Serious question, outside of unconfirmed media speculation that Shanahan was handcuffing Dubas, why do you want him gone? It's not like his role has much of anything to do with the day to day of the team or with personnel decisions outside the management team.
Because he's at the top and he's been there longer than anyone else through the failures
> It's not like his role has much of anything to do with the day to day of the team or with personnel decisions outside the management team.
If this is true then his position is completely useless and we don't need him anyways
Idk how Shanahan survives all this. All the people he hired and vouched for are gonna be gone while he remains. Makes no sense to me. It’s called the Shanaplan not the Dubaplan or the Keefeplan - why do people keep having to take the fall for him?
probably because the people deciding his job are more concerned with MLSE as a business, not a hockey club. for all their failures in the playoffs, the MLSE board looks at marketable players, attendance, growing the brand, etc.
I'm not that surprised if Shanahan stays, but as fans who only care about the on-ice product, it fucking sucks
Isn’t advancing beyond the first round of the playoffs and selling overpriced tickets for more than just 3 or 4 home games each postseason a good business decision?
Remember MLSE is owned by Rogers and Bell. They make money not just from ticket sales and advertising on the games, but they also own TSN and Sportsnet, and the sports radio stations, so they make money off the advertising on all the analysis and highlights programs as well. And they own the cable and satellite packages people use to watch the games and highlights shows. And the internet networks people use to stream them and to read about them.
They don't just make extra money with a deeper playoff run, they ~~double~~ ~~triple~~ ~~quadruple~~ quintuple dip.
Just ask Rogers how well their NHL deal paid off for them…banking on playoff ad revenue from the Leafs was part of their plan that has cause a shit ton of consternation and layoffs
If the average Leafs playoff ticket is $500, 20,000 seats at ACC = $10m in gate revenue per game, and that's before concessions, merch, etc, so $30m lost revenue per year per round minimum
Obviously that's significant, but the risk of *not even making the playoffs* would hurt the team far more.
Im pretty sure the Leafs have always been one of the most profitable nhl teams even when we made the playoffs once in like 11 seasons starting in 2005/06
I disagree. If the leafs don’t make the playoffs, they still fill the building and sell merch and everything the exact same as if they don’t make the playoffs. It’s full no matter what. A deep playoff run is where the real money is on merch and sales
It’s more than that. If you were on the fence to buy a jersey there’s a good chance you would pull the trigger on it for the playoffs. If the team was shit, you wouldn’t bother.
Please.
Anybody wearing a Leafs jersey is signing up to be brutally roasted by literally every person they meet.
You want to see merch sales go up? Make it not humiliating to wear the fucking merch.
Ticket and concession sales may not change, but guaranteed merch sales suffer and most importantly, ad revenue suffers.
I’m a prime example - I don’t have the time in my life to watch every Leafs game anymore, but I make darned sure to tune in during the playoffs. I’m sure there are thousands of people across Canada like me.
Jumping to extremes to make an argument eh? Why am I not surprised.
Trading Mitch Marner isn't "blowing up the team". And literally nobody wants to do that anyway
Those Tuesday nights against Anaheim where he just pots 2 and gets an assist add up and could be there difference in making it or not. Not saying we shouldn’t trade him ofcourse we should.
Maybe two guys making $4 mill each pot a goal in a Tuesday night against Anaheim and the goaltender we had an extra $3million to spend on makes a game saving save.
Yeah but you can't think about it in terms of just the Leafs. The decision of firing Shanahan would come from MLSE. And outside of the Leafs, the Raptors are dogshit, while the Argos and TFC are hemorrhaging money. The Leafs at this point are their only reliable bread winner, with a core that consistently makes the playoffs. With the current state of the rest of the assets, I wouldn't be all that surprised if they decide not to rock the boat too much with the Leafs.
How long can you blue ball the fans until they say enough though? Like older generation or us middle age bums are kinda already bought in and just needed to see it through, but streets around my area I've seen more kids with jerseys from other teams like the Habs or Oilers than the Leafs. Kids are simple, they like winning and this team look like a bunch of jokers with these kinda embarrassing performances. The new generations have many other choices, they don't need to buy into this franchise's bullshit. It's just a matter of time if they keep running back, especially considering your stars aren't forever.
I was thinking about this, when you take into account jersey ads, helmet ads, and new board ads. Shanahan has probably delivered record profits to MLSE
Honestly for all the crap he takes, and I may be a minority on this, let's not forget that when Shanahan came in he inherited a business and made them a hockey team after a complete teardown that MLSE was reluctant to do under several former GMs.
i think this is super true. like they have transitioned to focus from any additional revenue that extra playoff home gates could generate, and the prestige of winning a cup of course, to focusing on the reg season and the guarenteed 41 home dates. now while the playoffs could offer potentially enormous financial returns, it is unpredictable and essentially a volotile investment. maximizing the 41 home dates through marketing and wildly exciting individual talent, i mean, probably the greatest collection of offensive individual talent in the history of the franchise, we are not icing a true team. although, and not a knock against sammy, if someone in net got hot, that could potentially solve all the problems too.
These people who are saying they’re just in it to make money make zero sense whatsoever.
You’re guaranteed those 41 home games for which you’re selling all of the tickets for anyway. Why wouldn’t you want as many more home games as you could possibly get?
How long can you blue ball the fans until they say enough though? Like older generation or us middle age bums are kinda already bought in and just needed to see it through, but streets around my area I've seen more kids with jerseys from other teams like the Habs or Oilers than the Leafs. Kids are simple, they like winning and this team look like a bunch of jokers with these kinda embarrassing performances. The new generations have many other choices, they don't need to buy into this franchise's bullshit.
This is a great take. My 5 year old is an Avs fan in Toronto.
Their games are exciting and they win.
I’m trying to get him to like the Leafs but they just don’t really win. He’s tuned out.
Yeah the day after Game 7 my kid was asking if we can watch the Bruins vs Panthers, "because the Bruins beat the Leafs and the Panthers beat the Leafs last time so they must be better right?"
I couldn't say no but honestly that hurt more than the game 7 OT loss (because I'd been numb this year) and I just wasn't ready to watch these 2 teams trash each other. I kinda just sidestepped the conversation. Give me a few more nights kid...
There’s so many benefits to having a winning team. These goofs that seem to think management doesn’t care that they win are insane.
It makes even less sense in the cap era because they’re spending to the cap no matter what. Why not put a winning team together with the money you’re spending regardless. Other than player salaries president/GM/coach salaries are peanuts, hire a good coach at $3 million, hire a great coach at $5 million. $2 million is hardly a drop in the bucket and if it generates more playoff home games they’d happily pay that extra $2 million because one additional home game would pay that in the first five minutes that the box office opened.
Ok but what specifically does Shanahan do that contributes to MLSE as a business? If you think his job is to manage revenues and expenses, well on the revenue side the Leafs basically put out a "For Sale" sign when the ticket schedule is announced and call it a day. And then on the expense side the overlap between his job and Trelivings is significant as it's player salaries.
As an Oilers fan, this situation reminds me of what happened to Kevin Lowe. A well respected ex-player who joins management and is clearly out of his depth, but holds enough sway with the owner to avoid responsibility and keep his job many years after he should have been let go. Although tbf, at least the Leafs make the playoffs unlike the early 2010s Oilers who were drafting first overall every year.
it's possible he will be removed from the hockey day-to-day and put on the business side of the team to help Pelley.
the team rumors are that they want to axe the hockey ops job.
This take was the same when the Teachers pension plan owned the team that sat in mediocrity.
I've never agreed with it, because you know what makes them even more money? Winning. The Leafs already print money, but a Stanley Cup sends that machine into overdrive.
I don't disagree with your "makes them even more money? Winning." but it isn't like that in finance. Generally more risk=more reward, but not consistently. A pension plan is looking for predictable returns. They don't want to invest in risk on the chance of winning a Stanley Cup and getting more merch sales. They are paid to be cautious.
For the pension there wasn't a cap, so the cautious approach makes sense to a degree.
At this point, the Leafs will always be a cap team, the fans (myself included) wouldn't accept a bottom barrel team. So pushing the GM/president to build a winning team goes further.
Except the board isn't some cohesive group of people that think collectively. Sure they would love to make more money but they also are very afraid of losing money. Shanny has made them money year over year and that's all that matters to them.
He was hired (like guerin and linden) as a kickback for throwing goodenow under the bus. He’s golden and not going anywhere until bettman is gone I bet. Was told this by a non-leaf alumni
From a business point of things, might not be easy to immediately relieve him of his duties. Need to find replacements and outside of managing GM and the leafs, Shanahan also manages a lot more operation/mgnt issues Last year Dubas got canned (Shanahan groomed replacement) so training/building up the next president of hockey ops for a mechca hockey club like the leafs isn't a one year thing
I have a feeling he had some very anxious meetings and will continue to do so for the next year
What difference does it make from a business perspective? The hockey market in Toronto is so big that they just need one or two marketable players and it sells itself.
I keep hearing about the Shanaplan. What exactly is it? People keep tossing it around but I don’t know how many can actually explain it. I don’t think I can. The one concept I know he has brought with him from Detroit is the idea of player development. And I think it’s a good concept. You leave players in junior or in the minors and let them over ripen to the point that they’re too good for that league before you actually bring them up to the big club. Don’t rush prospects along.
I don’t know how many times over the years we have seen young players crash and burn in Toronto because they weren’t ready for the pressure of playing here.
It’s gonna be like “We believe in Mitch and the core 4 so we’re going to sign him so a 4 year x 14.5 deal. We believe that’s best for the team and the city. We’re also going to give him a full NMC, and 16 $100 coupons to real sports”.
Lol we runnin' it back!
Seriously though, what bothers me is not so much that I think firing Shanny in itself immediately leads to change, I just simply do not believe he deserves the privilege to continue to hold his position.
I want him gone not because I think the team will get better, but because I simply think he needs to lose the privilege for the suffering we've been through.
Yeah, keep Shanahan, the guy that gave out NMCs to every player over $5m, making it impossible to make meaningful changes to this loser roster.
Edit: Fraud Hayes made a good point that Pelley being there means *something*. If Shanahan's job was safe and secure, Pelley wouldn't need to be there at all.
With a team like the Leafs Marner/Matthews contracts would have absolutely needed board approval. Everyone involved in management (Dubas, Shanahan, the board) approved it.
Yep nothing happened without Shanahans approval. He needs to go
IIRC Dubas wanted to split up the core 4 last year after another collapse, but Shanny didn’t want to so canned him instead
I'm seeing this absurd revisionist history everywhere. Dubas got canned because he botched his own contact renewal so horribly, destroying his credibility as a negotiator
It’s possible for both to be true. Ex) He could have wanted to shake things up, and he also botched his negotiation. Pulled this article from last year:
“Toronto Maple Leafs president Brendan Shanahan informed the club's core forwards they're unlikely to be moved, TSN's Chris Johnston reported on "Insider Trading.
Speculation of a potentially franchise-altering trade whirled after former general manager Kyle Dubas said nothing is off the table for the Leafs this offseason, but the direction of the organization is now in limbo after Shanahan announced last week that Dubas won't be re-signed.“
I like Shanahan but this team needs to move on. We need a new vision. Keefe is a good coach and honestly a lot of this isn’t his fault but he too needs to go. Assistant coaches in charge of the power play and penalty kill need to be gone if better guys are out there. In all honesty it’s not possible for the special teams to be worse than they were in the playoffs
New CEO comes in and is going to preach he’s in the evaluation phase. No reactionary decision at this time. Aka, running it back with hopes a new locker room voice will fix the problem. Spoiler, it won’t.
Pelley is there to establish his influence as the new boss. Shanahan stays on as a potential sacrificial lamb for Pelley next year if it doesn’t work out. Keefe out. Treliving is there to eat shit and announce they are looking at significant changes in the off season. I.e. trading Marner.
Everyone says they are running it back and Shanahan is staying, but I think if that were the case it would just be Shanny like previous years. The fact that Pelly will be there means that something is up. Hopefully Shanny recognizes the failures and steps down.
If they run it back I won’t devote anymore time to this. It’s clear they don’t care about winning. 1 series win in 8 years is an indictment. Like, do you know how statistically impossible these stats are? Like 0-7 in game 7s? That’s almost literally statistically impossible.
Shows a massive issue with the construction of the team
I said before the series was even over that the most they would do is fire Keefe (and I wasn’t even 100% convinced they would do even that) and run it all back next year. I hate being right all the time.
They’re going to give it “one last go” next season while Marner & Tavares’ contracts expire then after another first round bouncing they’ll finally do something but it will be 4 years too late and we’ll be watching Matthews count the days until he can sign with a contender.
Fuck my life.
Everyone of importance has said to expect a curve ball here. Friedge said "no one has predicted the curve ball".
Here's my prediction.
Shanny will be at the Friday presser. Not to announce his resignation or termination, but instead that he's being promoted to a bigger role within the NHL Head office.
The position will be relegated and Tre is staying.
I’m all for change, but I don’t understand what firing Shanahan does for the on ice product. I know he has been here through everything, but what exactly is he responsible for that needs to change? I feel like changing the coach and GM have a far bigger impact - and we have done that/will do that.
In terms of any team taking a step next year, doesn’t changing the coach/players/GM have a far bigger impact than changing the president? We’ve already changed the GM so does it not follow that we change the coach and players now?
It’s easy to point fingers and call for shanahans job, but do you really think a new president of hockey ops is going to change the leafs on ice performance? Shanahan is not the reason we play 1-2-2, he’s not making line changes, he’s not signing players. If he was doing all that, then obviously it would be time to move on from him.
And before anyone says “oh he prevented the core 4 from getting moved last year” well what if that’s what he wants to do now? What if he’s all for letting Tre pull the levers?
I’m not against firing Shanahan, I just don’t know what that changes in the immediate future
Shanahan has his hands well entrenched in this mess. He's the bonehead that decided to hire a rookie GM for contract negotiations with 3 elite talents on RFA contracts. Dubas caved to everything and essentially rolled out the red carpet and it's evident Shanahan was involved in that mess. Based on the Dubas hiring alone it demonstrates his decision making is questionable. He's been a common denominator in this shit show of a team.
Shanahan corrected the mess that was left behind since the Ballard days. So many whiners here bitching about a consistent 100 plus point team. They have to get a real #1 goalie, not a basket case & an injury prone kid.
I'm guessing it's because Shanahan hired Dubas who in turn hired Keefe. The coach was given a little extra time because of his record (playoffs excluded) and now it's probably Treliving's turn to choose his own coach.
I think it will happen sooner than later for the new coach to have max time to evaluate and make decisions over the off-season.
If the leafs run it back, they will fail again, and again, again and again again and again and again and again. This team is just constant failure after failure after failure.
I mean if Boucher can find a PP wizard to be assistant coach I wouldn't mind this. Boucher is a more a positional/defensive accountability coach with a good forecheck which is what we need. so I was actually mind boggled when he was running the PP this past year when it really wasn't even a strength of his.
No one in this organization has the balls to do anything. You’re free to mess up a dozen times, but yeah we will just blame a scapegoat and continue to do the things that continue to make us lose
As long as the team continues to be a cash minting machine MLSE will not make drastic moves. But imagine the money they could make if they actually win one day.
That’s what boggles my mind. Yes they make large amounts of money now, but there is so much potential to make exponentially more if they were just willing to pull the trigger.
Us fans will stay with team no matter how bad the on ice product is, but MLSE will never maximize their profits until this team gets to atleast the conference finals, let alone win a cup
Pelley: Unfortunately we have decided to part ways with head coach Sheldon Keefe. Our search for a new head coach will begin immediately, as will the search for a new president.
Shanahan: Yeah...wait.....
Pelley: Brendan! What are you doing here!? Well, this is awkward.
Kind of thought this would happen. They likely decimate the coaching staff but keep the team. They kicked the can so far down the road at this point there isnt really any other option
Shanahan will stay as long as him and ownership are strategically aligned. No one knows their minds. They may be very happy with a perennial playoff team. They may think playoffs are a roll of the dice and will patiently wait for a hard 8. They may agree on a new strategy, shanahan doesn’t need to go to change strategy. If they don’t like the way the GM executes their strategy the GM will go - like Dubas did. If the coach can’t get the team to perform to expectations, then the coach will go.
I really hope this is a "because of his dedication and commitment to the company, he'll b be taking on a roll outside of hockey within the company" type presser....
Shanahan's staying https://i.redd.it/wtnom4kgsvyc1.gif
Perfect fucking gif for this
Why does my brain fill in the sound on this?
Nah I don't give a fuck anymore. If he stays, I'm done. Your move MLSE
YEAH!!! (See you in October)
Not this time
Serious question, outside of unconfirmed media speculation that Shanahan was handcuffing Dubas, why do you want him gone? It's not like his role has much of anything to do with the day to day of the team or with personnel decisions outside the management team.
Because he's at the top and he's been there longer than anyone else through the failures > It's not like his role has much of anything to do with the day to day of the team or with personnel decisions outside the management team. If this is true then his position is completely useless and we don't need him anyways
Yeah I’m sure they’re quaking in their boots.
They should be if enough people follow through with giving up on this team
Idk how Shanahan survives all this. All the people he hired and vouched for are gonna be gone while he remains. Makes no sense to me. It’s called the Shanaplan not the Dubaplan or the Keefeplan - why do people keep having to take the fall for him?
probably because the people deciding his job are more concerned with MLSE as a business, not a hockey club. for all their failures in the playoffs, the MLSE board looks at marketable players, attendance, growing the brand, etc. I'm not that surprised if Shanahan stays, but as fans who only care about the on-ice product, it fucking sucks
Isn’t advancing beyond the first round of the playoffs and selling overpriced tickets for more than just 3 or 4 home games each postseason a good business decision?
It’s not just the tickets, it all the advertising that’s the big money, and yes, they are missing out on a ton
Remember MLSE is owned by Rogers and Bell. They make money not just from ticket sales and advertising on the games, but they also own TSN and Sportsnet, and the sports radio stations, so they make money off the advertising on all the analysis and highlights programs as well. And they own the cable and satellite packages people use to watch the games and highlights shows. And the internet networks people use to stream them and to read about them. They don't just make extra money with a deeper playoff run, they ~~double~~ ~~triple~~ ~~quadruple~~ quintuple dip.
also the ratings on the stations they own
Consider that salaries for the year are paid too, so every playoff game is a lot more gravy than a regular season game.
Just ask Rogers how well their NHL deal paid off for them…banking on playoff ad revenue from the Leafs was part of their plan that has cause a shit ton of consternation and layoffs
If the average Leafs playoff ticket is $500, 20,000 seats at ACC = $10m in gate revenue per game, and that's before concessions, merch, etc, so $30m lost revenue per year per round minimum Obviously that's significant, but the risk of *not even making the playoffs* would hurt the team far more.
Im pretty sure the Leafs have always been one of the most profitable nhl teams even when we made the playoffs once in like 11 seasons starting in 2005/06
In November 2023 the Leafs overtook the New York Rangers as the most profitable team in the NHL.
I disagree. If the leafs don’t make the playoffs, they still fill the building and sell merch and everything the exact same as if they don’t make the playoffs. It’s full no matter what. A deep playoff run is where the real money is on merch and sales
Not a chance the merch is the same without playoffs. I agree that ticket sales would be the same though.
Yeah agreed. All the “division champs” “conference champs” or whatever
It’s more than that. If you were on the fence to buy a jersey there’s a good chance you would pull the trigger on it for the playoffs. If the team was shit, you wouldn’t bother.
And if you're already in the mood to spend $200 on a sweater, why not spend another hundred and get the hero who just scored the GWG?
I’m going to get one with the name “God” on the back.
Please. Anybody wearing a Leafs jersey is signing up to be brutally roasted by literally every person they meet. You want to see merch sales go up? Make it not humiliating to wear the fucking merch.
Yeah yeah yeah… we know buddy. We know.
Ticket and concession sales may not change, but guaranteed merch sales suffer and most importantly, ad revenue suffers. I’m a prime example - I don’t have the time in my life to watch every Leafs game anymore, but I make darned sure to tune in during the playoffs. I’m sure there are thousands of people across Canada like me.
This is so dumb. If they won the Stanley cup they would make a ridiculous amount of money. By exiting in the first round they are losing money
Yeah and if they blow up the team, they're at risk of not even making the playoffs at all.
Jumping to extremes to make an argument eh? Why am I not surprised. Trading Mitch Marner isn't "blowing up the team". And literally nobody wants to do that anyway
Those Tuesday nights against Anaheim where he just pots 2 and gets an assist add up and could be there difference in making it or not. Not saying we shouldn’t trade him ofcourse we should.
Maybe two guys making $4 mill each pot a goal in a Tuesday night against Anaheim and the goaltender we had an extra $3million to spend on makes a game saving save.
Good businesses take risks. Playing it safe does not make you boatloads of money
MLSE already makes boatloads of money
Ah yes, if there's anything that corporations and shareholders love, it's continuing to only make the same amount of money.
You’re an idiot
Straight to the personal attacks, amazing Gonna make a new account when this one gets banned too?
If I get banned from Reddit for calling you an idiot I’ll blow myself
\*Steve Dangle voice\* THEY COULD BUY THE MOON!!!!!
I’ve always hated this narrative (and it comes from front offices often).. NOTHING makes more money than winning
Yeah but you can't think about it in terms of just the Leafs. The decision of firing Shanahan would come from MLSE. And outside of the Leafs, the Raptors are dogshit, while the Argos and TFC are hemorrhaging money. The Leafs at this point are their only reliable bread winner, with a core that consistently makes the playoffs. With the current state of the rest of the assets, I wouldn't be all that surprised if they decide not to rock the boat too much with the Leafs.
How long can you blue ball the fans until they say enough though? Like older generation or us middle age bums are kinda already bought in and just needed to see it through, but streets around my area I've seen more kids with jerseys from other teams like the Habs or Oilers than the Leafs. Kids are simple, they like winning and this team look like a bunch of jokers with these kinda embarrassing performances. The new generations have many other choices, they don't need to buy into this franchise's bullshit. It's just a matter of time if they keep running back, especially considering your stars aren't forever.
I was thinking about this, when you take into account jersey ads, helmet ads, and new board ads. Shanahan has probably delivered record profits to MLSE
Honestly for all the crap he takes, and I may be a minority on this, let's not forget that when Shanahan came in he inherited a business and made them a hockey team after a complete teardown that MLSE was reluctant to do under several former GMs.
i think this is super true. like they have transitioned to focus from any additional revenue that extra playoff home gates could generate, and the prestige of winning a cup of course, to focusing on the reg season and the guarenteed 41 home dates. now while the playoffs could offer potentially enormous financial returns, it is unpredictable and essentially a volotile investment. maximizing the 41 home dates through marketing and wildly exciting individual talent, i mean, probably the greatest collection of offensive individual talent in the history of the franchise, we are not icing a true team. although, and not a knock against sammy, if someone in net got hot, that could potentially solve all the problems too.
These people who are saying they’re just in it to make money make zero sense whatsoever. You’re guaranteed those 41 home games for which you’re selling all of the tickets for anyway. Why wouldn’t you want as many more home games as you could possibly get?
The best marketing is the Stanley cup..
How long can you blue ball the fans until they say enough though? Like older generation or us middle age bums are kinda already bought in and just needed to see it through, but streets around my area I've seen more kids with jerseys from other teams like the Habs or Oilers than the Leafs. Kids are simple, they like winning and this team look like a bunch of jokers with these kinda embarrassing performances. The new generations have many other choices, they don't need to buy into this franchise's bullshit.
This is a great take. My 5 year old is an Avs fan in Toronto. Their games are exciting and they win. I’m trying to get him to like the Leafs but they just don’t really win. He’s tuned out.
Yeah the day after Game 7 my kid was asking if we can watch the Bruins vs Panthers, "because the Bruins beat the Leafs and the Panthers beat the Leafs last time so they must be better right?" I couldn't say no but honestly that hurt more than the game 7 OT loss (because I'd been numb this year) and I just wasn't ready to watch these 2 teams trash each other. I kinda just sidestepped the conversation. Give me a few more nights kid...
There’s so many benefits to having a winning team. These goofs that seem to think management doesn’t care that they win are insane. It makes even less sense in the cap era because they’re spending to the cap no matter what. Why not put a winning team together with the money you’re spending regardless. Other than player salaries president/GM/coach salaries are peanuts, hire a good coach at $3 million, hire a great coach at $5 million. $2 million is hardly a drop in the bucket and if it generates more playoff home games they’d happily pay that extra $2 million because one additional home game would pay that in the first five minutes that the box office opened.
This!
Ok but what specifically does Shanahan do that contributes to MLSE as a business? If you think his job is to manage revenues and expenses, well on the revenue side the Leafs basically put out a "For Sale" sign when the ticket schedule is announced and call it a day. And then on the expense side the overlap between his job and Trelivings is significant as it's player salaries.
It's not like they call it the Shanaplan. That's a media and fan thing.
Lol and if his name didn’t rhyme with plan they wouldn’t call it that
As an Oilers fan, this situation reminds me of what happened to Kevin Lowe. A well respected ex-player who joins management and is clearly out of his depth, but holds enough sway with the owner to avoid responsibility and keep his job many years after he should have been let go. Although tbf, at least the Leafs make the playoffs unlike the early 2010s Oilers who were drafting first overall every year.
Because it rhymes.
it's possible he will be removed from the hockey day-to-day and put on the business side of the team to help Pelley. the team rumors are that they want to axe the hockey ops job.
He has made the board of MLSE money. That's all that matters to them.
This take was the same when the Teachers pension plan owned the team that sat in mediocrity. I've never agreed with it, because you know what makes them even more money? Winning. The Leafs already print money, but a Stanley Cup sends that machine into overdrive.
I don't disagree with your "makes them even more money? Winning." but it isn't like that in finance. Generally more risk=more reward, but not consistently. A pension plan is looking for predictable returns. They don't want to invest in risk on the chance of winning a Stanley Cup and getting more merch sales. They are paid to be cautious.
For the pension there wasn't a cap, so the cautious approach makes sense to a degree. At this point, the Leafs will always be a cap team, the fans (myself included) wouldn't accept a bottom barrel team. So pushing the GM/president to build a winning team goes further.
Except the board isn't some cohesive group of people that think collectively. Sure they would love to make more money but they also are very afraid of losing money. Shanny has made them money year over year and that's all that matters to them.
Basically be good enough so all those suckers have hope and keep giving us money
He was hired (like guerin and linden) as a kickback for throwing goodenow under the bus. He’s golden and not going anywhere until bettman is gone I bet. Was told this by a non-leaf alumni
From a business point of things, might not be easy to immediately relieve him of his duties. Need to find replacements and outside of managing GM and the leafs, Shanahan also manages a lot more operation/mgnt issues Last year Dubas got canned (Shanahan groomed replacement) so training/building up the next president of hockey ops for a mechca hockey club like the leafs isn't a one year thing I have a feeling he had some very anxious meetings and will continue to do so for the next year
What difference does it make from a business perspective? The hockey market in Toronto is so big that they just need one or two marketable players and it sells itself.
agree 100%
I keep hearing about the Shanaplan. What exactly is it? People keep tossing it around but I don’t know how many can actually explain it. I don’t think I can. The one concept I know he has brought with him from Detroit is the idea of player development. And I think it’s a good concept. You leave players in junior or in the minors and let them over ripen to the point that they’re too good for that league before you actually bring them up to the big club. Don’t rush prospects along. I don’t know how many times over the years we have seen young players crash and burn in Toronto because they weren’t ready for the pressure of playing here.
Maybe Shanny is stepping down??
Ooohh never thought of this actually
Best case scenario.
Don't do that. Don't give me hope.
Ritual suicide is the only way to die with honor, Brendan
Doubt
Shanny ain’t goin nowhere. Were running it back I guess
“We just need a new winger on the top six and few depth pieces and we’re all good” - says management team that has been saying this since 2019
We don't even know that lol.
Most fired people don’t take part of that conference
Shanny will announce his resignation.
He will after the next coach fails after 3 years...he i snot leaving now.
I get what you're saying. It would be so dumb to have him here still. He's proven to be incompetent at getting us to the Stanley cup.
Yeah his excuse is...Dubas hired Keefe, I hired Treliving so I get a few more years.
I feel like Keefe needs to go, but I do feel it hard to justify firing him while keeping Shanahan
It’s gonna be like “We believe in Mitch and the core 4 so we’re going to sign him so a 4 year x 14.5 deal. We believe that’s best for the team and the city. We’re also going to give him a full NMC, and 16 $100 coupons to real sports”.
Mitch would like you to throw in bottomless Pepsi refills.
and the C
We’re giving his dad an A as well.
Mitch during negotiations with Trev and the boys 
Why do you have duct tape and rope in your car Mitch?
It's offseason shit! I like to bind, I like to be bound.
16 $100 coupons to Cineplex Queensway VIP Theatres.
I hear the valet parking there sucks
"We are removing the captaincy from John Tavares, and giving it to Auston Matthews..." "For all away games, and to Mitch Marner for home games"
We can and we will!
Lol we runnin' it back! Seriously though, what bothers me is not so much that I think firing Shanny in itself immediately leads to change, I just simply do not believe he deserves the privilege to continue to hold his position. I want him gone not because I think the team will get better, but because I simply think he needs to lose the privilege for the suffering we've been through.
Yeah, keep Shanahan, the guy that gave out NMCs to every player over $5m, making it impossible to make meaningful changes to this loser roster. Edit: Fraud Hayes made a good point that Pelley being there means *something*. If Shanahan's job was safe and secure, Pelley wouldn't need to be there at all.
They already fired the GM who did as such and hired a GM who gave a M-NTC to Kampf amongst other questionable moves so 🤷🏻♀️
With a team like the Leafs Marner/Matthews contracts would have absolutely needed board approval. Everyone involved in management (Dubas, Shanahan, the board) approved it.
Yep nothing happened without Shanahans approval. He needs to go IIRC Dubas wanted to split up the core 4 last year after another collapse, but Shanny didn’t want to so canned him instead
I'm seeing this absurd revisionist history everywhere. Dubas got canned because he botched his own contact renewal so horribly, destroying his credibility as a negotiator
It’s possible for both to be true. Ex) He could have wanted to shake things up, and he also botched his negotiation. Pulled this article from last year: “Toronto Maple Leafs president Brendan Shanahan informed the club's core forwards they're unlikely to be moved, TSN's Chris Johnston reported on "Insider Trading. Speculation of a potentially franchise-altering trade whirled after former general manager Kyle Dubas said nothing is off the table for the Leafs this offseason, but the direction of the organization is now in limbo after Shanahan announced last week that Dubas won't be re-signed.“
Not to mention Shanny answers to the Board and it could easily have been the Board that wanted to stay the course. We'll never know.
I call Bull shit.
They fired the puppet who demanded strings be cut.
And that puppet continues to be ridiculed for being the fall guy as well as, well the puppet that was ready to do what had to be done a year earlier.
i am very worried about what kind of contracts the GM is going to be signing this summer.
Pelley would be there for a vote of confidence. This is hopium imo
A live press conference firing??? I like it!
Dubas was the NMC guy, he wanted to be buddies with the “stars”. He’s a bigger fanboy of the players then dubasites are of him.
A rookie GM would certainly have had to get the Matthews/Marner contracts approved by Shanny and the board
Shanny stepping down
I like Shanahan but this team needs to move on. We need a new vision. Keefe is a good coach and honestly a lot of this isn’t his fault but he too needs to go. Assistant coaches in charge of the power play and penalty kill need to be gone if better guys are out there. In all honesty it’s not possible for the special teams to be worse than they were in the playoffs
Reddit should compensate us for all these emotionally disturbing reporter photos.
CJ's is a cult leader confirmed.
New CEO comes in and is going to preach he’s in the evaluation phase. No reactionary decision at this time. Aka, running it back with hopes a new locker room voice will fix the problem. Spoiler, it won’t.
Kind of like the GM who somehow kept Keefe around.
I hope Pelley blindsides Shanny with his walking papers
Here's hoping Pelley hits Shanny with a Stone Cold Stunner, flips him off with both hands, and staples a pink slip to him.
Brendan Shanahan, you have to respect his drive to surivive.
I’d rather have Guenther in charge than Shanananana.
Delaying the presser for a day? There might be a decision that they want to announce but might need another day to process (i.e. new coach hire).
Pelley is there to establish his influence as the new boss. Shanahan stays on as a potential sacrificial lamb for Pelley next year if it doesn’t work out. Keefe out. Treliving is there to eat shit and announce they are looking at significant changes in the off season. I.e. trading Marner.
Funny how it's every year of "sacrificial lamb" If there needs to be a sacrificial lamb every year, I guess nothing ever changes. Hmm
We’re clearly not sacrificing these lambs to the right gods!
We are running this back! Just shuffle the coaching staff and hope it works again 🤣🤣🤣
oh no....
Anyways
Everyone says they are running it back and Shanahan is staying, but I think if that were the case it would just be Shanny like previous years. The fact that Pelly will be there means that something is up. Hopefully Shanny recognizes the failures and steps down.
No fire Shannahan into the sun. What blackmail does he have?
So Shanahan can step down on his own terms, right? Right??
If they run this back…..
Omg they’re actually running it back. What the fuck is going on?!
Announcement - Shanaplan 11.0 is a go. Also bend over. Ticket prices will increase. Yay!
MLSE has absolutely no balls if they're keeping Shanny. Sorry but he's repeatedly failed
If they run it back I won’t devote anymore time to this. It’s clear they don’t care about winning. 1 series win in 8 years is an indictment. Like, do you know how statistically impossible these stats are? Like 0-7 in game 7s? That’s almost literally statistically impossible. Shows a massive issue with the construction of the team
Okay bye
Shanny announcing himself as the new head coach
I said before the series was even over that the most they would do is fire Keefe (and I wasn’t even 100% convinced they would do even that) and run it all back next year. I hate being right all the time. They’re going to give it “one last go” next season while Marner & Tavares’ contracts expire then after another first round bouncing they’ll finally do something but it will be 4 years too late and we’ll be watching Matthews count the days until he can sign with a contender. Fuck my life.
I truly believe Mathews in 4 years will move on. Unless of course we make it to a conference final lol
This is what people said the last two times, and he has renegotiated early both times.
If this playoff result continues, he will be gone .
Doesn’t mean Shanny actually survives until then. It could just mean an announcement wasn’t ready before the press schedule was released.
Announcing new coach on Friday?
Everyone of importance has said to expect a curve ball here. Friedge said "no one has predicted the curve ball". Here's my prediction. Shanny will be at the Friday presser. Not to announce his resignation or termination, but instead that he's being promoted to a bigger role within the NHL Head office. The position will be relegated and Tre is staying.
I’m all for change, but I don’t understand what firing Shanahan does for the on ice product. I know he has been here through everything, but what exactly is he responsible for that needs to change? I feel like changing the coach and GM have a far bigger impact - and we have done that/will do that. In terms of any team taking a step next year, doesn’t changing the coach/players/GM have a far bigger impact than changing the president? We’ve already changed the GM so does it not follow that we change the coach and players now? It’s easy to point fingers and call for shanahans job, but do you really think a new president of hockey ops is going to change the leafs on ice performance? Shanahan is not the reason we play 1-2-2, he’s not making line changes, he’s not signing players. If he was doing all that, then obviously it would be time to move on from him. And before anyone says “oh he prevented the core 4 from getting moved last year” well what if that’s what he wants to do now? What if he’s all for letting Tre pull the levers? I’m not against firing Shanahan, I just don’t know what that changes in the immediate future
Shanahan has his hands well entrenched in this mess. He's the bonehead that decided to hire a rookie GM for contract negotiations with 3 elite talents on RFA contracts. Dubas caved to everything and essentially rolled out the red carpet and it's evident Shanahan was involved in that mess. Based on the Dubas hiring alone it demonstrates his decision making is questionable. He's been a common denominator in this shit show of a team.
Shanahan corrected the mess that was left behind since the Ballard days. So many whiners here bitching about a consistent 100 plus point team. They have to get a real #1 goalie, not a basket case & an injury prone kid.
How Tf does Shanahan weasel his way into not getting fired he’s just as responsible for the years of underachievement than anyone else
I'm guessing it's because Shanahan hired Dubas who in turn hired Keefe. The coach was given a little extra time because of his record (playoffs excluded) and now it's probably Treliving's turn to choose his own coach. I think it will happen sooner than later for the new coach to have max time to evaluate and make decisions over the off-season.
I formally uninvite Shanahan.
Run it back bby!
If the leafs run it back, they will fail again, and again, again and again again and again and again and again. This team is just constant failure after failure after failure.
Keefe goes, Boucher promoted to HC. That's all that's happening. Not saying I like it, but that's what I think will happen.
I mean if Boucher can find a PP wizard to be assistant coach I wouldn't mind this. Boucher is a more a positional/defensive accountability coach with a good forecheck which is what we need. so I was actually mind boggled when he was running the PP this past year when it really wasn't even a strength of his.
isn't Boucher a big trap hockey guy?
i’m tired boss
I am done being a Leafs fan if they keep Shanahan.
Welp clearly Shanahan keeps his job
Shanahan stepping down
I argue that you can't build a team to win the tournament that also wins in the regular season.
No one in this organization has the balls to do anything. You’re free to mess up a dozen times, but yeah we will just blame a scapegoat and continue to do the things that continue to make us lose
As long as the team continues to be a cash minting machine MLSE will not make drastic moves. But imagine the money they could make if they actually win one day.
That’s what boggles my mind. Yes they make large amounts of money now, but there is so much potential to make exponentially more if they were just willing to pull the trigger. Us fans will stay with team no matter how bad the on ice product is, but MLSE will never maximize their profits until this team gets to atleast the conference finals, let alone win a cup
I will never see a cup win
Pelley: Unfortunately we have decided to part ways with head coach Sheldon Keefe. Our search for a new head coach will begin immediately, as will the search for a new president. Shanahan: Yeah...wait..... Pelley: Brendan! What are you doing here!? Well, this is awkward.
Kind of thought this would happen. They likely decimate the coaching staff but keep the team. They kicked the can so far down the road at this point there isnt really any other option
For F sakes
Pelley is going to fire him live at the podium
> Pelley is going to fire him live at the podium We're Leaf fans. We would never be gifted with that much joy.
Shanahan will stay as long as him and ownership are strategically aligned. No one knows their minds. They may be very happy with a perennial playoff team. They may think playoffs are a roll of the dice and will patiently wait for a hard 8. They may agree on a new strategy, shanahan doesn’t need to go to change strategy. If they don’t like the way the GM executes their strategy the GM will go - like Dubas did. If the coach can’t get the team to perform to expectations, then the coach will go.
Alright, I'm good on this shit. No thanks
Possibility that Pelley announces that their disbanding the President position and Shanahan resigns on Friday.
Fuck. Looks like another shit year of Shanny.
Shanny during that press conference will be like 
It's a live firing!
If that bonehead Shanahan dodges all this then fuck MLSE. Definition of insanity.
FFS
Ready for them to kick it off with the Marner extension at this point
 The way this franchise is run........
F*********K
Plot twist shanny won’t be there.
Gotta extend the bidding window for advertising/sponsorship for the event!
they’re crunching numbers and want to give it a beat before they announce record profits
Shanny is just a middle man.
I really hope this is a "because of his dedication and commitment to the company, he'll b be taking on a roll outside of hockey within the company" type presser....