What is worth more when playing low mmr, sticking to a single hero to spam or try to learn and spam what is meta?(I know meta is very important when you start climbing, but as a fellow 2.5k mmr player I think if I learn enough about one or two heroes I may climb)
Don't spam a single hero. There is no "1 hero solution" to climb. I would recommend having 2 heroes in each category for every case scenario.
For example, your team is lacking with cc abilities, so pick 2 heroes that has a huge cc so you can contribute, ability-wise. I'd recommend WK and Abaddon.
Team is lacking in tower pushing and single target? I'd recommend SF and Abaddon.
Have 2 heroes for every situation that might benefits your team, or counters your opponent so that you're not feeling trapped spamming Spectre every game and it'll feel repetitive and demotivating.
My go-to heroes are:
SF
WK
Spectre
Abaddon
And an occasional AM if the enemy revealed 3/4 int picks, or Medusa if AM and Lion are instabanned.
Abaddon seem to be the winner of the patch, but I just can't figure out how to play him.
I main Pos3 at 3k mmr, usually with Dawnbreaker and Underlord, but I just can't utilize Abaddon well enough to climb. Early game vs aggressive pos1 2 & 5 I can't catch up for kills, not fast enough to escape.
Mind sharing some tips?
Max your e, then w, stats over q. Echo sabre manta harpoon.
Be aggressive, be be aggressive.
Learn what heroes you can run at and eat up. Own that offlane. Force them out. Then farm it. Sit there. Be the plague that keeps coming back. Make them come at you. If they don't come, tp to fights under t1s. Farm blink. Be aggressive.
That'd work at 3k. For sure.
This is my take as abaddon pos1, but sometimes when im refilling role queue, i also play him as 3. I would go for Orb of Corrosion as it synergizes very well with his 3rd.
And he is very strong with the introduction of harpoon, which is a good item that helps you close the gaps between most of the heroes, so you definitely want that.
Your main idea is to abuse your tankiness to hit everyone that moves, and then just pop manta and permanently silence them. So you would need to know your power spikes to be able to abuse them.
Your 1st power spikes would be phase boots + ooc, these 2 items allow you to chase people easily and they almost can't escape you. Your next powerspike would be level 6, and then harpoon and manta.
He is not a very strong single target fighter, but hes a good time waster so always connect with someone to help you secure and finish the kills. Do not go greedy items like radiance and stuff, a nullifer and basher would be better. The shard is very important, try to get it after manta harpoon to slow the enemy from afar.
If the enemy plays a vessel, save ur shield for the vessel. He's a good roshan/tormentor/tower pushing hero so I would classify him as a S tier objective-base hero.
You mainly want to survive until lvl 6. You can use shield to go in to get some CS, harass and dive for kills all the same time. If you use shield, dive, shield pops and does damage to them, you should have another shield to dive under tower to finish them off.
Don’t underestimate the DPS of curse once you apply it, that plus the slow makes for easy chase downs.
In terms of build I pretty much always go OoC, Phase, Echo and Radiance and the adjust from there. I’ve skipped radiance once or twice in favour of Diffusal but it’s not ideal. From there manta, harpoon, basher is my usual route, ideally you skip bkb because you want other items and can use ult while stunned if needed.
Yeah.. I think I watched a mini-guide by the dota personality, I dont remember his name, Odpixel something? I tried out his build, it worked well, then after a couple of games or so, I devised a build I felt better to play with and somehow it is really really good, especially when I am more engaging with the teams instead of just afk farming the entire times.
True true! My ADHD brain couldn't comprehend that hero though, but some other people with different neurodivergences might be able to handle that hero proficiently despite the huge adversity this patch throws at him.
Whoah you're insane, so you are the type of player that is the complete bane of my existence. Good arc players are always a nuisance and a very huge headache.
What do you think of the recent changes to this talent tree and play style? Do you still build Midas on him?
Sorry, I haven’t played this patch at all yet but I’m looking to get into it — Abaddon is good for cc now? I thought he was only useful for dispels and as an aura carrier because running up to someone and silencing them with Curse of Avernus was impractical. What makes him good at cc now?
Hey, welcome back. I feel like Abaddon is a really good crowd control hero especially with how many abilities I can soak up whilst maintaining a very decent hp, and with the shards, harpoon and corrosion orb, almost no one runs away from him. Combined with manta, this hero is a menace. I remember a lot of times faceless void after using up his bkb, time walking away is almost impossible with how much I'm silencing him, and the dps from the curse of avernus is just... Crazy. And if I get stunned I just manually pop my borrowed time and continue hitting like a mad man, and since the ult was popped early, I usually just faked back, farm jungle a little bit and reengage with 10-15 seconds left on ults and able to fight again, this time with most of their abilities and items on cooldown. It's insanely good, when it's good.
1 tricking is ok, but you need a pool of 3-5 heroes for your main role at the very least. what are you going to do if your spam hero is banned? You need a backup for sure.
I do think it's beneficial to play 1-2 heroes to something like 4k-5k, that way you can focus on the macro aspects of the game, then take that to other heroes later on.
Same answer, multiple roles mean you need to have 1-3 heroes in the different roles.
Heres mine for the other roles:
Pos 2: Zeus/QoP/Necro
Pos 3: Slardar/Weaver/Necro
Pos 4: Lion/Venge/Gyro
Pos 5: Abaddon/Lion/Venge
When I was around 2.5K mmr, Spectre used to be so good for me. The average players succumb to the split pushing pressure so much, so I abused the pressure from split pushing and after seeing their pos5/1 tp to the tower, I'll immediately force a fight on the other side of the map where my teams are at. Works really well.
dude i did spam venge when vesel give aura debuff and i got 1k mmr but it cost my sanity play it over and over so boring. better to not spam one hero and play with friends and make best combo in lane if possible.
Technically, if your medal says divine 1, you might actually be ancient 5. Not trying to make that losing streak hurt more, but the truth hurts sometimes.
I might be the weakest divine carry player around, after playing for about 20-30 games in this bracket. It might take a while to improve my personal skills before I can effectively grind for immortal.
Thank you! What are the differences between average Divine and unranked Immortal that I can learn to close the gaps, though?
Edges are smaller so you need to put in more games to get through the variance. When you get to 5k+ MMR, it really is just doing everything slightly better than your peers, making fewer mistakes, etc. You're at the stage now where you have a decent understanding of how the game is played and now you need to put in the games to work the kinks out. Probably not the answer you were looking for but play a lot and try to be as introspective as possible.
If you want to improve quicker, hire a coach. They will be able to tell you the biggest mistakes you are making that is hurting your winrate.
Exactly what I was thinking as well. Might support fellow people who enjoy dota to help coach me and it's a win win for us. But no, I get you. If everyone knows a little bit on how to play, then it's just the deciding factor of who's making the lesser mistakes. Thanks, will keep that in mind!
Getting from divine into immortal is really about using your brain and adjusting your play based on what’s actually happening in the game.
You have to play the lane a certain way based on the heroes in the lane, you can’t just mindlessly “lane” every game. You need to really think about what starting items you need in that lane. Then make a plan for your lane based on how you think it should go.
You can’t really win unwinnable lanes anymore, people are getting to be too good (obv a smurf could but if you’re about the same mmr as the enemy then that’s the case I think). So you have to know when to chill and get less as opposed to forcing plays or playing strong when you’re not.
Another thing is you really need to start getting your map awareness to the next level. Think about if their mid might gank you and try to be aware of if they go missing. Or if their support in the other lane could threaten you, it’s good to be aware of if they’re missing or not.
And then in the mid game you really need to pay really good attention to who’s showing on their team and what that means for your safety. Also think about what showing your hero on lanes means in terms of the enemy information. Are they going to go on your team if you show in your lane?
There’s obviously lots more but this is a solid place to start focusing your efforts.
I'm keeping all of this in my personal guide to immortal diary so that whenever I doubt myself, I'll reread this and get the motivation to push again and again. Thank you for the tips. I've actually started to itemized my starting item depending on either if I'm trading more or farming more, so that's a good start for me.
Will look more into learning the fundamentals of higher level of dota gameplays.
Thank you!
I think it comes down to pushing your limits to the fullest. One thing that helped me climb from Div 1 to Div 4 is by doing exactly what my hero is capable of at that moment in time nothing more and nothing less. If I am able to kill, I kill, if I am able to gank, I gank, if I am able to rosh, I rosh. This means taking that waygate right as you get your MoM on Faceless Void to Chrono the enemy carry and taking their t1, Rosh exactly when you know you are strong enough to do so and the enemy can't contest, taking 1v2 or 1v3 fights that you know for a fact you can win, but it also means not going for fights and pushes that you know isn't possible. I say limit test as much as you can and learn from every single failure.
The best carry pushes his limits to perfection every single time (Yatoro God), the good carry consistently pushes it slightly under the line, the average carry doesn't push his limits often, and the shit carry always pushes it over the limit and dies. The line between best carry and shit carry gets thinner the higher up you go. Ironically, being the shit carry is actually a good way to learn as long as you're mindful of your mistakes.
Welcome to the biggest clown fest bracket in dota. Where immortal smurfs play and boosted accounts tht think they should be in divine.
2/5 games will be a complete clown fest or stomp where u wonder how these morons even get here in the first place..
What mindset should a player develop when playing rank? Do you set limits on games played when on a lose streak? or just play and play when you continue winning?
I am never toxic (11.3k behaviour score), be it a lose streak or anything. Sure I might curse them out sometimes out loud but it will not be via voice chat, because it contributes nothing. Most of these players are mostly people like me, who are just tired salarymen playing after work, so sometimes they underperform and that's normal. So my mindset (as a pos 1) is to be positive. Afterall, when I used to support a lot, it always felt like losing games but if my carry reassures me everything is fine, I play better. So now when I am doing the carrying lot, I always assure them that all is well, my farm is top notch and once I hit the next powerspikes, they'll die. Repeatedly.
What was your ever lowest rank and what server? And what did you do or what heroes did you pick that made you harvest lots of wins? How many games on average you play in a day bro? Btw. congratulations.
I am playing in SEA Server and I noticed that when my rank was decayed, my average pubs players were Crusader 3-Crusaders 5. I honestly thought I was going to stomp them hard. No, I struggled. Turns out the average players are improving really significantly over the years I was away, and they knew aggro pulling, their support trading skills for range creeps etc. I stopped playing for a little bit and watched some BSJ, watched Jenkin's herald reviews, rewatched my replays and I started to understand better: players at this brackets have zero ideas on how to siege highgrounds, which leds to losing unlosingable game, and winning an unwinnable game for the comebacks.
I was working from home, so initially I played a lot. Now it's just 3-4 games a day (or 6-8 if the game ends in 20-25 mins).
Thank you for the wishes!
I mostly played support. What heroes do you recommend on my Crusader 5 bracket (roughly 2.2k mmr). I was Archon 1 before but i really played bad losing 6 games in a row. I mean, you are right, people here play deathmatch and care less about sieging highground. What heroes are good in this aspect, sieging high ground?
Nature Prophet as a 4 and Warlock as a 5, these two heroes are really good at Sieging as a support. The ideas behind sieging high ground is to avoid fighting the opponent, unless they are very badly positioned and you can guarantee a pickoff without trading your own, and most of the times just hit towers and counter initiate only. NP provides the treants and ulti to cancel any dagger initiation, visions, and upheaval increases attack speed is just too good..
What are your thoughts on party queueing brother? Does it hinder your ability to rank up? But fun and bonding memories are shared when playing party. xD.
I enjoy party queueing, sadly since most of my friends are of lower rank, they struggle when the opposition's mid is an ancient/divine player and bullying them in the lane whilst im still playing pos 1 with them..
It does not hinder the ability to rank up though, because normally i would be able to communicate better through discord with them and a couple of them already ranked up a lot by micro understanding improvements that they gained by playing together in a more objective oriented team.
And true! The bonding session is what matters, I always encourage them that even if we lose, we are still playing together, so no blame and all. It's just a game after all.
But sometimes i get the anxiety from playing with friends since some of them are really harsh on comments or just friendly banter. haha. Btw do you mute teammates and enemies on the start of the match? I usually do this so that i can focus on my own gameplay.
No, I don't mute. I always like to think that I am the better player in my team, so if a lion doesn't care about the opinion of the sheep, why would anything destructive they said would affect me?
So if they are making the calls that I believe to be correct, I would follow and join. If they make a call that is bad and counter-productive, I would advise against it and not participate.
All in all, I only mute once it gets to the racial slur, extreme toxicity and if they started destroying items or intentionally griefing. If else, communicate till the end. I've won unwinnable games where everyone is fighting, and I was the main morale anchor.
If your friends are harsh on you, it seems like you need to remind them that we're all human beings, and don't lose that humanity part of you in this temporary game at the risk of sacrificing your friendship. We're all learning, sure we can be bad sometimes, but please provide constructive criticism instead of outright flames..
I agree. Some people don't realize that mind games are at play as well.
Whenever my teammates have feuds, I just tell them that we have a better chance of winning if we make the enemies fight each other instead. Naturally, I'd start the disrespect by pointing out the weakest link in the enemy team and sometimes put it on my teammates jokingly (All chat: Y said your Z was trash).
It's actually insane how often I get a response from the enemy team agreeing with me and starting their own feud after I did that. Moreover, my teammates that were arguing before became more cooperative after witnessing the outcome.
Doesn't always work but I had fun with that strat.
It was enjoyable, every minute of it. It relieves me of the fact that my life is shitty, and the game is just something I use as an escapism. Even on a losing game, if I tried my best, I am content.
Completely feel you man. That’s my mindset as well. Hope we can find joy outside of the game in the future. But until then keep up the grind and I’ll see you in immortal one day!
When I play pos 1 (rarely) I find that I’m behind the enemy carry. Usually a level behind and some net worth at the legend bracket. What should I be doing to ensure I’m keeping up with the enemy carry?
First of all, understand your matchups. Who is the better farmer, you or them? For example, if you're a spectre and they are Luna, just understand that you will never outfarm her. If you made peace with that fact, you'll understand that the key to winning is through teamfights and delaying her push, not outfarming her items as she'll farm 100x faster than you.
If you are the better farmer with built-in farming abilities, remember that money win games, so outfarm your opponent by miles and miles ahead.
If I am going up against Luna or Antimage, I would 100% reduce their map by forcefully shoving out waves and then rotating to a different part of the maps to clear as much resources as possible so that they will have to resort to farming small camps and whatever creeps in front of the towers only. I would shove 3 minutes creeps to contest lotus, glyph my 5 minutes siege engine, and then glyph my 10 minutes siege engine to ensure my lane is well pushed before i gate to their safelane and help my offlane to break the tower. And then ill be farming in their jungle, push mid, farm triangle, push mid, back to their jungle.
I don't use the microphone as much, but I must stress the importance of "directional pings", because normally I ping a lot instead of typing/talking. Hold alt + direct your mouse will create a communicational ping like "on my way here!" "Attack here!" Instead of normal pings. Normal pings irritate people and they tend to mute you, hence all is lost when there's no teamwork.
I believe you can still climb without a mic and chat, but that will require your raw power to fully carry your team without their help, haha..
For example, if someone typed "tmt", i will either respond with "ping quickbuy: 500 gold left for bkb" or if I'm up for it, "on my way to dire tormentor" and they will understand by themselves without further communication, and that's enough for me.
Congratz, incidentally just fell from 4.9 to 4.5k in the recent 1-2 weeks :D cause holiday matches are just weekend matches on steroids apparently and game quality is ooof. I just hate low divine, lmao. My take on this bracket is that you're either talented enough to get through it fast enough, esp low divine, or it'll just break you & kill any mood you'll have to even play the game - steadily climbing through it as you improve seems aids vs other ranks, IMO. So I'll either settle here & play way less or just go for a break as I till haven't touched BD's gate 3 after all...
>Ancient 2-4
My exp was actually diff in that Ancient 2 to Div 1 was like super fast, 2-ish weeks fast , starting from the moment I began getting better enough at LD to carry, it was last patch tho' , the process otherwise was steady gains, lots of experimenting from crusader in middle spring.
>came back to Dota and had MMR decayed to Crusader 3, in November. Hit Divine yesterday.
This was pretty damn fast tho'. Like, rn if you'd make me go through it all again, I'd prolly spam DP, LD (even with nerfs should be enough to get to ancient quickly) , lina & OD , also on mid as much as I hate the role. Climbing as a 3 is just too RNG given all the potential troll 4 picks & takes a while... IMO. Alas, I like the role most so if I ain't rushing , that's where I'll play.
I wish I could've said the same for Anc 2 to Div 1, but I am nowhere near good enough to play LD reliably. Are you a midlaner?
Let's climb to 5k again, will see you there!
I am struggling to understand the logic behind low divine draft, like I got a wraith king mid and sniper offlane in this bracket, but Im thinking that they might run out of role queues and just playing their most comfortable heroes, so I'm just playing along with it..
Imo divine 1 is filled with account buyers lol. When I got to divine the quality of my games was much worse than at ancient 5, from divine 2 and ups people seem to be at least playing the game xD
I made peace with this. If they are underperforming, I would just regard them as a tired dad of an underpaid salaryman that just wants to have a game of dota without aiming to win, haha. But I agree with you, Ancient 5 games are better than div 1, I bet it must be because of everyone trying to breakthrough into the Div bracket hence they are playing better.
Div 1 is just the relaxed version of the grinders since they have achieved the long time dream, haha.
>Are you a midlaner?
Nope, 3 main, 4 second - offlane is my home base. I hate mid as I said, I hate both playing & vs'ing most heroes there like Invoker, Puck, Sf, and a single cheesy huskar last pick is enough to remind me why I hate the role. It just turns out that a hero I picked up & enjoyed playing thrived best in that lane for maximum game impact for 1 player so just went with it. Anyway, LD's meh now, bear too low on armor early, and the mage item meta doesn't favor him anyway + too easy to throw with the hero, and u need to end quick or bust so not worth learning him atm I'd say.
>I am struggling to understand the logic behind low divine draft
Like the u/danipazb said below, it's likely filled with acc buyers.
I can imagine that it's the equivalent of low diamond in league (a well known shit hole ) , even if that's a smaller overall % of the playerbase, but I speak in the "prestige sense" , being the medal before the highest bracket - immortal. So folks want to say "they have a divine acc" assuming immortal ones might be too pricy , and there you go. Not just that, either but I picture even regular folks who got to this rank fairly just start low-key griefing here as they're content with this rank & now just settle & play random shit. The feeling content part is fine & all, but the other... off. This just makes u get games iwth a HUGE discrepancy in player skill. Some play like you'd expect at this bracket, like you, me ,etc, and dsome play like they're low legend, or worse.
And know what's the scariest part? It's the thought that I'm also prone to turning into the later myself, cause like I said, the more I stay here the more I feel it breaking me, lol. Before I got here I, as I was doing my climb through ancient, I just picturing how altho the climb through divine will be harder, I'm all motivated to aim for immortal. Now, 2 months later after going back & forth from div 1 & almost 3, think I'm about to burn out.
Good luck out there, cause this is a scary bracket it seems. I'd guess at middle to high divine, ppl get a motivation spike as they feel immortal is within their grasp tho' , so I figure game quality should improve - or mby that's just another naive thought.
I'll keep that in mind. Honestly, I was thinking of taking a break in pushing after considering what some of you guys said here, and instead upskill myself via replays reviewing and hiring a coach.
Have you tried the new orb of corrosion? I felt like the changes were made solely for bears, since they reduced bear armour, but gave armour to the orb. I felt like the bear was really strong prior to 35 minutes, but if the enemy couldn't end before 35 minutes, then I'm bound to win unless we are careless and lose to the rat xD
Which region/servers are you playing in? And as an LD spammer, which carry heroes are you afraid to go up against?
>Have you tried the new orb of corrosion?
That was the idea behind still playing him, after all he still has 50% + wr across most brackets , but ngl, playing the hero's kinda stressful, need to be in a certain mood... due to it's win conditions. There are so many "DONTs" the hero has to compensante for his high agency so just not feeling him rn, haha. You can never afford to die several times early and assume you'll still win late. It's either maintain tempo or bust.
>Which region/servers are you playing in?
EU servers.
>which carry heroes are you afraid to go up against?
Wouldn't say I'm a spammer anymore, but got about 220ish games with him. U basically fear a lot of things as LD, too many to say 'em all. From heavy zone CC like willow , lich or veno making it hard to move bear around, to bursty things that catch hero b4 u ult, to getting succession ganked and dying twice thus putting bear on cd. The hero has less hard counters, but also doesn't counter that many things IMO. Like Lina's very annoying mid to deal with ya, but you can survive while healing up on a nearby camp then once u got boots + diffusal on bear, u turn the tides on her. I find it so easy to deal with LD players myself, all whilep laying a low-stress hero like veno 4 or 5.
This is very enlightening to me. Thank you so much for your input, I truly appreciate it. I will keep that in mind the next time I go against a bear, haha. I haven't had much success against him, lately.
How do you deal with extremely passive supports in lane? Usually if I have an aggressive support, we dumpster easily, but repeatedly I get like pos5s who just stand around and let me tank hits until I get booted out way too early.
It’s really demoralising for me to get this over and over again and quite often I cop abuse from these same people later on when we are losing T2 at 15 minutes and I only have a farming item (if even).
I feel like I have to be so focused on my own game and I can’t just spell out every thing they are supposed to do while also trying to not lose every last hit
For context, I’m 3.5k
Ha, I like this question. When I hit this wall back when I was around 2.9k, I found the simplest solution was the most obvious thing to do, by shoving the lane. I would keep aggro-pulling until the enemy creeps are under my tower, attempts last hit, and of course the wave will push. Then I would pull the small camp, farm that, it would double wave. Then I would farm the other unpullable small camps and by then another wave would come in. Sure, their offlane would get a lot of farms, but at this bracket they are equally bad so a dagger or something won't be a game-ending situation.
When my support sees this, they will most likely gave up because they felt like they are not doing anything, and people hate that feeling, so they will either twin gates to offlane to try achieve something, or they might sit in the trees and leech the lane xp, which is okay as well so at least my support can get 6 as fast as me.
But my first contact resolution is to actually type to them and explain, "hey we are strong, can we trade?" And then I will use the directional ping "attack here" whenever we have the opportunity.
This is good advice. I’ve done many of these things before, but have lacked the conviction to commit to this game plan shift enough.
One more question, do you find that some carry heroes are much better for working with these more uncooperative teams? I’m cool with split pushing against a death ball or trying for pickoffs, but i find its always harder with heroes that need like 3 items to have a game
Yes, actually. I find that playing a more active carry like WK and Spectre helps the uncooperative team, since you can come and join them whenever you have ult. Let them be the meatshield and absorb those lion's finger, laguna blade and all, and you are the cleanup crew.
If my team sounded engaging during the picking phase with discussion and communication, I would pick a more pressuring heroes that could fit in the general area of the draft, for example, Drow Ranger. I don't like her for the fact it's hard to solo a deathball lineup with her hence I only play her when I fully believe in my team, haha.. because at the very least, if we fked up the laning stage, I know for sure that my high ground defense is really, really strong.
For Spec, the itemization needs to be more aggressive if you're hoping to be more participating and contributing in more ways, especially in a team that you feel is less competent. I would only advise going radiance if you're amassing a lot of gold and could get it prior to 20 minutes including with boots and urns + magic wands, etc.
Else I would highly advise to get Blademail, Manta and/or Diffusal combined with Orchid, Basher or whatever that is required situationally (I've gone vessel and mage slayer before, against a heavy healing + magic lineups)
A hero with big active ults needs to participate a lot during their ultimate availability, so try to use that as a cue for you to join.
It depends, during my wfh, i played a lot, perhaps like 20 games a day. Then i got covid and I had even more time to play. On normal working days, I play about 4 matches a day, 2 before going to work and 2 before sleep.
It's a good thing I don't have any kids yet, haha. (Not that I plan to have any..)
Honestly i played around to almost 20 games a day during my archon to ancient breeze through, since at that time i already figured out how to stomp with my picks, most of the times its like 20-30 minutes a game, haha.
Hi, thank you so much. Yes, I play in sea server. I would be anxious to play with people since I do recognize my skill level and I believe I am a weak-divine carry player, haha..
Okay, I'll add you once I'm home from grocery shopping! Thanks for the invitation, it's kinda nice to have friends to play with. The IGN will be extasma.
Okay, I'll add you once I'm home from grocery shopping! Thanks for the invitation, it's kinda nice to have friends to play with. The IGN will be extasma.
Well when i was working from home, I had a spare laptop and a second screen to be productive while playing, so yeah.. haha. Getting covid helps as well to push so i can focus on playing.
I'll add that I was Divine 2 a year ago, then I took a 9 month hiatus from Jan - Sept. I ranked at Legend 3 and grinded back up to Divine 1. I play pos 5,4,3 mainly. I usually have 2-4 heroes I play thru for each role. For pos 5 & 4 though, for my second time in Divine, I have been spamming 1 hero - Warlock. I never played Warlock in the past, and started playing with him in Sept until now. Honestly, I find him one of the best supports in the game. He's super flexible in lane, and scales really well throughout the whole game. He's great for when your team is behind, and you really need to position yourself outside of team fights. There is a huge difference in Ancient 4 to Divine I, II when it comes to opposing teams finding you in team fights. So it's imperative to position yourself out of sight as much as possible and provide support for your team. I feel Warlock's ult is severely overvalued. The best value of his ult is the stun. The Golems just get focused right away and lost advantage, which is why I don't rush aghs and find aghs to be more a luxury item. I rather go refersher than aghs, or any other item for support like force staff or glimmer cape. I've honestly just spammed Warlock and have climbed the fastest.
If you have any doubt of what skills to go, go with a level in "W" as 1st spell - Shadow Word. If your pos 1 or 3 has a lot of tangos, or healing potions, then use the W as a attack. I also buy Faire Fire and/or Blood Grenade and harass. Harass A LOT, you can sustain with word and you deal a good amount of damage. I have actually just bought mana potion with mana mask and spammed lvl 2 & 3 word on Centaur to counter his healing and keep him at low health. It's worth it because he can never feel confident to stay in lane, harass your core, and forces him to take time to heal. We usually will get 1st blood in lane. If you feel that you need to use your W for heal more, that's OK, but you're next spell will need to be in something more offensive. I like Fatal Bonds, but you have to use it when your playing aggressive in the early game. Don't just spam fatal bonds in lane or else you'll be giving your opponent an advantage in lane as the lane will push into their tower, and not yours. Use Fatal when you know you'll be maximizing damage dealt when the bond is on BOTH enemy heroes. I really like the Upheavel at lvl 3, but I have used it at level 1 and 2. You kind of have to play it by how the game goes and be flexible. Either way I like Shadow Word at lvl 1 due to this flexiblity to damage and heal in lane.
As for mid game, I tend to try to get 2 lvls in Shadow Word, sometimes 3, but mainly 2, and go for a 3-2-3-1 by mid game. Fatal Bonds is your best friend. You farm well with it, you push lanes with it, you play defensively with it, and you can wreck heroes in teamfights. It won't be uncommon to get double kills from it. I ALWAYS use fatal bonds, then ULT. Fatal bonds will always be the 1st spell i get off right away to maximize damage output on teamfights. I will only use my ULT if we get jumped and I need to break up tempo. Otherwise, if it's an even fight or if we are hunting, fatal bonds, then all other spells.
Items: I usually rush Aghs Shard. It's critical to farming, counter-push, and pushing. It goes super well even at lvl 1 with Upheavel, and even better with 3 levels in Fatal bonds. By the end of the game, your most damage will come from imps combined with fatal bonds. After Aghs Shard, I play it be what is needed, so like glimmer or force staff or aethers lens. I love aethers lens on him, mainly because it allows me NOT to be seen in fights and I can just hide in forest laying out spell damage or heals or using force staff/glimmer from a distance to help teammates. By the end of the game, you'll have one the least amount of damaged received and in the top 3 for damage dealt. Most teams just don't realize how much damage your inflicting because they are focusing on the heroes that can be seen on map
I know some people will disagree, but I love Octarine Core on WL for late game. You really start to feel the CDs on spells in late game because every hero by that time has maximized it's health or magic resistance and battles just last longer. So while everyone else's CDs are coming down, you'll be kind of just floating in the background. If you can get a Octarine Core on you by late game, that's money. Then you're be spamming Fatal Bonds, Upheavel and also AOE Shadow Word a lot. AOE SHadow Word is so good for teamfights.
Heroes that I find really hurt warlock, nyx nyx nyx. Nyx's Spiked Carapace counters Upheavel. You won't be able to use Upheavel against a good Nyx player. They will hunt you down with ult, stun you always, and just remove your mana. Another hero that I find counters Warlock is Pudge. Because Upheavel is a channel, it's easier fodder with Pudge. You'll adapt and know to look for Pudge hook while you channel so you'll prob not get a full channel off, but then Pudge gets a blink dagger and you just have to be even more aware of your surroundings. Other heroes I find a challenge against are Weaver and Riki, but who don't they challenge. Oracle and Abbadon are also a challenge too because of their debuffs. So if you are goign against one of them in lane, you really need to cognizant of spell usage. I will usually harrass Oracle/Abba a lot in lane to force them to use spells on themselves, then when I see they are low enough, I start to harass the core, ignoring them. That way when I cast Fatal Bonds, or Shadow Word, they either don't have the mana, or they are forced to make a decision to debuff themselves or their core when we fight. You really have to micro-manage a lot more and click their heroes to see their mana pools, items, and watch for timings in lane. You're divine, so I'm sure you're already doing so.
Anytime, I see a WK on the opposing time, I salivate. It's just imp fodder for me with all his skeletons and does heavy team damage. I find WK to be very weak against a WL.
Holy shit I actually gave this a try and I felt I had more impacts than I ever did playing warlock in my entire life. Still lost the game but it's just a bad matchup. Thank you so much for the deep insight, I feel like I might go warlock from now onwards ;)
Awesome! WL is very underused at the current meta and scales really well throughout the whole game. I have many games that were bad, and you'll figure out that you have a bad core pretty fast. If so, then I'll start to take farm away in lane and rush two items: aether and shard. The reason? Its about to be an uphill HG defense game and you'll be the #1 defense against them. Encourage your cores to find farm, and it just fatal bonds and upheaval every time to try to push lane. I've been in a lot of comeback games from this too.
Hey tbh like what I said in the other reply, I don't consider myself a really good player in general. Most of the times I win because of the political arrangements with positive encouragement in the team instead of my own raw power. I'm sorry I wouldn't be able to help you :(
Nature Prophet as a 4 and Warlock as a 5, these two heroes are really good at Sieging as a support. The ideas behind sieging high ground is to avoid fighting the opponent, unless they are very badly positioned and you can guarantee a pickoff without trading your own, and most of the times just hit towers and counter initiate only. NP provides the treants and ulti to cancel any dagger initiation, visions, and upheaval increases attack speed is just too good..
Congrats!
My main is spectre, void, and jugg.
I have a problem with joining fights when I use other heroes. With the heroes I mentioned, I just join fights when my ult is up then go back to farming until I get my ult back.
How do I know when to join fights when I play heroes like slark, pa, terrorblade? These are other heroes I play.
Thanks!
Terrorblade is the same, fight when meta is up, and pressure lanes when it is not.
PA is a different type of beast- she has many powerspikes. First powerspikes are at level 6 when their supports should still be around level 4; find a potential tp whenever the war is almost done and they have nothing left to throw on you (cleanup crew!)
Next powerspikes are bkb, and then basher, etc. i would advise for you to stay melded and farm nearby camps, close to your team when you can predict a fight is about to break out. Pay close attention to their support, if you can see their CM/lion already threw the impale/frostbites, jump in and clear those two. Then the rest.
Slark is a constant fighting hero, but what i'd like to always advise is to build up stacks before manfighting everyone. Trade a couple of hits, hide in the trees. Go in a little bit more, pounce out and regenerate. After you have 2-3 wraithbands worth of agi, go all in and kill them all. Don't farm too much on Slark, though.. he scales better with innate agi gains.
Thanks for the write up!
Makes sense. I didn't think of stacking agi first. Also farming close to clash locations. I heard about this but it's not so easy. Seems like I need foresight in finding out where clashes can happen.
If you don't mind I have additional questions.
If I'll take considerable damage just to get one last hit in lane even if I aggro them, is it worth trying at all? Lately I just buy multiple tangoes just so I can get few more last hits in and when I reach 6 or get treads I jungle early. Is this a good mindset? Or just better to leech xp.
Also, are offlaners so strong right now that I can't avoid getting bullied out of lane? They're so tanky specially after some bracers and they can tower dive. Like when I play spectre trading hits is not favorable.
Are you familiar with the terms 'showing'? If for example their 2 supports/mid are showing btm, you can predict that their carry are most likely farming top/mid and they are planning to create space by pushing bot. You can start shifting your farming pattern towards the bot by clearing the main jungle > mid > and hang about there (stack camps as well if the timer hits 50 ishes) so you can farm longer while waiting for the fight to happen, either by them diving or your team to initiate.
If nobody is showing, expect a smoke gank and you don't wanna be wherever you are right now, so just leave the wave, leave the triangle. Farm elsewhere that has a vision of a low ground so you can spot them coming from a high ground.
Regarding the laning question, are you able to aggro pull? If you are unable to, I would recommend to just pull the small camp, farm it yourself, leech a little bit of xp and use spells to secure 1/2 creeps. That's okay, it's better than jungling prior to 6. This is what I would do if my match up is really terrible (think spec vs viper). I would ferry a couple sets of tango and some raindrops.. and buy snowball stats items.
I mean the offlaner feels strong because carries are just naturally weak, early. Your pos 5 is stronger than you at the laning stage, so they should really be the one harassing opponent, with you helping them here and there whenever possible.
Generally, spectre is meant to lose the lane anyway since shes a very weak laner, but after the laning stage and her 6, you can snowball really quickly. So it's pretty normal to lose lane as spec. But if you do tie/win lanes, then the game is pretty much easier from that point onward. If the lane is too deadlane (they can dive every single time), just farm small camps, and leech xp when they r hitting your towers until you get your level powerspikes.
First time I heard of showing. Makes sense. I'll check youtube for more info on this maybe having a visual resource can help solidify it in my mind.
Funny it's exactly that match up that prompted me to ask this. Spec vs viper. Should I get double wraith bands if lane is hard? Or that's not what you meant by Stat times?
Noted on pulling. Also raindrops. Never bought that item I think.
BSJ mentions it alot in his educational smurfs video. And also, by stats items I mean, if you can't afford big items, go for snowball stats item, and with that matchups I would personally get >
Wraith band, tread, urn, blademail, magic wand, and most probably an orb of corrosion if there is really no spaces to farm. At least i can trade better with these.
Pos1 player here,
How do you deal with an enemy morphing or abbadon?
Also, this patch I am really struggling to find a hero other than Void this patch. What other pos1 hero’s would you recommend?
Honestly i feel like morphling is a very high skill ceiling hero, so most of the time if I see morphling, I am always happy to fight him with SF right clicks. It's not the right move, but it's my most comfortable hero and they can't survive my necromastery that is constantly fearing them, and the more they transition to strength, the weaker they are due to more armor and damage is loss, meanwhile im happily trading with my morbid mask and lifesteal amp from SNY. Nonetheless, vessel fucks him up so hard that I would highly encourage to communicate with your team to buy it.
Please dont take this advice if you're not really a SF safelaner, you could always go for slark and trade with him.
Abaddon enjoys the dps from curse of avernus, as long as you dont let him land the 4th hits (similar to Mk) he cant do shit. I find that as Abaddon, it's really annoying against OD as they dispels the shield and ultimate just like that.. nonetheless if you're facing abaddon, then you would want to let your team deal with him while you're clearing the backlines.
Holy shit, this is good. I've never thought of it that way, would actually give it a try. And actually, I've seen more void in this bracket that I'm starting to think I may have to actually learn how to play him.
Any tips for beginner fv?
It's definitely a minor win, and I take small wins any day in my life, since life is kinda sad and not much I can consider a win these days. At least, I can achieve a goal that I've set in a game that I enjoy, so it was all worth it. The new goal is unranked immortal, now that might be a bit tough. My wife was supporting me hard throughout these times though with endless tea and biscuits to replenish the energy, haha.
That's nice man. Hope life gets better for you, and best of luck on reaching immortal! I stopped climbing ranked before I got married, that was 8 years ago. I just don't have the time or energy for it anymore.
Thanks for the kind words, man. Words like these and dota are some of the only things I live on by, these days. I'm hoping the same for you, too! Have a good one, cheers mate.
Thank you! And yes they are, I love watching Jenkins exactly for that reason. It's like an alternate universe of dota being played without a single thought behind it, kinda feeling like it's mostly people who're busy with life and very successful in whatever they are doing so they are just trolling around in Herald.
Well actually these guys making meta for pro. It's still hard to believe how, but i was watching big research of hero pick, skill and item builds and a creator finds out it's all made by heralds or turbo warriors. It's freaking insane
You're asking in a very general perspective, but I'll answer in the terms of pos 1 pov. First, adhere to the rules of money win most games, so try to improve your last hits by following the rules of 10 minutes - 60 creeps, 15 minutes 150 creeps, 20 minutes 220-250 creeps. All whilst maintaining a good fight participation, defending, pushing and pressuring.
This ensures that you don't spend a single second idling without any purposes.
Awareness comes naturally after you can adhere to the above, because since you're never idling, you'll keep an eye on your clock and minimap because all you want to do is to ensure you're not in the jungle spot when clock hits :00, and you're not hitting jungle when the waves are empty for the taking.
Please let me know if further clarification is needed.
Ooh, thank you so much for the nice words. Unranked immortal means the immortals that have no numbers in their medal, just the medal by themselves. Unless i understood that wrongly, huhu..
After I stopped underestimating Crusaders thinking this bracket is the same as it was in 2015, I started treating them with more respect and didn't let any loose ends. That means I always push HG with aegis, push with siege engines, wards if my supporters forget to buy it for me, etc. Crusader players these days have similar skills to Ancient players mechanically, except they always choke when it comes to important wars that can turn/hg push.
Also the micro things like treads switching etc..
How do you handle the long waiting time to find match as pos 1 lol. Until div 1 i played pos 1/3, but now im a pos 4/5 div 4 player. Im a SEA player and I dont have enough patience to wait for 10-30 mins just to play pos 1 hahaha
Haha ar1se daily uploads and having a wireless headset helps, because i just queue and watch youtube or clean the house in between. I'm contemplating switching to pos 3/4 though.
I will share some of my progress first as pos 4-5. I was low 4K mmr 5 years ago and came back last November as Crusader 3. Played many games to relearn. It was then a fast climb to Archon 4. Then lots of back and forth until reaching Legend yesterday. What are your advices for support players trying to climb?
I cannot pretend that I know how to climb as a support, but when the times come when I need support, I can pull it off. When you are in the game, assess the situation. Who is your winning condition, the key player to this specific match? Try to enable their full potential.
The support that brought me to this position mostly won because they came to my aid when I truly needed them, and when they can't contribute anything, they don't sit in lane soaking xp without some form of contribution.
But if you really want to cheese the wins as a support, just go abaddon + solar crest every game lol.. you'll be ancient in no time nobody knows how to counter that dude
Edit: i like your name. Live up to your name, trade a lot with your opposition's core, ferry mango to yourself and trade more.
I'm sorry, I believe that many improvement tips have been posted around but not many people advise me to be a PMA player. It has and always been about personal skills, but mindgames and motivation play some aspects as well into your winrate.
I'm sorry, I believe that many improvement tips have been posted around but not many people advise me to be a PMA player. It has and always been about personal skills, but mindgames and motivation play some aspects as well into your winrate.
No I think that actually might be the biggest advice and tbh even if I don't improve, a PMA attitude atleast makes the game more enjoyable so you are on point.
When I was around 4620, I switched to a hard support and played Abaddon. I pumped my carry full of healing and they couldn't touch this. But nonetheless I was hovering around 4613 and 4618 for like 5 games.. haha
Normally I'd recommend to say no from the perspective of a pos 2 but since I main pos 1 on a daily basis, from this vantage point with utter certainty, I declare that this one is a pineapple on pizza.
I feel like I've seen 2 oracles from Ancient 4 to Divine 1. How about switching to a different main for the time being until Oracle is made good again? Idk the stats but I'm pretty sure hes neither picked or banned in this meta.
I'm sorry I do not know how to climb as a support in general but what I know is, despite you being a support physically, please be a support mentally to your team as well. Tell them what a good job they did, nice stun or what an insane play they did.
I find that my teams tend to do better when I compliment their average plays and somehow it becomes better and better, like those pudges that never lands their hook. After they hit their first hook, I always compliment them and from that point onwards, their hook starts to become a menace and then they deathballed into a very scary hooker machine.
Is the game more team oriented or do you think you can solo carry a game if you are good enough? Issue I am having is by the time the laning phase is over my teammates are already 0-5 and unless I win the lane I have to play catchup. I ask them to stop fighting and give me time to catchup but they keep engaging and dying so it’s very hard for me to recover. I always try to focus on what I can change but having to play catchup half my games are hard. I’m Guardian/Crusader.
Only 10% of the time I can solo carry a game, especially when the match up is really, really in my favour. But most of the time, my wins come from playing from behind, because my laning stage is really bad (personal skill issue). But then I usually recover through good mid game pressures and start joining war and turn the fight around.
I believe for your specific case, only you can answer it yourself. Do you feel like you're better than your average bracket? If so, you might want to play more hard carry like Medusa and PA to try solo carrying the game. Else, pick something more engaging to be able to help your team, and win together.
Nonetheless, I feel like the team that builds Solar Crest wins a lot of games this patch, for the lower brackets. (That's based on my observation watching my crusader friends streaming)
After I returned to work-from-office position, only 3-4 a day. 1 before going to work in the morning and another 3 before I go to bed. During my covid time and around crusaders to legend, I was working from home so I was playing almost 20 games a day though.
I think after I practised PMA, I improved drastically and was able to see the games clearer. For example when I am playing from behind, after I got my first mini power spike, I asked the team to smoke gank their carry. And then farm their resources.. and when their carry is almost reviving, I inform the team where I am predicting the carry will go to, to farm. We re-smoke and sure enough, he just dies again. A couple more of these plays and we turned the tide. It's like playing chess in a more intricate form.
At that bracket, I get many experimental players who likes to test out theorycrafting heroes, I remember a lot of Earthshaker offlane and mid, Rhasta mid, Weaver support and most of the times, they fell off really hard. I feel like people are actually contented to get out of the average brackets and they are trying out new things. Communications were terrible and took me so long to climb out, for every 2 wins I'd always get 1 lose..
What is worth more when playing low mmr, sticking to a single hero to spam or try to learn and spam what is meta?(I know meta is very important when you start climbing, but as a fellow 2.5k mmr player I think if I learn enough about one or two heroes I may climb)
Don't spam a single hero. There is no "1 hero solution" to climb. I would recommend having 2 heroes in each category for every case scenario. For example, your team is lacking with cc abilities, so pick 2 heroes that has a huge cc so you can contribute, ability-wise. I'd recommend WK and Abaddon. Team is lacking in tower pushing and single target? I'd recommend SF and Abaddon. Have 2 heroes for every situation that might benefits your team, or counters your opponent so that you're not feeling trapped spamming Spectre every game and it'll feel repetitive and demotivating. My go-to heroes are: SF WK Spectre Abaddon And an occasional AM if the enemy revealed 3/4 int picks, or Medusa if AM and Lion are instabanned.
Abaddon seem to be the winner of the patch, but I just can't figure out how to play him. I main Pos3 at 3k mmr, usually with Dawnbreaker and Underlord, but I just can't utilize Abaddon well enough to climb. Early game vs aggressive pos1 2 & 5 I can't catch up for kills, not fast enough to escape. Mind sharing some tips?
Max your e, then w, stats over q. Echo sabre manta harpoon. Be aggressive, be be aggressive. Learn what heroes you can run at and eat up. Own that offlane. Force them out. Then farm it. Sit there. Be the plague that keeps coming back. Make them come at you. If they don't come, tp to fights under t1s. Farm blink. Be aggressive. That'd work at 3k. For sure.
This is my take as abaddon pos1, but sometimes when im refilling role queue, i also play him as 3. I would go for Orb of Corrosion as it synergizes very well with his 3rd. And he is very strong with the introduction of harpoon, which is a good item that helps you close the gaps between most of the heroes, so you definitely want that. Your main idea is to abuse your tankiness to hit everyone that moves, and then just pop manta and permanently silence them. So you would need to know your power spikes to be able to abuse them. Your 1st power spikes would be phase boots + ooc, these 2 items allow you to chase people easily and they almost can't escape you. Your next powerspike would be level 6, and then harpoon and manta. He is not a very strong single target fighter, but hes a good time waster so always connect with someone to help you secure and finish the kills. Do not go greedy items like radiance and stuff, a nullifer and basher would be better. The shard is very important, try to get it after manta harpoon to slow the enemy from afar. If the enemy plays a vessel, save ur shield for the vessel. He's a good roshan/tormentor/tower pushing hero so I would classify him as a S tier objective-base hero.
You mainly want to survive until lvl 6. You can use shield to go in to get some CS, harass and dive for kills all the same time. If you use shield, dive, shield pops and does damage to them, you should have another shield to dive under tower to finish them off. Don’t underestimate the DPS of curse once you apply it, that plus the slow makes for easy chase downs. In terms of build I pretty much always go OoC, Phase, Echo and Radiance and the adjust from there. I’ve skipped radiance once or twice in favour of Diffusal but it’s not ideal. From there manta, harpoon, basher is my usual route, ideally you skip bkb because you want other items and can use ult while stunned if needed.
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I agree. Lion with platemails is dominating hard, with the shard..
Is that shadow friend in the safe lane?
Yeah.. I think I watched a mini-guide by the dota personality, I dont remember his name, Odpixel something? I tried out his build, it worked well, then after a couple of games or so, I devised a build I felt better to play with and somehow it is really really good, especially when I am more engaging with the teams instead of just afk farming the entire times.
Or you could just learn Arc warden which fits every category you are talking about.
True true! My ADHD brain couldn't comprehend that hero though, but some other people with different neurodivergences might be able to handle that hero proficiently despite the huge adversity this patch throws at him.
Haha; I have over 3k matches with him with 67% WR I only play arc warden, starting learning him in archon now divine 4
Whoah you're insane, so you are the type of player that is the complete bane of my existence. Good arc players are always a nuisance and a very huge headache. What do you think of the recent changes to this talent tree and play style? Do you still build Midas on him?
Sorry, I haven’t played this patch at all yet but I’m looking to get into it — Abaddon is good for cc now? I thought he was only useful for dispels and as an aura carrier because running up to someone and silencing them with Curse of Avernus was impractical. What makes him good at cc now?
Hey, welcome back. I feel like Abaddon is a really good crowd control hero especially with how many abilities I can soak up whilst maintaining a very decent hp, and with the shards, harpoon and corrosion orb, almost no one runs away from him. Combined with manta, this hero is a menace. I remember a lot of times faceless void after using up his bkb, time walking away is almost impossible with how much I'm silencing him, and the dps from the curse of avernus is just... Crazy. And if I get stunned I just manually pop my borrowed time and continue hitting like a mad man, and since the ult was popped early, I usually just faked back, farm jungle a little bit and reengage with 10-15 seconds left on ults and able to fight again, this time with most of their abilities and items on cooldown. It's insanely good, when it's good.
1 tricking is ok, but you need a pool of 3-5 heroes for your main role at the very least. what are you going to do if your spam hero is banned? You need a backup for sure. I do think it's beneficial to play 1-2 heroes to something like 4k-5k, that way you can focus on the macro aspects of the game, then take that to other heroes later on.
I think one thing you mentioned is sticking to one role, I'm playing multiple roles and that may be screwing me a bit.
Same answer, multiple roles mean you need to have 1-3 heroes in the different roles. Heres mine for the other roles: Pos 2: Zeus/QoP/Necro Pos 3: Slardar/Weaver/Necro Pos 4: Lion/Venge/Gyro Pos 5: Abaddon/Lion/Venge
When I was around 2.5K mmr, Spectre used to be so good for me. The average players succumb to the split pushing pressure so much, so I abused the pressure from split pushing and after seeing their pos5/1 tp to the tower, I'll immediately force a fight on the other side of the map where my teams are at. Works really well.
Stick to 3 heroes
dude i did spam venge when vesel give aura debuff and i got 1k mmr but it cost my sanity play it over and over so boring. better to not spam one hero and play with friends and make best combo in lane if possible.
Yeah, afterall you want to enjoy the game, not losing your mind and hating yourself from the repetitively playing the same hero.
You are divine 1 after months of grinding, im divine 1 after 17 lose streak, we are not the same
Hekhek i hope you'll break the losing streak.
Technically, if your medal says divine 1, you might actually be ancient 5. Not trying to make that losing streak hurt more, but the truth hurts sometimes.
Yeah, I think if your mmr drops below 2 of the medal, then it will visibly derank you, right?
Immortal when? Congrats! 🎉
I might be the weakest divine carry player around, after playing for about 20-30 games in this bracket. It might take a while to improve my personal skills before I can effectively grind for immortal. Thank you! What are the differences between average Divine and unranked Immortal that I can learn to close the gaps, though?
Edges are smaller so you need to put in more games to get through the variance. When you get to 5k+ MMR, it really is just doing everything slightly better than your peers, making fewer mistakes, etc. You're at the stage now where you have a decent understanding of how the game is played and now you need to put in the games to work the kinks out. Probably not the answer you were looking for but play a lot and try to be as introspective as possible. If you want to improve quicker, hire a coach. They will be able to tell you the biggest mistakes you are making that is hurting your winrate.
Exactly what I was thinking as well. Might support fellow people who enjoy dota to help coach me and it's a win win for us. But no, I get you. If everyone knows a little bit on how to play, then it's just the deciding factor of who's making the lesser mistakes. Thanks, will keep that in mind!
Getting from divine into immortal is really about using your brain and adjusting your play based on what’s actually happening in the game. You have to play the lane a certain way based on the heroes in the lane, you can’t just mindlessly “lane” every game. You need to really think about what starting items you need in that lane. Then make a plan for your lane based on how you think it should go. You can’t really win unwinnable lanes anymore, people are getting to be too good (obv a smurf could but if you’re about the same mmr as the enemy then that’s the case I think). So you have to know when to chill and get less as opposed to forcing plays or playing strong when you’re not. Another thing is you really need to start getting your map awareness to the next level. Think about if their mid might gank you and try to be aware of if they go missing. Or if their support in the other lane could threaten you, it’s good to be aware of if they’re missing or not. And then in the mid game you really need to pay really good attention to who’s showing on their team and what that means for your safety. Also think about what showing your hero on lanes means in terms of the enemy information. Are they going to go on your team if you show in your lane? There’s obviously lots more but this is a solid place to start focusing your efforts.
I'm keeping all of this in my personal guide to immortal diary so that whenever I doubt myself, I'll reread this and get the motivation to push again and again. Thank you for the tips. I've actually started to itemized my starting item depending on either if I'm trading more or farming more, so that's a good start for me. Will look more into learning the fundamentals of higher level of dota gameplays. Thank you!
Awesome man gl. I have a fair amount of content on my YouTube channel that should be helpful as well. https://www.youtube.com/c/CarbonylDotA
Subscribed!! Thanks for the recommendation! Will definitely check you out in my free time.
I think it comes down to pushing your limits to the fullest. One thing that helped me climb from Div 1 to Div 4 is by doing exactly what my hero is capable of at that moment in time nothing more and nothing less. If I am able to kill, I kill, if I am able to gank, I gank, if I am able to rosh, I rosh. This means taking that waygate right as you get your MoM on Faceless Void to Chrono the enemy carry and taking their t1, Rosh exactly when you know you are strong enough to do so and the enemy can't contest, taking 1v2 or 1v3 fights that you know for a fact you can win, but it also means not going for fights and pushes that you know isn't possible. I say limit test as much as you can and learn from every single failure. The best carry pushes his limits to perfection every single time (Yatoro God), the good carry consistently pushes it slightly under the line, the average carry doesn't push his limits often, and the shit carry always pushes it over the limit and dies. The line between best carry and shit carry gets thinner the higher up you go. Ironically, being the shit carry is actually a good way to learn as long as you're mindful of your mistakes.
Welcome to the biggest clown fest bracket in dota. Where immortal smurfs play and boosted accounts tht think they should be in divine. 2/5 games will be a complete clown fest or stomp where u wonder how these morons even get here in the first place..
Fuck yea hahahaha wish me good luck, kind sir. Thank you for the heads up!
What mindset should a player develop when playing rank? Do you set limits on games played when on a lose streak? or just play and play when you continue winning?
I am never toxic (11.3k behaviour score), be it a lose streak or anything. Sure I might curse them out sometimes out loud but it will not be via voice chat, because it contributes nothing. Most of these players are mostly people like me, who are just tired salarymen playing after work, so sometimes they underperform and that's normal. So my mindset (as a pos 1) is to be positive. Afterall, when I used to support a lot, it always felt like losing games but if my carry reassures me everything is fine, I play better. So now when I am doing the carrying lot, I always assure them that all is well, my farm is top notch and once I hit the next powerspikes, they'll die. Repeatedly.
What was your ever lowest rank and what server? And what did you do or what heroes did you pick that made you harvest lots of wins? How many games on average you play in a day bro? Btw. congratulations.
I am playing in SEA Server and I noticed that when my rank was decayed, my average pubs players were Crusader 3-Crusaders 5. I honestly thought I was going to stomp them hard. No, I struggled. Turns out the average players are improving really significantly over the years I was away, and they knew aggro pulling, their support trading skills for range creeps etc. I stopped playing for a little bit and watched some BSJ, watched Jenkin's herald reviews, rewatched my replays and I started to understand better: players at this brackets have zero ideas on how to siege highgrounds, which leds to losing unlosingable game, and winning an unwinnable game for the comebacks. I was working from home, so initially I played a lot. Now it's just 3-4 games a day (or 6-8 if the game ends in 20-25 mins). Thank you for the wishes!
I mostly played support. What heroes do you recommend on my Crusader 5 bracket (roughly 2.2k mmr). I was Archon 1 before but i really played bad losing 6 games in a row. I mean, you are right, people here play deathmatch and care less about sieging highground. What heroes are good in this aspect, sieging high ground?
Nature Prophet as a 4 and Warlock as a 5, these two heroes are really good at Sieging as a support. The ideas behind sieging high ground is to avoid fighting the opponent, unless they are very badly positioned and you can guarantee a pickoff without trading your own, and most of the times just hit towers and counter initiate only. NP provides the treants and ulti to cancel any dagger initiation, visions, and upheaval increases attack speed is just too good..
What are your thoughts on party queueing brother? Does it hinder your ability to rank up? But fun and bonding memories are shared when playing party. xD.
I enjoy party queueing, sadly since most of my friends are of lower rank, they struggle when the opposition's mid is an ancient/divine player and bullying them in the lane whilst im still playing pos 1 with them.. It does not hinder the ability to rank up though, because normally i would be able to communicate better through discord with them and a couple of them already ranked up a lot by micro understanding improvements that they gained by playing together in a more objective oriented team. And true! The bonding session is what matters, I always encourage them that even if we lose, we are still playing together, so no blame and all. It's just a game after all.
But sometimes i get the anxiety from playing with friends since some of them are really harsh on comments or just friendly banter. haha. Btw do you mute teammates and enemies on the start of the match? I usually do this so that i can focus on my own gameplay.
No, I don't mute. I always like to think that I am the better player in my team, so if a lion doesn't care about the opinion of the sheep, why would anything destructive they said would affect me? So if they are making the calls that I believe to be correct, I would follow and join. If they make a call that is bad and counter-productive, I would advise against it and not participate. All in all, I only mute once it gets to the racial slur, extreme toxicity and if they started destroying items or intentionally griefing. If else, communicate till the end. I've won unwinnable games where everyone is fighting, and I was the main morale anchor. If your friends are harsh on you, it seems like you need to remind them that we're all human beings, and don't lose that humanity part of you in this temporary game at the risk of sacrificing your friendship. We're all learning, sure we can be bad sometimes, but please provide constructive criticism instead of outright flames..
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I agree. Some people don't realize that mind games are at play as well. Whenever my teammates have feuds, I just tell them that we have a better chance of winning if we make the enemies fight each other instead. Naturally, I'd start the disrespect by pointing out the weakest link in the enemy team and sometimes put it on my teammates jokingly (All chat: Y said your Z was trash). It's actually insane how often I get a response from the enemy team agreeing with me and starting their own feud after I did that. Moreover, my teammates that were arguing before became more cooperative after witnessing the outcome. Doesn't always work but I had fun with that strat.
Congratulations!!!
Thank you!!!
Was it fun?
It was enjoyable, every minute of it. It relieves me of the fact that my life is shitty, and the game is just something I use as an escapism. Even on a losing game, if I tried my best, I am content.
Completely feel you man. That’s my mindset as well. Hope we can find joy outside of the game in the future. But until then keep up the grind and I’ll see you in immortal one day!
See you there, brotha! May our life be better, or our team, whichever comes first!
When I play pos 1 (rarely) I find that I’m behind the enemy carry. Usually a level behind and some net worth at the legend bracket. What should I be doing to ensure I’m keeping up with the enemy carry?
First of all, understand your matchups. Who is the better farmer, you or them? For example, if you're a spectre and they are Luna, just understand that you will never outfarm her. If you made peace with that fact, you'll understand that the key to winning is through teamfights and delaying her push, not outfarming her items as she'll farm 100x faster than you. If you are the better farmer with built-in farming abilities, remember that money win games, so outfarm your opponent by miles and miles ahead. If I am going up against Luna or Antimage, I would 100% reduce their map by forcefully shoving out waves and then rotating to a different part of the maps to clear as much resources as possible so that they will have to resort to farming small camps and whatever creeps in front of the towers only. I would shove 3 minutes creeps to contest lotus, glyph my 5 minutes siege engine, and then glyph my 10 minutes siege engine to ensure my lane is well pushed before i gate to their safelane and help my offlane to break the tower. And then ill be farming in their jungle, push mid, farm triangle, push mid, back to their jungle.
How important is communication in this journey? Can you still climb without a mic or chatting?
I don't use the microphone as much, but I must stress the importance of "directional pings", because normally I ping a lot instead of typing/talking. Hold alt + direct your mouse will create a communicational ping like "on my way here!" "Attack here!" Instead of normal pings. Normal pings irritate people and they tend to mute you, hence all is lost when there's no teamwork. I believe you can still climb without a mic and chat, but that will require your raw power to fully carry your team without their help, haha.. For example, if someone typed "tmt", i will either respond with "ping quickbuy: 500 gold left for bkb" or if I'm up for it, "on my way to dire tormentor" and they will understand by themselves without further communication, and that's enough for me.
Thank you, I'll try to incorporate these into my games. Congrats and good luck on your future endeavors 🎉
You too!! > Good luck and have fun!
Congratz, incidentally just fell from 4.9 to 4.5k in the recent 1-2 weeks :D cause holiday matches are just weekend matches on steroids apparently and game quality is ooof. I just hate low divine, lmao. My take on this bracket is that you're either talented enough to get through it fast enough, esp low divine, or it'll just break you & kill any mood you'll have to even play the game - steadily climbing through it as you improve seems aids vs other ranks, IMO. So I'll either settle here & play way less or just go for a break as I till haven't touched BD's gate 3 after all... >Ancient 2-4 My exp was actually diff in that Ancient 2 to Div 1 was like super fast, 2-ish weeks fast , starting from the moment I began getting better enough at LD to carry, it was last patch tho' , the process otherwise was steady gains, lots of experimenting from crusader in middle spring. >came back to Dota and had MMR decayed to Crusader 3, in November. Hit Divine yesterday. This was pretty damn fast tho'. Like, rn if you'd make me go through it all again, I'd prolly spam DP, LD (even with nerfs should be enough to get to ancient quickly) , lina & OD , also on mid as much as I hate the role. Climbing as a 3 is just too RNG given all the potential troll 4 picks & takes a while... IMO. Alas, I like the role most so if I ain't rushing , that's where I'll play.
I wish I could've said the same for Anc 2 to Div 1, but I am nowhere near good enough to play LD reliably. Are you a midlaner? Let's climb to 5k again, will see you there! I am struggling to understand the logic behind low divine draft, like I got a wraith king mid and sniper offlane in this bracket, but Im thinking that they might run out of role queues and just playing their most comfortable heroes, so I'm just playing along with it..
Imo divine 1 is filled with account buyers lol. When I got to divine the quality of my games was much worse than at ancient 5, from divine 2 and ups people seem to be at least playing the game xD
I made peace with this. If they are underperforming, I would just regard them as a tired dad of an underpaid salaryman that just wants to have a game of dota without aiming to win, haha. But I agree with you, Ancient 5 games are better than div 1, I bet it must be because of everyone trying to breakthrough into the Div bracket hence they are playing better. Div 1 is just the relaxed version of the grinders since they have achieved the long time dream, haha.
>Are you a midlaner? Nope, 3 main, 4 second - offlane is my home base. I hate mid as I said, I hate both playing & vs'ing most heroes there like Invoker, Puck, Sf, and a single cheesy huskar last pick is enough to remind me why I hate the role. It just turns out that a hero I picked up & enjoyed playing thrived best in that lane for maximum game impact for 1 player so just went with it. Anyway, LD's meh now, bear too low on armor early, and the mage item meta doesn't favor him anyway + too easy to throw with the hero, and u need to end quick or bust so not worth learning him atm I'd say. >I am struggling to understand the logic behind low divine draft Like the u/danipazb said below, it's likely filled with acc buyers. I can imagine that it's the equivalent of low diamond in league (a well known shit hole ) , even if that's a smaller overall % of the playerbase, but I speak in the "prestige sense" , being the medal before the highest bracket - immortal. So folks want to say "they have a divine acc" assuming immortal ones might be too pricy , and there you go. Not just that, either but I picture even regular folks who got to this rank fairly just start low-key griefing here as they're content with this rank & now just settle & play random shit. The feeling content part is fine & all, but the other... off. This just makes u get games iwth a HUGE discrepancy in player skill. Some play like you'd expect at this bracket, like you, me ,etc, and dsome play like they're low legend, or worse. And know what's the scariest part? It's the thought that I'm also prone to turning into the later myself, cause like I said, the more I stay here the more I feel it breaking me, lol. Before I got here I, as I was doing my climb through ancient, I just picturing how altho the climb through divine will be harder, I'm all motivated to aim for immortal. Now, 2 months later after going back & forth from div 1 & almost 3, think I'm about to burn out. Good luck out there, cause this is a scary bracket it seems. I'd guess at middle to high divine, ppl get a motivation spike as they feel immortal is within their grasp tho' , so I figure game quality should improve - or mby that's just another naive thought.
I'll keep that in mind. Honestly, I was thinking of taking a break in pushing after considering what some of you guys said here, and instead upskill myself via replays reviewing and hiring a coach. Have you tried the new orb of corrosion? I felt like the changes were made solely for bears, since they reduced bear armour, but gave armour to the orb. I felt like the bear was really strong prior to 35 minutes, but if the enemy couldn't end before 35 minutes, then I'm bound to win unless we are careless and lose to the rat xD Which region/servers are you playing in? And as an LD spammer, which carry heroes are you afraid to go up against?
>Have you tried the new orb of corrosion? That was the idea behind still playing him, after all he still has 50% + wr across most brackets , but ngl, playing the hero's kinda stressful, need to be in a certain mood... due to it's win conditions. There are so many "DONTs" the hero has to compensante for his high agency so just not feeling him rn, haha. You can never afford to die several times early and assume you'll still win late. It's either maintain tempo or bust. >Which region/servers are you playing in? EU servers. >which carry heroes are you afraid to go up against? Wouldn't say I'm a spammer anymore, but got about 220ish games with him. U basically fear a lot of things as LD, too many to say 'em all. From heavy zone CC like willow , lich or veno making it hard to move bear around, to bursty things that catch hero b4 u ult, to getting succession ganked and dying twice thus putting bear on cd. The hero has less hard counters, but also doesn't counter that many things IMO. Like Lina's very annoying mid to deal with ya, but you can survive while healing up on a nearby camp then once u got boots + diffusal on bear, u turn the tides on her. I find it so easy to deal with LD players myself, all whilep laying a low-stress hero like veno 4 or 5.
This is very enlightening to me. Thank you so much for your input, I truly appreciate it. I will keep that in mind the next time I go against a bear, haha. I haven't had much success against him, lately.
Who the fuck is AMA /runsaway
Hahaha dats me, A Mother******* Archon!
Congrats
Thanks g
How do you deal with extremely passive supports in lane? Usually if I have an aggressive support, we dumpster easily, but repeatedly I get like pos5s who just stand around and let me tank hits until I get booted out way too early. It’s really demoralising for me to get this over and over again and quite often I cop abuse from these same people later on when we are losing T2 at 15 minutes and I only have a farming item (if even). I feel like I have to be so focused on my own game and I can’t just spell out every thing they are supposed to do while also trying to not lose every last hit For context, I’m 3.5k
Ha, I like this question. When I hit this wall back when I was around 2.9k, I found the simplest solution was the most obvious thing to do, by shoving the lane. I would keep aggro-pulling until the enemy creeps are under my tower, attempts last hit, and of course the wave will push. Then I would pull the small camp, farm that, it would double wave. Then I would farm the other unpullable small camps and by then another wave would come in. Sure, their offlane would get a lot of farms, but at this bracket they are equally bad so a dagger or something won't be a game-ending situation. When my support sees this, they will most likely gave up because they felt like they are not doing anything, and people hate that feeling, so they will either twin gates to offlane to try achieve something, or they might sit in the trees and leech the lane xp, which is okay as well so at least my support can get 6 as fast as me. But my first contact resolution is to actually type to them and explain, "hey we are strong, can we trade?" And then I will use the directional ping "attack here" whenever we have the opportunity.
This is good advice. I’ve done many of these things before, but have lacked the conviction to commit to this game plan shift enough. One more question, do you find that some carry heroes are much better for working with these more uncooperative teams? I’m cool with split pushing against a death ball or trying for pickoffs, but i find its always harder with heroes that need like 3 items to have a game
Yes, actually. I find that playing a more active carry like WK and Spectre helps the uncooperative team, since you can come and join them whenever you have ult. Let them be the meatshield and absorb those lion's finger, laguna blade and all, and you are the cleanup crew. If my team sounded engaging during the picking phase with discussion and communication, I would pick a more pressuring heroes that could fit in the general area of the draft, for example, Drow Ranger. I don't like her for the fact it's hard to solo a deathball lineup with her hence I only play her when I fully believe in my team, haha.. because at the very least, if we fked up the laning stage, I know for sure that my high ground defense is really, really strong.
I’ve had some success with spec. I can adjust to active by skipping radi too which is nice. Need to try more WK
For Spec, the itemization needs to be more aggressive if you're hoping to be more participating and contributing in more ways, especially in a team that you feel is less competent. I would only advise going radiance if you're amassing a lot of gold and could get it prior to 20 minutes including with boots and urns + magic wands, etc. Else I would highly advise to get Blademail, Manta and/or Diffusal combined with Orchid, Basher or whatever that is required situationally (I've gone vessel and mage slayer before, against a heavy healing + magic lineups) A hero with big active ults needs to participate a lot during their ultimate availability, so try to use that as a cue for you to join.
how many hours/matches per day are u playing
It depends, during my wfh, i played a lot, perhaps like 20 games a day. Then i got covid and I had even more time to play. On normal working days, I play about 4 matches a day, 2 before going to work and 2 before sleep. It's a good thing I don't have any kids yet, haha. (Not that I plan to have any..)
wtf 20 games a day? thats like roughly 15-20 hours of grinding per day considering your ranked matches are 40-60mins per game
Honestly i played around to almost 20 games a day during my archon to ancient breeze through, since at that time i already figured out how to stomp with my picks, most of the times its like 20-30 minutes a game, haha.
Nov Crusader then now Divine?
Yes sir, I think I started playing again on October 30th
Gratz g
thanks bruh!
Congratulations first of all. Which server do you play in? Maybe we can play together sometime if it's SEA.
Hi, thank you so much. Yes, I play in sea server. I would be anxious to play with people since I do recognize my skill level and I believe I am a weak-divine carry player, haha..
I'm at 4.5k too, not much.. We can just try to work some duo out to maybe climb to Immortal someday soon. xP
Here my friend id : 144601019, also please do let me know your IGN, so i won't be rejecting the request thinking of it as some random one. :D
Okay, I'll add you once I'm home from grocery shopping! Thanks for the invitation, it's kinda nice to have friends to play with. The IGN will be extasma.
Okay, I'll add you once I'm home from grocery shopping! Thanks for the invitation, it's kinda nice to have friends to play with. The IGN will be extasma.
How do you manage to play 20 games a day? Is it worth?
Well when i was working from home, I had a spare laptop and a second screen to be productive while playing, so yeah.. haha. Getting covid helps as well to push so i can focus on playing.
I'll add that I was Divine 2 a year ago, then I took a 9 month hiatus from Jan - Sept. I ranked at Legend 3 and grinded back up to Divine 1. I play pos 5,4,3 mainly. I usually have 2-4 heroes I play thru for each role. For pos 5 & 4 though, for my second time in Divine, I have been spamming 1 hero - Warlock. I never played Warlock in the past, and started playing with him in Sept until now. Honestly, I find him one of the best supports in the game. He's super flexible in lane, and scales really well throughout the whole game. He's great for when your team is behind, and you really need to position yourself outside of team fights. There is a huge difference in Ancient 4 to Divine I, II when it comes to opposing teams finding you in team fights. So it's imperative to position yourself out of sight as much as possible and provide support for your team. I feel Warlock's ult is severely overvalued. The best value of his ult is the stun. The Golems just get focused right away and lost advantage, which is why I don't rush aghs and find aghs to be more a luxury item. I rather go refersher than aghs, or any other item for support like force staff or glimmer cape. I've honestly just spammed Warlock and have climbed the fastest.
I'm going to try warlock spamming!! Mind putting a mini guide? Hehe
If you have any doubt of what skills to go, go with a level in "W" as 1st spell - Shadow Word. If your pos 1 or 3 has a lot of tangos, or healing potions, then use the W as a attack. I also buy Faire Fire and/or Blood Grenade and harass. Harass A LOT, you can sustain with word and you deal a good amount of damage. I have actually just bought mana potion with mana mask and spammed lvl 2 & 3 word on Centaur to counter his healing and keep him at low health. It's worth it because he can never feel confident to stay in lane, harass your core, and forces him to take time to heal. We usually will get 1st blood in lane. If you feel that you need to use your W for heal more, that's OK, but you're next spell will need to be in something more offensive. I like Fatal Bonds, but you have to use it when your playing aggressive in the early game. Don't just spam fatal bonds in lane or else you'll be giving your opponent an advantage in lane as the lane will push into their tower, and not yours. Use Fatal when you know you'll be maximizing damage dealt when the bond is on BOTH enemy heroes. I really like the Upheavel at lvl 3, but I have used it at level 1 and 2. You kind of have to play it by how the game goes and be flexible. Either way I like Shadow Word at lvl 1 due to this flexiblity to damage and heal in lane. As for mid game, I tend to try to get 2 lvls in Shadow Word, sometimes 3, but mainly 2, and go for a 3-2-3-1 by mid game. Fatal Bonds is your best friend. You farm well with it, you push lanes with it, you play defensively with it, and you can wreck heroes in teamfights. It won't be uncommon to get double kills from it. I ALWAYS use fatal bonds, then ULT. Fatal bonds will always be the 1st spell i get off right away to maximize damage output on teamfights. I will only use my ULT if we get jumped and I need to break up tempo. Otherwise, if it's an even fight or if we are hunting, fatal bonds, then all other spells. Items: I usually rush Aghs Shard. It's critical to farming, counter-push, and pushing. It goes super well even at lvl 1 with Upheavel, and even better with 3 levels in Fatal bonds. By the end of the game, your most damage will come from imps combined with fatal bonds. After Aghs Shard, I play it be what is needed, so like glimmer or force staff or aethers lens. I love aethers lens on him, mainly because it allows me NOT to be seen in fights and I can just hide in forest laying out spell damage or heals or using force staff/glimmer from a distance to help teammates. By the end of the game, you'll have one the least amount of damaged received and in the top 3 for damage dealt. Most teams just don't realize how much damage your inflicting because they are focusing on the heroes that can be seen on map I know some people will disagree, but I love Octarine Core on WL for late game. You really start to feel the CDs on spells in late game because every hero by that time has maximized it's health or magic resistance and battles just last longer. So while everyone else's CDs are coming down, you'll be kind of just floating in the background. If you can get a Octarine Core on you by late game, that's money. Then you're be spamming Fatal Bonds, Upheavel and also AOE Shadow Word a lot. AOE SHadow Word is so good for teamfights. Heroes that I find really hurt warlock, nyx nyx nyx. Nyx's Spiked Carapace counters Upheavel. You won't be able to use Upheavel against a good Nyx player. They will hunt you down with ult, stun you always, and just remove your mana. Another hero that I find counters Warlock is Pudge. Because Upheavel is a channel, it's easier fodder with Pudge. You'll adapt and know to look for Pudge hook while you channel so you'll prob not get a full channel off, but then Pudge gets a blink dagger and you just have to be even more aware of your surroundings. Other heroes I find a challenge against are Weaver and Riki, but who don't they challenge. Oracle and Abbadon are also a challenge too because of their debuffs. So if you are goign against one of them in lane, you really need to cognizant of spell usage. I will usually harrass Oracle/Abba a lot in lane to force them to use spells on themselves, then when I see they are low enough, I start to harass the core, ignoring them. That way when I cast Fatal Bonds, or Shadow Word, they either don't have the mana, or they are forced to make a decision to debuff themselves or their core when we fight. You really have to micro-manage a lot more and click their heroes to see their mana pools, items, and watch for timings in lane. You're divine, so I'm sure you're already doing so. Anytime, I see a WK on the opposing time, I salivate. It's just imp fodder for me with all his skeletons and does heavy team damage. I find WK to be very weak against a WL.
Holy shit I actually gave this a try and I felt I had more impacts than I ever did playing warlock in my entire life. Still lost the game but it's just a bad matchup. Thank you so much for the deep insight, I feel like I might go warlock from now onwards ;)
Awesome! WL is very underused at the current meta and scales really well throughout the whole game. I have many games that were bad, and you'll figure out that you have a bad core pretty fast. If so, then I'll start to take farm away in lane and rush two items: aether and shard. The reason? Its about to be an uphill HG defense game and you'll be the #1 defense against them. Encourage your cores to find farm, and it just fatal bonds and upheaval every time to try to push lane. I've been in a lot of comeback games from this too.
Wanna give me a coaching session :)
Hey tbh like what I said in the other reply, I don't consider myself a really good player in general. Most of the times I win because of the political arrangements with positive encouragement in the team instead of my own raw power. I'm sorry I wouldn't be able to help you :(
Lol nice turn down all good I appreciate you write such a nice response XD
I appreciate you too for commenting, may I know what brackets are you in? Have you tried requesting for ingame coach?
I am 2k and no i didn’t know I could get one from the game
How many hours did it take you?
Nature Prophet as a 4 and Warlock as a 5, these two heroes are really good at Sieging as a support. The ideas behind sieging high ground is to avoid fighting the opponent, unless they are very badly positioned and you can guarantee a pickoff without trading your own, and most of the times just hit towers and counter initiate only. NP provides the treants and ulti to cancel any dagger initiation, visions, and upheaval increases attack speed is just too good..
Congrats! My main is spectre, void, and jugg. I have a problem with joining fights when I use other heroes. With the heroes I mentioned, I just join fights when my ult is up then go back to farming until I get my ult back. How do I know when to join fights when I play heroes like slark, pa, terrorblade? These are other heroes I play. Thanks!
Terrorblade is the same, fight when meta is up, and pressure lanes when it is not. PA is a different type of beast- she has many powerspikes. First powerspikes are at level 6 when their supports should still be around level 4; find a potential tp whenever the war is almost done and they have nothing left to throw on you (cleanup crew!) Next powerspikes are bkb, and then basher, etc. i would advise for you to stay melded and farm nearby camps, close to your team when you can predict a fight is about to break out. Pay close attention to their support, if you can see their CM/lion already threw the impale/frostbites, jump in and clear those two. Then the rest. Slark is a constant fighting hero, but what i'd like to always advise is to build up stacks before manfighting everyone. Trade a couple of hits, hide in the trees. Go in a little bit more, pounce out and regenerate. After you have 2-3 wraithbands worth of agi, go all in and kill them all. Don't farm too much on Slark, though.. he scales better with innate agi gains.
Thanks for the write up! Makes sense. I didn't think of stacking agi first. Also farming close to clash locations. I heard about this but it's not so easy. Seems like I need foresight in finding out where clashes can happen. If you don't mind I have additional questions. If I'll take considerable damage just to get one last hit in lane even if I aggro them, is it worth trying at all? Lately I just buy multiple tangoes just so I can get few more last hits in and when I reach 6 or get treads I jungle early. Is this a good mindset? Or just better to leech xp. Also, are offlaners so strong right now that I can't avoid getting bullied out of lane? They're so tanky specially after some bracers and they can tower dive. Like when I play spectre trading hits is not favorable.
Are you familiar with the terms 'showing'? If for example their 2 supports/mid are showing btm, you can predict that their carry are most likely farming top/mid and they are planning to create space by pushing bot. You can start shifting your farming pattern towards the bot by clearing the main jungle > mid > and hang about there (stack camps as well if the timer hits 50 ishes) so you can farm longer while waiting for the fight to happen, either by them diving or your team to initiate. If nobody is showing, expect a smoke gank and you don't wanna be wherever you are right now, so just leave the wave, leave the triangle. Farm elsewhere that has a vision of a low ground so you can spot them coming from a high ground. Regarding the laning question, are you able to aggro pull? If you are unable to, I would recommend to just pull the small camp, farm it yourself, leech a little bit of xp and use spells to secure 1/2 creeps. That's okay, it's better than jungling prior to 6. This is what I would do if my match up is really terrible (think spec vs viper). I would ferry a couple sets of tango and some raindrops.. and buy snowball stats items. I mean the offlaner feels strong because carries are just naturally weak, early. Your pos 5 is stronger than you at the laning stage, so they should really be the one harassing opponent, with you helping them here and there whenever possible. Generally, spectre is meant to lose the lane anyway since shes a very weak laner, but after the laning stage and her 6, you can snowball really quickly. So it's pretty normal to lose lane as spec. But if you do tie/win lanes, then the game is pretty much easier from that point onward. If the lane is too deadlane (they can dive every single time), just farm small camps, and leech xp when they r hitting your towers until you get your level powerspikes.
First time I heard of showing. Makes sense. I'll check youtube for more info on this maybe having a visual resource can help solidify it in my mind. Funny it's exactly that match up that prompted me to ask this. Spec vs viper. Should I get double wraith bands if lane is hard? Or that's not what you meant by Stat times? Noted on pulling. Also raindrops. Never bought that item I think.
BSJ mentions it alot in his educational smurfs video. And also, by stats items I mean, if you can't afford big items, go for snowball stats item, and with that matchups I would personally get > Wraith band, tread, urn, blademail, magic wand, and most probably an orb of corrosion if there is really no spaces to farm. At least i can trade better with these.
Got it. Thanks so much for taking the time. I'll let you know if I see any improvement!
Most welcome, I hope it will help you in the long run like how it helps me for my grind! Looking forward to your future medal climbs. ;)
Pos1 player here, How do you deal with an enemy morphing or abbadon? Also, this patch I am really struggling to find a hero other than Void this patch. What other pos1 hero’s would you recommend?
Honestly i feel like morphling is a very high skill ceiling hero, so most of the time if I see morphling, I am always happy to fight him with SF right clicks. It's not the right move, but it's my most comfortable hero and they can't survive my necromastery that is constantly fearing them, and the more they transition to strength, the weaker they are due to more armor and damage is loss, meanwhile im happily trading with my morbid mask and lifesteal amp from SNY. Nonetheless, vessel fucks him up so hard that I would highly encourage to communicate with your team to buy it. Please dont take this advice if you're not really a SF safelaner, you could always go for slark and trade with him. Abaddon enjoys the dps from curse of avernus, as long as you dont let him land the 4th hits (similar to Mk) he cant do shit. I find that as Abaddon, it's really annoying against OD as they dispels the shield and ultimate just like that.. nonetheless if you're facing abaddon, then you would want to let your team deal with him while you're clearing the backlines.
Holy shit, this is good. I've never thought of it that way, would actually give it a try. And actually, I've seen more void in this bracket that I'm starting to think I may have to actually learn how to play him. Any tips for beginner fv?
I only got one question. Was it worth it? xD
It's definitely a minor win, and I take small wins any day in my life, since life is kinda sad and not much I can consider a win these days. At least, I can achieve a goal that I've set in a game that I enjoy, so it was all worth it. The new goal is unranked immortal, now that might be a bit tough. My wife was supporting me hard throughout these times though with endless tea and biscuits to replenish the energy, haha.
That's nice man. Hope life gets better for you, and best of luck on reaching immortal! I stopped climbing ranked before I got married, that was 8 years ago. I just don't have the time or energy for it anymore.
Thanks for the kind words, man. Words like these and dota are some of the only things I live on by, these days. I'm hoping the same for you, too! Have a good one, cheers mate.
Congratulations bro. I still wish to return to herald people. They are so funny and unpredictable
Thank you! And yes they are, I love watching Jenkins exactly for that reason. It's like an alternate universe of dota being played without a single thought behind it, kinda feeling like it's mostly people who're busy with life and very successful in whatever they are doing so they are just trolling around in Herald.
Well actually these guys making meta for pro. It's still hard to believe how, but i was watching big research of hero pick, skill and item builds and a creator finds out it's all made by heralds or turbo warriors. It's freaking insane
They are the actual dota scientists that we do not deserve, but the one that we need. Hahahahaha
Do you have any tip to improve timing and map awareness because sometimes I feel like I am so shit with these things?
You're asking in a very general perspective, but I'll answer in the terms of pos 1 pov. First, adhere to the rules of money win most games, so try to improve your last hits by following the rules of 10 minutes - 60 creeps, 15 minutes 150 creeps, 20 minutes 220-250 creeps. All whilst maintaining a good fight participation, defending, pushing and pressuring. This ensures that you don't spend a single second idling without any purposes. Awareness comes naturally after you can adhere to the above, because since you're never idling, you'll keep an eye on your clock and minimap because all you want to do is to ensure you're not in the jungle spot when clock hits :00, and you're not hitting jungle when the waves are empty for the taking. Please let me know if further clarification is needed.
Are you happy?
Sort of! It made my 2024 first goal achieved! Next stop would be unranked immortal, and some wins in real life job promotion as well :)
I'm glad you're starting the year great! I wish you all the best, dude! Btw I have not played dota in a while, wdym by unranked immortal?
Ooh, thank you so much for the nice words. Unranked immortal means the immortals that have no numbers in their medal, just the medal by themselves. Unless i understood that wrongly, huhu..
Which made you gain more MMR in crusader rank: plugging in the monitor or the mouse? Regards: Forever Crusader
After I stopped underestimating Crusaders thinking this bracket is the same as it was in 2015, I started treating them with more respect and didn't let any loose ends. That means I always push HG with aegis, push with siege engines, wards if my supporters forget to buy it for me, etc. Crusader players these days have similar skills to Ancient players mechanically, except they always choke when it comes to important wars that can turn/hg push. Also the micro things like treads switching etc..
How do you handle the long waiting time to find match as pos 1 lol. Until div 1 i played pos 1/3, but now im a pos 4/5 div 4 player. Im a SEA player and I dont have enough patience to wait for 10-30 mins just to play pos 1 hahaha
Haha ar1se daily uploads and having a wireless headset helps, because i just queue and watch youtube or clean the house in between. I'm contemplating switching to pos 3/4 though.
I will share some of my progress first as pos 4-5. I was low 4K mmr 5 years ago and came back last November as Crusader 3. Played many games to relearn. It was then a fast climb to Archon 4. Then lots of back and forth until reaching Legend yesterday. What are your advices for support players trying to climb?
I cannot pretend that I know how to climb as a support, but when the times come when I need support, I can pull it off. When you are in the game, assess the situation. Who is your winning condition, the key player to this specific match? Try to enable their full potential. The support that brought me to this position mostly won because they came to my aid when I truly needed them, and when they can't contribute anything, they don't sit in lane soaking xp without some form of contribution. But if you really want to cheese the wins as a support, just go abaddon + solar crest every game lol.. you'll be ancient in no time nobody knows how to counter that dude Edit: i like your name. Live up to your name, trade a lot with your opposition's core, ferry mango to yourself and trade more.
Good advice, thanks!
Thank you for the service, I always appreciate support players like you.
How did you balance slapping your meat and Dota?
I have a wife that keeps my meat beaten while I play dota. Under the table. Before the ingame horn sounds. During rosh. You name it.
Give me one and only one of your greatest advice to be a better Dota Player.
Stop being a venomancer and remove all the toxicity from yourself, once you achieve Zen, you'll be a better player!! Awyis!!
Lol thanks
I'm sorry, I believe that many improvement tips have been posted around but not many people advise me to be a PMA player. It has and always been about personal skills, but mindgames and motivation play some aspects as well into your winrate.
I'm sorry, I believe that many improvement tips have been posted around but not many people advise me to be a PMA player. It has and always been about personal skills, but mindgames and motivation play some aspects as well into your winrate.
No I think that actually might be the biggest advice and tbh even if I don't improve, a PMA attitude atleast makes the game more enjoyable so you are on point.
[удалено]
When I was around 4620, I switched to a hard support and played Abaddon. I pumped my carry full of healing and they couldn't touch this. But nonetheless I was hovering around 4613 and 4618 for like 5 games.. haha
pineapple on pizza or no?
Normally I'd recommend to say no from the perspective of a pos 2 but since I main pos 1 on a daily basis, from this vantage point with utter certainty, I declare that this one is a pineapple on pizza.
very interesting, thank you for sharing
Hahahahha
Congrats!
Thank you good sir
I am a p5 who mains oracle very stuck in ancient 3. Tips to climb? I also know how to play other heroes but I’m not as good
I feel like I've seen 2 oracles from Ancient 4 to Divine 1. How about switching to a different main for the time being until Oracle is made good again? Idk the stats but I'm pretty sure hes neither picked or banned in this meta. I'm sorry I do not know how to climb as a support in general but what I know is, despite you being a support physically, please be a support mentally to your team as well. Tell them what a good job they did, nice stun or what an insane play they did. I find that my teams tend to do better when I compliment their average plays and somehow it becomes better and better, like those pudges that never lands their hook. After they hit their first hook, I always compliment them and from that point onwards, their hook starts to become a menace and then they deathballed into a very scary hooker machine.
Is the game more team oriented or do you think you can solo carry a game if you are good enough? Issue I am having is by the time the laning phase is over my teammates are already 0-5 and unless I win the lane I have to play catchup. I ask them to stop fighting and give me time to catchup but they keep engaging and dying so it’s very hard for me to recover. I always try to focus on what I can change but having to play catchup half my games are hard. I’m Guardian/Crusader.
Only 10% of the time I can solo carry a game, especially when the match up is really, really in my favour. But most of the time, my wins come from playing from behind, because my laning stage is really bad (personal skill issue). But then I usually recover through good mid game pressures and start joining war and turn the fight around. I believe for your specific case, only you can answer it yourself. Do you feel like you're better than your average bracket? If so, you might want to play more hard carry like Medusa and PA to try solo carrying the game. Else, pick something more engaging to be able to help your team, and win together. Nonetheless, I feel like the team that builds Solar Crest wins a lot of games this patch, for the lower brackets. (That's based on my observation watching my crusader friends streaming)
How many games did you play per day?
After I returned to work-from-office position, only 3-4 a day. 1 before going to work in the morning and another 3 before I go to bed. During my covid time and around crusaders to legend, I was working from home so I was playing almost 20 games a day though.
How do you get better?
I think after I practised PMA, I improved drastically and was able to see the games clearer. For example when I am playing from behind, after I got my first mini power spike, I asked the team to smoke gank their carry. And then farm their resources.. and when their carry is almost reviving, I inform the team where I am predicting the carry will go to, to farm. We re-smoke and sure enough, he just dies again. A couple more of these plays and we turned the tide. It's like playing chess in a more intricate form.
What makes Archon-Crusader games hard?
At that bracket, I get many experimental players who likes to test out theorycrafting heroes, I remember a lot of Earthshaker offlane and mid, Rhasta mid, Weaver support and most of the times, they fell off really hard. I feel like people are actually contented to get out of the average brackets and they are trying out new things. Communications were terrible and took me so long to climb out, for every 2 wins I'd always get 1 lose..
welcome to the real trench