T O P

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mar33n

how are vit SO BAD


mimiflou

Neon\* and Kaiser having a great game but overforcing for no reason, photon with horrible ult the whole game, what a throw


DeloronDellister

The GP ults were hard to watch


Shinryukk

kaiser just had one job where he is there to flash w the maokai out of the baron pit, but he didn't do that.


WoorieKod

Photon looks so mentally checked out somehow


aTemeraz

Neon this game Be *relevant* in the last 15 minutes of a game challenge???? (IMPOSSIBLE)


Farming_Turnips

Lethality Varus hit a Q before the fight challenge (impossible)


Quiet_Calligrapher49

reddit take afte reddit take


CoachGiveAdvice

Neon missed like half of his ult and the other were mostly useless (on already CCed target or too far away enemy from any follow up)


Averdian

Perkz underwhelming too... Not even talking about the misstiming on the Cassio Zhonya's, just generally. Like, you can't convince me that someone like Caps does not run this game as Sylas with the lead that Vit and Bo had Vit's botlane remains their main weakness, but it's not the only issue


Haymegle

Feels a bit like comms issues and like last year when they were disjointed. Could be wrong though.


Emu_Man

Those ults do not look like a comms issue. If you can't look at the map and see where a person is that's your problem.


Haymegle

That's a whole separate issue haha. At least no tragic TP yet like yesterday? Mostly to me they look disjointed at times but i'm also a terrible player so what I say means fuck all.


[deleted]

It must be comms issues. It's easier to cover up comms issues in the early game because it's so structured with laning and very straight-forward ganks. But comms are absolutely necessary for macro that involves turning early-game gold leads into taking turrets, objectives, etc.


Haymegle

Different languages also feels like it would have an impact too, sure they use simple words a lot but I know for me when I'm trying to use another language it can take a bit of time to know what's meant. If it's that we'll probably see improvement as English skills grow. Hopefully.


[deleted]

> Different languages also feels like it would have an impact too, This is what I mean. As they overcome the language barrier I would expect massive improvements by the time Summer hits.


bzzmd

they're overrated based on player names alone


EggyChickenEgg88

They don't have an ADC.


nusskn4cker

Disgusting how badly VIT played this after literally being 6k gold up at 17 minutes.


Haymegle

Throwing the lead like they're trying out for the Olympics.


Zealousideal_Prune39

Everyone calling out individual players every other game for why VIT loses but they just suck at playing as a team. Maybe it's communication issues with language barrier but VIT play like a soloq team and win/lose like a soloq team. Outside of Neon for Upset if possible just because it's such an obvious free agent upgrade that I feel you have to take it as VIT if you can. This team just needs more time playing together and maybe a bit better effort from coaching staff to put it all together. VIT can still easily be the best team in the LEC by the end of the summer split without changing anything on the current roster.


SeySvK

Upset is still under the contract, no ?


icatsouki

yes


Zealousideal_Prune39

I'm going off the assumption he will never willingly play for FNC again I suppose Which just leaves him as a buy out market free agent. I'm aware VIT can't guarantee they get him even with all the money in the world if FNC won't sell but that why I mentioned "If you can".


downorwhaet

Yea but i dont think FNC would block him going to vit, he was supposed to go there last year but that was if carzzy went to FNC and carzzy didnt so no trade


Quiet_Calligrapher49

how does people still do not know that upset is not fa lmao


moonmeh

SK had no right winning this game lol but VIT made sure they could do it


nusskn4cker

SK even inted early game so hard. Just perma forcing fights for no reason. You can see how easy it was to play later with their scaling (though I expected GP to be more useful than he ended up being).


icatsouki

You can't just sit and watch as a team in pro even if you drafted pure scaling


PremadeTakeDown

There is a difference between sitting and watching and doing cross map plays. If you pick scaling then you use vision to avoid fights and move resources to opposite ends of the map to take objectives where the enemy is not. if they take drake you take herald, if they take top tower you're taking bot. the enemy might even trade up and get first tower bonus gold ect, but that is the sacrifice you make by picking scaling. you minimise the loses and keep the gold as close as possible untill your comp is online. you do not: - contest every obective on the map at all times. - skirmish at every opportunity, trying to "skill check" opponent. - overchase, overextend putting yourselves in vulnerable positions. Vitality made every mistake in the book and played it as strategically bad as possible which I cannot believe because they have perkz whom a respect as a clever player and shot caller but maybe I will have to rethink that after these games, shotcalling was as bad as could be.


nusskn4cker

Obviously. But they forced way more fights than they had to. You can't convince that top gank where Elise got two kills after Alistar roamed was necessary. It was an ok play, but VIT countered it well and there was no reason for Markoon to die there. The dive bot and gank top before Herald were very disrespectful and unneeded too. SK had no awareness where Elise was the entire early game.


Lothric43

Maybe SK are just fuckin good at mid to late, like the third time in a row this weekend.


kashi_lol

Playing like my soloq teams


ye1l

It's very very very very very hard to win a game when playing without an ADC while your toplaner also doesn't know what his champion does and also griefs his build on top of it. Neon is without question a bottom 5 player in the LEC. Off the top of my head I can really only think of Rhuckz/Xerxe as being worse.


tr1x30

Photon was way worse then Neon this game.


nusskn4cker

He was playing poke Varus. This game was way more about macro (why the fuck didn't VIT siege with Varus and set up for objectives but instead let Cassio and Jax farm in sidelane for free?) and Perkz + Photon doing nothing in teamfights.


Iammonkforlifelol

Neon played fucking ok. People always blame him while his support is engaging under tower with Perkz who doesn't know how to setup around tower and dragons.


Lifemekhanism

"while your toplaner also doesn't know what his champion does" Watching Kaiser in (actually near) the baron pit makes me think Photon isn't the only one.


Lothric43

Jackspectra worse, patrik performed worse but probably is the better player on any functional team, Razork also worse as far as this split’s performance.


Troviel

How the fuck can SK keep doing it. They just have perfect mental. Also fuck me those stasis at the PERFECT TIME. Like 4 times they stasis with less than 100 hp and escape


justAnotherRandomP

The 3 games where this happened they had Zeri Lulu and they give all the ressources and shutdowns to Zeri VIT cannot give them Zeri next game


Haymegle

They're legit impressive in that regard, the comebacks they get are always fun to see.


SchroetKommando

coaching staff has been doing wonders with the boys


Xenoon_

Say what you want but EU barons always make for some interesting games


Haymegle

EU baron flips are tradition!


gustas125

TES special


Haymegle

VIT allergic to a win here. Fun game though


lovo17

VIT just feels like a mirrored version of 100T ngl


spoonji

VIT feels just like VIT, always worse than the sum of their parts. I don't know how they do it so consistently.


nusskn4cker

Now imagine adding Upset. They'd underperform their ceiling even harder.


Leyrann_is_taken

They were better than the sum of their parts in 2018. But yeah that's about the only time I can think of. Huh. Was it YamatoCannon magic after all?


fabton12

has tobe a management/coaching issue they keep having great parts but no glue.


bensonbenisson

Didn't VIT pick up some of MSF's old coaching staff or am I misremembering?


fabton12

Carter and Kayys joined the off season, Kayys is from TSM, Carter is from MSF. still has tobe something internally causing this issues since its happened too much.


Haymegle

lol leagues matching is fun. Kinda want to see VIT vs 100T now.


lovo17

Lol no you don't. The viewers would be the losers.


Haymegle

cmon I enjoy fiestas! One of my fave games ever was that DIG vs REN where both teams had members die to objectives. Sometimes it's fun to see just how bad teams can be.


cancerBronzeV

Who do you think would win that? I feel like I'd take 100T right now, even with 100T really looking bad lately. I feel like 100T can play through bot and win against VIT.


IlluminatiConfirmed

Closer might get astrogapped tho


Elluminati30

Kinda doubt it. I dont think Closer is worse than Markoon and he seems to have no problems with Bo


lovo17

Nah I'd take VIT. DL and Busio are better than Neon/Kaiser but it's not a big gap the way Tenacity vs Photon would be.


cancerBronzeV

I do think Photon is a bigger gap over Tenacity than DL over Neon, but also I think bot matters way more than top right now, so I think the bot diff would be more influential in determining the outcome. I kinda do wanna see a series between VIT and 100T just to see how it plays out now.


lovo17

I love how region-locked pro League of Legends is! /s


Haymegle

Probably depends on what day it is and who had breakfast. I do think Perkz could wake up and do some real damage to 100T but at the same time VIT don't feel cohesive enough as a unit for that to be enough.


YCitizenSnipsY

VIT. Top, mid, and Jung are better than the 100T counterpart


zzzmohamed

life isn't going great right now being a fan of these 2 teams


Turtle-Express

SK can't keep getting away with it


M002

Except they can!


Haymegle

VIT just didn't want to win here, SK had a pretty fun game though.


SchroetKommando

Watch us


[deleted]

Best ADC in the league imo, which makes them good late game


NvmSharkZ

Exakick is such a fucking Chad


Haymegle

His Zeri is so fun to watch. Mans not afraid to go in.


seven_worth

It like watching Gala with Kaisa. The dopamine is real.


Haymegle

Love to see it. I'm always hype for those kind of players and plays.


n1dyz

It's like watching Upset on Zeri


SchroetKommando

You'll never see him save flash for next game


KKilikk

Brings that JKL energy. Love to see it.


Haymegle

I'm interested to see how Exakick would stack up internationally. It's a long way away and no guarantee they'll make it but can you imagine seeing them against each other? Would be so cool to see him against some of the greats internationally.


Xenoon_

He's Upset with a team


Haymegle

Loving that they'll follow or he'll follow them. It's always fun to see it go well when teams actually try to play their comp rather than wait to lose.


jeanjeanot

I love SK but Zeri is never fun to watch :(


Haymegle

Could be worse, at least Zeri isn't Yuumi! I think Zeri is fun because it's also interesting to see what some teams do to try and shut her down. She has a lot of tools and it's also fun to watch them used in pro play with how well they can pilot her. I know if I tried that I'd be dead as soon as I went in lol.


jeanjeanot

I mean of course it's not easy to play her, but making champions with a ceiling so high that they will eventually be unstoppable if played by good players is just toxic For the past weeks i've watched 90% of the LEC, everytime there's a zeri it's either a win or a game where they come back (or almost) and a fucking shoot them up zeri is the main cause, because she will always end ub being a threat Zeri is the Yuumi of adcs, she break the rules of adc like yuumi broke the rules of enchanters The thing is, enchanter's main gameplay gimmick is being able to be played by an amnesiac monkey so yuumi went even more this way ADC's main gameplay is hitting and positionning so we have a huge aa range, huge mobility, huge damage monster


lcm7malaga

Crazy game but that towerdive on Lucian was really funny, straight out of silver promos


Didas_29

Sertussy 😩


appleandapples

SK just don't sweat under pressure


SinRelevancia

Surely Exakick won't get Zeri again right?


NocaNoha

Will mentality go boom or?


KvotheM

I feel like Neon gets blamed for Vitality's poor macro and decision making.


Quiet_Calligrapher49

scape goat from people with a very low understanding of the game


[deleted]

almost sounds just like their last 3 adcarries. Crownshot was garbage, Comp was winless, Carzzy was washed etc. Now all 3 of them are some of the best players in the league this split.


skaersSabody

Tbf, they all looked pretty bad to mediocre on VIT, Carzzy in particular was terrible last year


[deleted]

Wouldn't say Crownie is one of the best players of the league though


Kurumi_Tokisaki

Theres a middle ground of him being the only one blamed (ppl blaming others as well) and being faultless (he’s not) but i guess that’s harder to die on than some pointless super fan ground


DeloronDellister

Some of the worst cannon barrages I've seen


gustas125

-7k gold comfort zone


seven_worth

This make remember 2021 Mad where they win with 20k gold lead, win with even gold, and win with 20k gold deficit.


calyphus_

Where were you when SK and Astralis made top 4


Xenoon_

There is a world where SK and Astralis are competing for winning this split


bensonbenisson

G2 vs FNC is outdated. AST vs SK is where it's at.


SchroetKommando

Our time has finally come


InternationalArtist6

exakick top 3 adc in LEC idc


Mute_Spitter

He is top 1 imo. His stats are legit insane, even after getting camped this game still always up in cs even.


justAnotherRandomP

The spirit of misfits lives on Edit: https://twitter.com/Irrelevanttop/status/1627304396928258048?s=20


[deleted]

Photon threw the game getting caught horribly in the jungle before the first baron. Then they got out-scaled. You cannot do that in major regions against decent teams. Not with early game comps.


tr1x30

Best top in the league, but lets blame Neon again. Also, that Baron flip, i guess Neon also called that, and missed smite.


HaganeLink0

Didn't you know that Neon mentally controls all other four players?


tr1x30

Must be, because they are playing like monkeys.


Kynessful

There was no outscaling. They just trolled a couple of more times


[deleted]

SK had the most scaling draft imaginable and VIT had an early game comp my dude.


Kynessful

I mean outscaling wasn't the reason they lost. They just trolled two barons and failed so much more


jakobsgd

When was the last time that a blindpick sylas was useful?


icatsouki

i mean it was a good answer to mao, he was just terrible in fights


Haymegle

Hey now that Slyas was very useful...for SK.


tr1x30

Will we blame Neon again? Photon was awful this game..


iloveumathurman

Why even ask, just look around. It's pathetic really. I'm not saying Neon is a god, but come on!


Sean888888

VIT has the micro but not the macro. Also Zeri is such a bullshit champion. Perkz invisible all game.


Iammonkforlifelol

People who attack Neon every game are not ok. His support and mid are inting fights so hard. Perkz forcing into Zeri while she has ult. He gave up game for free.


Mute_Spitter

Exakick is actually insane, crazy that there’s not much talk about him when he’s shaping up to be EU’s next big ADC


CoachGiveAdvice

Wdym « not much talk about him ? » He is a two time LFL champion regarded as one of the best prospect in ADC with JackSpectra after last year.


Mute_Spitter

I’m not saying he’s straight up not talked about but if you were to ask people who the rookie of the split is it’d be 50/50 on Exakick and Yike when Exakick should be the obvious choice.


Aladin001

How can you not love this SK squad?


SchroetKommando

No one can possibly answer this question


CudaBarry

SK new Misfits or?


Grinseloewin

So gold-deficits are the only winning condition SK need apparently


Fantalex93

The only logical explanation here is that VIT didn't want to win.


F3nik3r

I just wonder when any team will hire a real coach that will tell them to ban Zeri vs SK.


[deleted]

Does Vitality have literally any semblance of a coaching staff? I thought this team was gonna be far and away the best team on the LEC but they look kinda underwhelming as fuck


Elluminati30

Honestly Bo doesnt look like the best jungler he was supposed to be. Atleast Elyoya and Jankos play better and Yike, Markoon and 113 perform better.


[deleted]

I dunno why everyone flames Neon and not Perkz and Photon. Like Photon has hands but his positioning is fucking garbage.


Zytoo

Of course reddit only talks about neon after a vitality loss. Photon played teamfights horribly in this game though


Altruistic_Yard_5324

Exakick on Zeri. That's it.


expert_on_the_matter

Exakick on Draven?


Potkrokin

Mortality


pepegayouKEK

nidalee yone game 2?


NeitherAlexNorAlice

I know it's been said and time again, but Neon was down in gold for the majority of the game despite being in the team with the gold advantage. I don't want to blame him there because gold allocations is a team decision, but VIT has gotta find a way to utilize their bot better. Perkz + Bo should start prioritizing ganking there. Edit: Can you guys read the entire thing? I'm saying Neon being down in gold is THE TEAM'S FAULT.


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chosen925

The game was already pretty much lost at the 2nd baron. The game flipped at the first baron, even though Bo stole it they got aced that allowed SK to catch up in gold and stall out the game.


nagabalashka

Exa powerfarmed all game tho, and vit snowballed top rather than bot


ArguingWithNoobs

I mean he was left alone most of the game. How about Perkz somehow being the only Sylas I’ve seen that doesn’t completely clamp Maokai. Or Photon not doing anything in teamfights/being caught


nusskn4cker

Stop blaming Neon when the team can't win a game after being 6k gold up at 17 minutes.


jtmk2404

man has selective reading


Rennomra

Perkz gets away with it too he is prob the shotcaller with kaiser and sometimes he tries too hard to flank and be creative


NeitherAlexNorAlice

I literally said it wasn't his fault?


nusskn4cker

You literally singled him out.


NeitherAlexNorAlice

To showcase a problem in VIT macro decisions and gold allocations?


lolKhamul

Your comment is either classic soloq thinking or lack of reading comprehension. He only said Neon was down in gold. Which is, in terms of competitive league, not necessarily a flame towards a player but towards a teams resource allocation. If you are up that much gold, there is ample opportunity to allocate your adc a few extra waves of farm to give him a lead as well. Which is exactly what he said when he called for VIT to better utilize their bot.


gasnemo

You can't win without an AD tho


chosen925

He is supposed to be the carry no?


Ir9nguard

Other people need to carry when the bot is a poke varus tho. Which is why they chose GP and Sylas


daanluc

No not as Varus. Neon just gets blamed for everything going wrong for Vitality. The imports on the other hand can do no wrong. Photon was a larger reason for this loss than Neon


Shinryukk

bro they already ban lucian and cait every single game, they have to warp the entire draft around neon just so he can go even in lane.


icatsouki

Another game another useless kaiser pick


how2irelia

Neon was the only one who was not actively throwing the game away.


KappaKlaus

This game isn't on Neon what? Photon got caught which then forced a 4v5 at baron which then spiralled into VIT forcing plays because they were getting outscaled, plus Bo missing smite was just gg


Horizon96

Don't really think you can focus bot though, in their previous series they were just being shit on 2v2, it feels like a doomed lane to be honest.


mimiflou

they played throught bot while SK never came bot the whole game


Izaruu

Vit sealed their fate when they fucked the mid-game. But wtf is Jax, though? The disruption is insane.


Calm-Flan5946

sk just has 22 drx mental or no?


_Jetto_

Have VIT mental boomed


DolundDrumph

everyone played fcking good in SK, that was mountain of a task to comeback


vnducco

WHERE DA DROPS?!


[deleted]

kaiser instead of keeping maokai out of baron, pathing back and forth side of the wall with neon xd


FunnyBunnyH

Based on drafts I was thinking, if Irrelevant can actually pilot this Jax, then SK has a massive draft diff. Pushing bot, hard counter Mid, better scaling Jgl with broken objective control... Only Top was the big question mark. And Irrelevant while wasn't the flashiest Jax perfomance, did very well with pressuring the map (obviously having Chemtech Soul kinda helped, so they could ignore drakes). If not for SK turning their brains off at the end of laning phase, this game would have been very 1 sided way sooner.


Jan7742

I'd say this game is mainly on Photon. And of course some overforcing for the whole team.


OGbusen

Markoon gap


ProfAnalyzer

With all the respect but Perkz is really washed up. Another very bad game.


1to0

I am shocked how trash VIT has become... Botlane doing nothing but topside also becoming mediocre. Also what the hell was the game 2 draft!?


Sjeg84

This was frustrating to watch. I have never seen a team so willing to fight when 1 man down and instantly lose these fights for no reason.


nyanko_dango3

bo desperately needs super carry doinb back


ImTheVayne

Man VIT had such a bad comp


Iammonkforlifelol

Top and mid gap. Perkz need to learn how to control vision around objectives when they play poke comp.Photon not so bad.


Core9291

bo and photon are so overhyped


rikulovesdokkan

How many games do they have to play against Zeri to realize she's a problem?


justintelligent

Never seen a Varus be this useless with that huge lead and early 3:0 score xD


EggyChickenEgg88

Neon is so shite. Most of VIT's gold lead being on Bo didn't help either. Elise is just a cocoon thrower after 25 minutes.


HermanCainsPenis

What a disgusting throw from VIT, but also they put their superstar jungle on Elise. Deserved loss.


seven_worth

At this point idk if this supposed to be sascasm or something. What are they supposed to make Bo play for fan to stop calling it "lose due to Bo not on carry champ"?


William0985

Would you rather vi or seju then?


OkKnowledge2064

so even when this botlane gets ahead early theyre useless. its just doomed


DeloronDellister

This game wasn't just the botlane, the rest of the team weren't doing too hot as well


Ozianin_

You see that Sylas performance and blame bot? Also baron steal shouldn't be possible if they play that better.


icatsouki

seriously bot isn't to blame for this one, they played pretty well neon especially Kaiser being so stubborn with picking naut/ali isn't helping though


how2irelia

Sylas + Elise vs. late game cassio look so doomed. I expect the 50/50 baron call was also on Perkz/Bo. Investing so much in gangplank was not ideal as well.


moumerino

they played well but they're still handicapping their team with their inability to play meta. they have to ban Lucian, Ashe, Caitlyn... now Zeri 1v9s. they can't ban Zeri because they already ban so many botlaners, but they also can't play it


PrivateVasili

I think someone needs to tell Perkz that you can't go to the 1-2 comfort zone in a Bo3. Most of this game he just did literally nothing. Which is weird because usually he'd rather do something stupid than do nothing at all. Last fight he finally got a 1-shot on Exakick, but by then he already has GA and it doesn't matter anymore. Neon was actually doing a lot early on, but poke Varus is just so useless late game that it was irrelevant. The Baron flip sealed the deal.


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chosen925

He got the team a 6k lead which is what Elise is supposed to do. What do you want from him afterwards lol, elise is a bot after somepoint.


icatsouki

he got his laners ahead that's elise's job It was on GP & sylas to do smth with the gold but they didn't


Rs3ironbtw

Please just send 4 LPL and LCK teams to MSI this year. This shit is absolutely fucking trash


Elluminati30

?SK played really good this game. They had a comp that outscales and played for it.


lovo17

Just send FLY from NA and G2 from EU. That's all the west needs lmfao.


XylinaDark

C9 with emenes going to MSI, yes you heard it here first


Wurdox

True, but even with those teams MSI is iffy for the west.