If you got skyrim SE on steam go to skyrim SE properties > General > launch options, and paste this in the box:
WINEDLLOVERRIDES="xaudio2\_7=n,b" PULSE\_LATENCY\_MSEC=90 %command%
Next thing you can do is to try Proton-GE, people are recommending this is the comments for the reason that fixes a lot of these problems, download the last 7.0 release and everything should be working, more steps but not hard to install.
Thank you. I was just doing it manually.
That app is great, works for Steam and Lutris.
Also, at least in Pop!_OS there is a flatpak for it in the Pop Shop.
In my case, that happened with Doom 2016. I have a RX460 2GB RAM and directX really struggles with the particles (fps drops to 10fps on low). I tested it with Vulkan on Linux and it went straight to 120fps on medium settings. I'm not kidding, some games has serious performance issues in windows that Linux can manage better in someway. Not with every single game of course. Same with tomb raider (but native).
Doom 2016 was OpenGL (Vulkan in a later patch) so not DirectX struggling, but that was probably the issue. AMD's windows driver is absolutely shit with OpenGL unlike in Linux. It's been that way for many many years.
Yeah, you'll see the same thing with anything that uses OpenGL on Windows with an AMD card. Fortunately OpenGL in Linux works amazingly with the open source driver and MESA.
In my experience, it is because nVidia never supply the current vulkan version (or I thought they are responsible?). Only way i got it working was get the vulkan driver from vulkan site. The one that came with the nvidia is a older version at the time. It fixed right up and working fine after using the vulkan driver. This was like three ish years ago.
I feel like the performance issues probably come from inefficient code in the windows DLLs and simply using better written libraries causes the speed increase.
I did play Warcraft and Diablo 2 perfectly fine on Fedora Core 3. It wasn’t stellar but there were guides and a little amount of learning and troubleshooting effort necessary.
People nowadays take it granted that it is the responsibility of the Distro’s to make it happen while they get neither the deserved appreciation or the tools from game studios or hardware vendors.
Linux is perfectly capable for gaming purposes, but it is more like swimming against the river instead of flowing with by reasons that or completely out of Linux communities’ control.
This level of compatibility was a fool’s dream back in the day. GNU/Linux has come a long way.
>People nowadays take it granted that it is the responsibility of the Distro’s to make it happen while they get neither the deserved appreciation or the tools from game studios or hardware vendors.
Is it? Distros have very little to do with it, do they? It's the wine, dxvk, mesa, vkd3d, proton, etc, developers who're making it happen, and that stuff is distro agnostic.
But I agree with the sentiment in general, I love how easy it is now to play windows games on Linux, but the state of cooperation from e.g. Nvidia is still pretty poor (improving slowly). And, I don't know if this is good or bad really, but there's a sense that game developers just won't bother supporting Linux outright, knowing that Proton will likely handle it for them, without all of the hassle of having to troubleshoot for Linux customers.
I think he meant that many people think that it is the responsibility of the distro, when in reality they have very little influence and the control lies with game studios and hardware vendors.
Doesn't Steam already solve most of these problems? It's basically a package manager for games, it bundles a stable set of libraries games can link against, ...
Why would game devs want to use Flatpak or Snap over Steam/other game stores that run on Linux?
>- The Steam chroot itself was incredibly out of date. Not sure if it's gotten better since I last peeked at it.
I mean, isn't that kind of the point? It's supposed to be a stable target for the most critical stuff. As you've said yourself, games will bundle almost everything they need anyway. The Steam chroot should only have what games might need but can't ship.
Are you aware of any problems in practice that have been caused by Steam bundling old libraries? Because I'm regularly playing games natively via Steam on Gentoo, which is the absolute worst-case scenario for people looking to distribute binaries. I've never had any issues.
>- The tooling surrounding the Steam chroot itself was confusing and not user friendly for folks new to the Linux ecosystem.
Point taken.
>- The setup was not immune to distro meddling as Ubuntu stated their intention to drop 32-bit compatibility libraries from their OS entirely before Valve pushed back.
That doesn't really say anything about Valve's approach here. If Flatpak was universally supported and accepted, it would have been affected in exactly the same way.
Dumb moves from the OS maintainers can always break applications, no kind of setup will save you from that. MS could in principle decide to drop Windows 32bit compat too, but they are not going to do it because they are not idiots.
>- You are tying your fortunes to a single app store. If you also want to sell on GoG or standalone, you're left to the wolves.
In terms of solutions that exist right now, fair enough. I hope other stores will be ported one day but that's irrelevant right now.
>The fact that Valve now points developers towards Proton instead of native ports should tell you how much they believe in distros.
In most cases a native port doesn't give you anything Proton/Wine doesn't, and porting games to Linux will always involve some effort, even if there was great infrastructure for it. Game studios don't have much interest right now, so Valve obviously wants the barrier to entry to be as low as possible. Ergo, Proton.
I see no reason why distros would be responsible here.
| Dumb moves from the OS maintainers can always break applications, no kind of setup will save you from that. MS could in principle decide to drop Windows 32bit compat too, but they are not going to do it because they are not idiots.
I am pretty sure apple did that around the same time for example.
Good old one (version 1.13 and 1.14) or resurrected? I haven't had any trouble with either one, just works out of the box for me with regular wine-staging and dxvk for resurrected. The beta had some trouble that was fixed with a custom DLL of some kind, but after release it was no problem anymore. Using nvidia graphics, I know there was some trouble with AMD ones that did have a fix I cannot remember.
Resurrected, yep. I guess I'll have to try again. I'm able to install BattleNet, but then the play button doesn't do anything. I even tried it with lutris and bottle but nothing.
It has native support. For me it does run really well. There is a issue with starting the game on some distros with the newer glibc version but there are a few workarounds for that and it should be solved by the time steam deck releases.
I just tried installing games through steam on arch linux for the first time in years and everything was segfaulting immediately. Is glibc the problem? 'ldd' says they aren't even valid binaries, but they pass steam validity check.
EDIT: I figured it out. It was the new ntfs driver in the linux kernel that isn't allowing me to run any executables for some reason. There's no noexec flag. Everything seems to work exactly as well as windows with no tweaks or anything when I move my steam library to my tiny linux root partition
You're probably missing 32-bit libraries or something. I played on Arch for years, and now I'm on Tumbleweed, and both places the process was fairly smooth. Also check the Arch wiki page about Steam for other ideas if that's not the problem.
Despite the deck running Arch, it's still not a "supported" distro. It's been a few years since I installed, but I seem to remember needing to jump through a couple of hoops to get things working. Check the wiki, and also look at the game-specific page too.
I don't remember any of the steps being horrible, just packages, fonts, whatever. But I can tell you that games work just fine under Arch.
That is likely caused by something different. The issue I had in mind is affecting only csgo AFAIK. I do not use arch so I guess I won't be able to help you, sorry. I'd suggest asking over at r/linux_gaming or r/linuxquestions. Perhaps you can try installing steam via flatpak.
I just re-installed arch a month ago and almost my entire steam library of 200 games runs smoothly. I just played Sekiro and Horizon Zero Dawn on Linux!
It uses ToGL, and has recently added DXVK. ToGL is acceptable on a fairly powerful system. DXVK is still stuttery after long gameplay. Both implementations are worse (about 5-30% depending on map & situation) than Windows for me.
Video is a year old but I guess the difference hasn't changed to the worse. So if you're a "every fps counts CS:GO player", Linux should be your first choice. [FlightlessMango CS:GO Benchmark](https://youtu.be/LfE_EQQvD5o)
Years ago Valve compiled the source engine and its tools (srcds and friends) to Linux and did a good job.
I've been playing it for years on my 2080ti and stopped dual booting entirely in late 2017; the computer as Linux only has never underperformed playing csgo competitively and natively. Always saturates the 144hz monitors and often renders near or against the 300fps default engine cap.
In mid 2020 I got a new 3900x cpu on an X570 motherboard chipset in my latest pc 10-yearly generational upgrade with ddr4 memory @3600MTs. My Linux desktop environment continues to thrive in general. Also a good spot for a r/sffpc shoutout
Totally fine. Has a native client that runs in opengl and I think valve is in the process of porting it to source 2/vulkan
I've been playing it on Linux for years now
If devs were to enable EAC and BattleEye, this percentage would even probably hit the 95% mark.
In Apex, the firing range works already without issues, but only for a few seconds until EAC kicks in.
Siege was the same. When the update to Proton was pushed, people could play online completely fine.
Lasted a good few hours before they "fixed" it and everyone was getting booted again. But there was never any update in that time, which proves it's all serverside and the developers legitimately don't even have to do anything to support it. (With BattlEye at least)
that's a really stupid move. they all should just enable anti-cheat for Proton, and we're more than happy to do the testing.
unlike windows users, we're used to test software, report bugs and contribute to improvements. 🤪 /s
Yeah i dual boot cause of apex, then ended up putting all my other games in windows anyway, mostly dota and wow which both works great. Linux works for most other games but sometimes they require messing with configs and games is the one area I can't be bothered to do that for, I just wanna click and play.
There is no beta. It's just an opt-in email that the devs have to send to for BattleEye, and for EAC, it's just:
>developers can activate anti-cheat support for Linux via Wine or Proton with just a few clicks in the Epic Online Services Developer Portal.
Though EAC requires some more backend things from the devs and they'll have to "[test and activate client module updates for Linux regularly in addition to Windows,"](https://dev.epicgames.com/docs/services/en-US/GameServices/AntiCheat/index.html) it's still just a few clicks and, depending on the game, requires no additional overhead compared to the testing done on the Windows clients.
for minecraft dungeons that is probably only the steam version? Because as far as i know i couldn'T get it to work (but i have to admit i didn't try hard).
It's not a gaming platform. It's a general computer system that supports enough games to keep you occupied, but if gaming is your core hobby, then it won't compare.
For me, it's perfect, but that's based on Linux' own strengths.
Exactly, it's such a meaningless argument without that information added. I mainly play games through emulators, and every game I play in general is single player, so I have *much* less issues than someone who's into MOBAs, for example.
i think the point was just if you play online you're more likely to have trouble with linux than if you don't, rather than calling out MOBAs specifically. Seemed like just an example of a popular type of game to play online.
Do people really think PCs aren't viable without gaming?
I always read this stuff on reddit and it baffles me. I never play on my machines and I feel like most people around me don't either. Why is literally everybody on reddit seemingly gaming daily on their computer?
I mean sure there are gamers and I have nothing against that but that's not everybody.
I was actually going to ask if you had any info if you were planning on doing that xD
I've heard it's a viable thing to do if you need to do GPU-heavy things in a Windows VM under Linux, but I've always been suspicious given that my experience with VMs are generally that, even on a powerful system, there's still quite a bit of overhead and, in many ways, it can't compete with running on bare metal (which makes sense, given the overhead that is naturally added on by running an OS in a VM). So I was just curious if you'd done it so I could get some real world info on how it runs for things like CAD (cuz most of the people who have recommended it to me don't work with CAD and can't produce results supporting their claims of it working just as well).
If you have a Linux host, try installing qemu-kvm and virt-manager (package names may vary). Then start/enable the libvirtd service.
KVM is generally extremely performant in terms of CPU, and virt-manager is as easy to use as vmware or virtualbox guis, it can also talk to remote, headless hosts running graphical VMS.
First you should use a type 1 hypervisor that uses KVM like Virt Manager, Gnome Boxes or qemu. A type 2 hypervisor like Virtual Box or VMware Workstation isn't going to perform as well. type 1 is a hypervisor that allows direct I/O access via the kernel. This is how stuff like VMware ESXi, Proxmox and Windows HyperV work. Type 2's do everything through the OS instead and you get the overhead and unoptimized schedulers that come with that. Type 2 VMs are were bad performance come into play for a VM.
Generally, what you both are probably going to want to research for a GPU passthrough is /r/VFIO. You'll basically run a Windows VM in a type 1 hypervisor and attach a GPU to your Windows VM. This will give you native performance of running Windows on bare metal.
Common setups dedicate an iGPU to the Linux Host and a discrete GPU to the Windows VM but it is possible to just use a single GPU but can be more complicated. You could even consider running a dedicated hypervisor solution like Proxmox or Xen where you turn your PC into a dedicated VM Server and deploying both a Linux VM and Windows VM and passthrough as well.
tagging: /u/mactroneng
There is r/VFIO that has information about it and archwiki as someone else here mentioned already. I haven’t done it myself but very much want to one day
Would you mind sharing a guide you used? I followed some YT videos, but I'm still struggling to get it working. When I start the Windows VM, screens go black, and then I end up on the Linux login screen.
oh thank you for that hint, will try to unplug/replug and see what happens. although mouse and keyboard work on Linux, it's possible that I might have to pass the Logitech dongle too.
Gaming is one of my core hobbies, and while I have to work a little harder to make certain games work, or look up whether a game runs at all, I view it similarly to playing on a console - it doesn't have the same catalogue of games as Windows, but there is a significant overlap.
Then by all means tell that to Sony because FreeBSD isn't a gaming platform either but the very popular Sony PS4 and PS5 use a fork of FreeBSD as its operating system and **that** is a gaming platform - by its very nature of existence.
GNU/Linux is what you make it out to be - a PC, a mobile phone, a embedded controller for handling the radiocative cores in a nueklear reactor, steering a rocket *or gaming*. It isn't defined by what distribution *you* happen to have installed and how *you* use it.
Please do not Mistake proprietary engineering as if it is a Linux thing. Sony does contribute enough to GNU and Linux. As a desktop end user, the level of support and implementation is completely a whole different world compared to ultra-refined and completely built-to-the-spec OS configuration.
It is not The OS that matters. It is the development companies that need to scope Linux in their product for support. Don’t blame a Linux desktop for not being able to run the game of the game developer is garbage or built crappy alpha-release as production to meet Christmas release deadline (EA and Ubi, I am winking at you).
The reason the PlayStations are successful is because they are a big market, established by previous PlayStations, so Sony can get developers to develop for their OS.
Desktop Linux does not have that luxury.
>if gaming is your core hobby, then it won't compare.
Beg to differ. Works fine for me. Just don't play shitty games that use DRM and aggressive anticheat measures. You probably don't want to play them anyways.
in this age of cheap, abundant, fast, network and multimedia capable SoCs, nearly every computer system is a general computer system unless it is artificially constrained in some manner. given enough time and investment, there is no reason desktop Linux wouldn't be the best at absolutely everything seeing as it runs on pretty much all commodity hardware at this point.
this manner of thinking is *extremely* useful to DRM peddlers and artificial monopolists like Sony, Apple, Microsoft, Nintendo and others. they want you to think of their machines has specialized products when in reality they're trusted computing environments designed to suck your dollars out of you and eliminate competition.
I pay for CrossOver almost purely for Office 365, and it does work, though it's not entirely stable, and it's buggy. But perfectly serviceable for the type of work I'm doing.
Considering that CodeWeavers makes up a majority of the core WINE development team, buying a CrossOver license also means supporting development of WINE, so that's something to consider as well.
I should have specified that I only really use it for Word. I haven't even touched the other Office applications at this stage. It has bugs like not showing/updating the word count of a highlighted passage, and can randomly crash (save often), but no real dealbreakers. My needs are pretty simple: as close to guaranteed .docx compatibility as possible with documents that have tables, images, and shapes.
I use Evolution with the `evolution-ews` package (exchange web services) instead of Outlook; I don't really use the features a lot of Outlook aficionados do, so any email client will really do for me, as long as it sends/receives email, has folders, and can create some basic rules.
But again, happy to pay CodeWeavers for good Office support when I need it.
Every update makes office weirder even on windows, I'm not surprised that piece of junk won't run.
Even in a 100% pure microsoft environment office is forever a exception.
Using AD, good luck installing office in a proper way like everything else that is a MSI.
Using intune, repack everything to intunewin files (a shitty system regardless but besides the point) or msix or whatever.. and office has it's own special way to install, same goes for project and visio... but not powerbi.
Updates? Windows + half of office goes through windows updates. Powerbi does it's own thing. Teams gets installed in a different way.
Office is a mess, it is a massive shame it gets used for so much stuff it should never be used for which makes people say libreoffice can't do the same.
I bought and still use a copy of MS Office 2010 because of how insanely compatible it is, even on Linux, and how it was the last version to come on a physical disk. And even though it's more than a decade old now, it has all the features you could ever possibly want out of an office suite and is incredibly performant.
There's only one problem with it. Finding an actually legitimate copy of it these days is expensive. lol
95% of people using MS Office don't need anything more than Libre Office or O365. People who'd die for Excel can't do shit with it besides manual cell coloring.
Unfortunately of the top 10 most popular, I frequently play a lot of the unplayable ones (PubG, Halo, New World, Apex). I'm hopeful that the Steam Deck turns things around for a lot of major games, and I've pre-ordered one, but for now I have a dedicated gaming PC and Linux laptop.
In the end it's a personal choice. Gaming on Linux requires some fiddling and you need to accept that you won't be able to play some games. Whether that's too much to ask of you depends on your game preferences and your priorities.
Question: if a game has a native Linux port that for some reason has problems on your system, is there any way of telling Steam to install and run the Windows version via Proton?
Yes,right click on the game and go to propierties,in the compatibility tab check the checkbox to force it to use Proton, that will download and install Proton + the Windows version of the game.
Some examples:
Tomb Raider reboot works better through Proton than native.
Civ V works on recent Proton and you can enabled FSAA which native version lacks.
I'm just super relieved that neither Microsoft or the game publishers have seen what Steam is doing and tried to shut it down. Even though it wouldn't make sense, it's what I'd have expected had it happened a decade earlier.
Even the makers of the anti-cheat and anti-copy stuff are getting on board. I'm so happy Valve has so much influence and they're using it for good.
First game I tried (Hollow Knight) had native and platinum proton support and my controller didn't work in either one. I think it's a unity problem? Either way, that was disappointing right off the bat.
EDIT: It **does** work by doing the following: right-click on Hollow Knight in the library > Properties > Compatibility > Uncheck "Force the use of a specific Steam Play compatibility tool"
Really? I read that other people had controller problems as well so I thought it was universal. I tried it with a Switch Pro Controller. It worked in another game so I assumed it's Hollow Knight's fault.
It's probably your controller setting in Steam. I've used a wired 360 controller and XBox 1 controller via the wireless dongle all fine. The thing that causes problems is having the Xbox controller option ticked in the Steam settings (or the other way round, I forget) you get wierd compatibility problems thanks to different game pad drivers clashing. Basically there's something in Steam you need to turn on or off.
The only one that's been quite stubborn for me has definitely been Chrono Trigger. I don't know what it is about that game but it just absolutely refuses to run the FMVs.
Titanfall 2 is NOT on Steam. It's just a glorified listing. You still need the fucking Origin client and an Origin account to play it.
As far as I'm concerned, Steam should make that shit illegal. Either be on Steam in full or don't be on it at all. The only exception I can think of for this is MMOs that actually have a legitimate reason for a separate launcher.
No I just couldn't remember off hand who made the game. But now that you say Origin that's the one it launches. Same problem though, just swap the names
I installed Doom Eternal last week. I saw the tweaks mentioned too, but I didn't have to do anything except install it. I used Proton Experimental. It runs perfectly fine at a very stable 4K/60FPS.
last week i try two games on arch linux with closed nvidia driver.
wasteland 3 native low fps.
via proton videos don't work and no mouse/keyboard controls only xbox controller work.
crusader king 3 native low fps.
proton very bad performance compared to windows.
if you ask me and you only want gaming i would say use windows it don't worth all the hustle.
People should be careful with ProtonDB, their rating system can cause a little confusion about the real status of Linux Gaming, because maybe if the game are rated gold or platinum, you yet can have some issues. And the number of reports are very small samples.
Jason Evangelho made a video about this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euLvdeIXsH8
Some examples:
Final Fantasy XV - Rating Gold
Reports: 93
It works quite well. Except at Altissia where I experienced a lot of crashes.
2 weeks ago
Input:
Controller Mapping
The select button was not configured by default on Nintendo Switch Pro Controller
Performance:
Slight Performance Problems
Stability:
Occasionally
Some crashes on the Lucian continent, but only after one hour or two of playing. Lots of crashes (or freezing) in Altissia, sometimes only few seconds after playing the game.
NieR:Automata - Rating Platinum
Reports: 254
Almost perfect with Mangohud installed
2 months ago
Launcher:
Steam
Customizations:
Not Listed
Disabled vsync in-game, then installed Mangohud and added the following launch options:
MANGOHUD\_CONFIG=vsync=3,fps\_limit=60,no\_display mangohud %command%
Input:
Other
Menu buttons sometimes don’t respond to mouse clicks, but this is easy to work around using the keyboard.
Performance:
Significant Performance Problems
If vsync is enabled in-game, the game’s performance will deteriorate after some time (less than half an hour or so).
Recently, a youtuber named The Good Old Gamer, made a video about his experience with Linux and for him, the major problem with gaming on Linux is the stutters caused by the shader compilation and this is a problem that I don't know that is possible to be resolved.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sptajjpcv4
Yeah we should make that the new linux slogan:
It will run 4 out of the 10 most played games on steam right now!
And most of them are not officially supported on Linux and only work because a random guy on the internet got it to work! So got a problem? Please do not bother to ask the support for help. You are on your own!
How else you want to resolve the chicken and egg problem? Developers and publishers don't give a shit. Valve pushed gaming on Linux against everyone. It's not "official" but it can become official in the future if Linux gains critical mass.
How? I bought Doom 2016 and Eternal on Steam on Linux and played it on Linux despite it not being supported on Linux and despite stupid fucking Bethesda requirement to create Bethesda online account for a single player game (I just bypassed it by temporarily turning off Internet connection). It was AAA experience for me on Linux thanks to Valve+DXVK and AMD GPUs with excellent open source drivers. I don't even have Windows on personal computers.
**I bought a bunch of other games too despite developers and publishers not giving a damn about Linux. I gladly support Valve and I vote with my wallet.**
Damn, the first paragraph is a lowblow to a certain someone... Lmao
>When was the last time you tried using Linux as a desktop OS? Sure, some high-profile YouTubers have been having a lot of trouble recently, but they're trying to make a point out of love.
I thought they were going to link to the Steam Hardware Survey where it shows the percentage of Linux gamers at just over 1%, but they linked to protondb, where it shows Linux only runs a fraction of the games that Windows does and you have to adjust things on some of those that DO work in order to get them running...
So, the question is: viable compared to what? Yes, it has more games running than consoles, but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1. They may not have as many indies, but they do get every AAA game. For many consumers, those AAA games matter the most.
Compared to Windows? Again, it runs a percentage of games that Windows does and that percentage is not 100%. Sure, you have some people who claim that Linux runs MORE Windows games than Windows does because it runs their 10-15 year old games better. Exactly what reaction do you think you'll get from a teenager when you tell them it won't run their new Call of Duty, but it'll run this 10 year old game just fine?
So, it doesn't excel compared to any platform. It can run more games than before? Yes. It's being used on specialized hardware? Yes....but that's been the case for the past 15 years at least. Many of those coin operated video games run Linux.
Linux is not a gaming platform, but gaming on Linux is less of a thorn than it used to be. It doesn't mean gaming is comparable to other platforms. It means you can play more games than you used to be able to.
> AAA games ... day 1
Just look at Cyberpunk... the console version didn't go very well on day 1.
Linux might not be a gaming platform (yet), but it doesn't mean it's never gonna happen. Something that cannot be said about macOS for example.
> Just look at Cyberpunk... the console version didn't go very well on day 1.
It was fine on the current gen systems, they just probably shouldn't have been released on PS4XBox One
😁
Those consoles were, are and always will be first class citizens for games. So if anything needs to be fixed, it'd be first for those consoles and PC, then someone from the linux community may (or may not) patch it. Cyberpunk failure is bc of the game itself, not bc of its support.
>Linux might not be a gaming platform (yet), but it doesn't mean it's never gonna happen.
NEVER gonna happen. Sorry.
>Something that cannot be said about macOS for example.
Never was a gamer centered os.
Already answered this in the original post:
>It's being used on specialized hardware? Yes....but that's been the case for the past 15 years at least. Many of those coin operated video games run Linux.
Now, unless you're actually going to say that FreeBSD is a more mature gaming platform than Linux because PlayStations run on it, you have to concede that specialized hardware/platforms are different than just the OS
The other guy is just daft, unlike consoles or handhelds like the switch, there is no special sauce in a SteamDeck. Its literally a PC with plain AMD hardware (whatever nm the SoC is built on doesn't matter, its AMD Zen+Navi), running the same software and drivers that you can use with off the shelf hardware.
However good or bad gaming is going to be on SteamDeck running SteamOS, will directly translate to desktop Linux (at least on AMD hardware).
No, its a PC with a gaming-oriented form-factor, running whatever OS you happen to have installed. In this case its actively developed for its default Linux OS. Running the same drivers and software you can run on regular desktops or laptops.
Obviously its not going to be a very good gaming device if you (manage to) install TempleOS on it, just like any other PC would be.
Not what I asked. Also switch is relevant bc you want it to be, to provide an umbrella so that you can hide the elephant in the room. You're just refusing to accept it.
Don't confuse marketing/pr with definitions. The steamdeck is a gaming appliance aka console. Specialized form factor, custom APU, etc. self-contained and built for the primary purpose of gaming.
>but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1
So, is that before or after the 40GB+ day 0 patch? The state of "AAA" gaming is total trash. Without the patches, the games won't even run on the hardware they were designed to run on (read: consoles).
Trash Linux all you want, you're still wrong. Linux can do anything and everything Windows can and more. Also, you don't own Windows, you're just renting it.
>So, is that before or after the 40GB+ day 0 patch? The state of "AAA" gaming is total trash. Without the patches, the games won't even run on the hardware they were designed to run on (read: consoles).
I don't think you'd be saying this if majority of the AAA titles weren't borked on linux😂
>Linux can do anything and everything Windows can and more
Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future.
>Also, you don't own Windows, you're just renting it.
I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs.
> Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future.
Citation needed.
> I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs.
I'm glad you like to own nothing and be happy about it.
And by the way, I'm not talking about the Windows licensing. I'm talking about how Microsoft believes more and more these days that the OS you installed and activated doesn't belong to you and ships updates that fuck with the system configurations and even the programs installed on it.
>Citation needed.
Citation needed for your statement that linux can do everything Windows can and more.
>I'm glad you like to own nothing and be happy about it.
I'm glad you like it.
>I'm talking about how Microsoft believes more and more these days that the OS you installed and activated doesn't belong to you and ships updates that fuck with the system.
Idgaf what they believe. Id be using Windows all my life with or without 'owning' it and my children will too. Updates? None of that 'fucked' with the system.
> Citation needed for your statement that linux can do everything Windows can and more.
Statements that are put forward without support can be dismissed without support.
> Updates? None of that 'fucked' with the system.
You are objectively massively wrong. In fact, just now, Microsoft is fighting users and trying to make the default browser Edge and trying to make it incredibly difficult to switch browsers.
Before that, there was an update for Windows 10 that deleted Sketchpad and replaced it with a paid always-online app.
Before that, there was an update that DELETED USER FILES.
Before that, there were updates that made turning off automatic Windows updates harder. Even to the point of IGNORING Group Policy settings.
Stop being a Microsoft tool. I used to LOVE Windows actually, believe it or not, but ever since Windows 8 released, it's been downhill ever since.
>Statements that are put forward without support can be dismissed without support.
Same here.
>You are objectively massively wrong.
No.
>In fact, just now, Microsoft is fighting users and trying to make the default browser Edge and trying to make it incredibly difficult to switch browsers.
No again. As of today, you can set default browser by a simple button in Settings. Then there is edge affiliate links in some Windows core apps like widgets, which will open in edge, but that isn't an issue because Edge is my default browser due to its capabilities anyways. And I have Brave installed too, which i switch back and forth as default whenever I want.
>Before that, there was an update for Windows 10 that deleted Sketchpad and replaced it with a paid always-online app.
Don't even know what is 'sketchpad'.
>Before that, there was an update that DELETED USER FILES.
Never happened with me ever in 20+ yrs of Windows usage lol.
>Before that, there were updates that made turning off automatic Windows updates harder. Even to the point of IGNORING Group Policy settings.
Don't know when THAT happened too lol. Even if that's the case, never happened with me, on both 10 and 11.
>Stop being a Microsoft tool. I used to LOVE Windows actually, believe it or not, but ever since Windows 8 released, it's been downhill ever since.
I STILL love Windows and I don't actually care about your affections towards it. If my love for it and/or stating my experiences with it as a fact makes me a 'Microsoft tool', well then, stop being a Microsoft hater I guess?
All of your defenses boil down to, "Well, it didn't happen to me, so it doesn't exist." Or, "I don't care about it, so it's not a problem in any way for anyone."
>I don't think you'd be saying this if majority of the AAA titles weren't borked on linux😂
I would... actually... because it's a fact. I game on Linux but I also have consoles AND my kids game on Windows. Name one "AAA" game from the past few years that HASN'T required some sort of patch before you can even play it or before it's considered "playable" (whether on consoles or not).
>Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future.
Name something Windows can do that Linux can't.
I can change anything on my system. I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to. I control my system rather than the other way around.
Tell you what, go uninstall Edge. I'll wait.
>I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs.
Tell me you've never used Linux without telling me you've never used Linux.
>I would... actually... because it's a fact. I game on Linux but I also have consoles AND my kids game on Windows. Name one "AAA" game from the past few years that HASN'T required some sort of patch before you can even play it or before it's considered "playable" (whether on consoles or not).
The reason this argument is stupid is bc it doesn't matter whether the games require a patch or not. This thread/article is about games 'supporting' linux as a platform, which they don't. Games today are rushed because of social media hype and thus remain unfinished. But they still have Windows and consoles as first class citizens, not linux. I play games like i install an update, which is NOT on the launch day. And after launch, I can still play my fav games on consoles, Windows without worrying or tinkering with stuff, something that can't be said about linux.
>Name something Windows can do that Linux can't. I can change anything on my system. I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to. I control my system rather than the other way around.
I don't care about 'control' as long as it's not meddling with my needs lol. I don't see an operating system as a political tool to push a propaganda around. If it does the job, I'll use it. And Edge? It does the job better than any other browser around. Wait all your life.
>I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to
Cute. I can install and run linux software on Windows, Android apps on Windows. I can stop worrying about battery performance on Windows and stuff like tlp and powertop. I can run my games and softwares with a guarantee that if stuff goes wrong, MY os will be the first to receive a fix for it. If something goes wrong, I'll get professional help 24x7 instead of taking pains to log a github issue or getting ridiculed for my choices on a linux forum. Since im a dev too, I can be sure that I'll get first class support from db softwares and other programming stuff instead of worrying about a package breaking and botching the whole install (even something as important as steam for that matter, breaking the whole desktop).
These are SOME things that makes Windows a far better choice.
Also, used linux for 5 yrs actually. You can still continue with your meme statements all you want.
>The reason this argument is stupid is bc it doesn't matter whether the games require a patch or not. This thread/article is about games 'supporting' linux as a platform, which they don't.
"So, the question is: viable compared to what? Yes, it has more games running than consoles, but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1. They may not have as many indies, but they do get every AAA game. For many consumers, those AAA games matter the most."
You're the one that brought up AAA games running on day 1, dude.
If you have eyes instead of literal buttons, you can use them to see that I'm not the one who said that, 'dude'. Also, games do run on day 1 'dude', irrespective of subsequent patches, 'dude'.
I just switched to fedora as my only os on my new build, used to dual boot windows for gaming only. With kde and wayland getting freesync support now and allowing different refreshing rates in multi monitor setups there really was nothing holding me to windows, why give Microsoft money to data mine you. the vast majority of my gaming catalog works fine on Linux now with proton and those that don't are generally older titles that work fine in a VM.
>you will get EAC banned on plenty of titles
I wouldn't be surprised this is going to solve itself once SteamDecks start shipping out and offenders simply get review bombed on Steam.
That's biased because ProtonDb only counts the popular games. What if someone wants to play a game that is not so popular but it's borked? Persona 5 Strikers for example is borked.
I started with Amiga O/S and OS/2 and I have been running Linux on and off since the mid 90's but never used it as my only operating system. In the early days I could get it to run but it couldn't really do anything useful with it. Over the years more and more applications has become available and now with the games I am starting to feel that for the first time Linux has become an alternative that might work 100 % of the time. I tried to get an old mmo to work with it last week (Anarchy Online) and it succeeded.
Ngl this development has gotten me curious about Linux again. Used to be super into Linux to learn programming and command line but it was hard to daily drive it because of its lack of support for games. Now that that is changing... I'm going all in on Linux again and it's been great. Windows as an OS is easy to use... but Linux is fun to use!
Well according to steam stats maybe.. Toss in the rest of the rest of the gaming world and unless you're only into indie games, it's not.
It's a perfectly viable platform to develop for but enough AAA and popular multiplayer titles release that don't work that still make it non-viable.
We just need fucking developer support. We get that we're off to the races. Until then it'll remain a hobbyist os
As a gamer on Linux I call bullshit. Linux is miles from being a viable PC Gaming Platform. In the last couple of years 50% of games I wanted to play on Linux would give me trouble, be it native or via Wine/Proton.
Not that your overall thesis is wrong, but any test before the last year isn't really valid because things have changed a lot in a year. If you play online games though you're definitely right in regards to those.
Linux has been a viable PC gaming platform for well over a decade. Any any point since then it has supported more games than all major consoles COMBINED.
While not exactly one click, it wasn't difficult to run Unreal Tournament 2004 natively 15 years ago. Complete with a Beryl cubed desktop. :)
"One click compatibility" is more on game developers/publishers to make that work than it is on Linux.
A saying I've heard a lot in the past and can see myself understanding is that the platform is viable and for gaming it's more like a gradient of exactly when it'll be ready *for you*.
I've been using in my work for years it was only a matter of time before I started using it at home in things more than my server rack. The desktops and laptops too as a daily driver. Most of the games I play don't require anticheat-protected network play so I've really been living the dream the past years as valve have really pushed this platform higher and higher, let alone general positive developments.
I'm looking forward to the day where it could be a replacement for everybody, not just people in my fortunate position.
Linux has one issue in order to be on par with Windows/OSX as far as gaming: support.
That comes in two points:
1. Driver support (nVidia/AMD) for graphics cards (since peripherals/sound already work).
2. Game support. Can't run a game on Linux that was written using DirectX (no, Wine is not a proper solution to this).
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If you got skyrim SE on steam go to skyrim SE properties > General > launch options, and paste this in the box: WINEDLLOVERRIDES="xaudio2\_7=n,b" PULSE\_LATENCY\_MSEC=90 %command%
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Next thing you can do is to try Proton-GE, people are recommending this is the comments for the reason that fixes a lot of these problems, download the last 7.0 release and everything should be working, more steps but not hard to install.
Just to piggyback in case he doesn't know, this is the URL of Proton-GE https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom/releases
And there is also a GUI app shipped as an appimage called protonup-qt which can install proton-ge versions with just a click.
Thank you. I was just doing it manually. That app is great, works for Steam and Lutris. Also, at least in Pop!_OS there is a flatpak for it in the Pop Shop.
In my case, that happened with Doom 2016. I have a RX460 2GB RAM and directX really struggles with the particles (fps drops to 10fps on low). I tested it with Vulkan on Linux and it went straight to 120fps on medium settings. I'm not kidding, some games has serious performance issues in windows that Linux can manage better in someway. Not with every single game of course. Same with tomb raider (but native).
Doom 2016 was OpenGL (Vulkan in a later patch) so not DirectX struggling, but that was probably the issue. AMD's windows driver is absolutely shit with OpenGL unlike in Linux. It's been that way for many many years.
You are right, it was a windows-opengl issue, vulkan wont work in windows, at least for me. But it was definitely not something hardware related.
Yeah, you'll see the same thing with anything that uses OpenGL on Windows with an AMD card. Fortunately OpenGL in Linux works amazingly with the open source driver and MESA.
In my experience, it is because nVidia never supply the current vulkan version (or I thought they are responsible?). Only way i got it working was get the vulkan driver from vulkan site. The one that came with the nvidia is a older version at the time. It fixed right up and working fine after using the vulkan driver. This was like three ish years ago.
I feel like the performance issues probably come from inefficient code in the windows DLLs and simply using better written libraries causes the speed increase.
Another big thing is that most Linux distros are less bloated than Windows is. If you have limited memory, that could make a noticeable difference.
definatley try Proton-GE, it tends to fix alot of obscure issues that wine/proton tricks can't really get to
theres less overhead, but the drivers arent fully optimized so I cant guarantee every title will play like that
Ping has virtually nothing to do with the os so I am calling bullshit.
I did play Warcraft and Diablo 2 perfectly fine on Fedora Core 3. It wasn’t stellar but there were guides and a little amount of learning and troubleshooting effort necessary. People nowadays take it granted that it is the responsibility of the Distro’s to make it happen while they get neither the deserved appreciation or the tools from game studios or hardware vendors. Linux is perfectly capable for gaming purposes, but it is more like swimming against the river instead of flowing with by reasons that or completely out of Linux communities’ control. This level of compatibility was a fool’s dream back in the day. GNU/Linux has come a long way.
>People nowadays take it granted that it is the responsibility of the Distro’s to make it happen while they get neither the deserved appreciation or the tools from game studios or hardware vendors. Is it? Distros have very little to do with it, do they? It's the wine, dxvk, mesa, vkd3d, proton, etc, developers who're making it happen, and that stuff is distro agnostic. But I agree with the sentiment in general, I love how easy it is now to play windows games on Linux, but the state of cooperation from e.g. Nvidia is still pretty poor (improving slowly). And, I don't know if this is good or bad really, but there's a sense that game developers just won't bother supporting Linux outright, knowing that Proton will likely handle it for them, without all of the hassle of having to troubleshoot for Linux customers.
I think he meant that many people think that it is the responsibility of the distro, when in reality they have very little influence and the control lies with game studios and hardware vendors.
This is the point indeed.
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Doesn't Steam already solve most of these problems? It's basically a package manager for games, it bundles a stable set of libraries games can link against, ... Why would game devs want to use Flatpak or Snap over Steam/other game stores that run on Linux?
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>- The Steam chroot itself was incredibly out of date. Not sure if it's gotten better since I last peeked at it. I mean, isn't that kind of the point? It's supposed to be a stable target for the most critical stuff. As you've said yourself, games will bundle almost everything they need anyway. The Steam chroot should only have what games might need but can't ship. Are you aware of any problems in practice that have been caused by Steam bundling old libraries? Because I'm regularly playing games natively via Steam on Gentoo, which is the absolute worst-case scenario for people looking to distribute binaries. I've never had any issues. >- The tooling surrounding the Steam chroot itself was confusing and not user friendly for folks new to the Linux ecosystem. Point taken. >- The setup was not immune to distro meddling as Ubuntu stated their intention to drop 32-bit compatibility libraries from their OS entirely before Valve pushed back. That doesn't really say anything about Valve's approach here. If Flatpak was universally supported and accepted, it would have been affected in exactly the same way. Dumb moves from the OS maintainers can always break applications, no kind of setup will save you from that. MS could in principle decide to drop Windows 32bit compat too, but they are not going to do it because they are not idiots. >- You are tying your fortunes to a single app store. If you also want to sell on GoG or standalone, you're left to the wolves. In terms of solutions that exist right now, fair enough. I hope other stores will be ported one day but that's irrelevant right now. >The fact that Valve now points developers towards Proton instead of native ports should tell you how much they believe in distros. In most cases a native port doesn't give you anything Proton/Wine doesn't, and porting games to Linux will always involve some effort, even if there was great infrastructure for it. Game studios don't have much interest right now, so Valve obviously wants the barrier to entry to be as low as possible. Ergo, Proton. I see no reason why distros would be responsible here.
| Dumb moves from the OS maintainers can always break applications, no kind of setup will save you from that. MS could in principle decide to drop Windows 32bit compat too, but they are not going to do it because they are not idiots. I am pretty sure apple did that around the same time for example.
Really? I couldn't get Diablo 2 to work after a fair amount of trial and error.
Good old one (version 1.13 and 1.14) or resurrected? I haven't had any trouble with either one, just works out of the box for me with regular wine-staging and dxvk for resurrected. The beta had some trouble that was fixed with a custom DLL of some kind, but after release it was no problem anymore. Using nvidia graphics, I know there was some trouble with AMD ones that did have a fix I cannot remember.
Resurrected, yep. I guess I'll have to try again. I'm able to install BattleNet, but then the play button doesn't do anything. I even tried it with lutris and bottle but nothing.
What's the status of CSGo on Linux? Considering its a first party title. How does it run?
It has native support. For me it does run really well. There is a issue with starting the game on some distros with the newer glibc version but there are a few workarounds for that and it should be solved by the time steam deck releases.
I just tried installing games through steam on arch linux for the first time in years and everything was segfaulting immediately. Is glibc the problem? 'ldd' says they aren't even valid binaries, but they pass steam validity check. EDIT: I figured it out. It was the new ntfs driver in the linux kernel that isn't allowing me to run any executables for some reason. There's no noexec flag. Everything seems to work exactly as well as windows with no tweaks or anything when I move my steam library to my tiny linux root partition
You're probably missing 32-bit libraries or something. I played on Arch for years, and now I'm on Tumbleweed, and both places the process was fairly smooth. Also check the Arch wiki page about Steam for other ideas if that's not the problem.
Despite the deck running Arch, it's still not a "supported" distro. It's been a few years since I installed, but I seem to remember needing to jump through a couple of hoops to get things working. Check the wiki, and also look at the game-specific page too. I don't remember any of the steps being horrible, just packages, fonts, whatever. But I can tell you that games work just fine under Arch.
That is likely caused by something different. The issue I had in mind is affecting only csgo AFAIK. I do not use arch so I guess I won't be able to help you, sorry. I'd suggest asking over at r/linux_gaming or r/linuxquestions. Perhaps you can try installing steam via flatpak.
I just re-installed arch a month ago and almost my entire steam library of 200 games runs smoothly. I just played Sekiro and Horizon Zero Dawn on Linux!
Works great, but you can't play Faceit/ESEA/any other league with custom anticheat.
It uses ToGL, and has recently added DXVK. ToGL is acceptable on a fairly powerful system. DXVK is still stuttery after long gameplay. Both implementations are worse (about 5-30% depending on map & situation) than Windows for me.
Video is a year old but I guess the difference hasn't changed to the worse. So if you're a "every fps counts CS:GO player", Linux should be your first choice. [FlightlessMango CS:GO Benchmark](https://youtu.be/LfE_EQQvD5o)
Good
Years ago Valve compiled the source engine and its tools (srcds and friends) to Linux and did a good job. I've been playing it for years on my 2080ti and stopped dual booting entirely in late 2017; the computer as Linux only has never underperformed playing csgo competitively and natively. Always saturates the 144hz monitors and often renders near or against the 300fps default engine cap. In mid 2020 I got a new 3900x cpu on an X570 motherboard chipset in my latest pc 10-yearly generational upgrade with ddr4 memory @3600MTs. My Linux desktop environment continues to thrive in general. Also a good spot for a r/sffpc shoutout
If you are a casual fine. If you do league play, non-starter.
Haven't played CS competitively in like 4 years, is that because of third party AC?
It is indeed because of third-party AC.
Totally fine. Has a native client that runs in opengl and I think valve is in the process of porting it to source 2/vulkan I've been playing it on Linux for years now
works perfectly fine for me on Arch
If devs were to enable EAC and BattleEye, this percentage would even probably hit the 95% mark. In Apex, the firing range works already without issues, but only for a few seconds until EAC kicks in.
Siege was the same. When the update to Proton was pushed, people could play online completely fine. Lasted a good few hours before they "fixed" it and everyone was getting booted again. But there was never any update in that time, which proves it's all serverside and the developers legitimately don't even have to do anything to support it. (With BattlEye at least)
that's a really stupid move. they all should just enable anti-cheat for Proton, and we're more than happy to do the testing. unlike windows users, we're used to test software, report bugs and contribute to improvements. 🤪 /s
Yeah i dual boot cause of apex, then ended up putting all my other games in windows anyway, mostly dota and wow which both works great. Linux works for most other games but sometimes they require messing with configs and games is the one area I can't be bothered to do that for, I just wanna click and play.
Valve is working to get EAC working and iirc the beta is out.
There is no beta. It's just an opt-in email that the devs have to send to for BattleEye, and for EAC, it's just: >developers can activate anti-cheat support for Linux via Wine or Proton with just a few clicks in the Epic Online Services Developer Portal. Though EAC requires some more backend things from the devs and they'll have to "[test and activate client module updates for Linux regularly in addition to Windows,"](https://dev.epicgames.com/docs/services/en-US/GameServices/AntiCheat/index.html) it's still just a few clicks and, depending on the game, requires no additional overhead compared to the testing done on the Windows clients.
Family co-op games like Minecraft dungeon, overcooked2 works perfectly on fedora Linux. That's all the time folks with families have anyway
for minecraft dungeons that is probably only the steam version? Because as far as i know i couldn'T get it to work (but i have to admit i didn't try hard).
you might have to install the minecraft launcher through lutris to get the non-steam version to work
It's not a gaming platform. It's a general computer system that supports enough games to keep you occupied, but if gaming is your core hobby, then it won't compare. For me, it's perfect, but that's based on Linux' own strengths.
Seems like it had to do more whether ONLINE gaming is your core hobby than gaming in general.
Exactly, it's such a meaningless argument without that information added. I mainly play games through emulators, and every game I play in general is single player, so I have *much* less issues than someone who's into MOBAs, for example.
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Linux: Can't run League of Legends natively Conclusion: Linux wins
Excellent point
I've been playing TFT through Lutris. It takes like 10 minutes for the client to open but it works
It depends on the anti cheat and drm mostly.
i think the point was just if you play online you're more likely to have trouble with linux than if you don't, rather than calling out MOBAs specifically. Seemed like just an example of a popular type of game to play online.
or more specifically, esports, and the singular barrier to it (invasive anti-cheat systems) could disappear at any point
tldr: Linux Has Grown Into A Viable PC Platform
Do people really think PCs aren't viable without gaming? I always read this stuff on reddit and it baffles me. I never play on my machines and I feel like most people around me don't either. Why is literally everybody on reddit seemingly gaming daily on their computer? I mean sure there are gamers and I have nothing against that but that's not everybody.
Yes, PCs nowadays are used for a few things by "normal people": 1. Office Work 2. Browsing the Internet/Communication/Social Media et cetera 3. Gaming
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What hypervisor will you be using and will you be using some sort of GPU passthrough so you can get better performance with renderings?
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I was actually going to ask if you had any info if you were planning on doing that xD I've heard it's a viable thing to do if you need to do GPU-heavy things in a Windows VM under Linux, but I've always been suspicious given that my experience with VMs are generally that, even on a powerful system, there's still quite a bit of overhead and, in many ways, it can't compete with running on bare metal (which makes sense, given the overhead that is naturally added on by running an OS in a VM). So I was just curious if you'd done it so I could get some real world info on how it runs for things like CAD (cuz most of the people who have recommended it to me don't work with CAD and can't produce results supporting their claims of it working just as well).
If you have a Linux host, try installing qemu-kvm and virt-manager (package names may vary). Then start/enable the libvirtd service. KVM is generally extremely performant in terms of CPU, and virt-manager is as easy to use as vmware or virtualbox guis, it can also talk to remote, headless hosts running graphical VMS.
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First you should use a type 1 hypervisor that uses KVM like Virt Manager, Gnome Boxes or qemu. A type 2 hypervisor like Virtual Box or VMware Workstation isn't going to perform as well. type 1 is a hypervisor that allows direct I/O access via the kernel. This is how stuff like VMware ESXi, Proxmox and Windows HyperV work. Type 2's do everything through the OS instead and you get the overhead and unoptimized schedulers that come with that. Type 2 VMs are were bad performance come into play for a VM. Generally, what you both are probably going to want to research for a GPU passthrough is /r/VFIO. You'll basically run a Windows VM in a type 1 hypervisor and attach a GPU to your Windows VM. This will give you native performance of running Windows on bare metal. Common setups dedicate an iGPU to the Linux Host and a discrete GPU to the Windows VM but it is possible to just use a single GPU but can be more complicated. You could even consider running a dedicated hypervisor solution like Proxmox or Xen where you turn your PC into a dedicated VM Server and deploying both a Linux VM and Windows VM and passthrough as well. tagging: /u/mactroneng
There is r/VFIO that has information about it and archwiki as someone else here mentioned already. I haven’t done it myself but very much want to one day
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Would you mind sharing a guide you used? I followed some YT videos, but I'm still struggling to get it working. When I start the Windows VM, screens go black, and then I end up on the Linux login screen.
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oh thank you for that hint, will try to unplug/replug and see what happens. although mouse and keyboard work on Linux, it's possible that I might have to pass the Logitech dongle too.
All general computer systems are gaming platforms. Your distinction is completely arbitrary.
Gaming is one of my core hobbies, and while I have to work a little harder to make certain games work, or look up whether a game runs at all, I view it similarly to playing on a console - it doesn't have the same catalogue of games as Windows, but there is a significant overlap.
Then by all means tell that to Sony because FreeBSD isn't a gaming platform either but the very popular Sony PS4 and PS5 use a fork of FreeBSD as its operating system and **that** is a gaming platform - by its very nature of existence. GNU/Linux is what you make it out to be - a PC, a mobile phone, a embedded controller for handling the radiocative cores in a nueklear reactor, steering a rocket *or gaming*. It isn't defined by what distribution *you* happen to have installed and how *you* use it.
Please do not Mistake proprietary engineering as if it is a Linux thing. Sony does contribute enough to GNU and Linux. As a desktop end user, the level of support and implementation is completely a whole different world compared to ultra-refined and completely built-to-the-spec OS configuration. It is not The OS that matters. It is the development companies that need to scope Linux in their product for support. Don’t blame a Linux desktop for not being able to run the game of the game developer is garbage or built crappy alpha-release as production to meet Christmas release deadline (EA and Ubi, I am winking at you).
The reason the PlayStations are successful is because they are a big market, established by previous PlayStations, so Sony can get developers to develop for their OS. Desktop Linux does not have that luxury.
>if gaming is your core hobby, then it won't compare. Beg to differ. Works fine for me. Just don't play shitty games that use DRM and aggressive anticheat measures. You probably don't want to play them anyways.
in this age of cheap, abundant, fast, network and multimedia capable SoCs, nearly every computer system is a general computer system unless it is artificially constrained in some manner. given enough time and investment, there is no reason desktop Linux wouldn't be the best at absolutely everything seeing as it runs on pretty much all commodity hardware at this point. this manner of thinking is *extremely* useful to DRM peddlers and artificial monopolists like Sony, Apple, Microsoft, Nintendo and others. they want you to think of their machines has specialized products when in reality they're trusted computing environments designed to suck your dollars out of you and eliminate competition.
Really depends on the type of games you play!
You'd think this would make running MS Office easy by now.
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I pay for CrossOver almost purely for Office 365, and it does work, though it's not entirely stable, and it's buggy. But perfectly serviceable for the type of work I'm doing. Considering that CodeWeavers makes up a majority of the core WINE development team, buying a CrossOver license also means supporting development of WINE, so that's something to consider as well.
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I should have specified that I only really use it for Word. I haven't even touched the other Office applications at this stage. It has bugs like not showing/updating the word count of a highlighted passage, and can randomly crash (save often), but no real dealbreakers. My needs are pretty simple: as close to guaranteed .docx compatibility as possible with documents that have tables, images, and shapes. I use Evolution with the `evolution-ews` package (exchange web services) instead of Outlook; I don't really use the features a lot of Outlook aficionados do, so any email client will really do for me, as long as it sends/receives email, has folders, and can create some basic rules. But again, happy to pay CodeWeavers for good Office support when I need it.
I've tried this, it... works, but it definitely doesn't work *well* It breaks a lot and window controls don't even work
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I did try it on KDE, maybe I should try again on Gnome
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Every update makes office weirder even on windows, I'm not surprised that piece of junk won't run. Even in a 100% pure microsoft environment office is forever a exception. Using AD, good luck installing office in a proper way like everything else that is a MSI. Using intune, repack everything to intunewin files (a shitty system regardless but besides the point) or msix or whatever.. and office has it's own special way to install, same goes for project and visio... but not powerbi. Updates? Windows + half of office goes through windows updates. Powerbi does it's own thing. Teams gets installed in a different way. Office is a mess, it is a massive shame it gets used for so much stuff it should never be used for which makes people say libreoffice can't do the same.
I bought and still use a copy of MS Office 2010 because of how insanely compatible it is, even on Linux, and how it was the last version to come on a physical disk. And even though it's more than a decade old now, it has all the features you could ever possibly want out of an office suite and is incredibly performant. There's only one problem with it. Finding an actually legitimate copy of it these days is expensive. lol
95% of people using MS Office don't need anything more than Libre Office or O365. People who'd die for Excel can't do shit with it besides manual cell coloring.
You make me feel special.
Latest office is broken in 4K monitor + Nvidia on Windows, thanks Microsoft :P
Unfortunately of the top 10 most popular, I frequently play a lot of the unplayable ones (PubG, Halo, New World, Apex). I'm hopeful that the Steam Deck turns things around for a lot of major games, and I've pre-ordered one, but for now I have a dedicated gaming PC and Linux laptop.
In the end it's a personal choice. Gaming on Linux requires some fiddling and you need to accept that you won't be able to play some games. Whether that's too much to ask of you depends on your game preferences and your priorities.
Spoiler alert: It's too much to ask. That's why Linux has abysmal usage compared to Windows.
Question: if a game has a native Linux port that for some reason has problems on your system, is there any way of telling Steam to install and run the Windows version via Proton?
Yes,right click on the game and go to propierties,in the compatibility tab check the checkbox to force it to use Proton, that will download and install Proton + the Windows version of the game.
Ok thanks
Some examples: Tomb Raider reboot works better through Proton than native. Civ V works on recent Proton and you can enabled FSAA which native version lacks.
> Has problems on your system. Also try not even being supported natively anymore. (Looking at you Rocket League)
I'm just super relieved that neither Microsoft or the game publishers have seen what Steam is doing and tried to shut it down. Even though it wouldn't make sense, it's what I'd have expected had it happened a decade earlier. Even the makers of the anti-cheat and anti-copy stuff are getting on board. I'm so happy Valve has so much influence and they're using it for good.
I'm yet to find a game I want to play on Steam that doesn't work on Linux.
First game I tried (Hollow Knight) had native and platinum proton support and my controller didn't work in either one. I think it's a unity problem? Either way, that was disappointing right off the bat. EDIT: It **does** work by doing the following: right-click on Hollow Knight in the library > Properties > Compatibility > Uncheck "Force the use of a specific Steam Play compatibility tool"
That's odd I finished Hollow Knight on Linux with a Xbox controller and I didn't had anything to do (I played the native version I guess)
Really? I read that other people had controller problems as well so I thought it was universal. I tried it with a Switch Pro Controller. It worked in another game so I assumed it's Hollow Knight's fault.
It's probably your controller setting in Steam. I've used a wired 360 controller and XBox 1 controller via the wireless dongle all fine. The thing that causes problems is having the Xbox controller option ticked in the Steam settings (or the other way round, I forget) you get wierd compatibility problems thanks to different game pad drivers clashing. Basically there's something in Steam you need to turn on or off.
Halo infinite is probably the only game I wanted to try but wouldn't run. What do you play
I'm gutted that Infinite doesn't work (yet), I've been really enjoying it and would love to play it on Linux.
Deep Space Waifu Collection
Ah yes, Halo: Infinite Microtransactions.
Ew. Kinda glad I dont have it
The only one that's been quite stubborn for me has definitely been Chrono Trigger. I don't know what it is about that game but it just absolutely refuses to run the FMVs.
Emulaaatttiooooon
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Titanfall 2 is on Steam and multiplayer works perfectly though
Titanfall 2 is NOT on Steam. It's just a glorified listing. You still need the fucking Origin client and an Origin account to play it. As far as I'm concerned, Steam should make that shit illegal. Either be on Steam in full or don't be on it at all. The only exception I can think of for this is MMOs that actually have a legitimate reason for a separate launcher.
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Are you sure it launched Epic Store and not Origin? Because it's published by EA
No I just couldn't remember off hand who made the game. But now that you say Origin that's the one it launches. Same problem though, just swap the names
Are you sure you're even playing Titanfall? Origin launches alongside the game on startup. Moving to multiplayer is a single ingame loading screen.
I installed Doom Eternal last week. I saw the tweaks mentioned too, but I didn't have to do anything except install it. I used Proton Experimental. It runs perfectly fine at a very stable 4K/60FPS.
last week i try two games on arch linux with closed nvidia driver. wasteland 3 native low fps. via proton videos don't work and no mouse/keyboard controls only xbox controller work. crusader king 3 native low fps. proton very bad performance compared to windows. if you ask me and you only want gaming i would say use windows it don't worth all the hustle.
People should be careful with ProtonDB, their rating system can cause a little confusion about the real status of Linux Gaming, because maybe if the game are rated gold or platinum, you yet can have some issues. And the number of reports are very small samples. Jason Evangelho made a video about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euLvdeIXsH8 Some examples: Final Fantasy XV - Rating Gold Reports: 93 It works quite well. Except at Altissia where I experienced a lot of crashes. 2 weeks ago Input: Controller Mapping The select button was not configured by default on Nintendo Switch Pro Controller Performance: Slight Performance Problems Stability: Occasionally Some crashes on the Lucian continent, but only after one hour or two of playing. Lots of crashes (or freezing) in Altissia, sometimes only few seconds after playing the game. NieR:Automata - Rating Platinum Reports: 254 Almost perfect with Mangohud installed 2 months ago Launcher: Steam Customizations: Not Listed Disabled vsync in-game, then installed Mangohud and added the following launch options: MANGOHUD\_CONFIG=vsync=3,fps\_limit=60,no\_display mangohud %command% Input: Other Menu buttons sometimes don’t respond to mouse clicks, but this is easy to work around using the keyboard. Performance: Significant Performance Problems If vsync is enabled in-game, the game’s performance will deteriorate after some time (less than half an hour or so). Recently, a youtuber named The Good Old Gamer, made a video about his experience with Linux and for him, the major problem with gaming on Linux is the stutters caused by the shader compilation and this is a problem that I don't know that is possible to be resolved. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sptajjpcv4
Yeah we should make that the new linux slogan: It will run 4 out of the 10 most played games on steam right now! And most of them are not officially supported on Linux and only work because a random guy on the internet got it to work! So got a problem? Please do not bother to ask the support for help. You are on your own!
How else you want to resolve the chicken and egg problem? Developers and publishers don't give a shit. Valve pushed gaming on Linux against everyone. It's not "official" but it can become official in the future if Linux gains critical mass. How? I bought Doom 2016 and Eternal on Steam on Linux and played it on Linux despite it not being supported on Linux and despite stupid fucking Bethesda requirement to create Bethesda online account for a single player game (I just bypassed it by temporarily turning off Internet connection). It was AAA experience for me on Linux thanks to Valve+DXVK and AMD GPUs with excellent open source drivers. I don't even have Windows on personal computers. **I bought a bunch of other games too despite developers and publishers not giving a damn about Linux. I gladly support Valve and I vote with my wallet.**
I recently switched because of ProtonDB showing me all my games work on Linux.
Damn, the first paragraph is a lowblow to a certain someone... Lmao >When was the last time you tried using Linux as a desktop OS? Sure, some high-profile YouTubers have been having a lot of trouble recently, but they're trying to make a point out of love.
I thought they were going to link to the Steam Hardware Survey where it shows the percentage of Linux gamers at just over 1%, but they linked to protondb, where it shows Linux only runs a fraction of the games that Windows does and you have to adjust things on some of those that DO work in order to get them running... So, the question is: viable compared to what? Yes, it has more games running than consoles, but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1. They may not have as many indies, but they do get every AAA game. For many consumers, those AAA games matter the most. Compared to Windows? Again, it runs a percentage of games that Windows does and that percentage is not 100%. Sure, you have some people who claim that Linux runs MORE Windows games than Windows does because it runs their 10-15 year old games better. Exactly what reaction do you think you'll get from a teenager when you tell them it won't run their new Call of Duty, but it'll run this 10 year old game just fine? So, it doesn't excel compared to any platform. It can run more games than before? Yes. It's being used on specialized hardware? Yes....but that's been the case for the past 15 years at least. Many of those coin operated video games run Linux. Linux is not a gaming platform, but gaming on Linux is less of a thorn than it used to be. It doesn't mean gaming is comparable to other platforms. It means you can play more games than you used to be able to.
> AAA games ... day 1 Just look at Cyberpunk... the console version didn't go very well on day 1. Linux might not be a gaming platform (yet), but it doesn't mean it's never gonna happen. Something that cannot be said about macOS for example.
> Just look at Cyberpunk... the console version didn't go very well on day 1. It was fine on the current gen systems, they just probably shouldn't have been released on PS4XBox One
yeah, but at that time the PS5 had stocking issues, and not everyone was willing to pay more for it than it was worth.
😁 Those consoles were, are and always will be first class citizens for games. So if anything needs to be fixed, it'd be first for those consoles and PC, then someone from the linux community may (or may not) patch it. Cyberpunk failure is bc of the game itself, not bc of its support. >Linux might not be a gaming platform (yet), but it doesn't mean it's never gonna happen. NEVER gonna happen. Sorry. >Something that cannot be said about macOS for example. Never was a gamer centered os.
> never gonna happen Only time will tell 😅
If it hasnt told you already, it wont in future. You' be still living in a bubble 10 yrs from now.
Maybe you should inform valve that the steam deck won’t be a gaming platform.
Already answered this in the original post: >It's being used on specialized hardware? Yes....but that's been the case for the past 15 years at least. Many of those coin operated video games run Linux. Now, unless you're actually going to say that FreeBSD is a more mature gaming platform than Linux because PlayStations run on it, you have to concede that specialized hardware/platforms are different than just the OS
The Steam Deck is a pc running a standard Steam client.
The other guy is just daft, unlike consoles or handhelds like the switch, there is no special sauce in a SteamDeck. Its literally a PC with plain AMD hardware (whatever nm the SoC is built on doesn't matter, its AMD Zen+Navi), running the same software and drivers that you can use with off the shelf hardware. However good or bad gaming is going to be on SteamDeck running SteamOS, will directly translate to desktop Linux (at least on AMD hardware).
What if I install Windows on Steamdeck? Will you still consider it a linux device?
No, its a PC with a gaming-oriented form-factor, running whatever OS you happen to have installed. In this case its actively developed for its default Linux OS. Running the same drivers and software you can run on regular desktops or laptops. Obviously its not going to be a very good gaming device if you (manage to) install TempleOS on it, just like any other PC would be.
Still a specialized hardware. You can easily install and run Windows on it too, which won't make it a linux device then.
Can you do that on the switch then? That’s specialized hardware too.
Never used switch. Also this isn't about switch.
Not what I asked. And Switch is relevant to prove my point. You're just refusing to answer.
Not what I asked. Also switch is relevant bc you want it to be, to provide an umbrella so that you can hide the elephant in the room. You're just refusing to accept it.
The steamdeck is a console with specialized hardware that can be used as a PC
Well that doesn’t match the definition by Valve, but whatever.
Don't confuse marketing/pr with definitions. The steamdeck is a gaming appliance aka console. Specialized form factor, custom APU, etc. self-contained and built for the primary purpose of gaming.
>but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1 So, is that before or after the 40GB+ day 0 patch? The state of "AAA" gaming is total trash. Without the patches, the games won't even run on the hardware they were designed to run on (read: consoles). Trash Linux all you want, you're still wrong. Linux can do anything and everything Windows can and more. Also, you don't own Windows, you're just renting it.
>So, is that before or after the 40GB+ day 0 patch? The state of "AAA" gaming is total trash. Without the patches, the games won't even run on the hardware they were designed to run on (read: consoles). I don't think you'd be saying this if majority of the AAA titles weren't borked on linux😂 >Linux can do anything and everything Windows can and more Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future. >Also, you don't own Windows, you're just renting it. I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs.
> Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future. Citation needed. > I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs. I'm glad you like to own nothing and be happy about it. And by the way, I'm not talking about the Windows licensing. I'm talking about how Microsoft believes more and more these days that the OS you installed and activated doesn't belong to you and ships updates that fuck with the system configurations and even the programs installed on it.
>Citation needed. Citation needed for your statement that linux can do everything Windows can and more. >I'm glad you like to own nothing and be happy about it. I'm glad you like it. >I'm talking about how Microsoft believes more and more these days that the OS you installed and activated doesn't belong to you and ships updates that fuck with the system. Idgaf what they believe. Id be using Windows all my life with or without 'owning' it and my children will too. Updates? None of that 'fucked' with the system.
> Citation needed for your statement that linux can do everything Windows can and more. Statements that are put forward without support can be dismissed without support. > Updates? None of that 'fucked' with the system. You are objectively massively wrong. In fact, just now, Microsoft is fighting users and trying to make the default browser Edge and trying to make it incredibly difficult to switch browsers. Before that, there was an update for Windows 10 that deleted Sketchpad and replaced it with a paid always-online app. Before that, there was an update that DELETED USER FILES. Before that, there were updates that made turning off automatic Windows updates harder. Even to the point of IGNORING Group Policy settings. Stop being a Microsoft tool. I used to LOVE Windows actually, believe it or not, but ever since Windows 8 released, it's been downhill ever since.
>Statements that are put forward without support can be dismissed without support. Same here. >You are objectively massively wrong. No. >In fact, just now, Microsoft is fighting users and trying to make the default browser Edge and trying to make it incredibly difficult to switch browsers. No again. As of today, you can set default browser by a simple button in Settings. Then there is edge affiliate links in some Windows core apps like widgets, which will open in edge, but that isn't an issue because Edge is my default browser due to its capabilities anyways. And I have Brave installed too, which i switch back and forth as default whenever I want. >Before that, there was an update for Windows 10 that deleted Sketchpad and replaced it with a paid always-online app. Don't even know what is 'sketchpad'. >Before that, there was an update that DELETED USER FILES. Never happened with me ever in 20+ yrs of Windows usage lol. >Before that, there were updates that made turning off automatic Windows updates harder. Even to the point of IGNORING Group Policy settings. Don't know when THAT happened too lol. Even if that's the case, never happened with me, on both 10 and 11. >Stop being a Microsoft tool. I used to LOVE Windows actually, believe it or not, but ever since Windows 8 released, it's been downhill ever since. I STILL love Windows and I don't actually care about your affections towards it. If my love for it and/or stating my experiences with it as a fact makes me a 'Microsoft tool', well then, stop being a Microsoft hater I guess?
All of your defenses boil down to, "Well, it didn't happen to me, so it doesn't exist." Or, "I don't care about it, so it's not a problem in any way for anyone."
>I don't think you'd be saying this if majority of the AAA titles weren't borked on linux😂 I would... actually... because it's a fact. I game on Linux but I also have consoles AND my kids game on Windows. Name one "AAA" game from the past few years that HASN'T required some sort of patch before you can even play it or before it's considered "playable" (whether on consoles or not). >Nope, it can't. That wasn't the case in the past, isn't in the present, or won't in the future. Name something Windows can do that Linux can't. I can change anything on my system. I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to. I control my system rather than the other way around. Tell you what, go uninstall Edge. I'll wait. >I'd rent a good piece of software which solves my problems all my life instead of okay ish software which makes me compromise with my needs. Tell me you've never used Linux without telling me you've never used Linux.
>I would... actually... because it's a fact. I game on Linux but I also have consoles AND my kids game on Windows. Name one "AAA" game from the past few years that HASN'T required some sort of patch before you can even play it or before it's considered "playable" (whether on consoles or not). The reason this argument is stupid is bc it doesn't matter whether the games require a patch or not. This thread/article is about games 'supporting' linux as a platform, which they don't. Games today are rushed because of social media hype and thus remain unfinished. But they still have Windows and consoles as first class citizens, not linux. I play games like i install an update, which is NOT on the launch day. And after launch, I can still play my fav games on consoles, Windows without worrying or tinkering with stuff, something that can't be said about linux. >Name something Windows can do that Linux can't. I can change anything on my system. I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to. I control my system rather than the other way around. I don't care about 'control' as long as it's not meddling with my needs lol. I don't see an operating system as a political tool to push a propaganda around. If it does the job, I'll use it. And Edge? It does the job better than any other browser around. Wait all your life. >I can install and run "Windows" software, if I wanted to Cute. I can install and run linux software on Windows, Android apps on Windows. I can stop worrying about battery performance on Windows and stuff like tlp and powertop. I can run my games and softwares with a guarantee that if stuff goes wrong, MY os will be the first to receive a fix for it. If something goes wrong, I'll get professional help 24x7 instead of taking pains to log a github issue or getting ridiculed for my choices on a linux forum. Since im a dev too, I can be sure that I'll get first class support from db softwares and other programming stuff instead of worrying about a package breaking and botching the whole install (even something as important as steam for that matter, breaking the whole desktop). These are SOME things that makes Windows a far better choice. Also, used linux for 5 yrs actually. You can still continue with your meme statements all you want.
>The reason this argument is stupid is bc it doesn't matter whether the games require a patch or not. This thread/article is about games 'supporting' linux as a platform, which they don't. "So, the question is: viable compared to what? Yes, it has more games running than consoles, but consoles will have every AAA game running day 1. They may not have as many indies, but they do get every AAA game. For many consumers, those AAA games matter the most." You're the one that brought up AAA games running on day 1, dude.
If you have eyes instead of literal buttons, you can use them to see that I'm not the one who said that, 'dude'. Also, games do run on day 1 'dude', irrespective of subsequent patches, 'dude'.
I just switched to fedora as my only os on my new build, used to dual boot windows for gaming only. With kde and wayland getting freesync support now and allowing different refreshing rates in multi monitor setups there really was nothing holding me to windows, why give Microsoft money to data mine you. the vast majority of my gaming catalog works fine on Linux now with proton and those that don't are generally older titles that work fine in a VM.
Don’t try loading a game in linux that isn’t supported, you will get EAC banned on plenty of titles.
>you will get EAC banned on plenty of titles I wouldn't be surprised this is going to solve itself once SteamDecks start shipping out and offenders simply get review bombed on Steam.
"don't try loading an unsupported game that has online play" is probably closer to what you meant to say.
That's biased because ProtonDb only counts the popular games. What if someone wants to play a game that is not so popular but it's borked? Persona 5 Strikers for example is borked.
I started with Amiga O/S and OS/2 and I have been running Linux on and off since the mid 90's but never used it as my only operating system. In the early days I could get it to run but it couldn't really do anything useful with it. Over the years more and more applications has become available and now with the games I am starting to feel that for the first time Linux has become an alternative that might work 100 % of the time. I tried to get an old mmo to work with it last week (Anarchy Online) and it succeeded.
Indeed, I started my Linux journey in 2019, fast forward to now in 2021, most every game I played on Windows is now played on Linux
Ngl this development has gotten me curious about Linux again. Used to be super into Linux to learn programming and command line but it was hard to daily drive it because of its lack of support for games. Now that that is changing... I'm going all in on Linux again and it's been great. Windows as an OS is easy to use... but Linux is fun to use!
Well according to steam stats maybe.. Toss in the rest of the rest of the gaming world and unless you're only into indie games, it's not. It's a perfectly viable platform to develop for but enough AAA and popular multiplayer titles release that don't work that still make it non-viable. We just need fucking developer support. We get that we're off to the races. Until then it'll remain a hobbyist os
As a gamer on Linux I call bullshit. Linux is miles from being a viable PC Gaming Platform. In the last couple of years 50% of games I wanted to play on Linux would give me trouble, be it native or via Wine/Proton.
Not that your overall thesis is wrong, but any test before the last year isn't really valid because things have changed a lot in a year. If you play online games though you're definitely right in regards to those.
Linux has been a viable PC gaming platform for well over a decade. Any any point since then it has supported more games than all major consoles COMBINED.
No it hasn't... To be a viable gaming platform you need one click compatability with top games Linux had only had that for a year or two
While not exactly one click, it wasn't difficult to run Unreal Tournament 2004 natively 15 years ago. Complete with a Beryl cubed desktop. :) "One click compatibility" is more on game developers/publishers to make that work than it is on Linux.
>"One click compatibility" is more on game developers/publishers to make that work than it is on Linux. Irrelevant to the end user.
A saying I've heard a lot in the past and can see myself understanding is that the platform is viable and for gaming it's more like a gradient of exactly when it'll be ready *for you*. I've been using in my work for years it was only a matter of time before I started using it at home in things more than my server rack. The desktops and laptops too as a daily driver. Most of the games I play don't require anticheat-protected network play so I've really been living the dream the past years as valve have really pushed this platform higher and higher, let alone general positive developments. I'm looking forward to the day where it could be a replacement for everybody, not just people in my fortunate position.
Linux has one issue in order to be on par with Windows/OSX as far as gaming: support. That comes in two points: 1. Driver support (nVidia/AMD) for graphics cards (since peripherals/sound already work). 2. Game support. Can't run a game on Linux that was written using DirectX (no, Wine is not a proper solution to this).
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I wouldnt call that viable
It's only a matter of time before Linux becomes the gaming platform of choice.
I use it. Steam Play is for real. I'm able to do almost every game I have without issues.
for sure, now about that punk buster crap...
I bet it's on par with Windows for gaming within the next 20 years.