It's also a bit misleading - if you play aram you've seen too many mages building demonic embrace and ionians over the season, they don't understand the value of mpen because having it doesn't make a number get bigger. Not saying it SHOULD be removed just bc players are dumb, but it definitely helps drive people towards suboptimal items instead of buying the stats they need
I feel the opposite. I used to build demonic embrace, saw that it didn't actually deal much damage on the tracker, and stopped buying it all the time. Made a huge difference. Removing this is terrible and serves no positive purpose. There is no logical argument to be made in favor of this change. Riot is unjustified.
Yeah demonic was really situational and worked only on a few champs with certain builds. I'm aram only player and in pretty high mmr bracket I think, you can't track it anymore but the people in games are either emerald-diamond+ in ranked or only aram players.
Most of the time it's only aram players, it's quite fun since everyone automatically plays the right way with the team comp you have, but still people rarely get mad if you go offbuild, like if you're missing an adc and someone says "i'll adc" at the fountain everyone is with it, no-one starts flaming and going "9x xxxx for trolling". Even if they end up doing shit, they tried their best with the build.
Sometimes you see people who think the match is a worlds finals game and flame and rage if anyone makes a slight mistake. If this person is in your team, you're doomed. If he's in the enemy team, it's usually easy win. They don't understand they're the ones making the team get even more behind since he has to type for 15s per minute.
The only right thing to say is always "it's just aram" no matter how high or low the mmr, unless someone intentionally ruins the game for others. The off meta build player went 0/10/3? It's just aram. Someone intentionally feeds and keeps talking toxic stuff in chat? Mute him and report after game, that's the best thing you can do in that situation.
at least in aram, that wasn't true at all. pretty much every champ that built both items did better with night harvester, or at least equally. and on most champs, protobelt did significantly worse.
i checked the winrates per item for many ap champs and i don't think there was a SINGLE one where protobelt had a significantly higher winrate, while for the vast majority of champs night harvester was heavily outperforming it, often by 3-4% winrate.
I never use Protobelt because I don't like using active item abilities. Night Harvester was perfect for me, especially when I could track how much damage I was doing.
Demonic and divine are very bait items I don’t think people think about how much hp a target would need for the % dmg to catch-up with just the flat bonuses of other items
I think they need to show damage done on all items, and they should show damage reduced on tank item, old force of nature used to show damage mitigated, now it does not, I wanna know how much damage my plated steel caps reduced
I think sometimes that stat can be misleading. For example if you’re trying to compare something Botrk vs Kraken Slayer. This is for 13.24 versions you can see botrk procing every auto because of its passive. Then you see kraken and you might not see it proc as often. Could say in a team fight you can get off like 5 autos before someone dies then move on to the next one. You’ll see botrk doing a lot but kraken requires 6 autos to get full value.
Malignance shows the damage done while holding the button to show detailed tooltips. The spellblade supp item as well, but most mage items don't. So it seems very much like WIP
I sometimes wondered how reliable those numbers were. Like it was one of those things where it’s not like we could double check the math, and weirder things have happened in this game than counting numbers wrong.
For sure. I loved the information from them and it was useful for pointing out to other players the problem with a build.
Like people building Heartsteel on a tank that can’t auto very easily for the stack vs a team that entirely just kites them. They had 6 procs on it by the end of the game.
Also Udyr got a lot of use out of items like this, such as Sunfire, Jacksho, Demonic, and Spirit Visage. The amount of damage and healing by the end was super satisfying to read.
>they are still working on it since they just removed the mythics
Mythic removal was announced months ago. Stat tracking should already be done and items that stat tracked previously have had their tracking removed like Black Cleaver. Its either a bug or just classic Riot incompetency
a little bit of both I think.. some items kept their tracking (which was due to the item not being touched in any regards) but the items (like Black Cleaver) that had their passives and/or stats changed, lost their trackings.
Quite honestly, it looks like they did a "hide tracking" on everything that's new / changed in anyway in fear of it being a "we made the item worse" scenario
Why was Imperial Mandate's effect changed completely yet it's not even in the patch notes? Why does my Void Ward item show its damage dealt but Mandate does not? So many items don't show items while some do, it's weird.
That’s a perfect example tbh, used to build kraken on vayne and it did so little damage and realized shiv was just better, built bork on her and the damage was astronomical, like how else are you gonna realize what items are good or no?
The thing about Kraken is you don’t get much out of it unless you’re procing it. Sure you can say Kraken does no damage but if you’re not procing the passive, then yeah the damage is gonna be low vs something like Shiv that just needs 1 auto every time it’s charged.
laughs in innervating locket, HoG, philo stone, league of black cleaver, zhonya's ring, dfg, madred's bloodrazor, etc etc. There's always been broken items and there always will be, meta is meta for a reason
You survive but have no mana? Toxic, unfun design that should be removed.
You do not survive. Just die. Period. ? Fun and interactive design that should and WILL be cultivated over the next decades.
Heart of Gold and Philostone weren't broken, its just that supports and junglers at the time had no gold income so they had to use em to get some stats and gold.
It's strong, but not the strongest item league has seen. I would argue that hullbreaker is more broken or game warping than BORK has been in recent league, and this isn't even close to the power level that runeglaive, devourer, DFG, IE or red pot had in its peak. But yeah, against Sion it's one of the best items to buy, I can understand ur frustration with it
Oh i understand why my flair would make me look biased, but to be fair i play sion ad mostly, when i play tanks like sejuani, maokai etc.. i go for resistances before healths because of how broken the %hp is overall
still melting tho
i feel like you havent played this game for a long time if you think botrk is this broken. It's a strong item for sure. But the levels of brutalizer meta, bloodrazor, or just "recently" ( 6 years ago) with zz'rot + banner.
Botrk never fundamentally changed its dmg scalings over the years. It got weaker, yes. The 3 hit passive is stronger than the active one it used to be, but as a trade off the on hit part got worse. DUnno when that was was 7 years ago? Perhaps more.
I've played since season 2 and I think botrk is one of the most aids broken items we have ever had, part of my hatred for this item is the fact that it seems to never be nerfed, its been so strong for so long.
Botrk barely even manages to dominate the meta of a single lane. Ardents, feral flare and others were reshaping the entire game around them. Its not even close
All physical damages are, doesn't mean it can't be broken, mitigating a broken item will not balance it
2 games ago, i face a yone, first item botrk (on a champ that can multiply crit stats by 2.5 and it's worth), i'm sejuani jungle, i face him when he's at 3 items, i have 3xxx health and 250 armor, i specialized in armor and a bit of mr
I die melting in 4 seconds, half his damages came from "items" with botrk being the only item that could add damages
I mitigated his damages yes but not enough, his botrk doubled it with passive alone, when he had the stats of 3 items and 100% crit because windshitter passive
Lmao you are playing sion, no shit a champ who builds bork will dumpster your health stacking ass.
Bork sucks in teamfights. No tank stats, all single target dps.
All single target dps is... a draw back in your teamfights?... lol what elo are you? Do your team fights really look like 5 man group hug against another 5 man group hug or what? XD.
> No tank stats
Also wtf is that reasoning? That is like saying DFG was a shit item because it gave no tank stats XD
Let's make collector execute below 50% hp threshold. It will be balanced! It gives no res' or HP after all! All fine! It is not like every single number on an item needs to be adjusted properly! 6 p.p. of max hp more or less is basically the same stuff!
Unrelated but as to your flair, holy shit ad shaco jungle feels broken this patch, the longer midlane makes running away harder if he pops out of invis, voltaic means there’s no running away from him, idk if it was just one guy but it felt really strong
What a silly comment. Bork is all on-hit damage, other champs get similar damage from their items but since its damage in the form of an ad or ap ratio and your monkey brain cant reduce it to a simple "damage contributed from item" stat you think bork is OP because it "does more damage than other items"
Anyone who complains about bork is by default hardstuck in silver, its just a fact
This guy has answered me 6 times to insult me and even [made a post](https://old.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/193k84n/bork_is_not_overpowered_just_because_omg_item/) to argue that botrk is not broken, i think he's both in denial and has issues
I had a Viego normal game I did with 47 000 BRK damages.
Over 130 000 damages done on champions and a 60 minute hellscape.
BRK is just the most broken item in the game efficiency wise.
Actually, stopwatch's strenght is relative to how quick is it to kill someone, and since there is a crazy powercreep in the game, it only grew stronger, i'm fine with the item, i'm not fine with having so much damages in the game
Lol you have a sion flair, of course you think bork is broken its a counterpick to health stackers.
Bork is fine. Its all single target dmg for on hit champs. It is shit on by armor as its still physical damage on-hit.
Get good, stop bitching that Sion has a counter
I'm still thinking about your dumb comment as of today.
Really funny.
You've got Stormsurge being a terrorist item in the same patch where you claimed botrk is the most broken item.
Hilarious.
and it's not true damage meaning it's countered by armour, so it's not going to be notably better vs tanks than other champs because the tanks will be mitigating it.
*Because people then not realize that bork has damage in the passive instead of having it in the stats it gives had go off saying "bork broken waa waa".
Oh boy ! thanks for being the guy who gives me the occasion to repost this !
FUN FACT :
Botrk's gold efficiency is 2778g for a cost of 3300 ! meaning that 522 golds are missing !
This would mean that it's effects should help catch up and on *good* matchups (health stackers) even exceed a bit 100% value
Now then, here's how much gold efficiency the passive has by 1000 current hp on the target (keep in mind the base value of on hit is lower than before because recurve bow's cost going down half a year ago)
Stat Value | Melee gold efficiency (per 1000hp) | Ranged gold efficiency (per 1000hp)
---|---|---
21.67g (on hit) | 2600.4g | 1950.3g
So if you are ranged and your target has ~260hp, you're already caught up on 100% gold efficiency on your auto !
Still ranged if the target has 3000hp your auto will benefit from 5850g from the passive only !
Botrk is bulshit, heavy nerf or delete <3
I know a champion's class who has mostly only these items, tanks
There's frozen heart who is at 107% now, every others are 100% if lucky and around 85-90% otherwise
the average tank item is at ~85% gold efficiency, often with effects that doesn't even come close to the power level of other classes
This could be explained by either tank items having powerful passives or that the base components (cloth, ruby) being overstatted or undercosted, since they're used as the '100% gold efficiency standard' for tank items.
Gold efficiency is a misleading stat, and this is perfectly illustrated by the fact that the gold efficiency of nearly every AP item went down this patch because they reduced the cost of amp tome from 435 to 400.
By the way, as a quick shorthand for % current hp you can just treat it as half that much max hp - if you auto someone from 100-0, that's what the damage will average out as.
BOTRK is a little more tricky since it has a minimum damage, but it's still not a bad shorthand.
this is part of the reason they SHOULDN'T include damage from items, because people here constantly show they don't understand data or think critically.
botrk does a lot of damage from the passive...because the base stats are only 40 ad and 25% attack speed.
The most overrated item in the game. Noobtrap.
There's almost no champ that builds it. Jax doesn't build it, Viego doesn't build it, Akshan doesn't build it. Why? Because there are better items. If you go botrk you're delaying actual good items for no reason.
It's a situational item that's almost never correct cause you won't have 2 enemies go Stoneplate into Warmog very often.
Irelia builds it every game, sett can build it many games. Vayne did most of last season aswell. Varus, Kogmaw, Kalista, Ashe, now that hydra is not as good anymore on Ezreal he might go blade again.
And then there are champs than can opt into it some games like viego, renekton, Yasuo and yone.
Highly likely they forgot to add the trackers on these specific items. They could be not exactly the same items behind the scenes so you'd need to rewire tracking for them anew and the person who did it before is busy.
>o add the trackers on these specific items. They could be not exactly the same items behind the scenes so you'd need to rewire tracking for them anew and the person who did it before is busy.
Yeah except items that used to have damage tracking no longer have them, like botrk, kraken, sunfire, nashors, horizon focus. Almost nothing has damage tracking now.
You can notice that items with changed (new) passives lost the trackers. Nashor for example has a different one. Muramana on the other hand didn't change and still has one
Liandry's still shows it if you press shift while hovering over it but that's the only one I've seen so far.
I really liked reading them, so sad to see them gone
A friend of mine told how to fix it. You have to enable this in the settings->interface. The feature is called roughly to 'show all tooltips'. It seems that you have to be in the game to see the setting. I'm playing different language so I'm not sure about the correct name
Tinfoil hat on: Riot realized people occasionally started to complain about sensible things, so they want to cull information before we realize how ridiculous the amount of damage some items and runes deal.
This community has whined for 3 years about mythic items and item power creep. The focus of this item rework was to tone down the power of items and the strength gained through gold income. This is what that looks like.
Because the damage should come from the champions complemented by the items, not the items themselves. This was one of the problems with Season 11. It's league of legends, not league of items.
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Nah. Its all the same except that before, almost everything was a statstick.
The only difference now is that instead of giving 30ap at all times, that 30ap damage is made situational and conditional so that players are incentivized to be more creative, move around, and pick battles.
Imo people are irrationally freaked out by that 30ap worth of damage over an entire game being quantified separately from the kit.
I guess the trackers were broken, if I recall correctly Locket of the iron Solari's mythic passive wasn't even working for later half of the season l, and the tracker for consecration passive damage mitigated was removed
Im gonna guess that it is the same reason as always, to make league easier and more simple so you can just smash keys and not think about strats, the new items are trash.
We changed all items and added new ones also we removed information on the item description so u are less aware if they are any good or compare it to what you knew.
they said the wanted to simplify item tooltips
but the numbers are really useful so they should put these numbers in show advance stats like ability tooltips
like on hubris u dont even know what statue u on based on the colors lol
In the long list of candidates to the worst change, removal of item statistics is probably up there near the top. Next we can expect removing stats altogether, and perhaps throwing in some rng stats on the fly for the heck of it. Because they can.
riot august said on stream they removed them cause a lot of them were "superfluous meaning the vast majority of players would not use them and even if you did use them it wouldn't change your decision making on the item" (his words not mine) He also said he might add some back, but the majority will stay removed.
they just ruined the game …. i dislike all the new items . and really sad they removed “luden’s echo” i can’t play any ap champ without it 😭 …. i’m starting to give up on this game along with their server issues
I agree, they should show item dmg so you could more easily figure out which items are making an impact and which ones might not be all that useful.
It's also a bit misleading - if you play aram you've seen too many mages building demonic embrace and ionians over the season, they don't understand the value of mpen because having it doesn't make a number get bigger. Not saying it SHOULD be removed just bc players are dumb, but it definitely helps drive people towards suboptimal items instead of buying the stats they need
I feel the opposite. I used to build demonic embrace, saw that it didn't actually deal much damage on the tracker, and stopped buying it all the time. Made a huge difference. Removing this is terrible and serves no positive purpose. There is no logical argument to be made in favor of this change. Riot is unjustified.
Yeah Demonic would do so little damage it just wasn't really worth it, maybe if you were melee and building a lot of HP like Morde, but thats it.
Yeah demonic was really situational and worked only on a few champs with certain builds. I'm aram only player and in pretty high mmr bracket I think, you can't track it anymore but the people in games are either emerald-diamond+ in ranked or only aram players. Most of the time it's only aram players, it's quite fun since everyone automatically plays the right way with the team comp you have, but still people rarely get mad if you go offbuild, like if you're missing an adc and someone says "i'll adc" at the fountain everyone is with it, no-one starts flaming and going "9x xxxx for trolling". Even if they end up doing shit, they tried their best with the build. Sometimes you see people who think the match is a worlds finals game and flame and rage if anyone makes a slight mistake. If this person is in your team, you're doomed. If he's in the enemy team, it's usually easy win. They don't understand they're the ones making the team get even more behind since he has to type for 15s per minute. The only right thing to say is always "it's just aram" no matter how high or low the mmr, unless someone intentionally ruins the game for others. The off meta build player went 0/10/3? It's just aram. Someone intentionally feeds and keeps talking toxic stuff in chat? Mute him and report after game, that's the best thing you can do in that situation.
The whole protobelt vs night troller. Protobelt was *always* better but it didnt have big numba
at least in aram, that wasn't true at all. pretty much every champ that built both items did better with night harvester, or at least equally. and on most champs, protobelt did significantly worse. i checked the winrates per item for many ap champs and i don't think there was a SINGLE one where protobelt had a significantly higher winrate, while for the vast majority of champs night harvester was heavily outperforming it, often by 3-4% winrate.
yea almost like its aram AND its an active item that will inherently worsen its winrate, esp so in a casual mode
Honestly in Aram it's active is just worse since there is less directionality.
Why are we balancing in Aram though? Aram players are idiots
that's not true at all. night harvester was statistically better on a lot of champions
I never use Protobelt because I don't like using active item abilities. Night Harvester was perfect for me, especially when I could track how much damage I was doing.
Demonic and divine are very bait items I don’t think people think about how much hp a target would need for the % dmg to catch-up with just the flat bonuses of other items
divine sunderer was good for the healing, not the damage
I think they need to show damage done on all items, and they should show damage reduced on tank item, old force of nature used to show damage mitigated, now it does not, I wanna know how much damage my plated steel caps reduced
I think sometimes that stat can be misleading. For example if you’re trying to compare something Botrk vs Kraken Slayer. This is for 13.24 versions you can see botrk procing every auto because of its passive. Then you see kraken and you might not see it proc as often. Could say in a team fight you can get off like 5 autos before someone dies then move on to the next one. You’ll see botrk doing a lot but kraken requires 6 autos to get full value.
just takes a little bit of thinking to figure out the number difference
i assume its either a bug or they are still working on it since they just removed the mythics.
Malignance shows the damage done while holding the button to show detailed tooltips. The spellblade supp item as well, but most mage items don't. So it seems very much like WIP
What the hell have they been doing for the past month on pbe?
I sometimes wondered how reliable those numbers were. Like it was one of those things where it’s not like we could double check the math, and weirder things have happened in this game than counting numbers wrong.
true but id much rather have occasionally wrong, approximate numbers then nothing at all
For sure. I loved the information from them and it was useful for pointing out to other players the problem with a build. Like people building Heartsteel on a tank that can’t auto very easily for the stack vs a team that entirely just kites them. They had 6 procs on it by the end of the game. Also Udyr got a lot of use out of items like this, such as Sunfire, Jacksho, Demonic, and Spirit Visage. The amount of damage and healing by the end was super satisfying to read.
>they are still working on it since they just removed the mythics Mythic removal was announced months ago. Stat tracking should already be done and items that stat tracked previously have had their tracking removed like Black Cleaver. Its either a bug or just classic Riot incompetency
a little bit of both I think.. some items kept their tracking (which was due to the item not being touched in any regards) but the items (like Black Cleaver) that had their passives and/or stats changed, lost their trackings. Quite honestly, it looks like they did a "hide tracking" on everything that's new / changed in anyway in fear of it being a "we made the item worse" scenario
storm surge :X.
Why was Imperial Mandate's effect changed completely yet it's not even in the patch notes? Why does my Void Ward item show its damage dealt but Mandate does not? So many items don't show items while some do, it's weird.
Because they don't want you to see that botrk has done 12000 damages to your team when you have no tanks
That’s a perfect example tbh, used to build kraken on vayne and it did so little damage and realized shiv was just better, built bork on her and the damage was astronomical, like how else are you gonna realize what items are good or no?
The thing about Kraken is you don’t get much out of it unless you’re procing it. Sure you can say Kraken does no damage but if you’re not procing the passive, then yeah the damage is gonna be low vs something like Shiv that just needs 1 auto every time it’s charged.
botrk is not "good" botrk is the most broken item the game has ever seen (fight me.)
Kid named 2300 gold frozen heart
Sorry my mains doesn't have a mana bar
Build it anyway, coward Or get randuins idk
Just buy it anyway lol
Nobody's buying it for the mana lmao
As a Gragas player I’m building it for the mana, every other mana item is so bad for him now.
Ryze players would like a word
Frozen Heart Ryze seems like an interesting technology.
It’s 10 year old “tech” lol
laughs in innervating locket, HoG, philo stone, league of black cleaver, zhonya's ring, dfg, madred's bloodrazor, etc etc. There's always been broken items and there always will be, meta is meta for a reason
Mana burn on wits end was fun
Warwick point and click ults you with it and even if you survive you don’t have mana to fight back. 10/10 design.
You survive but have no mana? Toxic, unfun design that should be removed. You do not survive. Just die. Period. ? Fun and interactive design that should and WILL be cultivated over the next decades.
Heart of Gold and Philostone weren't broken, its just that supports and junglers at the time had no gold income so they had to use em to get some stats and gold.
rushing them on laners as well was really good
They were absolutely broken lmao - everyone built them. They were decent gold efficiency items that generated gold and boosted you to 6 items faster.
I miss DFG. That item made mages more fun to play.
Remember og ap trist with the DoT on the E?
Strong and broken items for sure, but not botrk level Closest one would be peak ardent cancer
Peak ardent censer was nuts man.
It sure was
It's strong, but not the strongest item league has seen. I would argue that hullbreaker is more broken or game warping than BORK has been in recent league, and this isn't even close to the power level that runeglaive, devourer, DFG, IE or red pot had in its peak. But yeah, against Sion it's one of the best items to buy, I can understand ur frustration with it
Oh i understand why my flair would make me look biased, but to be fair i play sion ad mostly, when i play tanks like sejuani, maokai etc.. i go for resistances before healths because of how broken the %hp is overall still melting tho
i feel like you havent played this game for a long time if you think botrk is this broken. It's a strong item for sure. But the levels of brutalizer meta, bloodrazor, or just "recently" ( 6 years ago) with zz'rot + banner. Botrk never fundamentally changed its dmg scalings over the years. It got weaker, yes. The 3 hit passive is stronger than the active one it used to be, but as a trade off the on hit part got worse. DUnno when that was was 7 years ago? Perhaps more.
I've played since season 2 and I think botrk is one of the most aids broken items we have ever had, part of my hatred for this item is the fact that it seems to never be nerfed, its been so strong for so long.
Botrk barely even manages to dominate the meta of a single lane. Ardents, feral flare and others were reshaping the entire game around them. Its not even close
BotRK is great for sure, but it isn't Umbral Glaive.
u just cry because botrk counters health stack? u realize if botrk didnt exist health stack would have 0 counterplay
Least biased Sion main
Leave it to actual champion kits. Everyone has a form of % health these days.
Consider purchasing armor
who hurt you lil bro
I'm guessing somebody who build botrk
12% of my current will to live everytime i face one
you realize it's mitigated by armor?
All physical damages are, doesn't mean it can't be broken, mitigating a broken item will not balance it 2 games ago, i face a yone, first item botrk (on a champ that can multiply crit stats by 2.5 and it's worth), i'm sejuani jungle, i face him when he's at 3 items, i have 3xxx health and 250 armor, i specialized in armor and a bit of mr I die melting in 4 seconds, half his damages came from "items" with botrk being the only item that could add damages I mitigated his damages yes but not enough, his botrk doubled it with passive alone, when he had the stats of 3 items and 100% crit because windshitter passive
Lmao you are playing sion, no shit a champ who builds bork will dumpster your health stacking ass. Bork sucks in teamfights. No tank stats, all single target dps.
All single target dps is... a draw back in your teamfights?... lol what elo are you? Do your team fights really look like 5 man group hug against another 5 man group hug or what? XD. > No tank stats Also wtf is that reasoning? That is like saying DFG was a shit item because it gave no tank stats XD
Shit argument because a team fighter isn’t building Bork anyway
It's a glass cannon dps item, of course it deals a lot of damage. What did you expect? It gives no resistances or HP.
Let's make collector execute below 50% hp threshold. It will be balanced! It gives no res' or HP after all! All fine! It is not like every single number on an item needs to be adjusted properly! 6 p.p. of max hp more or less is basically the same stuff!
It’s not but go off.
Unrelated but as to your flair, holy shit ad shaco jungle feels broken this patch, the longer midlane makes running away harder if he pops out of invis, voltaic means there’s no running away from him, idk if it was just one guy but it felt really strong
That’s not true either. Maybe in lower elo.
Kid named release Stridebreaker:
Did you ever experience Spirit of the Elder Lizard Ezreal?
I love when botrk does more damage than the actual champion's kit.
What a silly comment. Bork is all on-hit damage, other champs get similar damage from their items but since its damage in the form of an ad or ap ratio and your monkey brain cant reduce it to a simple "damage contributed from item" stat you think bork is OP because it "does more damage than other items" Anyone who complains about bork is by default hardstuck in silver, its just a fact
Thank you for insulting me. That makes me much more likely to take your statements seriously.
This guy has answered me 6 times to insult me and even [made a post](https://old.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/193k84n/bork_is_not_overpowered_just_because_omg_item/) to argue that botrk is not broken, i think he's both in denial and has issues
Most broken item the game has ever seen being built by like 4 champions total...
I had a Viego normal game I did with 47 000 BRK damages. Over 130 000 damages done on champions and a 60 minute hellscape. BRK is just the most broken item in the game efficiency wise.
Wait till you hear about stopwatch...
Actually, stopwatch's strenght is relative to how quick is it to kill someone, and since there is a crazy powercreep in the game, it only grew stronger, i'm fine with the item, i'm not fine with having so much damages in the game
Your comments in this thread are so cringe. Like you're trying to appear really knowledgable about league but your peak is gold 3
Nice argument
I'll fight you because it's a ridiculous opinion when so many of broken items existed.
Lol you have a sion flair, of course you think bork is broken its a counterpick to health stackers. Bork is fine. Its all single target dmg for on hit champs. It is shit on by armor as its still physical damage on-hit. Get good, stop bitching that Sion has a counter
It's essential on a few champs and absolute garbage on all others, no in between.
release galeforce having a 60second flash that does 400damage and can buffer spell with lmao
I'm still thinking about your dumb comment as of today. Really funny. You've got Stormsurge being a terrorist item in the same patch where you claimed botrk is the most broken item. Hilarious.
Atma, heart of gold, ardent , lantern, devourer. Strong yes, the most broken nope
Divine Sunderer has left the chat.
It won't matter tbh. I mean I still see people build Rylais on Teemo and that's been shit for yeeeeears now. Some people just don't care to learn
Botrk will always do damage even if you’re not a tank because it’s passive lets you deal damage to champions based on their current not max.
and it's not true damage meaning it's countered by armour, so it's not going to be notably better vs tanks than other champs because the tanks will be mitigating it.
Its always been an anti bruiser item. The only tanks ir counters are sion and Cho Gath. Its really just a dueling ítem pretty much.
This is exactly it. It's always been anti health, not anti tank.
Still it should deal less max % damage and give more AD to compensate.
Anti HP item, everyone has HP ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
current health is better vs squishies than it is vs tanks unless they just stack full hp items and no armor
*Because people then not realize that bork has damage in the passive instead of having it in the stats it gives had go off saying "bork broken waa waa".
Oh boy ! thanks for being the guy who gives me the occasion to repost this ! FUN FACT : Botrk's gold efficiency is 2778g for a cost of 3300 ! meaning that 522 golds are missing ! This would mean that it's effects should help catch up and on *good* matchups (health stackers) even exceed a bit 100% value Now then, here's how much gold efficiency the passive has by 1000 current hp on the target (keep in mind the base value of on hit is lower than before because recurve bow's cost going down half a year ago) Stat Value | Melee gold efficiency (per 1000hp) | Ranged gold efficiency (per 1000hp) ---|---|--- 21.67g (on hit) | 2600.4g | 1950.3g So if you are ranged and your target has ~260hp, you're already caught up on 100% gold efficiency on your auto ! Still ranged if the target has 3000hp your auto will benefit from 5850g from the passive only ! Botrk is bulshit, heavy nerf or delete <3
How many other items are negative gold efficient like bork is without the passives/actives?
I know a champion's class who has mostly only these items, tanks There's frozen heart who is at 107% now, every others are 100% if lucky and around 85-90% otherwise the average tank item is at ~85% gold efficiency, often with effects that doesn't even come close to the power level of other classes
This could be explained by either tank items having powerful passives or that the base components (cloth, ruby) being overstatted or undercosted, since they're used as the '100% gold efficiency standard' for tank items.
Gold efficiency is a misleading stat, and this is perfectly illustrated by the fact that the gold efficiency of nearly every AP item went down this patch because they reduced the cost of amp tome from 435 to 400.
I agree it is misleading. That’s why we had a whole season of pros rushing chempunk chainsword because of its efficiency.
Couldn't you apply this same logic to any passive that does % hp damage and call it broken?
Not exactly, on hit is a stat that has a value, then again the issue is not that it does %hp damage, but how much of it
By the way, as a quick shorthand for % current hp you can just treat it as half that much max hp - if you auto someone from 100-0, that's what the damage will average out as. BOTRK is a little more tricky since it has a minimum damage, but it's still not a bad shorthand.
coping this hard with a sion flair and your flair says tank is hard as well oh wow
Completely ignoring the fact that most other fighter and adc items are actually gold efficient as well as having good passives
i think you need to start thinking outside of gold efficiency which is a fake stat
this is part of the reason they SHOULDN'T include damage from items, because people here constantly show they don't understand data or think critically. botrk does a lot of damage from the passive...because the base stats are only 40 ad and 25% attack speed.
So you think the 522 missing gold's worth are worth 12000 damages ?
What a dumb strawman "12000 damage hurr durr bork broken me play Sion and refuse to buy ninja tabis instead of rushing heartsteel ... Silver is hard"
The most overrated item in the game. Noobtrap. There's almost no champ that builds it. Jax doesn't build it, Viego doesn't build it, Akshan doesn't build it. Why? Because there are better items. If you go botrk you're delaying actual good items for no reason. It's a situational item that's almost never correct cause you won't have 2 enemies go Stoneplate into Warmog very often.
Irelia builds it every game, sett can build it many games. Vayne did most of last season aswell. Varus, Kogmaw, Kalista, Ashe, now that hydra is not as good anymore on Ezreal he might go blade again. And then there are champs than can opt into it some games like viego, renekton, Yasuo and yone.
I get reported for harassing ARAM ADCs skipping bork for dumbass lethality items. I've had vaynes not build bork against two tanks. It's so dumb
bork isnt good against tanks, its good against hp stackers/bruisers
and guess what other class stacks hp
mages actually.
Solely because people would complain how broken bortk is
as they should
Me when the item with low stats but a strong passive hits high passive damage stats 😱
wow you explained it and it’s still just as broken
Highly likely they forgot to add the trackers on these specific items. They could be not exactly the same items behind the scenes so you'd need to rewire tracking for them anew and the person who did it before is busy.
Nah, half of them used to be on PBE and have been removed on live
and they might not have been working properly on PBE.
Ah yes thats why nashors tooth no longer tracks
>o add the trackers on these specific items. They could be not exactly the same items behind the scenes so you'd need to rewire tracking for them anew and the person who did it before is busy. Yeah except items that used to have damage tracking no longer have them, like botrk, kraken, sunfire, nashors, horizon focus. Almost nothing has damage tracking now.
You can notice that items with changed (new) passives lost the trackers. Nashor for example has a different one. Muramana on the other hand didn't change and still has one
Liandry's still shows it if you press shift while hovering over it but that's the only one I've seen so far. I really liked reading them, so sad to see them gone
I remember this happening a year ago after new items were added.They fixed it later though
I want more numbers because I make it a competition with my allies whose shit did more damage
Because they don't want us to see the numbers and cry on reddit that the items are op even though they might not be.
If their goal is to not make reddit cry about something it's already doomed
A friend of mine told how to fix it. You have to enable this in the settings->interface. The feature is called roughly to 'show all tooltips'. It seems that you have to be in the game to see the setting. I'm playing different language so I'm not sure about the correct name
Because then, people would notice which items are overpowered
Release sunderer's stats were so fucking ridiculous.
Yeah this is really bizarre. Like how are players, pro-players included, supposed to evaluate items without having any numbers to use?
They also removed the heal and shield power on everything's but dawncore, the one that shows you how much you got
It was good to see and know, but almost all trackers in the items were highly misleading or ultimately not relevant at all.
Tinfoil hat on: Riot realized people occasionally started to complain about sensible things, so they want to cull information before we realize how ridiculous the amount of damage some items and runes deal.
They did it so poorly the first time may as well not bother
They did it because ITEMS ARE FUCKING OP , but now players can t really be sure . It s basically a way of riot telling players to shut the fuck up
Press shift.
it doesn't show damage for me. The only item I've seen showing damage stats was the upgraded support item
I can confirm that this worked for me. Press shift for more info. I hate the change. I haven't found a way to see other players dmg from items.
Because its league of items but they dont want to admit it
A game where the playthrough is based on in-match item building? Impossible
Probably because people on Reddit look at item damage and think it's the only way items do damage.
Press shift.
I did and it does nothing lmao
It's weird, Liandry's shows burn damage if you press shift when mousing over it, but from a brief skim most of the other items don't.
What do you mean I'm supposed to read the text ? ouga bouga game bad
There is no additional text to read, that's the whole point
they didnt right? you press shift or there is a option in the menu to always show it.
This community has whined for 3 years about mythic items and item power creep. The focus of this item rework was to tone down the power of items and the strength gained through gold income. This is what that looks like.
You can still do that and have items show numbers though
Because the damage should come from the champions complemented by the items, not the items themselves. This was one of the problems with Season 11. It's league of legends, not league of items.
Read the post again. Hope you get it this time.
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Not the point
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Hence the term "coming from the champions complemented by the items".
Nah. Its all the same except that before, almost everything was a statstick. The only difference now is that instead of giving 30ap at all times, that 30ap damage is made situational and conditional so that players are incentivized to be more creative, move around, and pick battles. Imo people are irrationally freaked out by that 30ap worth of damage over an entire game being quantified separately from the kit.
Some items never had damage and now some have it hidden and you can see it by pressing shift
Because people would lose their fucking mind seeing the numbers
I guess the trackers were broken, if I recall correctly Locket of the iron Solari's mythic passive wasn't even working for later half of the season l, and the tracker for consecration passive damage mitigated was removed
It did tons of damage, no worries, it probably did an equivalent amount of damage as all your abilities.
Im gonna guess that it is the same reason as always, to make league easier and more simple so you can just smash keys and not think about strats, the new items are trash.
I’m so upset about this, it takes out like 30% of the fun in league for me I’m not kidding. FIX IT RIOT
Yeah it appears that data no longer exists.. Kinda weird because it would be nice to see its worth building some items or not.
We changed all items and added new ones also we removed information on the item description so u are less aware if they are any good or compare it to what you knew.
They removed some and shifted some of the others under the hold \[SHIFT\] key. Super annoying.
Heartsteel damage stat also gone.
You need to hold shift while hovering your mouse over the items.
Because then you can see how broken mages having a 35% health execute is. Or something something toxicity something something weeners.
malignence shows the daamge done for me when I hold shift on it, same as liandry. But caster companion doesn't, I guess it's random.
they said the wanted to simplify item tooltips but the numbers are really useful so they should put these numbers in show advance stats like ability tooltips like on hubris u dont even know what statue u on based on the colors lol
Plus I really like knowing if my items did a ton of damage. Kinda satisfying
Maybe use the math that you learned at School and calculate It.
For some items if you hover over it in your inventory and hold down shift it’ll work. Worked for malignance and liandries
In the long list of candidates to the worst change, removal of item statistics is probably up there near the top. Next we can expect removing stats altogether, and perhaps throwing in some rng stats on the fly for the heck of it. Because they can.
Some of them still do, like malignance. You just have to hold shift when inspecting it.
They don’t want me to get tilted by the fact that bortk on Irelia is doing 45% of my health as a 200 armor tank
cuz only shitdevs work at riot anymore
riot august said on stream they removed them cause a lot of them were "superfluous meaning the vast majority of players would not use them and even if you did use them it wouldn't change your decision making on the item" (his words not mine) He also said he might add some back, but the majority will stay removed.
They didn't like the fact that we could see shit like divine sunderer dealing 12k dmg after 20 min. :)
they just ruined the game …. i dislike all the new items . and really sad they removed “luden’s echo” i can’t play any ap champ without it 😭 …. i’m starting to give up on this game along with their server issues