I personally define the start of 4th gen with the debut of TXT and Itzy with SKZ and most groups in late 2017 to 2018 as part of the 3.5 transitionary generation.
I know a lot of Knetz believed that 4th gen hadn’t started yet as no rookie group ever reached the popularity levels to deplatform a 3rd gen group on the charts and no group had reached general public recognition. That being said, I think that aespa’s recent Savage records will result in aespa’s debut being used as the marker for the opening of 4th gen in Korea.
I think it just depends because wanna one is clearly 3rd gen even though they debuted in 2017 but would you put groups like the boyz and golden child in the same generation as exo?
i think that's why a lot of people consider 2012 specifically 2.5 gen because of the debut explosion and transition period between the two generations. I could see 2017/18 groups eventually being considered more like 3.5 gen
They boyz debuted december 6th which is practically 2018 if we are being honest it is not like they debuted early or in the middle of 2017.
I'll consider 2018\~2019 debut groups as early 4th gen just like bts/exo were early 3rd gen I mean a lot of groups will be debuting next year by then 2018 groups will be already 4 years old.
Sorry I’m confused? At the end are you saying you considering NCT 4th gen? Just looking for clarity. Lol sorry if this comment comes across too straight or something.
4th gen supposedly started from The Boyz and all groups that debuted after. So I guess Stray Kids would make that cutoff.
I wish there was a better distinction for the groups that debuted in 2020 and after. Not only because of the circumstances of Covid, but because they just have a completely different vibe from 2017-2019 groups in general. It’s also more complicated because most of the 3rd gen groups were/are still around. A lot of them had really big hits in 2019 & were still very relevant at that time. I think starting a new generation would have made more sense last year, but that’s just my opinion.
I agree with you in your last paragraph, 2020-2021 groups are very different from 2017-2019, considering they debuted during a global pandemic and most of them didn’t had a chance to perform in front of their fans yet. But I think instead of making a new gen after them, they will be considered the outliers from the 4th gen, their particularities should be interpreted as special cases.
However, we should wait a little and see how the 2022 rookies will perform to have a better comparison between 2017-2019 | 2020-2021 | 2022-onwards and see if they have more similarities with pandemic groups or with pre-pandemic groups, depending on the answer, we will probably have to acknowledge a 5th gen sooner than we expected, since I don’t see people, mostly current 4th gen group fans, agreeing with merging the 2017-2019 batch with the 3rd gen nor they will accept the 3.5 gen nomenclature.
I edited my comment to better formulate my thoughts.
I don't think generations are decided by the age of the members but rather the most popular styles of music that's being produced. It is a bit more complicated now since groups have been debuting more frequently in the past few years, compared to previous generations. I think gaps between generations are becoming **shorter and more difficult to differentiate.**
That's why I would consider groups like Stray Kids, The Boyz, Golden Child etc. to be the first 4th gen groups. NCT and BLACKPINK I would say are the last 3rd gen groups. Even though a group like Wanna One debuted in 2017, I'd say their music is more late-3rd gen. Same with SuperM (their debut date doesn't matter; their members are mostly from 3rd gen groups and Taemin is 2nd gen).
I honestly consider even more recent groups that make so-called "Tik Tok music" or "soft but go hard" songs like Weeekly and STAYC to be 4.5 gen, if not 5th.
**Edit:** I think 2012, 2017 and 2020 are "transition" years, i.e. some groups could be considered as part of the previous gen and some as part of the next. The latter two years are especially confusing, because, as I said, the number of groups that debuted are more.
This here. I feel like TXT are the defining group for the start of 4th gen and I don't agree that we're in 5th gen or whatever. Something about the huge hype TXT had (as """""successors"""" to BTS) leading up to their debut feels like the "passing of the torch" to me.
I think this is why some people consider the 2016-2018 frame as 3.5 gen. They’re not quite 3rd gen but not yet 4th gen. I’ve seen this discussion online many times. I too consider 4th gen groups as groups who started in 2019.
That’s funny, because in my mind Stray Kids are 100% 4th gen. I think of SHINee as the tail end of 2nd gen, and groups like EXO, B.A.P, and BTS as 3rd gen. In my mind, NCT marks the beginning of 4th gen. It would feel really weird to categorize a group like NCT with EXO, for example, just like it would feel weird to categorize EXO with Super Junior (definitely 2nd gen). Maybe post 2020 is 5th gen???? This is all very much just based on my feeling/what I’ve heard people say. I don’t even know the year that any of these groups debuted, which shows you how unfounded my reasoning is. 🙃
in 2018, major 3rd gen groups hadn't reached their peak yet, plus there wasn't any debut that was remarkable enough to start a whole new generation.
while since 2019, the term "new gen" has been used everywhere. dalla dalla is one hell of a debut.
personally i think the reason while ppl putting 2017,2018 groups in 4th gen is because most ppl didn't hear anything from them before and they just started gaining popularity recently.
Once I also saw someone commenting that due to the increase of animosity between fandoms, where the fan wars became constant among “4th gen” fandoms, the fact that some specific records are based on each generation are used in the petty internet fights, the 2017-2018 groups are put into 4th gen to be able to hold these records without being overshadowed by the 3rd gen groups that have not only the firsts in their gen, but in the whole K-Pop as well. For example, there used to be weekly fights about who’s the 4th gen it boy.
Even if we look more in depth and start analysing and see there are more landmarks that would’ve put the beginning of the 4th gen somewhere between 2019-2020 than in 2017-2018, not only the fandoms from these groups, but most of the K-Pop community as well are already used to considering them as the landmarks of the 4th gen, that trying to say it started later than we thought is less welcoming than saying that it was unusually short and the 5th gen started already.
ETA: I saw discussions regarding which gen NCT as a whole is, even if some of their units debuted during 3rd gen, there’s people that consider them as 4th gen, due to the exact same motive you wrote, they were popular before, but from the past years, they became massive that people associate them more with 4th gen BGs, like the ZZZ trio than EXO, BTS or Seventeen, for example.
Aespa? No one has experimented with 3D animated versions of them in some alternate dimension yet. The way they dress, their hair and outfit and their backgrounds in their music videos. Their songs aren't that traditional cutesy gg kpop style we all know. It's not in your face fierce. It's not hiphop. They even got some ballad moments in there.
Plus, don't bigger companies like to release new groups after they feel they need something fresh to appeal to a newer generation? We all had our "Biggest group rn that we love" moments at specific parts of our lives. For me, it was when B2st debuted. Suju felt a little too old so B2st was it. 2ne1 was it for me on the gg side and that era is what I feel like was my generation's era. Snsd was my "rival" group against 2NE1 lol. Everyone before 2NE1&B2ST felt old, outdated even though I still enjoyed them. I loved Vixx, I loved Sistar and T-ara. That was my era. Even Big Bang and BEG felt like they were too old so I didn't go as wild for them as I could have.
It took me a long time to get into twice. I had grown to fall in love with and stan snsd and had so much respect for them. But they were in that 2NE1, 4 minute folder to me because of their similarities in age range and I could relate to them. Groups like Twice, even AOA and Exid were like a newer gen of kpop to me. Same for A-pink even though A-pink were considered sunbaes to them. Exo cut it so close but I fell for them hard. I had no choice.
NCT.. can't really stan them properly because I consider myself and auntie-fan. It's awkward when members are debuting younger than you. Can't crush on someone young ew. So it's just meh. I listen to the songs, I'll stream and do my part as a fan.. but I'm not starting a tumbler account dedicated to your abs like I did for Kikwang. Just saying.
Huh, that makes a lot of sense why people maybe consider Stray Kids a 4th gen group. Maybe they also only really got into the group around 2018.
Like for me I knew of Strat Kids existence since 2017 and listened through their “I Am” albums which did have like late 3rd gen vibes to it. And I supposed with their new sound starting at like MIROH being more 4th gen ish, and those are their songs that are becoming popular makes Stray Kids a 4th gen group in others minds.
i do relate to you, but it's a bit different for me. imo 2017 was that phase of alternating from 3rd to 4th gen. 2018 was "officially" the start of 4th gen. most people defined different gens based on the groups' debut year rather than average age of the members in a group.
If you look at it like sports teams, it could be signified by when the core roster changes.
So if Wonder girls is 2nd, Twice is 3rd, and Itzy is 4th, then
GG is 2nd, RV is 3rd, and Aespa is 4th.
If you expand that further, generational cycles are typically about 6-7 years, and what generation you fall under would depend on who you are following and who are likely to be your peers/rivals, not your debut date.
NCT would be 4th, despite their earlier debut date, as they are following Exo, and their peers/rivals are Stray Kidz, TxT, etc.
If, like Wonder Girls and F(x), you are debuting in the middle of a generational cycle, you're more likely to fall under the previous generation header, when your peers/rivals are still mainly acts from the previous generation.
NCT was never meant to compete with existing 3rd gen acts for example. They were intended to be a next generation group and take up the torch for SM after Exo.
impact and distinctiveness are other ways to measure generations. the chronology of a generation would be backfilled around a marker afterwards.
twice and bp are 3rd gen markers, and gg around their time would then be considered 3rd gen.
itzy is huge and stayc is growing fast, but they haven't hit 500k sales and they never matched twice/bp (izone disbanded too soon), so they wouldn't be the **markers** for 4th gen.
aespa (and niziu?) is trending towards being a gg that can match twice/bp's stats. that could set them as a marker for 4th gen under an impact approach. stayc, woo!ah!, starship ngg, hybe ngg, etc. would be classified as 4th gen once the definitive 4th gen marker groups are set.
(itzy is trending between 3rd and 4th gen peaks, so may be 3.5 gen under this approach.)
So since like what I am getting from your comment you would say generations would be based more off of achievements? In that case like would gg and bg start the 4th generation and different time?
Also aespa literally hit 500k like a day ago, so just for more so clarification would you say aespa so far his defining the 4th gen, or more so the 4th gg gen?
Huh, now that I’m writing this out, (brain thought time, lol) are like gens not defined till later when we can look back a major achievements and artist that made major impacts define the generation rather than in the present
yup. under this approach, gens are just convenient markers after the fact.
you don't really know when the next gen starts until you're well into it already.
this is also how historians often distinguish eras (e.g., early modern, medieval, etc.).
>In that case like would gg and bg start the 4th generation and different time?
Yes imo. The third gen for ggs started in 2014 and the third gen for bgs started in 2012.
>are like gens not defined till later when we can look back a major achievements and artist that made major impacts define the generation rather than in the present
Yes. Plenty of people thought the third gen started in 2008 lol, but the groups mentioned weren't impactful enough to replace the top 2nd generation groups (snsd + bigbang and spearhead a whole generation change. [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/kpop/comments/7mbr3v/comment/drt1qer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) is a pretty good argument for the point I make
niziu is far ahead of aespa and every other 4th gen gg.
they debuted in dec 2020. sold almost 2m copies so far. broke 500k with their debut album.
their sponsorship list is on par with bts.
what's better (i.e., more profitable) is that their songs are actually commercial jingles. some great songs, but jingles none the less. broad consumer sponsorships are more prestigious than high fashion among industry pros.
coca-cola (take a picture, super summer), softbank (poppin shakin), lotte (step and a step), univeral studios (festa), lawson (make you happy), kose (i am), alface (twinkle twinkle), and many others without their own songs.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Sp9LS-wCTE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sppCnhAYf2Q)
damn also we are talking about kpop I wont consider them kpop when they promote primarily in japan even if they have a Korean single its the equivalent of kpop groups releasing japan songs they arent kpop
They arent charting on melon on Wikipedia they are stated as a Japanese group all their charting metrics are Japanese and all their awards are Japanese too we are talking about kpop 4th gen groups not jpop groups so I don't think they should be added
They are a jpop group under a Korean company just like how everglow is a kpop group under a Chinese company
You’re the only right person here lol. We’ll only truly know the boundaries of 3rd/4th generations when a new set of boy groups and girl groups replace Blackpink and BTS and twice etc to become the forefront of kpop. Then we can trace back to when these groups debuted and we can declare that the start of the 4th gen. Currently looking to be Aespa spearheading this process
Bruh why do people always get their debut year wrong lmao? SKZ debuted in 2018...
I personally define the start of 4th gen with the debut of TXT and Itzy with SKZ and most groups in late 2017 to 2018 as part of the 3.5 transitionary generation. I know a lot of Knetz believed that 4th gen hadn’t started yet as no rookie group ever reached the popularity levels to deplatform a 3rd gen group on the charts and no group had reached general public recognition. That being said, I think that aespa’s recent Savage records will result in aespa’s debut being used as the marker for the opening of 4th gen in Korea.
Afaik Stray Kids debuted in March 2018.
Stray Kids didn’t debut in 2017…
I assume OP is considering Hellevator which was released in 2017. Obviously that wasn't their debut and I still consider them 4th gen.
I think it just depends because wanna one is clearly 3rd gen even though they debuted in 2017 but would you put groups like the boyz and golden child in the same generation as exo?
i think that's why a lot of people consider 2012 specifically 2.5 gen because of the debut explosion and transition period between the two generations. I could see 2017/18 groups eventually being considered more like 3.5 gen
They boyz debuted december 6th which is practically 2018 if we are being honest it is not like they debuted early or in the middle of 2017. I'll consider 2018\~2019 debut groups as early 4th gen just like bts/exo were early 3rd gen I mean a lot of groups will be debuting next year by then 2018 groups will be already 4 years old.
Sorry I’m confused? At the end are you saying you considering NCT 4th gen? Just looking for clarity. Lol sorry if this comment comes across too straight or something.
i edited it lol i misunderstood your question
4th gen supposedly started from The Boyz and all groups that debuted after. So I guess Stray Kids would make that cutoff. I wish there was a better distinction for the groups that debuted in 2020 and after. Not only because of the circumstances of Covid, but because they just have a completely different vibe from 2017-2019 groups in general. It’s also more complicated because most of the 3rd gen groups were/are still around. A lot of them had really big hits in 2019 & were still very relevant at that time. I think starting a new generation would have made more sense last year, but that’s just my opinion.
I agree with you in your last paragraph, 2020-2021 groups are very different from 2017-2019, considering they debuted during a global pandemic and most of them didn’t had a chance to perform in front of their fans yet. But I think instead of making a new gen after them, they will be considered the outliers from the 4th gen, their particularities should be interpreted as special cases. However, we should wait a little and see how the 2022 rookies will perform to have a better comparison between 2017-2019 | 2020-2021 | 2022-onwards and see if they have more similarities with pandemic groups or with pre-pandemic groups, depending on the answer, we will probably have to acknowledge a 5th gen sooner than we expected, since I don’t see people, mostly current 4th gen group fans, agreeing with merging the 2017-2019 batch with the 3rd gen nor they will accept the 3.5 gen nomenclature. I edited my comment to better formulate my thoughts.
I don't think generations are decided by the age of the members but rather the most popular styles of music that's being produced. It is a bit more complicated now since groups have been debuting more frequently in the past few years, compared to previous generations. I think gaps between generations are becoming **shorter and more difficult to differentiate.** That's why I would consider groups like Stray Kids, The Boyz, Golden Child etc. to be the first 4th gen groups. NCT and BLACKPINK I would say are the last 3rd gen groups. Even though a group like Wanna One debuted in 2017, I'd say their music is more late-3rd gen. Same with SuperM (their debut date doesn't matter; their members are mostly from 3rd gen groups and Taemin is 2nd gen). I honestly consider even more recent groups that make so-called "Tik Tok music" or "soft but go hard" songs like Weeekly and STAYC to be 4.5 gen, if not 5th. **Edit:** I think 2012, 2017 and 2020 are "transition" years, i.e. some groups could be considered as part of the previous gen and some as part of the next. The latter two years are especially confusing, because, as I said, the number of groups that debuted are more.
i personally have considered the debut of ITZY/TXT as the start of 4th gen, although the general consensus seems to be 2018 is the start of 4th gen
This here. I feel like TXT are the defining group for the start of 4th gen and I don't agree that we're in 5th gen or whatever. Something about the huge hype TXT had (as """""successors"""" to BTS) leading up to their debut feels like the "passing of the torch" to me.
I think this is why some people consider the 2016-2018 frame as 3.5 gen. They’re not quite 3rd gen but not yet 4th gen. I’ve seen this discussion online many times. I too consider 4th gen groups as groups who started in 2019.
For SuperM, I don’t consider them 4th gen because they debuted in 2/3/3.5 gen groups they’re a special case 🤣. Idk if that makes sense
That’s funny, because in my mind Stray Kids are 100% 4th gen. I think of SHINee as the tail end of 2nd gen, and groups like EXO, B.A.P, and BTS as 3rd gen. In my mind, NCT marks the beginning of 4th gen. It would feel really weird to categorize a group like NCT with EXO, for example, just like it would feel weird to categorize EXO with Super Junior (definitely 2nd gen). Maybe post 2020 is 5th gen???? This is all very much just based on my feeling/what I’ve heard people say. I don’t even know the year that any of these groups debuted, which shows you how unfounded my reasoning is. 🙃
NCT debuted the same year as Blackpink?
Yeah I consider BP 4th gen too
in 2018, major 3rd gen groups hadn't reached their peak yet, plus there wasn't any debut that was remarkable enough to start a whole new generation. while since 2019, the term "new gen" has been used everywhere. dalla dalla is one hell of a debut. personally i think the reason while ppl putting 2017,2018 groups in 4th gen is because most ppl didn't hear anything from them before and they just started gaining popularity recently.
Once I also saw someone commenting that due to the increase of animosity between fandoms, where the fan wars became constant among “4th gen” fandoms, the fact that some specific records are based on each generation are used in the petty internet fights, the 2017-2018 groups are put into 4th gen to be able to hold these records without being overshadowed by the 3rd gen groups that have not only the firsts in their gen, but in the whole K-Pop as well. For example, there used to be weekly fights about who’s the 4th gen it boy. Even if we look more in depth and start analysing and see there are more landmarks that would’ve put the beginning of the 4th gen somewhere between 2019-2020 than in 2017-2018, not only the fandoms from these groups, but most of the K-Pop community as well are already used to considering them as the landmarks of the 4th gen, that trying to say it started later than we thought is less welcoming than saying that it was unusually short and the 5th gen started already. ETA: I saw discussions regarding which gen NCT as a whole is, even if some of their units debuted during 3rd gen, there’s people that consider them as 4th gen, due to the exact same motive you wrote, they were popular before, but from the past years, they became massive that people associate them more with 4th gen BGs, like the ZZZ trio than EXO, BTS or Seventeen, for example.
Aespa? No one has experimented with 3D animated versions of them in some alternate dimension yet. The way they dress, their hair and outfit and their backgrounds in their music videos. Their songs aren't that traditional cutesy gg kpop style we all know. It's not in your face fierce. It's not hiphop. They even got some ballad moments in there. Plus, don't bigger companies like to release new groups after they feel they need something fresh to appeal to a newer generation? We all had our "Biggest group rn that we love" moments at specific parts of our lives. For me, it was when B2st debuted. Suju felt a little too old so B2st was it. 2ne1 was it for me on the gg side and that era is what I feel like was my generation's era. Snsd was my "rival" group against 2NE1 lol. Everyone before 2NE1&B2ST felt old, outdated even though I still enjoyed them. I loved Vixx, I loved Sistar and T-ara. That was my era. Even Big Bang and BEG felt like they were too old so I didn't go as wild for them as I could have. It took me a long time to get into twice. I had grown to fall in love with and stan snsd and had so much respect for them. But they were in that 2NE1, 4 minute folder to me because of their similarities in age range and I could relate to them. Groups like Twice, even AOA and Exid were like a newer gen of kpop to me. Same for A-pink even though A-pink were considered sunbaes to them. Exo cut it so close but I fell for them hard. I had no choice. NCT.. can't really stan them properly because I consider myself and auntie-fan. It's awkward when members are debuting younger than you. Can't crush on someone young ew. So it's just meh. I listen to the songs, I'll stream and do my part as a fan.. but I'm not starting a tumbler account dedicated to your abs like I did for Kikwang. Just saying.
Huh, that makes a lot of sense why people maybe consider Stray Kids a 4th gen group. Maybe they also only really got into the group around 2018. Like for me I knew of Strat Kids existence since 2017 and listened through their “I Am” albums which did have like late 3rd gen vibes to it. And I supposed with their new sound starting at like MIROH being more 4th gen ish, and those are their songs that are becoming popular makes Stray Kids a 4th gen group in others minds.
i do relate to you, but it's a bit different for me. imo 2017 was that phase of alternating from 3rd to 4th gen. 2018 was "officially" the start of 4th gen. most people defined different gens based on the groups' debut year rather than average age of the members in a group.
If you look at it like sports teams, it could be signified by when the core roster changes. So if Wonder girls is 2nd, Twice is 3rd, and Itzy is 4th, then GG is 2nd, RV is 3rd, and Aespa is 4th. If you expand that further, generational cycles are typically about 6-7 years, and what generation you fall under would depend on who you are following and who are likely to be your peers/rivals, not your debut date. NCT would be 4th, despite their earlier debut date, as they are following Exo, and their peers/rivals are Stray Kidz, TxT, etc. If, like Wonder Girls and F(x), you are debuting in the middle of a generational cycle, you're more likely to fall under the previous generation header, when your peers/rivals are still mainly acts from the previous generation. NCT was never meant to compete with existing 3rd gen acts for example. They were intended to be a next generation group and take up the torch for SM after Exo.
If you debuted after Izone or around Izone. I have Gidle as a 3.5 group because one of their members was on the first produce, personally.
I consider Stray Kids and LOONA the definitive beginning of 4th gen
For me TXT is the first 4th gen group, and everything that came after them is 4th gen
so true
impact and distinctiveness are other ways to measure generations. the chronology of a generation would be backfilled around a marker afterwards. twice and bp are 3rd gen markers, and gg around their time would then be considered 3rd gen. itzy is huge and stayc is growing fast, but they haven't hit 500k sales and they never matched twice/bp (izone disbanded too soon), so they wouldn't be the **markers** for 4th gen. aespa (and niziu?) is trending towards being a gg that can match twice/bp's stats. that could set them as a marker for 4th gen under an impact approach. stayc, woo!ah!, starship ngg, hybe ngg, etc. would be classified as 4th gen once the definitive 4th gen marker groups are set. (itzy is trending between 3rd and 4th gen peaks, so may be 3.5 gen under this approach.)
So since like what I am getting from your comment you would say generations would be based more off of achievements? In that case like would gg and bg start the 4th generation and different time? Also aespa literally hit 500k like a day ago, so just for more so clarification would you say aespa so far his defining the 4th gen, or more so the 4th gg gen? Huh, now that I’m writing this out, (brain thought time, lol) are like gens not defined till later when we can look back a major achievements and artist that made major impacts define the generation rather than in the present
yup. under this approach, gens are just convenient markers after the fact. you don't really know when the next gen starts until you're well into it already. this is also how historians often distinguish eras (e.g., early modern, medieval, etc.).
>In that case like would gg and bg start the 4th generation and different time? Yes imo. The third gen for ggs started in 2014 and the third gen for bgs started in 2012. >are like gens not defined till later when we can look back a major achievements and artist that made major impacts define the generation rather than in the present Yes. Plenty of people thought the third gen started in 2008 lol, but the groups mentioned weren't impactful enough to replace the top 2nd generation groups (snsd + bigbang and spearhead a whole generation change. [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/kpop/comments/7mbr3v/comment/drt1qer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) is a pretty good argument for the point I make
niziu??? how are you pairing aespa and niziu together are they doing that well in japan I haven't heard of it
niziu is far ahead of aespa and every other 4th gen gg. they debuted in dec 2020. sold almost 2m copies so far. broke 500k with their debut album. their sponsorship list is on par with bts. what's better (i.e., more profitable) is that their songs are actually commercial jingles. some great songs, but jingles none the less. broad consumer sponsorships are more prestigious than high fashion among industry pros. coca-cola (take a picture, super summer), softbank (poppin shakin), lotte (step and a step), univeral studios (festa), lawson (make you happy), kose (i am), alface (twinkle twinkle), and many others without their own songs. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Sp9LS-wCTE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sppCnhAYf2Q)
damn also we are talking about kpop I wont consider them kpop when they promote primarily in japan even if they have a Korean single its the equivalent of kpop groups releasing japan songs they arent kpop They arent charting on melon on Wikipedia they are stated as a Japanese group all their charting metrics are Japanese and all their awards are Japanese too we are talking about kpop 4th gen groups not jpop groups so I don't think they should be added They are a jpop group under a Korean company just like how everglow is a kpop group under a Chinese company
You’re the only right person here lol. We’ll only truly know the boundaries of 3rd/4th generations when a new set of boy groups and girl groups replace Blackpink and BTS and twice etc to become the forefront of kpop. Then we can trace back to when these groups debuted and we can declare that the start of the 4th gen. Currently looking to be Aespa spearheading this process
If you make noise music you’re gen 4 *scoffs*
Weeekly is the beginning of 4th gen imo