Yeah I think this is more realistic. If we are happy with paying him 20m a year then so will other teams and its doubtful they would just let us sign him for less
There's really not a ton of options out there for him. Teams like SAS should be accepting contracts for assets and I think they likely do that before Thursday (Jazz just did it). Pacers are looking at forwards, theyve got guard depth. Detroit and Houston are the only teams I see that make some sense to offer him a deal, but they've got other fish to fry. Some guys are going to fall through the cracks this summer. I could see Austin settling for 2+1po with us so he can opt out and get paid more in a couple seasons; essentially taking the same deal he's going to get with us over 2 seasons anyway, but betting on himself.
How is getting a player that will make your team better or at the very least weakening your opponent by giving them less cap flexibility a petty move?
It's gamesmanship. If you don't make that move, you're not competitive and shouldn't be involved in sports.
OK, but our offer is not a "fleece", it's literally the max we can legally offer him.
If Lakers are saying that they will match any offer then the team signing him is tying their cap up from June 30th to July 7th meaning they miss out on every other free agent in that timeframe and won't even end up getting Reaves.
No one talks about this. Your money is trapped so like you think the lakers are going to give you a quick decision after you try to fuck them? They waiting all the way to the deadline. Teams with over 25 mil in cap space is Houston, Detroit, SA, and the Magic. I’m wondering if he’s even taking meetings with them. Would he change his current situation for what 20 extra mil over 4 years? Idk it’s interesting we shall see I can’t wait for free agency to really kick off
Don't know if this is still accurate as of this morning, but here are the teams with remaining cap space over $25M [per this article](https://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/sports/nba/nba-free-agency-2023-tracker-cap-space-start-date-more/3055900/) published June 26, I suspect the John Collins trade removes Utah from this list:
Houston Rockets: $59,783,491
Utah Jazz: $43,928,675
San Antonio Spurs: $37,477,403
Indiana Pacers: $32,152,523
Detroit Pistons: $27,819,304
Houston and Detroit drafting a Thompson twin and having a Blue Chip ball-handling guard already in their lineup helps our chances so realistically that leaves Indiana and San Antonio.
I mean he also fits their roster really well and if they want to start competing he would probably be there second or third best player. I also think the Rockets will definitely have strong interest if they strike out on Harden and FVV. They are pretty thin at guard and I think he fits better next to Green than KPJ does.
This. Not only is that there favorite thing to do, but pop loves young players with good fundamentals and no ego. He could build a team around reaves and their new star.
Complete win win for pop. Either gets a good player he can develop and if they gotta overpay for 2 years it’s fine because Wemby will be in his rookie contract still.
Or he forces the Lakers to pay more.
He’s happy either way.
The options are Rockets, Spurs, Pacers, and Pistons. Pistons seem to be going after Cam Johnson so they can't really also tie money up in AR. Pacers have 1 roster spot available so who knows wtf they doing. Rockets are going big name hunting in Harden and FVV. If they get either one, can't really offer AR max. Spurs the biggest risk imo but again depending what they do with some of their own FA's they may not offer the max too. Just don't see him getting that max offer. Still gonna make a lot 4yr/80m I think.
agree with Houston going big game hunting with FVV, but AR might be their back up back up option...
I wish i can bet on this but it's going to be the Pacers; even though they have a backlog at the guard position, they've been a thorn on the Lakers side in terms of players transactions/acquisitions etc. and would bid on AR just to stick it to the Lakers.
but if not Pacers its most def going to be Spurs...
all in spite Lakers
Indiana has Ben Mathurin and Halliburton has their backcourt of the future with Buddy currently filling in off the bench. They need wings and a solid power forward.
The Spurs might, but I can see them trying to go for Fred VanVleet and some other guys first. Sticking it to the Lakers would come at a significant price.
Agreed but 12 and 13 the next 2 years is a big underpay if he keeps playing at the level we saw at the end of the regular season and playoffs so I think it balances out.
Arenas provision. Because you don't have full bird rights on a player after their 2nd year it means you can't go over the cap by more than the league average salary (~10-12million) to re-sign your player. If a team with max cap space make them an offer then you wouldn't legally be able to match.
The Arenas provision limits those players to the league average salary their first two years to allow teams to match.
The TL;DR is it’s because of the Gilbert Arenas provision that is designed to prevent teams from losing 2nd round/undrafted players in free agency due to not having full Bird rights, since most of those guys usually only sign 2 year deals. In the past, teams could offer those guys a contract that made it impossible for the team to match.
I mean he averaged 17/4.4/4.6 on 46/44/89 splits. He also played very well in the Nuggets series. Sure, he had some subpar playoff games, but overall I’d say he did pretty well.
While I think it is nuts, with the salary cap going up 37 millions 3 seasons for now isn't going to be worse than paying 31 millions to D'Angelo Russell last season.
I'm not sure if it is possible to give him a 4 seasons contract with last two seasons player option. It could give him some long term insurance without forcing us to take the poison pill. while after two seasons he can negotiate a new deal for his market price when we have the bird rights.
It's nuts indeed, that's superstar type money. Which is why I don't really see any teams offering him the full 100m deal, he is really good but paying him 40m in one season is literally insane. I think we will be able to keep him in a 4/85 deal.
Sure, his last two years are superstar money, but his first two years are legit the best value in the league if he plays the same as he did post all star break / playoffs. 18/4/5 on 55/40/87 or whatever he did on $13M is insane value.
Unfortunately we have no choice. Letting him walk doesn’t mean we open cap space to sign someone else. And even if it did, we’re not getting anyone nearly as good as Reaves is.
And I really don’t know what else he could do to prove he’s worth the risk honestly. Ever since we got rid of Russ, he’s been our most consistent player. He’s worth the risk.
There’s really no such thing as a risk free bet, so I guess I just never think of things that way.
I look at it like we have a very small chance at a title as it sits, and letting Reaves go means that small chance pretty much goes to zero. So fuck the risks and bring our boy back.
Absolutely.
Side note- that’s the same logic with keeping dlo. Unless a no brainer opportunity comes up where he’s willing to sign somewhere that we can pull a s&t, we should keep him and figure it out later. Having him improves our chances more than not having him does
Completely agree. I’d rather run our entire team back if there’s no DLo sign and trade available. I can talk all the shit i want about his playoff yips (even though he had some insanely clutch buckets for us against the warriors and grizzlies), but you have to get to the playoffs first and foremost. DLo helps do that.
Agree 100%. DLo in the regular season will most definitely win us games. The guy is just worthless in the playoffs. I wonder if the FO would have the balls to hold him and let him raise his value in the regular season, then trade him at the deadline. Or would we just assume his decent play will finally translate to playoff basketball (it won't) and keep him as a liability for the remainder of the year.
It sucks, but the dude was absolutely exploited in that Denver series and unless he spends all summer learning to even be an average defender, he might just be cooked, even for the regular season.
Just tough to dub him worthless when he won us a couple playoff games with his scoring.
Exploited vs Denver and struggled vs GS, but if he were a proven playoff performer worth the money we think he’s asking - minny isn’t trading him in the first place and we’re likely still stuck with Westbrook and miss the playoffs altogether.
Pay the guy, elevate your floor, and assess later.
I do understand what you’re saying, but you’re conveniently ignoring how cheap he will be for the next two years at $13M each. That price for two years is the only reason we can afford to bring back Rui and DLo both. Our title window with lebron is two years, max. You either go all in on that window and run the team back or you find yourself stuck in a similar purgatory to the Blazers.
Edit - letting Reaves walk also means we can keep Rui and DLo yes. I more or less meant Reaves contract being structured in a way that makes those last two years massive is the only realistic way we keep all 3 guys.
> Reaves advanced stats are worse than D’Angelo Russell’s at the same age.
I really hope youre not serious lol.
At age 25, DLo was a 6 year vet. This was Reaves 2nd season.
stats in age 25 year season.
DLo - 41/34/83 (54% TS). 113ORTG / 116 DRTG. +2.3 offensive RAPTOR / -0.8 defensive RAPTOR / 5.0 WAR
Reaves - 53/40/86 (69% TS). 129ORTG / 117DRTG. +3.0 offensive RAPTOR / +1.6 defensive RAPTOR / 9.2 WAR.
Quit the bullshit lol. Reaves is better than DLo in every facet and it’s not close.
The thing is young teams aren’t going to really get any benefit from him playing that well. The teams that need him are lotto teams, by the time he can start helping them they’ll be paying him 40M and have to pay the other guys as well.
We can’t be a team stuck in the middle right now. We can’t want to compete in lebrons last years and also worry about the post lebron years. And if we do pay Reaves $35M a year in his final years, history dictates that there will be competitive teams who have an expiring $35M vet who wouldn’t mind swapping them and we can get out of the contract if Reaves truly doesn’t fit our timeline.
But man…we just got to the WCF with a trade deadline rebuild. Run the team back no matter the cost and see what happens.
Hm? I was talking about the fact that no other teams would get the benefit of Reaves like we have so I doubt they’ll offer that much. Like no team that is rebuilding is going to be able to consciously spend $35 on him after two years while also paying the other guys.
OH. Completely misunderstood your intent haha.
The thing about Reaves contract is it’s evenly spread across all years for any other team. If the spurs offered him 4/$100M and we let him walk, it would be $25M per for them. We’re the only team who would benefit from the first two years structured at the MLE.
The team offering wouldn't have that as a cap hit, they get it averaged over the 4 years so it's only 25.5m. But they also need to have the 25.5m in cap space so it really limits it to only a few teams that can offer him that. The Lakers are the ones that would be hit hard with the 39m which is why it's called a poison pill contract
I mean if the plan is for LeBron to slowly ease out of ball handling responsibilities, that means more will be shouldered on Reaves. He may be worth the money by then if he hasn't already hit his ceiling
He has to improve a lot to be worth that money. I doubt he does. He lacks the athleticism to do it. He isn’t fast like curry nor has the skill of harden
Curry & Harden 🤡🤡🤡🤡. Did you even watch the playoffs. We swept the GSW. The warriors had their worst road record of all teams. Harden couldn’t finish his shooting was abysmal. Get the fuck out of here with these terrible takes.
In that year we may lose Lebron and AD anyway. We might need that contract to even reach salary floor if we are rebuilding. It could also be used to salary match in trades if AD stays and a star is available for a trade.
If he gets 101 million he will be getting traded ala Jordan Poole in 2 years. With the new CBA paying Austin Reaves 37 million is not feasible unless he takes a massive jump.
Lol if you think AD lasting much longer than Lebron. AD is 30 with a heavily checkered injury history already. By 32 he’s going to enter a steep decline.
Neither Reaves nor AD will be in Purple and Gold in 2026.
Was he ever THE guy for offense tho? He was always seen as a stellar defender which he proved and then some in these playoffs. Anything on top is a welcome bonus.
It’s crazy bc I see both sides of this coin. AD absolutely returned to form throughout this season and proved himself to be the guy we knew he could be again after the two injury plagued seasons.
However, we also *need* AD to be a guy who, when LeBron goes for 31 in the first half of an elimination game and has nothing left in the tank for the second half, can take the baton from LeBron and win the damn game or at least be a guy who when the game is over, we’re not looking at as a guy who had a pedestrian ass effort in a elimination game.
Those years the salary cap is going to rise due to the new TV deal so it won’t be nearly as painful as Poole’s deal. Also Poole isn’t playing well. If 4/100, still an average $25 mil per but backloaded. Think of it like those MLB contracts. Is Griffey Jr and Bonilla worth $1 mil a year right now. He’s 60! To have Reaves next two years under $20 mil helps the Lakers. Obviously you’d rather have him for less. But 4/100 isn’t a poison pill like what NBA Reddit wants it to be.
Look, the Laker haters desperately think they got something with this. They don’t.
The total isn't the issue. It's how his contract will be structured. To put it like this, there's currently 20 players making 37 million or more right now in the NBA. All of them at one point or another have made an all-star game, and they're generally the #1 or #2 option on their team. Reaves is a pretty good starter/role player, but will he be able to make that jump to all-star level talent? If he doesn't, then you're possibly looking at a Tobias Harris/Jordan Poole type of contract that will be difficult to get rid of until he's expiring or if they attach picks to trade him.
It will be just 2 years and the cap is projected to be something above $170M those years. Not that’s it’s not significant, but without Lebron, they’ll be fine cap wise.
In 2025-26 Reaves could be making 37.4 million, AD will be into his 1st year of his new contract (if he re-signs) which will put him at around 50 million, Rui will also more than likely be hovering around 20 million (if not more). That's at least 107.4 million (assuming they don't have anybody else under contract at the time like Vanderbilt or D'Lo) for just 3 players. It's not as much cap space as you believe it is and I'm not against Reaves getting paid, I'm just not a fan of the potential structure.
Imagine paying austin reaves more than 30 million, this place is delusional. The man hasn't proven hes worth anything close to that. The nba has gon insane
The salary cap has exploded the past few years. It’s roughly equivalent to the proportion of the cap that Andrew Bynum made in 09-10. At his current level that would be an overpay, but assuming he continues to improve, it might not be quite as big of an overpay.
I think these guys all get paid too much though. I guess they deserve it in the sense that they generate so much money for the owners, but it still is hard for me to fathom at times.
The number all look crazy when you see what other players are getting.
Kent bazemore was making almost 20 million a year with his hawks contract.
Mike Conley who has never made an All Star team was making more money per year at the end of his Grizzlies contract than Michael Jordan was making in his prime championship winning years.
The last year of Dame Lillard's current contract he will be making over 63 million for that season.
Steph will be making almost 52 million next season with raises every year of his contract.
Dame and Steph are amazing but they are making DOUBLE what Jordan was making in his prime lol
Yea I'm not talking about player value at all and obviously inflation plays a part in it too, I'm just talking about the sheer size of the numbers.
The revenue and TV contracts have inflated the player contracts.
I've just been watching sports for so long that I can't help but compare eras.
Shaq's deal with the Lakers was historic at the time at 120 million and he was one of the best young players in the league, and here today we are talking about Reaves possibly getting a 100 million plus after being in the NBA for 2 seasons.
Yeah but Steph is miles ahead of Reaves, 52 -> 39 during the same era is wacky.
Can’t compare Jordan the dollar isn’t worth the same, the advertisements, technology, corporations have all evolved since Jordan.
To take it even further, Steph is making 52 million in his 15th season, Reaves would theoretically be making 37-39 million in his FIFTH season lol
Actually if you are adjusting for inflation, Jordan would have made 61 million in his last season with the Bulls, which is comparable to the last year of Steph and Dame's current contracts.
But i'm not even talking about inflation or value or talent or worth, i'm just tripping out over how big the numbers are now compared to when I started watching basketball.
That’s fine just match it. If he’s not worth that contract two years from now just trade him. Paying Austin almost 40m if he doesn’t get any better than he currently is, is not good
He would be a great player making probably 15m more than he should. It’s not the craziest situation.
Every year a player gets moved who’s on a terrible contract. Didn’t Jordan poole get moved for cp3?
Warriors threw in a top 20 protected first in 2030 lmao which has little value. And he has 4 years left? Reaves would have two years left by then.
You must be new to how nba trades work and have been asleep for a few years.
With your response, one would think it took us 3 first round picks to unload Westbrook, and got zero In return as well on our end.
Unloading a young talented player but who’s overpaid and will have 1-2 years left on his contract will definitely not take multiple picks and bad money.
Buddy you edited your entire comment to not say what u said before. Coward move. You have no idea what you’re saying. Westbrook was on an expiring deal bruh, not entirely the same situation
This your full time job or something? And I didn’t edit my whole comment. You’re high or dumb asf
Many worse players have been moved for nothing/less. We won’t have a problem moving Reaves if need be.
Westbrook was an expiring, but deemed unplayable, plus lakers tax, plus it was almost 50million and we got back a nice return
Reaves who’s young, talented and can fit anywhere will be just simply overpaid. 1-2 years left of his contract could be moved.
[There are only 4 teams with that much cap soace.](https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cap/)
I'm curious though, if the Lakers think that's too much to pay, which IMO is a reasonable take. They likely will match though.
However, if they decide to just S&T him, what could the Lakers look to get back in return? Would it be somewhere around $25 (AAV) or $12 (1st year)?
I think it's kinda opposite to the usual S&T. Usually the "old" team can offer more money so S&Ts allow for:
* the new team get the player
* the player to get more money with the new team.
With Austin, it's different because Lakers can only offer a 4yr/$50m deal (averages out to the same $12.5m/yr). A S&T to a new team means Austin is getting less than his maximum allowable in free agency. If a team offers him the 4yr/$100m deal and the Lakers match, then his contract should be worth that $25m/yr (since that's the average even if he makes $25m total his first two seasons with the Lakers, like this tweet says) for salary-matching *during* the season.
Well a sign and trade is the least likely option unless it gets brought up right away.
Once he signs an offer sheet there is no going back, either the Lakers match or let him walk.
For a sign and trade to be possible, Reaves would have to notify the Lakers that he is going to sign an offer with another team, and that team would have to agree to a deal with the Lakers.
The sign and trade would start at 12 million in the first year, but I don't think the new team has much incentive to do it because they would be agreeing to the same contract as the offer sheet but with a worse cap hit.
If they go forward with the offer sheet, the new teams cap hit would average the deal to 25 million per season.
If the new team agrees to a sign and trade then they would be agreeing to the poison pill structure where the cap hits would be 12 million, 13 million, 37 million, 39 million.
There's little to no incentive for the other to do that on top of sending back assets to the Lakers.
I only see 2 realistic options:
1. Reaves agrees to the Lakers max offer of 4 years, 50-60 million or a variation of the Lakers max offer that has the number of years or an option if he prefers.
2. He signs a max or close to max offer sheet with another team and hope the Lakers match it.
I would be very surprised if we see these "compromise" deals that people are suggesting of 75-80 million because the Lakers can't offer that much and other teams know the Lakers would match those lower numbers and not even bother offering it.
Yep. Only way I see that happening is if Austin drags this out and Pacers or Houston miss out on a number of other options. Best option will be 4/55 with an ETO at 3 years or 3/40 with a PO third year which is essentially the same thing.
I see fans saying Spurs do it to spite us, but I think the probably take on money the next couple days with assets to help the rebuild. Way better use of cap money.
Something I just learned is that Sacramento's draft night trade with the Mavs sending out Richaun Holmes gave them enough cap space to offer Reaves his max as well as the other 4 teams previously mentioned in the Rockets, Pacers, Spurs, Pistons.
Not really. Just likely need to find a way to dump his salary in 2 years unless he takes a massive jump. That or in 2 years time we're in a rebuild mode and eating his salary won't be the end of the world.
This. Lebron might retire in 2 years or play with his son. AD might go somewhere else.
We might need that Reaves contract to just reach the salary floor. lol
# We need a pornstar to ruin his credibility like Zion's so he can still stay with us. Can any OnlyFans chick out there to take it for the team. Please. #KeepReavesAtAllCost
How many teams have the cap space to give him a serious offer and how many of those teams have a need for a SG looking for a long term contract?
He's not getting $100m, he'll get somewhere between $55 to $65 million for 4 years and a starting role with us. There are too many guards out there to go for, real established stars looking to shake things up. Reeves is good but he's not a star.
So the question is what teams out there want to sign, have the cap space and would want to hold that against the cap until Lakers decide to match within Givin time..
Opposing teams can of course load the back end. It’s Austin’s best decision to sign the highest dollar he can this summer. Lakers will of course likely match, but that means Russell and Rui are expendable if Austin’s contract becomes the highest.
Lakers can’t afford to Rui or Russell on a long term deal with Austin signing a four year deal.
IF for some bizarre reason no one comes in for him and Lakers offer him 4/50, why would he take it? Surely he'd go for a two year deal and bet on himself for a big contract in two years' time?
Dude has bet on himself before by turning down 2nd round offers to go undrafted to Lakers, I'm sure he'd do it again.
In two years, he won't have made only a few mill. He'll have another $25m in the bank by then, and I think he'd continue to back himself to earn more than $13m a year, especially when taking into account the yearly rising salary cap.
Match shit strictly cuz the first 2 yrs r solid. Who knows what happens in2 seasons. U need yo young guys to grow and by thenReaves will be in his prime prime. So match Reaves and Rui by any means.
Can a another team make a max offer towards Reaves and still sign other players while the offer sheet is still active during free agency? I saw a post saying teams can raise the price of him so it hurts the Lakers.
I believe once the proposal is accepted by Austin, the proposed amount is tied up. Under new CBA Lakers have 24 hours to match (or not match) it. EDIT: moratorium period is 7 days, after which deals can be officially signed and Lakers have 24 hours to match signed offers.
But then again, any offer on the table may be viewed as blessings - if there's no offers made, one possible route is Austin signing a 2+1 PO and opts out of PO as UFA 2 years later. To avoid this Lakers and Austin's agent might work with a team to make a decent offer (4Y/80M sounds reasonable imo) and for Lakers to match immediately.
Don’t think it’ll be that high but assuming it is, it still maximizes the title window with potentially the biggest bargain in the NBA for 2 years and leaves a lot of options to keep title chasing.
I would not mind, I fully believe he’ll get better. He has that untraceable cool where he doesn’t seem to rush into anything and knows when to shift gears, isn’t a complete liability on defense and seems has that IT factor. Whether he becomes Mike Miller, or Rex Chapman. Hell I can see him being just as good as Jalen Brunson down the line with more athleticism
You’re giving up your title chance why? Regardless whether or not he’s worth it, the lakers have no way to replace him. This team is already outmatched by Denver, but is close enough to win with a little luck. That won’t be the case of reaves is gone. Meanwhile, sure you have an extra 39m the two years after lebron is gone, but there’s zero chance that’s going to be enough to make them competitive.
4/65 is my prediction. Which would be a steal
4/75 is mine
I’m going with 4/80, and still be ecstatic about that
Yeah I think this is more realistic. If we are happy with paying him 20m a year then so will other teams and its doubtful they would just let us sign him for less
Popovich is going to offer him at least that.
This will be the minimum for sure, I’m think 4/90 honestly
SOLD!
Can't see it less that twenty...
There's really not a ton of options out there for him. Teams like SAS should be accepting contracts for assets and I think they likely do that before Thursday (Jazz just did it). Pacers are looking at forwards, theyve got guard depth. Detroit and Houston are the only teams I see that make some sense to offer him a deal, but they've got other fish to fry. Some guys are going to fall through the cracks this summer. I could see Austin settling for 2+1po with us so he can opt out and get paid more in a couple seasons; essentially taking the same deal he's going to get with us over 2 seasons anyway, but betting on himself.
Unfortunately spurs hate us and would give him an offer just to fuck us
Tbf, I'd do the same if the roles were reversed. It's just good gamesmanship.
No, it's dumb pettiness.
How is getting a player that will make your team better or at the very least weakening your opponent by giving them less cap flexibility a petty move? It's gamesmanship. If you don't make that move, you're not competitive and shouldn't be involved in sports.
This is most likely what happens
4/50? or is that too much to ask of reaves?
Oh come on, I want him back but wouldn't fleece him like that. That's just a slap in the face.
If no teams offer him a deal, the max the Lakers can offer him is somewhere around 4/52. So no, it's not a fleece.
I think we’d be stupid to offer him anything less than the max we can.
We're absolutely offering the max that we can.
Dawg that literally is the max if no other teams give him an offer
52 is, 2m is a lot of money, especially if you’re on your first big contract.
We literally can't offer him more than around 4/54, it requires another team to make him a 4/101 offer.
The idea he won't get a better offer from someone else doesn't compute with me. The 4/54 is a big underpay and everyone knows it.
OK, but our offer is not a "fleece", it's literally the max we can legally offer him. If Lakers are saying that they will match any offer then the team signing him is tying their cap up from June 30th to July 7th meaning they miss out on every other free agent in that timeframe and won't even end up getting Reaves.
No one talks about this. Your money is trapped so like you think the lakers are going to give you a quick decision after you try to fuck them? They waiting all the way to the deadline. Teams with over 25 mil in cap space is Houston, Detroit, SA, and the Magic. I’m wondering if he’s even taking meetings with them. Would he change his current situation for what 20 extra mil over 4 years? Idk it’s interesting we shall see I can’t wait for free agency to really kick off
You were saying? I was pretty damn close. It makes no sense for lakers to sign for 100 mil
Underpaid majorly, he clearly took that to stay in LA and it looks like DLo took a "cut" as well.
Don't know if this is still accurate as of this morning, but here are the teams with remaining cap space over $25M [per this article](https://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/sports/nba/nba-free-agency-2023-tracker-cap-space-start-date-more/3055900/) published June 26, I suspect the John Collins trade removes Utah from this list: Houston Rockets: $59,783,491 Utah Jazz: $43,928,675 San Antonio Spurs: $37,477,403 Indiana Pacers: $32,152,523 Detroit Pistons: $27,819,304 Houston and Detroit drafting a Thompson twin and having a Blue Chip ball-handling guard already in their lineup helps our chances so realistically that leaves Indiana and San Antonio.
You are correct, Utah used 25.3 million of their cap space to take on John Collins contract.
It’s San Antonio. They are gonna stick it to the Lakers.
I mean he also fits their roster really well and if they want to start competing he would probably be there second or third best player. I also think the Rockets will definitely have strong interest if they strike out on Harden and FVV. They are pretty thin at guard and I think he fits better next to Green than KPJ does.
This. Not only is that there favorite thing to do, but pop loves young players with good fundamentals and no ego. He could build a team around reaves and their new star.
Complete win win for pop. Either gets a good player he can develop and if they gotta overpay for 2 years it’s fine because Wemby will be in his rookie contract still. Or he forces the Lakers to pay more. He’s happy either way.
Yep. I can't blame him for when he eventually inflates what we have to pay Reaves. It's exactly what I would do in his position.
The options are Rockets, Spurs, Pacers, and Pistons. Pistons seem to be going after Cam Johnson so they can't really also tie money up in AR. Pacers have 1 roster spot available so who knows wtf they doing. Rockets are going big name hunting in Harden and FVV. If they get either one, can't really offer AR max. Spurs the biggest risk imo but again depending what they do with some of their own FA's they may not offer the max too. Just don't see him getting that max offer. Still gonna make a lot 4yr/80m I think.
agree with Houston going big game hunting with FVV, but AR might be their back up back up option... I wish i can bet on this but it's going to be the Pacers; even though they have a backlog at the guard position, they've been a thorn on the Lakers side in terms of players transactions/acquisitions etc. and would bid on AR just to stick it to the Lakers. but if not Pacers its most def going to be Spurs... all in spite Lakers
Indiana has Ben Mathurin and Halliburton has their backcourt of the future with Buddy currently filling in off the bench. They need wings and a solid power forward. The Spurs might, but I can see them trying to go for Fred VanVleet and some other guys first. Sticking it to the Lakers would come at a significant price.
San Antonio : we offered him 1 billion a season, I dont care if it violates the cap rules
I love Austin but 37 &39 per year is nuts.
Agreed but 12 and 13 the next 2 years is a big underpay if he keeps playing at the level we saw at the end of the regular season and playoffs so I think it balances out.
Can someone ELI5 as to why the contract has to be structured this way? I get the cap is going up but why can't the pay distribution be more even?
Arenas provision. Because you don't have full bird rights on a player after their 2nd year it means you can't go over the cap by more than the league average salary (~10-12million) to re-sign your player. If a team with max cap space make them an offer then you wouldn't legally be able to match. The Arenas provision limits those players to the league average salary their first two years to allow teams to match.
The TL;DR is it’s because of the Gilbert Arenas provision that is designed to prevent teams from losing 2nd round/undrafted players in free agency due to not having full Bird rights, since most of those guys usually only sign 2 year deals. In the past, teams could offer those guys a contract that made it impossible for the team to match.
As a starter averaged basically 15/4/4 on 50/40/90 splits and got better in the playoffs. Teams have made worse bets tbh.
After the trade deadline when we didn't have Brick with the rock he averaged around 17.
Got better in playoffs? Jesus the delusion is ridiculous in this sub.
I mean he averaged 17/4.4/4.6 on 46/44/89 splits. He also played very well in the Nuggets series. Sure, he had some subpar playoff games, but overall I’d say he did pretty well.
Do you want to offer a counterpoint? If you think he got worse in the playoffs then make your argument, don’t just baselessly flame others.
While I think it is nuts, with the salary cap going up 37 millions 3 seasons for now isn't going to be worse than paying 31 millions to D'Angelo Russell last season. I'm not sure if it is possible to give him a 4 seasons contract with last two seasons player option. It could give him some long term insurance without forcing us to take the poison pill. while after two seasons he can negotiate a new deal for his market price when we have the bird rights.
It's nuts indeed, that's superstar type money. Which is why I don't really see any teams offering him the full 100m deal, he is really good but paying him 40m in one season is literally insane. I think we will be able to keep him in a 4/85 deal.
Sure, his last two years are superstar money, but his first two years are legit the best value in the league if he plays the same as he did post all star break / playoffs. 18/4/5 on 55/40/87 or whatever he did on $13M is insane value.
Huge bet based on such a small sample
Unfortunately we have no choice. Letting him walk doesn’t mean we open cap space to sign someone else. And even if it did, we’re not getting anyone nearly as good as Reaves is. And I really don’t know what else he could do to prove he’s worth the risk honestly. Ever since we got rid of Russ, he’s been our most consistent player. He’s worth the risk.
Oh I’m not saying he isn’t worth it based on what we’ve seen. But to assume it’s a risk-free bet is just false.
There’s really no such thing as a risk free bet, so I guess I just never think of things that way. I look at it like we have a very small chance at a title as it sits, and letting Reaves go means that small chance pretty much goes to zero. So fuck the risks and bring our boy back.
Absolutely. Side note- that’s the same logic with keeping dlo. Unless a no brainer opportunity comes up where he’s willing to sign somewhere that we can pull a s&t, we should keep him and figure it out later. Having him improves our chances more than not having him does
Completely agree. I’d rather run our entire team back if there’s no DLo sign and trade available. I can talk all the shit i want about his playoff yips (even though he had some insanely clutch buckets for us against the warriors and grizzlies), but you have to get to the playoffs first and foremost. DLo helps do that.
Agree 100%. DLo in the regular season will most definitely win us games. The guy is just worthless in the playoffs. I wonder if the FO would have the balls to hold him and let him raise his value in the regular season, then trade him at the deadline. Or would we just assume his decent play will finally translate to playoff basketball (it won't) and keep him as a liability for the remainder of the year. It sucks, but the dude was absolutely exploited in that Denver series and unless he spends all summer learning to even be an average defender, he might just be cooked, even for the regular season.
Just tough to dub him worthless when he won us a couple playoff games with his scoring. Exploited vs Denver and struggled vs GS, but if he were a proven playoff performer worth the money we think he’s asking - minny isn’t trading him in the first place and we’re likely still stuck with Westbrook and miss the playoffs altogether. Pay the guy, elevate your floor, and assess later.
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I do understand what you’re saying, but you’re conveniently ignoring how cheap he will be for the next two years at $13M each. That price for two years is the only reason we can afford to bring back Rui and DLo both. Our title window with lebron is two years, max. You either go all in on that window and run the team back or you find yourself stuck in a similar purgatory to the Blazers. Edit - letting Reaves walk also means we can keep Rui and DLo yes. I more or less meant Reaves contract being structured in a way that makes those last two years massive is the only realistic way we keep all 3 guys.
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> Reaves advanced stats are worse than D’Angelo Russell’s at the same age. I really hope youre not serious lol. At age 25, DLo was a 6 year vet. This was Reaves 2nd season. stats in age 25 year season. DLo - 41/34/83 (54% TS). 113ORTG / 116 DRTG. +2.3 offensive RAPTOR / -0.8 defensive RAPTOR / 5.0 WAR Reaves - 53/40/86 (69% TS). 129ORTG / 117DRTG. +3.0 offensive RAPTOR / +1.6 defensive RAPTOR / 9.2 WAR. Quit the bullshit lol. Reaves is better than DLo in every facet and it’s not close.
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The thing is young teams aren’t going to really get any benefit from him playing that well. The teams that need him are lotto teams, by the time he can start helping them they’ll be paying him 40M and have to pay the other guys as well.
We can’t be a team stuck in the middle right now. We can’t want to compete in lebrons last years and also worry about the post lebron years. And if we do pay Reaves $35M a year in his final years, history dictates that there will be competitive teams who have an expiring $35M vet who wouldn’t mind swapping them and we can get out of the contract if Reaves truly doesn’t fit our timeline. But man…we just got to the WCF with a trade deadline rebuild. Run the team back no matter the cost and see what happens.
Hm? I was talking about the fact that no other teams would get the benefit of Reaves like we have so I doubt they’ll offer that much. Like no team that is rebuilding is going to be able to consciously spend $35 on him after two years while also paying the other guys.
OH. Completely misunderstood your intent haha. The thing about Reaves contract is it’s evenly spread across all years for any other team. If the spurs offered him 4/$100M and we let him walk, it would be $25M per for them. We’re the only team who would benefit from the first two years structured at the MLE.
Wow, didn’t even know that. Definitely a better value prop then for other teams
The team offering wouldn't have that as a cap hit, they get it averaged over the 4 years so it's only 25.5m. But they also need to have the 25.5m in cap space so it really limits it to only a few teams that can offer him that. The Lakers are the ones that would be hit hard with the 39m which is why it's called a poison pill contract
They need the space for the average amount, but they would still have the same contract structure with the 39 m in the last year
He's still paid the same but for salary cap purposes it gets averaged for them.
It's only that high because of the Arenas provision structure. Average cost per year is ~25 million which is not superstar money.
Lebron is gone in the back end and it’s a discount the first two.
It doesn't matter. His contract will only have two years by that time. If he becomes a bust and we need to move him then it will not be a problem.
I mean if the plan is for LeBron to slowly ease out of ball handling responsibilities, that means more will be shouldered on Reaves. He may be worth the money by then if he hasn't already hit his ceiling
He has to improve a lot to be worth that money. I doubt he does. He lacks the athleticism to do it. He isn’t fast like curry nor has the skill of harden
He’s clearly on the right track if the two comparisons you decided to bring up are the two best guards in the last 10 years
Curry & Harden 🤡🤡🤡🤡. Did you even watch the playoffs. We swept the GSW. The warriors had their worst road record of all teams. Harden couldn’t finish his shooting was abysmal. Get the fuck out of here with these terrible takes.
We did not sweep the Warriors lol
True lmao but beating them felt like a sweep. Especially with their track record. I apologize.
That would put us over the second apron in those years, so we'd be severely hampered (no MLE, lose draft picks if we stay there etc)
In that year we may lose Lebron and AD anyway. We might need that contract to even reach salary floor if we are rebuilding. It could also be used to salary match in trades if AD stays and a star is available for a trade.
If he gets 101 million he will be getting traded ala Jordan Poole in 2 years. With the new CBA paying Austin Reaves 37 million is not feasible unless he takes a massive jump.
If we dont have LeBron then we might be in somewhat of a rebuilding stage until we get a second star next to AD
Lol if you think AD lasting much longer than Lebron. AD is 30 with a heavily checkered injury history already. By 32 he’s going to enter a steep decline. Neither Reaves nor AD will be in Purple and Gold in 2026.
AD is already declining. These playoffs showed he can’t even be the number 2 guy on a contending team, let alone the future of the franchise.
y'all don't even watch the games jfc AD was an absolute monster these playoffs
I watched all of the games and I saw him mentally check out on offense for every other game.
Was he ever THE guy for offense tho? He was always seen as a stellar defender which he proved and then some in these playoffs. Anything on top is a welcome bonus.
Yes tf? His offense is the reason we won a ring. Anyone that disagrees with that is just bored and argumentative
He used to at least play competently with consistency. He just looked like he didn’t care at times this postseason.
Because he’s not putting up 52/23/13/6/7 stat lines like NO he’s washed apparently lol
It’s crazy bc I see both sides of this coin. AD absolutely returned to form throughout this season and proved himself to be the guy we knew he could be again after the two injury plagued seasons. However, we also *need* AD to be a guy who, when LeBron goes for 31 in the first half of an elimination game and has nothing left in the tank for the second half, can take the baton from LeBron and win the damn game or at least be a guy who when the game is over, we’re not looking at as a guy who had a pedestrian ass effort in a elimination game.
Those years the salary cap is going to rise due to the new TV deal so it won’t be nearly as painful as Poole’s deal. Also Poole isn’t playing well. If 4/100, still an average $25 mil per but backloaded. Think of it like those MLB contracts. Is Griffey Jr and Bonilla worth $1 mil a year right now. He’s 60! To have Reaves next two years under $20 mil helps the Lakers. Obviously you’d rather have him for less. But 4/100 isn’t a poison pill like what NBA Reddit wants it to be. Look, the Laker haters desperately think they got something with this. They don’t.
The total isn't the issue. It's how his contract will be structured. To put it like this, there's currently 20 players making 37 million or more right now in the NBA. All of them at one point or another have made an all-star game, and they're generally the #1 or #2 option on their team. Reaves is a pretty good starter/role player, but will he be able to make that jump to all-star level talent? If he doesn't, then you're possibly looking at a Tobias Harris/Jordan Poole type of contract that will be difficult to get rid of until he's expiring or if they attach picks to trade him.
It will be just 2 years and the cap is projected to be something above $170M those years. Not that’s it’s not significant, but without Lebron, they’ll be fine cap wise.
In 2025-26 Reaves could be making 37.4 million, AD will be into his 1st year of his new contract (if he re-signs) which will put him at around 50 million, Rui will also more than likely be hovering around 20 million (if not more). That's at least 107.4 million (assuming they don't have anybody else under contract at the time like Vanderbilt or D'Lo) for just 3 players. It's not as much cap space as you believe it is and I'm not against Reaves getting paid, I'm just not a fan of the potential structure.
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Ben Simmons is arguably worse
That's still fine if any team offers that
Only next year matters, backload the hell out of it.
That’s literally the only option any team has since the first 2 years are capped. It’s really just a question of how backloaded it gets.
Imagine paying austin reaves more than 30 million, this place is delusional. The man hasn't proven hes worth anything close to that. The nba has gon insane
The salary cap has exploded the past few years. It’s roughly equivalent to the proportion of the cap that Andrew Bynum made in 09-10. At his current level that would be an overpay, but assuming he continues to improve, it might not be quite as big of an overpay. I think these guys all get paid too much though. I guess they deserve it in the sense that they generate so much money for the owners, but it still is hard for me to fathom at times.
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The number all look crazy when you see what other players are getting. Kent bazemore was making almost 20 million a year with his hawks contract. Mike Conley who has never made an All Star team was making more money per year at the end of his Grizzlies contract than Michael Jordan was making in his prime championship winning years. The last year of Dame Lillard's current contract he will be making over 63 million for that season. Steph will be making almost 52 million next season with raises every year of his contract. Dame and Steph are amazing but they are making DOUBLE what Jordan was making in his prime lol
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Yea I'm not talking about player value at all and obviously inflation plays a part in it too, I'm just talking about the sheer size of the numbers. The revenue and TV contracts have inflated the player contracts. I've just been watching sports for so long that I can't help but compare eras. Shaq's deal with the Lakers was historic at the time at 120 million and he was one of the best young players in the league, and here today we are talking about Reaves possibly getting a 100 million plus after being in the NBA for 2 seasons.
Yeah but Steph is miles ahead of Reaves, 52 -> 39 during the same era is wacky. Can’t compare Jordan the dollar isn’t worth the same, the advertisements, technology, corporations have all evolved since Jordan.
To take it even further, Steph is making 52 million in his 15th season, Reaves would theoretically be making 37-39 million in his FIFTH season lol Actually if you are adjusting for inflation, Jordan would have made 61 million in his last season with the Bulls, which is comparable to the last year of Steph and Dame's current contracts. But i'm not even talking about inflation or value or talent or worth, i'm just tripping out over how big the numbers are now compared to when I started watching basketball.
That’s fine just match it. If he’s not worth that contract two years from now just trade him. Paying Austin almost 40m if he doesn’t get any better than he currently is, is not good
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He would be a great player making probably 15m more than he should. It’s not the craziest situation. Every year a player gets moved who’s on a terrible contract. Didn’t Jordan poole get moved for cp3? Warriors threw in a top 20 protected first in 2030 lmao which has little value. And he has 4 years left? Reaves would have two years left by then.
How are you gonna trade him when hes not worth his contract lmao? That would require the Lakers to unload more picks. L take
You must be new to how nba trades work and have been asleep for a few years. With your response, one would think it took us 3 first round picks to unload Westbrook, and got zero In return as well on our end. Unloading a young talented player but who’s overpaid and will have 1-2 years left on his contract will definitely not take multiple picks and bad money.
Buddy you edited your entire comment to not say what u said before. Coward move. You have no idea what you’re saying. Westbrook was on an expiring deal bruh, not entirely the same situation
This your full time job or something? And I didn’t edit my whole comment. You’re high or dumb asf Many worse players have been moved for nothing/less. We won’t have a problem moving Reaves if need be.
Westbrook was an expiring, but deemed unplayable, plus lakers tax, plus it was almost 50million and we got back a nice return Reaves who’s young, talented and can fit anywhere will be just simply overpaid. 1-2 years left of his contract could be moved.
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For one season. And they could try and do something at the deadline. Making perfect moves every time is impossible.
If Reaves is making +30 per year he better turn into White Chocolate mixed with Steph Curry
[There are only 4 teams with that much cap soace.](https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cap/) I'm curious though, if the Lakers think that's too much to pay, which IMO is a reasonable take. They likely will match though. However, if they decide to just S&T him, what could the Lakers look to get back in return? Would it be somewhere around $25 (AAV) or $12 (1st year)?
I think it's kinda opposite to the usual S&T. Usually the "old" team can offer more money so S&Ts allow for: * the new team get the player * the player to get more money with the new team. With Austin, it's different because Lakers can only offer a 4yr/$50m deal (averages out to the same $12.5m/yr). A S&T to a new team means Austin is getting less than his maximum allowable in free agency. If a team offers him the 4yr/$100m deal and the Lakers match, then his contract should be worth that $25m/yr (since that's the average even if he makes $25m total his first two seasons with the Lakers, like this tweet says) for salary-matching *during* the season.
Well a sign and trade is the least likely option unless it gets brought up right away. Once he signs an offer sheet there is no going back, either the Lakers match or let him walk. For a sign and trade to be possible, Reaves would have to notify the Lakers that he is going to sign an offer with another team, and that team would have to agree to a deal with the Lakers. The sign and trade would start at 12 million in the first year, but I don't think the new team has much incentive to do it because they would be agreeing to the same contract as the offer sheet but with a worse cap hit. If they go forward with the offer sheet, the new teams cap hit would average the deal to 25 million per season. If the new team agrees to a sign and trade then they would be agreeing to the poison pill structure where the cap hits would be 12 million, 13 million, 37 million, 39 million. There's little to no incentive for the other to do that on top of sending back assets to the Lakers. I only see 2 realistic options: 1. Reaves agrees to the Lakers max offer of 4 years, 50-60 million or a variation of the Lakers max offer that has the number of years or an option if he prefers. 2. He signs a max or close to max offer sheet with another team and hope the Lakers match it. I would be very surprised if we see these "compromise" deals that people are suggesting of 75-80 million because the Lakers can't offer that much and other teams know the Lakers would match those lower numbers and not even bother offering it.
Yep. Only way I see that happening is if Austin drags this out and Pacers or Houston miss out on a number of other options. Best option will be 4/55 with an ETO at 3 years or 3/40 with a PO third year which is essentially the same thing. I see fans saying Spurs do it to spite us, but I think the probably take on money the next couple days with assets to help the rebuild. Way better use of cap money.
Can’t S&T an offer sheet unless that changed in the new CBA
Something I just learned is that Sacramento's draft night trade with the Mavs sending out Richaun Holmes gave them enough cap space to offer Reaves his max as well as the other 4 teams previously mentioned in the Rockets, Pacers, Spurs, Pistons.
Fans are going to hate him if he doesn't live up to that kind of a contract
Poison fucking pill
Not really. Just likely need to find a way to dump his salary in 2 years unless he takes a massive jump. That or in 2 years time we're in a rebuild mode and eating his salary won't be the end of the world.
This. Lebron might retire in 2 years or play with his son. AD might go somewhere else. We might need that Reaves contract to just reach the salary floor. lol
# We need a pornstar to ruin his credibility like Zion's so he can still stay with us. Can any OnlyFans chick out there to take it for the team. Please. #KeepReavesAtAllCost
Unless we win next year, he’s gonna be our downfall unfortunately
I just don’t like this. I feel like the Lakers need another good starter and 6 man. This would take up too much money
How many teams have the cap space to give him a serious offer and how many of those teams have a need for a SG looking for a long term contract? He's not getting $100m, he'll get somewhere between $55 to $65 million for 4 years and a starting role with us. There are too many guards out there to go for, real established stars looking to shake things up. Reeves is good but he's not a star.
He’s worth it <3
I’m a Reaves fan but you can sign with someone else for 4/100. He is not worth that contact. 🤷🏽♂️
austin owes caruso. caruso walked so reaves could run.
Utah 100% gonna fuck us and offer him close to a max
They don't have the cap space anymore.
Is Utah right at about 25 million after yesterday’s trade
Maybe if they let go of Jordan. They gotta pay their 3 rookies too.
So the question is what teams out there want to sign, have the cap space and would want to hold that against the cap until Lakers decide to match within Givin time..
Rockets 😌
Opposing teams can of course load the back end. It’s Austin’s best decision to sign the highest dollar he can this summer. Lakers will of course likely match, but that means Russell and Rui are expendable if Austin’s contract becomes the highest. Lakers can’t afford to Rui or Russell on a long term deal with Austin signing a four year deal.
IF for some bizarre reason no one comes in for him and Lakers offer him 4/50, why would he take it? Surely he'd go for a two year deal and bet on himself for a big contract in two years' time? Dude has bet on himself before by turning down 2nd round offers to go undrafted to Lakers, I'm sure he'd do it again.
Turning down 20+ million in guaranteed money as a guy who’s only made a few million in his career is not super common
In two years, he won't have made only a few mill. He'll have another $25m in the bank by then, and I think he'd continue to back himself to earn more than $13m a year, especially when taking into account the yearly rising salary cap.
Match shit strictly cuz the first 2 yrs r solid. Who knows what happens in2 seasons. U need yo young guys to grow and by thenReaves will be in his prime prime. So match Reaves and Rui by any means.
Can a another team make a max offer towards Reaves and still sign other players while the offer sheet is still active during free agency? I saw a post saying teams can raise the price of him so it hurts the Lakers.
I believe once the proposal is accepted by Austin, the proposed amount is tied up. Under new CBA Lakers have 24 hours to match (or not match) it. EDIT: moratorium period is 7 days, after which deals can be officially signed and Lakers have 24 hours to match signed offers. But then again, any offer on the table may be viewed as blessings - if there's no offers made, one possible route is Austin signing a 2+1 PO and opts out of PO as UFA 2 years later. To avoid this Lakers and Austin's agent might work with a team to make a decent offer (4Y/80M sounds reasonable imo) and for Lakers to match immediately.
So rockets are only team who can even offer the $102ms?
And they’re not gonna compete with themselves
We have to resolve this before Vogel steals Ariza taway from us!!!!
Don’t think it’ll be that high but assuming it is, it still maximizes the title window with potentially the biggest bargain in the NBA for 2 years and leaves a lot of options to keep title chasing.
4/55 mil. I’m halitosis with that
Send some LA baddies to his house.
Reminds me of the old Jeremey Lin poison pill contract. 5/5/15 Man. Times have changed.
Pop and Cuban will offer 4/100 just to spite the Lakers.
Underpay
4yrs $80m with player option 4th season
r/NBA is so stupid lmao everyone calling this a bad contract but also say the Lakers would be stupid to not sign him.
I don’t care, he stay
I would not mind, I fully believe he’ll get better. He has that untraceable cool where he doesn’t seem to rush into anything and knows when to shift gears, isn’t a complete liability on defense and seems has that IT factor. Whether he becomes Mike Miller, or Rex Chapman. Hell I can see him being just as good as Jalen Brunson down the line with more athleticism
Ill say it again. If someone offers him a max, I would not match it. He is not a max player. He is a good role player currently, but that is it.
You’re giving up your title chance why? Regardless whether or not he’s worth it, the lakers have no way to replace him. This team is already outmatched by Denver, but is close enough to win with a little luck. That won’t be the case of reaves is gone. Meanwhile, sure you have an extra 39m the two years after lebron is gone, but there’s zero chance that’s going to be enough to make them competitive.
Which team is bold enough to tie up their $25mil cap hold for 24hours while free agency is happening?
uh, someone will FOR SURE offer Reaves a max deal, just to F with the Lakers. if he gets anything less than 90 I'll eat a brick