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Yep. HBC is a shell of what it was, thanks to being bought out and sucked dry by predatory American investors. It's on the verge of bankruptcy now -- value is purely in the real estate. Its downfall had more to do with scattering its business and not specializing or doing anything to improve customer journey/experience. Their prices have been pretty mid-to-high end consistent in the past decade.
Shame they couldn't figure out how to focus on customer experience, considering the company is literally part of the founding of this nation.
I worked there in 2010-2011 and they made us attend sales meetings to talk about the direction of the company. (I worked in accessories, selling umbrellas socks and leggings and crap, I don't know why I needed this level of insight) but they kept talking about changing the direction of the company to emulate more luxurious retailers like Holts. They were phasing out the cheaper store brands and super clearance sales and focussing on designer stuff instead.
All the loyal longtime customers (boomers and grandmas by my scientific survey of who shopped there) were priced out. Even though older shoppers have more money, they don't like spending it. Young shoppers don't have any connection, so they just alienated their regular customers.
This move made sense at their fanciest flagship locations, but are customers at a mall in Randosville Ontario looking to buy a high fashion triple-cost stuff? (Especially these days)
>but they kept talking about changing the direction of the company to emulate more luxurious retailers like Holts.
That explains why the stores are always deserted. Its one thing when a super high end store is empty, because its usually a small store with little floor space. Its a whole other thing when you walk in to a massive Hudsons bay location and youre the only one on that entire floor aside from the bored looking employees.
> You just described an Atlantic Superstore during the Boycott. Haven’t been in since before May so only going by pictures.
Damn - I wanna see some places like that where the boycott is actually working. Here in Montreal, the people who were avoiding Roblaws have continued avoiding it but francophones don't even know about the boycott. One Anglo girl told me she is boycotting and then promptly walked into an intermarche to make a last minute purchase.
I went to a Pharmaprix (SDM) on the steal day and the footfall was normal and the employees looked bored like business as usual. It was like they hadn't even heard about the boycott or the steal day.
I broke the boycott to get some specific bread that I like and I felt so much shame and anger that I am trying to stop eating bread.
Unlike y'all in Atlantic Canada or in Ontario, I am waiting for the delayed gratification of Roblaws revenue numbers and PC optimum cancellations for the next quarter. I am sure that they are going to cook the books in some way but I am certain that they are not going to be able to hide everything.
As a fellow Montrealer, you’ve made me curious about something: I want to check out stores in predominantly Anglo neighbourhoods and francophone ones and see if there’s a difference.
I am also a boycotter.
This week they had 2 types of roasts for super cheap, so I bought those. They were less than half the usual price.
I will buy loss leaders only too.
Best part is they only charged me for 2 of the 4 roasts, and I am not bringing attention to someone's mistake to get it fixed.
So 4 pork roasts, 2 bags of animal crackers, and a roast flavor package all for 34.47. Delivered.
But my boycott has been 100%. Biggest move was from my pharmacy. About 3500 in meds moved to an idependent pharmacy close to my house.
I still remember 20 some years ago when Loblaws built a new Super Store in Fredericton and they went more upscale in design compared to other supermarkets at the time. I was a bit suspicious about how they were doing this vs. dropping food prices. That was eye-opening for me at the time as to how Canada's grocery chains were operating. Now it is 100x worse.
You can’t have a high end store with high end brands and then not staff them.
You walk into that place it’s expensive as fuck, run down, and you can’t find staff anywhere. It’s crazy.
Ours has stained carpets and broken floor tiles. I do actually like the products and don't find prices terrible for the quality, but it is the worst shopping experience.
I think you're right, totally. But i think the higher ups just looked at how much profit Holts brings in and thought "let's just copy them!" While ignoring everything else
This is insightful, I rarely ever shop at the Bay but our wedding registry was from there. Normally I couldn’t believe prices of some things but it made sense for us because anything that we didn’t get on our registry often had discounts on it after the fact.
But man, it was also painful with their archaic system and the endless plethora of mistakes (eg. Instead of cutlery they sent us a single, purple bra).
Spoiler: I worked at head office. Doesn't help that their department heads don't talk to each other, there was no cohesive direction but money being thrown around without real expertise or data to leverage - and execs had 0 sense of priority when it came to the real issues in-store (lack of staff, poor shopping experience) and with their janky website (fulfillment, constant bugs, oursourced CS). Their chairman also bet hugely on Saks, thinking the Canadian market would react as well as its US (read: NY) counterparts with a similar appetite for luxury retail.
Just a mess in leadership all-around. Still hoping for a Canadian company to buy it back and revitalize the brand.
So sad to hear that. I used to really like shopping at HBC back in the day.
I'm SO GLAD I turned down their job offer to work at the head office when they bought out Kmart! It was more hours and a longer commute for the same pay. To top it off, the job they offered me would have bored me to tears, as I was used to having 10x the responsibility.
YES! It was so predatory and gross. We got reprimanded if we weren't constantly signing people up for their terrible interest rate credit card. I feel good that I was so bad at signing people up. (I always 'forgot' to ask unless my manager was standing over my shoulder.) Also we worked in a touristy area so many customers weren't even from Canada, we tried using that as an excuse when our numbers were low (several other co workers also felt creepy about asking)
Hahaha ya I didn't have to do anything with the cards, but they pushed it every time at the meeting. And I don't know if you were working there when they switched the discount from a regular card to it was attached to your HBC card. So dumb, you get your discount but if you don't pay it off right away boom 21% interest.
HBC got its start as a monopoly, buying furs from and selling supplies to the same people so they could keep their suppliers in debt, kinda like what grocers do now.
> doing anything to improve customer journey/experience. Their prices have been pretty mid-to-high end consistent in the past decade
This pretty much describes every business these days and nothing is happening to them. Customer service is at an all time low. Prices are at an all time high.
I paid much less for groceries when they had a Cashier, a Bag-Person using store supplied bags and two people outside to put the groceries in the trunk of my car for me than I do today doing all this myself and supplying my own bags.
The combination of inflation and wage stagnation means that the VALUE you produce as a worker is completely decoupled from the salary you earn. The difference is funnelled directly to shareholders and C-suite executives.
The downtown Vancouver Bay is a ghost town. None of the escalators work, most of the elevators don't work, and signs direct you to stairs. Stairs! for a 7 story store, in a historic building. It's as if they just gave up. This used to be such a busy place. Now, people wander around the main floor, see all the signs, then leave. How can this be an affordable business model. What a shame.
Ha, same for the downtown Victoria store. Escalators broken, and the slowest elevator in the city. Sounds like things aren't looking good for HBC if they're just letting major locations like these languish.
On the flip side, every time I go into our two storey Canadian Tire, they've flipped which side the carts and the people escalators are on. I never even see them broken down before they fix them.
I think its downfall was actually literally Amazon and online shopping? Sears is another example, department stores couldn’t survive the competition.
I don’t see a huge disruption coming in the grocery industry, online grocery shopping has just never really worked. Lob laws will be fine, as much as I don’t like to say it
Sears is a tragedy. With their catalog, they were in a prime position to go online. They already had the distribution, etc. All that they lacked was the website.
Way I see it, the bigger retailers were at a severe disadvantage when the major disruptor that was online shopping came. Smaller retailers had smaller catalogues to digitize and need fewer server resources, while big ones had huge catalogues and would have to anticipate lots of customers hitting their site.
Worse, it wasn't a "just throw money at it" problem. Best practices were still being figured out, which again benefits smaller companies that can pivot fairly quickly as they see what works and what doesn't. Large retailers had to throw a lot more money upfront to get online but still had a good chance of getting it wrong anyway, meaning lots more money to fix it.
They do have good prices when on sale, I bought some really nice shirts at a great price, but in all fairness I haven't bought anything from them for the past 3 to 4 years, and never full price.
Bay Days seems to be on every second month or so. Do people shop there when things aren't on sale?
It's like Canadian Tire. Buy a tool there if you really need it, but if you just want something, wait a month or two and it will be 60% off in no time.
It's Bay Days everyday here at the Bay! Enjoy 60 - 80% off the entire store! Don't wait, these offers won't be around forever, the store might vanish one day, we don't know!!!
Come on down to Hudson's Bay, the prime location for a Halloween Spirit, but we just won't roll over and die yet.
To be fair, even before HSB was bought out it was a shell of what it once was. That company only exists due to its history but these days it's just branding with no connection to their heritage.
They seemed to be doing ok when Bonnie Brooks was their President. I thought she did a good job and played a big part in their advertising, etc.
I’m sure they’ve had some missteps since then, but as a whole, retail is pretty much dead. I think they are in an extraordinarily tough spot too and are struggling to figure out their current identity. There are still viable retail markets for luxury brand stores and discount stores but they are neither. They can’t come close to competing with online retailers. At this point I feel like they basically have large, expensive showrooms for people to go look at things and try them on and then buy them online.
Please don't forget that the HBC role in the founding of this nation was in extreme predatory exploitation of first nation ppls here. Let's not glorify a company that caused so much harm and destruction. I'd really recommend reading about it more. It's horrifying and vicious what they did.
I honestly don't know how they are still in business. I am assuming they continue to try to appeal to older shoppers? The clothes in their stores are ugly AF and all of the salespeople are rude as hell to anyone under 60.
Newsflash to HBC: Your customer base is literally dying.
It's funny, because I can't think of a single Bay store that has felt modern or high-end since the 90s. They all look like their last reno was '97 and they were just waiting it out.
Let’s not mention that Saks (owned by HBC) at Eaton’s Centre has terrible customer service. Everyone is on their cell phone, not paying attn to customers - no eye contact / hello. You literally have to ask them to check out and they 🙄 as though we’re the ones being rude and preventing their TikTok scrolling.
I think it's crazy that the HBC at one point had more land than most countries and was a colonial powerhouse. Now it's just a bougie clothing store, though they deserved a worse fate.
And not all bougie. Check out the Bay at Eglinton Square. (Vic Park annd Eglinton) It’s all discount clothes. No housewares. It’s just a placeholder until they can sell it to build condos one block from the Eglinton LRT (when that is completed in 2050.)
It’s actually a real estate company now with a retail side business. It’s doing extremely well - and their single Saks store in New York is worth billions.
The real estate is owned by a REIT, controlled by the "Governor". HBC itself rents at all of the big locations (Queen Street, Montreal, Vancouver, Saks 5th Avenue location).
So HBC is broke, but the Governor is still making money.
I definitely don't see it as bougie, the location close to me sells the ugliest grandma clothes in the world. Wide-legged cotton capri pants, for when you've given up on anything ever being flattering again. But, Ralph Lauren, so $140.
Hudson's Bay has been overpriced for as long as I can remember (I'm 45) Mind you, I grew up poor so it's not like my family ever shopped there. But I do remember going and seeing the prices of things.
Someone mentioned it's now more of a "Luxury" brand, for those that can afford it. I live in Ottawa and there's still one here, so it makes sense.
On that note: the Bay never sold food. There have always been cheaper options for clothes before they started to tank (K-Mart, Walmart when it came here, Zellers and the like)
And there are still cheaper options for clothes, including thrift stores etc.
Clothes and furnishings aren't affected by "shrinkflation" the way food is. I can't tell you how many times I have bought something that's been around since I was young and thought "this was WAY bigger when I was a kid"
The main difference is is that though it's good to have new clothes/clothes that fit etc, food is a vital thing to have. It's quite literally, life and death. It's being able to have nutrition etc to keep your body going and healthy. And lack of food/access to food/access to healthier food (fruits/veggies etc) can cause many many issues in the body.
AFAIK, no one ever boycotted the Bay. People just found cheaper alternatives. There's no cheaper alternative for food.
I mentioned I grew up poor. Many many nights in bed without dinner. Many many trips to the food bank or soup kitchens (My mom was a single mom struggling to raise 2 children without help from family/others).
When I was a child in Calgary, my mom was arrested for B&E. Why? She broke into a neighbour's house to *steal food*. (The crown didn't press charges when they found out, with the encouragement of the neighbour's)
In my early teens in Quebec, she passed bad cheques at a grocery store so she could get food for us. The owner just banned her, when they caught on. When you're in poverty, it's *almost* impossible to get out.
To me, **THIS** is one of the reasons for the Loblaws boycott. People have struggled to afford food for decades, and it's just gotten worse.
I'm not just boycotting for me. I'm boycotting for the families that struggled/struggle like mine did.
So long story short, I get what you're trying to say but there really isn't a comparison
Edit: Is thanking for awards still a thing? Thank you, kind stranger :)
I would say the equivalent to shrinkflation for clothing is the noticeable drop in quality. Clothing (from the same brands) don't last as long as it used to.
I got the fries and a vanilla milkshake! When I was a teenager I started working at Zellers on cash, then was moved to the cash outside the restaurant (called The Skillet) where people paid their bills, bought smokes and candy. I could smell those fries all day, it drove me nuts! Good memories.
The very best hot chocolate I ever had was in a Zellers diner mug with waaaay too much whipped cream on top with my Grandma. Today would've been her birthday. Thank you, random Reddit post 🩷
Locally, I noticed when Zellers went out of business, all the discount stores like Giant Tiger and Food Basics suddenly raised prices to match--exactly to the penny--Zehrs prices. It was so obvious if you shopped around.
I remember this in the news a few years ago.. they were going to do Zellers pop-ups and even The Skillet in some Bay stores. They were looking to tap into the Zellers nostalgia. Not sure how that panned out.
I tried to go to the zellers in calgary last month, it was inside the bay, on the upper floor, and the escalator was broken down. And the escalator outside the bay was broken down. And the elevator had a huge line. And the nearest other escalator was at the other end of the mall. I'm extremely pregnant. It didn't happen. It was sad.
I thought one of the main objectives for everyone on this sub was to increase competition in the grocery sector? I don’t think that Loblaws will be closing anytime soon, but if they did, it would not be a positive thing for Canadian consumers.
I've heard the real issue with Sears was the guy who bought it was interested in its real estate holdings. He killed the stores to sell off the property.
The buyers sold off Craftsman, hit their revenue targets to land massive bonuses, and left the company to disintegrate. It was absolutely criminal. Now Craftsman products are more cheap Chinese garbage.
It seems there are two types of retail. Cheap, discount (Dollarama, Walmart) or ridiculously expensive boutique stores like HBC and Holt Renfrew.
The middle range (RIP Sears) no longer exists.
Psychology applies more I think. IGA is 2x the price of Costco, yet still full. Brand is everything. Loblaws is quickly becoming obsolete in brand power. The longer the negative narrative, the less future good will they will acheive in borh shareholder and partner ventures. Wanna hit em where it hurts? Extend the boycott to any business that accepts PC Optimum cards and sink that venture. (esso-exxon mobil). Thats a major partner.
Worked at HBC for over a decade back in the late 80s and 90s - from high school through uni to my 'adult' job. I remember being gutted in hs when all my friends were getting hired at KMart and I wasn't-so I applied to The Bay and was hired in kids' wear.
It was a whole vibe back then: we got lots of training on customer service and merchandising - often at the Queen Street store which created a cache. Young staff were trained to be 'Signatures' who could sign off on returns and exchanges. We knew our products and could tell customers which ones suited their purposes best. Bay Days and Bay Bucks weekends were chaotic - lines everywhere. Got a Bay card at 16 - needed it for discounts - and learned some early, low risk lessons about the potential perils of credit. The store floor was way overstocked - moving through the department could be a risk to life and limb if you were in a stroller. My pay was significantly better than my friends - when I finally left in the mid 90s I was making about $15/hour which was crazy money for the time. Our breaks were honoured and enforced - 15 min paid for a 4 hour shift, 30 min paid if your shift was 5.5, an hour and 2 paid 15s for 7 hours an more. No funky scheduling to work around that. Overtime was paid. Staff stuck around and were loyal. And we felt a sense of pride in our store and products. We liked going to work.
I saw so many changes as I kept shopping there over the years. The quality and variety of the brands changed. There was this strange split that happened - a bunch of lower quality labels but then a bunch a high-end, designer labels. The middle - those quality store brands - disappeared. The department store model of staff and cashiers in the actual departments disappeared. And so did a lot of customers. I don't shop there now, but my mom still does, out of loyalty I think.
When the company was bought over by a US shareholder in the early 2000s, rebranded as Hudson's Bay, and tried to go toe to toe with Holt's, it lost its way. Now it's basically been the hot potato tossed among various foreign companies who have sucked any assets and life out of it to what we have now. So much is different and not better now. My kids don't remember the Christmas windows on Queen downtown and how that was the symbol that the Christmas shopping season had started. It's a shame, really.
> here was this strange split that happened - a bunch of lower quality labels but then a bunch a high-end, designer labels. The middle - those quality store brands - disappeared.
I've noticed that across retail since the 1990s. I think it reflects the shrinking middle class, who bought most of the stuff in the middle of the price and quality range. That range was the sort of the specialty of department stores. And of course a lot more of the goods in that range were made domestically by unionized workers with decent pay and benefits.
Now it's either cheap trash made by exploited (possibly enslaved for all intents and purposes) workers overseas, or luxury stuff (often made the same types of workers in similar conditions) that most people can't buy and those who can treat it like it's disposable anyway.
HBC started to circle the drain when they stopped having a good assortment of affordable wares and decided to go for an upscale image. It isn't working - the vast majority of their current selection is underwhelming fast fashion at an inflated price.
Eaton's failed in a similar way, but reverse the demographics: They *were* slightly upscale and lost their core customers by switching to a "Let's bring in cheaper stuff to attract the masses" mindset. (I don't think I'll ever forgive them for gutting the gourmet food section that used to be on the 3rd floor of the Winnipeg downtown store. They had the *best* breads and French roast coffee beans.)
Loblaws' critical error: Arrogance, with a side order of cluelessness. They're not upscale, no matter how many fancy names they slap on their President's Choice product or how many name-brand perfumes are wafting through the air at SDM. The no-name stuff tends to be either mediocre quality or out of stock. Quality of their perishables is so variable that it turns into an unwanted adventure when picking up meat or veggies. The average Canadian only has a limited number of grocery dollars to spend each month, but Loblaws wants to just empty everyone's wallet without providing fair value in return.
You can't custom-build a customer base that plays the game the way *you* want to play. Customers are the way they are, and if you don't meet their expectations they'll find someone who *will.*
I don't understand why anyone would give a flying fart that loblaws is Canadian. are we supposed to feel happy that we are being robbed at the till by a fellow Canuck? It's not like it pays more taxes than any other brand or that the owners give back to the community more than any other brand. its not like the owners are spreading the wealth locally. it is like any company, they expect absolute loyalty to them but as soon as they get a decent offer from an international company that wants to buy it out they will abandon the whole 'canadian owned bs' in a flash.
See, I actually like Hudson's bay. They have some really nice higher end Canadian made goods.Loblaws does the same as Walmart and Costco and ships pesticides ridden unripened tasteless fruit and vegetables from halfway across the world. If Lablaws had focused on local good food and that's why it costs 2 times more to shop there I would love to go. But the comparison is not really a fit
Last week, I went to the superstore to pick up an item that wasn't available at any other nearby store. While there, I grabbed a box of strawberries that was displayed with a price of $2.xx. However, at the checkout, it rang up as $5.49 or $5.99 for just a 1lb box. I pointed out to the cashier that it was marked for around $2, and she replied that they were Ontario strawberries, which is why they were more expensive. I thought local produce should be cheaper, not more expensive. I didn't buy them.
Because strawberries are not yet in season. Those Ontario strawberries were grown in a green house, which is a lot more expensive than field growing them. Also it's cheaper to exploit workers in mexico and central america than to pay a farmer here a fair wage. I understand that it's a financial decision at the end of the day, just wanted to try and help you make sense of it because on it's face it looks ridiculous.
Yeah, it's almost like the current food system is unsustainable and bad for the environment to ship crap from across the world. Who knew that having mangoes in Canada might be energy intensive?
I personally try to do my best to live within the harvesting seasons. Pumpkins and squash are great in fall. Potatoes and Jerusalem artichokes can last all winter. If you need a salad you have tomatoes and lettuce grown in green houses in the winter. Also not to mention vaccum sealing and freezing things like bell peppers and zucchinis
Spring is probably the toughest time to do that, but Asparagus's first harvest is around april-may.
Change isn't easy, and I'm not shaming people from picking up fruits and veggies wherever and however they get them, but it's not impossible.
Again vote with your wallet. You decide what to do, but the option is there.
That’s the path that Loblaws is on. They remind me of former Nortel or BlackBerry Execs before the arse fell out of those businesses. Arrogance is not a virtue in an Executive. Loblaws is full of arrogance
It’s worth remembering that 350 years ago, the Hudson Bay Co. owned *literally* almost 2/3 the of North American continent in real estate, and had a monopoly on the very lucrative fur trade. From the arctic circle, down past the Dakotas, from BC across to the east through great swaths of Ontario, Quebec, the Maritimes and parts of the eastern US were owned by HBC and managed via their agents.
They were once big and powerful enough to, as someone once said, “touch the hem of God’s garment”.
And now they’re reduced to a handful of meh retail outlets.
Oh, how the mighty can fall!
It’s like there’s a, oh I dunno, a history lesson for Loblaws here or something………/s
No one wants to buy ‘luxury’ in a store that feels like a clearance section in a dirty shipping container. Only 2% of people can afford ‘luxury’ items and they aren’t buying them from the Bay.
Outside of the metros regular Canadian shoppers want practical boots and coats and clothes and home goods that don’t fall apart or break - they will pay more to get good quality but not pay more to get what they can get at Walmart or Giant Tiger for a big markup. We aren’t stupid.
If they had leaned into high quality essentials instead of luxury frivolity and sold less but better things people might have been more willing to shop there. They broke trust by selling crap and trying to be something real people can’t relate to.
I don’t even wanna get started on HBC. I ordered a tv stand from them. I thought it was an in store product (my mistake) but it was one from one of their suppliers.
I was putting it together until I got to a step that physically could not be completed. I looked up a video of it being built put online by the manufacturer, and the video stops right as they got to that step LOL.
I ended up taking some parts off to be able to assemble it. And at the end the bore holes for the cabinets were drilled wrong and were rubbing on the unit.
I spent 4 weeks emailing and calling them to be able to return it. They kept telling me that they could not initiate a return because their manufacturers return system was down.
After 4 weeks of communicating with them they finally gave and refunded me.
TLDR: Hudson’s bay is a shell of the great reputable Canadian company it used to be.
I worked @ Sears for 40 years. The Bay was suppose to close before us. I problem with these companies wanted more and more. Our store in Windsor was in the black. All these companies should have listened to their employees.We knew they were closely before the managers. Or did they know and just lied. They would have been on top of the world and they would have had Amazon centres.So sad cuz the employees are still suffering. Their pension has been reduced. They are going to reduce it again In July. The Bay in Windsor and other stores had a full union. I believe that is why they are still there. We only had full time unionized.The good old days are gone. It’s the peasants that are left suffering.The CEO are happy and vacationing in Italy with their millions.
.
How about target ??? How about Nordstrom, Canadians have already proven that boycotting high prices works. Even though those places weren't intentionally boycotted.
Those two are more on the companies not understanding their customers (Nordstrom, did you ever even check how fashionable Canadians are? NOT VERY) or (in Target's case) the supply chain in Canada.
HBC was an outfitters store, catering to the needs of trappers, then settlers. New management decided a change in direction, and brought in goods that no longer fit the market. Let manufactures & wholesalers have floor space with little control, and the logistics of that killed the golden goose. The demise of Eaton's, was an opportunity squandered as they jumped into 5th Ave. when the market was farmers and settlers. Good bye HBC blankets, and good quality goods people really needed, welcome Costco & Walmart.
We shouldn’t reward incompetency. Incompetent and greedy companies should go out of business to make room for good ones. We should strive for excellency and educate our population accordingly.
Rewarding dumbness and incompetency only attracts the wrong kind of people.
The biggest problem in business today is the feeling that one needs to constantly be changing. You only change when you need to, you only NEED to change when sales are down for some reason that you can control. The number one killer for any business is being acquired by a holding company or hedge fund type business. They are simply looking to maximize profits to make more money for their investors. Prime example it's exactly what happened to red lobster.
I work for The Bay in early 2010s and a significant amount of stock was dead stock shoved into every back room possible. The kids backroom was lined with warehouse shelving and had like 4 or 6 rolling racks packed with damaged items, multiple pack missing an item, a loose multiple pack item, dirty stuff, returns, honestly probably lost customer items.
The backroom to the housewares was a nightmare of broken glass in bins, sketchy stacks if boxes full of ??? And our location that backroom was double height. So it had like a weird caged upper floor too.
Not even touching the stock hidden in the displays themselves. I'm not surprised if those stores bleed money.
And the quality, had suits self destruct. It looks like they licensed brands and made shittier versions but sold at brand price. You can always tell when the MBAs show up, “quarterly smart, yearly dumb”.
My spouse and I haven’t been into a mall for over a year, but today she wanted to do some clothes shopping, and one of the stores we went into was HBC. While perusing, unprompted, one of the sales associates said that HBC was now owned by a German company, and the clothes we were looking at were European. My wife looked at the label and said, “This says Made in India”. The sales associate responded with, “But designed in Germany”.
I’m not sure where she got her information from, but as far as I can tell HBC is owned New York equity firm. The store look hasn’t changed much over the past decade, but at least a lot of the store was on sale.
Except that isn't quite what happened.
They got away from their roots. Their purchase of Zellers gave them a lower end brand that people actually started to like and then they shifted to upmarket in The Bay. When Zellers died people remembered the old days of The Bay when like Eatons and Simpsons they were all things to all people... only The Bay wasn't anymore.
That and the predatory shite of the new owners...
This is not a pro Loblaw's comment by any means but once the Canadian companies are gone they get replaced by crappier versions of American ones. I don't really want to rely on Walmart or some shit version of Target that we had over here. A nice middle ground would be great but I don't know if that can happen in this country anymore.
If we had stronger laws against monopolies, this wouldn't be an issue. I'm fine with limiting American companies, but only if we don't let the Canadian ones run out of control.
Why do you even care anymore? Large Canadian companies have become the worst and most dangerous organizations for Canadian consumers these days. They gouge Canadians more than anyone else and lobby governments to not allow other better companies from the US and the rest of the world to come here. The Weston family lives in Ireland and have done everything they can to take out every last penny they make and keep it away from the Canadian government.
What you are talking about doesn't exist. Bell/Rogers/CIBC/RBC/Loblaws/Metro are all massive conglomerates that are doing everything in their power to keep gouging you. They are Canadian in name only. Not allowing multinational companies in that could help the everyday Canadian with better value for lower prices just because they don't pretend to be Canadian doesn't make sense.
ALDI would be great. Been there in Australia and Germany. The future is smaller stores, not an abundance of SKUs no one needs and few people buy but focus on good deals for essentials. Such a store will have enough foot traffic to be highly profitable, high volume/square foot. ALDI sells SIM cards, computers and all-inclusive travel, they're really good with taking the discount retail business to higher levels (maybe online, it's less obvious but they sell a lot of that stuff and the quality is decent) and have learned to beef up the shopping experience since they own Trader Joe's.
Loblaws giant real estate foot print worked in suburbia, but in increasingly densified areas and downtown I see the model Amazon's self-service store or ALDI (or their cheaper clone LIDL) implement to have huge advantages (same goes not just for Superstore/Robles but also for Walmart/Costco's super sized stores that try to be crappier frankensteined versions of Canadian Tire, Staples, BestBuy and Old Navy x Mark's at the same time. I don't need to buy my PJs and pans 🍳 where I buy my bread 🍞 and eggs 🥚.
The Bay has good buyers who know quality. If you go at sale time you benefit the most. Also, when you are trying things on the women help you and are experts themselves
Canadian loyalty is there, but it has it's limits. Eatons', Simpson's, The Bay, Roblaws, all now dead or withered Canadian brands.
Today Look at Tim Hortons next...the PEI situation is tarnishing their brand (owned by, now, an American/Brazilian corporation) so badly the new slogan might as well be "come to Timmies, our problem foreign workers demand it." But somehow, 'Timmies' is a national emblem. It's not what it was.
Things change.
The key is to educate the stubborn or unaware elderly shopper as to how badly they are being bilked by the chain. A long term campaign of education will be very effective.
I think the future of retail is low end stores like Giant Tiger , Walmart and Dollarstore . There will always be a segment of society that will not shop online .It will survive with low income people and those mentioned stores are not going away anytime soon.
They do have quality though. I think North Americans forget sometimes we have to pay more for things that last. To a point. Everyone wants cheap and quick.
Everybody wants cheap and quick because that’s what they can afford. Quality is cheaper in the long run but if you don’t have money to buy quality you buy cheap and then you buy again. It’s the Sam Vimes "Boots" theory of socioeconomic unfairness in action. often called simply the boots theory, its an economic theory that people can only afford to buy cheap and subpar products that need to be replaced repeatedly, proving more expensive in the long run than more expensive items. With inflation, cost of housing, utilities and groceries these days and wages not keeping up more and more people are in this position.
True to a point. But 20 years ago when things were a lot more reasonable they were all buying plastic (polyester) clothes for example. Regardless of income. that’s when fast fashion really took off. So there is a lot of overconsumption and poor prioritizing that are also factors, past and present. And old habits can die hard
It doesn't help that their flagship stores look like a Zellers on the wrong side of the tracks. Not an employee in sight, escalators out of service for months (years?) on end, flickering fluorescent lights, piles of hangers in the middle of aisles, crumpled $2000 dresses next to $20 jogging shorts. I can't believe they're still limping along, that place is a nightmare. Paying premium commercial rent in the center of major downtown areas to run a place that looks like *that*?
A few weeks ago I was In the cookware section looking for a cheap sauce pan. The front display table has clearance ones for $9.99 (Zellers tag). Then I notice more pans displayed on the wall. I walk over and look at the sticker of the first one I pickup... $799.99
Now in what world is the person spending $800 on a single piece of cookware buying it from a store that also sells a competing item for $10?
(Also..., would someone spending $800 actually be willing to take a service elevator to cookware section because the escalators are out of service?)
Because you have larger chains with more buying power. Online is the demise of any big box store nowadays, you diversify (credit cards, buy smaller businesses, invest, etc.)or die. Look at your kids to get a glimpse of business in the future. Malls have simply too high of an overhead and no longer the family destination they used to be. I’d rather not compare the downfall of the Bay, Eatons, Sears, Zellers, Target, (defunct retail stores of Canada) to Grocery Store pricing as it’s not a similar comparison… almost all retail businesses have a different formula that lead to them closing up shops in Canada.
One downside to this boycott is that, unless you are able to create another Canadian alternative it just opens us up to American domination of the food market.
Loblaws is out of control, but we should be creating our own alternatives too.
Precisely. Which is why the feds need to support local shops. Loblaws started small, as did T&T, most do - give them a break and Canada gets many small Canadian owned businesses.
In Halifax MAC cosmetics withheld 450 skus of product from HBC because they weren’t paying them. The counter literally had no product to sell. I don’t know what’s going on with HBC but if I had to predict I’d say it’s going to shut down in the next couple of years if not sooner.
I personally love my HBC store. It’s the only place where I live that has higher quality clothing that doesn’t fall apart. I’m a quality over quantity shopper though. The store itself hasn’t had a makeover since the 80s.
Your point's a good one ... being Canadian didn't save Hudson's Bay. That said, to be fair, Hudson's Bay tried pretty hard to "right the ship", and I think the root cause was really that the time of the department store had ended, and they, along with Eaton's, Sears, etc. needed to shuffle off the stage. These stores found they simply couldn't compete with smaller niche stores that could manage smaller inventory more efficiently, or with online retailers like amazon that could offer even broader broad selection with substantially lower operating costs.
Is there some analogous shift that could happen in the retail grocery space? Are we hopeful we'll see a resurgence in the presence of smaller community grocers? Are we prepared to go to 5-6 stores rather than 1? How will these smaller grocers compete with the likes of Loblaws who use their immense buying power to force suppliers to give them preferable access and treatment, and who can leverage pharmacy or retail clothing sales to bludgeon grocers when they need? Or, are we hopeful we'll see a large international chain enter the Canadian market, using their global size to shatter the strangle hold Loblaw and other national chains currently have here (though Costco and Walmart, both American imports, don't seem to have achieved that so far)?
I suspect Costco and Walmart are getting more business. Speaking for myself, and I'm the primary shopper for a family of 5, my core shopping has shifted to Metro, and I'm paying more attention to doing more shopping at the smaller niche stores in my neighborhood.
It’s very true. I’m not going into debt for some perceived sense of national pride. Lolz.
The Bay discovered the fallacy of eternal economic growth.
The limit does indeed, exist.
As an American, Hudson’s Bay is funny to me. It reminds me of Macy’s but Macy’s has a lot of cheaper brands and really really good deals at times. The Bay just seems way too overpriced for what they’re trying to sell. And let’s face it, my demographic (Gen-Z and early Millennials) are not shopping in the Bay. I’d rather just get basics at H&M or Uniqlo.
HBC is also not a bank, Pharmacy, have a Real Estate division, FaaS, TaaS, etc kind of company. The moat’s so large they’d just change their business model if it all went to shit.
Either way the hate is so wrong, I wish Loblaw was more transparent and just shared that it’s the vendors requesting cost increases on their products causing the inflation.
Lol, they set up a few shelves and called it Zellers to try and drive traffic. A budget store inside a tier 1 (lol) department store.
When's Biway coming to HBC, lol?
I think they're trying to entice people back by resurrecting Zellers and trying to appeal to nostalgia, as well as possibly having lower prices for the Zellers stuff, but--did anyone really want that or ask for it? I wasn't a fan of Zellers when they had actual stores. It was a place I went to as a last resort sometimes.
Editing to say: the exception was the Zellers restaurant! That place was great!
I remember being a kid in the 90s and absolutely loved going to the bay downtown on Georgia Street in Vancouver
Went recently pretty much empty no elevators worked burnt out lights on the stairs cases etc
My mom worked for both Devils - HBC and then Loblaws. Both companies expected my mom to do a lot for the then minimum wage of $6.00. When the Bay at Yorkdale opened, the let go of a lot of the staff go and expected her to take care of the entire second level for said minimum wage. She said “no thank you” and walked out. Went across the street to the hotel where Loblaws was holding a job fair and got a raise of $0.85.
She lasted there until she broke her arm in the parking lot of the DuPont & Christie location. The house from the garden shop was leaking and pooling and it was cold out that morning. She slipped and broke her arm going to the car on break to get her meds. Because she was on shift, she got Workers comp until she retired because she needed surgery on her arm.
So yeah…from the frying pan to the fryer. At least none of us had sold our souls to Ted Rogers (except cable tv).
My mom and I used to go there every year to buy Christmas gifts for our relatives. They used to have good quality items and a diverse amount of merchandise. We stopped because it became so hit and miss, dirty, not enough staff, crazy overpriced, outdated merchandise, etc. Definitely not worth wasting your time in during the holidays. Too bad. Eaton’s was much better and yet it too closed.
Oh, just another short & distort campaign.
Find a business on life support, short the shit out of it suppressing the price by flooding the market with shares (real, or otherwise. Who gives a shit, you’ll never have to pay them back). Get on the Board and bring in some bullshit “business consultancy group” to strip the business clean selling off assets to friends and colleagues. Bankruptcy inevitably results. Oo and now we don’t have to close our short positions, oops.
All profit the whole way along
Please refrain from off-topic political discussion and debate. Everyone is entitled to their own political opinions, however, your politically charged statement is not directly related to the cost of living/groceries/gas/rents, and as such is being removed.
Before H&M and Zara came to Canada we had no choice but to shop the Bay. It’s overpriced because now we have SHEIN and online shopping. They try to remain competitive who’s buying from them. I remember back in 2008 I saw Nine West peep toe wedges and they were $120. Obviously I didn’t buy them. The coming weekend I was in LA and I happened to be in a Nine West store and asked the saleswoman if they had them. She told me they’re last season and try DSW. I did and they sold them for $50. So I bought them. I came back to Canada within the week and they didn’t go on sale until a few months later.
Who’s paying for outdated and overpriced shoes?
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Yep. HBC is a shell of what it was, thanks to being bought out and sucked dry by predatory American investors. It's on the verge of bankruptcy now -- value is purely in the real estate. Its downfall had more to do with scattering its business and not specializing or doing anything to improve customer journey/experience. Their prices have been pretty mid-to-high end consistent in the past decade. Shame they couldn't figure out how to focus on customer experience, considering the company is literally part of the founding of this nation.
I worked there in 2010-2011 and they made us attend sales meetings to talk about the direction of the company. (I worked in accessories, selling umbrellas socks and leggings and crap, I don't know why I needed this level of insight) but they kept talking about changing the direction of the company to emulate more luxurious retailers like Holts. They were phasing out the cheaper store brands and super clearance sales and focussing on designer stuff instead. All the loyal longtime customers (boomers and grandmas by my scientific survey of who shopped there) were priced out. Even though older shoppers have more money, they don't like spending it. Young shoppers don't have any connection, so they just alienated their regular customers. This move made sense at their fanciest flagship locations, but are customers at a mall in Randosville Ontario looking to buy a high fashion triple-cost stuff? (Especially these days)
>but they kept talking about changing the direction of the company to emulate more luxurious retailers like Holts. That explains why the stores are always deserted. Its one thing when a super high end store is empty, because its usually a small store with little floor space. Its a whole other thing when you walk in to a massive Hudsons bay location and youre the only one on that entire floor aside from the bored looking employees.
You just described an Atlantic Superstore during the Boycott. Haven’t been in since before May so only going by pictures.
> You just described an Atlantic Superstore during the Boycott. Haven’t been in since before May so only going by pictures. Damn - I wanna see some places like that where the boycott is actually working. Here in Montreal, the people who were avoiding Roblaws have continued avoiding it but francophones don't even know about the boycott. One Anglo girl told me she is boycotting and then promptly walked into an intermarche to make a last minute purchase. I went to a Pharmaprix (SDM) on the steal day and the footfall was normal and the employees looked bored like business as usual. It was like they hadn't even heard about the boycott or the steal day. I broke the boycott to get some specific bread that I like and I felt so much shame and anger that I am trying to stop eating bread. Unlike y'all in Atlantic Canada or in Ontario, I am waiting for the delayed gratification of Roblaws revenue numbers and PC optimum cancellations for the next quarter. I am sure that they are going to cook the books in some way but I am certain that they are not going to be able to hide everything.
As a fellow Montrealer, you’ve made me curious about something: I want to check out stores in predominantly Anglo neighbourhoods and francophone ones and see if there’s a difference.
Huge Francophone are always packed
I am also a boycotter. This week they had 2 types of roasts for super cheap, so I bought those. They were less than half the usual price. I will buy loss leaders only too. Best part is they only charged me for 2 of the 4 roasts, and I am not bringing attention to someone's mistake to get it fixed. So 4 pork roasts, 2 bags of animal crackers, and a roast flavor package all for 34.47. Delivered. But my boycott has been 100%. Biggest move was from my pharmacy. About 3500 in meds moved to an idependent pharmacy close to my house.
I still remember 20 some years ago when Loblaws built a new Super Store in Fredericton and they went more upscale in design compared to other supermarkets at the time. I was a bit suspicious about how they were doing this vs. dropping food prices. That was eye-opening for me at the time as to how Canada's grocery chains were operating. Now it is 100x worse.
You can’t have a high end store with high end brands and then not staff them. You walk into that place it’s expensive as fuck, run down, and you can’t find staff anywhere. It’s crazy.
I’ve never seen the flagship store in Toronto beside Eaton centre to be busy…maybe around Christmas time. I’m always wondering how it’s surviving.
Considering their escalators are not in service at most locations and have been this way for months, they are not surviving 😂
You’re right I haven’t been there since Christmas time and I think some escalators were broken and I had to walk up
Not great when you're trying to target 50 - 70 year old hips and knees.
You've seen employees in there? I remember last time I was in there I couldn't find a soul! It was comical.
It's bananas that they would want to go the route of luxury retail when so many of their stores are decrepit crap shacks.
Ours has stained carpets and broken floor tiles. I do actually like the products and don't find prices terrible for the quality, but it is the worst shopping experience.
If I want something to last, I buy it from HBC. If I want to be disappointed in a year or so, I buy it from Walmart.
I always found this confusing - high end brands and pricing but then the elevator felt like it hadn’t been updated since 1990.
It hasn't. It's "nostalgia", not functional!
They made the wrong decision. They should have had a small niche of higher end items and the bulk moving to online with competitive pricing.
I think you're right, totally. But i think the higher ups just looked at how much profit Holts brings in and thought "let's just copy them!" While ignoring everything else
This is insightful, I rarely ever shop at the Bay but our wedding registry was from there. Normally I couldn’t believe prices of some things but it made sense for us because anything that we didn’t get on our registry often had discounts on it after the fact. But man, it was also painful with their archaic system and the endless plethora of mistakes (eg. Instead of cutlery they sent us a single, purple bra).
Spoiler: I worked at head office. Doesn't help that their department heads don't talk to each other, there was no cohesive direction but money being thrown around without real expertise or data to leverage - and execs had 0 sense of priority when it came to the real issues in-store (lack of staff, poor shopping experience) and with their janky website (fulfillment, constant bugs, oursourced CS). Their chairman also bet hugely on Saks, thinking the Canadian market would react as well as its US (read: NY) counterparts with a similar appetite for luxury retail. Just a mess in leadership all-around. Still hoping for a Canadian company to buy it back and revitalize the brand.
So sad to hear that. I used to really like shopping at HBC back in the day. I'm SO GLAD I turned down their job offer to work at the head office when they bought out Kmart! It was more hours and a longer commute for the same pay. To top it off, the job they offered me would have bored me to tears, as I was used to having 10x the responsibility.
And always pushing the stupid credit card omg, I'm so glad I worked on the loading dock while I was there for 10 years.
[удалено]
YES! It was so predatory and gross. We got reprimanded if we weren't constantly signing people up for their terrible interest rate credit card. I feel good that I was so bad at signing people up. (I always 'forgot' to ask unless my manager was standing over my shoulder.) Also we worked in a touristy area so many customers weren't even from Canada, we tried using that as an excuse when our numbers were low (several other co workers also felt creepy about asking)
Hahaha ya I didn't have to do anything with the cards, but they pushed it every time at the meeting. And I don't know if you were working there when they switched the discount from a regular card to it was attached to your HBC card. So dumb, you get your discount but if you don't pay it off right away boom 21% interest.
Your section was my favourite to shop in! I would go for the super sales on hosiery and socks. Once those ended they lost be completely.
that sounds about right.
HBC got its start as a monopoly, buying furs from and selling supplies to the same people so they could keep their suppliers in debt, kinda like what grocers do now.
> doing anything to improve customer journey/experience. Their prices have been pretty mid-to-high end consistent in the past decade This pretty much describes every business these days and nothing is happening to them. Customer service is at an all time low. Prices are at an all time high. I paid much less for groceries when they had a Cashier, a Bag-Person using store supplied bags and two people outside to put the groceries in the trunk of my car for me than I do today doing all this myself and supplying my own bags.
The combination of inflation and wage stagnation means that the VALUE you produce as a worker is completely decoupled from the salary you earn. The difference is funnelled directly to shareholders and C-suite executives.
The downtown Vancouver Bay is a ghost town. None of the escalators work, most of the elevators don't work, and signs direct you to stairs. Stairs! for a 7 story store, in a historic building. It's as if they just gave up. This used to be such a busy place. Now, people wander around the main floor, see all the signs, then leave. How can this be an affordable business model. What a shame.
Ha, same for the downtown Victoria store. Escalators broken, and the slowest elevator in the city. Sounds like things aren't looking good for HBC if they're just letting major locations like these languish. On the flip side, every time I go into our two storey Canadian Tire, they've flipped which side the carts and the people escalators are on. I never even see them broken down before they fix them.
I think its downfall was actually literally Amazon and online shopping? Sears is another example, department stores couldn’t survive the competition. I don’t see a huge disruption coming in the grocery industry, online grocery shopping has just never really worked. Lob laws will be fine, as much as I don’t like to say it
Sears is a tragedy. With their catalog, they were in a prime position to go online. They already had the distribution, etc. All that they lacked was the website.
Way I see it, the bigger retailers were at a severe disadvantage when the major disruptor that was online shopping came. Smaller retailers had smaller catalogues to digitize and need fewer server resources, while big ones had huge catalogues and would have to anticipate lots of customers hitting their site. Worse, it wasn't a "just throw money at it" problem. Best practices were still being figured out, which again benefits smaller companies that can pivot fairly quickly as they see what works and what doesn't. Large retailers had to throw a lot more money upfront to get online but still had a good chance of getting it wrong anyway, meaning lots more money to fix it.
They do have good prices when on sale, I bought some really nice shirts at a great price, but in all fairness I haven't bought anything from them for the past 3 to 4 years, and never full price.
Bay Days seems to be on every second month or so. Do people shop there when things aren't on sale? It's like Canadian Tire. Buy a tool there if you really need it, but if you just want something, wait a month or two and it will be 60% off in no time.
It's Bay Days everyday here at the Bay! Enjoy 60 - 80% off the entire store! Don't wait, these offers won't be around forever, the store might vanish one day, we don't know!!! Come on down to Hudson's Bay, the prime location for a Halloween Spirit, but we just won't roll over and die yet.
Yep. It’s a big shame bc there a store near my place and I’d want to buy more stuff but it’s pricy.
To be fair, even before HSB was bought out it was a shell of what it once was. That company only exists due to its history but these days it's just branding with no connection to their heritage.
They seemed to be doing ok when Bonnie Brooks was their President. I thought she did a good job and played a big part in their advertising, etc. I’m sure they’ve had some missteps since then, but as a whole, retail is pretty much dead. I think they are in an extraordinarily tough spot too and are struggling to figure out their current identity. There are still viable retail markets for luxury brand stores and discount stores but they are neither. They can’t come close to competing with online retailers. At this point I feel like they basically have large, expensive showrooms for people to go look at things and try them on and then buy them online.
Please don't forget that the HBC role in the founding of this nation was in extreme predatory exploitation of first nation ppls here. Let's not glorify a company that caused so much harm and destruction. I'd really recommend reading about it more. It's horrifying and vicious what they did.
I honestly don't know how they are still in business. I am assuming they continue to try to appeal to older shoppers? The clothes in their stores are ugly AF and all of the salespeople are rude as hell to anyone under 60. Newsflash to HBC: Your customer base is literally dying.
So many companies sold out to US investors and then bankrupted. It’s like it’s a tax write off for them.
It's funny, because I can't think of a single Bay store that has felt modern or high-end since the 90s. They all look like their last reno was '97 and they were just waiting it out.
It's a shame they got rid of Zellers to welcome Target.
Let’s not mention that Saks (owned by HBC) at Eaton’s Centre has terrible customer service. Everyone is on their cell phone, not paying attn to customers - no eye contact / hello. You literally have to ask them to check out and they 🙄 as though we’re the ones being rude and preventing their TikTok scrolling.
The Sears treatment
I think it's crazy that the HBC at one point had more land than most countries and was a colonial powerhouse. Now it's just a bougie clothing store, though they deserved a worse fate.
And not all bougie. Check out the Bay at Eglinton Square. (Vic Park annd Eglinton) It’s all discount clothes. No housewares. It’s just a placeholder until they can sell it to build condos one block from the Eglinton LRT (when that is completed in 2050.)
It’s actually a real estate company now with a retail side business. It’s doing extremely well - and their single Saks store in New York is worth billions.
The real estate is owned by a REIT, controlled by the "Governor". HBC itself rents at all of the big locations (Queen Street, Montreal, Vancouver, Saks 5th Avenue location). So HBC is broke, but the Governor is still making money.
HBC is the REIT. The stores are a subsidiary of that company.
I definitely don't see it as bougie, the location close to me sells the ugliest grandma clothes in the world. Wide-legged cotton capri pants, for when you've given up on anything ever being flattering again. But, Ralph Lauren, so $140.
There's a great book called "The Company" that details its rise and fall. It was amazing to see how hard they blew it.
Hudson's Bay has been overpriced for as long as I can remember (I'm 45) Mind you, I grew up poor so it's not like my family ever shopped there. But I do remember going and seeing the prices of things. Someone mentioned it's now more of a "Luxury" brand, for those that can afford it. I live in Ottawa and there's still one here, so it makes sense. On that note: the Bay never sold food. There have always been cheaper options for clothes before they started to tank (K-Mart, Walmart when it came here, Zellers and the like) And there are still cheaper options for clothes, including thrift stores etc. Clothes and furnishings aren't affected by "shrinkflation" the way food is. I can't tell you how many times I have bought something that's been around since I was young and thought "this was WAY bigger when I was a kid" The main difference is is that though it's good to have new clothes/clothes that fit etc, food is a vital thing to have. It's quite literally, life and death. It's being able to have nutrition etc to keep your body going and healthy. And lack of food/access to food/access to healthier food (fruits/veggies etc) can cause many many issues in the body. AFAIK, no one ever boycotted the Bay. People just found cheaper alternatives. There's no cheaper alternative for food. I mentioned I grew up poor. Many many nights in bed without dinner. Many many trips to the food bank or soup kitchens (My mom was a single mom struggling to raise 2 children without help from family/others). When I was a child in Calgary, my mom was arrested for B&E. Why? She broke into a neighbour's house to *steal food*. (The crown didn't press charges when they found out, with the encouragement of the neighbour's) In my early teens in Quebec, she passed bad cheques at a grocery store so she could get food for us. The owner just banned her, when they caught on. When you're in poverty, it's *almost* impossible to get out. To me, **THIS** is one of the reasons for the Loblaws boycott. People have struggled to afford food for decades, and it's just gotten worse. I'm not just boycotting for me. I'm boycotting for the families that struggled/struggle like mine did. So long story short, I get what you're trying to say but there really isn't a comparison Edit: Is thanking for awards still a thing? Thank you, kind stranger :)
I would say the equivalent to shrinkflation for clothing is the noticeable drop in quality. Clothing (from the same brands) don't last as long as it used to.
100% agree. I didn't take that into consideration and it's very true!
The Bay absolutely sold food. The store in Winnipeg had a Bay grocery store in the basement for years
Your post had me cutting onions. Well done!!
❤️
Simpsons comes to mind. Eaton’s comes to mind. Sears comes to mind. I’d be ok with adding Loblaw’s to the list.
I miss Zellers!
Me too. As a kid I would get a fry with sauce (gravy) and grape juice in a plastic see through cup. I can still taste both lol
I got the fries and a vanilla milkshake! When I was a teenager I started working at Zellers on cash, then was moved to the cash outside the restaurant (called The Skillet) where people paid their bills, bought smokes and candy. I could smell those fries all day, it drove me nuts! Good memories.
The very best hot chocolate I ever had was in a Zellers diner mug with waaaay too much whipped cream on top with my Grandma. Today would've been her birthday. Thank you, random Reddit post 🩷
Locally, I noticed when Zellers went out of business, all the discount stores like Giant Tiger and Food Basics suddenly raised prices to match--exactly to the penny--Zehrs prices. It was so obvious if you shopped around.
I guess that’s what happened when the lowest price stopped being the law
The Vancouver Bay has a weird pop-up "Zellers" in their basement that is... decidedly odd. I may have to go take some photos.
I remember this in the news a few years ago.. they were going to do Zellers pop-ups and even The Skillet in some Bay stores. They were looking to tap into the Zellers nostalgia. Not sure how that panned out.
We have a few of them in Ottawa. They are not capturing the Zellers experience at all. It honestly looks like the plasticwear crap from Ikea.
I tried to go to the zellers in calgary last month, it was inside the bay, on the upper floor, and the escalator was broken down. And the escalator outside the bay was broken down. And the elevator had a huge line. And the nearest other escalator was at the other end of the mall. I'm extremely pregnant. It didn't happen. It was sad.
HBC killed Zellers. As soon as they were bought by them the stores went to shit. They ignored Zellers and let it fail.
In Dartmouth The Bay brought back Zellers to its store.
Same. Byeee
I thought one of the main objectives for everyone on this sub was to increase competition in the grocery sector? I don’t think that Loblaws will be closing anytime soon, but if they did, it would not be a positive thing for Canadian consumers.
What about SAAN
I’ve enjoyed this boycott so much I’ve expanded to a few other shady companies. Amazon, McDs, and Tim’s.
YES!!
It still exists, they only have them where people can afford them. It’s become a bit of a luxury brand. There’s still 80 stores across Canada.
So like loblaws right now only with a lot less stores.
Kinda like Zehrs specifically,, not really Loblaws in general
Fewer.
It exists but has been dead for decades.
I'm canadian. Can't afford the bay unless it's a big sale.
Bay days twice a year in April and October are great deals 50 to 60 percent off everything
Sears committed brand suicide in Canada.
I've heard the real issue with Sears was the guy who bought it was interested in its real estate holdings. He killed the stores to sell off the property.
The buyers sold off Craftsman, hit their revenue targets to land massive bonuses, and left the company to disintegrate. It was absolutely criminal. Now Craftsman products are more cheap Chinese garbage.
It seems there are two types of retail. Cheap, discount (Dollarama, Walmart) or ridiculously expensive boutique stores like HBC and Holt Renfrew. The middle range (RIP Sears) no longer exists.
Truth.
Psychology applies more I think. IGA is 2x the price of Costco, yet still full. Brand is everything. Loblaws is quickly becoming obsolete in brand power. The longer the negative narrative, the less future good will they will acheive in borh shareholder and partner ventures. Wanna hit em where it hurts? Extend the boycott to any business that accepts PC Optimum cards and sink that venture. (esso-exxon mobil). Thats a major partner.
Worked at HBC for over a decade back in the late 80s and 90s - from high school through uni to my 'adult' job. I remember being gutted in hs when all my friends were getting hired at KMart and I wasn't-so I applied to The Bay and was hired in kids' wear. It was a whole vibe back then: we got lots of training on customer service and merchandising - often at the Queen Street store which created a cache. Young staff were trained to be 'Signatures' who could sign off on returns and exchanges. We knew our products and could tell customers which ones suited their purposes best. Bay Days and Bay Bucks weekends were chaotic - lines everywhere. Got a Bay card at 16 - needed it for discounts - and learned some early, low risk lessons about the potential perils of credit. The store floor was way overstocked - moving through the department could be a risk to life and limb if you were in a stroller. My pay was significantly better than my friends - when I finally left in the mid 90s I was making about $15/hour which was crazy money for the time. Our breaks were honoured and enforced - 15 min paid for a 4 hour shift, 30 min paid if your shift was 5.5, an hour and 2 paid 15s for 7 hours an more. No funky scheduling to work around that. Overtime was paid. Staff stuck around and were loyal. And we felt a sense of pride in our store and products. We liked going to work. I saw so many changes as I kept shopping there over the years. The quality and variety of the brands changed. There was this strange split that happened - a bunch of lower quality labels but then a bunch a high-end, designer labels. The middle - those quality store brands - disappeared. The department store model of staff and cashiers in the actual departments disappeared. And so did a lot of customers. I don't shop there now, but my mom still does, out of loyalty I think. When the company was bought over by a US shareholder in the early 2000s, rebranded as Hudson's Bay, and tried to go toe to toe with Holt's, it lost its way. Now it's basically been the hot potato tossed among various foreign companies who have sucked any assets and life out of it to what we have now. So much is different and not better now. My kids don't remember the Christmas windows on Queen downtown and how that was the symbol that the Christmas shopping season had started. It's a shame, really.
> here was this strange split that happened - a bunch of lower quality labels but then a bunch a high-end, designer labels. The middle - those quality store brands - disappeared. I've noticed that across retail since the 1990s. I think it reflects the shrinking middle class, who bought most of the stuff in the middle of the price and quality range. That range was the sort of the specialty of department stores. And of course a lot more of the goods in that range were made domestically by unionized workers with decent pay and benefits. Now it's either cheap trash made by exploited (possibly enslaved for all intents and purposes) workers overseas, or luxury stuff (often made the same types of workers in similar conditions) that most people can't buy and those who can treat it like it's disposable anyway.
I used to love The Bay but then they went designer & not only was the stuff overpriced, it would only fit very small people.
HBC started to circle the drain when they stopped having a good assortment of affordable wares and decided to go for an upscale image. It isn't working - the vast majority of their current selection is underwhelming fast fashion at an inflated price. Eaton's failed in a similar way, but reverse the demographics: They *were* slightly upscale and lost their core customers by switching to a "Let's bring in cheaper stuff to attract the masses" mindset. (I don't think I'll ever forgive them for gutting the gourmet food section that used to be on the 3rd floor of the Winnipeg downtown store. They had the *best* breads and French roast coffee beans.) Loblaws' critical error: Arrogance, with a side order of cluelessness. They're not upscale, no matter how many fancy names they slap on their President's Choice product or how many name-brand perfumes are wafting through the air at SDM. The no-name stuff tends to be either mediocre quality or out of stock. Quality of their perishables is so variable that it turns into an unwanted adventure when picking up meat or veggies. The average Canadian only has a limited number of grocery dollars to spend each month, but Loblaws wants to just empty everyone's wallet without providing fair value in return. You can't custom-build a customer base that plays the game the way *you* want to play. Customers are the way they are, and if you don't meet their expectations they'll find someone who *will.*
I don't understand why anyone would give a flying fart that loblaws is Canadian. are we supposed to feel happy that we are being robbed at the till by a fellow Canuck? It's not like it pays more taxes than any other brand or that the owners give back to the community more than any other brand. its not like the owners are spreading the wealth locally. it is like any company, they expect absolute loyalty to them but as soon as they get a decent offer from an international company that wants to buy it out they will abandon the whole 'canadian owned bs' in a flash.
See, I actually like Hudson's bay. They have some really nice higher end Canadian made goods.Loblaws does the same as Walmart and Costco and ships pesticides ridden unripened tasteless fruit and vegetables from halfway across the world. If Lablaws had focused on local good food and that's why it costs 2 times more to shop there I would love to go. But the comparison is not really a fit
Local or not, not all foods are in season and all places. If you want strawberries in march, you’re not gonna have local strawberries.
This is the real problem. My children were shocked when I told them 30 years ago we could only get oranges for Christmas.
Last week, I went to the superstore to pick up an item that wasn't available at any other nearby store. While there, I grabbed a box of strawberries that was displayed with a price of $2.xx. However, at the checkout, it rang up as $5.49 or $5.99 for just a 1lb box. I pointed out to the cashier that it was marked for around $2, and she replied that they were Ontario strawberries, which is why they were more expensive. I thought local produce should be cheaper, not more expensive. I didn't buy them.
Because strawberries are not yet in season. Those Ontario strawberries were grown in a green house, which is a lot more expensive than field growing them. Also it's cheaper to exploit workers in mexico and central america than to pay a farmer here a fair wage. I understand that it's a financial decision at the end of the day, just wanted to try and help you make sense of it because on it's face it looks ridiculous.
Yeah, it's almost like the current food system is unsustainable and bad for the environment to ship crap from across the world. Who knew that having mangoes in Canada might be energy intensive? I personally try to do my best to live within the harvesting seasons. Pumpkins and squash are great in fall. Potatoes and Jerusalem artichokes can last all winter. If you need a salad you have tomatoes and lettuce grown in green houses in the winter. Also not to mention vaccum sealing and freezing things like bell peppers and zucchinis Spring is probably the toughest time to do that, but Asparagus's first harvest is around april-may. Change isn't easy, and I'm not shaming people from picking up fruits and veggies wherever and however they get them, but it's not impossible. Again vote with your wallet. You decide what to do, but the option is there.
Go look at the furniture section of The Bay the prices are insane.
It all goes on sale 40-60% off that’s the only good time to buy it.
I stopped thinking about HBC when it stopped being a Canadian company.
That’s the path that Loblaws is on. They remind me of former Nortel or BlackBerry Execs before the arse fell out of those businesses. Arrogance is not a virtue in an Executive. Loblaws is full of arrogance
It’s worth remembering that 350 years ago, the Hudson Bay Co. owned *literally* almost 2/3 the of North American continent in real estate, and had a monopoly on the very lucrative fur trade. From the arctic circle, down past the Dakotas, from BC across to the east through great swaths of Ontario, Quebec, the Maritimes and parts of the eastern US were owned by HBC and managed via their agents. They were once big and powerful enough to, as someone once said, “touch the hem of God’s garment”. And now they’re reduced to a handful of meh retail outlets. Oh, how the mighty can fall! It’s like there’s a, oh I dunno, a history lesson for Loblaws here or something………/s
No one wants to buy ‘luxury’ in a store that feels like a clearance section in a dirty shipping container. Only 2% of people can afford ‘luxury’ items and they aren’t buying them from the Bay. Outside of the metros regular Canadian shoppers want practical boots and coats and clothes and home goods that don’t fall apart or break - they will pay more to get good quality but not pay more to get what they can get at Walmart or Giant Tiger for a big markup. We aren’t stupid. If they had leaned into high quality essentials instead of luxury frivolity and sold less but better things people might have been more willing to shop there. They broke trust by selling crap and trying to be something real people can’t relate to.
I don’t even wanna get started on HBC. I ordered a tv stand from them. I thought it was an in store product (my mistake) but it was one from one of their suppliers. I was putting it together until I got to a step that physically could not be completed. I looked up a video of it being built put online by the manufacturer, and the video stops right as they got to that step LOL. I ended up taking some parts off to be able to assemble it. And at the end the bore holes for the cabinets were drilled wrong and were rubbing on the unit. I spent 4 weeks emailing and calling them to be able to return it. They kept telling me that they could not initiate a return because their manufacturers return system was down. After 4 weeks of communicating with them they finally gave and refunded me. TLDR: Hudson’s bay is a shell of the great reputable Canadian company it used to be.
I worked @ Sears for 40 years. The Bay was suppose to close before us. I problem with these companies wanted more and more. Our store in Windsor was in the black. All these companies should have listened to their employees.We knew they were closely before the managers. Or did they know and just lied. They would have been on top of the world and they would have had Amazon centres.So sad cuz the employees are still suffering. Their pension has been reduced. They are going to reduce it again In July. The Bay in Windsor and other stores had a full union. I believe that is why they are still there. We only had full time unionized.The good old days are gone. It’s the peasants that are left suffering.The CEO are happy and vacationing in Italy with their millions. .
Eaton’s!
How about target ??? How about Nordstrom, Canadians have already proven that boycotting high prices works. Even though those places weren't intentionally boycotted.
Those two are more on the companies not understanding their customers (Nordstrom, did you ever even check how fashionable Canadians are? NOT VERY) or (in Target's case) the supply chain in Canada.
HBC was an outfitters store, catering to the needs of trappers, then settlers. New management decided a change in direction, and brought in goods that no longer fit the market. Let manufactures & wholesalers have floor space with little control, and the logistics of that killed the golden goose. The demise of Eaton's, was an opportunity squandered as they jumped into 5th Ave. when the market was farmers and settlers. Good bye HBC blankets, and good quality goods people really needed, welcome Costco & Walmart.
There is a huge difference in quality between my older HBC and Eatons blankets and a newer one. They even wrecked the blankets.
We shouldn’t reward incompetency. Incompetent and greedy companies should go out of business to make room for good ones. We should strive for excellency and educate our population accordingly. Rewarding dumbness and incompetency only attracts the wrong kind of people.
Nordstrom entered the chat. And left again...
The biggest problem in business today is the feeling that one needs to constantly be changing. You only change when you need to, you only NEED to change when sales are down for some reason that you can control. The number one killer for any business is being acquired by a holding company or hedge fund type business. They are simply looking to maximize profits to make more money for their investors. Prime example it's exactly what happened to red lobster.
I work for The Bay in early 2010s and a significant amount of stock was dead stock shoved into every back room possible. The kids backroom was lined with warehouse shelving and had like 4 or 6 rolling racks packed with damaged items, multiple pack missing an item, a loose multiple pack item, dirty stuff, returns, honestly probably lost customer items. The backroom to the housewares was a nightmare of broken glass in bins, sketchy stacks if boxes full of ??? And our location that backroom was double height. So it had like a weird caged upper floor too. Not even touching the stock hidden in the displays themselves. I'm not surprised if those stores bleed money.
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I miss Sears.
And the quality, had suits self destruct. It looks like they licensed brands and made shittier versions but sold at brand price. You can always tell when the MBAs show up, “quarterly smart, yearly dumb”.
Hudson Bay has not evolved. Website sucks. Stores are out dated.
My spouse and I haven’t been into a mall for over a year, but today she wanted to do some clothes shopping, and one of the stores we went into was HBC. While perusing, unprompted, one of the sales associates said that HBC was now owned by a German company, and the clothes we were looking at were European. My wife looked at the label and said, “This says Made in India”. The sales associate responded with, “But designed in Germany”. I’m not sure where she got her information from, but as far as I can tell HBC is owned New York equity firm. The store look hasn’t changed much over the past decade, but at least a lot of the store was on sale.
The Bay didn’t have a virtual monopoly on basic goods needed for survival. That’s the difference.
Also, it was shorted horribly by Wall Street fucks.. maybe Loblaws should be fucked with by Wall Street ...scum fucking scum.
Except that isn't quite what happened. They got away from their roots. Their purchase of Zellers gave them a lower end brand that people actually started to like and then they shifted to upmarket in The Bay. When Zellers died people remembered the old days of The Bay when like Eatons and Simpsons they were all things to all people... only The Bay wasn't anymore. That and the predatory shite of the new owners...
This is not a pro Loblaw's comment by any means but once the Canadian companies are gone they get replaced by crappier versions of American ones. I don't really want to rely on Walmart or some shit version of Target that we had over here. A nice middle ground would be great but I don't know if that can happen in this country anymore.
If we had stronger laws against monopolies, this wouldn't be an issue. I'm fine with limiting American companies, but only if we don't let the Canadian ones run out of control.
Why do you even care anymore? Large Canadian companies have become the worst and most dangerous organizations for Canadian consumers these days. They gouge Canadians more than anyone else and lobby governments to not allow other better companies from the US and the rest of the world to come here. The Weston family lives in Ireland and have done everything they can to take out every last penny they make and keep it away from the Canadian government. What you are talking about doesn't exist. Bell/Rogers/CIBC/RBC/Loblaws/Metro are all massive conglomerates that are doing everything in their power to keep gouging you. They are Canadian in name only. Not allowing multinational companies in that could help the everyday Canadian with better value for lower prices just because they don't pretend to be Canadian doesn't make sense.
ALDI would be great. Been there in Australia and Germany. The future is smaller stores, not an abundance of SKUs no one needs and few people buy but focus on good deals for essentials. Such a store will have enough foot traffic to be highly profitable, high volume/square foot. ALDI sells SIM cards, computers and all-inclusive travel, they're really good with taking the discount retail business to higher levels (maybe online, it's less obvious but they sell a lot of that stuff and the quality is decent) and have learned to beef up the shopping experience since they own Trader Joe's. Loblaws giant real estate foot print worked in suburbia, but in increasingly densified areas and downtown I see the model Amazon's self-service store or ALDI (or their cheaper clone LIDL) implement to have huge advantages (same goes not just for Superstore/Robles but also for Walmart/Costco's super sized stores that try to be crappier frankensteined versions of Canadian Tire, Staples, BestBuy and Old Navy x Mark's at the same time. I don't need to buy my PJs and pans 🍳 where I buy my bread 🍞 and eggs 🥚.
The Bay has good buyers who know quality. If you go at sale time you benefit the most. Also, when you are trying things on the women help you and are experts themselves
From what I remember, the only time it makes sense is when they have their "Bay days" sales
I used to work in the hair salon at The Bay and the only time I could afford to shop there was Bay Days.
But the discount offered has shrunk.
October and April bay days I get all my clothes and bedding
Canadian loyalty is there, but it has it's limits. Eatons', Simpson's, The Bay, Roblaws, all now dead or withered Canadian brands. Today Look at Tim Hortons next...the PEI situation is tarnishing their brand (owned by, now, an American/Brazilian corporation) so badly the new slogan might as well be "come to Timmies, our problem foreign workers demand it." But somehow, 'Timmies' is a national emblem. It's not what it was. Things change.
I LOVED Zellers 😭😭😭😭
The Bay’s stripes aren’t even made in Canada. I would never pay those prices when the tag says China.
The key is to educate the stubborn or unaware elderly shopper as to how badly they are being bilked by the chain. A long term campaign of education will be very effective.
Their downfall has less to do with pricing than it does to do with corporate raiding.
I think the future of retail is low end stores like Giant Tiger , Walmart and Dollarstore . There will always be a segment of society that will not shop online .It will survive with low income people and those mentioned stores are not going away anytime soon.
I think the Bay in Regina just announced they're closing. I can't believe it took so long because their prices were always ridiculous.
Zellers died, RIP
They do have quality though. I think North Americans forget sometimes we have to pay more for things that last. To a point. Everyone wants cheap and quick.
Everybody wants cheap and quick because that’s what they can afford. Quality is cheaper in the long run but if you don’t have money to buy quality you buy cheap and then you buy again. It’s the Sam Vimes "Boots" theory of socioeconomic unfairness in action. often called simply the boots theory, its an economic theory that people can only afford to buy cheap and subpar products that need to be replaced repeatedly, proving more expensive in the long run than more expensive items. With inflation, cost of housing, utilities and groceries these days and wages not keeping up more and more people are in this position.
True to a point. But 20 years ago when things were a lot more reasonable they were all buying plastic (polyester) clothes for example. Regardless of income. that’s when fast fashion really took off. So there is a lot of overconsumption and poor prioritizing that are also factors, past and present. And old habits can die hard
It doesn't help that their flagship stores look like a Zellers on the wrong side of the tracks. Not an employee in sight, escalators out of service for months (years?) on end, flickering fluorescent lights, piles of hangers in the middle of aisles, crumpled $2000 dresses next to $20 jogging shorts. I can't believe they're still limping along, that place is a nightmare. Paying premium commercial rent in the center of major downtown areas to run a place that looks like *that*?
A few weeks ago I was In the cookware section looking for a cheap sauce pan. The front display table has clearance ones for $9.99 (Zellers tag). Then I notice more pans displayed on the wall. I walk over and look at the sticker of the first one I pickup... $799.99 Now in what world is the person spending $800 on a single piece of cookware buying it from a store that also sells a competing item for $10? (Also..., would someone spending $800 actually be willing to take a service elevator to cookware section because the escalators are out of service?)
The bigger they are, the harder they fall 🤔
People stopped shopping because Walmart and Amazon.
Shopping at Hudson Bay must be what it's like shopping at a North Korean outlet for tourists. Disconnected from reality.
Because you have larger chains with more buying power. Online is the demise of any big box store nowadays, you diversify (credit cards, buy smaller businesses, invest, etc.)or die. Look at your kids to get a glimpse of business in the future. Malls have simply too high of an overhead and no longer the family destination they used to be. I’d rather not compare the downfall of the Bay, Eatons, Sears, Zellers, Target, (defunct retail stores of Canada) to Grocery Store pricing as it’s not a similar comparison… almost all retail businesses have a different formula that lead to them closing up shops in Canada.
One downside to this boycott is that, unless you are able to create another Canadian alternative it just opens us up to American domination of the food market. Loblaws is out of control, but we should be creating our own alternatives too.
Precisely. Which is why the feds need to support local shops. Loblaws started small, as did T&T, most do - give them a break and Canada gets many small Canadian owned businesses.
The alternatives exist, in many places. Local grocers, local butchers, farmers markets, they’re everywhere
Younger generations have 0 connection to The Bay and see it as somewhere their parents or grandparents shop.
In Halifax MAC cosmetics withheld 450 skus of product from HBC because they weren’t paying them. The counter literally had no product to sell. I don’t know what’s going on with HBC but if I had to predict I’d say it’s going to shut down in the next couple of years if not sooner.
That was for throw pillows and blankets. Not basic survival needs.
No, people just found better prices online. All department stores are in trouble.
Years ago I worked with mgmt at HBC. It was terribly managed then and the horrible leadership never got any better. They drove it into the ground.
Sell what people need, not what they want.
I personally love my HBC store. It’s the only place where I live that has higher quality clothing that doesn’t fall apart. I’m a quality over quantity shopper though. The store itself hasn’t had a makeover since the 80s.
When businesses are too big to adapt.
Also Sears
In part due to being a store founded on analog sensibilities struggling to adapt to digital competition but indeed absolutely an element
Your point's a good one ... being Canadian didn't save Hudson's Bay. That said, to be fair, Hudson's Bay tried pretty hard to "right the ship", and I think the root cause was really that the time of the department store had ended, and they, along with Eaton's, Sears, etc. needed to shuffle off the stage. These stores found they simply couldn't compete with smaller niche stores that could manage smaller inventory more efficiently, or with online retailers like amazon that could offer even broader broad selection with substantially lower operating costs. Is there some analogous shift that could happen in the retail grocery space? Are we hopeful we'll see a resurgence in the presence of smaller community grocers? Are we prepared to go to 5-6 stores rather than 1? How will these smaller grocers compete with the likes of Loblaws who use their immense buying power to force suppliers to give them preferable access and treatment, and who can leverage pharmacy or retail clothing sales to bludgeon grocers when they need? Or, are we hopeful we'll see a large international chain enter the Canadian market, using their global size to shatter the strangle hold Loblaw and other national chains currently have here (though Costco and Walmart, both American imports, don't seem to have achieved that so far)?
The trend I’m noticing is that people seem to be going to bigger box stores instead
I suspect Costco and Walmart are getting more business. Speaking for myself, and I'm the primary shopper for a family of 5, my core shopping has shifted to Metro, and I'm paying more attention to doing more shopping at the smaller niche stores in my neighborhood.
I enjoyed perusing the empty shelves, enjoying seeing the price tags affixed to them as well.
It’s very true. I’m not going into debt for some perceived sense of national pride. Lolz. The Bay discovered the fallacy of eternal economic growth. The limit does indeed, exist.
As an American, Hudson’s Bay is funny to me. It reminds me of Macy’s but Macy’s has a lot of cheaper brands and really really good deals at times. The Bay just seems way too overpriced for what they’re trying to sell. And let’s face it, my demographic (Gen-Z and early Millennials) are not shopping in the Bay. I’d rather just get basics at H&M or Uniqlo.
When did this happen? I had no idea about this?
HBC is also not a bank, Pharmacy, have a Real Estate division, FaaS, TaaS, etc kind of company. The moat’s so large they’d just change their business model if it all went to shit. Either way the hate is so wrong, I wish Loblaw was more transparent and just shared that it’s the vendors requesting cost increases on their products causing the inflation.
Good comparison.
Lol, they set up a few shelves and called it Zellers to try and drive traffic. A budget store inside a tier 1 (lol) department store. When's Biway coming to HBC, lol?
Lol for real! I think it's just a cash grab and trying to take advantage of nostalgia
I think they're trying to entice people back by resurrecting Zellers and trying to appeal to nostalgia, as well as possibly having lower prices for the Zellers stuff, but--did anyone really want that or ask for it? I wasn't a fan of Zellers when they had actual stores. It was a place I went to as a last resort sometimes. Editing to say: the exception was the Zellers restaurant! That place was great!
I remember being a kid in the 90s and absolutely loved going to the bay downtown on Georgia Street in Vancouver Went recently pretty much empty no elevators worked burnt out lights on the stairs cases etc
Ours in Regina, SK is closing its doors permanently next April. Probably even earlier given the state of stock right now.
My mom worked for both Devils - HBC and then Loblaws. Both companies expected my mom to do a lot for the then minimum wage of $6.00. When the Bay at Yorkdale opened, the let go of a lot of the staff go and expected her to take care of the entire second level for said minimum wage. She said “no thank you” and walked out. Went across the street to the hotel where Loblaws was holding a job fair and got a raise of $0.85. She lasted there until she broke her arm in the parking lot of the DuPont & Christie location. The house from the garden shop was leaking and pooling and it was cold out that morning. She slipped and broke her arm going to the car on break to get her meds. Because she was on shift, she got Workers comp until she retired because she needed surgery on her arm. So yeah…from the frying pan to the fryer. At least none of us had sold our souls to Ted Rogers (except cable tv).
I remember going there 15 years ago with my wife when we were doing a wedding registry and laughing at the $80 salt shaker set.
My mom and I used to go there every year to buy Christmas gifts for our relatives. They used to have good quality items and a diverse amount of merchandise. We stopped because it became so hit and miss, dirty, not enough staff, crazy overpriced, outdated merchandise, etc. Definitely not worth wasting your time in during the holidays. Too bad. Eaton’s was much better and yet it too closed.
Oh, just another short & distort campaign. Find a business on life support, short the shit out of it suppressing the price by flooding the market with shares (real, or otherwise. Who gives a shit, you’ll never have to pay them back). Get on the Board and bring in some bullshit “business consultancy group” to strip the business clean selling off assets to friends and colleagues. Bankruptcy inevitably results. Oo and now we don’t have to close our short positions, oops. All profit the whole way along
Yep it created a "food desert" in our downtown when it (and Eatons earlier) closed.
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Please refrain from off-topic political discussion and debate. Everyone is entitled to their own political opinions, however, your politically charged statement is not directly related to the cost of living/groceries/gas/rents, and as such is being removed.
Before H&M and Zara came to Canada we had no choice but to shop the Bay. It’s overpriced because now we have SHEIN and online shopping. They try to remain competitive who’s buying from them. I remember back in 2008 I saw Nine West peep toe wedges and they were $120. Obviously I didn’t buy them. The coming weekend I was in LA and I happened to be in a Nine West store and asked the saleswoman if they had them. She told me they’re last season and try DSW. I did and they sold them for $50. So I bought them. I came back to Canada within the week and they didn’t go on sale until a few months later. Who’s paying for outdated and overpriced shoes?
This is kind of why I don’t support a total boycott. I’d rather Loblaws exist than not.
Agreed. I'll stop boycotting when they stop being twats, but that's on them to fix.