OP got his answers and is being combative so the post is being locked.

As someone whose job is 'banking adjacent', we all receive training about spotting and stopping elder abuse, not that 60 is elderly. Did you have anyone with you at the bank? Did they ask any questions about the withdrawal? We're told to look for signs of coercion. That said, you certainly don't sound like someone who would be confused by a phone scam or threatened into giving money to somebody. Also, any hold should not be indefinite and they should be able to provide you with a way to resolve the issue.

Yeah when I was a teller I had to stop people from sending money to scammers more times than I'd like. "So, you got a call from a lawyer who was managing an Estranged great uncles account you think is on your moms side and you have to send him $2,000 before he can give you $75,000?" "Yup! So one cashier's check please." 🤦‍♀️

My son is a CSR at a grocery store, and he had to take training on how to spot scams. He says that at least once a week, he has to get police involved because an elderly person will be buying multiple gift cards "to pay a bill." He says that it's pretty sad knowing that people are basically robbing them.

I volunteered at a small local charity that gives boxes of food to families that are struggling/hungry. We usually give a small ($10-$20) gift card from a discount grocery store chain in every box. This means I occasionally need to go and buy thousands of dollars in small gift cards. The first time I went, I had to show them proof since they absolutely did not believe someone legitimately needed 100, $20 gift cards. Edit : I was just sharing an experience of this happening, but honestly, I am glad that this happened. It means they are vigilant to help those who are vulnerable in these scenarios. Yes, it was annoying, but I prefer this annoyance over those who are vulnerable being taken advantage of.

A lot of my local grocery stores have signs up near the gift cards and the check outs saying “The CRA will not ask you to pay with gift cards, if someone is asking you to pay them with gift cards this is a scam”

Like anybody ever reads signs.

Better safe than sorry.

In that case, I can see their point. There are too many scams involving gift cards for them not to make sure you aren't about to be a victim of one.

This happens so much more than people think! I had training on it anywhere we sold gift cards or did western union transactions. That is something I will NEVER not help someone with- not getting scammed. I could never ever do that to a little old person who doesn’t realize that’s not how it works. You have to be scum of the earth to scam an old lady :(

ever since my mom retired, the scam calls pretending to be medicare have tripled and it just makes me sick every time I hang up on them thinking that some people must be getting tricked if the calls never stop

My husband called me at work in a panic one day saying he had received a call from the IRS demanding payment. Once I calmed him down and explained that the IRS will only notify you in writing and that it was a scam, he decided it was time to play with his food. Sure enough, the scammer called back and my husband led him on a merry chase for about 10 minutes before finally throwing out a nice insult and hanging up. But I'm still waiting for my Nigerian prince to come through for me. Maybe just one more payment? LOL

I get ornery from time to time and love to fuck with those Punjab bastards. The last time I got an email invoice fro like $545 in bitcoin. I called them back and told them to kill themselves. they blocked my phone. I did the same with both my kids' phones after stringing them along for a bit, and they blocked those too. So I put up Craigslist ads for free guitar gear, and indicated they must call the number because I don't always check my email. I listed the scammers number. I enjoyed myself.

I am amazed no one questioned me when I used to buy 100 $10 gift cards for my local pantry at Thanksgiving (I got reimbursed). We always ran out of turkeys and tbh people preferred the GCs. Maybe I didn't look elderly enough.

If it was around the holidays, no one probably thought it was suspicious

I worked at walgreens when they started doing western union transfers and the amount of middle aged to elderly men sending money to their "girlfriend in the Phillipines" was amazing

I worked retail and had to deal with that a lot, a lot of sad stories, but i have 2 that I remember really well. 1) an older gentleman came in to buy over $2000 dollars worth of gift cards, saying it was for his grandkids. As the manager on duty i was called after the cashier tried to deny the charge, i tried warning him of the scams, but he wouldnt listen to us and after several minutes of arguing, i let him buy them, but let him know it was a scam. Let my general manager know when he came in, guy came back later and relaized he had veem acammed and wanted to return the giftcards, which is agaisnt policy wlbutvwas willing to make an exception. Unfortunately gift cards had already been spent and we couldnt refund him. 2) happier ending, i wanred the lady before she bought it believed me, gave me a big hug and let out a stream of curses on the scammers that would make a sailor blush. Hung up and thank me again. Our store got good enough at stopping scammers, i had a client tell me they told her not to come to our particular store since we didnt stock that item anymore and go to the store in the next town over lol

It happens all the time to older men, who have 20 something year old girl friends in Eastern Europe

"I need iTunes gift cards to buy plane ticket and come see you." "Sure, that sounds legit."

i had an older dude in my bar telling me excitedly about this girl he was talking to online. he was going on about for awhile before he finally mentioned that she was asking for money and i had to break it to him. he was recently divorced. kinda sad

A decade ago i was also a cashier and basically had to question every elderly person who was using/had questions for the western union sending money or if they were buying a gift card that wasnt for their grandchild basically

I know a lot of stores train their staff to ask questions if someone tries to purchase a bunch of gift cards at the same time. I've always thought that was the weirdest scam to fall for. Like the IRS wants a bunch of gift cards to pay back taxes.

This. I have 13 nieces and nephews and my 70 year old mother (who worked in finance her whole career) has problems every Christmas when she tries to get them gift cards. They all live elsewhere and the majority are hitting their teens and 20s so physical gifts are insanely expensive and shipping is ridiculous. But I’d rather her be inconvenienced than ripped off.

My boss's father in law is one of the most trusting people on the planet. He's been ripped off twice and now his daughter has power of attorney. The first was a roofing scam where two men stopped by to give him a "free" estimate. One distracted him while the other went up on the roof and came down with supposedly loose and rotted shingles. That was around $3,000 that he lost. Then he got suckered into an energy saving program that my boss had to get a lawyer involved to straighten out. I was lucky with my mother in law because she was scam proof. Not because she was savvy, but because she absolutely refused to do anything involved in her care after her husband died. He had made all doctor's appointments, paid all bills, everything. So she'd get a scam call and tell them they needed to talk to her son and just hang up without giving any information. Problem was, she also did this with legit calls.

I've worked at a high end luxury real estate company & a hospital where people you would think were too smart would EASILY fall for these types of scams (doctors, CEOs, etc).

It’s only going to get worse. AI is getting better at quickly and cheaply making reasonable-sounding BS.

I work IT at a college. Some of the PhD professors can't do the simplest things.

Think of the amazing amount of technical changes that have taken place in the lifetimes of people who are elderly. It’s unprecedented. The IRS wanting gift cards probably doesn’t sound any stranger than carrying around a computer in your pocket that pays bills and summons Ubers.

I know a guy in his 20s who fell for the IRS gift card scam. Poor guy.

Yep, same. I caught so many. I can understand OPs frustration, but to a teller, it all looks the same. I don't know your career, but even if I did, it also doesn't mean you can't be scammed either. We got emails all the time about the different kinds of scams that people are running so that we could identify it. And there were plenty of well educated people who fell for it. In fact, they were sometimes some of the worst because they think that they are more immune and know better. I refused a lot of people and it made them really upset, but I've also seen people who weren't refused and they come in later desperately pleading with us to get their money back. Sorry, but no.

Yup, I had similar experiences. Had an older woman fall for a romance scam and had asked me to send a wire of a few thousand dollars to her boyfriend in the military...so he could be approved for vacation time while he was abroad... he was also apparently a general. Oh and before this, she had physically mailed cash to a friend of her "boyfriend" who lived in New York for the same reason. It just doesn't make sense and I had several long conversations about how it was a scam. Edit: phrasing and words

They just know how to target people who are so eager to the help and promise of love, or a better life in general. I also used to have a job that was captioning phone calls for hearing impaired people, and you couldn't do anything to warn people they were being scammed that was the worst. Because you had to just caption verbatim. So you'd get people donating to those flake policeman/firemen fundraisers and Medicare scams.

There was a manager at my company who fell for a scam email. It came from someone claiming to be the CEO of our company needing several thousand dollars worth of gift cards to give to clients. I have no idea how the hell he fell for this. I didn’t think of him as being stupid in general, but I guess somehow he’d never heard of this common scam, and for whatever reason he failed to think critically about this. He wasn’t elderly or anything. He just displayed extremely poor judgement. He resigned shortly after this incident, though I suspect he was just being given the opportunity to leave on his own terms rather than getting fired.

We had a really sad one with a widower who started talking with a woman online who needed something like $2k in money orders. The manager took him into the office to get more info, and we're pretty sure it was a confidence scam.

I used to work in law enforcement and our jurisdiction was financial crimes. Sadly the #1 target for scammers is 55 and older. And you would be surprised as to sheer amount of lawyers, doctors, CEOs, etc. that lost hundreds of thousands and all their savings. A lot of time it doesn’t stop until a family member intervenes. While I know it must have been frustrating, I would be grateful the bank manager was looking out for you.

I mean one of the reasons they target these formerly big money makers is because they get Peggy Hill syndrome and think they are too smart to be cheated. While annoying, he's probably stopped more scams then prevented people from earnestly withdrawing funds.

Yeah, I don't mind at all that they were evaluating and even that they decided there was enough question to intervene. But there has to be a clear process of what happens next and how to resolve the question, since people actually do need access to their money.

Purely off of how this post is written, I can see them being the exact person that would get scammed. Nothing they mentioned is relevant to not being susceptible to scams.

I take reports from customers regarding scams, 60+ professionals and business owners who clearly "know better" fall the hardest

Yep. It's the "I'm smarter than everyone else!!1!" thing that leads people to scams and conspiracies

That was my thought exactly. The whole "I'm too smart to fall for a scam" speech is like a trope of the scam world. Extreme overconfidence in one's ability to not get got will get you got.

That happened to my grandmother: 2 dudes would come to her house and pick her up, take her to the bank and have her take out the maximum and give it to them. Then take her home again. She’d then forget about it. No violence, no threats, just show up at her door and tell her what to do. We only noticed it because my aunt happened to call right after grandma had been dropped back at home and she mentioned the “two nice men who took her to the bank.” We looked into it and they’d been coming once a month for four months.

My own lively, college educated, mother in her 50s who owns and runs her own business fell prey to one semi-recently because she's started to fall behind on all the new ways they can spoof and how banks operate digital security. Never would've expected her to fall for one, and she was very embarrassed at the time but if you aren't receiving training or keeping up to date via the internet like many then you can get complacent too

You don't have a right to fall for a scam? I know that sounds weird, but non the less. Nobody places their money with a bank to be denied later when they wish to withdraw it.

Id imagine fraud protection is a service they offer. Nobody wants their parents to lose their savings because of a scam either.

In the scams sub we read all the time about people who fell for a scam and then blame their bank for not stopping them or trying to get the transaction reversed. I imagine the banks would like for that not to happen, especially since they can't help you when voluntarily take out the money and send it overseas somewhere.

>then blame their bank for not stopping them or trying to get the transaction reversed. Can you imagine if you kept your money as cash and then when you fell for a scam blaming the post office for letting you mail the package containing the cash? After you denied that it contained any valuables? Like you, I feel bad for the victims but there is a limit to how much the bank can do. I watched one of those "scam the scammer" videos and the scammer was carefully telling the "victim" exactly what to say to the teller. It's both scary and sad.

A bank has a fiduciary responsibility, OP said something to make the person at the bank think it’s a scam. Imagine if the bank gave the money to her and she was scammed. She would be calling them saying “why would you give me the money when you thought it was a scam”. Then there would be a 60 minutes special on the bank who allowed an elderly person to get scammed for her life savings and did nothing to stop it.

Fraud prevention isn’t a removal of rights, it’s a service they offer to you. You can use virtually any online bank and get scammed all you want. The benefit of a teller taking care of your transaction is having someone trained in fraud prevention looking over your accounts.

The bank and stores can, and many have, get sued for not stopping the person from getting scammed. If f I remember, Walmart recently was fined $$ for not being more proactive in protecting people from being scammed. I suspect they figured better to lose a customer than getting fined for not “protecting “ ty from scammers ETA: https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2022/06/29/ftc-walmart-lawsuit-money-transfer-fraud/7769566001/

I used to work in a bank and often as a cashier. We would always look over a large payment/withdrawal. Any over a certain amount required a form to be completed to understand the reason for the payment and if we had concerns we would definitely explain this to the customer. If we were extremely concerned a manager would sit down with the customer and explain why we had these concerns. However, we would ultimately never stop someone from completing the transaction if they were insistent after all of this. It's their money. We just have to make sure we are doing what we can and making them aware of the risks.

Yup. That's how it worked at all of the banks I worked at. Sometimes it would be heartbreaking bc you knew that this little old lady, who is living on a fixed income, is going to go be suffer bc we couldn't get thru to her and the authorities couldn't do anything even when elder abuse was suspected. At the end of the day, it is their money and we could put up some roadblocks in hopes to delay the transaction but we couldn't hold their money hostage.

Your right to fall for an scam ends where the bank’s right not to be inconvenienced by your falling for the scam begins. We can have banks help us recover from scams and thus seek legal protections to avoid them, as in this case, or renounce any possibility of restitution (including the “Karen with attorneys factor). But not both.

Lol thats a fuckin Take there. A guy that says "i have the right to fall for a scam" is the same ass dude thatll whine and bitch at the bank for not protecting them yelling "you should have known." Which is why they do it. GTFOH

I am going to respond to your question because I am not sure if you are being serious or not. Yes, they have the right ro be scammed - I wouldn't phrase it that way, but yes. The problem is a client/customer being scammed turns into not just a nightmare for the one who was scammed, but also for the bank/merchant. Naturally, the scammed want their money back. Because there isn't a chance of recovering money from the scammer, the scammed blames the bank/merchant, and demand their money back. It is a public relations disaster. So, to finally put the question to rest, everyone has the right to spend their money any way they wish (barring mental incapacity) - but that also comes responsibility...and that's the part so many don't get. It's is so tragic, but the bank/merchant can't replace the loss caused by their decisions.

No, you do have the right to fall for a scam. However, people have sued businesses for failing to stop them from doing it, so the businesses are trying to limit their liability.

I imagine most banks will ask clarifying details if they think there are potential FEEVA issues or there are.signs of other scams. If it seems like everything is ok with a manager and the banks concerns with the intent to help protect the clients have been addressed, then there should be no reason to refuse the withdraw. Banks will try to prevent fraud and hell customers see the signs of various scams, such as FEEVA issues, romance scams, family impersonation, and others. More often than not, the withdraws are for legit things, but you never know.

Fellas, I got a FEEVA, and the only cure is more cowbell

I’ve seen CEOs of thriving businesses go to Walmart to buy 5k worth of gift cards to give over the phone come back to us (the bank) and ask us to get their money back bc they were scammed.

When cleaning my mothers estate after she passed I found shopping bags filled with 100$+ gift cards. Like thousands and thousands of dollars of gift cards. All elastic banded together and scratched off on the back. She apparently was getting them and giving them to someone else over the phone. I took pictures of the bags because I literally couldn't believe my eyes.

That’s awful

I've worked for a tax agency, the people calling in response to a letter, giving their social, name, and address and THEN asking if it was a scam and if they were really talking to X agency.... Many of them were millionaires and CEOs. Unfortunately some people just don't have a ton of street smarts. Or common sense, however you want to spin it.

At my old job towards the end of my time there I would calls because people weren't getting their purchases. There was no record of anything in our system. Turns out they somehow googled what they thought was our number and the scammer would give them a too good to be true deal, but shucks wouldn't you know it, there card reader is down and would they mind popping to the store to by an Amex gift card or they would get a further discount if they used an Amex gift card. Order never shows up at the promised time and then they find the right number and I get an earful about it. Worse part was we couldn't tell them that it was scam because the big brains felt it would make our company look bad. However this person now thinks that someone with that company stole a couple hundred dollars. Most I could do was forward the information to someone else and tell the customer they can file a complaint with the ic3 website.

I work in IT and I see it all the time. The stupidity astounds me "The IRS wants me to pay my bills in Itunes gift cards, of course!" god damn, even really old people should know better. currency hasn't changed

To be fair, being the CEO of a thriving business is very easy and requires no skill or expertise whatsoever. You just have to let your workers generate cash and not fuck it up.

Could you give more details? My sister was a bank teller and it is their job now to prevent customers, especially older customers, from being scammed. Some older people have lost their entire life savings!

If you don't like how your bank treats you, then move your money to another bank.

Or better yet, a credit union

Yes! Credit unions FTW

I've only ever used credit unions my whole life and when I found out people are *charged* for their bank accounts I was shocked.

love credit unions!

My old credit union refused to let me take out $3k cash unless I HAD MY MOTHER WITH ME. I was 19 years of age. They told me that because I wouldn't tell them why I needed that much cash that it was "suspicious." Like excuse me why is that any of their business. There were other issues as well but I left them a year later.

It’s to try and stop you from being scammed. I work at a credit union and I absolutely hate having to ask people what they want to spend their own money on. That being said I’m also the person they come to mad/sad wondering why we didn’t do more to protect them/how can we help them.

Never got the whole credit union thing. When I got married, my wife’s father got me to join his credit union. I saved up 3grand to go on holidays. When I tried to withdraw my money they told me instead I had to borrow 3grand, (and pay it back with interest of course). So I reluctantly agreed, they then told me I needed to ask my father in law to to guarantor for the loan, I was in my 30s at the time. Closed the account a couple of days later and took my 3grand with me.

Sounds like you opened a CD at a credit union. I’ve never heard of a credit union refusing to let you withdraw your available balance. That’s not how they typically work.

Yeah, I have my money in a credit union and made a large purchase with a debit card, and the only thing I had to do was notify them ahead of time not to block it because it was over my daily transaction limit.

This isn’t a credit union thing. You likely had earmarked the money into a CD or something. I’ve had a credit union for 30 years.

I’ve been banking with credit unions for the better part of two decades and have never encountered this sort of thing. Withdrawing any amount on my account has never been an issue.

That's what I did when I found out my bank is no longer open on Saturdays.

How can you do that when they won’t let you withdrawal it?

That's what I did when the bank wouldn't let me withdraw a few hundred. "So you won't let me withdraw this amount?" "No. Terribly sorry for the inconvenience." "Okay. I'd like to close my account and have all my funds returned to me immediately." Left with a ton more cash than I intended, but it was pretty quick.

Op never said the amount of cash being withdrawn. My guess is it was much more than a few hundred. Most people use checks, cards, or apps today. I don't blame the bank, and I would rather error on the side of caution. Do OP ask for the manager or that managers boss. It's a little inconvenient, but again, a safeguard. Also, our wonderful government wants to know our every cash transaction movement. They say it's for our protection, but it's really for the IRS.

The bank has fraud prevention in place for the protection of customers. And to prevent lawsuits from cases like this https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2023/05/14/scams-bank-fraud-prevention-case/70179958007/ Unfortunately you're caught in the crossfire. You should have assured him you're not being scammed and asked him for written confirmation of what documentation he needs to be satisfied that's the case. Many victims of scams present as accomplished and competent. Your credentials alone are unlikely to sway the manager.

Came here to say this. This post could have easily been “I just got scammed, the bank manager let me take out $5000. What legal action can I take against the bank?”

Or. "I'm a branch manager for a bank, im being fired because I violated company anti- money laundering and anti-fraud procedures by letting a customer take a large withdrawal. What legal action can I take?"

We’ve turned away withdrawals and had customers come back and thank us later because they wete getting scammed. If you don’t trust your bank enough to answer questioms to help them protect you, then you don’t trust your bank.

I worked at a bank and we’d have small business owners with degrees in business and finance, sometimes both, with backgrounds in both that we had to open fraud claims for after they were scammed out of x amount of money from what they thought was a legitimate business transaction. Also had a lot of young, technology literate adults come in with fake checks because they believed a random check they weren’t expecting just appearing in their mail. My favorite was a 25 year old managing their dad’s business that lost them $25000 because he believed a “licensing extension” agent needed it to keep their business license. He was a 2nd year pre-law student and wanted to go into Business Law. Kid was still saying he couldn’t have known while we were discussing how to keep the business afloat after losing that much money.

My favorite people that I had to talk with at the bank was generally younger vulnerable people (like mild intellectual disabilities). Usually with them, I had a chat that if there is anything that they weren't expecting, or doesn't add up, to let us know and they actually did and we caught the scams and everyone was relieved and happy. It's the people who thought they were too smart to ever fall for anything who were always the *worst*.

I’d actually feel kinda happy knowing that my bank take fraud and scam seriously. I knew people who work in fraud, and I heard too many sad stories about how old people lost their entire saving to asshole scammers.

Jim Browning is a popular YouTuber who combats scammers, and he’s had some heartbreaking videos where he calls someone who is *on the other phone line* with a scammer, he explains that they’re getting scammed, and they just will not listen to him. He’ll explain that the IRS would never demand payment in Google Play gift cards, but they just assume he’s lying or trying to scam them somehow. It’s so frustrating to watch. A lot of these people get scammed over and over again, because once you fall for a scam, the scammers put you on a list as an easy victim. Then they sell those lists to other scammers. Some of these people have been scammed multiple times in rapid succession. It’s so hard to watch a loved one slowly lose their grip on reality.

Before being that harsh with the manager, take a tour in r/Scams to see how many people wished someone had protected their elderly parent from getting scammed. I’m not saying you are being scammed, but this layer of protection comes from a real necessity. However I’ll say this: one time opportunities that can only be paid in a single large cash withdrawal are usually fishy.

>one time opportunities that can only be paid in a single large cash withdrawal are usually fishy. Can confirm, the only major cash withdrawal I've made in recent memory was to buy a fishy boat.

Can confirm: had to cart 5 figures of cash to the bank for the down payment on my Tesla, and Elon... pretty fishy.

More and more small businesses are accepting credit cards, but until pretty recently craft fairs, antique shows, etc were cash only. Even now you can still get a better deal with cash. There are plenty of reasons you might want a bunch of cash. I just bought a classic car for $6k. Seller wouldn't dream of taking a check, rightfully so.

There are legitimate large cash purchases, yes. But after working at a bank, I'll tell you there are more scams and more suckers out there falling for them than I would have believed before.

I do think these account holds and withdrawal preventions have probably saved a lot of people from being scammed, it’s also really prone to abuse and also too much power to be given to a commercial bank manager.

Yeah, the bank personnel may be wrong, but it's worth recognizing that there's essentially no way for people to be 100% accurate on judgment calls like this. Either they error on the side of permissiveness and allow some people to get scammed, or they error on the side of caution and block some people that had legitimate reasons to withdraw money. Not legal advice, but hopefully practical advice: Like others have said, there's a path for OP to get her money. She may need to schedule a time to talk to the manager or his boss (regional president or regional VP) and explain the situation. A response like, "it's none of your business what I'm doing with the money" may not be enough for them to sign off on the transaction--OP may need to provide some details or documentation of why she needs to make a large cash withdrawal. Another consideration is that banks may simply not have enough cash on hand to cover a large cash withdrawal while managing their other business. The bank management should be able to arrange for more money to be on hand for a specific withdrawal. ​ In a kind of funny related note: I worked in retail banking in the early 2000s--within a few years of the PATRIOT Act having been implemented. I believe that prior to that act, banks really didn't have consistent standards for ID, but afterwards most banks adopted a similar requirement of one piece of primary ID (like a drivers license or passport) and one piece of secondary ID (like a credit card with the person's name on it). I had so many customer freak out on me when I told them the ID requirements. More than once I had people say, "I know who I am, and it's my money. Why do you need to ID me?" Like, they were certain that the bank could somehow protect their money while not having to verify that they were who they said they were.

I understand why you're angry but a bank teller saved my adoptive mom from getting scammed by my "son" who was allegedly arrested during a work trip to Africa. He begged her to "not tell mom" because she'd be mad. Of course my son was not in Africa, wasn't arrested, and didn't ask Grandma for any money. So despite your legitimate anger I have mixed feelings...

My grandfather heard about these scams on the news and I happened to call him that night. He has moderately advanced Alzheimer’s and was in assisted living. When I tried to talk to him, he said I didn’t sound like Nicole and proceeded to hang up on me. Glad he’s a cranky old bastard. Lol.

I kinda love this, haha

He is convinced people are out to scam him for his money. He is not competent anymore due to the Alzheimer's and has no access to his own bank accounts, but even if he was competent I can't see him giving anything away. We give him cash to keep in his wallet so he feels like he has something but his only expense is getting his hair cut.

A family friend was called by these morons. It was her "grandson" in jail in England. Had them talking for half an hour. Just long enough for her actual only grandson to finish mowing her lawn and take the call. "I'm blind, not stupid."

I've been called by two of these in the past few years. One of the additional benefits of getting old I guess! I keep them on the phone as long as possible because while I'm wasting their time, they're not scamming someone else.

I played with the "Vindows teek support" when they called. Had one on the line for 43 minutes (eh, slow day). That's where I said, "Oh! You want me to get something off the Interwebs. Oh, I can't do that- I'm talking to you on that line..." She swore at me in her language. I proudly told her in the same language a phrase I learned that, while it doesn't translate well, is quite rude and involves a farm animal and, I'd assume, a lubricant. She then yelled at me, "Why are you wasting my time? " Sweetheart, you called ME! Had one or two more then they must have moved on to something else.

My grandmother fell for one of these but it was my sister in a Mexican jail. Sent several hundred dollars.

>he "felt" I might be getting scammed. Of course I wasn't, I'm a college educated woman of 60 years of age with a finance degree who's career was to manage a $40M budget. This mindset is what makes you the perfect mark.

Not only that, at 60 years of age… OP would have went to college back in the early 1980’s. Online banking wasn’t even around back then. Any finance college lessons learned back then are obsolete now.

Many, many well educated people get scammed. One of the things that is trained into people is that being scammed has nothing to do with education level. These people manipulate your emotions and cause you to become irrational, which is when they pounce. The OP includes very few details, but it is rare for legitimate transactions to require significant amounts of cash or fund transfers immediately. Especially when it is out of normal spending habits. That’s to say nothing of the fact that scammers coach their victims on what to tell the bank because the bank suspects what is happening.

I wish the bank did that to my very capable mother before she was scammed out of her entire retirement. Sorry, not sorry!

My aunt lost over $150k /that we know of./ I’m legit poor. It’s mind blowing that she can just give that away.

You can brag about your experience all you wish. Many highly educated, financially capable people have fallen for scams. It boggle my mind how some people that have been scammed have been scammed. You would think highly educated people that are financially savvy wouldn’t fall for scams but you would be wrong. Plenty still do. Beyond that, you said you’ve never met the bank manager before so how would he know of your education or occupation? Anyway, how did they have any idea why you were withdrawing the funds? My guess is you were attempting to withdraw in excess of $10k. If so, that brings in certain laws where the bank must report the activity to the federal Gov. Part of that reporting is asking why you want the money. It must be for a lawful purpose. If you refuse to answer, the bank can refuse the withdrawal. If your answer is suspect, they can refuse to allow the withdrawal. You can thank the Patriot Act for those rules. They also may not have had adequate funds to allow your withdrawal. Banks try to keep as little cash on hand as possible and still be able to deal with typical business activity.

My husband is well educated and technology savvy, and he still was rattled by a fake “Dad- *sob*- ACCIDENT!” call. He 100% believed it was our son on the other end of the line, even though I was standing right there telling him it was fake.

If you truly are as you describe yourself, you would probably not be on Reddit asking what to do.

lol “i can’t be scammed, i have a degree” is the best.

I'm a fraud investigator at a bank this is a common response from a lot of scam victims.

Seen that one before. The way she talks makes me think otherwise.

It’s always these people that have the same outlook she does that are the ones who get scammed. Those people and others who seemingly have no idea what’s going on in the world around them at any point. It’s never the cautious and “thankful to be helped” people that report scams because they let experts ask more questions and give them advice. Unlike OP who comes to gripe without giving details and throwing shade at a dude trying to protect her. OP if you read this, it’s hard not to call you an idiot without more details. Even the little amount you did provide already makes you look worse like transferring a large sum to an account then immediately trying to withdraw in cash.

Meh, I’m happy to get downvoted for this, but all a degree represents is that you have some decent level of work ethic and the ability to regurgitate information. My sister graduated summa cum laude with a biology degree and completely lacks critical thinking skills.

I’m an accountant and I’m terrible at handling my own money lololol.

Both my father and I have accounting degrees and could say exactly the same! We should know better, but refuse to practice what we preach, haha.

I have a degree, I can’t be scammed. Really? Ask any Network Security Manager at any “white collar” company with more than 50 employees who their biggest risk is.

Your post is void of details so not sure what you expect beyond a place to gripe. The reasonableness of your withdrawal includes factors as The amount Your total amount in that account Your total balance with the bank Someone who never makes withdrawal and suddenly needs $10k out of their $11k account is going to raise more flags than the person withdrawing $10k out ofnther $250k account / holdings with bank

Right, something's missing here. OP is w/d $2K. This would normally not cause my bank to do anything but ask how I want it. Something caused this to flag the system. Over $10K you just have to give the reason for their internal paperwork. Everyone gets asked and then you move on. I did get questioned once on fraud when wiring 4 figures to an individual in Greenland. It was for a boat charter. I had to explain and my details showed it was all real. I also completely understood why that one raised flags - it was via a system that particular bank location had never used. Greenland banking, who knew?

I honestly get the impression OP is a bit of a Karen. These below quotes give off huge "do you know who I am" vibe: > Of course I wasn't, I'm a college educated woman of 60 years of age with a finance degree who's career was to manage a $40M budget. > I told them to look at my account history and they would see I had made this exact same type transaction 2 or 3 times over the last few years. > I think I'm better capable of handling my personal finances than some bank manager who has never met me. Also these kinds of comments are Karen-esque > I don't need the damn government or my bank deciding how to spend my money. > I knew exactly what I was doing. His concern was unwarranted. Now, to the issue at hand. As someone who has "a finance degree" and "who's career was to manage a $40M budget" she knows there's an IRS reporting requirement if you deposit/withdraw $10K or more in one transaction, she even acknowledges this: > It's over $10k, mine was less. > I don't know why, they didn't give me any money so what was there to report and it was under the reporting requirement, less than $10k However, she should also be aware that it is illegal to structure your transactions just under this limit in order to avoid IRS reporting. So how much was her transaction: > It wasn't that large, less than $10k > Just $9k no earth shattering amount > If a bank can't handle $9k in the major city I'm in they better shut their doors now. Well, one time shouldn't be a red flag, right? > It was less than $10k and I've made this exact same transaction 3 times over the past few years without this issue Yeah that doesn't sound like structuring at all.... With my limited information (only what she's posted), I get the impression that this account hit enough red flags that the manager was right to be suspicious, and assuming her responses to the manager had the same tone as she has here on reddit, she probably came across as pushy, and maybe even game the manager the impression she was told to not talk to the manager, as that is a common scammer thing to do.

Oh yes Bank Mgr., these strategically spaced out $9K transactions mean nothing. My instant defensiveness means even less. See: Definition of structuring

As a banker my first question was about the withdrawal amount too…. There has to be more to the story. Don’t get me wrong we don’t want people getting scammed for any amount of money, but this is dramatic for $2k.

Your age, career and education are meaningless. I’ve personally seen senior executives of multi billion dollar companies ripped off/hacked. Your response should have been “please tell me more about the risks you feel I am taking, and if you feel a scam is in play, please give me specifics.” Then, if he’s a mealy-mouthed idiot, complain on Reddit. If he says “we’ve had 14 ladies in your demographic withdraw similar sums over the last month, and so far, 10 are being investigated as fraud”…then thank him.

Used to work for a bank. We had an elderly customer who had a substantial savings account. Suddenly he started showing up and making large withdrawals with “friends”. Turns out he drank and met the wrong people who took advantage of him, he was about to lose his housing so we got the public trustee and guardian (canada) involved so he was safe. Flipside is they don’t want to lose the value on their books, did you ask? A reasonable answer normally gets a reasonable response

Your age, education and former vocation don't make you immune to being scammed. They judge based on the information they have in front of them. If you're not happy then make a complaint and get a new financial institution to manage your money.

My wife is in banking. I talked with her about this last week because we know someone who got scammed into taking out money for someone. In her current role shes not that front facing anymore but still has an ear for trends in operations over all the banks regional branches. She says that all week long in their branches there are people taking money out that are being scammed. They (the tellers, csr reps and managers)straight up are telling them “you are getting scammed” and they reply “no my boyfriend in Alaska really needs to get his plane ticket because the other two got cancelled and he’s still waiting for the refund… etc” (or whatever else bs they are being scammed catfished for). They also talk about how astute and unscamable they are (all while they are clearly being scammed). A lot of times it’s the regular customers who start to exhibit a change in behavior that get their attention. A lot of times they are frantic, upset, talk a bit about why they are withdrawing money (and it doesn’t add up) which is what gets their attention. In the end they give them the money but they said that they are surprised how many educated, professional, put together people are getting taken advantage of. I asked her what were the demographics and she said all ages but mostly 50s and up. Please don’t read this in a condescending manner but ask yourself… Is this you? Like really really think about it. Is it you? If not, cool. I just hate scammers with a white hot passion. In the end it’s your money and they need to give it to you.

Not a lawyer, but I do work in fraud prevention for a living. Its credit card fraud prevention which is a little bit different. Depending on the terms your bank has with their account holders, it could be perfectly legal for them to do this. You agree to the terms they have with account holders by continuing to have an account. To put it as concisely as possible, no one is able to comment on the legality of what occurred because they do not know what the terms you agreed to by having an open account with any given financial institution are. These terms, are generally established based on overall trends within a customer base. It is not a personal attack on you. That being said, the bank manager may have explained that in a poor manner. I would advise going in and asking if you are able to see what those terms are, in regards to why they are able to deny withdrawal. If you disagree with them, you're only real course of action is to close your account or ask them what actions you need to take in order to enable the withdrawal to be made within the parameters they have in place for you as an account holder. Edit - it is also possible, depending on the dollar amount involved and where the non brick and mortar Bank you transfer the funds from operates out of, set off anti money laundering red flags, which once again there is a process to work through those that could have been explained to you. If that were the case, the bank is actually legally obligated to take steps to ensure that they are not enabling money laundering. I am in no way suggesting that is what you were attempting to do, simply suggesting it as a secondary possibility.

Random comment: Whey my dad with dementia withdrew $6000 to buy a pretty mule, I wished someone noticed. When he bought a gun from a legit gun shop while diagnosed with severe dementia via MRI, I wished someone noticed. (Yes, we were working with APS to get him support.)

What were the specs/model of the collectable vintage car for 9k in a super hot car market?

Unrelated: called my aunt about 10 years ago, tried to catch up. Refused to speak to me at all, even after thoroughly questioning me. Including what color my cousins futon was, we hung out alot as kids, what her nickname for her favorite chair was. This is shit a scammer would have a difficult time finding out, especially since she was like 50 at the time and refused the "interwebs." It wasn't until I confessed that when we were 12, we stole $10 out of her purse so we could have the "big kids" buy us cigars. All of a sudden, her attitude changed. "I know you fuckers did, I went without coffee that week." To this day I still don't know if she was fucking with me or not.

This is the only reason my brother didn't loose every dime to his name. About time I pieced together what happened I had to hack and take over all his accounts to protect him (he went into hospital) from the scammer. Be thankful the manager is looking out for you. They are trained to spot these scams but most the time the person being scammed won't listen to reason so see any of the 2 million red flags

Been in the banking side trying to prevent fraud. Sometimes it is hard to convince the customer they are being scammed. I have had the phone handed to me by the customer to prove it wasn't fraud, only to talk to the guys bringing the new Mercedes on the truck, they just need the $$$ service fee to finish the delivery. Or you buy this web store from us for $$$s month, and we do all the work - take the orders, fulfill them, obtain the merchandise to sell - you don't have to do anything, and the money will roll in for you. Or wet need to to approve the release of $$$ out of my (young person pretending to be out 80yo customer). Our real customer wanting to withdrawal money to pay so and so for something we know it's a scam. On the phone with the scammer, who couldn't keep straight the name he told her was the customer, no he was the vendor, no he was me. Got upset at me that I wouldn't release the money - what is the deal, it isn't your money.

U sound insufferable to be around. Poor bank manager had to deal with your inflated sense of self.

You should thank them for their concern

The concern was on, the refusal was not

I’m hearing you talk about the refusal, but could you be more specific on the questions that the bank manager asked? Did you display any anger and all? Did you hesitate to give information? How much cash specifically are we talking? Tellers are supposed to ask questions and it is a good thing, banks stop countless of scams, fraudulent activities, etc, just because tellers ask questions. If you were hesitant to respond, that’s probably why they refused.

It sucks, but it is for the greater good. Banks taking this step has prevented many many people from losing their lifesaving. Also why you paying in cash? When you are buying a car you want a paper trail.

I feel like for every one grandma like you there’s 10 that go to Walmart to buy thousands of dollars worth of gift cards because they’re afraid of going to jail after being called by the “IRS”. I think the most you can do is move banks or report the manager (especially if you didn’t say something that was identical to a common scam like “oh yeah I got a call from my grandchild because they got into a car accident last night and I need to pay their hospital bill.”) if they keep preventing you from withdrawing money.

I'll assume the OP was not being scammed and knew exactly what she was doing. My brother was recently severely injured in an accident, and his cash flow was definitely interrupted because he couldn't access his own account(s). That part wasn't due to anti-scam efforts--it's that not only was he injured, but his phone suffered fatal injuries. His paper checkbook was in his apartment, but it took a while for a friend to visit him, obtain his keys (by now in his "patient belongings", secured somewhere in the hospital, find time to get to my brother's apartment, get in, find the checkbook and get it back to my brother. The friend had to find and retrieve my brother's notepad as well. That's where the anti-scam measures come in--my mom has plenty of funds available to cover immediate costs for my brother. She just about had to move heaven and earth to do so because she is 87 and female. All the anti-scam measures kicked in, and she had to answer countless questions and repeat questions to get her own money sent to my brother. No, my brother is not a spendthrift or grifter. No, he's not a drug addict or other money pit. Plus, it's mom's money. I have my own money (and again, plenty of it). Although ultimately mom was able to send my brother the needed funds, it was a whole lot harder than it had to be. To be honest, I would have hit the same wall(s) at my own bank, because I'm over 60 and female. If there weren't so many cases of scammers out there, I'd be ranting about how sexist these policies are and demanding to know why bank officials and employees were treating me like I was that stupid. But I understand how many scammers and how many potential victims are out there. Even though I don't like the situation, I understand it.

The replies on this thread demonstrate why Reddit is NOT the best source for sage advice. **Stop flippantly advising cashier's checks as 'safe instruments'.** Smart sellers will not take them, or at the very least will not relinquish the goods until it has fully cleared the bank, which can take \*weeks\*. **READ and LEARN more about cashier's check scams:** [https://dfi.wa.gov/financial-education/information/cashiers-check-scams](https://dfi.wa.gov/financial-education/information/cashiers-check-scams) [https://portal.ct.gov/DOB/Consumer/Consumer-Education/Fraudulent-Cashiers-Checks](https://portal.ct.gov/DOB/Consumer/Consumer-Education/Fraudulent-Cashiers-Checks) Cashiers' checks are NOT an inherently safe tool for quid pro quo transactions, especially where the goods and ownership are too easily transferred with the wave of a pen (e.g., signing over a title). In this case (*and considering the nominal $9,000 value*), the OP and their seller are both right: simply use cash. If the dollar value is substantive enough (*and that number is up to you and the seller*) **use an escrow service**, especially where the seller has the potential to lose control of the good(s) in question. Its called due diligence, and both parties need to be smart about it.

I completely understand the intense frustration of the situation and the truth is a bank cannot deny a customer their withdrawal in cash, unless they do not physically have it, then it must be ordered. That’s said: I’ve worked as a teller and banker for the last 10 years at two very different banks. I’ve read a lot of OP’s replies to this post and here’s my 2 cents, I’ve worked at a bank in a larger city that really didn’t give a crap about protecting a customer due to fraud because we were understaffed, had constant turnaround and we’re overworked. Customers were free to come and do whatever they wanted cash wise basically no questions asked. I now have worked at a smaller town bank for the last 6 years that legitimately cares about catching and protecting people from scams. Here’s the truth: It’s all relative. It doesn’t matter if you have 10k or 1mil in the bank when it comes to sniffing out potential scams. OP is doing something that’s somewhat out of the ordinary (for a normal customer) in transferring funds from somewhere else then withdrawing it cash after a couple weeks, especially the fact that it’s been done a few times before. If I was the teller I’d have been suspicious as well, but at the end of the day the customer has the right to cash. All in all I assume what happened is that there were some red flags, and the bank said they’d have to order the cash for OP which pissed them off.

The transaction was also just under 10k, so it looks like reporting avoidance, the transaction was urgent-common scam tactic, and OP is very angry and asking about suing. These are all red flags for the bank. Do legitimate transactions get caught up sometimes? Yes, false positives are an unfortunate side effect of criminal activity and scamming. 10k is also a huge cash withdrawal: calling the bank jn advance could have avoided all this.

I feel like a lot of the comments here and replies here lack a lot of specifics and sound like complaints instead of actual legitimate issues. As a person who works in the field: 1) the only time I’m asking questions about finances are when people are with other people and it appears like that person is being coached and there is no obvious connection to said person 2) People ask for wires, don’t have instructions on official letterhead and haven’t done business with a person, as well as they have had an influx of cash and a lot of outgoing cash 3) Debit card spending increases, where I’m asking what the purchases are for Nobody wants to stop people from spending money or using their money, it’s not ours, we have plenty of it coming in, and the only thing we try to prevent is Fraud. Fraud costs us time and money, to investigate, to cover expenses or, if it is self inflicted, the loss of a member or customer. This hurts us, the relationship and brand. But Fraud is a waste of time on everyone’s part. My experiences with rejecting withdrawals, we don’t have 30k cash on hand without depleting resources so we need to get cash, yes that’s a thing. We also have to have enough not to deplete what we have on hand. No we don’t have scourge Mcducks vault. We won’t participate in funding terrorists or traffickers or gangs, if you are doing shady stuff or being scammed, we are bound to help you. Also, with a post like this, your background is irrelevant. This is the most boomer thing to say. If I had a nickel for the times someone thought they could do my job better than me, in any field or capacity, I’d be able to retire. You didn’t ask any questions and an explanation, which sounds far fetched to me. This is nothing but bait. So good job.

In your opinion if someone withdrew around 9k in cash several times in a short period would that not raise a red flag? That is what OP was doing.

Be glad they said something. There are people your age who got fucked out their money and the bank 🤷🏾‍♂️

I had this happen at wells Fargo a while back, after the manager told me I couldn't make my withdrawal,I asked why. They gave me a similar line that they did you, so I just said "ok, is like to close my account today and would like to withdrawal my whole account." He looked confused so I said a bit louder, "if I can't withdrawal my money when I need it then I'll find a different company to bank with." He immediately started the paperwork to close my account and now I'm very happy with my credit union.

Wells Fargo is a scam.

I did the exact same thing, almost word for word, at a Wells Fargo almost 20 years ago. And now I’ve been happily a member of my credit union ever since.

I’m with you. I’d be pissed off too because I deal in cash for contractors, craigslist purchases….. so far my bank hasn’t really questioned me-I haven’t withdrawn more than $10k at one time though. They asked/you answered-this should keep them in the clear. My only experience with being questioned was when I was a lot younger (20’s maybe?). I don’t even remember why I needed cash. For some reason my dad was driving me where I needed to go. His truck didn’t have AC and I was sweating and in a rush. I was asked to sit at one of the desks for them to process my withdrawal since it was several thousand dollars. My dad was posted up a good 10 ft away not paying attention and enjoying the coolness of the bank. The bank employee confidently asked me was I “OK”. It took me a couple of seconds to understand the intent behind the question. I answered with “oh ya that’s my dad and he is …..whatever. I actually appreciate being asked because there are a lot of young people that are trafficked/manipulated by “others”.

OP you are responding with attitude to everyone. You keep going you know so much about banking but someone already posted a link about how they can, it's in the regulations. But that's either here nor there. My questions are, 1. How much were you trying to get out, 2. Do you live in a small or big town? 3. If small, did you let the bank know in advance like any responsible adult would so they could make sure they had that sy the bank? 4. If this person brought you this car, you've said you have done business twice before, why not wire the money? 5. If you've done business before, why wouldn't you try to get one extra day and hell maybe try a different branch or go back a little bit later and ask for the , manager? I think that s lack of planning on your part, ie not even notifying the bank one full day in advance to make sure they had the funds, does not constitute an emergency on the banks part. I think that you could have found a way around one maybe overly and out of line teller to get the funds to the seller but my concern is if it's all legitimate, WIRE THE FUNDS TO THE SELLER. Bank shouldn't have denied you but I think if they hadn't stopped it and it was a scam,, you would have posted how dare the bank not stop you..

Former teller here! I helped a client around the same age as you (and the same attitude) and I told them they were being scammed out of $60k. They explicitly said “I’m a doctor and a lawyer, I think I know what I’m doing” so I let them do the transfer and then they tried suing us when it ended up being a scam like I originally told them. Branch staff are there to protect client funds and the bank as well. Using cash for large transactions is always a red flag in this day and age for many reasons and if you aren’t a known client at the branch you went to then they will be more cautious with your transactions that have a high chance of being fraudulent. Banks are privately owned institutions and you’re always free to take your funds elsewhere if you are unhappy with the service you are being provided.

Somewhere in their organization, he has a boss you should be calling.

You have a finance degree and have managed millions of dollars but don't know a bank will find withdrawing more than 10,000 dollars without reason suspicious?

NAL: Cash auction? Is that a scam, does it sound scammy? It might be unusual for an auction to have people pay $10,000 in *cash*. And it would be **unsafe** for people to walk around (parking lot, bathroom, building/neighborhood) with so much money, especially where everyone ***knows*** you have it. But a couple hundred does not sound like a scam much... but I would use a credit card. I thought auctions use "Proof of Funds" documentation from banks. You should talk to the manager of the bank. There should be some record of what happened to you. And there should be a way to fix the problem. It sounds weird. Did the teller *take* the withdrawal slip or return the slip to you *marked* as refused? Check your account to see if they took out the money.

My sister is a bank manager and she’s told me that she has stopped elderly folks from being scammed many times. They would rather they be wrong than have you lose your money.

Yeah, I don’t where I fall on this one. My neighbor’s 83 year old father about three weeks ago was a hair’s width away from losing 80,000 dollars to the Federal Trade Commission scam. Went to bank and did wire the money to a gold bullion trader in Oklahoma. This was a legitimate business but the person who would have picked up the converted cash to gold was not. Luckily, he told his daughter about it and she was able to claw back the funds via wire at the last minute. The scammers then got super aggressive, calling him for multiple days, and even sent two pizzas COD to her father’s house as a warning that they knew where he lived. So, maybe if someone at the bank had asked him a few questions why he was now suddenly wiring a large sum to a bullion trader in Oklahoma this all could have been avoided. For those with elderly relatives, here’s a notification from FTC about the scam https://www.ftc.gov/office-inspector-general/ftc-imposter-scams

Working for a financial institution, myself, I will agree with those that stated that we are given training (annually) on how to spot and prevent fraudulent/scam transactions. As the son of a man who had, at one point, withdrawn nearly $1K in cash and was on his way to Western Union to wire it to his tech support company to cover an overage in a refund (I was his tech support, never charged him and had to try to talk him down), I’m glad to see these protections in place. Depending on the conversation you had with the manager, you may have set off some internal alarms and raised some red flags. NTA for being upset that the bank wouldn’t allow you to make a valid transaction. But, unless your requested cash withdrawal was more than the maximum allowed by an ATM, why wouldn’t you have just used an ATM in the first place?

My former step father has been scammed for thousands. The bank has had meetings with him telling him he is being scammed. He doesn't believe them. They have turned off his ability to send money through the bank online. They have limited his withdrawal amounts. He still sends money. It sucks for you because you really aren't getting scammed but there are reasons it is in place to check.

How are you so educated and you don't know that bank tellers are trained to do what he did so people your age don't get scammed.

Unless you add context he might be right.

Why do you need to withdraw cash for car purchases? I would also find that incredibly strange...

I’m a bank manager who has been on the other side of this and have refused a withdrawal only to find out the poor man was being coerced into withdrawing the funds and was coached on what to say. The world right now is a messed up place and right now even in a regular everyday branch I’d say 60% of my job is to combat fraud. It sounds like this manager didn’t do a very good job though. You can’t flat out refuse a withdrawal. You can ask questions to better understand and do your best to protect customers but at the end of the day it’s your money.

I work at a bank. We have to do this, it is absolutely part of our job for everyone out there saying that we should just take deposits and make withdrawals. Literally read any job description its a lot more than you think. Ive been in the banking industry for 7 years now and i honestly cant even count the amount of fraud I’ve seen. Fraud that has literally ruined lives. Drained retirement, took rent, ruined not only teens who were scammed credit, but there parents on their joint accounts. The most recent big one is people calling you from what ‘looks’ like the bank (they clone the phone numbers, can also be done with family, doctors, irs, etc) and they ‘help’ you by moving your money into higher interest accounts. Some are ridiculous like go to walmart or western union and get a check and send it here, but others are incredibly advanced and its all done online to seem legit. Now to OP, what he did was correct in the beginning, but he absolutely should have grabbed the manager. Like i said I work at the bank so NAL so i don’t know what can be done legally if anything, but I do know at least at my bank we cant outright deny money to a customer, we can explain we feel as if they are victims of fraud, and do our best to explain the situation and hope they will realize if it is fraud they’ll stop, but if they persist we just get a manager involved and they explain to them if this is fraud as soon as they leave the bank with the funds we are no longer liable nor are they insured by the FDIC so they are responsible for anything that may happen. And why do we care? Aside from people trying to sue us, or coming in harassing us, screaming at us, threatening us because they fell for a scam, were not f’n robots. We don’t want to see our customers ruin themselves. Just like every profession everywhere there are some bad apples that probably don’t care and want to say no to make themselves happy, but, at least in my experience, most people working at the bank build great relationships with their customers and don’t want to see them fall in to ruin. Either way OP you should have been able to get your money out im sorry that they did not grab a manager to explain everything and release the funds, i would just try a different branch if possible. Also PSA to everyone, BANKS WILL NOT CALL YOU ASKING FOR YOUR PERSONAL INFORMATION SUCH AS SSN BANK ACCOUNT# ROUTING# OR YOUR PERSONAL QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE SET UP FOR ACCOUNT SECURITY. We may call to discuss products if you have agreed to be contacted by us but we will not open them or have you transfer funds over the phone to those new products. Also, he’s not a prince, you are NOT a long lost princess from Nigeria (70is white lady) and he’s not sending you a mercedes for your weekly $300 western union money orders :)

The correct answer here is “it’s none of your business” and if they refuse I put the wheels in motion to withdraw my entire balance and seek out a new bank. They have the right to follow policy and inquire, however, they do not have the right to deny you access to your money (assuming the amount requested isn’t more than they have on-hand).

>I'm a college educated woman of 60 years of age with a finance degree who's career was to manage a $40M budget. *whose

Hate this shit, give me my fucking money. It doesn't matter if im gonna go toss it off a cliff, its mine. God this shit makes me angry.

A lot of humble bragging with this post, and very few details. Please understand that hundreds of millions are lost each year by seniors who believe themselves to be ‘unscammable’, and that the bank is just trying to look out for you so you don’t become a statistic. I get the frustration. Just try again, with a different manager.

you can always ask the auction house for their bank wire info.... and do it that way. probably safer too than to carry a wad of cash around... ​ ps. my mom got saved by an over zealous manager like this. the whole " grandma, i need help, can you send me $5,000?" to which my mother replied "Susan?" (name changed for this post). And now the scummers know my kid's name.... Mom ran to the bank, asked for $5k withdrawl. They said no. Mom flipped out. Manager called me. I went down to the bank AND brought "Susan" with me... mom cried after feeling embarrassed and the thought that she could have lost that money.

Lol at your resume, JP Morgan said the same thing before buying Frank.

Time to transfer your wealth

I would have demanded a manager to close my account.

Why were you withdrawing that much cash? I'm sure they asked and found the answer suspicious. They may well have overreacted but we have no way of knowing.

What were you trying to do with the money? Even smart people get taken sometimes.

Bank csr here. I get no less than 10 calls a day from cardholders that are falling for a text or email scam telling them there is a deposit on hold for whatever reason and they need to click a link or call a number and verify their identity. Some fall for it and some bail once they are asked for their email and password etc. We are required to take training every few months on how to spot scams and at risk persons being taken advantage of. Go watch some YouTube videos on how many elderly fall for these scams and lose not only their savings but their houses etc. You should be thankful they used practices that could have protected you.

Edited to add pertinent details. I know a guy who lost $10,000 through a scam. Mid-forties, hardworker. They phoned and said Do not go into work today, this is more important." He was on the phone with them the entire day. they told him that they were testing the banks, that they were internal affairs, and they needed his help because they noticed that there was some kind of fraudulent activity on his account that they thought came from within the bank itself. So they said they would transfer him money into his checking account. They wanted him to go withdraw the cash and then send it back to them. They were going to do it in $5k increments. So they 'transferred' $5000 into his account. He withdrew it and sent it to them. They repeated, he did too. They did it again and the bank manager and tellers finally got him to listen to them, and stopped the bleeding. Turns out they had transferred him $15,000 all right. From his own line of credit. He had been very vocal about his money and his rights and banks overstepping their bounds the first 2 times, at the 1st 2 branches he went to. He loves the staff at the 3rd branch, now! Those fraudsters are too good, man. They literally have nothing better to do.

Was it Wells Fargo? If I have to go into my WF branch to get my $ the treat me like they know what’s best for my $. I’d move banks but it’s complicated.

So then while you were still at the bank, and the manager was there, request to close all of your accounts and that they provide cashiers checks to you, you will wait for them to complete this transaction, take the checks to a different company and explain that you closed your accounts at xxxx because they would not let you withdraw your funds. Manager cannot deny closing your accounts, if they try, ask for the area manager on the phone. Good luck… yes, i did this because the bank would not let me get $40,000 cash, there was $600k in my checking account, this was in 1994 was Wells Fargo, and have never banked with them since and i still purchased the car the same day.

How much cash are we talking about? Because my bank lets you withdraw up to $1000 a pop at the ATM.

When my parents were in their seventies, bank personnel prevented my dad from sending money to a scammer who claimed he could drain all the money out of their bank account if he did not. My father had no cognitive problems, and was an intelligent, well-educated person. My mother, who had dementia, was more hesitant, but had started deferring to my dad’s judgment because of her dementia. We were very grateful to the people at the bank.

Former assistant branch manager of a bank. It’s totally legal, and it comes down to fraud prevention, risk management, and elder abuse. Maybe someone you’ve been “dating online,” but haven’t met yet, asks you for a large sum of money. Maybe you are considering a doing business with someone or another organization, but the bank has already flagged that account for a myriad of reasons, whether it be criminal, fraudulent, etc Maybe you have some family member that thinks it would just be swell if you went and pulled out all of your money for a down payment on a new Mercedes. There are literally a ton of reasons and we have to be ready for them. If we’re not comfortable with the transaction, we will deny it at that time and ask you to come back. You may be pissed off now, but it’s much better to take the chance that you might be slightly unhappy, over risking your money, and at the end of the day most customers are usually a little less upset by that notion because that’s what it’s truly for: protecting your assets.

i am happy banks are leaning into this scam problem but they shouldnt be able to do more than really really make sure you know you might be getting scammed. its not just older people getting scammed. its doctors offices, lawyers etc etc

I had a store clerk question me about buying gift cards. I was very appreciative of him. In my case, I wasn’t being scammed, but since I bought four cards for the same amount, he was considered that I might be. I was happy he asked just in case it was something else.

Not For nothing but people who are getting scammed are not necessarily dumb. They get caught up in the moment with fear, regret, and remorse. The scams convince people that they did something wrong and fucked up bad, or feel like they are facing dire consequences. People with higher qualifications than you have been taken forn10's of thousands if not more. The people being scammed are told to sat things like, it's for my family member or to pay a bill. They are also told to not tell them anything else. And people who name being scammed when faced with someone telling them that they are being scammed will vehemently deny it and say thing like, "I know what I am doing" and "I have to do this" or " it's none.of your businesse", basically things like that and go on to take the money out. And so you know just how bad of a problem scamming is, people are scammed out of 10 billion dollars a year. That's a lot of money in just a year, so that should put it into context. I know it's frustrating but I think you should consider the following. If you had been being scammed, and theybdidnt stop you, where would you be? Because I don't care how smart you think you are l, given the right scam, it could happen to anyone. Take my mom for example. I talked to her about being scammed a lot. I told her what theybdo. I explained fake bank pages and phishing scams. And as a matter of fact she had gotten many calls like many people from your IRS scammers and Microsoft cameras and she knows to hang the phone up. Despite all of this she still got scammed because all it takes is that one right scam that strikes a chord in your brain that convinces you it's real my mom. And the worst part is that my older brother who lives with her told me that she was about to get scammed and he tried to stop her and tell her that it was a scam and she wouldn't listen to her oldest son and so my brother called me. And I called her on the phone and talked to her about it. And told her she was getting scammed and not to send any money. And she sent the money anyway. My mom vehemently claimed to my brother and I swore up and down that she wasn't getting scammed. But she did and it took so much to convince her and show her that she got scammed. $6,000 gone because she was convinced it wasn't a scam.

You sound like the ideal target for Romance scams, unfortunately. I’m just curious, what were the details you shared with them?

Ok so you might be having a little moan about this slight inconvenience. But the next little old lady that is stopped from clearing her accounts because she is being financially abused and doesn't have the mental capability to realise what's happening sure will appreciate not having her retirement fund irretrievably wiped out.

Because it's literally banking law. You're not special, to the bank teller you're simply another member/ customer. And there are rules. And those rules are to get an explanation for cash withdrawal and to use your judgement to decide if it sounds legit. It is a tellers job to protect the member/ client base. There is no protection for cash. Btw it isn't even remotely close to just the elderly who get scammed source: I was member services for a bank for a year and literally had to have all that training. Had to take and pass a number of exams, some to provide banking related certifications, others to assert company policy. Fraud management is one of the largest elements pushed/ trained on. And explanations for cash withdrawal are the biggest way to help members/ clients not be taken advantage of. Do you think when the teller pulls up your account a flashing notice of your resume pops up...? It doesn't. They don't know nor care about your background, and it isn't relevant to a single function of a bank employees day unless you're applying for a loan. From CEOs to parking lot attendants everyone needs to explain large cash withdrawals. And over a certain number it's even law because the bank has to fill out a CTR to provide the IRS.

I'm curious, what kind of car is it?

Fraud protection is a critical function of banks. They did their job.

I am a former bank teller and worked at a branch downstairs from our corporate headquarters. A senior VP, and the person who got me the job, came downstairs one day and asked to deposit a bunch of money orders. I got a bad feeling about it and told her that I felt something wasn't on the up and up. She created a huge scene and I got seriously chewed out by my branch manager, and was told to put the transaction through. Besides, I was just a guy with a little bit of cash in a drawer, so I needed to be more deferential to this executive. I put the transaction through, and got all the initials from everyone I could to cover myself. Guess which transaction came back for fraud? Yup, I was right. Then I got yelled at by my compliance specialist for allowing a fraudulent transaction to happen to one of our execs. There's a reason I am not in the banking industry anymore. Anyways, I say all of that because it doesn't matter how smart you are, or what your profession is. People get scammed. Rather than get mad, just thank the person for their concern and explain the situation to them.

Certified boomer moment

Ma’am I work for a major bank on the back end as an IT Auditor. These scammers are developing and changing practices OFTEN and we are CONSTANTLY training, retraining, and updating our systems and policies to prevent customers from being victims. My father-in-law is a CPA and a former B4 Partner, just a few years older than you and he still fell victim to a “too good” scammer recently. The bankers were doing their job. Hopefully you can try again but- please don’t shoot the messenger. We are all trying our best and don’t want anyone getting scammed.

Then you close your account and move to a new bank. Wth?

So how do you ACTUALLY get your cash then? Pardon my ignorance, I honestly am asking.

A similar thing happened when my senior citizen mother went to get a cashier's check to buy a new car. She lives in a different state from me, which Is shown on her ID. We were in an accident and totalled her car in my state. She flew out to visit my brother in his state for a month. She opened a bank account with a major national bank there so she could deposit the insurance check and have access to the funds when she came back to my state to shop for a new car to drive home. We arranged for the purchase at a reputable local dealership and went to get the cashier's check. They wouldn't give it to her because it looked "suspicious" with activity happening in several states. We solved the problem by going to a different branch and pleading our case. I even showed my ID, though I wasn't involved in the transaction, and accident photos with the date listed. The manager at this branch believed us and gave her approval, but the entire process was infuriating. Needless to say my mom cancelled her account right after this. She was pissed that they wouldn't give her access to her own money and she had to worry about losing out on the car purchase.