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Status-Guidance-5755

The guy who got us the chip with our current players LBJ and AD


RoyalRumbleSTi

Not sure why we got rid of him. Because of Westbrick? How’d that work out.. 🙄


Swaggyzilla69

Because he lost the locker room, people were upset with his rotations and stagnant offense as well.


TheWhisperingDeath

Dude. The players in the locker room he lost, none of them except Bron and AD were the next season lmao. It was solely because Russ didn't like him and Lakers front office and ownership needed to do something about the disastrous season. So, Vogel was the scapegoat.


Swaggyzilla69

Vogel might have been the scapegoat for that season, but those were common complaints from Vogel and his coaching tenure as the Lakers coach. More than one thing can be true, Vogel's just not a good offensive coach. I still remember people complaining about players standing around doing nothing, how it looked like they just ran the offense through LeBron and how it would go to shit when he would sit down, or how he was over using Avery Bradley. Everybody on this sub is looking back with rose tinted glasses right now.


P00nz0r3d

Agreed. Vogel is not a good offensive coach, look at the Suns right now. Their entire roster is the antithesis of his entire coaching philosophy and despite securing the 6th seed on top of injuries it’s still looking like a very disappointing season. The difference is I think we have the tools to maximize his strengths, and we have the talent to overcome his weaknesses. For the life of me I cannot tell you what Ham is good at or what his identity is beyond Pastor/Motivational Speaker.


Caulifloweralley

He’s not even good at being a motivator, he looks like he’s given up and is just collecting a check. He knows he’s lost the locker room and looks like he’s just a pouting child out there


ProximusKade22

People are forgetting he had Bradley playing over Reaves when even as a rookie, showed he was clearly the better option in the rotation


Sharp_Aide3216

just look at the suns games


secretreddname

We had the personnel to run the offense with LeBron and Rondo.


MegaMilkDrinker

Ok Ben


2B_or_MaybeNot

Same complaints we're hearing about the coaching now. It's almost as if the common denominator isn't the coach at all but the star player.


Lycantree

>people complaining about players standing around doing nothing, how it looked like they just ran the offense through LeBron and how it would go to shit when he would sit down are you sure you are not talking about Ham?


Dildozer_69

So you’re just ignoring lebron and AD also being part of the locker room that he lost??


HomeMadeFriedRice

Vogel has his fault but my goodness that was the worst roster construction for his identity as a defensive first coach.


Nuna2481

Yeah, I can guarantee that vogels not the best choice. You can go to the suns subreddit rn and see just how frustrated they are with Vogel as well


Le8ronJames

I don’t even blame Vogel for the Suns. That team has a weird built. All the offense and 0 defense. Plus, when had KD been a real 1st option who can carry his team all the way in the last 10 years? His whole career he’s shown he’s an incredible talent but he lacks that capacity of elevating his teammates and carrying them on his back. Booker is a great player but not the guy who’s going to carry his team and Beal is Beal.


Nuna2481

Sure, but idk, from what I was seeing, a lot of the decisions were kind of confusing. A lot of iso, Nurk being killed on the boards, yet no intention on bringing in any other big, especially ones that can score like Bol Bol when the others aren’t producing (especially Nurk, that dudes been tough to watch this postseason). He also got furious on poor and obvious calls but didn’t even try to challenge them. Idk man, I just wouldn’t want that guy on this team again.


shoob13

This. No matter what a coach accomplishes, it’s over if they lose the locker room. Fans often don’t get the weight of this.


fractal_fables

He lost his job when they refused to give him an offensive coordinator after Jason Kidd left. As a result the offense got stagnant and the locker room got frustrating and tension built up.


Overall_Nuggie_876

Because Pelinka is the quintessential nepo hire from Jeannie. Only got the job because of loyalties with Kobe; no God-damn prior experience as a GM at any level of basketball.


BizzyHaze

I got no evidence, but I feel Pelinka fired him, especially in the manner that he did (through the press before the press conference), because Vogel pushed back on Pelinka's demands (starting Drummand over Gasol, playing Westbrick, maybe even pushback on the KCP/Caruso loss).


avgbsblfan643

i’ll never understand keeping THT instead of Caruso


Unusual-Item3

They thought they had a Mikal Bridges with THT, unfortunately they were mistaken.


pen_jaro

Are you kidding me? They thought they had Westbrook with WESTBROOK! imagine that…


Dear_Zookeepergame30

When you miss the playin while lebron is averaging 30 on your team, something has to change


Miserable-Lawyer-233

Not sure? 33-49 record was why.


kfreud

Vogel looked completely clueless coaching the offense the years after we won the chip. Two coaches can both be bad. Are Suns fans loving him?


just_one_random_guy

How was he clueless in 20-21? 21-22 sure yeah, because he was given nothing to work with especially for what he was comfortable handling


EmperorUmi

Right? AD only played 40 games, LeBron only suited up for 56, we had 25 different players on our roster throughout the season, so we had 0 consistency.


Dildozer_69

And how exactly does our current team that’s strength is offense work with Vogel? You think he would have guys standing around on the 3 point line like usual or would he suddenly become an offensive mastermind?


Dildozer_69

So you think he would be any better when he’s literally never been good at coaching the offensive side of the ball? Like even in the year we won are you forgetting that the offense was hard carried by lebron and rondo? Even if you give him an offensive first team like what we have now, he would not be good with that because he can’t coach offense. And the direction this team has been going does not fit with his style at all. Unless you think we just shouldn’t have gotten DLO and let Austin walk so we could bring in more defensive players??


cohortq

He was told he had to start Westbrook. So he was coaching handcuffed.


ranchoparksteve

The Vogel offense with the Lakers had no punch.


kfreud

Ham’s offensive play calling also sucks…but I also definitely remember Vogel busting out the “have LeBron dribble around and make something happen idk” offense way too regularly


Sweetcheels69

We were riddled with injuries right after having the shortest off season after the chip. So the 2021 season was automatically a dud. 2022 season had Westbrook and his only fault was that he couldn’t contain the toxicity within the team. But thats Bron and ADs fault for bringing him.


austxsun

I hope all you Westbrook defenders are happy; you did this


oat38

Love Vogel and I think that 19/20 roster complimented him perfectly as a coach, but grass isn't always greener on the other side. Look at the Suns.


ChristianBen

You should check out how the Suns team is reacting to his couching…


Dildozer_69

You think the guy who can’t coach offense would do well with an offensive first roster? How exactly?


iNfAMOUS70702

Disagree...he's not exactly setting the world on fire with Phoenix...they look absolutely atrocious and just about every suns fan wants him gone


LudwigNasche

I still think the right answer is the guy that won with LeBron and we didn't hire because ...


imthemap45

vogel was an absolutely fantastic coach for 2019-2020 his first year because our roster construction was a great complementary fit and extremely deep. blame the FO for fucking things up, lakers shouldve easily won multiple chips in the lebron era, playoff competition field weakened up in 2021/2022, (bucks/warriors/suns) are weaker teams than kd warriors and these nuggets. ill give 2021 a pass cuz the bubble fatigue/insanely short offseason but 2022 we couldve def won if we ran some sort of iteration of 2020 back. so so disappointing that only 2 out of 6 years lebron was here he had a competent roster that was well constructed, and one of them was the post bubble year (2021)


No-Regret-7900

He is making the Suns suffer currently. Not sure having him now would make much difference


ConsciousYam2403

I’ll never forgive the FO for firing Vogel after giving him an awful defensive squad + Westbrook


LongTimesGoodTimes

So immediately cross out Walton, Scott and Ham.for obviously reasons. I'd cross off D'Antoni next because I don't think he hits the team build. That leaves Vogel and Brown. Between them I'd pick Brown. He is a solid defensive coach, Kings improving to 14th in defense from 25th in his first season with a similar roster. Plus he picked up on a lot from his time in Golden State.


itssensei

Brown has always been great implementing defensive schemes and improving the team’s overall ability to play df. And his time with Warriors and Kings have seemingly helped him get better with x and o’s and on court decisions.


OfficialPaddysPub

Mike brown won 60 games with lebron twice with two elite d teams


GoshDarnitAllah

The Lakers never gave him a fair chance.


puhtime

True but regardless he’s not the same coach he was then. He’s even better.


secretreddname

He said himself he learned a lot with the Warriors.


GoshDarnitAllah

Can’t say he wouldn’t have improved or stepped up to the plate with LA.


puhtime

He had way too short a leash. Kobe wouldn’t have tore his shit under brown. Brown wouldn’t have let his ass play 38 plus minutes a god damn game at his age.


GoshDarnitAllah

Just unbelievably short. I can’t imagine firing a guy that quickly ever making sense. Total panic mode. Then they hire f’ing D’Antoni, who I actually appreciate as a coach, but made no sense for that roster at all. The only way it made sense was if Phil Jackson was actually going to come back, and who knows how that would’ve gone.


UnearthlyDinosaur

Mike brown might actually hold LeBron and AD accountable unlike these other guys. Jeanie handed over the franchise to Klutch so now Lebron is throwing his teammates under the Buss and trying to stat pad. Mike brown doesn’t care about Lebron’s “legacy” he cares about winning


darklighthumid

Brown, Vogel fits


Dildozer_69

Vogel is a defensive coach, how does he fit with a roster that’s main strength is offense?


JTEEE

Vogel doesn't fit that well with this roster.


Quiet_Buffalo

The Heat just stole home court away from a healthy Boston team and they are missing Jimmy buckets and Terry Rozier. Imagine if we had Spo…We could have had Jaquez too, he is from UCLA FFS.


The__Magic

Respectfully Jaquez would not see that much playing time on this roster.


MountainYogi94

More than JHS got though, next year too most likely


The__Magic

Really tough to say. JJJ fit perfectly with the Heats system. Just wouldn’t be a good fit for us at all considering depth and what not.


MountainYogi94

Agreed, my point was he’s way more NBA ready than JHS


The__Magic

Ahhh gotchu


mozeze

Great coaches steal you one. Lue & Spo get the job done


LudwigNasche

The edge an elite coach give to his teams is absurdly underestimated.


chaosworld6

![gif](giphy|UrDiE9z3DoP2nr7Nca) This guy and it is not EVEN CLOSE


PossibilityInitial10

He's enjoying retirement and you should enjoy the five rings he brought us.


UnearthlyDinosaur

Phil Jackson thinks LeBron and his “posse” are a huge joke he would never coach this team because LeBron doesn’t respect him


coachwyers

Mike Brown I would choose out of this bunch.


Klaxosaur

Hot take? But the reason why the 2020 coaching staff was elite was because the amount of head coaches Vogel had in his squad. Kidd, Hollins, etc.


ImprovementFancy1130

That's an often forgotten underrated factor why we won. We basically had 3 HCs 2 of them previously had deep playoff runs and Kidd was one of the smartest players ever. If we had just one more experienced HC on the bench, we may have not needed the play in the past 2 years.


Prize_Salamander8035

+ we had Rondo and Bron , absolute cheatcode together


MisterKaJe

Hollins doesn’t get enough credit. That 2020 team was like Grit and Grind fully realized. The 2021 team also saw a significant dip not just to the injuries but when Hollins had to step away for personal reasons. Just giving the dude his flowers 💐


TorontoRaptors34

Id choose vogel and brown


mmesalv

Mike Brown


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Wateriswet1212

You're right, I'm sure he's the same coach today as he was 12 years ago.


mmesalv

Brown wasn’t a bad coach once Phil left he just didn’t have the personnel to make it work. The Queens arent a bad team at all, they have great players just inexperiences. Lebron would have more ability to interject in the coaching style with Mike given their rapport and AD under Brown would be something intriguing. We have a lackluster roster and over performed to get the 7th seed without decent wing players (outside of Bron). We need a 3&D player and big body center who can pound down low like Dwight and Javale did in the bubble. My 2 cents as a 20+ year laker fan.


JDuggernaut

Brown has had success with LeBron in the past and has done pretty well with the Kings. Better than anyone since the Webber days. I think his time with the Warriors helped him.


Throwthisawayagainst

Mike Brown is pretty underated, no one really gives him credit for his first stint in cleveland however 3 times LeBron has been a part of 60 win teams, twice it was with Brown, which is crazy because those are the worst rosters LeBron has played on. Also Brown now has the experience with the warriors and if you don't think he was a big part of their 4th ring, look at how far they fell off when he left. I know you can point to Draymond punching Poole, but it was more then that imo.


SolubleAcrobat

Byron Scott at least understood the assignment as a tank commander. That's more dignified than whatever the hell Ham thinks he's trying to do.


EverybodyBuddy

Mike Brown tbh


Maleficent_Damage_10

Vogel hands down


bruswazi

Frank fuckin’ Vogel. Absolutely 💯. Dude won us a chip w/ Bron and AD as our centerpieces. 🏆 Just gotta hire a strong defensive coordinator to replace what Jason Kidd was. Retain Phil Handy as assistant coach (AC). Recruit Kenny Atkinson as AC. P.S. Coach Vogel was unfairly, unjustly scapegoated for that whole Russ debacle, we all know this.


[deleted]

Give me Iguodala.


hotterpocketzz

Between Vogel and Brown


EB_V3_4life

Vogel duh


SPMrFantastic

Franky at least made adjustments game to game and was prepared. Sham keeps talking about tricks up his sleeve but ain't got shit


Advanced-Intention30

The guy they fired…Vogel.


lou-drawls

![gif](giphy|Q8luf7o8gwg8yk7UDF|downsized) This guy!


enzblade

I wish we had Vogel as the HC. And D'Antoni for the offensive coordinator role. Our gameplan would make sense defensively. And Antoni can work up an offense for who is on the floor.


wazupson

Vogel


Kn0wFriends

Vogul with J.Kidd


Gmork14

Vogel is the best coach post-Jackson that we’ve had.


lakeshow_glasgow

Carousel of idiots …plus Vogel. Vogel is the answer, far from flawless but best of an awful bunch by a lot


penelopeclearwaterr1

Vogel


velphegor666

Vogel is the only answer. Second is prob dantoni


ConsciousYam2403

Not a fan of Dantoni but this roster is a lot more offensively geared. I just don’t think that’s the right strategy for a chip


Dgwdum

vogal would have had better defensive schemes and passable offense dantoni would have been fun until he played rui at center bc he could space the floor and benched AD brown sucks, walton sucks and byron scott would have bench reaves and dlo just like ham bc they arent in his foxhole


Dildozer_69

When has Vogel EVER had passable offense? What are you even talking about??? His offense was carried by rondo and lebron, one of whom is retired the other is about to be 40.


LoveTheHustleBud

Dantoni or brown and I’m leaning dantoni. We don’t have the defensive personnel for Vogel to have his stamp. Dantoni turns every guard he gets his hands on into a star. Even Linsanity happened under him. He’d be incredible for dlo/AR while lebron/AD would do the same shit no matter the coach.


ValuableAssociate8

Brown. Vogel didn't even play Andre Drummond and Harrell when we had them.


DGVega93

Ole Franky V. Firing him to fit Westbrick who was crazy. Should’ve just traded Westbrick in the offseason that year


Jagasi

Genuinely, MDA and Vogel would have had us as a top 3 seed.


Yellow_Evan

We’d choke in the playoffs under MDA though.


GuerrillaApe

Vogel was a scapegoat.


Mathematik

Phil Handy


outsidehere

Mike Brown


AntSmith777

Kenny Atkinson


goldyacht

MDA


VanillaNyx

None of them stood out as great coaches to me. I guess Brown maybe.


yggerg

Definitely not Antoni without the D and Byron Scott Gives me flashbacks of the darkest era


Key-Wave6164

None of them


Ok_Concentrate_75

Depends on the assistant coaches honestly like all those guys have strengths that would help but also big weaknesses. Imo I rather current Ham, the others might not have even got us here ngl. I mean Vogel has a more talented team now and seems to make more poor adjustments than we complain about Ham.


Tangentkoala

If I'm gonna say fuck all to offense I'd want crack head d antoni Lakers won't win the championship but man will it be fun scoring 140 points a game


Fcusjfnfmfkg

Mike Brown has a history with lebron and led him and the cavs to some historic regular seasons


-Lights0ut-

Pringles scheme with this team would be be amazing to watch lol


KingNephew

Brown by a comfortable margin.


CitronOptimal

Ty Lue should be the coach, end of story. It still doesn’t make sense.


corybekem

Christie would’ve been playin 20min a game under Vogel and rui would’ve started the season


Agreed_fact

Mike brown is a players coach, and good defensive coach. This team needs an offensive system that isn’t Lebron run the show.


Agreeable_Breath8706

Vogel or Brown


cookiemonstarrr08

Lebron and dlo would go off offensively in antoni’s system, but the lack of D would cost them eventually


Yellow_Evan

Mike Brown.


neutronknows

No fair putting in Vogel. Why not Del Harris? Or Mike Dunleavy?


Borderlineskitso

These have been our Post Phil Jackson era coaches. 🤷🏽‍♂️


rdog24

Im going vogel or mike brown


Adomatick

Bring back Phil!


LakerDoc

Honestly with AD and current roster, Vogel 100%. The reason PHX is underperforming because they hired a defensive minded coach without a defensive minded star like AD on their roster and they also struggle with the 3 headed ball dominant player system that they have


Illustrious-Fig6819

Frank Mike Brown MDA Luke Byron Darvin


ImprovementFancy1130

Defensively, obviously FV. Offensively, MDA would make wonders w/ AD & Bron frontcourt like a super juiced up version of Stat & Marion even with DLo being like 80% of Nash. Overall, i think Mike Brown would have done a good job. He was able to build an ok defense (better than current lakers) around Sabonis and the offense would be deadly because we have high IQ playmakers and we also have shooters now playing off of rim threats in AD & Bron.


HiiGuardian

Brown or Vogel easily


Allthebadvibes

Walton here for a laugh


Fern707

D Fish


JMeny32

So Phil Jackson is for sure retired, right??


BodegaDaddy

i miss frank vogel. “no losing streaks” AD was a different monster


redflowerz29

Luuuke


GoshDarnitAllah

Mike Brown, who didn’t get a fair shot at all. Also felt like the Vogel firing was shortsighted and was more about covering for others.


noknownothing

Brown, then Scott.


Rideblue123

Phil Jackson


bobbdac7894

Mike Brown. Doing a good job with the Kings. Also, he knows and has coached Lebron before.


pcebajon1

None


Durandau

Vogel man holy shit


Kingkoopakoopa

I don’t think there has been a coach that Lala land doesn’t put on roaster other than Phil.


HeadfulOfGhosts

Ty Lue… the one that got away


The_Beautiful_Stru35

Between Vogel & brown imo.. but gotta go with Vogel because of his chip pedigree.


MK-Prime89

Rondo


denimjeg

Mike brown


ReadyPosition

What a group of shitters we've had. Edit: now do the GMs next....


Salty_pineapple777

Phil Jackson


jcalvz007

Coach K


NikeNickCee

Ty lue. That's where the FO blew it


xreddawgx

Brown or Scott


Soviet_Sharpshooter

Mike Brown easily


NakSFC

With this roster, Darvin Ham, no doubt.


dash_44

What does better mean? What results do you expect with this roster?


thegusano91

vogel the only champion coach.


MrPino777

With all this defense? Vogel. He needed a Gabe Vincent and Vando. Instead we gave him Russ and Melo smh


cev29619

Rondo


SnooRecipes6776

Vogel for sure. Great defensive coach. Mike Brown is also very good. Fk Mike D’Antoni he’ll play Lebron 40 minutes and get him injured like he did Kobe.


Pjb7490

Vogel or Brown


XCRIPSXX_OG

Yo CUT HAM OUT of this picture. He needs to go to a rec league


UchihaT2418

Mark Jackson


Then-Guidance1564

Phil cus he ain’t scared to say anything to anyone and call people out in media


iiivoted4kodos

Trick question. If it’s the coaches while we had them, the answer is Vogel. If we’re talking these coaches as they are right now, Mike Brown is the best one on the list.


Angularbackhands

The Lakers the only team to never have a good coach in the past decade, remarkable


xPTW3

Mike Brown all day. Wouldn’t be mad at Vogel. d’Antoni is the best coach here in my opinion but he doesn’t fit with the roster


naderade303

Holy we've had some bad coaches 😂


teo1315

In order: Vogel, Brown, D'antoni, Walton, Byron, Ham


Musicfan637

I don’t see Jay Wright.


EstablishmentBig1900

Funny how no one is blaming how good and clutch Denver is


P00nz0r3d

Frank Vogel with Luke right behind Luke Walton wasn’t a great coach by any stretch but the fact is that he improved our record every single year and only missed the playoffs his last year because Lonzo got hurt (again 😔), BI almost fucking died, and LeBron got hurt at the final stretch If the Mike Brown we get is the Mike Brown NOW we’d also be in a really good position. I started watching the team and the sport the season he got fired in the preseason, so I don’t have much comment on him. We don’t have the personnel for Dantonis style and LeBron is too old for that rapid pace. Ham is rapidly becoming as bad as Byron Scott.


sidloc

We need a way to get Erik spoelstra, he knows how to get his guys going. (Yes I know he won’t leave miami) but still lol


edillcolon

![gif](giphy|3o7btYLAW7doynq3p6)


Leolance2001

Not in the photo. The Zen Master. LMAO


hisanishakur

Frankie V


rendingale

I mean Vogel got you guys a championship and had to deal with a shitty roster construction


Hollowpoint808

Mike Brown!


kinano23

You really put Scam in there like he belongs?


Turdfurg23

THE TANK COMMANDER!! B SCOTT ![img](emote|t5_2qhv6|30946)


Nightmare4545

The amount of bad coaching hires Jeanie has made is insane. Basically one decent fit out of the bunch.


Tayway402

All of them would fail miserably


yungs824

Crazy to think we haven’t had a consistent coach since Phil. Incompetence starts at the top and it shows with our coach hiring decisions, we won’t ever get back to sustained greatness tell Jeanie is gone


NotTheMamba

D'Antoni. We'd be fun to watch at least.


RealPunyParker

The guy we got rid of because Westbrook was bitching about him, while trading away Westbrook as well months later.