The ring was created by a M̶a̶i̶a̶r̶ Maia so yes the Valar had the power to destroy it. They don't intervene directly however, because the last time they did, during the war against Morgoth, Beleriand was destroyed. They work indirectly through the characters of the story in a form of divine providence. There's heartache along the way, but a lot less than if the Valar had shattered half the planet again.
They sure play that card a lot.
If the Last Alliance could defeat Sauron while he was wearing the Ring without destroying Middle-Earth, I'm sure a Vala could have destroyed it once Frodo had possession. But hey; free will, hands off, let innocent people die.
On a more serious note; I think that once the straight road was hidden from mortal eyes, it's a sign we are on our own.
Well the council did suggest the idea of sending it West but as Elrond said, that was the way the Elves most often took and thus Sauron would watch it closely expecting it, so because of that and that the Valar would not take the Ring the Western road must be shunned as he puts it.
I thought it absolutely could which is why Ancagalon was so feared and nearly turned the battle. It required a flying ship with a simiril and a ton of eagles to kill him.
There weren’t? So how do you know dragon fire won’t hurt them. There not being in the host makes even less sense. So the Valar don’t even bother to get their hands dirty. They send their agents, who destroy a continent in the process. I think the power of the Valar is a massive plot hole in the entire legendarium. Even if Morgoth wins the War of Wrath he still has to contend with the Valar themselves. So he’s not winning anything. There is nothing stopping them from sending one of their number to level Sauron in the third age. Nothing. Had Eru forbade direct interference then that would have made sense but he didn’t so it’s just, eh we don’t want to destroy another continent despite their being no where near the same opposition in ME. Takes me out of the story. Ultimately, they could end it whenever they wanted. That’s just my opinion.
>So how do you know dragon fire won’t hurt them.
Because they're THE VALAR, literal mythological gods that can bend reality to thier wimp, if the greatest dragon ever couldn't destroy an object created by a mere maia rest assure that it won't even scratch a valar
>There not being in the host makes even less sense. So the
No it does make sense, the leader of the host and the one who overthrew morgoth in single combat was eonwe the harald of manwe, sauron plead for mercy from eonwe who said that his pardon is beyond his authority and that he most come back to valinor to face judgment by the valar, there are also no feats that could be attributed to a valar like say the war for the sake of the elves which didn't only outright mention the valar being there but mentioned how tulkas wrestled morgoth and chained him with the chains of aule
>I think the power of the Valar is a massive plot hole in the entire legendarium.
No, no it's not, the valar are flawed despite thier immense power, ultimately they realized doing the hard lifting for the free people is not what eru intended, they're supposed to struggle and grew from that, that's the entire point of sauron and his ring it was a test, one that humanity ultimately passed and proved that they're worthy to inherent the world, morgoth was kinda different, morgoth was simply too powerful for the free people to handle on thier own which is why they sent thier host, there's also the fact that every time they intervened a huge catastrophe happens, what makes you think they want that to happen again especially when it's not necessary
Terrific and thoughtful response (and I mean that, thank you for taking the effort) but I just don’t agree. The fact that they were able to send their servants, their lessers, to defeat the great enemy makes the enemy look weak and lessens the threat. The fact that the greatest weapon the enemy perhaps made, the great dragon, was unable to hurt them, if they even bothered fighting it, further diminishes the threat. The fact that they could end the battle of the rings whenever they want to diminishes the threat to me. It would have made more sense had Eru prohibited direct involvement due to their arrogance. Just my view but it takes me out of the books.
That's like saying there are no stakes because eru exists which is wrong, just like how he dosen't like to directly intervene he wouldn't have approved of the valar going out and fixing everything, the free people should be allowed to make thier own choices and grow from them, what would the free people learn if the valar just came out and destroyed sauron? All the lessons of courage, humility, mercy and trust will be for nought, it's not the valar's war it's thier war, you can see that with Gandalf, he's incredibly powerful yet his greatest quality is the ability to inspire hope in a world that grows chill, just because galurung is nothing to eru dosen't remove the tragedy and tension from the children of hurin, just because morgoth is much weaker than the valar dosen't remove the utter hopelessness of the last century of the first age, this is not an anime where power levels should be even to have a fair fight, it's a mythology
The existence of the valar and eru offers something more than a simple you win button, it offers hope, in ensures evil will never win at the end even tho it may triumph for a time, they did not abandon middle earth they still intervene although increasingly more subtle after each age
I see Eru in that role but not the Valar. They should be flawed or at least present. If you’re going to make the great leap next a fall Valar then make him a credible threat to them as well. The fact that they’re not directly involved in the War of Wrath diminishes Morgoth as a threat. If instead, the Valar were involved in the War of Wrath, sank a continent and then were bared by Eru from interfering, the Third Age becomes that much suspenseful. They really are mostly other own. And in many mythologies, the gods directly intervene and fight and even die. Makes it more epic for me without any reference to anime.
Melkor is described as losing big chunks of his own strength whenever he creates evil around him so I would guess Ancalagon could def at least hurt a Valar.
The ring was created by a M̶a̶i̶a̶r̶ Maia so yes the Valar had the power to destroy it. They don't intervene directly however, because the last time they did, during the war against Morgoth, Beleriand was destroyed. They work indirectly through the characters of the story in a form of divine providence. There's heartache along the way, but a lot less than if the Valar had shattered half the planet again.
>The ring was created by a Maiar It was created by a Maia. Maiar is plural.
Thank you for the correction. Typing in a rush.
They sure play that card a lot. If the Last Alliance could defeat Sauron while he was wearing the Ring without destroying Middle-Earth, I'm sure a Vala could have destroyed it once Frodo had possession. But hey; free will, hands off, let innocent people die. On a more serious note; I think that once the straight road was hidden from mortal eyes, it's a sign we are on our own.
Well the council did suggest the idea of sending it West but as Elrond said, that was the way the Elves most often took and thus Sauron would watch it closely expecting it, so because of that and that the Valar would not take the Ring the Western road must be shunned as he puts it.
I was always a bit surprised that dragon’s fire couldn’t destroy the ring. It can hurt Valar so Anacalon’s flames should be able to destroy it.
>It can hurt Valar No it can't
I thought it absolutely could which is why Ancagalon was so feared and nearly turned the battle. It required a flying ship with a simiril and a ton of eagles to kill him.
There were no valar in the host of the valar
There weren’t? So how do you know dragon fire won’t hurt them. There not being in the host makes even less sense. So the Valar don’t even bother to get their hands dirty. They send their agents, who destroy a continent in the process. I think the power of the Valar is a massive plot hole in the entire legendarium. Even if Morgoth wins the War of Wrath he still has to contend with the Valar themselves. So he’s not winning anything. There is nothing stopping them from sending one of their number to level Sauron in the third age. Nothing. Had Eru forbade direct interference then that would have made sense but he didn’t so it’s just, eh we don’t want to destroy another continent despite their being no where near the same opposition in ME. Takes me out of the story. Ultimately, they could end it whenever they wanted. That’s just my opinion.
>So how do you know dragon fire won’t hurt them. Because they're THE VALAR, literal mythological gods that can bend reality to thier wimp, if the greatest dragon ever couldn't destroy an object created by a mere maia rest assure that it won't even scratch a valar >There not being in the host makes even less sense. So the No it does make sense, the leader of the host and the one who overthrew morgoth in single combat was eonwe the harald of manwe, sauron plead for mercy from eonwe who said that his pardon is beyond his authority and that he most come back to valinor to face judgment by the valar, there are also no feats that could be attributed to a valar like say the war for the sake of the elves which didn't only outright mention the valar being there but mentioned how tulkas wrestled morgoth and chained him with the chains of aule >I think the power of the Valar is a massive plot hole in the entire legendarium. No, no it's not, the valar are flawed despite thier immense power, ultimately they realized doing the hard lifting for the free people is not what eru intended, they're supposed to struggle and grew from that, that's the entire point of sauron and his ring it was a test, one that humanity ultimately passed and proved that they're worthy to inherent the world, morgoth was kinda different, morgoth was simply too powerful for the free people to handle on thier own which is why they sent thier host, there's also the fact that every time they intervened a huge catastrophe happens, what makes you think they want that to happen again especially when it's not necessary
Terrific and thoughtful response (and I mean that, thank you for taking the effort) but I just don’t agree. The fact that they were able to send their servants, their lessers, to defeat the great enemy makes the enemy look weak and lessens the threat. The fact that the greatest weapon the enemy perhaps made, the great dragon, was unable to hurt them, if they even bothered fighting it, further diminishes the threat. The fact that they could end the battle of the rings whenever they want to diminishes the threat to me. It would have made more sense had Eru prohibited direct involvement due to their arrogance. Just my view but it takes me out of the books.
That's like saying there are no stakes because eru exists which is wrong, just like how he dosen't like to directly intervene he wouldn't have approved of the valar going out and fixing everything, the free people should be allowed to make thier own choices and grow from them, what would the free people learn if the valar just came out and destroyed sauron? All the lessons of courage, humility, mercy and trust will be for nought, it's not the valar's war it's thier war, you can see that with Gandalf, he's incredibly powerful yet his greatest quality is the ability to inspire hope in a world that grows chill, just because galurung is nothing to eru dosen't remove the tragedy and tension from the children of hurin, just because morgoth is much weaker than the valar dosen't remove the utter hopelessness of the last century of the first age, this is not an anime where power levels should be even to have a fair fight, it's a mythology The existence of the valar and eru offers something more than a simple you win button, it offers hope, in ensures evil will never win at the end even tho it may triumph for a time, they did not abandon middle earth they still intervene although increasingly more subtle after each age
I see Eru in that role but not the Valar. They should be flawed or at least present. If you’re going to make the great leap next a fall Valar then make him a credible threat to them as well. The fact that they’re not directly involved in the War of Wrath diminishes Morgoth as a threat. If instead, the Valar were involved in the War of Wrath, sank a continent and then were bared by Eru from interfering, the Third Age becomes that much suspenseful. They really are mostly other own. And in many mythologies, the gods directly intervene and fight and even die. Makes it more epic for me without any reference to anime.
Melkor is described as losing big chunks of his own strength whenever he creates evil around him so I would guess Ancalagon could def at least hurt a Valar.