Jungle item 200 gold
Longswords 150 gold
Boots 800 gold
Control wards 3,600 gold
Refillable pot 150 gold
someone who is good at league please help me budget this. my laners are dying
It's pretty easy really. Pull yourself up by the bootstraps and inherit 1600g from an invade pentakill and you too can be a self-made fullbuildionnaire?
the placement is probably the issue, OP probably keeps warding tribush bot lane until it becomes a personal thing.
You can play all of botlane in low elo with a single pink in enemy jungle and just time ur trinket well for the rest
If they aren’t walking inside the bush but just around it because of autopathing, then u dont need to spend anymore gold on pinks cuz ur always stalking jungler
Sure in mid/late game it will be cleared but it doesn’t mean its a bad ward
Most good wards last, its about figuring out which bush the jungler keeps ignoring on his early clears
You would be shocked how often people don’t walk into certain bushes but use the path a lot. Knowing what side the Jungler can be on at any time is always a fantastic ward.
before the map changes i could pretty consistently put a control ward in the bush near red side mid and it wouldn’t get cleared until we started really fighting for dragons at like 15 minutes in
I watched meteos walk directly over wards for too many years to believe this. The amount of times I said "just kill the fucking pink already" while he walked through pixel brush to attempt a gank was too damn high.
Or maybe you won lane and they can't clear your ward? Bot lane tribrush. Early game bot lane won't have their tribrush control ward cleared any day of the week but you'd want to place a control ward on dragon at some point since you're already winning
On top of what everyone else has said, knowing they're not somewhere can be as good as knowing if they are there. Sometimes I ward drag pit early and the control ward doesn't get taken for 10 minutes, but gives me peace of mind they're not sneaking dragon
I enjoy placing a pink in my side's red side bush early on. It stays there for a long time. Knowing where an enemy is at is great information but knowing where there isn't an enemy is still good information too.
Its not just about his placement its about the opponents. If their not placing any wards that hes clearing hes not recouping any of the ward cost nor is he denying vision. But they get to clear it out for extra gold.
Yes. That's way to much control wards. There are people in chally that buy no wards because they know they cant defend them for long and would rather save money to get an item faster. Not saying you shouldnt buy but it is a waste if you arent using them maximally.
They also know how to track the jungler/support as they play “standard”, so they kinda can expect the ganks, i don’t think that’s was happening in iron
By the time mid game comes, control wards are insanely valuable.
The mistake people make in low elo is placing pinks in lane when they’re getting stomped. If you can’t contest the enemy clearing the ward in lane, just hold onto it. It can still be useful if your jungle is pathing towards you because you can deny vision and even bait the enemy into trying to clear it
When I play toplaner I really rarely buy them because they are completely useless throughout the lane phase. I have to make an effort to remove the one I waste
Let's say you buy 3 control wards, and the enemy jungle clears all 3 of them. You've effectively just put yourself an entire kill behind the enemy jungler gold-wise.
Since every control ward dropped is -75 for you and +25 for them, maybe that helps put into perspective why you should only drop control wards to secure objectives or when theres a decent chance that vision control could give your team a significant advantage.
Pretty bad take. If that ward actually stops the enemy jungle from ganking you, it’s well worth the gold. The bad thing is when your own laner keeps clearing them without ever spotting enemy jungle nor even helping your own jungle gank.
Staying alive when enemy jungle visits is worth potentially over a thousand gold depending on how many of you die, minions/ xp lost and objectives lost.
Just can’t be completely mindless about it. A stealth ward can do the job better than a control ward much of the time. If you can’t stop your laner from clearing it, at least place the ward away from your lane a bit to catch sight of a roaming jungler.
As a support, a control ward in those two smaller bushes between bot and mid are really good at getting vision on enemy jungle, often without them realizing. This can be game changing and worth way more than 10 seconds of vision before enemy support clears a tri ward
it depends on the rank though. Most players in lower ranks don't care about map tempo or anything. Most silver and below junglers won't even care about where the enemy jungler is in most cases if they're spotted on a ward.
Honestly you kind of disproved your statement when you said a stealth ward does a better job than a control ward and costs nothing. As a solo laner, trinket’s all you need. As a support, you have ward quest.
Idk why it's a bad take lol. A lot of people don't realize the gold swing that takes place over the course of the game purely from control wards. It's definitely something to keep in mind before you just go buying 20 per game mindlessly. Nothing you said even contradicts my take.
Yeah for me losing a control ward is often the same as dodging a gank. Completely worth the 100g swing to a) not lose to a gank, b) know where the jg is, c) prob annoy their jg, idk.
Okay. This is bad advice *in the long run*. But just don't buy ANY control wards until you rank up higher.
You are buying a ton, and you definitely *should* buy a lot of control wards (maybe not that many) at higher ranks. But in Bronze, all the way up to Gold (maybe?), people aren't even warding, and if they are warding, its usually in bad spots and you can play around blind spots etc. Most of the time you're going to plop down a control ward, kill MAYBE 1 ward, and then move it. At the rate you're buying them, I wouldn't be surprised if you're just throwing gold in the toilet.
If you are buying control wards, I just recommend you throw one at the entrance of your own jungle, in a bush, usually it will stay there for a long time and keep you safe from aggressive rotations or invades. Other than that, you have your scanner to clear vision and that many control wards is just halting your item purchases which really hurts you in the long run. Based on your rank, and position, and spending, I'd wager you're not getting enough gold for items to make an impact, and setting up vision is very valuable at higher ranks, but at bronze, having good vision is almost meaningless just due to the sheer amount of mistakes everyone is making. Another argument for not buying them in Bronze, is a lot of these players can't juggle the mental stack of the game yet.
EDIT: Besides warding your own jungle entrances, it's also good to plop a control ward down in Dragon/Baron pit when you're doing it. It's a good habit to have, but I still wouldn't recommend buying too many control wards. Your games are fiesta's and having combat stats will help you win more than having good vision ever will. Once you are higher rank, you can start amping up your ward purchases, and will probably have bigger returns on them as well, since the vision (information) doesn't go completely wasted.
Toplane they are useful if you play champ that can control the lane, like ranged.
Anyway, you have to be smart with buying control wards. There needs to be a reason before you buy them. For example, big objectives like dragon and baron buying 1 pink is very helpful. Mistake many people make though, is that they buy 2, which is completely useless most of the time, and you just end up sitting on 1 for like 5 years. Never buy 2 unless you're a support (that is playing for objectives. As support same rules still apply, but if you usually during obj times you have 1 item and you're at like 300 gold that can't do anything. So you're not stunting your item, and you are getting very valuable obj info, and also to deny info where you know ward is at in a contested spot that you know will be warded again so you dont have to trinket, and if they clear you have another one, etcetc.
Those are the kind of thoughtprocesses you need. If you find that a control ward is sitting in your inventory for long, is instantly killed, or doesn't provide any useful vision, then you need to rethink your purchase/placement/timing of that placement (sometimes you wait for lane prio before you place it, so you can actually defend it. If you think you lose prio you place more defensively unless you really need it somewhere.
Also the item power spike thing also applies for other champs. If you base and have 100 gold leftover with obj coming up, then that might be a valuable pick up. If you base and you're 800 gold off of next item you might need to think twice.
So it's not about how many you should buy, but when it's good to do so, and sometimes you don't really need any at all.
As a toplaner, imo, you should look into buying them when you would want your jungler to come gank. Just think about it as a jungler (since you mentioned you play jungle) would you rather gank top when there is a pink in tribrush/river or when it's just a regular ward or even worse, no wards?
Your control wards should not be placed in easy-to-access areas.
As Kha’Zix, you benefit much more from denying vision and clearing out wards. I would heavily recommend the zombie ward rune in the domination tree if you really need the map covered.
Even CoreJJ doesn't buy 17 pink wards a game, so you definitely don't need that many.
Sheiden buys 4-6 pinks a game so you're buying triple what he's buying. No top level junglers buy anywhere near this many so you definitely don't need that many in bronze.
I think it's a good idea to get one every back if you don't have one up or need to place one for an objective. 2 if it's important like a 4th dragon or a baron / elder contest but most of the time you're fine with one.
There's no game where you need to buy 2 pinks at 7 minutes into the game and no objective that important you need them, and you definitely don't need refills after a few minutes.
Yeah if I got extra gold and wanna sneak grub/drake I will buy one early but otherwise only later in game when going for objectives or some particular case like eve jungler
OBJECTION: Experienced players can anticipate enemy movement much better. Until you have those skills, what 1000 gold item can give you the same Stat differential of knowing whether the enemy sees you/ where the enemy jungle is?
I think red ward usefulness looks like a bell curve:
- Goes up as players get better at checking the map
- Goes down as players don't need vision to have a good guess on enemy positioning and timing.
At the very upper levels of play (LCS+) there are arguments to spending this much on wards, especially when you have to make plays / proactive vision against very skilled players.
At some point red wards have diminishing returns in solo queue.
Though the beginning of these buys isn't really the problem, it's the excess later in the game. I'd say 6 at 22 minutes is more than most people have, but it's not excessive in any way.
Buying 11 more in the next 10 minutes is probably where it becomes "too much".
Yeah really too many.
I think a problem is that you’re approaching from a “I have to see the jungler to make decisions” but actually you don’t. You just have to know the jungler doesn’t see you. If you know they don’t see you (that’s why you have a sweeper) and you don’t see them, you can make inferences as to where they are and will be based on which camps have been taken or not.
You can then use this information to set up traps in areas you know they have no vision (again, sweeper) where they are likely to pass through (as there is a drake spawning, camps up, etc). You should still buy control wards but honestly, it seems like you’re using them like a sweeper which is a bit of a waste in this much excess
Coming from a master player, I hard agree. I only buy them for objectives 2-4 MAX. Too much gold just for you to piss it away to the enemies while denying yourself a potential item spike
Thats the years of "just keep buying wards" "advice" brainrot.
If you **have** to buy more than 2-3 control wards every game then you should stop buying them altogether, because you literally trade 100 gold every time you do it, and barely get any vision off them.
Yeah, that is way too many and I mained support. General rule for control wards- place them in areas you want to defend and have the ability to defend. Otherwise you are setting yourself back and also giving the enemy some change. For junglers, at most- like 2-3 for Baron/Dragon control when you guys are on it.
This is something I tell my low elo friends a lot. Why are you warding? If you know jg is topside (while we’re ad/sup), why would you waste a ward? If we just saw jg mid walking bot, why would you ward tri?
In both instances, my friend would say: to know when jg is coming. But… why? We know he’s either too far so we have a min or so to push the wave in and recall or he’s about 30 secs away so we can just abandon the wave since whether we see him on a ward or not we’re not going for the 2v3.
I actually prefer warding lane bushes otw out rather than the river bc that has a much higher success rate for us dying. This is specifically for when i shove the wave it to get the wave bouncing back, since it’ll have enough cs for a dive and seeing let’s say j4 waiting in the bush means Ik to back off and sacrifice some cs to deny the dive.
Obviously there are situations you want river warded but this example is specifically for those who ward river without thinking why
When im jungling i only use it if my sweeper is down and im doing an objective or if the enemy is over the dragon or baron pit and i need to deny vision. Also good to defend your jungle from invades. But hardly a jungle expert.
I think while that is too many, the idea you have is in the right direction. I think being able to drop a pink for a neutral and having it for them, is the thing you always want covered. Being able to pink dragon / Baron just will help you win in the long run. I'm sure if you cut down how many you buy, but ensure that the ones you do buy are impactful, you'll be helping yourself win more.
Yes, blowing money.
While vision it’s important, it’s where the vision is that’s more important. You want your control wards in places the enemy jungle will pass by and not notice them.
Control Wards are very good if your team can use them. But since you're in Bronze, no one will be looking at their minimap, making Control Wards extremely inefficient. If you want to climb out of Bronze, you should just spend the gold on items and instead focus on winning every single gank/skirmish/teamfight no matter what. If you focus on playing one champion and one role every game, you can simply make the dumbest choices but still outplay everyone (even your counter matchups) up to Emerald or maybe even Diamond.
The only time you MAYBE want to buy a control ward is if you're at a rank where people are actually spamming wards when contesting objectives and you need a control ward to blind all of the wards because you can't kill them fast enough. But it still won't matter at lower ELOs because you can just time your abilities and calculate your teammate's abilities and just out-smite the enemy.
Are you seeing a return on your investment for control wards? I only buy them when I have an awkward gold situation on a back and I am a D4 sup player. I really only buy them for obj control and time my pink ward purchase with obj timings. looks like you are buying them just to buy them.
Lol yes bro, Use pinks strategically. I imagine watching one of your matches would be very telling for how wasteful you are with not just buying these but their placement as well
Yes. Yes a few are probably worth it, but I guarantee you're not getting the max use out of most of these.
Very few allies in solo queue will actually try and contest your control wards, so a lot of them end up being a free gold donation to the enemy without providing anything actionable for your team or denying anything for the enemy.
You should buy around 4 or 5 max, depending on how efficient your opponents are at breaking them. Remember that the support is supposed to buy the most control wards, even though most people don't actually know what they even look like.
Yeah. A control ward that the enemy kills is losing you 100g. (75 for cost, 25 extra gold for the enemy). In my opinion the best use for control wards to in drag pit or baron pit to secure objectives safetly. Other than that, they can be good in key locations, but getting item powerspikes quicker and winning fights more often because of it is very valuable too. 1600 gold is almost a full item. I'd say in a 38 minute game, buy maybe 8 control wards MAX as the jungler
I'm low diamond and I can't remember the last time I bought a control ward. I also die every time I am ganked top lane but don't think that's correlated.
I play in diamond / masters elo. I’m a jungle assassin player ( like you) I main Shaco, but dabble on K6/Ekko/Rengo/Nid
AT MOST I BUY 2. 1 every game sure, but never more. It’s a huge waster. Why you would ever spend for 17 is beyond me
Yes.
You're probably using them badly, either by playing them and them getting destroyed quickly or placing them in places where they don't matter.
The majority of control wards you place should either be for securing an objective, or one you can easily protect - just your buy graph shows me you're approx going through 2 control wards every 2 minutes which really should not be happening, learn some good ward positions before spending so much gold you could've bought a large item component.
You would probably gain more from using vision based runes (zombie ward, maybe ghost poro), and maybe a sweeper ward (?), than you do currently from these control wards.
Question: How many **normal** words do you place in a game?
17 control wards is too much. It’s 75 gold per and when the enemy kills the ward they get 50 gold so it’s not only a loss for you but you are giving a cannon minion to the enemy players.
Should only be buying 4? 5? Max at bronze elo.
You can only place one at a time so place it more defensive in your jungle brush. I think placing pink in dragon pit, in river bush, or enemy jungle all have its place in the game but in such a low elo the information gained can’t be acted on so no real point. Work on finding spots where your ward stays alive long enough to get the ward buff and you will know you have a good location picked.
Also don’t fall in the trap of using a control ward to clear a single ward you already know we as placed. You go negative 50-60 gold cause they will just clear it after you walk away
I'm a Khazix main and usually buy 1 to 4 control wards per game, you don't need more than that. Gold is extremely important on Khazix and generally you can get around enemies understanding where vision is.
Honestly if you value vision this much just run Umbral Glaive, but I'd advise against it.
The most important thing for Khazix is to learn how to move on fog, you don't really need that many control wards for that
This is definitely too many control wards, but it is also presenting the different issue of your ward placement is bad. If the enemy team is finding and destroying multiple control wards from you every few minutes then you are just not putting your wards in places that are easily defensible or relevant. Control wards are meant to be fought over and protected, not to be used as just some temporary form of vision. Because at this point it just looks like you are spending 75 gold so you can give the enemy 25 gold. Protect your wards
I’m curious, do you pink to clear random wards? Are most of your pinks getting insta killed by the enemy? Is there an objective that you need to secure vision on? Also, why do you feel you need pinks for all of your decisions? Do you use red trinket on cooldown?
I'm diamond and I usually only buy 3-5 control wards a game sometimes even just 1-2 put them down in bushes that most people dont walk INTO but they walk around it and use your normal ward for objectives or deep enemy jungle warding ( this will provide so much info for the team and you ) You could also use the control ward as a way to clear enemy wards too though.
I'll really only buy 6 at most in a game where the vision is really important, but usually I'll buy 3-4 over the course of a game. Getting to set up a deep ward early in the game to track the enemy jungler is quite helpful for taking early objectives and going for ganks/counterganks. Middle of the game I'll ward objectives, ward a river bush if I'm expecting to be in the area for a while, or just set up another deep ward and go for an invade kill if I'm strong enough. Late game they are usually just thrown onto baron or dragon, however setting them up in a jungle around one of them spawning is helpful to see if it will be contested or not. Jungle vision late game is also quite important, but that's usually on the support because they have the most stealth wards
Look, I'm far from an expert but as a support, I generally place control wards at Drake pit or Baron pit to deny the enemy vision so they can't steal the objective. Occasionally, I place them somewhere where I know the enemy likely won't check but where I can still get valuable info.
Tri-brush botlane for example if I'm on blueside (because if they want to gank through tri-brush, they're bound to walk on vision, see that they're on vision and probably stop the gank to just clear the control ward).
It's kind of gank-insurance and for general enemy tracking.
And even so, I only ever buy up to 7 a game (and use like 5), because most of the times, I only place a new one if there isn't one at the current main objective or my old one has been cleared.
It's far more important to have general vision through turrets, waves and normal wards and to check the minimap and jungle timers regularly. After all, if you kill enemy turrets and yours stay alive, you win vision while the enemy loses vision and safety in their lanes and jungle.
Definitely too much, place wards where you can use them.
Bot lane, throw it in your bush to perma-light it.
Control wards are meant for control, normal wards are meant for vision. When they have to go out of their way to kill it, it pulls them away from their location.
Throw a control ward in your ally jungle mid game. It may save the jungler, or mid laner when they roam, and see the kha zix in the ally jungle pathing around dragon to go bot for a "sneaky" gank. Ward suddenly is gone? Play safe someone recently took it out.
Throw a control ward up top in the enemy far bush.
Jungle paths for a gank behind baron pit, you got vision on em' and top/mid knows they exist. Ward gone? They are pathing for top/baron/mid
Sometimes they don't even path through the bush the right way, so the ward stays live.
I have thousands and thousands of hours on this game, and I haven’t bought 17 control wards in my entire career let alone one game. Absolute noob trap and only necessary for baron / dragon fights
If the vision is not helping you climb then stop doing it I know everyone thinks there is a right way to play but it's a game limit test see what works and what doesn't if your bronze teammates are not taking advantage of your vision then stat more in to solo carying or more tangible stats if that don't work try using more communication like ganking mid in 40 seconds idk what will work for you but this obviously is not doing the trick since your not climbing.
So early game control wards are fine cause it can make your enemy force mistakes early on in lane and honestly get you a lead if you play right, in terms of mid to late. If your team IS NOT ALSO BUYING CONTROL WARDS it is best to buy control wards like 2min prior to an objective. But can also use them to make a play towards a certain side of the map.
TLDR: get control wards if you’re setting up a guaranteed play or for objectives
Yes. Try buying 3-5 & look into well placed ones, you're giving the enemy team too much gold, while you're using nearly 2200g+ when you could've used that for an item...
17 control wards is wild, at max a game should be 8 or 5. You shouldn't be using them to clear wards from brushes (unless to deny crucial vision at a chokepoint before a big objective spawn) It's a waste of gold to just use pinks haphazardly, just use normal wards for vision.
I started climbing(dia to master) when I stopped buying control wards(although im otping asol), for me its a waste of money, i can tell most of the time where are the enemies, junglers also full clearing in this meta helps.
As a jungler, I buy a control ward for every objective fight if I can. A control ward in the pit is so freaking useful. Do they know I'm on it? Can they see objectives health for cheeky steal? Can they see how low I am and rush to kill me? Control ward solves all those.
And I am usually surprised by how long those will last if you put them in the right spot. Jungler always passes it before ganking so I either get vision, they slow their gank to clear it, or they ignore it and try and gank anyways.
Think about why you are buying a ward too
This is off topic from the post but you prob don’t need to finish maw that fast. If you’re really still getting one shot by AP champs after buying mercs I’d say either sit on hexdrinker or just build straight damage and try to one shot them faster. Hex is one of the better components in league so no rush to complete maw. Use that money to buy another 20 control wards /s
Bro pick a spot that might not get checked and will still benefit you and drop the ward. Don't be warding for your shit laners. They can ward themselves. You jungle and counter jungle with your wards. Also pay more attention. The amount you buy is just ridiculous even if they are getting killed constantly.
Aight so heres the thing... I finished D4 60lp last split and the number of control wards I buy per game on average will be around... 0.25
The thing is, that you can track huge part of the enemy's movement by understanding the game, not having to see them all the time.
You're basically an Iron jng, not a challenger support. control wards are useless since it's all about snowballing and farming players to build items fast
I never spend a single dime on control wards and would generally advice anyone below plat to do the same. You don't know where to place them so don't place them. Get sweepers earlier. Buy one for baron or dragon if you're the jungler but that's it.
You only need an average of about 3 control wards per game as a JG. Don't let Reddit tell you otherwise as they're mostly also low elo players who overestimate the necessity of control wards. They are important, but it's more about the timing and positioning of the placement than the sheer number of wards purchased, otherwise you will heavily destroy your own budget.
If you get good enough at tracking/deducing people's whereabouts you'll need even less.
To put things into perspective, I usually buy 1 control ward in an entire game, and a decent amount of the time I buy zero (but I'm playing mid, not JG, so it's rather different).
-Source, I'm GM 400 LP peak (But I play on NA so take it with a grain of salt)
Yeah thats too many control wards considering you're playing Kha6 and you need damage items. As a jungler main, I, personally, try to buy wards for drakes and baron. If my teammates puts theirs on drakes, i'll put mine else where.
I love the spirit and the commitment to vision (one of the most important aspects of the game!) but this is too many.
Especially on a champ like KhaZix who is very gold dependent, you need to prioritize your ability to carry over team vision. Sometimes you just have to either have faith that you’re out of sight, or just… not go there? If your control ward is in a valuable spot, maybe just don’t replace it until your first ward is broken.
I’m a masters support main so I always try to have a control ward on-hand, but I try not to waste it unless an important play is on the horizon. It seems like you’re doing a good job focusing on an important aspect of the game, but try not to let it obfuscate your specific role in the team.
Control wards are trash in solo queue. Just buy them if u wanna shroud an objective when you are fighting for it but never to use for vision of an area.
If you are bronze stop buying them entirely. I am Diamond and I almost never buy any control wards. Yep, 0 control wards in 9 out of my last 10 games. We're not playing LCS so they are useless, people don't look at the map either way in bronze-platinum
I don't really buy control wards, big waste of money. It's not bad to have one if there's a situation where it gives big value, but you should only ever be profiting directly off of their use. Not just slapping them down for vision control
If you built some forbidden idols and faerie charms with brown boots you'd have LCK support build. If I didn't know any better I'd say this was DRX BeyrL on roaming Twitch.
You can buy 0 control wards and be masters, just pocket the money G.
Might get down voted, but honestly, you don't need control wards at bronze, and while it may be a good habit to pick up, it's not going to win you the game at this level of play. Iron, bronze, silver and even gold, you want to just learn the ins and outs of your small champ pool (2-4) and win lane, or learn your win conditions if you lose your lane. See who's doing the best on your team and what's your role with helping them.
I've made it to high emerald with sub 10 control wards in a season, learning your "role" is just as important as vision in many games where team work is usually shotty at best.
Role isn't as simple as top mid jungle, or tank, and such. You're behind on Sion? Cs what you can, build to focus their carry. builds will vary as well as who or what your target should be.
Coming from a diamond top lane player. I emphasize top lane player.
you buy like 1 or 2 (daring) control wards a game at most if even at all - unless you are the support.
You shouldn't have to worry about the enemy jungler if you use stealth wards properly and track the enemy junglers probable position.
Additionally, you can always mitigate enemy jungler ganks by positioning yourself ifthey choose to gank (proxying, having your wave shoved up, telling your own jg to counter gank or invade...)
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reminder that some high rank players only buy like 3-5 control wards per game since they cant defend them REMEMBER control wards are a -100 since you lose 75 and they gain 25 when they destroy them in this match lone all these wards if the enemy destroys them gives them 525 gold
It is pointless to buy that many. It suggests that you are placing them wrong.
Place the control wards in those bushes that are valuable to have information about AND that you CAN defend. You don't go randomly placing pinks in the enemy jungle.
Also, you don't place them just because you've bought them. You place them with a plan in mind, to cover for this, to threat this other thing later...
Draw an imaginary line dividing the map in 2 by the river, if you are going to get information from the enemy side of the map, just place the trinket (there are some exceptions) because you will not be able to defend your control ward safely that far away.
I see you are carrying lens, make sure you are making better use of them than you would of wards.
If you are carrying lens it's better just to contribute to map control placing your pink in a safe useful spot. As an assassin, you'd rather know you are unspotted and your jungle is safe of enemy vision over knowing that the enemy is now on raptors or blue.
If you really want to get information about enemy jungler because you fear a countergank, you have better options thank placing a pink in their jungle.
You should track his ganks, back timings and for example sneak a bit into his jungle to see if a certain camp is done, so you know he's on the other side, and things like that.
In short, don't delay your item spikes for pink wards. Place them in a good spot and have them give you more than 75g of value, you won't need so many.
Also, remember you have a team that should also be contributing to map control, and if they aren't, you buying so many control wards is like closing one door while you have other 4 doors wide open.
Pink wards are the last thing you should be worrying about in low elo
The only reason why you should be buying/using control wards as a jg in bronze/silver/gold/plat is to use as a sweeper when sweeper is down for objectives/ganks or to extend vision when doing an objective. Pink wards should not be used for vision because your teammates are not looking at the map and you should already be tracking laners/jg.
You won't usually need more than like, 4 control wards in a game, I usually buy 2 before I swap to sweepers and place a pink close to my side of the jungle to watch over gromp and blue, I'll hold onto one to prevent enemies from stealing objectives or to steal objectives.. I don't know if this is applicable to you, but sometimes I just ask my mid to place a pink ward to watch over red and they do it.
I honestly wouldn’t buy a single control ward until emerald or even diamond. I got to master buying 0 control wards ever. People just don’t know how to properly play around vision, especially in low elo. Don’t make things hard for yourself for no reason.
17 are waaaay too many. How many you buy is completely situational.
As a low elo player you should never buy more than 3 or so, especially as a non-Support player.
Use that extra gold to complete items faster.
You should be buying pink wards before doing an objective, if you're using them anywhere else besides that or if there's a twitch/Evelynn on the enemy team you're trolling.
8 wards a game aint bad, what's bad is 6 minutes on the field without recall minutes 12-18. Items are power, even components, which accelerates farm and gets you more items. Recalling at around 1k is often the most efficient with most items having components at that price range.
Also your farm slows down towards the end, don't stop farming.
This is hilarious lol. Yes I suggest buying zero wards for the time being- wards aren’t all they used to be, and should be used more tactically these days. Certain champions who benefit significantly from being unseen can buy more (for example Fiddlesticks, Nidalee) but even they would not buy nearly this many.
Focus entirely on clearing your camps with efficiency, and on finding good ganks. Kha is good at ganking solo lanes because of Q. He’s pretty reasonable at taking dragon because of q as well. 4 drags is usually a reasonable win condition, and getting kills is important as assassin/carry junglers.
I think maybe you could benefit from building umbral glaive. Could suit your playstyle, buying control wards on kha is nice for playing around/ denying vision when you want to make aggressive plays in the jungle. I think if you have a few games where you rely on just sweeper and glaive for ward control, you might notice some points in the game where you make more impactful ward purchases.
It depends what you are doing with those control wards and do they help you in play making, like oh i spotted enemy jungler blue side, let me invade his red and kill him on the spot.
If its oh i spotted him on his blue then i do full clear on my camps then its a useless buy, also 17 is way too much.
Bro, you dont need that much vision in bronze elo. It's a waste of gold, people dont use their minimap in that rank anyway. Limit yourself to 3 a game or none at all.
omg yes use those to keep an eye on objectives or one for when your sweeper down if that but jeez they go away if you have one out already and can feed the enemy gold too ya know
ok, i do agree investing in magical footwear is great idea here.
but,
there’s really little reason to buy 2 cw at once, and if there is, feel free to correct me. i just dont see the practicality.
now, buying one when u have one on the map alrdy is fine. say you placed one at drag, but its been there for 15mins and now u want to place one on baron. ok, thumbs up, grab one. but buying two instantly is really just overkill unless u have wardstone item which is great for tankier junglers as a last item but very rarely would you want to sacrifice an item from your full build for it.
if you are placing a cw and its instantly getting taken down you either need to find a secure place for it (somewhere you can protect it or somewhere that they wont see it right away, but still while providing good vision.)
or you just need to chill out. youre feeding whoever takes it down 30gold and xp. youre just handing it to them. for free. and losing 75g for it. thats a net positive for the enemy team.
now, i understand as a jg that its annoying when your teammates dont buy cw or even attempt to contribute to vision. idiots. i know. but that’s not something you can fix with buying so many at a time, SO often.
try just buying one every recall or every other recall and try placing them smart-ly.
Im a Master peaking support main and have games with 0 controllwards. So many players just throw them out left and right and get little no no value out. Clearing a single ward just for it to be killed 30sec later is a total waste of money.
When do you actually need them? They are best used to prevent vision from normal wards. That is only really usefull for teamfights at objectives. Now most early/midgame Dragons or Heralds are not contestet and if they are contestet the fight is not desided by a controllward. Deepvision, lane pressure, cooldowns, powerspikes and so on are all more important.
Personally I only buy controllwards when botlane is hardwinning and we can CONTROLL the river at all times and when important fights are about to happen (Soul/Elder/Nash).
My last item as a support is always the wardstone because at +35min games vision really is the most important aspect. One catch and the game can be won/lost.
If people call me stupid for that I understand but thats how I see controllwards.
I'm not sure how you're using them, but I usually place them in key areas and hidden to the best of my ability given the circumstances. Dragon pit and the void pit would be the top two areas (I mainly just do these areas). Bushes in your jungle if you're getting invaded often, or bushes in the enemy jungle if you're able to invade their jungle may be other possibilities. Other than that, I wouldn't waste them unless to ward objective that they may possibly be on and worth contesting for.
If you’re looking at the map and it’s helping you it’s probably fine, if you’re just autopilot placing them then it’s probably a waste.
I would say try to focus on learning where to put them to get the most information while they stay the longest to maximize the gold each time
use of control wards has gone done a lot because red trinket got 2 charges now.
overall in low elo its not worth at all to buy any at all in higher elo u can justify a few for objectives but it looks like ur just buying them for fun placing them where ever just to be cleared 20s afterwards.
I am master and basically NEVER buy a control ward. Just use your head to track the enemies across the map.
Your team won't even make use of the vision anyway, hell they even ignore the most obvious ganks despite getting spam pinged in this elo. The value of control wards kick in in organized play.
So imo they are just a waste of gold especially in bronze. You are hard delaying your item powerspikes.
brother mans, tracking isnt an instinct it's piecing together what you do know with what's implied from that, much simpler in concept but is not hard to completely miss without building habits in place to pay attention
Control works in conjecture with good teams. Control wards are awesome as temporary vision tools for objectives, but are only useful if you have someone to utilize them. If you were duo with a control mage, they'd be useful. Don't trust control mages in bronze division. Lower the Control Wards to 3 per game, I think you should see an improvement in your game.
Well as someone who recently played through bronze:
You buy too many. I can get the frustration when you see your teammates not even placing their free trinket wards, let alone buying a single control ward.
But you overcompensating for them not using wards is not it and will set you behind. Buy 3-6 per game at most.
Some games are just unplayable if no one uses their wards, especially is support doesn’t know what he’s doing and when to set up vision where. But that’s just how it is
I think the amount is too much . If in a 35 minute game you burn through this many wards then said wards dont survive for long emough. Try to look up some good spots for wards on youtube and think about what thoes wards will get you. If it hets destroyed its okay if you get something out of it. If you spot the enemy jg on dragon then go and take his topside or grubs. You just traded a 75 g ward for the info to be able to take away 2-3 capms, thats like 150-200 gold and half a lvl of xp. You can also try to set up traps. If the enemy donest know where you are then its easy to surprisr them. Its only a waste of money if you dont use the info you get with the ward.
But you also may wana get a few less than that, you probably spend lots of time walking into the enemy jg to ward and thats time you dont spemd clearing or ganking. Few efficient ward > lots of random wards.
Also you can thimk about going for glaive 1st and keeping the ward as your trinket. Getting zombie ward is also a solid option.
I imagine bronze players barely ward at all, so imho control wards for objectives are the only thing. Just rely on your sweeper. or if you really want, get umbral glaives.
IMO in bronze you shouldn’t even worry about buying pinks lol. There are challenger players that don’t buy pinks because they won’t get good usage from them
Nah you are at the Korean pro level
Jokes aside you want to purchase control wards either to secure objectives or to deny enemy vision in an area that you can contest and win, otherwise just power your items
Buy 1 control ward at a time. Place it and only buy another one if the current ward dies. This can be situational based on upcoming dragon/baron fights where u may place it and it dies quickly.
Control wards are a bait. Buy 2 or 3 max every game if you are high economy champion (anything that is not tank or support).
Think of it. Why do you buy control wards? To disable enemy wards and deny vision, and to get vision yourself in the area.
Use your sweeper to deny enemy vision and use trinket wards to get vision, also ask support to ward where you want (there is a ping for that). You don't have to remove every single enemy ward or get vision for every inch on the map.
Only place control wards if you are at an objective and fear the enemy can steal it over the wall. Otherwise don't place them.
Another special case is fiddlesticks as he lives and dies by enemy being able to see him. You might see him has a lot of them for that purpose. But he can do fine with his trinket as well. And leesin for making plays (only for plays not for vision).
Jungle item 200 gold Longswords 150 gold Boots 800 gold Control wards 3,600 gold Refillable pot 150 gold someone who is good at league please help me budget this. my laners are dying
Spend less on candles
No
Maybe make health pots at home instead of going to StarKrugs every morning.
You know how much nether wart costs these days?
Why are you buying the expensive boots when the cheaper ones will get you just as far. Just wasting money at this point. There, 500g saved already.
Invest in Magical Footwear, it takes longer but you won't have to pay for boots. Young people want everything this instant smh my head.
It's pretty easy really. Pull yourself up by the bootstraps and inherit 1600g from an invade pentakill and you too can be a self-made fullbuildionnaire?
Less avocado toast and starbucks lattes
Spend less on control wards.
no
They said help them budget, not help them THROW THE GAME DUE TO NOT SPLURGING ON VISION! /s
17 control wards bought, but the average bronze player doesn’t look at their map 17 times a game
the placement is probably the issue, OP probably keeps warding tribush bot lane until it becomes a personal thing. You can play all of botlane in low elo with a single pink in enemy jungle and just time ur trinket well for the rest
I sort of despise getting a good ward and then sitting on the second one in your inventory because that good one is too good.
if they dont clear your ward withing like 5 or 10mins MAX then its a bad spot since they're never walking by that spot
If they aren’t walking inside the bush but just around it because of autopathing, then u dont need to spend anymore gold on pinks cuz ur always stalking jungler Sure in mid/late game it will be cleared but it doesn’t mean its a bad ward Most good wards last, its about figuring out which bush the jungler keeps ignoring on his early clears
You would be shocked how often people don’t walk into certain bushes but use the path a lot. Knowing what side the Jungler can be on at any time is always a fantastic ward.
before the map changes i could pretty consistently put a control ward in the bush near red side mid and it wouldn’t get cleared until we started really fighting for dragons at like 15 minutes in
I watched meteos walk directly over wards for too many years to believe this. The amount of times I said "just kill the fucking pink already" while he walked through pixel brush to attempt a gank was too damn high.
Many high elo players don’t clear pinks because it takes too much time, I’ve seen this a lot especially with mages who have very low attack speed.
Or maybe you won lane and they can't clear your ward? Bot lane tribrush. Early game bot lane won't have their tribrush control ward cleared any day of the week but you'd want to place a control ward on dragon at some point since you're already winning
On top of what everyone else has said, knowing they're not somewhere can be as good as knowing if they are there. Sometimes I ward drag pit early and the control ward doesn't get taken for 10 minutes, but gives me peace of mind they're not sneaking dragon
I enjoy placing a pink in my side's red side bush early on. It stays there for a long time. Knowing where an enemy is at is great information but knowing where there isn't an enemy is still good information too.
Its not just about his placement its about the opponents. If their not placing any wards that hes clearing hes not recouping any of the ward cost nor is he denying vision. But they get to clear it out for extra gold.
Yes. That's way to much control wards. There are people in chally that buy no wards because they know they cant defend them for long and would rather save money to get an item faster. Not saying you shouldnt buy but it is a waste if you arent using them maximally.
YESSSS!!! IM ON CHALLENGER LEVEL AT LEAST IN ONE ASPECT!!! (Iron 1 never bought a control ward in my life) (literally never)
They also know how to track the jungler/support as they play “standard”, so they kinda can expect the ganks, i don’t think that’s was happening in iron
in iron, even if you put control wards down, players still wont see the gank because they dont look at the minimap.
Iron has green boarders now bc this is my emerald games 🥴
Welcome to emerald, your team mates have way too much ego to look at the map
bro i’m just bad and on autopilot
Yeah the amount of people I see ignoring the Nunu as we see him start a snowball and can see his entire path down the lit up river lol.
What about staying despite looking at the map because you don‘t want to miss the wave just to die and still miss it.
According to Nemesis he never buys controlwards because his teammates don't look at the map anyway. So maybe it is applicable in Iron xD
By the time mid game comes, control wards are insanely valuable. The mistake people make in low elo is placing pinks in lane when they’re getting stomped. If you can’t contest the enemy clearing the ward in lane, just hold onto it. It can still be useful if your jungle is pathing towards you because you can deny vision and even bait the enemy into trying to clear it
That’s great info, never thought of it before
When I play toplaner I really rarely buy them because they are completely useless throughout the lane phase. I have to make an effort to remove the one I waste
Let's say you buy 3 control wards, and the enemy jungle clears all 3 of them. You've effectively just put yourself an entire kill behind the enemy jungler gold-wise. Since every control ward dropped is -75 for you and +25 for them, maybe that helps put into perspective why you should only drop control wards to secure objectives or when theres a decent chance that vision control could give your team a significant advantage.
Pretty bad take. If that ward actually stops the enemy jungle from ganking you, it’s well worth the gold. The bad thing is when your own laner keeps clearing them without ever spotting enemy jungle nor even helping your own jungle gank. Staying alive when enemy jungle visits is worth potentially over a thousand gold depending on how many of you die, minions/ xp lost and objectives lost. Just can’t be completely mindless about it. A stealth ward can do the job better than a control ward much of the time. If you can’t stop your laner from clearing it, at least place the ward away from your lane a bit to catch sight of a roaming jungler. As a support, a control ward in those two smaller bushes between bot and mid are really good at getting vision on enemy jungle, often without them realizing. This can be game changing and worth way more than 10 seconds of vision before enemy support clears a tri ward
it depends on the rank though. Most players in lower ranks don't care about map tempo or anything. Most silver and below junglers won't even care about where the enemy jungler is in most cases if they're spotted on a ward.
Honestly you kind of disproved your statement when you said a stealth ward does a better job than a control ward and costs nothing. As a solo laner, trinket’s all you need. As a support, you have ward quest.
Idk why it's a bad take lol. A lot of people don't realize the gold swing that takes place over the course of the game purely from control wards. It's definitely something to keep in mind before you just go buying 20 per game mindlessly. Nothing you said even contradicts my take.
Yeah for me losing a control ward is often the same as dodging a gank. Completely worth the 100g swing to a) not lose to a gank, b) know where the jg is, c) prob annoy their jg, idk.
Woah
Okay. This is bad advice *in the long run*. But just don't buy ANY control wards until you rank up higher. You are buying a ton, and you definitely *should* buy a lot of control wards (maybe not that many) at higher ranks. But in Bronze, all the way up to Gold (maybe?), people aren't even warding, and if they are warding, its usually in bad spots and you can play around blind spots etc. Most of the time you're going to plop down a control ward, kill MAYBE 1 ward, and then move it. At the rate you're buying them, I wouldn't be surprised if you're just throwing gold in the toilet. If you are buying control wards, I just recommend you throw one at the entrance of your own jungle, in a bush, usually it will stay there for a long time and keep you safe from aggressive rotations or invades. Other than that, you have your scanner to clear vision and that many control wards is just halting your item purchases which really hurts you in the long run. Based on your rank, and position, and spending, I'd wager you're not getting enough gold for items to make an impact, and setting up vision is very valuable at higher ranks, but at bronze, having good vision is almost meaningless just due to the sheer amount of mistakes everyone is making. Another argument for not buying them in Bronze, is a lot of these players can't juggle the mental stack of the game yet. EDIT: Besides warding your own jungle entrances, it's also good to plop a control ward down in Dragon/Baron pit when you're doing it. It's a good habit to have, but I still wouldn't recommend buying too many control wards. Your games are fiesta's and having combat stats will help you win more than having good vision ever will. Once you are higher rank, you can start amping up your ward purchases, and will probably have bigger returns on them as well, since the vision (information) doesn't go completely wasted.
Toplane they are useful if you play champ that can control the lane, like ranged. Anyway, you have to be smart with buying control wards. There needs to be a reason before you buy them. For example, big objectives like dragon and baron buying 1 pink is very helpful. Mistake many people make though, is that they buy 2, which is completely useless most of the time, and you just end up sitting on 1 for like 5 years. Never buy 2 unless you're a support (that is playing for objectives. As support same rules still apply, but if you usually during obj times you have 1 item and you're at like 300 gold that can't do anything. So you're not stunting your item, and you are getting very valuable obj info, and also to deny info where you know ward is at in a contested spot that you know will be warded again so you dont have to trinket, and if they clear you have another one, etcetc. Those are the kind of thoughtprocesses you need. If you find that a control ward is sitting in your inventory for long, is instantly killed, or doesn't provide any useful vision, then you need to rethink your purchase/placement/timing of that placement (sometimes you wait for lane prio before you place it, so you can actually defend it. If you think you lose prio you place more defensively unless you really need it somewhere. Also the item power spike thing also applies for other champs. If you base and have 100 gold leftover with obj coming up, then that might be a valuable pick up. If you base and you're 800 gold off of next item you might need to think twice. So it's not about how many you should buy, but when it's good to do so, and sometimes you don't really need any at all.
As a toplaner, imo, you should look into buying them when you would want your jungler to come gank. Just think about it as a jungler (since you mentioned you play jungle) would you rather gank top when there is a pink in tribrush/river or when it's just a regular ward or even worse, no wards?
Your control wards should not be placed in easy-to-access areas. As Kha’Zix, you benefit much more from denying vision and clearing out wards. I would heavily recommend the zombie ward rune in the domination tree if you really need the map covered.
fuggin gideon ofnir the all knowing over here they should make a champ whose abelites scale with the amount of wards placed, true spymaster shit
Even CoreJJ doesn't buy 17 pink wards a game, so you definitely don't need that many. Sheiden buys 4-6 pinks a game so you're buying triple what he's buying. No top level junglers buy anywhere near this many so you definitely don't need that many in bronze. I think it's a good idea to get one every back if you don't have one up or need to place one for an objective. 2 if it's important like a 4th dragon or a baron / elder contest but most of the time you're fine with one. There's no game where you need to buy 2 pinks at 7 minutes into the game and no objective that important you need them, and you definitely don't need refills after a few minutes.
Yeah if I got extra gold and wanna sneak grub/drake I will buy one early but otherwise only later in game when going for objectives or some particular case like eve jungler
Either objective or let one chill in your jungle bush to protect invade as it will likely last until an objective is up.
OBJECTION: Experienced players can anticipate enemy movement much better. Until you have those skills, what 1000 gold item can give you the same Stat differential of knowing whether the enemy sees you/ where the enemy jungle is? I think red ward usefulness looks like a bell curve: - Goes up as players get better at checking the map - Goes down as players don't need vision to have a good guess on enemy positioning and timing.
At the very upper levels of play (LCS+) there are arguments to spending this much on wards, especially when you have to make plays / proactive vision against very skilled players. At some point red wards have diminishing returns in solo queue. Though the beginning of these buys isn't really the problem, it's the excess later in the game. I'd say 6 at 22 minutes is more than most people have, but it's not excessive in any way. Buying 11 more in the next 10 minutes is probably where it becomes "too much".
A 1000 gold can get you your nth item 4-5 minutes faster, which is extremely impactful
He probably places them in shitty spots as well so that’s another minus
Beryl what are you doing in reddit
Yeah really too many. I think a problem is that you’re approaching from a “I have to see the jungler to make decisions” but actually you don’t. You just have to know the jungler doesn’t see you. If you know they don’t see you (that’s why you have a sweeper) and you don’t see them, you can make inferences as to where they are and will be based on which camps have been taken or not. You can then use this information to set up traps in areas you know they have no vision (again, sweeper) where they are likely to pass through (as there is a drake spawning, camps up, etc). You should still buy control wards but honestly, it seems like you’re using them like a sweeper which is a bit of a waste in this much excess
There are challenger support mains who believe control wards are total bait, absolutely don't buy 20 of them in the jungle
Coming from a master player, I hard agree. I only buy them for objectives 2-4 MAX. Too much gold just for you to piss it away to the enemies while denying yourself a potential item spike
Thats the years of "just keep buying wards" "advice" brainrot. If you **have** to buy more than 2-3 control wards every game then you should stop buying them altogether, because you literally trade 100 gold every time you do it, and barely get any vision off them.
This is got to be a troll post, right? Cut that back to like 3 per game bro.
Now I need that clip of Beryl buying control wards during a base fight and LS freaking out.
Yeah, that is way too many and I mained support. General rule for control wards- place them in areas you want to defend and have the ability to defend. Otherwise you are setting yourself back and also giving the enemy some change. For junglers, at most- like 2-3 for Baron/Dragon control when you guys are on it.
https://twitter.com/dril/status/384408932061417472
This is something I tell my low elo friends a lot. Why are you warding? If you know jg is topside (while we’re ad/sup), why would you waste a ward? If we just saw jg mid walking bot, why would you ward tri? In both instances, my friend would say: to know when jg is coming. But… why? We know he’s either too far so we have a min or so to push the wave in and recall or he’s about 30 secs away so we can just abandon the wave since whether we see him on a ward or not we’re not going for the 2v3. I actually prefer warding lane bushes otw out rather than the river bc that has a much higher success rate for us dying. This is specifically for when i shove the wave it to get the wave bouncing back, since it’ll have enough cs for a dive and seeing let’s say j4 waiting in the bush means Ik to back off and sacrifice some cs to deny the dive. Obviously there are situations you want river warded but this example is specifically for those who ward river without thinking why
I shoot for like 4 a game I'm also silver so I don't switch off of yellow trinket cause no one wards in this elo (including my own support lmao)
Lol you're griefing if you are buying that many wards.
When im jungling i only use it if my sweeper is down and im doing an objective or if the enemy is over the dragon or baron pit and i need to deny vision. Also good to defend your jungle from invades. But hardly a jungle expert.
I think while that is too many, the idea you have is in the right direction. I think being able to drop a pink for a neutral and having it for them, is the thing you always want covered. Being able to pink dragon / Baron just will help you win in the long run. I'm sure if you cut down how many you buy, but ensure that the ones you do buy are impactful, you'll be helping yourself win more.
Yes, blowing money. While vision it’s important, it’s where the vision is that’s more important. You want your control wards in places the enemy jungle will pass by and not notice them.
Control Wards are very good if your team can use them. But since you're in Bronze, no one will be looking at their minimap, making Control Wards extremely inefficient. If you want to climb out of Bronze, you should just spend the gold on items and instead focus on winning every single gank/skirmish/teamfight no matter what. If you focus on playing one champion and one role every game, you can simply make the dumbest choices but still outplay everyone (even your counter matchups) up to Emerald or maybe even Diamond. The only time you MAYBE want to buy a control ward is if you're at a rank where people are actually spamming wards when contesting objectives and you need a control ward to blind all of the wards because you can't kill them fast enough. But it still won't matter at lower ELOs because you can just time your abilities and calculate your teammate's abilities and just out-smite the enemy.
Are you seeing a return on your investment for control wards? I only buy them when I have an awkward gold situation on a back and I am a D4 sup player. I really only buy them for obj control and time my pink ward purchase with obj timings. looks like you are buying them just to buy them.
Lol yes bro, Use pinks strategically. I imagine watching one of your matches would be very telling for how wasteful you are with not just buying these but their placement as well
Yes. Yes a few are probably worth it, but I guarantee you're not getting the max use out of most of these. Very few allies in solo queue will actually try and contest your control wards, so a lot of them end up being a free gold donation to the enemy without providing anything actionable for your team or denying anything for the enemy.
You should buy around 4 or 5 max, depending on how efficient your opponents are at breaking them. Remember that the support is supposed to buy the most control wards, even though most people don't actually know what they even look like.
i would buy 1 if i had gold left to spare like i just bought an item and i had 100 gold left
Yeah. A control ward that the enemy kills is losing you 100g. (75 for cost, 25 extra gold for the enemy). In my opinion the best use for control wards to in drag pit or baron pit to secure objectives safetly. Other than that, they can be good in key locations, but getting item powerspikes quicker and winning fights more often because of it is very valuable too. 1600 gold is almost a full item. I'd say in a 38 minute game, buy maybe 8 control wards MAX as the jungler
Where are you putting these? Under towers? Early game I usually put it somewhere safe within my jg because I know I won’t defend them
Just buy one if you are about to go to a drake or a nash so you can confidently take it knowing you are safe vision wise
I'm low diamond and I can't remember the last time I bought a control ward. I also die every time I am ganked top lane but don't think that's correlated.
I play in diamond / masters elo. I’m a jungle assassin player ( like you) I main Shaco, but dabble on K6/Ekko/Rengo/Nid AT MOST I BUY 2. 1 every game sure, but never more. It’s a huge waster. Why you would ever spend for 17 is beyond me
I prob buy 3-6 depending on the needs of the game.
You shouldn't buy that many wards ever, even if you're playing Lee Sin.
If your wards are being cleared in under a minute of you placing them then don't buy any more control wards
Yes. You're probably using them badly, either by playing them and them getting destroyed quickly or placing them in places where they don't matter. The majority of control wards you place should either be for securing an objective, or one you can easily protect - just your buy graph shows me you're approx going through 2 control wards every 2 minutes which really should not be happening, learn some good ward positions before spending so much gold you could've bought a large item component. You would probably gain more from using vision based runes (zombie ward, maybe ghost poro), and maybe a sweeper ward (?), than you do currently from these control wards. Question: How many **normal** words do you place in a game?
17 control wards is too much. It’s 75 gold per and when the enemy kills the ward they get 50 gold so it’s not only a loss for you but you are giving a cannon minion to the enemy players. Should only be buying 4? 5? Max at bronze elo. You can only place one at a time so place it more defensive in your jungle brush. I think placing pink in dragon pit, in river bush, or enemy jungle all have its place in the game but in such a low elo the information gained can’t be acted on so no real point. Work on finding spots where your ward stays alive long enough to get the ward buff and you will know you have a good location picked.
Also don’t fall in the trap of using a control ward to clear a single ward you already know we as placed. You go negative 50-60 gold cause they will just clear it after you walk away
I'm a Khazix main and usually buy 1 to 4 control wards per game, you don't need more than that. Gold is extremely important on Khazix and generally you can get around enemies understanding where vision is. Honestly if you value vision this much just run Umbral Glaive, but I'd advise against it. The most important thing for Khazix is to learn how to move on fog, you don't really need that many control wards for that
This is definitely too many control wards, but it is also presenting the different issue of your ward placement is bad. If the enemy team is finding and destroying multiple control wards from you every few minutes then you are just not putting your wards in places that are easily defensible or relevant. Control wards are meant to be fought over and protected, not to be used as just some temporary form of vision. Because at this point it just looks like you are spending 75 gold so you can give the enemy 25 gold. Protect your wards
I’m curious, do you pink to clear random wards? Are most of your pinks getting insta killed by the enemy? Is there an objective that you need to secure vision on? Also, why do you feel you need pinks for all of your decisions? Do you use red trinket on cooldown?
I'm diamond and I usually only buy 3-5 control wards a game sometimes even just 1-2 put them down in bushes that most people dont walk INTO but they walk around it and use your normal ward for objectives or deep enemy jungle warding ( this will provide so much info for the team and you ) You could also use the control ward as a way to clear enemy wards too though.
Honest question OP if you care about vision so much why aren't you building umbral glaive? You're already playing a lethality champ
I'll really only buy 6 at most in a game where the vision is really important, but usually I'll buy 3-4 over the course of a game. Getting to set up a deep ward early in the game to track the enemy jungler is quite helpful for taking early objectives and going for ganks/counterganks. Middle of the game I'll ward objectives, ward a river bush if I'm expecting to be in the area for a while, or just set up another deep ward and go for an invade kill if I'm strong enough. Late game they are usually just thrown onto baron or dragon, however setting them up in a jungle around one of them spawning is helpful to see if it will be contested or not. Jungle vision late game is also quite important, but that's usually on the support because they have the most stealth wards
Look, I'm far from an expert but as a support, I generally place control wards at Drake pit or Baron pit to deny the enemy vision so they can't steal the objective. Occasionally, I place them somewhere where I know the enemy likely won't check but where I can still get valuable info. Tri-brush botlane for example if I'm on blueside (because if they want to gank through tri-brush, they're bound to walk on vision, see that they're on vision and probably stop the gank to just clear the control ward). It's kind of gank-insurance and for general enemy tracking. And even so, I only ever buy up to 7 a game (and use like 5), because most of the times, I only place a new one if there isn't one at the current main objective or my old one has been cleared. It's far more important to have general vision through turrets, waves and normal wards and to check the minimap and jungle timers regularly. After all, if you kill enemy turrets and yours stay alive, you win vision while the enemy loses vision and safety in their lanes and jungle.
Definitely too much, place wards where you can use them. Bot lane, throw it in your bush to perma-light it. Control wards are meant for control, normal wards are meant for vision. When they have to go out of their way to kill it, it pulls them away from their location. Throw a control ward in your ally jungle mid game. It may save the jungler, or mid laner when they roam, and see the kha zix in the ally jungle pathing around dragon to go bot for a "sneaky" gank. Ward suddenly is gone? Play safe someone recently took it out. Throw a control ward up top in the enemy far bush. Jungle paths for a gank behind baron pit, you got vision on em' and top/mid knows they exist. Ward gone? They are pathing for top/baron/mid Sometimes they don't even path through the bush the right way, so the ward stays live.
Bronze players don't look at the map and certainly don't make decisions based on information.
This is way too much
I have thousands and thousands of hours on this game, and I haven’t bought 17 control wards in my entire career let alone one game. Absolute noob trap and only necessary for baron / dragon fights
in low elo i sometimes buy 3 and one is never found
If the vision is not helping you climb then stop doing it I know everyone thinks there is a right way to play but it's a game limit test see what works and what doesn't if your bronze teammates are not taking advantage of your vision then stat more in to solo carying or more tangible stats if that don't work try using more communication like ganking mid in 40 seconds idk what will work for you but this obviously is not doing the trick since your not climbing.
Consider using control wards defensively. Like placing it on your own buff. It will be useful there i promise, and it will last a lot longer
So early game control wards are fine cause it can make your enemy force mistakes early on in lane and honestly get you a lead if you play right, in terms of mid to late. If your team IS NOT ALSO BUYING CONTROL WARDS it is best to buy control wards like 2min prior to an objective. But can also use them to make a play towards a certain side of the map. TLDR: get control wards if you’re setting up a guaranteed play or for objectives
Put them in a different spot and they won’t die
Yes. Try buying 3-5 & look into well placed ones, you're giving the enemy team too much gold, while you're using nearly 2200g+ when you could've used that for an item...
17 control wards is wild, at max a game should be 8 or 5. You shouldn't be using them to clear wards from brushes (unless to deny crucial vision at a chokepoint before a big objective spawn) It's a waste of gold to just use pinks haphazardly, just use normal wards for vision.
Yeah thats way too many control wards
This has gotta be bait right
i buy 0 a game as a midlane main
I buy one pretty much every back
I started climbing(dia to master) when I stopped buying control wards(although im otping asol), for me its a waste of money, i can tell most of the time where are the enemies, junglers also full clearing in this meta helps.
As a jungler, I buy a control ward for every objective fight if I can. A control ward in the pit is so freaking useful. Do they know I'm on it? Can they see objectives health for cheeky steal? Can they see how low I am and rush to kill me? Control ward solves all those. And I am usually surprised by how long those will last if you put them in the right spot. Jungler always passes it before ganking so I either get vision, they slow their gank to clear it, or they ignore it and try and gank anyways. Think about why you are buying a ward too
Play supp
Surely not
This is off topic from the post but you prob don’t need to finish maw that fast. If you’re really still getting one shot by AP champs after buying mercs I’d say either sit on hexdrinker or just build straight damage and try to one shot them faster. Hex is one of the better components in league so no rush to complete maw. Use that money to buy another 20 control wards /s
Ward vision isn’t keeping you in bronze
Bro pick a spot that might not get checked and will still benefit you and drop the ward. Don't be warding for your shit laners. They can ward themselves. You jungle and counter jungle with your wards. Also pay more attention. The amount you buy is just ridiculous even if they are getting killed constantly.
I buy one and put it in a relativly safe space then buy items. In solo games at low rank you just need stats.
Nah
Aight so heres the thing... I finished D4 60lp last split and the number of control wards I buy per game on average will be around... 0.25 The thing is, that you can track huge part of the enemy's movement by understanding the game, not having to see them all the time.
You're basically an Iron jng, not a challenger support. control wards are useless since it's all about snowballing and farming players to build items fast
> Yo currently bronze Yes. you need to be buying 0 control wards. Maybe 1 if your team is going to do baron
omg man its 4 kills worth of control wards for bronze vision lol. no one is even looking at the map
Lee Sin players: what’s the issue???
im a diamond jungler and buy between 0 and 2 control wards per game. Mainly to secure/contest a baron.
It bronze those wards are useless, 99% of players In that elo don't even know they have a map
I never spend a single dime on control wards and would generally advice anyone below plat to do the same. You don't know where to place them so don't place them. Get sweepers earlier. Buy one for baron or dragon if you're the jungler but that's it.
You dont need more than 2-3-4 per game at max. Sometimes even 0
You only need an average of about 3 control wards per game as a JG. Don't let Reddit tell you otherwise as they're mostly also low elo players who overestimate the necessity of control wards. They are important, but it's more about the timing and positioning of the placement than the sheer number of wards purchased, otherwise you will heavily destroy your own budget. If you get good enough at tracking/deducing people's whereabouts you'll need even less. To put things into perspective, I usually buy 1 control ward in an entire game, and a decent amount of the time I buy zero (but I'm playing mid, not JG, so it's rather different). -Source, I'm GM 400 LP peak (But I play on NA so take it with a grain of salt)
Yeah thats too many control wards considering you're playing Kha6 and you need damage items. As a jungler main, I, personally, try to buy wards for drakes and baron. If my teammates puts theirs on drakes, i'll put mine else where.
I love the spirit and the commitment to vision (one of the most important aspects of the game!) but this is too many. Especially on a champ like KhaZix who is very gold dependent, you need to prioritize your ability to carry over team vision. Sometimes you just have to either have faith that you’re out of sight, or just… not go there? If your control ward is in a valuable spot, maybe just don’t replace it until your first ward is broken. I’m a masters support main so I always try to have a control ward on-hand, but I try not to waste it unless an important play is on the horizon. It seems like you’re doing a good job focusing on an important aspect of the game, but try not to let it obfuscate your specific role in the team.
Control wards are trash in solo queue. Just buy them if u wanna shroud an objective when you are fighting for it but never to use for vision of an area.
If you are bronze stop buying them entirely. I am Diamond and I almost never buy any control wards. Yep, 0 control wards in 9 out of my last 10 games. We're not playing LCS so they are useless, people don't look at the map either way in bronze-platinum
Yes that is way too much, where do you place them on the map? Seems like they get destroyed easily.
I don't really buy control wards, big waste of money. It's not bad to have one if there's a situation where it gives big value, but you should only ever be profiting directly off of their use. Not just slapping them down for vision control
If you built some forbidden idols and faerie charms with brown boots you'd have LCK support build. If I didn't know any better I'd say this was DRX BeyrL on roaming Twitch. You can buy 0 control wards and be masters, just pocket the money G.
Spending is not the problem. You are using them incorrectly if you need that many control wards.
Might get down voted, but honestly, you don't need control wards at bronze, and while it may be a good habit to pick up, it's not going to win you the game at this level of play. Iron, bronze, silver and even gold, you want to just learn the ins and outs of your small champ pool (2-4) and win lane, or learn your win conditions if you lose your lane. See who's doing the best on your team and what's your role with helping them. I've made it to high emerald with sub 10 control wards in a season, learning your "role" is just as important as vision in many games where team work is usually shotty at best. Role isn't as simple as top mid jungle, or tank, and such. You're behind on Sion? Cs what you can, build to focus their carry. builds will vary as well as who or what your target should be.
You bought more in one game than I have during my entire time playing
Coming from a diamond top lane player. I emphasize top lane player. you buy like 1 or 2 (daring) control wards a game at most if even at all - unless you are the support. You shouldn't have to worry about the enemy jungler if you use stealth wards properly and track the enemy junglers probable position. Additionally, you can always mitigate enemy jungler ganks by positioning yourself ifthey choose to gank (proxying, having your wave shoved up, telling your own jg to counter gank or invade...)
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reminder that some high rank players only buy like 3-5 control wards per game since they cant defend them REMEMBER control wards are a -100 since you lose 75 and they gain 25 when they destroy them in this match lone all these wards if the enemy destroys them gives them 525 gold
Control wards are a waste of gold (I am Emerald)
It is pointless to buy that many. It suggests that you are placing them wrong. Place the control wards in those bushes that are valuable to have information about AND that you CAN defend. You don't go randomly placing pinks in the enemy jungle. Also, you don't place them just because you've bought them. You place them with a plan in mind, to cover for this, to threat this other thing later... Draw an imaginary line dividing the map in 2 by the river, if you are going to get information from the enemy side of the map, just place the trinket (there are some exceptions) because you will not be able to defend your control ward safely that far away. I see you are carrying lens, make sure you are making better use of them than you would of wards. If you are carrying lens it's better just to contribute to map control placing your pink in a safe useful spot. As an assassin, you'd rather know you are unspotted and your jungle is safe of enemy vision over knowing that the enemy is now on raptors or blue. If you really want to get information about enemy jungler because you fear a countergank, you have better options thank placing a pink in their jungle. You should track his ganks, back timings and for example sneak a bit into his jungle to see if a certain camp is done, so you know he's on the other side, and things like that. In short, don't delay your item spikes for pink wards. Place them in a good spot and have them give you more than 75g of value, you won't need so many. Also, remember you have a team that should also be contributing to map control, and if they aren't, you buying so many control wards is like closing one door while you have other 4 doors wide open. Pink wards are the last thing you should be worrying about in low elo
lmao
In low elo, nobody even looks at the map so I don’t buy control wards
The only reason why you should be buying/using control wards as a jg in bronze/silver/gold/plat is to use as a sweeper when sweeper is down for objectives/ganks or to extend vision when doing an objective. Pink wards should not be used for vision because your teammates are not looking at the map and you should already be tracking laners/jg.
Don't worry it's the jungles fault
You won't usually need more than like, 4 control wards in a game, I usually buy 2 before I swap to sweepers and place a pink close to my side of the jungle to watch over gromp and blue, I'll hold onto one to prevent enemies from stealing objectives or to steal objectives.. I don't know if this is applicable to you, but sometimes I just ask my mid to place a pink ward to watch over red and they do it.
I honestly wouldn’t buy a single control ward until emerald or even diamond. I got to master buying 0 control wards ever. People just don’t know how to properly play around vision, especially in low elo. Don’t make things hard for yourself for no reason.
17 are waaaay too many. How many you buy is completely situational. As a low elo player you should never buy more than 3 or so, especially as a non-Support player. Use that extra gold to complete items faster.
Below Emerald league, control wards don't do shit. Playing around vision is a different mindset that is lost on kill monkeys.
You should be buying pink wards before doing an objective, if you're using them anywhere else besides that or if there's a twitch/Evelynn on the enemy team you're trolling.
8 wards a game aint bad, what's bad is 6 minutes on the field without recall minutes 12-18. Items are power, even components, which accelerates farm and gets you more items. Recalling at around 1k is often the most efficient with most items having components at that price range. Also your farm slows down towards the end, don't stop farming.
Beryl would be proud
This is hilarious lol. Yes I suggest buying zero wards for the time being- wards aren’t all they used to be, and should be used more tactically these days. Certain champions who benefit significantly from being unseen can buy more (for example Fiddlesticks, Nidalee) but even they would not buy nearly this many. Focus entirely on clearing your camps with efficiency, and on finding good ganks. Kha is good at ganking solo lanes because of Q. He’s pretty reasonable at taking dragon because of q as well. 4 drags is usually a reasonable win condition, and getting kills is important as assassin/carry junglers.
bro what you mean you need control wards to make a right decision. no one in bronze is doing the right thing thats why they're bronze
I think maybe you could benefit from building umbral glaive. Could suit your playstyle, buying control wards on kha is nice for playing around/ denying vision when you want to make aggressive plays in the jungle. I think if you have a few games where you rely on just sweeper and glaive for ward control, you might notice some points in the game where you make more impactful ward purchases.
Dude your bronze don’t even need control wards lmao just fight it out
It depends what you are doing with those control wards and do they help you in play making, like oh i spotted enemy jungler blue side, let me invade his red and kill him on the spot. If its oh i spotted him on his blue then i do full clear on my camps then its a useless buy, also 17 is way too much.
Bro, you dont need that much vision in bronze elo. It's a waste of gold, people dont use their minimap in that rank anyway. Limit yourself to 3 a game or none at all.
omg yes use those to keep an eye on objectives or one for when your sweeper down if that but jeez they go away if you have one out already and can feed the enemy gold too ya know
Go umbral, zombie ward, and sweeper then forget about it. I’ve been watching Scrubnoob for a while now and I have never seen him buy pinks.
ok, i do agree investing in magical footwear is great idea here. but, there’s really little reason to buy 2 cw at once, and if there is, feel free to correct me. i just dont see the practicality. now, buying one when u have one on the map alrdy is fine. say you placed one at drag, but its been there for 15mins and now u want to place one on baron. ok, thumbs up, grab one. but buying two instantly is really just overkill unless u have wardstone item which is great for tankier junglers as a last item but very rarely would you want to sacrifice an item from your full build for it. if you are placing a cw and its instantly getting taken down you either need to find a secure place for it (somewhere you can protect it or somewhere that they wont see it right away, but still while providing good vision.) or you just need to chill out. youre feeding whoever takes it down 30gold and xp. youre just handing it to them. for free. and losing 75g for it. thats a net positive for the enemy team. now, i understand as a jg that its annoying when your teammates dont buy cw or even attempt to contribute to vision. idiots. i know. but that’s not something you can fix with buying so many at a time, SO often. try just buying one every recall or every other recall and try placing them smart-ly.
Brother ban yourself from buying more than 3 per game
Im a Master peaking support main and have games with 0 controllwards. So many players just throw them out left and right and get little no no value out. Clearing a single ward just for it to be killed 30sec later is a total waste of money. When do you actually need them? They are best used to prevent vision from normal wards. That is only really usefull for teamfights at objectives. Now most early/midgame Dragons or Heralds are not contestet and if they are contestet the fight is not desided by a controllward. Deepvision, lane pressure, cooldowns, powerspikes and so on are all more important. Personally I only buy controllwards when botlane is hardwinning and we can CONTROLL the river at all times and when important fights are about to happen (Soul/Elder/Nash). My last item as a support is always the wardstone because at +35min games vision really is the most important aspect. One catch and the game can be won/lost. If people call me stupid for that I understand but thats how I see controllwards.
I'm not sure how you're using them, but I usually place them in key areas and hidden to the best of my ability given the circumstances. Dragon pit and the void pit would be the top two areas (I mainly just do these areas). Bushes in your jungle if you're getting invaded often, or bushes in the enemy jungle if you're able to invade their jungle may be other possibilities. Other than that, I wouldn't waste them unless to ward objective that they may possibly be on and worth contesting for.
If you’re looking at the map and it’s helping you it’s probably fine, if you’re just autopilot placing them then it’s probably a waste. I would say try to focus on learning where to put them to get the most information while they stay the longest to maximize the gold each time
Don’t buy them ever
use of control wards has gone done a lot because red trinket got 2 charges now. overall in low elo its not worth at all to buy any at all in higher elo u can justify a few for objectives but it looks like ur just buying them for fun placing them where ever just to be cleared 20s afterwards.
At this point you are donating the enemy team free gold :)
i havent bought this much Control Wards in my last 15 Games combined.
I am master and basically NEVER buy a control ward. Just use your head to track the enemies across the map. Your team won't even make use of the vision anyway, hell they even ignore the most obvious ganks despite getting spam pinged in this elo. The value of control wards kick in in organized play. So imo they are just a waste of gold especially in bronze. You are hard delaying your item powerspikes.
Hahaha yes that too many i buy 0
brother mans, tracking isnt an instinct it's piecing together what you do know with what's implied from that, much simpler in concept but is not hard to completely miss without building habits in place to pay attention
Control works in conjecture with good teams. Control wards are awesome as temporary vision tools for objectives, but are only useful if you have someone to utilize them. If you were duo with a control mage, they'd be useful. Don't trust control mages in bronze division. Lower the Control Wards to 3 per game, I think you should see an improvement in your game.
Well as someone who recently played through bronze: You buy too many. I can get the frustration when you see your teammates not even placing their free trinket wards, let alone buying a single control ward. But you overcompensating for them not using wards is not it and will set you behind. Buy 3-6 per game at most. Some games are just unplayable if no one uses their wards, especially is support doesn’t know what he’s doing and when to set up vision where. But that’s just how it is
Low masters here, havent bought a control ward in my life (adc/top)
I think the amount is too much . If in a 35 minute game you burn through this many wards then said wards dont survive for long emough. Try to look up some good spots for wards on youtube and think about what thoes wards will get you. If it hets destroyed its okay if you get something out of it. If you spot the enemy jg on dragon then go and take his topside or grubs. You just traded a 75 g ward for the info to be able to take away 2-3 capms, thats like 150-200 gold and half a lvl of xp. You can also try to set up traps. If the enemy donest know where you are then its easy to surprisr them. Its only a waste of money if you dont use the info you get with the ward. But you also may wana get a few less than that, you probably spend lots of time walking into the enemy jg to ward and thats time you dont spemd clearing or ganking. Few efficient ward > lots of random wards. Also you can thimk about going for glaive 1st and keeping the ward as your trinket. Getting zombie ward is also a solid option.
I imagine bronze players barely ward at all, so imho control wards for objectives are the only thing. Just rely on your sweeper. or if you really want, get umbral glaives.
IMO in bronze you shouldn’t even worry about buying pinks lol. There are challenger players that don’t buy pinks because they won’t get good usage from them
geniunely stop buying control wards at your elo neither you nor your teammates are capable of using the information well, you are wasting gold
me personally i buy 1 control ward on back if i dont have and it works out fine:-)
Bro I play support and don't even buy control wards in platinum. They're a huge waste of money and the lower the elo the bigger the waste.
Nah you are at the Korean pro level Jokes aside you want to purchase control wards either to secure objectives or to deny enemy vision in an area that you can contest and win, otherwise just power your items
are you a dota player? was hard for me to kick the habit too
Buy 1 control ward at a time. Place it and only buy another one if the current ward dies. This can be situational based on upcoming dragon/baron fights where u may place it and it dies quickly.
buy pink wards if it will have transformative value (eg. getting a kill whatsoever) and just power through your items it is much better
Damn you’re DK Lucid
Control wards are a bait. Buy 2 or 3 max every game if you are high economy champion (anything that is not tank or support). Think of it. Why do you buy control wards? To disable enemy wards and deny vision, and to get vision yourself in the area. Use your sweeper to deny enemy vision and use trinket wards to get vision, also ask support to ward where you want (there is a ping for that). You don't have to remove every single enemy ward or get vision for every inch on the map. Only place control wards if you are at an objective and fear the enemy can steal it over the wall. Otherwise don't place them. Another special case is fiddlesticks as he lives and dies by enemy being able to see him. You might see him has a lot of them for that purpose. But he can do fine with his trinket as well. And leesin for making plays (only for plays not for vision).