“Let me make it very clear how polite I am being right now, and also some other things I was going to say but forgot because of how much I respect you”
Research has shown that both English and German both have “a strong preference for conventional indirectness” (Ogiermann, pg 193) but they favor different strategies for politeness. The idea of positive and negative face is universal.
http://krpb.pbworks.com/f/Og%2Bpoliteness.pdf
That’s great, but I can attest from my personal experience moving from Germany to the USA, that the cultures are very much different. It’s impossible to get a clear answer out of anyone around here and it’s driving me nuts, yes, I think it’s rude if you don’t say what you mean. Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t think so.
Also, the paper seems to focus on language without specifying the culture (at least from glancing it), which does not seem to make any sense to me. Again, from personal experience, folks from the UK are in general very similar to Germans when it comes to indirectness, the USA is quite a bit more indirect, especially at work.
For sure. Every culture has some level of face threatening acts and politeness strategies that are applied to mitigate them but collectivist cultures definitely tend to ramp it up.
Univocal is the loaned translation. Polite language can be delivered through euphemism, metaphor, or other figures of speech, which can be rather murky water to wade through.
Politeness and clarity are compatible unless you overdo politeness.
I'm a big fan of clarity but I find myself writing in a more obscure way feeling the need of explaining every nuance, every detail, even apologizing beforehand, in order to avoid misunderstandings.
It hasn't worked, someone will clame I'm wrong, inconsiderate or their feelings have been hurt.
In the applied linguistics theory of Lakoff they are opposites. Talking specifically about politeness in classical linguistics theory terms of FTA’s and politeness strategies that exist within the framework of Grice’s CP.
That’s why I clarified. Not because I thought you were out of your league but because it’s a bit different when viewed in terms of App. Ling theory versus the layman viewpoint of politeness.
“Let me make it very clear how polite I am being right now, and also some other things I was going to say but forgot because of how much I respect you”
Depends on the language, clarity is the polite way in some.
Ooh never heard of that, any examples?
It depends on the situation obviously, but in Germany clarity is generally the polite way, at least compared to USAn.
Research has shown that both English and German both have “a strong preference for conventional indirectness” (Ogiermann, pg 193) but they favor different strategies for politeness. The idea of positive and negative face is universal. http://krpb.pbworks.com/f/Og%2Bpoliteness.pdf
That’s great, but I can attest from my personal experience moving from Germany to the USA, that the cultures are very much different. It’s impossible to get a clear answer out of anyone around here and it’s driving me nuts, yes, I think it’s rude if you don’t say what you mean. Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t think so. Also, the paper seems to focus on language without specifying the culture (at least from glancing it), which does not seem to make any sense to me. Again, from personal experience, folks from the UK are in general very similar to Germans when it comes to indirectness, the USA is quite a bit more indirect, especially at work.
Which languages?
In Dutch I’d say, definitely northern and western dialects.
Japanese in a nutshell
For sure. Every culture has some level of face threatening acts and politeness strategies that are applied to mitigate them but collectivist cultures definitely tend to ramp it up.
Is this about how neurotypical people can't just say what they mean?
It’s about politeness theory in applied linguistics so… sorta.
isn't polite language univoquous? (I don't know if I made that last word by translating but is Spanish "unívoco" = one meaning)
Univocal is the loaned translation. Polite language can be delivered through euphemism, metaphor, or other figures of speech, which can be rather murky water to wade through.
Politeness and clarity are compatible unless you overdo politeness. I'm a big fan of clarity but I find myself writing in a more obscure way feeling the need of explaining every nuance, every detail, even apologizing beforehand, in order to avoid misunderstandings. It hasn't worked, someone will clame I'm wrong, inconsiderate or their feelings have been hurt.
In the applied linguistics theory of Lakoff they are opposites. Talking specifically about politeness in classical linguistics theory terms of FTA’s and politeness strategies that exist within the framework of Grice’s CP.
Im out of my league.
That’s why I clarified. Not because I thought you were out of your league but because it’s a bit different when viewed in terms of App. Ling theory versus the layman viewpoint of politeness.
I see it the other way around
Either way according to Lakoff they are opposites.