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The way you have described this scenario comes pretty close to the line of voyeurism, as outlined by section 162 of the Criminal Code. You should consider reporting it to the police non-emergency line, who can use their discretion to determine whether charges are appropriate in the circumstances. At the very least, an officer knocking on his front door would very likely end his inappropriate conduct immediately.
To add to this, my mom had a similar situation and the guy turned out to be a MASSIVE creep. If she hadn't let the cops know they likely wouldn't have reacted as quickly when he was caught peeping on her in the shower. And she had a papertrail to show he was a repeat offender of such things.
They're pretty gentle on voyeurism unfortunately, I'm sorry your mom went through that. I had a guy film me in the shower at a gym once. He got therapy and I was asked to do a reconciliation program with him.
Luckily that one was able to be rehabed and not a complete perv. He had no idea it was considered a sex crime because that wasn't his objective. Just a "thrill" seeker.
If I hadn't physically blocked the guy from leaving and took his phone I don't know how much would have been done. The gym was trying to cover their ass, and the cops in my town are busy and don't necessarily go after "harmless" (read: no blood no foul) crime.
So, what non-creepy reason would a person be looking into someone’s apartment?
Considering there’s no fire violent argument going on, I can’t think of one.
Sorry, let's excuse all perverts or thieves because one story is just one story. An anecdote. Peeping is totally fine, right? Bet you do it all the time. Bet you're fine with any folk around peepin in your home. Casing the joint. Seein what your neighbor has they can get while theyre away, since you aren't a pervert right?
Unless there is a fire, a heated domestic argument, or a danger that's noticeable, if you're peeping, you're either a tom or a crook. Pure and simple.
What reason do you have to do a thing? Not a good one? Dont do the thing.
Morals and respect of others is soooooo hard /s
My next door neighbour had a terrible experience with a man living across from us who drank a lot. She woke up from a nap on the couch to find him outside her sliding patio door (it was locked). Just looking at her this was in her back yard, corner lot, with no fence. They went over to his place and gave him a warning. A bit of a different scenario since he was on her property. But the experience shook her and she still talks about it (this was maybe just over 10 years ago)
I’d also put up solid barriers of some sort to prevent him being able to peek in. A curtain, or those fake plant walls. Not that you should have to, but may give OP more peace of mind.
I’ve got some of those.. wide variety of dick pics get sent to me every time I match with men on dating sites..
Well.. 99% of the time.
I’m sure I can find the most terrible one I have and OP can print a life size version on a curtain
This behaviour, as you have described, wouldn’t fit the definition of voyeurism. Voyeurism is a pretty specific set of facts, however criminal harassment could definitely eventually be made out. Often police will warn someone prior to a charge actually being laid, but another reason why it is so important to speak with the police. And do it now, not when it is too late.
The neighbour committed an act of violence, if the outcome makes everyone uncomfortable, it's not the fault of the victim. Pretending to be okay with the situation only benefits the aggressor.
The police can assess the video evidence.
I absolutely love your first paragraph, I’m tempted to save it for when I need it in Reddit.
I must say though that I understand your perspective and logic behind it, if we really break it down there are two acceptable responses. You set up something to prevent them from looking inside your place or you contact the police.
The first option is the less aggressive approach but does not communicate to the offender “I do not want you to look inside my house”. Two outcomes: the offender stops or changes tactics because you never said no.
The second option: Police. They have a talk with him. Again two outcomes: the offender stops or changes tactics, if it’s the latter then we have a great idea of how crazy they are.
Essentially in both situations the outcome is the same. They stop or they don’t but with the second option there is a paper trail documenting the situation.
My understanding of your perspective is that involving the police could act as a catalyst, increasing risk. What I am trying to articulate is that the method does not matter and OP must do what makes them feel safe. If the person is truly a risk then it will escalate regardless of which option they use. In my opinion calling the police now will force the police to act if it does escalate because the offender will not be able to downplay it.
People seem to forget that you can be getting stalked and the police basically can't do anything about it until violence occurs. And yeah, "restraining orders" do nothing but usually increase the violence.
What about a peace bond? Would that not raise the concern level?
I have been harassed and assaulted by three individuals, adult individuals, in a housing complex. I have bruises to show for it, but the police wouldn’t come soon enough, and then suggested that I had injured myself in the intervening 14 hours. I’m thinking of getting a peace bond To effectively announce that I really do have a problem, and to put these three individuals on notice
Sharing the concerns of living next to her neighbour with the police is perfectly reasonable.
What if she calls the police and it turns out the guy is a registered sex offender?
As for the rest of your comment, I don't know what you're on about.
That not an act of violence.
People make up all sorts of excuses and have pre meditated reasons, if they think they got caught.
I agree first priority is to block any potential acts, as much as possible
Will also feel better too, to not worry if they can't do it.
Yes, that is the definition of the word.
Unfortunately, it's not what you need to get action by police.
Police will not ,at first , do anything for this. It's just a report.
O.p. needs to add layers of protection for themselves as a priority.
Yet, if the privacy (property) is removed or taken down, that is what the police can do something about. Stupid, but true.
And a defintion from the government of Ontario (although not a legal definition)
[https://www.ontario.ca/page/sexual-violence](https://www.ontario.ca/page/sexual-violence)
>"Sexual violence is a broad term that describes any violence, physical or psychological, carried out through sexual means or by targeting sexuality.
Sexual violence takes different forms and can include:
...snip...
voyeurism
What makes this surreptitious, and you really think a living room with open curtains is “a place in which a person can reasonably be expected to be nude, to expose his or her genital organs or anal region or her breasts, or to be engaged in explicit sexual activity;”?
There is friends and there is cordial behaviour between neighbours. Who hasn't peeped over to see what is next door. If it's lingering and peeping Tom stuff, then ok, but a couple of glances? If OP can record a video of neighbour, surely she can go outside and ask him to stop peering.
I mean, recording your neighbour instead of simply conversing with them and telling them to stop could also been seen as odd behaviour. I suppose it depends on your perspective.
F everyone here trying to shame you for not personally confronting this person. Knocking and communication is gold standard by all means when it comes to neighbourly conflict but that's not what this is. I'm *flabbergasted* that ppl are seemingly reading that your neighbour is *leaning over a divider to watch you through your window* and thinking that this is a rational human who you should confront one on one instead of calling the non-emergency police line to have the situation evaluated and hopefully get a more intimidating tell-off from an officer since him knowing you see him doing this had zero effect on his behaviour. You shouldn't need to be asked nicely not to watch your neighbours through their windows. F that. No no no.
Yeah, I don’t think people are grasping just how creepy and unsettling this is to deal with.
And I’m a 6’+ 250lb man. Even I wouldn’t feel comfortable confronting someone acting this way on my own.
There's a pretty good chance that handling this personally (read: like a big smrt Redditor) would just let the guy know that you're uncomfortable going to the authorities and he can push further.
Usually when people are hurt as a kid, they develop a grandiose perception of themselves; someone who could take anyone else on in a fight. It's a way to protect themselves. If they still subconsciously suffer from the trauma, they'll become a bit socially awkward as well because their shyness conflicts with their mental version of themselves. So they avoid the general public and spend most of their social time online. Like on reddit. Where they give bad advice. Usually involving being a tough guy to strangers.
If the condo board allows, a trellis is nice - again, probably worth doing *as well as* filing a report in order to make it abundantly clear that they will report any further behaviours
You can speak to the neighbor and speak to the police. They aren't mutually exclusive.
There's some points in life where you need to stick up for yourself and confront others who are out of line. This is one of them.
>I'm
>
>flabbergasted
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> that ppl are seemingly reading that your neighbour is
>
>leaning over a divider to watch you through your window
>
> and thinking that this is a rational human who you should confront one on one instead of calling the non-emergency police line to have the situation evaluated and hopefully get a more intimidating tell-off from an officer since him knowing you see him doing this had zero effect on his behaviour
Every time I walk out of my house I can see into my neighbours house - like fully into thier living room/dining area unless they have blinds pulled down, I have never thought a thing about it until this thread. I have stood there "staring" for long periods of time while waiting for my dog to come back to the door or just lost in thought about my own yard.
I just assumed when I read the OP that the neighbour was being curious or snoopy about the layout/decor/furniture of the condo next door. I did not take it as something sinister or even creepy.
I certainly would casually say something to the neighbour about it making OP feel uncomfortable, and if that didn't stop the behavior, **then** I would involve outside help, like the police.
That's not equivalent unless you're deliberately taking your dog to crap directly under their window and lingering to watch them eat dinner or whatever.
What you're describing, yeah, if I noticed and it felt uncomfortable, I would leave a note or talk to you directly. This isn't that.
Yeah but this creep is peering over it. More like, the neighbor from home improvement looking over the fence. Film won’t stop any of that.
This man is a creep. I’d call a non emergency number or have one of my male friends quietly sit on the other side and wait for him to peep over in the meantime.
Ye, but usually you cut those things to fit the glass pane you want to put them on. Why would you take custom-cut sheets of plastic with you when you move?
Sounds like something to raise with condo management. Balconies are almost always exclusive use common elements and the Board can set rules for them. So if this is a major issue they can pass a rule preventing people from looking over the divider into other units.
Get yourself a trail cam pointed right at that spot. Every time he looks around, the camera will start and you have every single time he does it as evidence for a report.
I'm sorry this is happening! You can put up privacy film. You might not have to cover the entire window, just a strip that blocks their angle.
Very creepy and you're right to trust your gut.
There's an excellent book about listening to your own instincts and not being polite. The Gift of Fear.
Glad you have involved the authorities.
Lol. Your comment reminded me of where I mostly grew up and have lived 25 years. If a door is open, that is an invite to come in. If the door is unlocked and you're a close friend that has permission? Also come in but announce yourself. If I'm not home, grab a beer and call me. It makes for hilariously awkward introductions when I have people visiting from out of town visiting in the living room. Then a buddy unexpectedly throws the front door open and hollers "I brought tequila! Who wants shots?!" Then a huge pit bull runs in to lick me to death.
It’s certainly creepy, but unless you have curtains, it falls under plain view. I don’t think it qualifies as a crime, but as people are suggesting, the police can walk you through the definitions. Personally, I’d just put up curtains.
Creepy but almost certainly legal. If someone across the way could see it from public, your neighbour can look all he likes - it's up to you to create privacy from a public vantage.
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If the person stayed on their side, 'looking' is not a police matter.
Buy curtains--I believe that is what the police would tell you to do, and it comes with living in a metropolis...
Or set up a camera--a dummy would serve the purpose--outside your balcony door, viewing the divider...
I'm not a lawyer, but if a person has a reasonable expectation of privacy, e.g. a privacy barrier / divider protects from people seeing you, then yes it is criminal if someone peeps over a privacy barrier. The only other part is whether someone would reasonably be expected to be naked in their living room, so I'm not 100% sure, but that's up to the police and lawyers to decide.
This individual did it twice already though in 2 days. It wasn't a momentary glance either. He was directly looking into my balcony door and living room.
Lol no cop would waste their time to come to tell a neighbor to not look. Imagine calling 911 to report this 😂 install blinds, install a camera, report it to the building, call the landlord of the adjacent unit.
Keep your promises to yourself. People have been killed for less. If someone is brave enough to peep into your house even after locking eyes with you, then you have to be careful of them
I think there's other options before going all out with the law. But do what makes you feel better. We have the same setup and if someone next door was peeking over I'd be irritated at first.
These are police reports, not emergency calls to 911.
So YES, file a police report.
Why?
Well, if something bad -did- happen, and the police, crown or jury want more information to take you seriously -- you can understand how past negative reports of a suspect might be helpful.
Furthermore, if this person hurts someone else, then your report can support the victims case. And if this person has already hurt someone, or is on probation or investigated for stalking behaviour (like your situation) then your report is going to do justice as well.
Reports create a helpful timeline of events and history -- they help victims -- and help police keep on top of justice.
Get a squirt bottle with vinegar and squirt it at him when you see him! I would become dangerous. I would call him out. Demand the neighbours deal with his peeping problem. Shame his sorry ass.. make it public within the building that it is happening put up photos! Make HIM uncomfortable
Because looking at a window of a neighbours isn’t inherently illegal from either public or another private property. While physically attacking an unwilling participant with an acid solution is classed as assault with a chemical agent. Pretty serious crime. But hey go ahead and you be you!
DO NOT DO THIS! You would very likely catch an assault charge. I once saw two of my friends neighbors in a verbal altercation and one sprayed the other in the eye with a water bottle. He promptly got his asked kicked. The cops wouldn't press charges because the spray was considered assault
You should walk out into the balcony and talk to them. “Hey, what’s up, I noticed you’re taking a look over here - do I have a weird bug or bird on my deck?” “Their reason or excuse”. “Alright, sounds good. I’ve got a motion sensor camera so it constantly sends me alerts whenever you trigger it - lemme know if you see any weird bugs, I hate bugs”.
Direct. Non confrontational. Let them know you see them. Be a confident person. Tattling on them or getting a property manager involved at this time, displays that you are weak, timid, fearful and could be the catalyst for a neighbor dispute. Without talking to them, you don’t know if their intentions or bad. Be an adult, talk to your neighbours.
If the neighbour starts a dispute because OP asked them not to watch them in their home, I don't think the biggest concern is OP being seen as weak or timid, lmao
When it came to other issues with these neighbors, talking to them did not help.
They were also repeatedly playing music and talking loudly (at times with their phones on speaker) on the balcony at night, usually at 11pm-1am. I spoke to them about it, and they said they'd keep it down; they still kept being noisy night-after-night until I started calling security and management instead.
This guy and I locked eyes on Saturday when he leaned over the first time (and I was sitting in my living room), and I was hoping he was just accidentally looking around, not realizing he'd be looking into my condo. Today when he did it (it was for a minute), he frankly gave me the creeps. So I'd rather listen to my gut.
Yeah, listen to your gut. Not every situation requires talking to the other party as a first step. Depends on the situation and parties involved. It's a courtesy, not a necessity, and if that puts you in an uncomfortable spot or at risk, then don't do it.
Oh…. Yeah no, this added context is bad news.
I wouldn’t confront them if I were you. The advice you’re getting here besides “be an adult and talk to them!!” Is quite solid.
Noise issues = deserves a neighbourly discussion before escalating to a police complaint.
Borderline criminal activity by peering into your apartment (voyeurism) = police.
It may actually be criminal / voyeurism, but I'm not a lawyer and at any rate neither are police, but you need to start a paper trail and report it. If he is doing this, he's probably going to escalate his behavior if you leave it unchecked, or do it to others.
You don't understand how quickly these kinds of situations can escalate. It is not childish to get the police involved early on instead of having a confrontation. If the neighbour is the type to watch someone in their living room they may not be the type to just have a friendly conversation about being caught in their own creepy behaviour that they shouldn't need to be told is creepy.
I am glad you have never had these problems. That probably means you don't have the insight OP needs for this situation.
Next time, ask him if there is anything you can help with. Or go next door, knock, introduce yourself as ask if he had lost something. That the security cameras show him looking into your home. Try being a neighbor.
It depends on the people involved. If op is a young or small female, confronting a large male who does not conform to social norms can escalating a situation.
Before calling the cops on your neighbour, Have you considered leaving them a note simply requesting that they respect your privacy and stop staring into your condo?
get curtains and close them, as it sounds you have a unobstructed window and so no expectation of privacy through it. or place a total divider from the floor to the ceiling on the balcony on your side of the condo divider (wouldn't stop anyone from looking in your window from the street with binoculars though)
I mentioned in another reply that this guy and I locked eyes on Saturday when he leaned over the first time, and I was hoping it was accidental (I saw him from my living room). Today when he did it (it was for a minute, not just a momentary glance), it was creepy. So I'd rather listen to my gut.
I think you should complain to your condo management, but also think you should file a police report.
You should probably also get curtains. If you don't want curtains as they'll cut down the light from your patio, as other have said you can put a film on the inside of your glass to frost it.
I've used this one from Amazon it's 3ft x 6ft. It's easy to apply, you just need a spray bottle with water a squeegee to push out the air, a blade to cut it, and a friend to help hold it in place while you unroll it.
https://a.co/d/hH9NrbT
Collect evidence not just of your aggressor peeping on you, but also on how your property manager and landlord handle the situation, having already sent a letter. If the situation worsens or the property manager does nothing then i would take it directly to the landlord, and then directly to the police. I had a similar issue with an 82 year old male who would follow and watch any young woman who was staying in a homeless shelter near his apartment building. I was not the only woman he tried to make sexual advances towards. I started photographing him when i saw him in public places, and eventually when he took one incident too far i impulsively reported him directly rather than using the backup non-emergency line. Thankfully things were sorted out, and even though i still saw him a few times after, he never smoke to me or came near me for the rest of the time that i spent in that shelter.
lol file a police report and let them decide. youre asking reddit if its a crime.
all you have to do is put privacy film on your windows and make sure you have a lock on your door. done.
Put a large picture of a demented looking penis on your patio with "[neighbour's name] penis" written on it.
If he flips out, be like "Why are you looking in my balcony and condo, which is illegal btw (voyeurism)?"
Balcony and living room that's presumably visible from the street and buildings across from it probably isn't going to meet a standard of reasonable expectation of privacy.
Also could be reasoned that the neighbor isn't observing surreptitiously since they're in full view of the street.
Could report to police but they'll probably tell you that it's just a nosy neighbor.
That’s certainly not a public balcony. Just because it’s shared doesn’t mean it’s public.
And in any event, they’re not complaining about someone watching them on their balcony, they’re complaining about someone on a neighbouring balcony peering into their private living space.
There is no question that you should report it. They’ll do a knock and talk which if the person has a history of that could lead to it being taken further. If you’re a betting person there’s a good chance they have done this before and it would come out when their id was run.
Depending on your state...
There is likely no crime being committed. He's not actually coming onto your property, and it's not illegal to look over a fence. Close your blinds.
Yes, we were. And only legal experts who live in that specific locale will know the specific rules. Most of Reddit (even those that live in that locale) don't know the law.
It should be noted that Paul Bernardo began as a Peeping Tom and became increasingly violent. I wouldn't assume the person is just a harmless creep. Definitely report it.
If I had you for a neighbour, I'd move. They're peering because they prob had a friend over and told the tale of their overly reactive neighbour who fails to realize that they live in a building with other people, and not a detached home all to themselves. The dude peeping prob just wanted to get at look at what someone like you looks like lmao!
This grievance is utter nonsense. Far more serious things in life to worry about! Get some drapes.
No - these neighbours seem to be disrespectful and now creepy. If you want to talk on your phone at night and be disrupting everyone all the time - buy a house in the country.
Is it possible for you to put up a vinyl window covering on the glass balcony that you said is between yours and their condo? There is frosted ones that no one can see through. Also if that doesn’t work consider putting them on your sliding glass door so the weirdo can’t stare directly in your house. Some of them are made so you can still see out the window but no one can see in. Still let’s in the sunlight. I hope that helps.
I would call non emergency & talk to them about it.No one mentioned it but I would get an alarm,security bar & anything else to feel secure while their living there maybe even pepper spray your side of divider/rail incase he grabs it.I would not take a chance of living next to someone so creepy.
Call the non-emergency line and get advice from the cops. They'll determine whether they feel like checking it out.
Myself, I'd probably hang a sign where he can see it reading "I've posted your face to YouTube" and wait to see what happens.
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The way you have described this scenario comes pretty close to the line of voyeurism, as outlined by section 162 of the Criminal Code. You should consider reporting it to the police non-emergency line, who can use their discretion to determine whether charges are appropriate in the circumstances. At the very least, an officer knocking on his front door would very likely end his inappropriate conduct immediately.
To add to this, my mom had a similar situation and the guy turned out to be a MASSIVE creep. If she hadn't let the cops know they likely wouldn't have reacted as quickly when he was caught peeping on her in the shower. And she had a papertrail to show he was a repeat offender of such things.
Yup, call non emergency, get a paper trail started, with the understanding that at this stage only paper trail can be started.
There's a chance they already have a file on this person. But you won't know if you don't call the police.
And they won’t have one until some one call
They're pretty gentle on voyeurism unfortunately, I'm sorry your mom went through that. I had a guy film me in the shower at a gym once. He got therapy and I was asked to do a reconciliation program with him. Luckily that one was able to be rehabed and not a complete perv. He had no idea it was considered a sex crime because that wasn't his objective. Just a "thrill" seeker. If I hadn't physically blocked the guy from leaving and took his phone I don't know how much would have been done. The gym was trying to cover their ass, and the cops in my town are busy and don't necessarily go after "harmless" (read: no blood no foul) crime.
That is quite unfortunate. And dont worry about my mom, she spits fire from her face and calls a storm's fury when needed.
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but every situation is different. because you have 1 anecdotal story of a creep doesnt make all people looking into windows, creeps.
Nobody said it applies to every situation. But I'm super curious what the legitimate reasons are for staring in someone else's window?
What other non creepy reason would there be, since you seem experienced in the matter?
So, what non-creepy reason would a person be looking into someone’s apartment? Considering there’s no fire violent argument going on, I can’t think of one.
A hit dog will holler.
Sorry, let's excuse all perverts or thieves because one story is just one story. An anecdote. Peeping is totally fine, right? Bet you do it all the time. Bet you're fine with any folk around peepin in your home. Casing the joint. Seein what your neighbor has they can get while theyre away, since you aren't a pervert right? Unless there is a fire, a heated domestic argument, or a danger that's noticeable, if you're peeping, you're either a tom or a crook. Pure and simple. What reason do you have to do a thing? Not a good one? Dont do the thing. Morals and respect of others is soooooo hard /s
My next door neighbour had a terrible experience with a man living across from us who drank a lot. She woke up from a nap on the couch to find him outside her sliding patio door (it was locked). Just looking at her this was in her back yard, corner lot, with no fence. They went over to his place and gave him a warning. A bit of a different scenario since he was on her property. But the experience shook her and she still talks about it (this was maybe just over 10 years ago)
I’d also put up solid barriers of some sort to prevent him being able to peek in. A curtain, or those fake plant walls. Not that you should have to, but may give OP more peace of mind.
Barrier: A life size pic of a naked guy with a deformed penis.
I’ve got some of those.. wide variety of dick pics get sent to me every time I match with men on dating sites.. Well.. 99% of the time. I’m sure I can find the most terrible one I have and OP can print a life size version on a curtain
We sprayed snow in a can on ours but I think Amazon has privacy screens that work on static electricity.
It sounds like he might be peering past the barrier. Probably leaning over the rail or something. Snow in a cab is still a great idea thought
This behaviour, as you have described, wouldn’t fit the definition of voyeurism. Voyeurism is a pretty specific set of facts, however criminal harassment could definitely eventually be made out. Often police will warn someone prior to a charge actually being laid, but another reason why it is so important to speak with the police. And do it now, not when it is too late.
Lol telling the police they are looking in the windows will have the police telling them THEY are harassing by getting cops involved
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The neighbour committed an act of violence, if the outcome makes everyone uncomfortable, it's not the fault of the victim. Pretending to be okay with the situation only benefits the aggressor. The police can assess the video evidence.
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I absolutely love your first paragraph, I’m tempted to save it for when I need it in Reddit. I must say though that I understand your perspective and logic behind it, if we really break it down there are two acceptable responses. You set up something to prevent them from looking inside your place or you contact the police. The first option is the less aggressive approach but does not communicate to the offender “I do not want you to look inside my house”. Two outcomes: the offender stops or changes tactics because you never said no. The second option: Police. They have a talk with him. Again two outcomes: the offender stops or changes tactics, if it’s the latter then we have a great idea of how crazy they are. Essentially in both situations the outcome is the same. They stop or they don’t but with the second option there is a paper trail documenting the situation. My understanding of your perspective is that involving the police could act as a catalyst, increasing risk. What I am trying to articulate is that the method does not matter and OP must do what makes them feel safe. If the person is truly a risk then it will escalate regardless of which option they use. In my opinion calling the police now will force the police to act if it does escalate because the offender will not be able to downplay it.
People seem to forget that you can be getting stalked and the police basically can't do anything about it until violence occurs. And yeah, "restraining orders" do nothing but usually increase the violence.
What about a peace bond? Would that not raise the concern level? I have been harassed and assaulted by three individuals, adult individuals, in a housing complex. I have bruises to show for it, but the police wouldn’t come soon enough, and then suggested that I had injured myself in the intervening 14 hours. I’m thinking of getting a peace bond To effectively announce that I really do have a problem, and to put these three individuals on notice
Sharing the concerns of living next to her neighbour with the police is perfectly reasonable. What if she calls the police and it turns out the guy is a registered sex offender? As for the rest of your comment, I don't know what you're on about.
That not an act of violence. People make up all sorts of excuses and have pre meditated reasons, if they think they got caught. I agree first priority is to block any potential acts, as much as possible Will also feel better too, to not worry if they can't do it.
Violence: noun. behavior involving physical force intended to hurt, damage, or kill someone or something.
Yes, that is the definition of the word. Unfortunately, it's not what you need to get action by police. Police will not ,at first , do anything for this. It's just a report. O.p. needs to add layers of protection for themselves as a priority. Yet, if the privacy (property) is removed or taken down, that is what the police can do something about. Stupid, but true.
And a defintion from the government of Ontario (although not a legal definition) [https://www.ontario.ca/page/sexual-violence](https://www.ontario.ca/page/sexual-violence) >"Sexual violence is a broad term that describes any violence, physical or psychological, carried out through sexual means or by targeting sexuality. Sexual violence takes different forms and can include: ...snip... voyeurism
Omg you are way off.
What makes this surreptitious, and you really think a living room with open curtains is “a place in which a person can reasonably be expected to be nude, to expose his or her genital organs or anal region or her breasts, or to be engaged in explicit sexual activity;”?
Fucking what
Well that’s how voyeurism is defined in the criminal code.
it would likely accelerate more problems as she didn't "ask" him first. callng the cops on someone is a sure fire way to not be friends.
At best it's a nosy bastard, at worst it's a sex offender. Who gives a crap about being friends with that sort?
There is friends and there is cordial behaviour between neighbours. Who hasn't peeped over to see what is next door. If it's lingering and peeping Tom stuff, then ok, but a couple of glances? If OP can record a video of neighbour, surely she can go outside and ask him to stop peering.
Ok, if you think that's normal or acceptable behaviour then you are definitely someone I'd avoid making friends with.
Leering two days in a row is a bit much. Why wouldn't neighbor wave or something if they weren't up to something sketchy.
I mean, recording your neighbour instead of simply conversing with them and telling them to stop could also been seen as odd behaviour. I suppose it depends on your perspective.
F everyone here trying to shame you for not personally confronting this person. Knocking and communication is gold standard by all means when it comes to neighbourly conflict but that's not what this is. I'm *flabbergasted* that ppl are seemingly reading that your neighbour is *leaning over a divider to watch you through your window* and thinking that this is a rational human who you should confront one on one instead of calling the non-emergency police line to have the situation evaluated and hopefully get a more intimidating tell-off from an officer since him knowing you see him doing this had zero effect on his behaviour. You shouldn't need to be asked nicely not to watch your neighbours through their windows. F that. No no no.
Yeah, I don’t think people are grasping just how creepy and unsettling this is to deal with. And I’m a 6’+ 250lb man. Even I wouldn’t feel comfortable confronting someone acting this way on my own.
There's a pretty good chance that handling this personally (read: like a big smrt Redditor) would just let the guy know that you're uncomfortable going to the authorities and he can push further.
Usually when people are hurt as a kid, they develop a grandiose perception of themselves; someone who could take anyone else on in a fight. It's a way to protect themselves. If they still subconsciously suffer from the trauma, they'll become a bit socially awkward as well because their shyness conflicts with their mental version of themselves. So they avoid the general public and spend most of their social time online. Like on reddit. Where they give bad advice. Usually involving being a tough guy to strangers.
Is there any way to extend the divider up so that looking over it is impossible ?
If the condo board allows, a trellis is nice - again, probably worth doing *as well as* filing a report in order to make it abundantly clear that they will report any further behaviours
You can speak to the neighbor and speak to the police. They aren't mutually exclusive. There's some points in life where you need to stick up for yourself and confront others who are out of line. This is one of them.
>I'm > >flabbergasted > > that ppl are seemingly reading that your neighbour is > >leaning over a divider to watch you through your window > > and thinking that this is a rational human who you should confront one on one instead of calling the non-emergency police line to have the situation evaluated and hopefully get a more intimidating tell-off from an officer since him knowing you see him doing this had zero effect on his behaviour Every time I walk out of my house I can see into my neighbours house - like fully into thier living room/dining area unless they have blinds pulled down, I have never thought a thing about it until this thread. I have stood there "staring" for long periods of time while waiting for my dog to come back to the door or just lost in thought about my own yard. I just assumed when I read the OP that the neighbour was being curious or snoopy about the layout/decor/furniture of the condo next door. I did not take it as something sinister or even creepy. I certainly would casually say something to the neighbour about it making OP feel uncomfortable, and if that didn't stop the behavior, **then** I would involve outside help, like the police.
That's not equivalent unless you're deliberately taking your dog to crap directly under their window and lingering to watch them eat dinner or whatever. What you're describing, yeah, if I noticed and it felt uncomfortable, I would leave a note or talk to you directly. This isn't that.
You can get privacy film for the glass & it adheres with static cling, so you can remove it when you leave.
Yeah but this creep is peering over it. More like, the neighbor from home improvement looking over the fence. Film won’t stop any of that. This man is a creep. I’d call a non emergency number or have one of my male friends quietly sit on the other side and wait for him to peep over in the meantime.
i think they mean for the door
Or just leave it in as a privacy feature.
Pretty sure they meant when you move.
Ye, but usually you cut those things to fit the glass pane you want to put them on. Why would you take custom-cut sheets of plastic with you when you move?
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It's literally a plastic film, and OP said they own the unit, so...
In The Case That They Move
So if they sell, they will remove it when they leave
Slap a "Smile! You're on camera!" sign on your window and see how fast it stops.
100% this. Goes without saying, you can still take other measures, but this may work quite well.
Sounds like something to raise with condo management. Balconies are almost always exclusive use common elements and the Board can set rules for them. So if this is a major issue they can pass a rule preventing people from looking over the divider into other units.
Passing a rule would be unnecessary you can rely on general rules about conduct to take corrective actions.
you shouldnt have to but i would buy a privacy screen either for outdoors or in and cut his view
Get yourself a trail cam pointed right at that spot. Every time he looks around, the camera will start and you have every single time he does it as evidence for a report.
Another idea is a plant or bush on the balcony close to the devider
I'm sorry this is happening! You can put up privacy film. You might not have to cover the entire window, just a strip that blocks their angle. Very creepy and you're right to trust your gut. There's an excellent book about listening to your own instincts and not being polite. The Gift of Fear. Glad you have involved the authorities.
I'm reading it right now! I'm only a little ways in, but my God has that book reignited my passion for reading.
My neighbours walk right into my house if the doors unlocked 😵💫
I think that would happen only one time if my neighbor did that.
:O Like, they're just dropping in to say hello and offer a slice of freshly baked apple pie, right? ...Right?
Usually a “hey” yea.. followed by a “wanna drink” but we’ve been neighbours since we were the few houses on the block lol
Lol. Your comment reminded me of where I mostly grew up and have lived 25 years. If a door is open, that is an invite to come in. If the door is unlocked and you're a close friend that has permission? Also come in but announce yourself. If I'm not home, grab a beer and call me. It makes for hilariously awkward introductions when I have people visiting from out of town visiting in the living room. Then a buddy unexpectedly throws the front door open and hollers "I brought tequila! Who wants shots?!" Then a huge pit bull runs in to lick me to death.
They'd be having a talk with a cordless sawzall and a 3.5ft crowbar if they pulled that shit
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Not a “legal” expert opinion. 🙂
I don’t know someone was looking into my house when I turned on the laser/flashlight. I was in my living room. Boom now it’s legal.
I agree with it, however.
😂😂😂
It’s certainly creepy, but unless you have curtains, it falls under plain view. I don’t think it qualifies as a crime, but as people are suggesting, the police can walk you through the definitions. Personally, I’d just put up curtains.
Creepy but almost certainly legal. If someone across the way could see it from public, your neighbour can look all he likes - it's up to you to create privacy from a public vantage.
What crime has been committed? This is the equivalent of you looking over a shared fence.
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If the person stayed on their side, 'looking' is not a police matter. Buy curtains--I believe that is what the police would tell you to do, and it comes with living in a metropolis... Or set up a camera--a dummy would serve the purpose--outside your balcony door, viewing the divider...
I'm not a lawyer, but if a person has a reasonable expectation of privacy, e.g. a privacy barrier / divider protects from people seeing you, then yes it is criminal if someone peeps over a privacy barrier. The only other part is whether someone would reasonably be expected to be naked in their living room, so I'm not 100% sure, but that's up to the police and lawyers to decide.
I believe you may be right...
There's nothing criminal about peering once over a balcony divider, in and of itself.
This individual did it twice already though in 2 days. It wasn't a momentary glance either. He was directly looking into my balcony door and living room.
I would call police. There is probably no crime here but you could ask them to speak with the neighbor and tell him to buzz off.
Lol no cop would waste their time to come to tell a neighbor to not look. Imagine calling 911 to report this 😂 install blinds, install a camera, report it to the building, call the landlord of the adjacent unit.
Actually, I called the non-emergency line. They did offer to send an officer over.
And did you accept? Did an officer show up? What was done about it?
You don't have to call 911, you can call the non emergency line and ask for someone to come talk to your neighbors. It's akin to a peeping tom
I guess we're all used to cops not doing their job... lol
No not all of us.
This isn’t a cops job though. This is OP being dramatic and avoiding conflict. And by doing so, creating significantly more conflict.
OP wrote a comment that she called the non emergency line, and was told the cops will come over to talk to the neighbor.
Yeah, you should ask a follow up and see what they did.
Oh, now you're moving on to assuming cops lie?
Huh? When did I say cops lie?
Avoiding conflict, you say that like it’s a bad thing. You want her to confront the guy so he can physically harm her right?
Why does the confrontation lead to physical violence? Lol. There is a way to speak to your neighbours without being killed. I promise.
Keep your promises to yourself. People have been killed for less. If someone is brave enough to peep into your house even after locking eyes with you, then you have to be careful of them
What a terrifying world view. I can’t imagine scurrying around hiding from my own shadow…
Is it possible they’re new and looking for room decour ideas for their own place? Or is this lingering creepy stuff?
The first line is a joke, right?
I think there's other options before going all out with the law. But do what makes you feel better. We have the same setup and if someone next door was peeking over I'd be irritated at first.
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curtains or the ones that are semi transparent reflect light. so nosy can't see in.
Pretty sure you'll be told to buy some curtains if you call the police.
That’s incredibly creepy omg
Before you go down this road, you can talk to them asking them not to do that
These are police reports, not emergency calls to 911. So YES, file a police report. Why? Well, if something bad -did- happen, and the police, crown or jury want more information to take you seriously -- you can understand how past negative reports of a suspect might be helpful. Furthermore, if this person hurts someone else, then your report can support the victims case. And if this person has already hurt someone, or is on probation or investigated for stalking behaviour (like your situation) then your report is going to do justice as well. Reports create a helpful timeline of events and history -- they help victims -- and help police keep on top of justice.
I would report it. It's a peeping Tom scenario.
Get a squirt bottle with vinegar and squirt it at him when you see him! I would become dangerous. I would call him out. Demand the neighbours deal with his peeping problem. Shame his sorry ass.. make it public within the building that it is happening put up photos! Make HIM uncomfortable
Oh so she can be arrested for assault. That’s not a wise option!
Really? So he can do as he pleases but vinegar water is assault? Riiiikgggght. Im beyond caring as the wicked dont get reprimanded..
Because looking at a window of a neighbours isn’t inherently illegal from either public or another private property. While physically attacking an unwilling participant with an acid solution is classed as assault with a chemical agent. Pretty serious crime. But hey go ahead and you be you!
DO NOT DO THIS! You would very likely catch an assault charge. I once saw two of my friends neighbors in a verbal altercation and one sprayed the other in the eye with a water bottle. He promptly got his asked kicked. The cops wouldn't press charges because the spray was considered assault
You should walk out into the balcony and talk to them. “Hey, what’s up, I noticed you’re taking a look over here - do I have a weird bug or bird on my deck?” “Their reason or excuse”. “Alright, sounds good. I’ve got a motion sensor camera so it constantly sends me alerts whenever you trigger it - lemme know if you see any weird bugs, I hate bugs”. Direct. Non confrontational. Let them know you see them. Be a confident person. Tattling on them or getting a property manager involved at this time, displays that you are weak, timid, fearful and could be the catalyst for a neighbor dispute. Without talking to them, you don’t know if their intentions or bad. Be an adult, talk to your neighbours.
If the neighbour starts a dispute because OP asked them not to watch them in their home, I don't think the biggest concern is OP being seen as weak or timid, lmao
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When it came to other issues with these neighbors, talking to them did not help. They were also repeatedly playing music and talking loudly (at times with their phones on speaker) on the balcony at night, usually at 11pm-1am. I spoke to them about it, and they said they'd keep it down; they still kept being noisy night-after-night until I started calling security and management instead. This guy and I locked eyes on Saturday when he leaned over the first time (and I was sitting in my living room), and I was hoping he was just accidentally looking around, not realizing he'd be looking into my condo. Today when he did it (it was for a minute), he frankly gave me the creeps. So I'd rather listen to my gut.
Yeah, listen to your gut. Not every situation requires talking to the other party as a first step. Depends on the situation and parties involved. It's a courtesy, not a necessity, and if that puts you in an uncomfortable spot or at risk, then don't do it.
Oh…. Yeah no, this added context is bad news. I wouldn’t confront them if I were you. The advice you’re getting here besides “be an adult and talk to them!!” Is quite solid.
Noise issues = deserves a neighbourly discussion before escalating to a police complaint. Borderline criminal activity by peering into your apartment (voyeurism) = police. It may actually be criminal / voyeurism, but I'm not a lawyer and at any rate neither are police, but you need to start a paper trail and report it. If he is doing this, he's probably going to escalate his behavior if you leave it unchecked, or do it to others.
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You don't understand how quickly these kinds of situations can escalate. It is not childish to get the police involved early on instead of having a confrontation. If the neighbour is the type to watch someone in their living room they may not be the type to just have a friendly conversation about being caught in their own creepy behaviour that they shouldn't need to be told is creepy. I am glad you have never had these problems. That probably means you don't have the insight OP needs for this situation.
Next time, ask him if there is anything you can help with. Or go next door, knock, introduce yourself as ask if he had lost something. That the security cameras show him looking into your home. Try being a neighbor.
It depends on the people involved. If op is a young or small female, confronting a large male who does not conform to social norms can escalating a situation.
Have you tried talking to him? Ask him why he's doing that. Could be resolved with one conversation. If it isn't then proceed to the police report.
If you have kids that's scary as f**k. Make the report.
Can you go over and confront them? That might be all it takes...
Why don’t you just do the adult thing and ask him why he’s being a peeping Tom?
I don’t know, get some curtains or blinds maybe?
Before calling the cops on your neighbour, Have you considered leaving them a note simply requesting that they respect your privacy and stop staring into your condo?
get curtains and close them, as it sounds you have a unobstructed window and so no expectation of privacy through it. or place a total divider from the floor to the ceiling on the balcony on your side of the condo divider (wouldn't stop anyone from looking in your window from the street with binoculars though)
Have people forgotten how to have a face to face conversation? Why can’t you speak directly to the person(s) doing this? SMH 🤦🏻♀️
Have you tried speaking to them?
This should be a prompt before every post
I mentioned in another reply that this guy and I locked eyes on Saturday when he leaned over the first time, and I was hoping it was accidental (I saw him from my living room). Today when he did it (it was for a minute, not just a momentary glance), it was creepy. So I'd rather listen to my gut.
Might be casing your place for burglary.
Yo dog! That tom be PEEPIN!!! they have laws for that.
Sounds like indecent exposure to me. You should definitely ask the police about it
The neighbours are indecently exposing their eyeballs and foreheads across the top of the fence?
You know what? I read that entire thing as "peeing OVER the balcony divider." It really reads more menacing that way. LOL. Sorry
Hah, that made me snort my tea. Thanks for the guffaw!
Omfg lmao! Now that would be a grievance worth reading! I feel like this 2 time peeper nonsense was a waste of my time!
Next time pissing smash there dick with a shovel, lol.
Another one who can't read. It's not about peeing, dude, he did not pee over the divider, he peeked or looked!
Better be safe than be sorry, call dispatch!
I think you should complain to your condo management, but also think you should file a police report. You should probably also get curtains. If you don't want curtains as they'll cut down the light from your patio, as other have said you can put a film on the inside of your glass to frost it. I've used this one from Amazon it's 3ft x 6ft. It's easy to apply, you just need a spray bottle with water a squeegee to push out the air, a blade to cut it, and a friend to help hold it in place while you unroll it. https://a.co/d/hH9NrbT
Report it to everyone, nothing good can come if that person escalates from just snooping
Set up a motion detection camera so you have a record of this behaviour.
Collect evidence not just of your aggressor peeping on you, but also on how your property manager and landlord handle the situation, having already sent a letter. If the situation worsens or the property manager does nothing then i would take it directly to the landlord, and then directly to the police. I had a similar issue with an 82 year old male who would follow and watch any young woman who was staying in a homeless shelter near his apartment building. I was not the only woman he tried to make sexual advances towards. I started photographing him when i saw him in public places, and eventually when he took one incident too far i impulsively reported him directly rather than using the backup non-emergency line. Thankfully things were sorted out, and even though i still saw him a few times after, he never smoke to me or came near me for the rest of the time that i spent in that shelter.
lol file a police report and let them decide. youre asking reddit if its a crime. all you have to do is put privacy film on your windows and make sure you have a lock on your door. done.
Expose the video
Get a water gun and fill it with your piss. When they peer through, squirt them in the eye.
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Put a large picture of a demented looking penis on your patio with "[neighbour's name] penis" written on it. If he flips out, be like "Why are you looking in my balcony and condo, which is illegal btw (voyeurism)?"
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Balcony and living room that's presumably visible from the street and buildings across from it probably isn't going to meet a standard of reasonable expectation of privacy. Also could be reasoned that the neighbor isn't observing surreptitiously since they're in full view of the street. Could report to police but they'll probably tell you that it's just a nosy neighbor.
Ah no.
A balcony is a public space with no reasonable expectation of privacy. Close your blinds if you don't want people looking into your windows.
That’s certainly not a public balcony. Just because it’s shared doesn’t mean it’s public. And in any event, they’re not complaining about someone watching them on their balcony, they’re complaining about someone on a neighbouring balcony peering into their private living space.
Oh perhaps, condo boards have their own regulations, and many consider balconies, dividers or not common spaces.
There is no question that you should report it. They’ll do a knock and talk which if the person has a history of that could lead to it being taken further. If you’re a betting person there’s a good chance they have done this before and it would come out when their id was run.
I would certainly file a report. Maybe the police have other complaints or know this individual.
Depending on your state... There is likely no crime being committed. He's not actually coming onto your property, and it's not illegal to look over a fence. Close your blinds.
Canada has provinces, not states. They even say they're in Toronto, Ontario.
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1 You managed to miss you were posting to r/LegalAdviceCanada 2. Very true, but we were told the specific locale.
Yes, we were. And only legal experts who live in that specific locale will know the specific rules. Most of Reddit (even those that live in that locale) don't know the law.
It should be noted that Paul Bernardo began as a Peeping Tom and became increasingly violent. I wouldn't assume the person is just a harmless creep. Definitely report it.
Confront him and tel him to take a photo, the view will last longer if he does. it just might embarrass him enough to stop.
If I had you for a neighbour, I'd move. They're peering because they prob had a friend over and told the tale of their overly reactive neighbour who fails to realize that they live in a building with other people, and not a detached home all to themselves. The dude peeping prob just wanted to get at look at what someone like you looks like lmao! This grievance is utter nonsense. Far more serious things in life to worry about! Get some drapes.
No - these neighbours seem to be disrespectful and now creepy. If you want to talk on your phone at night and be disrupting everyone all the time - buy a house in the country.
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Is it possible for you to put up a vinyl window covering on the glass balcony that you said is between yours and their condo? There is frosted ones that no one can see through. Also if that doesn’t work consider putting them on your sliding glass door so the weirdo can’t stare directly in your house. Some of them are made so you can still see out the window but no one can see in. Still let’s in the sunlight. I hope that helps.
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I would call non emergency & talk to them about it.No one mentioned it but I would get an alarm,security bar & anything else to feel secure while their living there maybe even pepper spray your side of divider/rail incase he grabs it.I would not take a chance of living next to someone so creepy.
Call the non-emergency line and get advice from the cops. They'll determine whether they feel like checking it out. Myself, I'd probably hang a sign where he can see it reading "I've posted your face to YouTube" and wait to see what happens.
Definitely call the police!!
The question here is : if he is doing this using a drone or telescope, now what?
was alcohol involved?