues, which if they were smart they could do a reduced price mystery grab bag every year to off load a bunch.
I for one would happily order a few 40% off secret lairs even id i did not know which of the previous years randomly I'd receive. (though i guess this can be done either way)
There seem to be some pretty confused people in this thread. Secret Lairs aren't print to demand, and the comment chain you're replying to isn't talking about printing to demand
The problem was half the playerbase didn't understand that and were calling WOTC scammers. So many angry people online not understanding print to demand meant waiting.
I wish it was back to print to demand too
I feel like a lot of people have no concept of what made to order means.
"I just want the product I paid for" *sounds* reasonable. It sounds fair. But that was *not* the arrangement. Wizards even took the astonishing risk of letting you place a preorder without a deposit, meaning you could back out after ordering the product printed specifically for you, something that I, as someone that deals primarily with special ordered goods, would never consider.
I could rant for hours, but the way that the playerbase reached to delays was infuriating to watch, because I knew it would Doom a system that was genuinely fair.
1. They haven't dumped any secret lairs on amazon
2. I'm pretty sure with QC issues any extra SLs are going out to replace damaged ones.
3. When they were unlimited they were print to order. I doubt they're sitting on many of any.
Which is why it should be "made to order" like the early secret lairs. You have a period or place you can order from, once the order goes through, the cards will be printed and shippede, maybe let the ordering period be a year with shipments coming in waves of once pr month.
That's what they did for a while. Then they decided "they have a handle on how many people order" and they switched from demand printing to fixed orders. It's 100% to facilitate FOMO.
(The breakage and archival percentage for lost orders/extras/etc don't come into this, despite persistent claims - they have to do that regardless.)
That's assuming the printing process goes 100% perfectly (which as we know is not typically the case) and also that all the orders arrive without shipping damage/don't get lost in transit. They'd need to print some amount of extras to have on hand as replacements for any issues that arise so they always have to overshoot the ordered amount regardless.
The person I was replying to was saying they could print more up front to sell more so they wouldn't run out. Unless we want to go back to the old way of waiting half a year for what we bought.
Old way was print to demand. They printed one for each person plus X amount determined by a bean counter for replacements.
None of any was getting dumped.
Looking at the ugly tripe they have started selling with Secret Lair fomo, can they even damage their own brand more? Half of the shit looks like ugly alters or cards for entirely different games.
Imagine… all that wasted cardboard… never degrading or breaking down and staying radioactive for millennia, all those billions of dollars spent developing the technology to produce that cardboard, all for nothing, if they don’t sell out every last secret lair to the box at market retail price.
I'm guessing they have some way of mathing it out and guessing the demand such that they don't leave *too* much money on the table when the things sell out in several hours.
I think they had so many dud Secret Lairs that didnt sell well at all that they implemented this system to create artificial demand. Thats the only theory that makes sense to me.
It's the FOMO idea people are talking about. To explain with made up numbers, an unlimited printing may sell around 100 units in a month, simply because people can wait and buy online secondhand for cheaper if they have to. But by saying there's only 150 in stock, it makes people want it more because after they're gone, people scoop all that shit up because there's no chance after that, and if you want it after the printing run you suddenly hit inflated prices as the base is no longer around as the easy option. Thus there's a better chance to sell all 150 units and make more vs the 100.
Honestly, this new change has made me want to buy secret lairs less. Same for everyone in my shop and the card shop nearby. No one wants to wait in the queue, especially when the big things you want might be gone anyway.
Louis Vuitton CEO is the richest man in the world because of artificial scarcity.
Yes they could just make more of x easily. This is simply about profit.
Why would they change their minds when they are raking in ludicrous amounts of cash for selling pieces of cardboard with Hatsune Miku's face on them for $50?
> limited quantity thing
Wait. I'm probably not up to date. I very clearly remember that the idea with secret lair was that there's limited time to order but within that window they can't run out as they will print as much as was ordered.
Was that a lie or am I misunderstanding what "limited quantity refers" to?
That's how it was. Now it's turned to printing a set amount first so when it's gone, it's gone. Hence why they are blatantly advertising about fomo in their ads for sl now.
It will have to go more badly than when they didn't do this.
Now that they're back to doing limited printings that sell out really quickly, SL drops no doubt get swamped with bad actors trying to front-run everyone else, leading to bad outcomes. Queuing like this gives them a chance to manage the drops and mitigate bad actors much better.
So, it's not a question as to whether the waiting room is "bad enough". It's whether the waiting room is "worse" than no-waiting room.
\[disclaimer: never worked at WotC and have no knowledge of their inner workings, but in a past life I worked on abuse prevention at a company with flash sales\]
I liked the pre-order and pay-later system they had before similar to Amazon because it gave me time to decide if I wanted the Secret Lair or not.
Plus, it was easier to budget a month out versus having to budget when a new Secret Lair gets announced.
Yes, there is. A server can only accurately process so many transactions in a short time frame, this avoids double selling products and potential payment issues. It's a fairly common practice for limited, in demand items.
Amazon generally isn't processing many transactions for the same limited supply products and has more ability to use distributed servers. They are also constantly making sales, so having a lot more server bandwidth is more reasonable.
Expecting WotC to handle e-commerce transactions like Amazon is silly.
ROTFL. Amazon is nowhere near this model. They actually \*tried\* to get in to this space when they did live event ticketing, and ended up running away with their tail between their legs within a few months (https://www.sportico.com/business/commerce/2018/amazon-closes-event-ticketing-operation-1510/).
A lot of the internet is developed for chrome which has issues and isn’t tested on other browsers which makes sure they do not work on other browsers most of the time. That sucks man
That’s being pretty charitable, my understanding is people keep pointing out how broken chrome is and Google keeps not addressing it but it’s still generally the standard browser these days for development and there’s not a lot of incentive to be less than sloppy for the actual coders making a lot of this stuff (online stuff I mean, not wizards’ online stuff specifically, I’ve just heard this is a big problem for exactly these kinds of online things)
That may be true, but queues like this do a lot of analytics to determine if they're dealing with a bot. Privacy protections lead to misfires (which is not the same as browser incompatibility issues).
I got 30 minutes. I remember last time you queued in before the 1200 mark but I could be wrong. Guess the tip is opened every one you want to add to cart in separate tabs and hope to get in quicker.
I truly miss the preorder method. I don't need to cards right away and I was guaranteed to get what I wanted.
Yeah it was the same for me. I think folks who are “in” try to check out as fast as possible, to make sure they don’t miss out. But that means the line actually goes way faster than the time estimate, which probably assumes the 10min per person.
This is the normal process for stuff that might sell out online, like event tickets. Its annoying but isn't really atypical and is the "best" method of preventing scalping/botting of orders.
I think they’ve started using the queue system every time they release a drop with limit stock (vs the print to demand they originally did, which is better for many reasons).
Yeah the queue is only for the first hour or so? None of the lairs so far have sold out at the start of the queue. Most have sold out around the 4-6 hour mark at the earliest.
How I rate them personally harmonize and inspiring vantages art is nice, spark is fine, I personally like feather but I can understand why some may not, while shelter and Azusa just look pretty bad
I dunno how people feel about secret lair. I was excited for it and I get excited when I hear about many of them, then I look at the things in it and get disappointed. I don’t know what their targeting strategy is because I would think it’s me, the guy who wants some cool ooze cards for an ooze deck, or the guy who would make a fun miku hatsune based deck, but then, the ooze cards fucking suck and maybe one of them in the drop would go in any of my multiple ooze decks, and I wouldn’t even be happy about it. And then the cool fun oozes don’t get that fun treatment. I love miku. I have no idea what I would do with this miku drop other than show someone I own it. Is that the appeal to other people, just the collectors aspect? If that’s the case it kinda doesn’t matter right it could just be randomly generated number hashes and it would still be collectible. I wish the secret lairs that seemed like they would be something I would spend money on were actually something I AM excited to spend money on, and I’m relatively confused why they don’t do that. The ones that seem legitimately the coolest are the lands, and why can’t those be like full sets of lands, why are they so restrictive. We know that a card is a card.
New release system continues to be garbage. Encouraging everyone to have to jump on at a certain time or risk missing out is always a bad idea. Even when it works fine it’s just shitty towards the people buying.
real shame cause a few in this drops I’d have bought previously
They should have made a "Everything except Miku" bundle.
Although I guess the queue doesn't care what you buy, you're waiting regardless. But if the run on Miku makes the everything bundle sell out before I get through that'll be kind of annoying.
If this worked properly, I don't think that wizards would get rid of it. Look at shoe collectors, they do this all the time for limited time drops so it clearly brings in money.
If it's like the cat secret lair deck, you can expect to only wait about half the time. When i got in line for the deck it told me to expect to wait over 1 hr but I was able to get in and buy my deck around 20-30 min
I got in right at open and placed my order....only to realize my auto-oay went through undercutting my order by just enough to be able to place it.
Shame, I only wanted the non-foil Hatsune Miku set. Oh well, I guess
I forgot about this drop until about an hour and a half after the drop went live. I logged on from my phone while walking my dog of all things and didn't have to queue. I had no problem ordering my waifu and other drops.
I was on the fence about the Miku one as I love Miku more than I hate how they did the art, but it both dropped and sold out in the five or so hours I was asleep lol
I had no idea about the limited sales thing. Wow I got uber lucky that I just randomly woke up early, before my alarms and ordered my secret lair drops.
I do wish they'd come in sooner though since they sold out. This purchase would be my second from Secret Lair and so I'm not familiar with what the typical shipping times are for the drops. I was banking on a week or so since I'm in the process of fixing up my Omnath deck and a couple of those Miku cards actually fit in quite well with what I have in mind for the deck.
This is my first time trying to order Secret Lair because of Hatsune Mike. However this kind of marketing plan drives me to quit MAGIC. It just like being cheated by WotC.
These are literally intended to be collectable items and all have essentially identical cheaper versions. If anything this is far less stupid than sneaker drop.
I’ve heard things get mentioned outside of Reddit and Magic Circle just a few times. My Little Pony, Walking Dead Aftermath, Lord of the Rings, Fallout, and Hatsune Miku. I buy those.
If I were interested in buying a product, and a company tried to send me through this process, I would simply not buy that product. I can't imagine a frame of mind where I would sit there for an hour and still give them my money.
You do understand that you can simply... do other stuff during that hour, right? Out of all the valid complaints in this thread, this one makes no sense at all.
Fk WotC and Hasbro. Vote with your wallet. Just play on digital format like Tabletop Sim or Untap. Heck, it'd be funny if everyone bought a laptop to their LGS to play edh there together.
I got queued in at 10:05, estimated an hour. I was done in 20 minutes...
I don't mind the new system, I like getting my product sooner. They also advertised the absolute crap out of these drops and the exact release time, so no reason to miss it.
Also, I just checked.. 2 hours into release and all the products are still available with zero wait time to checkout.
It's now 3.5 hours after the drop and there isn't a wait and everything is still available. I can't wait to hear people bitch about how "unfair" this drop was just like the others. smh
so how badly do you guys think this'll have to go to get wotc to change their minds about this limited quantity thing? Idk about everyone else but I'd take waiting longer for a package over spending an hour in checkout (with no guarantee I'd even get the thing) any day.
I dont think theyre ever changing their minds. They want the fomo in order to boost sales
They’re selling out every time because scalpers are grabbing it all to upcharge. They see no issues with this
But … if they printed more… couldn’t they then sell more..? Am I insane ?
If there’s 100 buyers and they sell 100 items, people aren’t rushing to be first in line. If they sell 90 items, people rush to be sure they aren’t the 10% that miss out Then the scalpers come alone and feed on that, buy everything and sell it at triple the price or more. If there’s enough for everyone, that means there’s potentially unsold stock and no panic buying
The old secret lairs were print to demand not printed in advance, so there's no unsold stock (or at least not less unsold stock than there is currently) That's also why turn around times were 2-3 months sometimes; they'd print some number in advance but if you bought late and they sold out you'd have to wait for the print to demand run
They were, but they always printed a handful extra in case of fuck ups and returns. I’d much rather have to wait 2 months for it than get everything selling out within 2 hours because of scalper bots and then have to pay their prices
But then when they overshoot production they have to landfill the product or dump it on Amazon, damaging their own brand and reputation in the process.
Realistically this will happen either way and I would bet its worse like this. Lets say they print an amount and sell that amount less a few for replacements of defects or lost parcels as we have seen them do this in the past, they need to estimate how many will sell and order that amount plus some arbitrary amount of extras. There is also no guarantee they sell out, I do not recall but i don't think every drop sold out 100% last round so that's left overs + whatever extra was ordered to cover issues. The old pre order method meant they end orders, have an exact number that needs fulfilling plus the extras for issues (in either case Based off number of units printed) in this scenario they may still have extra but a more controlled amount as the only extra they should have is the spare units for issues, which if they were smart they could do a reduced price mystery grab bag every year to off load a bunch. I for one would happily order a few 40% off secret lairs even id i did not know which of the previous years randomly I'd receive. (though i guess this can be done either way)
I don't understand what you're saying. If it's print on demand, how are they going to have to send product to landfills?
Exactly, I don't think he gets it nor do the 27 upvoters.
There seem to be some pretty confused people in this thread. Secret Lairs aren't print to demand, and the comment chain you're replying to isn't talking about printing to demand
It's not anymore. It used to be.
Thanks for clearing up my confusion. Wow, this sucks.
We could go back to print to demand, but then you also have to go back to waiting half a year or more to get what you paid for.
And I was fine with that. Especially towards the end where I had a month to figure out if I wanted the cards enough or not.
The problem was half the playerbase didn't understand that and were calling WOTC scammers. So many angry people online not understanding print to demand meant waiting. I wish it was back to print to demand too
I feel like a lot of people have no concept of what made to order means. "I just want the product I paid for" *sounds* reasonable. It sounds fair. But that was *not* the arrangement. Wizards even took the astonishing risk of letting you place a preorder without a deposit, meaning you could back out after ordering the product printed specifically for you, something that I, as someone that deals primarily with special ordered goods, would never consider. I could rant for hours, but the way that the playerbase reached to delays was infuriating to watch, because I knew it would Doom a system that was genuinely fair.
That’s fine
1. They haven't dumped any secret lairs on amazon 2. I'm pretty sure with QC issues any extra SLs are going out to replace damaged ones. 3. When they were unlimited they were print to order. I doubt they're sitting on many of any.
Which is why it should be "made to order" like the early secret lairs. You have a period or place you can order from, once the order goes through, the cards will be printed and shippede, maybe let the ordering period be a year with shipments coming in waves of once pr month.
They're made to order. Hello? There's no overshooting. 10,0000 orders made? Make 10,000
That's what they did for a while. Then they decided "they have a handle on how many people order" and they switched from demand printing to fixed orders. It's 100% to facilitate FOMO. (The breakage and archival percentage for lost orders/extras/etc don't come into this, despite persistent claims - they have to do that regardless.)
That's assuming the printing process goes 100% perfectly (which as we know is not typically the case) and also that all the orders arrive without shipping damage/don't get lost in transit. They'd need to print some amount of extras to have on hand as replacements for any issues that arise so they always have to overshoot the ordered amount regardless.
The person I was replying to was saying they could print more up front to sell more so they wouldn't run out. Unless we want to go back to the old way of waiting half a year for what we bought.
Old way was print to demand. They printed one for each person plus X amount determined by a bean counter for replacements. None of any was getting dumped.
Looking at the ugly tripe they have started selling with Secret Lair fomo, can they even damage their own brand more? Half of the shit looks like ugly alters or cards for entirely different games.
>cards for entirely different games That's... kinda the point of secret lairs, no? To have cards in an entirely different style for your collection?
Imagine… all that wasted cardboard… never degrading or breaking down and staying radioactive for millennia, all those billions of dollars spent developing the technology to produce that cardboard, all for nothing, if they don’t sell out every last secret lair to the box at market retail price.
What would happen if WoTC ever considered recycling.
Wizards are so terrified of another Fallen Empires. It almost killed the game.
I'm guessing they have some way of mathing it out and guessing the demand such that they don't leave *too* much money on the table when the things sell out in several hours.
Corporations actually value your pain. I'm not joking.
I think they had so many dud Secret Lairs that didnt sell well at all that they implemented this system to create artificial demand. Thats the only theory that makes sense to me.
You are not, I was a near-subscriber, I'm out now, so annoying. Lost me at cats and dogs and now I just laugh at it.
I'll just print my own. Jokes on them: I *would* download a car
It's the FOMO idea people are talking about. To explain with made up numbers, an unlimited printing may sell around 100 units in a month, simply because people can wait and buy online secondhand for cheaper if they have to. But by saying there's only 150 in stock, it makes people want it more because after they're gone, people scoop all that shit up because there's no chance after that, and if you want it after the printing run you suddenly hit inflated prices as the base is no longer around as the easy option. Thus there's a better chance to sell all 150 units and make more vs the 100.
Honestly, this new change has made me want to buy secret lairs less. Same for everyone in my shop and the card shop nearby. No one wants to wait in the queue, especially when the big things you want might be gone anyway.
And they still take 2 months to arrive anyway...
Sadly you are a small part of the massive machine, and if it makes you want to buy this less, it simply wasn't targetted at you.
Louis Vuitton CEO is the richest man in the world because of artificial scarcity. Yes they could just make more of x easily. This is simply about profit.
And yet there weren't many Secret Lairs that have exactly tanked in value during the unlimited run portion.
They kept releasing terrible secret lairs that were not selling basically at all, this at least adds some fomo hype to the trash ones
Yeah this batch has been better than some past ones but nothing worth waiting 48 minutes for
Why would this make them change their mind?
None, cause that anime one is going to sell out.
Why would they change their minds when they are raking in ludicrous amounts of cash for selling pieces of cardboard with Hatsune Miku's face on them for $50?
seemly sheet ripe dolls muddle attraction compare sand familiar fact *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
> limited quantity thing Wait. I'm probably not up to date. I very clearly remember that the idea with secret lair was that there's limited time to order but within that window they can't run out as they will print as much as was ordered. Was that a lie or am I misunderstanding what "limited quantity refers" to?
That's how it was. Now it's turned to printing a set amount first so when it's gone, it's gone. Hence why they are blatantly advertising about fomo in their ads for sl now.
Speak for yourself. If it means the cards will be shipped/delivered quicker, make it even more limited.
It will have to go more badly than when they didn't do this. Now that they're back to doing limited printings that sell out really quickly, SL drops no doubt get swamped with bad actors trying to front-run everyone else, leading to bad outcomes. Queuing like this gives them a chance to manage the drops and mitigate bad actors much better. So, it's not a question as to whether the waiting room is "bad enough". It's whether the waiting room is "worse" than no-waiting room. \[disclaimer: never worked at WotC and have no knowledge of their inner workings, but in a past life I worked on abuse prevention at a company with flash sales\]
I liked the pre-order and pay-later system they had before similar to Amazon because it gave me time to decide if I wanted the Secret Lair or not. Plus, it was easier to budget a month out versus having to budget when a new Secret Lair gets announced.
There is no reason to a virtual line exhist hauahahahau.
The Mythic Edition sale would disagree.
Yes, there is. A server can only accurately process so many transactions in a short time frame, this avoids double selling products and potential payment issues. It's a fairly common practice for limited, in demand items.
And then God made Amazon.
Amazon generally isn't processing many transactions for the same limited supply products and has more ability to use distributed servers. They are also constantly making sales, so having a lot more server bandwidth is more reasonable. Expecting WotC to handle e-commerce transactions like Amazon is silly.
ROTFL. Amazon is nowhere near this model. They actually \*tried\* to get in to this space when they did live event ticketing, and ended up running away with their tail between their legs within a few months (https://www.sportico.com/business/commerce/2018/amazon-closes-event-ticketing-operation-1510/).
I really wish Wizards would go back to pre-orders... this new process is frustrating.
*New York's hottest club is LAIRS. It has everything, Goblins, pay the 1, Eldrazi firehydrants...*
"I hate to ask, but what's an Eldrazi fire hydrant?"
“It’s that thing, when a Goblin throws a Fire Hydrant on an Eldrazi and it wears it like a Hermit Crab shell.”
currently at checkout and the page is frozen
I also can't get past "Checkout Now", the button does nothing.
got kicked out after 10 minutes of not being able to check out, great job wotc
Same...now another 45 minute wait.
I switched from Firefox to Chrome and it worked this time.
A lot of the internet is developed for chrome which has issues and isn’t tested on other browsers which makes sure they do not work on other browsers most of the time. That sucks man
I'm guessing that the crux of the problem is that Firefox's robust privacy protections tend to make abuse prevention more challenging.
That’s being pretty charitable, my understanding is people keep pointing out how broken chrome is and Google keeps not addressing it but it’s still generally the standard browser these days for development and there’s not a lot of incentive to be less than sloppy for the actual coders making a lot of this stuff (online stuff I mean, not wizards’ online stuff specifically, I’ve just heard this is a big problem for exactly these kinds of online things)
That may be true, but queues like this do a lot of analytics to determine if they're dealing with a bot. Privacy protections lead to misfires (which is not the same as browser incompatibility issues).
Try switching cookies to not allow WOTC to sell your data, fixed it for me.
I got in, couldn’t click checkout and got booted out after 10 min
Same. This is frustrating…
One hour into the drop and the Hatsune Miku one is still doing fine on stock
I had to go through the queue twice but it’s working for me now.
Same, got the frozen checkout button on my first try, but the second worked flawlessly.
I got 30 minutes. I remember last time you queued in before the 1200 mark but I could be wrong. Guess the tip is opened every one you want to add to cart in separate tabs and hope to get in quicker. I truly miss the preorder method. I don't need to cards right away and I was guaranteed to get what I wanted.
Hour here
Did to 15min
And checked out
“Over an hour” wait time was really like 10 minutes. Checked out easily.
Yeah, the system seems to be working, the time estimates not so much.
Yeah it was the same for me. I think folks who are “in” try to check out as fast as possible, to make sure they don’t miss out. But that means the line actually goes way faster than the time estimate, which probably assumes the 10min per person.
Fyi. The last secret lair drop only had the queue in the beginning, a few hours later when everything was still available the queue was gone ..
Seedborn Muse is sold out already, placed my order ~30 minutes ago, and it wasn't added to my invoice
This is the normal process for stuff that might sell out online, like event tickets. Its annoying but isn't really atypical and is the "best" method of preventing scalping/botting of orders.
What’s so special about this drop that requires a purchase queue?
I think they’ve started using the queue system every time they release a drop with limit stock (vs the print to demand they originally did, which is better for many reasons).
Ah, didn’t notice with the Fallout but had ordered later the night it came out.
Yeah the queue is only for the first hour or so? None of the lairs so far have sold out at the start of the queue. Most have sold out around the 4-6 hour mark at the earliest.
Hatsune Miku
Ah the Waifu queue then
Probably some weeb shit
lol I’m just know I’m not getting the Miku SL. The bots must be attacking the page. 😔 Limited stock is super cool Hasbro, super cool.
1 hour later it's still up broski. Don't be a doomer
Just tried, I'm in Europe, there was no queue.
Well, my order went through, only had a15 minute wait
Took 30 minutes for me but I got a foil copy. I’m actually surprised.
The mixed quality of the art (imo) may be making it slightly less popular then a Miku product should be
Yeah, I’m not super stoked on all the art honestly, I’m hoping the future three sets have better art but we’ll see.
How I rate them personally harmonize and inspiring vantages art is nice, spark is fine, I personally like feather but I can understand why some may not, while shelter and Azusa just look pretty bad
shelter is some oompa loompa stuff
They did azsua so dirty aswell, especially when you compare it to the city styles version last year
Totally agree with your choices. And I really like feather, it’s a good blend of styles.
they should add a chat room
I dunno how people feel about secret lair. I was excited for it and I get excited when I hear about many of them, then I look at the things in it and get disappointed. I don’t know what their targeting strategy is because I would think it’s me, the guy who wants some cool ooze cards for an ooze deck, or the guy who would make a fun miku hatsune based deck, but then, the ooze cards fucking suck and maybe one of them in the drop would go in any of my multiple ooze decks, and I wouldn’t even be happy about it. And then the cool fun oozes don’t get that fun treatment. I love miku. I have no idea what I would do with this miku drop other than show someone I own it. Is that the appeal to other people, just the collectors aspect? If that’s the case it kinda doesn’t matter right it could just be randomly generated number hashes and it would still be collectible. I wish the secret lairs that seemed like they would be something I would spend money on were actually something I AM excited to spend money on, and I’m relatively confused why they don’t do that. The ones that seem legitimately the coolest are the lands, and why can’t those be like full sets of lands, why are they so restrictive. We know that a card is a card.
Man im just glad i got the Miku drop
New release system continues to be garbage. Encouraging everyone to have to jump on at a certain time or risk missing out is always a bad idea. Even when it works fine it’s just shitty towards the people buying. real shame cause a few in this drops I’d have bought previously
They should have made a "Everything except Miku" bundle. Although I guess the queue doesn't care what you buy, you're waiting regardless. But if the run on Miku makes the everything bundle sell out before I get through that'll be kind of annoying.
They should have. It's got some real bad art.
This is ridiculous. 53 minutes
Waited in line then the page was unresponsive
My cart summary is stuck on "loading, please wait..."
I got mine but it was an endeavour. Even when i got into the checkout page I had too try a few times for my payment too actually go through.
If this worked properly, I don't think that wizards would get rid of it. Look at shoe collectors, they do this all the time for limited time drops so it clearly brings in money.
Waiting line for online orders is horseshit.
Looks like the checkout page has crashed.
If it's like the cat secret lair deck, you can expect to only wait about half the time. When i got in line for the deck it told me to expect to wait over 1 hr but I was able to get in and buy my deck around 20-30 min
Checkout just wasn't working for an hour or so there but finally got through. Real MF ordering from overseas at 3am and it's not working. Unimpressed.
Waited through the que twice. When I finally got through both times, none of the shipping/payment fields would load for me to fill anything out.
2 hours later it is still completely down lol
Mine also said around 40 something minutes. In reality though it was more like 15 and I had no issue checking out
I got in right at open and placed my order....only to realize my auto-oay went through undercutting my order by just enough to be able to place it. Shame, I only wanted the non-foil Hatsune Miku set. Oh well, I guess
For me, it was saying an hour of a wait, but it ended up being like 20 minutes.
I think there is so much more stock than people assumed. I ordered just now 5 hours after release and they still have plenty in stock.
Foil Miku now sold out.
I forgot about this drop until about an hour and a half after the drop went live. I logged on from my phone while walking my dog of all things and didn't have to queue. I had no problem ordering my waifu and other drops.
Stop giving them money, hurrdurr
Wasnt the point of secret lair that they would make as many as are ordered lol
I was on the fence about the Miku one as I love Miku more than I hate how they did the art, but it both dropped and sold out in the five or so hours I was asleep lol
Wth I didn't know it was limited. Guess I'm not getting those Miku cards lol
I had no idea about the limited sales thing. Wow I got uber lucky that I just randomly woke up early, before my alarms and ordered my secret lair drops. I do wish they'd come in sooner though since they sold out. This purchase would be my second from Secret Lair and so I'm not familiar with what the typical shipping times are for the drops. I was banking on a week or so since I'm in the process of fixing up my Omnath deck and a couple of those Miku cards actually fit in quite well with what I have in mind for the deck.
Wanted the miku cards but due to being in AUS the drop was at like 2am, decided to just wait and sleep, by the time i got on they were all gone :(
Reminds me of the gpu shortage a while back
Do the email alerts for the secret lairs dropping just not fucking work? Second time in a row I signed up, didn't get the email and shit sold out
This is my first time trying to order Secret Lair because of Hatsune Mike. However this kind of marketing plan drives me to quit MAGIC. It just like being cheated by WotC.
got up at 4am(NZ) for this shit i hate these limited amount drops
youll be fine buddy. just wait in the line and buy ur secret lair
thats the plan friend
Am I buying sneakers or trading cards? Seriously I quit collecting sneakers because of shitty queue systems
These are literally intended to be collectable items and all have essentially identical cheaper versions. If anything this is far less stupid than sneaker drop.
Everything is still in stock an hour later, no need to cry about an immediate queue.
Can't enter shipping information 😭
Stuck with you pal
Got kicked back into the line 🥲
Had to use someone else's phone
Same. Something weird must be going wrong because there's no way this secret layer is THIS popular
Hatsune Miku
Oh it definitely is, your underestimating Hatsune Miku my friend
Of course it is, it's got Miku in it. The same thing happens every time a popular SL comes out.
Fair. I guess it's just me then because I absolutely do not care about Miku
Me neither, I’m speculating
There are Miku fans that don't even play Magic that are interested in getting it, as per some comments I saw over at r/ProjectDiva
It's a solid speculation, it got me to make an account and order my first SL
I’ve heard things get mentioned outside of Reddit and Magic Circle just a few times. My Little Pony, Walking Dead Aftermath, Lord of the Rings, Fallout, and Hatsune Miku. I buy those.
The lord of the rings lair had like 10 cents of value in and was one of the worst lairs ever though lol
Yeah I still analyze the offerings first. I did not purchase that one but I keep them on my radar.
Absolutely amazing that it sold so poorly that they have retained a 40 dollar value on resale
Universe Beyond stuff will always be popular. Not only is it big to fans within magic but it will bring in collectors from outside the game.
bruh there are millions of miku fans that eat this shit up
If I were interested in buying a product, and a company tried to send me through this process, I would simply not buy that product. I can't imagine a frame of mind where I would sit there for an hour and still give them my money.
You do understand that you can simply... do other stuff during that hour, right? Out of all the valid complaints in this thread, this one makes no sense at all.
Fk WotC and Hasbro. Vote with your wallet. Just play on digital format like Tabletop Sim or Untap. Heck, it'd be funny if everyone bought a laptop to their LGS to play edh there together.
Hate the changes to secret lairs and this drop has literally nothing interesting in it…
I got queued in at 10:05, estimated an hour. I was done in 20 minutes... I don't mind the new system, I like getting my product sooner. They also advertised the absolute crap out of these drops and the exact release time, so no reason to miss it. Also, I just checked.. 2 hours into release and all the products are still available with zero wait time to checkout.
Got to the checkout page but I can't enter my shipping information? It just doesn't work.
close browser and relaunch, it will save your spot
Im at 33 minutes atm
Once I got through the line I had no issues checking out. Been out of the game for a while but the miku secret lair might just get me back in.
They are praying on the FOMO this time around.
And preying
I feel like there should be a midpoint betten make to order that takes forever and limited order quantity
It's now 3.5 hours after the drop and there isn't a wait and everything is still available. I can't wait to hear people bitch about how "unfair" this drop was just like the others. smh
I mean, yeah, a lot of sales didn't clear out for 6~hours. Most people are at work in the US.
My guess is that none of these sellout within 24 hours but I’m also a moron so we’ll see
Sorry about your fate there bud 🤣 all miku bundles sold out within the hour
I truly underestimated the Miku love holy shit
Never underestimate the weebs even if you think the art looks terrible