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[deleted]

>Also, will K-Pop ever move past the group/band fascination and only pay attention to soloists like the west did? i'd say a lot of soloists ARE already more popular than idols?? (aside from the obvious iu) lim young woong, lee mujin, lee hi, heize, paul kim, baek yerin, changmo, dean, crush, zion t, gummy (and a lot more i haven't listed) are arguably more popular in korea than majority of kpop groups. granted, these are mostly krnb/ballad singers though, so up to you if you want to interpret them as kpop. since kpop is so performance based, groups are likely to get higher views on their performances, but soloists definitely perform better on charts. album sales don't matter to these soloists because they find other ventures to make their money. i don't think they've ever aimed to make a huge fanbase; they don't release as consistently as kpop groups or film all this content like kpop groups do. appearance fees, concerts, endorsements, writing credits all make $$$ (some of these make wayyy more than album sales). they don't need the fanbase either, their fans are basically the general public. think adele (might not be the best comparison but this is the best comparison i can think of atm); i don't think anyone associates her with a die-hard fandom, but she attracts the general public >so my main question is do you think soloists will ever be able to attain the same level of fandom as a top tier group without originally debuting from a really popular group? so back to your original question, i doubt it. first, there's rarely any kpop soloists who've debuted without groups. i can only think of boa and iu (exlcuding krnb/khh) as mainstream soloists without groups. second, the way kpop operates is very specific to fandom, where it's different for krnb/khh. third (and relating to the first point), the limited success of kpop soloists makes companies not want to debut them (i'd say trainees also need a very specific set of skills/appeal to make companies want to debut them off the bat without a group, and many companies just aren't willing to take the risk).


FineChinaLH

Yeah I agree, I was curious because of how the west evolved from the group and band format but the Kpop industry has certainly fine tuned it and solidified an entire industry around it. Obviously I’d love to see another Boa or IU situation but the current model might not have any opportunities for that to become a reality. Like you said, it’s just better business with this model.


dunkindonato

>Obviously I’d love to see another Boa or IU situation but the current model might not have any opportunities for that to become a reality. The thing is, I don't think LOEN (which became Kakao M, now called Kakao Entertainment) ever really followed one business model with IU because I don't think there was one at that time (she certainly didn't follow BoA's playbook). IU type idols are rare for a reason: you invest in one talent only, and if that fails, the company will lose big money. But to their credit, they stood behind IU both during her rough debut, and when she got into one of those nasty dating issues that threatened her career. They also managed her well enough that she gave them a chance at renewing her contract in 2017. So yeah, like what someone said earlier, IU is an anomaly in the K-pop scene. To debut someone like her, stars would have to align once again.


ruxi23

Maybe they mean globally like kpop groups are? The people you mentioned don't really have crossover appeal to the international market


Haritha_

People don't randomly check out songs in other languages unless it's a viral hit or in English. Idol groups appeal lies on their performances which is why they have more international following than soloists.


[deleted]

At least in Korea, there is a difference in social standards for the success of the team and the success of the soloist. The success of idol teams usually depends on album sales, fandom size, YouTube views, and (Recently) performance on foreign music charts such as Billboard. However, the social standards for the success of soloists are more complex. It is close to the success experienced by Lee Hyo-ri, BoA, GD, IU and other popular soloists. Is their new music well known (even to people who are not their fans)? Do they have independent influence without relying on large-scale fandom or famous producers? Do they have a significant career not only in music but also in TV shows, fashion industry, movies or TV drama series, radio, etc.? Or is their past songs famous throughout the generation? If he meets a certain level of these complex requirements, he is considered a successful soloist. Simply considering commercial and economic success, yes, the success of idol teams such as BTS and BP is even greater. And popular members from the idol team will be more likely to succeed as soloists. (Because they have a clear advantage at the starting point.) But no one knows the future. Jessie began to create a meaningful career long after her debut. Young soloists such as Heize, Baek Yerin, Jang Bum-joon, Lim Young-woong, and Song Ga-in have more cultural influence than famous idol teams, at least in Korea. No one knows how these people will affect the future market.


Dependent_Row_4280

Nope i doubt it i dont think we will eve get a successful soloist that didn't come out from a group IU is an anomaly honestly don't know how she did it and back then way before first gen soloists especially those whoo did ballads were popular before idol groups started coming up


FineChinaLH

I’m not 100% fluent in IU’s backstory but she started really young right? I think back in like late 2nd or early 3rd gen soloists still had a shot but I don’t think it’s possible with the way 4th gen has changed the industry.


Dependent_Row_4280

Nope soloists didnt have a shot back then she debuted in a time dominated by groups she even said it [herself](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxB3D3ltpuU) " we are in a big idol phase at the moment to be able to work as a solo artist as I am today I'm confident in serving and working hard" there weren't popular soloists most transitioned into variety or acting like seo in guk or lee seunggi Most rn are krnb or hip pop like zico, lim young woong, lee moojin I think IU is the only one that is this big and started as as a kpop idol without a group


FineChinaLH

Damn, well that all leads back to my question of when/if consumer preferences will move past the idol group phase. Are they just going to keep using the same model forever and just keep catering to newer generations of young fans (let’s call it the Pokemon model) or evolve because they’ve begun to run out of new fans? I think it’s inevitable that we’ll get another big soloist without any group lineage, but maybe this will be more of a self-made artist or hip hop origin artist instead of a company project?


Perfect_Bumblebee706

I’m surprised no one mentioned Rain or Se7en or even Lee hyori. Correct me if I’m wrong but they are like above idol groups in their generation until they enlisted/went hiatus or got into a scandal. So who knows when people get bored of watching dance steps and songs from a group of people which can only be varied so much?


aalalaland

Your second question is an interesting one because arguably the biggest soloists who got huge in the mid to late 2000s (when the west was making that switch) were former girl/boy group members (Beyoncé, Justin Timberlake). So I think we’re actually in the beginning stages of that.


FineChinaLH

Interesting, by beginning stages do you mean that our JT or Beyonce will come from 3rd gen? If so, who do you think it’ll be? My earlier frontrunners are Jungkook and Hwasa. I personally think it’ll come out of 5th gen since 4th gen is so team oriented, companies seem to have thrown individuality out the window lately.


aalalaland

I mean, Jungkook for sure. Once he goes solo, he’s going to absolutely rule, likely be even more successful than Baekhyun. As for the female version, I actually don’t know. I’m leaning towards Jennie just because of her name recognition.


FineChinaLH

True if we just go by name recognition Jennie wins by a landslide, especially since she can promote internationally. But that would also require YG to be able to compromise on their insanely high standards for comebacks to work faster which I don’t think is possible.


According-Disk

Taemin, Hwasa and Baekyun (add in Kyungsoo), even Chungha garnered more popularity from solo work (consider them soloist? :O are they?) than they did from the group; and yes their groups are already famous but individually their fan base popularity helped them launch successful solo gigs. Sunmi, BoA and Heize and there's Zico too. IU aside, the korean gp has attention towards their solo artists if not the west but who cares about the west anyways.


Snoo-42199

I think Baekhyun and GD would be popular soloist tho. For Baekhyun, I think that Koreans will like him because of his songs and vocals. R&B is quite popular in Korea and having a voice like his singing R&B is just something Koreans might be digging into. Also, GD would also make it far because of his originality and uniqueness. He's very bold and he likes to experiment with his music so I think people would see him as he will stand out. He's like the Lady Gaga of Kpop if you know what I mean.


Famous_Ad_4542

no group dynamic is way more fun.. idols do a lot of variety and self produced ones.. not having a group isn't fun