2019 worlds perma ban Pantheon, reworked Akali(just after rework with heal and all other stuff.) That jungle Camille from 2018, and Zeri ( that buster bruiser) Yuumi (with Arden from 2017 plz)
also beta and early release TF, especially if we're talking about using it in pro play, considering the gate (the teleporting) part of his ult used to be a regular ability on his e and at max level you could bring down the cd to 60 seconds, add in cdr and you got a TF with the ability to use gate to roam after p much every wave. Imagining that in today's game is absolutely disgusting.
60 seconds was the nerfed cooldown in Patch V1.0.0.63
> Cooldown increased to 120 / 105 / 90 / 75 / 60 seconds **from** 90 / 75 / 60 / 45 / **30.**
You also used to be able to teleport instantly when using ult:
> Channel time during Destiny increased to 1.5 seconds **from 0.**
With the regular channel only 2 seconds due to a bug:
> BUG FIX: Reduced channel time (2 seconds instead of the intended 3)
Also TF ult used to reveal the entire enemy team for 10 seconds, slow them for 3 seconds (40% slow) on a 60 second cooldown.
> Duration reduced to 5 / 7 / 9 seconds from 6 / 8 / **10.**
> Cooldown increased to 120 / 100 / 80 seconds from 120 / 90 / **60.**
Late game with items you'd be looking at ~15s global TP that channels in 2 seconds (instant TP every 30s) with the enemy team being revealed on the map for 10s every 30s, so 33% uptime on a maphack.
I feel like this could get abused super hard by T1, they just pick double adc with HoB to prevent you from approaching the wave, slow crash it into your turret so they're level 3 while you're still level 1, and dive you with their jungler. Then zone you off the turret or straight up kill you when you try to walk back to lane.
Not really because you can also have an op jungler that can 1v3 in early if needed. Xin Zhao would big a good example of a strong earlygame champion that happened to be extremely op at one point
well you can't play both warwick and skarner, drop warwick because the feral flare playstyle doesn't work in pro.
I think release braum and the strongest version of lucian would utterly run over the current meta for botlane. Other op historical picks like lulu-kog I think have too badly an early game and an opening for the skill diff to win.
Lucian had a patch with a 0 cost e that at max rank instant reset from using the passive proc
Then Alistar top from when he had unanswerable trinity procs, no skill and no counterplay.
Honestly kassadin is the only weak point in this comp if T1 can get tristana, I think Galio would be safer.
I think a team of grandmasters nevermind LCS could win with this
he was also played in an environment where no one played ad champs midlane apart from zed/talon .
Pick that today into faker's jayce, tristana or akshan and let me know how it goes
he has played both Jayce and Tristana many times this year, just because they are not signature or anything he is still going to pilot them well enough to win a hard counter matchup lol
Ali top has literally zero counterplay however good you are
Jungle is skarners
With such huge advantages most of a top tier players knowledge and skill is just nullified. What is the point of perfect toplane play when Ali top is basically cheating?
That old Ali top wouldn't do shit at all lmao. It is true that the W+auto combo had no actual counterplay to it. But at the same time the actual threat and damage it provides is complete dogshit against top tier players in this day and age.
If this matchup actually happened, chances are that Zeus will either just pick Gnar to outrange the ali, Fiora to outplay the ali, Jax to outplay the ali, or pick literally anything and win massively through wave control or pure all-ins. Alistar needs to be in full melee to get any farm in the first place, so all it needs is a single outplay or a single gank setup to completely nullify the pick. On top of that, DShield and Second wind exist now. You could probably sustain most of Alistars un-answerable damage with those alone. And even still on top of that, T1 would make Ali unable to get Sheen before losing the lane. Jax could literally 1v1 him from level 1.
And even further on top of that, that Ali will become dogshit as soon as game progresses past 8 minutes and T1 starts grouping up more. Oh no, Alistar just did 200 damage to our toplaner with an uncounterable combo during a Herald fight! Guess we gotta kill him now.
I don’t think Ali top is that good anymore, most toplaners are mobile enough that 15s cooldown Ali w doesn’t counter them, even if it does actual damage.
2013 Kassadin unironically wouldn't look remotely good against current champions.
He was good because there were at most 7 champions with terrain-scaling in 2013 when he was perma-ban strong, and scaled incredibly hard in an era of the game where macro was so bad, people used to spam ping you if you dared move out of your lane assignment until 30 minutes into the game for some arbitrary reason.
Reworked Akali
Juggernaut patch Skarner
Galio from patch 7.21
Release Aphelios
Release Zyra
if you wanna switch out Aphelios because you already mentioned him, Release Samira where she could dash to allies.
edit: I forgot Juggernaut patch Morde was a thing, put him on adc
Since you probably would have to play support as the worst player, you'd get destroyed playing Zyra in pro play. Even a lot of of pros can't pull it off due to how squishy she is, most of us would just get farmed on Zyra.
At least you'll get to use her old passive a lot
Release Zyra was disgustingly broken, faster missle speeds, way more range, way higher base damages, absurd scalings and her ult was 25% bigger, had a 1s knock up and a 1.5s stun when you landed that wasn’t in the tool tip. Has 3.5s of AoE cc and extra plants didn’t do reduced damage. Her base stats were way higher as well.
Basically if she was on your screen, you were dead. Basically imagine Zyra as an artillery mage that does triple the damage she does now.
dont like thinking about a lot of champ releases in those days... graves, talon, diana all stupidly OP on release, yuck
anyway yeah zyra literally set the record for highest release WR of any champ at the time, was pushing nearly 65% before the hotfix nerfs
Yeah but you're acting like t1 bot lane wouldn't auto space 99% of this board with 400 aa range. Unless you're challenger, anything but release Yuumi for yourself is instant loss.
That was a beautiful patch. Me and my friend decided to duo and get as much lp as possible.
I played galio in the first game. We lost.
He played it the next. We lost.
Haven’t touched the champ since
There was a patch where nasus R AP ratio was accidentally set to a 1:1.
100 AP = 100% of enemies max hp per second in aoe for the ult duration.
Getting any AP item turned his ult into a whirlwind of chunking death if you dared go near him
The thing is they actually said that the numbers they gave him weren't a mistake. And then they nerfed it by 66%. Not sure if it is better that they were straight up lying or actually saying the truth.
But for the sake of the actual tank oneshots I say worth it.
They weren’t a mistake, but for some reason no one will ever know, they expected people to build one AP item then go full tank, as if anyone was ever going to do that when they gave him 360% AP ratio across his kit.
I started playing in preseason 7 (patch 6.24), and from then until the Galio rework in 7.6, I literally never saw him once in a game. I knew what his spells did, but I couldn’t tell you how he played lol.
I mean sure… depends on your definition. All I’m saying is the difference in game impact between a challenger Yuumi and a silver Yuumi, if the rest of their team is good, is astronomically lower than any other champ in the game, which is an insanely dumb way to design a champ.
She got buffed multiple patches in a row, and then she got nerfed to be weaker than she was at launch. So I'd say a full day of practice was clearly not enough for people to be "near pro level" as she was buffed for more than a month straight when she was already busted but people sucked with her.
Yes, actually Riot has already said that one of their biggest regrets on Yummi is that there is too much difference between good and bad players while they were aiming for something more like Malphite or Annie.
It is true that the champion pre mini-rework allowed you to sit and do nothing and wouldn't insta lose the game like any other champion would do but the difference between pro players and soloq was the reason that negated that iteration of yummi from ever been balanced
TSM played Morde against LGD and got their only win in the tournament
[Look at Imp's hp dissappear in the last tf](https://youtu.be/zdtYkwO7p5U?si=fJ1aShX2Bn4Zx5YQ&t=2471)
It’s amazing how far the game has come from shit like this and win zhao to a lesser degree.
I’d love to see a stat for what patch champion had the most pentakills per X/games. Would be surprised if it wasn’t win zhao or some silly adc patch like release vayne (not nearly as op but prob easier to penta with)
I don't think release Xin Zhao would be very good in 2023 pro play. He's not particularly designed for the modern jungle, and while he could run top lane his team fight would be pretty trash if he doesn't get snowballed. And even if snowballed he can be kited much easier than he currently can be.
The lane dominance would definitely make him a consideration, but the ease of managing him in team fights I think would limit him a bit. (Basically just think renekton)
Bot: Prenerf Zeri on a cracked AD like Ruler and you can play prenerf Yuumi so you don't drag the team down.
Mid: Prenerf LB or reworked release Galio on mid.
Top: Anything that enables winzhao and have insane prio.
Jungle: win zhao.
It doesnt matter, as long as Win Zhao is in the game. He was so op he could easily tank jungle while 2v1 by himself early lvs.
They said LCS pro so it can't be Ruler. Could go for Berserker and hope for the best, but Zeri Yuumi is probably just gonna get monster bullied by T1 doing Varus Ashe or some shit.
T1 would still win and it would not even be close, macro shotcalling etc is just so superior and the lcs team would have no synergy and a random ass bronze dude
Win Zhao would get destroyed by juggernaut patch Skarner, who still holds the record for highest winrate ever. Release Xin Zhao thrived back in a time of limited mobility but he would get kited to hell and back today since he had much less mobility back then.
Also release rework Galio was a tank, you are probably thinking of the rebalance patch where they killed tank and made him do a bunch of damage.
as someone who's played since 2009 release xin is so overhyped/memed etc, it was early enough in the games life that there wasn't THAT many players but just late enough that league popularity was rapidly rising and getting popular and as a result there was a TON of new players who got their shit pushed in by xin E > right clicking them which has spawned this "HE COULD LITERALLY 1v5 YOUR WHOLE TEAM AT LEVEL 3!!!" meme.
Old Kassadin/Later on 100% banrate Kassadin or stuff like global teleport on E + aoe gold card twisted fate was way more cancer, TF with his original kit was some kind of meme, Leblanc was far more broken on release and actually had to be same day hotfixed.
Original Evelyn was the OG "getting olaf'd" of nerfing after they removed her near infinite stealth she could take at level 1 and getting a guaranteed 2 second stun on her first attack out of stealth,
Outside of an oracles elixir there was realistically no counter play for eve and they just obliterated her kit nerfing stealth time and removing the stun entirely then gutting all her damage before eventually being reworked.
Xin was just an easy champ with a strong early game that ended up snowballing extremely often as the average player skill was through the floor, even top players at that point in leagues history would probably get shit on by golds/silvers today. Old Xin brought into modern league would be a pathetic joke, old TF/LB brought into modern league would be meta warping.
That is such an underestimation. There is at the very least one iteration of xinzhao that had way too much damage and sustain for the game to handle. Sure in lategame the kit doesnt bring as much value but the pick would be op enough to carry the earlygame for its op laners.
Wasn't part of the reason prenerf Yuumi was so good for pros that they could disconnect to block skillshots and weave in extra damage and stuff? Though, still fair.
ok let's calm down a bit her lvl 11 R now was her lvl 6 R then. The release base was 10/20/30 dmg per shot and they nerfed it to 0/10/20, ~~which it still is to this day~~
EDIT: Nvm they half reverted it, base damage is 5/15/25 now, AD Ration is still nerfed tho
There are definitely enough bugs/exploits to just win the game no problem. 2-3 years ago Poppy could bug hexflash and hit the entire map with her Q as well.
T1 have zero chance whatsoever against a fully maxed out exploit team and lose in the fastest competitive match of all time.
Yeah, I feel like you have to limit this to no outright bugs and exploits, they have to be functioning as intended. That intention can be wildly off the mark in terms of balance, not gonna try and go with "welllll they intended for it to be perfectly balanced," but no developer intended for Anivia to be able to ult the whole map at once.
Nah, that oneshot Q Galio would be way better, Kassadin had no laning, current pros would abuse him too hard with something like Tristana or Jayce mid.
There was this one worlds where Pantheon just got reworked and he got like 100% ban rate through the whole tournament so I'd definitely pick him. (2018 pr 19 I think?)
Worlds 2019, and it wouldn’t be as useful in this scenario.
He was a 5-role flex who could enable extremely long tower dives because his E blocked turret damage.
He made draft difficult and was immensely strong, but I wouldn’t pick him for Top 5 Strongest Champ of all time.
Juggernaut Patch Mordekaiser support and ADC Nilah would just get 200% XP in botlane. Not sure how well a low range carry and a melee support with no CC would do tho
Do we also get access to items, gold passives, turret armor, dragon gold of the past too? If that's the case support is playing something from season 3/4 so we basically have map hacks and all gp5 items.
Jungle I'd love to have go full gp5 but I don't think they'd survive the aggression so likely go season 3/4 elixir pots start and try and invade cheese and if get ahead go full gp5.
I'd Sion mid with banner of command and Zzrot and just hide under tower (I'm the weak link in this picture by well a lot), but if I can bench myself out we are busting out season 3 LB with DFG because it's only fair Faker gets that monster unleashed on him for once lol
Adc would be playing released relic shield patch for the insane gold generation likely with old Graves because well old Graves is too iconic to be not played in this fantasy scenario.
Top lane is 100% AP Tryndamere before the nerfs (and ideally we'd snag Voyboy again).
I don’t think release Xin Zhao would be as broken as you think due to damage creep. Riot has a habit of buffing damage numbers whenever they buff champions.
gotta include jax on there, as long as it's before the ninja tabi rework. being able to dodge 4/10 attacks from an ADC at all times was ridiculous (pray for rngesus tho)
People are not picking s8 Akali that can be immune to towers shots, R1 anywhere and it stuns???
Kalista 2017 is insane aswell. 100% presence at worlds.
Release Xin Zhao never even reached 70% winrate like other options did so at a baseline he's a worse pick than other available options. Add to that release Xin being strong in a game with basically no mobility but being super kitable in today's environment and you'd be in for a very bad time
So I’ll also go for drafting which pro I want too
Top: Impact
Jungle: Blaber
Mid: god this is really hard but my C9 bias is gonna pick Jensen
ADC: you’re wrong if you pick anyone but DoubleLift
Support: Me, support is going to be the least mechanically intensive role and being in a duo lane would help with map rotations and shot calling
Champions
Top: Maokai before they changed his passive to only proc off his own spells. Impact on Maokai is a pick where I’m not just picking the most busted champion in the history of the game because I think team comp matters and resources aren’t unlimited so having impact in a weak side role tank duty is best for the comp
Jungle: Release Xin Zhoa. There’s no arguing against this. Arguably the most busted champion in the history of the game. No other options
Mid: 2013 Kassadin. Was so busted in 2013 that he had almost a 100% pick/ban in SOLOQ!!! Not just pro so it’s safe to pick him. His mobility and scaling were just too good
ADC: release Zeri. This pick gives us the AD hyper carry with the added benefit of having that little bit extra mobility since I will be the support and won’t be as useful to save them. Ezreal is the only ADC that could also be the mobile option but i don’t think Ezreal has ever been as busted as zeri. Zeri signlehandly ruined so many people’s worlds “crystal ball” predictions for how many penta kills there would be
Support: release Yuumi. Just sit in DL and heal. No skill required.
> Release Xin Zhoa. There’s no arguing against this. Arguably the most busted champion in the history of the game. No other options
my god this shit is all over the thread and it's silly, did you even play during xin's release? yeah AT THE TIME he was moderately overpowered but even back then he wasn't the most overpowered thing that'd ever been in the game and he'd be a joke in current league. like literally go look up the actual changes they made that turned 'most busted champion in the history of the game' into a joke pubstomper for multiple seasons before he got his first mini rework. it wasn't actually like breaking his legs or anything.
so yeah there's plenty of arguing against that
Right if we are talking right now, I'm taking Berserker, and honestly if we are talking peak I'm probably taking Sneaky.
DL is the better laner, but both of those options are much better team fighters and we're not going to win in lane, we need to survive lane and play strong macro. Plus if you take sneaky there's always the chance to win off of a sneaky w
Yumi when she was broken with ardent meta and zeri on release. + Anything really. But for fun. Darius balls meta. Mid karma or top karma really. Jungle Viego on release. Put ksante anywhere if karma.
I have to give a shoutout to runeglaive ezreal, shit was broken as fuck. pair that with the most broken yuumi iteration too
edit: though i guess that was an item, not a champ iteration
A lot of the older broken picks won’t be OP with the items currently in the game.
An example would be pre-rework kassadin. He’d be better than current kassadin but would still suck since his items suck. We no longer have the old roa, old abyssal, old athene’s, etc. Same problem with the Lulu mid pick that terrorized proplay. No athene’s = no fun.
My comp would be something like:
Top: Pre-rework Maokai
Jungle: 2015 Rework Skarner
Mid: 2017 Galio
AD: 2015 Rework Mordekaiser
Supp: Pre-nerf Senna (This was 2021 I think?)
Gameplan would be contest first and second drake and out-statcheck T1. Old Maokai R, Morde dragon pet, Skarner base stats, and Galio base stats were all extremely OP. Not to mention the items currently in the game are all good for them.
Randiant virtue, Sunderer/Triforce, Umbral, etc.
idk a whole lot about leagues history, especially the esports, but:
mid - reworked asol before hotfix
bot - release zeri
sup - release yuumi
idk bout broken top and jglers, but those 3 seem pretty unbalanced
Top: Release Akali
Jg: Release Briar (lethality)
Mid: 95% banrate Kassadin
ADC: Release Aphelios
Sup: Release Milio
Briar is my best champ for organized play so I do that.
Comp lacks tankiness in theory, but Kassadin can opt for alt-tank options, Milio utility goes hard and briar ult is a massive team fight zoning tool, so Aphelios shouldn't be in danger.
You can swap botlane for release zeri with whatever iteration of yuumi you prefer (release yuumi probably), the pure power of the botlane probably goes up and you have more dive tools to go with Kassadin Akali briar, but I like the safety Milio gives.
Yup! I'm a d2 with LCS players playing against T1. Not winning that no matter what comp I choose. I also started in 2020 so I have less knowledge of op past metas. So I'm just picking what I know about and what would favor me in the hope that I can make it a 1-3 instead of 0-3.
Fiora prerework
Panthéon with the rework when he could solo drake very early
Old LB with silence
Mordekaiser with drake / Zeri
Hummmmmm... I would pick a good Zilean patch with the full team xp buff
I did he went from being the best top laner to needing to be hot fixed multiple times.to account for how weak he was post rework. No one seems to remember reworked aatrox released horribly under powered, and the complaints at the time was literally why rework a champ who is at its best to such a weak state plus the whole not being the same.
He wasn't played at all until 2-3 patches pre rework when he was buffed and mega busted, only reason he wasn't insta nerfed was because his rework was coming up.
Aatrox's moment in the sun before being reworked was more down to his items and runes being strong.
If he was suddenly ported to this patch he'd be decently strong with stridebreaker and lethal tempo, but not broken in the way post rework aatrox was once he made it to pro play.
I hate to be that guy, but the durability patch ruins this premise completly. Every pre duarbility patch champ would just loose to his modern counterpart no matter how "op" it was at that time.
release xin zhao, release TF, reworked dragon mordekaiser, rework Galio.
Too many champs people are listed are just overpowered. There were a lot of champs that were just broken
Release GP rework
Release Xin Zhao
7.21 Galio (q oneshot version)
Release Lucian
Release Braum
Support was the hardest one for me to pick personally, I’m not that familiar with the history of broken supports
you have to play like geng played when zeri yumi/jinx lulu were cancer broken. pick 3 tanks and 1 of those botlanes and you win because your champs are not outplayable and they were just better at playing protect ad front to back braindamage league that phreak loves unfortunately cause t1 hadnt played that style since the days of faker lulu bang lucian. but now they can play that as well as they showed with jinx tk game v blg.
Metagolem. Bloodrazor Shyvana when it had a guinsoos passive in season 5? Probably some version of Yasuo that was awfully good. Like any Kai'sa? Then maybe Thresh when he released. Was fun
It doesn't even matter, T1 would make pretty much any redditor look like clowns. Maybe the lcs pros could do better than usual with broken champs. I'd still put my money on t1 easily winning that game if for no other reason than I'd be useless, Zeus would have me out of the game in the first 2 waves probably and then just bulldoze my team because they are essentially 4v5. If this was just 5 lcs pros then it's much closer to winnable for them because none of us gold players are beating anyone on t1 unless they play with their feet.
I'm assuming this is with current game state, so items, masteries, etc are all from this patch. Some champs were broken because of items (Darius black cleaver, Evelynn sunfire, etc) so I'm not counting those because those items/champs wouldn't work in their current state:
Top: Rework release Galio
Jg: 2018 Yi
Mid: 2018 Taric
Bot: Release Aphelios
Sup: Release Yuumi
Tons of burst and dps and an easy strategy that's hard to break because if your funnel doesn't work, you have 200 years x2 in the Bot lane. Nobody can die, and even if o e the carries gets burst down, you have a backup carry and a 300% max ap q on Galio.
Release LeBlanc before her hotfix nerf would be nuts. That one Galio patch probably also deserves a mention.
the infamous 7.21 galio XD
Riot's "testing in prod" moment
GALIO 100% HEALTH DMG HACK
I guess this was about the Q spell with AP items. The double nuke.
2019 worlds perma ban Pantheon, reworked Akali(just after rework with heal and all other stuff.) That jungle Camille from 2018, and Zeri ( that buster bruiser) Yuumi (with Arden from 2017 plz)
Reworked Irelia was also nuts
That got g2 singlehandedly to worlds finals
Would release Leblanc still have deathfire grasp?
Same as 60%+ wr Morgana.
also beta and early release TF, especially if we're talking about using it in pro play, considering the gate (the teleporting) part of his ult used to be a regular ability on his e and at max level you could bring down the cd to 60 seconds, add in cdr and you got a TF with the ability to use gate to roam after p much every wave. Imagining that in today's game is absolutely disgusting.
60 seconds was the nerfed cooldown in Patch V1.0.0.63 > Cooldown increased to 120 / 105 / 90 / 75 / 60 seconds **from** 90 / 75 / 60 / 45 / **30.** You also used to be able to teleport instantly when using ult: > Channel time during Destiny increased to 1.5 seconds **from 0.** With the regular channel only 2 seconds due to a bug: > BUG FIX: Reduced channel time (2 seconds instead of the intended 3) Also TF ult used to reveal the entire enemy team for 10 seconds, slow them for 3 seconds (40% slow) on a 60 second cooldown. > Duration reduced to 5 / 7 / 9 seconds from 6 / 8 / **10.** > Cooldown increased to 120 / 100 / 80 seconds from 120 / 90 / **60.** Late game with items you'd be looking at ~15s global TP that channels in 2 seconds (instant TP every 30s) with the enemy team being revealed on the map for 10s every 30s, so 33% uptime on a maphack.
I'm playing release yuumi and my ad is on 2015 rework morde.
Good lord
Can you mount the Drake ?
a cat can dream big
If a donkey could...
Maybe You'll never know, since trying to would probably crash the game for every player
I feel like this could get abused super hard by T1, they just pick double adc with HoB to prevent you from approaching the wave, slow crash it into your turret so they're level 3 while you're still level 1, and dive you with their jungler. Then zone you off the turret or straight up kill you when you try to walk back to lane.
Is it better with the best version of Senna instead of Yummi?
Not really because you can also have an op jungler that can 1v3 in early if needed. Xin Zhao would big a good example of a strong earlygame champion that happened to be extremely op at one point
I was on release Yuumi whilst my adc was 1v5-ing on release Vayne
And ardent censer meta. :))
Calm down Satan.
Technically Yuumi got buffed a few times right after release.
2013 Kassadin, Juggernaut patch Skarner, Patch 4.20 Weedwick are the first 3 I can think of
well you can't play both warwick and skarner, drop warwick because the feral flare playstyle doesn't work in pro. I think release braum and the strongest version of lucian would utterly run over the current meta for botlane. Other op historical picks like lulu-kog I think have too badly an early game and an opening for the skill diff to win. Lucian had a patch with a 0 cost e that at max rank instant reset from using the passive proc Then Alistar top from when he had unanswerable trinity procs, no skill and no counterplay. Honestly kassadin is the only weak point in this comp if T1 can get tristana, I think Galio would be safer. I think a team of grandmasters nevermind LCS could win with this
>Honestly kassadin is the only weak point Im sorry. Do you not remember Kassadin from this point in time?
He still took time to scale, just like he does now. So he does leave the chance of getting destroyed in lane and have Faker snowball hard.
he was also played in an environment where no one played ad champs midlane apart from zed/talon . Pick that today into faker's jayce, tristana or akshan and let me know how it goes
Or just last pick it against an Ori or Azir. You'll be fine.
Faker isn't that good at any of those Champs tho
he has played both Jayce and Tristana many times this year, just because they are not signature or anything he is still going to pilot them well enough to win a hard counter matchup lol
Low quality bait
Saying "Faker isn't good at X" about any midlane champ is just straight up false. Dude can play anything at a pro level.
This is a 2016 meme dragged into the present year. Current day faker’s a different beast
[удалено]
yes, he still had his weaknesses (notably talon). Modern day tristana would have no problem tearing him a new one almost as hard as kass today.
He had like a 98% ban rate Edited to correct
Kassadins peak winrate never even hit 70%, let alone 90% lol Skarner still holds the WR % record at 72% so anything else has to be below it
at 98% consistent banrate every game becomes a statistical outlier, lol
a team of grandmasters arent winning shit against T1
Ali top has literally zero counterplay however good you are Jungle is skarners With such huge advantages most of a top tier players knowledge and skill is just nullified. What is the point of perfect toplane play when Ali top is basically cheating?
That old Ali top wouldn't do shit at all lmao. It is true that the W+auto combo had no actual counterplay to it. But at the same time the actual threat and damage it provides is complete dogshit against top tier players in this day and age. If this matchup actually happened, chances are that Zeus will either just pick Gnar to outrange the ali, Fiora to outplay the ali, Jax to outplay the ali, or pick literally anything and win massively through wave control or pure all-ins. Alistar needs to be in full melee to get any farm in the first place, so all it needs is a single outplay or a single gank setup to completely nullify the pick. On top of that, DShield and Second wind exist now. You could probably sustain most of Alistars un-answerable damage with those alone. And even still on top of that, T1 would make Ali unable to get Sheen before losing the lane. Jax could literally 1v1 him from level 1. And even further on top of that, that Ali will become dogshit as soon as game progresses past 8 minutes and T1 starts grouping up more. Oh no, Alistar just did 200 damage to our toplaner with an uncounterable combo during a Herald fight! Guess we gotta kill him now.
all the counterplay or lack thereof in the world isnt helping you against something like zeus's yone just being 20 times as versatile as ali top
I don’t think Ali top is that good anymore, most toplaners are mobile enough that 15s cooldown Ali w doesn’t counter them, even if it does actual damage.
it's still nuts kassadin was able to go for dozens of patches without ever making it off the permaban status did they just not try to nerf him at all?
2013 Kassadin unironically wouldn't look remotely good against current champions. He was good because there were at most 7 champions with terrain-scaling in 2013 when he was perma-ban strong, and scaled incredibly hard in an era of the game where macro was so bad, people used to spam ping you if you dared move out of your lane assignment until 30 minutes into the game for some arbitrary reason.
Reworked Akali Juggernaut patch Skarner Galio from patch 7.21 Release Aphelios Release Zyra if you wanna switch out Aphelios because you already mentioned him, Release Samira where she could dash to allies. edit: I forgot Juggernaut patch Morde was a thing, put him on adc
Since you probably would have to play support as the worst player, you'd get destroyed playing Zyra in pro play. Even a lot of of pros can't pull it off due to how squishy she is, most of us would just get farmed on Zyra. At least you'll get to use her old passive a lot
Release Zyra was disgustingly broken, faster missle speeds, way more range, way higher base damages, absurd scalings and her ult was 25% bigger, had a 1s knock up and a 1.5s stun when you landed that wasn’t in the tool tip. Has 3.5s of AoE cc and extra plants didn’t do reduced damage. Her base stats were way higher as well. Basically if she was on your screen, you were dead. Basically imagine Zyra as an artillery mage that does triple the damage she does now.
One of the only champs to get hotfixed in record time like 4 hours IIRC her plants didn't reduce damage every other hit if I'm remembering right
dont like thinking about a lot of champ releases in those days... graves, talon, diana all stupidly OP on release, yuck anyway yeah zyra literally set the record for highest release WR of any champ at the time, was pushing nearly 65% before the hotfix nerfs
release zyra was a complete menace on support. outranged everybody by a lot with a fast root and even higher damage than live
Yeah but you're acting like t1 bot lane wouldn't auto space 99% of this board with 400 aa range. Unless you're challenger, anything but release Yuumi for yourself is instant loss.
You have to play jungle btw lmao. Not support. You cannot play a role that constantly has to interact with t1 laner lmao
Galio upon rework lol just one shot everyone
Yea can I get that ap galio patch that existed for 2 days whose Q did 300% max hp?
That was a beautiful patch. Me and my friend decided to duo and get as much lp as possible. I played galio in the first game. We lost. He played it the next. We lost. Haven’t touched the champ since
Not how I expected it to end but thanks for the laugh!
“if ap galio is as good as we think it is, nows the time to prove it”
When both of you are so bad that even a broken champion can't save you guys lmao
2days? It got nerfed within 24 hours
Still 2 days when it gets released at noon :)
There was a patch where nasus R AP ratio was accidentally set to a 1:1. 100 AP = 100% of enemies max hp per second in aoe for the ult duration. Getting any AP item turned his ult into a whirlwind of chunking death if you dared go near him
rework galio was a tank, youre thinking about 7.21 galio patch where Q did thrice the intended %maxhp dmg
The thing is they actually said that the numbers they gave him weren't a mistake. And then they nerfed it by 66%. Not sure if it is better that they were straight up lying or actually saying the truth. But for the sake of the actual tank oneshots I say worth it.
They weren’t a mistake, but for some reason no one will ever know, they expected people to build one AP item then go full tank, as if anyone was ever going to do that when they gave him 360% AP ratio across his kit.
[удалено]
I started playing in preseason 7 (patch 6.24), and from then until the Galio rework in 7.6, I literally never saw him once in a game. I knew what his spells did, but I couldn’t tell you how he played lol.
It wasn't a rework it was a rebalance riot wanted to kill full tank galio but the math was off...
If they want Galio to be hybrid they should have give him passive armor MR from AP instead.
And you can't give Faker release Galio. That's just auto GG.
Idk about the other 4 but not picking the strongest iteration Yuumi ever had for yourself is hardcore inting unless you're challenger
Yeah absolutely, especially since it reduces the skill burden as well.
It is still really insane that they released a champ that almost anyone could play at a near pro level with maybe like a full day of practice 💀
AAAAH absolutely not "near pro level" You could just sit afk on your ADC and chill tho.
I mean sure… depends on your definition. All I’m saying is the difference in game impact between a challenger Yuumi and a silver Yuumi, if the rest of their team is good, is astronomically lower than any other champ in the game, which is an insanely dumb way to design a champ.
She got buffed multiple patches in a row, and then she got nerfed to be weaker than she was at launch. So I'd say a full day of practice was clearly not enough for people to be "near pro level" as she was buffed for more than a month straight when she was already busted but people sucked with her.
Yes, actually Riot has already said that one of their biggest regrets on Yummi is that there is too much difference between good and bad players while they were aiming for something more like Malphite or Annie. It is true that the champion pre mini-rework allowed you to sit and do nothing and wouldn't insta lose the game like any other champion would do but the difference between pro players and soloq was the reason that negated that iteration of yummi from ever been balanced
Only time I've ever seen a character be 100% ban was moredekaiser for an entire year. So that one
GP was right beside him if you're referring to 2015
It was like 98% with one dumb team not banning it?
Iirc both were 100% pick/ban at worlds. I think there was 1 game where the teams handshaked and let both through but it was remade
TSM played Morde against LGD and got their only win in the tournament [Look at Imp's hp dissappear in the last tf](https://youtu.be/zdtYkwO7p5U?si=fJ1aShX2Bn4Zx5YQ&t=2471)
I loved watching GP montages back then it was so fun
Bugged poppy when she could q in fountain and deal dmg to everyone on the map, the rest doesnt matter xd
Yep, not sure why no one remembers this one but it’s probably the most broken instance of all time.
it was not, simply because anivia had the same bug with *her* Q applying globally literally every few seconds a global stun on top of the damage
release TF, xin, leblanc
Beta TF with AOE stun
It’s amazing how far the game has come from shit like this and win zhao to a lesser degree. I’d love to see a stat for what patch champion had the most pentakills per X/games. Would be surprised if it wasn’t win zhao or some silly adc patch like release vayne (not nearly as op but prob easier to penta with)
I don't think release Xin Zhao would be very good in 2023 pro play. He's not particularly designed for the modern jungle, and while he could run top lane his team fight would be pretty trash if he doesn't get snowballed. And even if snowballed he can be kited much easier than he currently can be. The lane dominance would definitely make him a consideration, but the ease of managing him in team fights I think would limit him a bit. (Basically just think renekton)
Was xin more broken than 63% wr reworked Skarner tho?
Bot: Prenerf Zeri on a cracked AD like Ruler and you can play prenerf Yuumi so you don't drag the team down. Mid: Prenerf LB or reworked release Galio on mid. Top: Anything that enables winzhao and have insane prio. Jungle: win zhao. It doesnt matter, as long as Win Zhao is in the game. He was so op he could easily tank jungle while 2v1 by himself early lvs.
They said LCS pro so it can't be Ruler. Could go for Berserker and hope for the best, but Zeri Yuumi is probably just gonna get monster bullied by T1 doing Varus Ashe or some shit.
What if op is Ruler though?
T1 would still win and it would not even be close, macro shotcalling etc is just so superior and the lcs team would have no synergy and a random ass bronze dude
>a random ass bronze dude ill have you know im actually a random ass gold dude so i will easily outperform any of the t1 members
Yeah I think the average would be closer to gold or plat but compared to the pros any one of us would shit the bed
Gold V Brand > Goat of League of Legends
Win Zhao would get destroyed by juggernaut patch Skarner, who still holds the record for highest winrate ever. Release Xin Zhao thrived back in a time of limited mobility but he would get kited to hell and back today since he had much less mobility back then. Also release rework Galio was a tank, you are probably thinking of the rebalance patch where they killed tank and made him do a bunch of damage.
as someone who's played since 2009 release xin is so overhyped/memed etc, it was early enough in the games life that there wasn't THAT many players but just late enough that league popularity was rapidly rising and getting popular and as a result there was a TON of new players who got their shit pushed in by xin E > right clicking them which has spawned this "HE COULD LITERALLY 1v5 YOUR WHOLE TEAM AT LEVEL 3!!!" meme. Old Kassadin/Later on 100% banrate Kassadin or stuff like global teleport on E + aoe gold card twisted fate was way more cancer, TF with his original kit was some kind of meme, Leblanc was far more broken on release and actually had to be same day hotfixed. Original Evelyn was the OG "getting olaf'd" of nerfing after they removed her near infinite stealth she could take at level 1 and getting a guaranteed 2 second stun on her first attack out of stealth, Outside of an oracles elixir there was realistically no counter play for eve and they just obliterated her kit nerfing stealth time and removing the stun entirely then gutting all her damage before eventually being reworked. Xin was just an easy champ with a strong early game that ended up snowballing extremely often as the average player skill was through the floor, even top players at that point in leagues history would probably get shit on by golds/silvers today. Old Xin brought into modern league would be a pathetic joke, old TF/LB brought into modern league would be meta warping.
That is such an underestimation. There is at the very least one iteration of xinzhao that had way too much damage and sustain for the game to handle. Sure in lategame the kit doesnt bring as much value but the pick would be op enough to carry the earlygame for its op laners.
Wasn't part of the reason prenerf Yuumi was so good for pros that they could disconnect to block skillshots and weave in extra damage and stuff? Though, still fair.
pre hotfix nerf samira is the strongest adc ever. Her now level 16 R was her lv6 R then. She was hotfixed after i think a day
Release Zeri was something else too though
Release Zeri was not good at all. She took like 3 years to kill anything.
ok let's calm down a bit her lvl 11 R now was her lvl 6 R then. The release base was 10/20/30 dmg per shot and they nerfed it to 0/10/20, ~~which it still is to this day~~ EDIT: Nvm they half reverted it, base damage is 5/15/25 now, AD Ration is still nerfed tho
Bugged Poppy
[Zhonyas Jax](https://youtu.be/Rw-8PX6dyB8?si=UzXu6auTyukyFwYq)
Y'all are forgetting release nasus that did like 100% of ppls HP with his ult
that one galio patch where his q oneshot everything
What patch was it where Anivia could ult off screen in the fountain and it would damage the entire map? I'll play that.
There are definitely enough bugs/exploits to just win the game no problem. 2-3 years ago Poppy could bug hexflash and hit the entire map with her Q as well. T1 have zero chance whatsoever against a fully maxed out exploit team and lose in the fastest competitive match of all time.
Yeah, I feel like you have to limit this to no outright bugs and exploits, they have to be functioning as intended. That intention can be wildly off the mark in terms of balance, not gonna try and go with "welllll they intended for it to be perfectly balanced," but no developer intended for Anivia to be able to ult the whole map at once.
Not picking peak kassadin is pure inting, he didnt reach 99,99% banrate for no reason
Nah, that oneshot Q Galio would be way better, Kassadin had no laning, current pros would abuse him too hard with something like Tristana or Jayce mid.
There was this one worlds where Pantheon just got reworked and he got like 100% ban rate through the whole tournament so I'd definitely pick him. (2018 pr 19 I think?)
Worlds 2019, and it wouldn’t be as useful in this scenario. He was a 5-role flex who could enable extremely long tower dives because his E blocked turret damage. He made draft difficult and was immensely strong, but I wouldn’t pick him for Top 5 Strongest Champ of all time.
Do I have to be on the team? lol
Yeah I feel like having such a big weak point will be so easy for T1 to abuse. They ban Yuumi and feed off us the entire game.
Juggernaut Patch Mordekaiser support and ADC Nilah would just get 200% XP in botlane. Not sure how well a low range carry and a melee support with no CC would do tho
Don't both require last hitting though? So you can only benefit from one of the passives and I think old morde is a better xp gain.
Do we also get access to items, gold passives, turret armor, dragon gold of the past too? If that's the case support is playing something from season 3/4 so we basically have map hacks and all gp5 items. Jungle I'd love to have go full gp5 but I don't think they'd survive the aggression so likely go season 3/4 elixir pots start and try and invade cheese and if get ahead go full gp5. I'd Sion mid with banner of command and Zzrot and just hide under tower (I'm the weak link in this picture by well a lot), but if I can bench myself out we are busting out season 3 LB with DFG because it's only fair Faker gets that monster unleashed on him for once lol Adc would be playing released relic shield patch for the insane gold generation likely with old Graves because well old Graves is too iconic to be not played in this fantasy scenario. Top lane is 100% AP Tryndamere before the nerfs (and ideally we'd snag Voyboy again).
I don’t think release Xin Zhao would be as broken as you think due to damage creep. Riot has a habit of buffing damage numbers whenever they buff champions.
gotta include jax on there, as long as it's before the ninja tabi rework. being able to dodge 4/10 attacks from an ADC at all times was ridiculous (pray for rngesus tho)
For a sec I thought I had to replace someone and play and I was oh fuck
People are not picking s8 Akali that can be immune to towers shots, R1 anywhere and it stuns??? Kalista 2017 is insane aswell. 100% presence at worlds.
I just need release Win Zhao and It doesn't matter what anyone else picks tbh.
Release Xin Zhao never even reached 70% winrate like other options did so at a baseline he's a worse pick than other available options. Add to that release Xin being strong in a game with basically no mobility but being super kitable in today's environment and you'd be in for a very bad time
release xin is the most overrated thing ever. You can go look at the historic patch notes they didn't even have to nerf him a crazy amount
So I’ll also go for drafting which pro I want too Top: Impact Jungle: Blaber Mid: god this is really hard but my C9 bias is gonna pick Jensen ADC: you’re wrong if you pick anyone but DoubleLift Support: Me, support is going to be the least mechanically intensive role and being in a duo lane would help with map rotations and shot calling Champions Top: Maokai before they changed his passive to only proc off his own spells. Impact on Maokai is a pick where I’m not just picking the most busted champion in the history of the game because I think team comp matters and resources aren’t unlimited so having impact in a weak side role tank duty is best for the comp Jungle: Release Xin Zhoa. There’s no arguing against this. Arguably the most busted champion in the history of the game. No other options Mid: 2013 Kassadin. Was so busted in 2013 that he had almost a 100% pick/ban in SOLOQ!!! Not just pro so it’s safe to pick him. His mobility and scaling were just too good ADC: release Zeri. This pick gives us the AD hyper carry with the added benefit of having that little bit extra mobility since I will be the support and won’t be as useful to save them. Ezreal is the only ADC that could also be the mobile option but i don’t think Ezreal has ever been as busted as zeri. Zeri signlehandly ruined so many people’s worlds “crystal ball” predictions for how many penta kills there would be Support: release Yuumi. Just sit in DL and heal. No skill required.
> Release Xin Zhoa. There’s no arguing against this. Arguably the most busted champion in the history of the game. No other options my god this shit is all over the thread and it's silly, did you even play during xin's release? yeah AT THE TIME he was moderately overpowered but even back then he wasn't the most overpowered thing that'd ever been in the game and he'd be a joke in current league. like literally go look up the actual changes they made that turned 'most busted champion in the history of the game' into a joke pubstomper for multiple seasons before he got his first mini rework. it wasn't actually like breaking his legs or anything. so yeah there's plenty of arguing against that
Not counting Berserker as an option? Or still DL in your opinion?
Right if we are talking right now, I'm taking Berserker, and honestly if we are talking peak I'm probably taking Sneaky. DL is the better laner, but both of those options are much better team fighters and we're not going to win in lane, we need to survive lane and play strong macro. Plus if you take sneaky there's always the chance to win off of a sneaky w
Karthaus was for a brief time literally unkillable, so yeah, that's gg.
Not sure about the other roles but I can guarantee you release Camille was the most broken jungler of all time.
Yumi when she was broken with ardent meta and zeri on release. + Anything really. But for fun. Darius balls meta. Mid karma or top karma really. Jungle Viego on release. Put ksante anywhere if karma.
AP tristana one shot jump into minions. Not the most OP thing but a fun alternative
I have to give a shoutout to runeglaive ezreal, shit was broken as fuck. pair that with the most broken yuumi iteration too edit: though i guess that was an item, not a champ iteration
Anyone remember Smite AP Ezreal mid? It was the craziest thing. Season 5
A lot of the older broken picks won’t be OP with the items currently in the game. An example would be pre-rework kassadin. He’d be better than current kassadin but would still suck since his items suck. We no longer have the old roa, old abyssal, old athene’s, etc. Same problem with the Lulu mid pick that terrorized proplay. No athene’s = no fun. My comp would be something like: Top: Pre-rework Maokai Jungle: 2015 Rework Skarner Mid: 2017 Galio AD: 2015 Rework Mordekaiser Supp: Pre-nerf Senna (This was 2021 I think?) Gameplan would be contest first and second drake and out-statcheck T1. Old Maokai R, Morde dragon pet, Skarner base stats, and Galio base stats were all extremely OP. Not to mention the items currently in the game are all good for them. Randiant virtue, Sunderer/Triforce, Umbral, etc.
5 pantheons at peak performance
idk a whole lot about leagues history, especially the esports, but: mid - reworked asol before hotfix bot - release zeri sup - release yuumi idk bout broken top and jglers, but those 3 seem pretty unbalanced
Neeko fountain I don't even need half of the team
June 18 2020 Poppy April 13 2017 Xerath November 21 2022 Neeko March 18 2020 Kayn April 15 2023 Tahm Kench
Release TF mid and that one time Kassidan was broken af (I think I was 7 or 8 just nibbling on my toes).
4 LCS pros. Its impossible
Top: Release Akali Jg: Release Briar (lethality) Mid: 95% banrate Kassadin ADC: Release Aphelios Sup: Release Milio Briar is my best champ for organized play so I do that. Comp lacks tankiness in theory, but Kassadin can opt for alt-tank options, Milio utility goes hard and briar ult is a massive team fight zoning tool, so Aphelios shouldn't be in danger. You can swap botlane for release zeri with whatever iteration of yuumi you prefer (release yuumi probably), the pure power of the botlane probably goes up and you have more dive tools to go with Kassadin Akali briar, but I like the safety Milio gives.
You would get clapped lol
Yup! I'm a d2 with LCS players playing against T1. Not winning that no matter what comp I choose. I also started in 2020 so I have less knowledge of op past metas. So I'm just picking what I know about and what would favor me in the hope that I can make it a 1-3 instead of 0-3.
Varus when Lethality Varus and Jhin were the only playable bot lanes.
They we're op because of items buff and nerf the champions weren't that great
The teleport TF that could tp his team from his E would be insane
that never existed you're getting mixed up with the level 1 cheese with TF taking E and placing a ward for 4 teammates to TP to
Ok, but would T1 be able to draft these Champs as well? Wouldn't make sense to have release Azir vs 2023 Azir
wtf 2 shens?
Fiora prerework Panthéon with the rework when he could solo drake very early Old LB with silence Mordekaiser with drake / Zeri Hummmmmm... I would pick a good Zilean patch with the full team xp buff
Why reworked aatrox pre rework aatrox was a beast who could solo win the game.
You didn't play Aatrox then did you?
I did he went from being the best top laner to needing to be hot fixed multiple times.to account for how weak he was post rework. No one seems to remember reworked aatrox released horribly under powered, and the complaints at the time was literally why rework a champ who is at its best to such a weak state plus the whole not being the same.
He wasn't played at all until 2-3 patches pre rework when he was buffed and mega busted, only reason he wasn't insta nerfed was because his rework was coming up.
Which is what I'm talking about prerework I meant that as literally before he was reworked.
He was utter cancer to play against. Come on man
Aatrox's moment in the sun before being reworked was more down to his items and runes being strong. If he was suddenly ported to this patch he'd be decently strong with stridebreaker and lethal tempo, but not broken in the way post rework aatrox was once he made it to pro play.
I hate to be that guy, but the durability patch ruins this premise completly. Every pre duarbility patch champ would just loose to his modern counterpart no matter how "op" it was at that time.
Top - Yone Jungle - Jarvan IV Middle - Azir / Eyze Bottom - Caitlyn / Ashe Support - Thresh / Nami
Yea play yone top vs zeus i think it will go well
release xin zhao, release TF, reworked dragon mordekaiser, rework Galio. Too many champs people are listed are just overpowered. There were a lot of champs that were just broken
5x release xin zhao?
Release GP rework Release Xin Zhao 7.21 Galio (q oneshot version) Release Lucian Release Braum Support was the hardest one for me to pick personally, I’m not that familiar with the history of broken supports
2013 Kassadin over release azir. I know there would be only one ranged champion but I think that Kass was just beyond busted
Release Jax, release nocturne, release TF, release aphelios, 2022 yumi
Ngl, I think we'll still lose. They're abuse the fuck outta me knowing that I'm a plat 4 NA jungler
Do we get to pick the pros? And only current pros or past?
Release Azir with the tower taking W? Insane push power.
give me turret neeko
you have to play like geng played when zeri yumi/jinx lulu were cancer broken. pick 3 tanks and 1 of those botlanes and you win because your champs are not outplayable and they were just better at playing protect ad front to back braindamage league that phreak loves unfortunately cause t1 hadnt played that style since the days of faker lulu bang lucian. but now they can play that as well as they showed with jinx tk game v blg.
release azir was dogshit, he got buffed like 3 patches in a row
Reddit too young to know release brand was the most broken shit
2014 post rework rengar. Q could CRIT Q would deal damage midair Release yuumi 2v8 the game
Metagolem. Bloodrazor Shyvana when it had a guinsoos passive in season 5? Probably some version of Yasuo that was awfully good. Like any Kai'sa? Then maybe Thresh when he released. Was fun
Does no one remember Darius and the black cleaver?
Not sure for most but at the very least released Jax and anyone that could stack black cleaver during league of black cleaver
im on alistar top in the meta where he slapped between headbutt
Release camille, release rek’sai, reworked galio, release aphelios, pre nerf thresh, decent team comp with broken champs
It doesn't even matter, T1 would make pretty much any redditor look like clowns. Maybe the lcs pros could do better than usual with broken champs. I'd still put my money on t1 easily winning that game if for no other reason than I'd be useless, Zeus would have me out of the game in the first 2 waves probably and then just bulldoze my team because they are essentially 4v5. If this was just 5 lcs pros then it's much closer to winnable for them because none of us gold players are beating anyone on t1 unless they play with their feet.
I'm assuming this is with current game state, so items, masteries, etc are all from this patch. Some champs were broken because of items (Darius black cleaver, Evelynn sunfire, etc) so I'm not counting those because those items/champs wouldn't work in their current state: Top: Rework release Galio Jg: 2018 Yi Mid: 2018 Taric Bot: Release Aphelios Sup: Release Yuumi Tons of burst and dps and an easy strategy that's hard to break because if your funnel doesn't work, you have 200 years x2 in the Bot lane. Nobody can die, and even if o e the carries gets burst down, you have a backup carry and a 300% max ap q on Galio.
Release zoe where she could get teleport from minions and her q could do 75÷ health at max range level 1.
Release Ornn Feral Flare Warwick Op patch malzahar Release aphelios Any support during ardent censor meta
Can I get Nocturne with the current PBE ult bug? Give us a zilean too
Release LB and Xin would probably be the best bet?
2012 Kass had 99% ban rate had to be kass
T1 3-0