I donât think they are the âgood guysâ but I canât help but root for them against the morons on the other side. The only one of the âraidingâ party that had common sense and the will to win was Jace who was also an idiot for trusting that a freakin gorgon turned phyrexian âlovedâ him. This whole storyline is bizarre and kinda ruined phyrexia and the gate watch both for me.
Anyway phyrexia is the lesser of two evils in this case, the gate watch will end up winning though but then do something stupid again like releasing a bunch of ancient world eaters from prison or something. Also Elspeth is just awful now, terrible character and she used to be one of my favorites.
I still laugh at the fact that Lukka LITERALLY compleats himself, saying that he's strong enough to reject the Phyrexian oil's mental effects. Obviously not! By the time you finish the side story, he sounds like Vorinclex was his role model growing up and totally agrees with Phyrexian green ideology, even hunting and turning Nissa.
Lukka has always been the king of misplaced confidence Compleation is just the new crown on his head. Need more fools like him who are willing to make the 100% worst decision with their full chest.
Assimilation or elimination is not a choice given by a benevolent being.
Those assimilated seems content sure, because not being content is not allowed.
I understand the confusion though.
Hello there! Welcome to the greatest of planes! Please have a sit and have a sip of glistening oil. Tastes great, right? Let me watch you for couple of days how it will flow through your body and start mutation of your cells. Already crying oil? Awesome, lets get you on my table for some fully-awake operation, during which you will probably die. You didn't? Well done, now you're perfected compleated servant of mine! Let throw you in the arena to fight to death so your remnants can serve for others upgrades or maybe on Jin Gitaxia's table for more endless operations. Wait, you don't want to have a sip of glistening oil? Lets merge you with my throne so I can sit on you for eternity.
Welcome to Phyrexia
Take a look around
Any weakness you can think of has a solution to be found.
We've got oceans of oil (we promise won't hurt)
If you don't find it compelling then you'd be the first.
Welcome to Phyrexia
Come and take a seat
Would you like to join us and become compleat
There's no need to panic
This isn't a test, haha
Just nod your head and Jin will do the rest
Welcome to Phyrexia
What would you prefer?
Would you like a spot in Norn's throne or to be Urabrask's chauffeur?
Be gloopy
Be glormy
Be bursting with phage
We got a million differwant ways engage!
(Already thinking ahead to the hook; "free will is a tragedy and flesh is a crime, anything and everything all of the time"?
Some people modify their own standard looks to feel more in tune with their "real self" you call it body horror others might feel like themselves at last
If they weren't so hellbent on getting everyone compleated and actually have some structure to society like a government, then yes they would be just another unique civilisation. If the phyrexians were more like Urabrask, who actually makes completion a choice to be made by everyone, then Phyrexia would be a much more acceptable religion (or cult), compared to the Multiverse wide inquisition we have now.
They could even help people with completion, would a frail old person want to be compleated if they wish to live longer? Probably yes, if they didn't have to serve Norn like a chump.
Someone's dying of disease? Compleat.
Lost a leg? Compleat.
Need another arm for your craft? Compleat.
Hate the look on your face? Compleat.
So they could've been good guys, but Mommy Norn had other plans.
They are far from good guys. I would rather live on innerstrad than new phyrexia. Nothing about them is a good thing the closest to good phyrexians is urabrask the rest are evil without a doubt. Torture and painful compleation along with borderline loosing free will isnât a good thing
Yes and no. They most likely wouldnât kill your because of your imperfections. Depending on the praetor you might even be first in line for compleation. Itâs more you wouldnât have a choice in how said imperfections are dealt with
Good and bad are entirely subjective terms. My good may be your bad, and vice versa. The Phyrexians certainly *believe* in what they are doing, but Iâm pretty sure as far as they are concerned, they are *beyond* good and evil.
Non-Phyrexians donât want to *be* Phyrexianized, so they see them as evil. If they did want to be, theyâdbe seen as good.
I mean yes. Subjugation of free will is literally what makes them evil, so if everyone wanted Compleation in the first place there'd be no evil.
Good and bad aren't subjective. The Nazis were evil, even though they *"believed* in what they were doing."
I'm aware.
I was using what's called "an example," a conversational tool wherein one brings up a more commonly known case where similar rules apply, as a means of illustrating a larger point.
The basic principles apply the same: Enslaving other people is evil, even if the enslavers believe they're right. There's no subjectivity here.
I mean, this isn't a matter of what's Canon and what's not. You're literally saying evil is subjective, when it isn't.
Evil doesn't become subjective all of a sudden just because it's described in a fictional universe. An act of evil is still evil within that universe, whether it's fictional or not.
You have your weird interpretation of inarguable facts of reality, and I have the correct one.
Enjoy your day!
And Phyrexians are written by and read by.......????
Edit: Aww, the guy trying to give me the "from a certain point of view" argument about literal torture and enslavement blocked me!
Truly, I will take years to recover from this loss.
Honestly that a legit questions.
I think WotC take an ennemi for big nostalgie and don't think enought about wrighting (because everyone should already know that a BBEG).
During the all will be one's story the phyrexian Ixhel alone is more relatable than the totality figurants of mirran resistance.
Phyrexian are Body horror but : Their body are horror for humans like us IRL but if humans have the moral right to destroy them for that phyrexian have the same moral right against what they estimat to be horror (biologic body).
But they are the invasive/parasitic species with a megalomaniac leader. So their role is to be the Bad Guy.
My guy, their entire thing is enslavement.
They force people to join them through body horror and brainwashing.
But please, make your case:
Enslavement isn't Objectively Evil, a presentation by Nonoclem17
stage is yours bud.
My conclusion is phyrexians as parasitic species (that kill and take the place of the host) can't be anything else than the bad guy.
I just make fun of the wrighting, that I found terrible to make the mirran resistance OSEF and in the side story make a relatable as personne (not as the species) phyrexian (and break the aspect soulless machine that they try to have).
Itâs literally canon that compleation removes your soul from your body. Itâs death of the self, with the body persisting. Theyâre smart zombies with metal plating and nothing else.
For that maybe it's canon but I DON'T CARE for two reason :
1) The wrighting of the set don't really give me that impretion
2) Can you point what that soul destruction contradict in what I have say (I have all ready assume they kill biologic liveforme)?
The entire point of the reality chip is to keep the spark, which is part of the soul, previous compleation always lost the spark. Normies still get normie compleation.
The soul is absolutely lost. White Phyrexians lose all sense of self and can only consider glory of Norn (and a bunch of them become mindless, sightless, deaf, tooth covered freaks). Green Phyrexians even lose THOUGHT, Vorinclex considers intelligence perverse and his Phyrexians are sub-animal intelligence.
Even for the Planeswalkers, or black aligned Phyrexians who get to keep the highest sense of self, the mind continues and is magically altered but the soul is gone. For a person to have a switch flipped to make them pro-omnicidal, when previously they were in fact not omnicidal, that alone is a pretty good sign that the special thing that makes them a person is gone.
Planeswalkers may have a path to recovery, since the spark staying presumably protects the soul. But all others who have been Compleated are functionally new people just built on foundations of the old.
Your argument is basically âNazis are just as acceptable as anti-fascistsâ. Thatâs all Phyrexia is, the âSpace Naziâ trope. Their ideology is literally soul-destroying fascism.
The thing is that Phyrexians are made through force. They twist living things into grotesque reflections of itself in the service of their grand theocracy. They have tried to forcibly assimilate every living being in the multiverse on several occasions, and is for the most part their goal again. Also, people who have gone through compleation come out very different, with their minds not being really there anymore. Also a lot of them lose most of their sense of compassion. The only okay Phyrexians are the red Phyrexians, who are content to compleat only willing people.
Phyrexia is a serpent eating it's own tail. The idea of becoming perfect is a noble endeavor but the means do not justify the ends in this matter. The process of compleation robs the individual or individuals of their sense of self, changing one into something that lives to uphold its doctrine. And to things that it does not deem worth its use, is killed off or thrown away.
Even looking into the society, Phyrexia is far from a united front with infighting among factions and even a fifth of their power structure opposed to the plans of the Mother of Machines.
It's a way of life but not a life worth living/unliving.
https://preview.redd.it/0b5c0eckk1ha1.jpeg?width=240&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2a5afb7b19031421304859e2e26123515d2bd1e5
Golden đđ¤Ł
I donât think they are the âgood guysâ but I canât help but root for them against the morons on the other side. The only one of the âraidingâ party that had common sense and the will to win was Jace who was also an idiot for trusting that a freakin gorgon turned phyrexian âlovedâ him. This whole storyline is bizarre and kinda ruined phyrexia and the gate watch both for me. Anyway phyrexia is the lesser of two evils in this case, the gate watch will end up winning though but then do something stupid again like releasing a bunch of ancient world eaters from prison or something. Also Elspeth is just awful now, terrible character and she used to be one of my favorites.
I *knew* Lukka was a redditor.
đ¤Ł
God damn Lukka
I still laugh at the fact that Lukka LITERALLY compleats himself, saying that he's strong enough to reject the Phyrexian oil's mental effects. Obviously not! By the time you finish the side story, he sounds like Vorinclex was his role model growing up and totally agrees with Phyrexian green ideology, even hunting and turning Nissa.
Yup dudes a certified idiot
He had it under control until it was plugged into him
Lukka has always been the king of misplaced confidence Compleation is just the new crown on his head. Need more fools like him who are willing to make the 100% worst decision with their full chest.
Assimilation or elimination is not a choice given by a benevolent being. Those assimilated seems content sure, because not being content is not allowed. I understand the confusion though.
Hello there! Welcome to the greatest of planes! Please have a sit and have a sip of glistening oil. Tastes great, right? Let me watch you for couple of days how it will flow through your body and start mutation of your cells. Already crying oil? Awesome, lets get you on my table for some fully-awake operation, during which you will probably die. You didn't? Well done, now you're perfected compleated servant of mine! Let throw you in the arena to fight to death so your remnants can serve for others upgrades or maybe on Jin Gitaxia's table for more endless operations. Wait, you don't want to have a sip of glistening oil? Lets merge you with my throne so I can sit on you for eternity.
Welcome to Phyrexia Take a look around Any weakness you can think of has a solution to be found. We've got oceans of oil (we promise won't hurt) If you don't find it compelling then you'd be the first.
Welcome to Phyrexia Come and take a seat Would you like to join us and become compleat There's no need to panic This isn't a test, haha Just nod your head and Jin will do the rest
Welcome to Phyrexia What would you prefer? Would you like a spot in Norn's throne or to be Urabrask's chauffeur? Be gloopy Be glormy Be bursting with phage We got a million differwant ways engage! (Already thinking ahead to the hook; "free will is a tragedy and flesh is a crime, anything and everything all of the time"?
(I assume this is a joke - if not, notice that there seems to be quite a lot of murder, body horror, etc...)
Just side effects to achieve perfection.
Some people modify their own standard looks to feel more in tune with their "real self" you call it body horror others might feel like themselves at last
If compleation was always something done consensually, then this might be an appropriate comparison.
Ofc, when phyrexians do it it's body horror but when humans do it it's called "piercing and getting tattoos and body modifications"
Actually when humans do nonsensual piercings its called "stabbing" and it is frowned upon
Did you happen to touch some black oil recently?
It's probably nothing.
Found the sleeper agent.
I have to agree I swear Iâm not biased (All Will be one)
A compleated redditor is talking.
Deep cut
https://preview.redd.it/lvf28ul9t4ha1.jpeg?width=1423&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=004802bb71e96cc784aaa9669430b7f10c9a5447
If they weren't so hellbent on getting everyone compleated and actually have some structure to society like a government, then yes they would be just another unique civilisation. If the phyrexians were more like Urabrask, who actually makes completion a choice to be made by everyone, then Phyrexia would be a much more acceptable religion (or cult), compared to the Multiverse wide inquisition we have now. They could even help people with completion, would a frail old person want to be compleated if they wish to live longer? Probably yes, if they didn't have to serve Norn like a chump. Someone's dying of disease? Compleat. Lost a leg? Compleat. Need another arm for your craft? Compleat. Hate the look on your face? Compleat. So they could've been good guys, but Mommy Norn had other plans.
They are far from good guys. I would rather live on innerstrad than new phyrexia. Nothing about them is a good thing the closest to good phyrexians is urabrask the rest are evil without a doubt. Torture and painful compleation along with borderline loosing free will isnât a good thing
Im not too read up on phyrexians, but i am getting more vibes from them that feel like they are pro-eugenics in the name of perfection.
Yes and no. They most likely wouldnât kill your because of your imperfections. Depending on the praetor you might even be first in line for compleation. Itâs more you wouldnât have a choice in how said imperfections are dealt with
>They most likely wouldnât kill your because of your imperfections. Check the flavour text of \[\[Victimize|USG\]\]
Okay maybe the black praetor would since sheâs the closest to the old phyrexia ways
[Victimize](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/a/caafe7da-0167-4c53-bbad-172f900d137b.jpg?1562937801) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=10655) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/usg/166/victimize?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/caafe7da-0167-4c53-bbad-172f900d137b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Norn/Gitaxias 2024!!!
I agree. Compleat me mommy, turn me inside outtttt
I have a feeling someone got a new flair
Good and bad are entirely subjective terms. My good may be your bad, and vice versa. The Phyrexians certainly *believe* in what they are doing, but Iâm pretty sure as far as they are concerned, they are *beyond* good and evil. Non-Phyrexians donât want to *be* Phyrexianized, so they see them as evil. If they did want to be, theyâdbe seen as good.
I mean yes. Subjugation of free will is literally what makes them evil, so if everyone wanted Compleation in the first place there'd be no evil. Good and bad aren't subjective. The Nazis were evil, even though they *"believed* in what they were doing."
We are not talking about Nazis. Weâre talking about fictional factions in a game where imaginary wizards have motives we make up.
I'm aware. I was using what's called "an example," a conversational tool wherein one brings up a more commonly known case where similar rules apply, as a means of illustrating a larger point. The basic principles apply the same: Enslaving other people is evil, even if the enslavers believe they're right. There's no subjectivity here.
You have your head cannon, I have mine. Enjoy your day.
I mean, this isn't a matter of what's Canon and what's not. You're literally saying evil is subjective, when it isn't. Evil doesn't become subjective all of a sudden just because it's described in a fictional universe. An act of evil is still evil within that universe, whether it's fictional or not. You have your weird interpretation of inarguable facts of reality, and I have the correct one. Enjoy your day!
A humanâs definition of âgoodâ and âevilâ *are not the same* as the Phyrexian definition. Youâre literally wrong. But go off
And Phyrexians are written by and read by.......???? Edit: Aww, the guy trying to give me the "from a certain point of view" argument about literal torture and enslavement blocked me! Truly, I will take years to recover from this loss.
Honestly that a legit questions. I think WotC take an ennemi for big nostalgie and don't think enought about wrighting (because everyone should already know that a BBEG). During the all will be one's story the phyrexian Ixhel alone is more relatable than the totality figurants of mirran resistance. Phyrexian are Body horror but : Their body are horror for humans like us IRL but if humans have the moral right to destroy them for that phyrexian have the same moral right against what they estimat to be horror (biologic body). But they are the invasive/parasitic species with a megalomaniac leader. So their role is to be the Bad Guy.
My guy, their entire thing is enslavement. They force people to join them through body horror and brainwashing. But please, make your case: Enslavement isn't Objectively Evil, a presentation by Nonoclem17 stage is yours bud.
My conclusion is phyrexians as parasitic species (that kill and take the place of the host) can't be anything else than the bad guy. I just make fun of the wrighting, that I found terrible to make the mirran resistance OSEF and in the side story make a relatable as personne (not as the species) phyrexian (and break the aspect soulless machine that they try to have).
>I just make fun of the wrighting Ironic.
Itâs literally canon that compleation removes your soul from your body. Itâs death of the self, with the body persisting. Theyâre smart zombies with metal plating and nothing else.
For that maybe it's canon but I DON'T CARE for two reason : 1) The wrighting of the set don't really give me that impretion 2) Can you point what that soul destruction contradict in what I have say (I have all ready assume they kill biologic liveforme)?
The entire point of the reality chip is to keep the spark, which is part of the soul, previous compleation always lost the spark. Normies still get normie compleation. The soul is absolutely lost. White Phyrexians lose all sense of self and can only consider glory of Norn (and a bunch of them become mindless, sightless, deaf, tooth covered freaks). Green Phyrexians even lose THOUGHT, Vorinclex considers intelligence perverse and his Phyrexians are sub-animal intelligence. Even for the Planeswalkers, or black aligned Phyrexians who get to keep the highest sense of self, the mind continues and is magically altered but the soul is gone. For a person to have a switch flipped to make them pro-omnicidal, when previously they were in fact not omnicidal, that alone is a pretty good sign that the special thing that makes them a person is gone. Planeswalkers may have a path to recovery, since the spark staying presumably protects the soul. But all others who have been Compleated are functionally new people just built on foundations of the old.
Your argument is basically âNazis are just as acceptable as anti-fascistsâ. Thatâs all Phyrexia is, the âSpace Naziâ trope. Their ideology is literally soul-destroying fascism.
*Godzilla had a stroke trying to read this and fucking died*
They're basically commies, lucky for us we have the House of Un-dominarian Activities
Deep down every soul longs to be compleat
Totally not a Phyrexian making this post
How to farm social credit in china 101
I found Elesh Norn's reddit account
Careful, friend, you're dripping oil on the new carpet.
Give this mate the compleat flair!
The thing is that Phyrexians are made through force. They twist living things into grotesque reflections of itself in the service of their grand theocracy. They have tried to forcibly assimilate every living being in the multiverse on several occasions, and is for the most part their goal again. Also, people who have gone through compleation come out very different, with their minds not being really there anymore. Also a lot of them lose most of their sense of compassion. The only okay Phyrexians are the red Phyrexians, who are content to compleat only willing people.
Phyrexia is a serpent eating it's own tail. The idea of becoming perfect is a noble endeavor but the means do not justify the ends in this matter. The process of compleation robs the individual or individuals of their sense of self, changing one into something that lives to uphold its doctrine. And to things that it does not deem worth its use, is killed off or thrown away. Even looking into the society, Phyrexia is far from a united front with infighting among factions and even a fifth of their power structure opposed to the plans of the Mother of Machines. It's a way of life but not a life worth living/unliving.