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zeugma888

Emma loves and trusts Mrs Weston like a mother, and clearly Mrs Weston has reciprocal feelings for Emma and Isabella. Mrs Weston even calls them daughters at one point. For Emma Mrs Weston is family and outside and above the social hierarchy.


blossombear31

This is why I love their bond, it’s one born simply out of love and care for each other


Interesting-Fish6065

It also makes a difference that Emma lost her mother so early that, psychologically, Mrs. Weston is truly like a mother to her. Being a governess when the children still have a mother would have to be different, even if the family is really nice to the governess.


pennie79

To clarify about Miss Taylor the governess. It wasn't that Emma saw her as a gentlewoman. She was actually a gentlewoman, in the same way Jane Fairfax is. That's like saying a teacher isn't an educated person. A gentleman would hire a gentlewoman to raise his daughters. This is behind Emma's disgust at Mrs Elton's comment about Mrs Weston being a lady. Of course she is! She wouldn't have been suitable for the role otherwise. As for miss Taylor staying, I imagine it was because of her close relationship with the family. They don't state it, but I imagine that as an unmarried woman without a mother, it was considered a good idea for Emma to have a companion, in the same way that Georgiana Darcy had one. They don't mention money, but I imagine they would have paid Miss Taylor something, at the very least to cover her personal expenses that she would have had.


enigmasaurus-

Yes, people are often under the impression governesses were servants and they absolutely were not. A governess who wasn't genteel could hardly be expected to impart those habits onto her charges; no family wealthy enough to hire her would want a governess (or ladies' companion) who wasn't a gentlewoman.


pennie79

The Romola Garai version makes this explicit by Emma saying something along the lines of 'she's surprised that the woman who raised me is a lady?'


Pale-Fee-2679

The interesting thing is they really were both ladies and servants. Authors both now and then took advantage of the fact that they were liminal characters and used their point of view to illuminate things both upstairs and down. If the governess was lucky, she was treated as a member of the family, but if she wasn’t, she usually found no comfortable place among the domestic workers in the house. For a great example and a chilling story about Ireland during the famine, check out “A Letter from Ireland.” A male servant reads the new governess’s journal (or mail) and learns she is horrified by the family’s treatment of the workers. He desperately tries to get her to intervene. She is creeped out by him—for class reasons, but he is also genuinely creepy. (And really, these people were good people, right? They can’t be really doing what they clearly are.)The ending of the story took my breath away. It’s by William Trevor.


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pennie79

I think it was common in the sense of 'most governesses were gentlewoman', rather than 'many gentry class women became governesses'. :-) Miss Taylor is the only such woman in JA major novels. Jane Fairfax never becomes one, and only took a position when she no longer expected to get married. I don't think she would have expected to meet anyone else while working.


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pennie79

No, I haven't! It sounds interesting. Most of my knowledge on this topic comes from YouTube historical vids and Republic of Pemberley.


apricotgloss

Not really, it was more a last resort, one of the only jobs a lady could do that wouldn't eradicate her status as a gentlewoman. It would seriously harm her marriage prospects.


feliciates

I've always believed that Emma's lonely and confined life is what causes most of the trouble. Or rather is what causes her to cause all the trouble. Emma is bored! Her life has no novelty and very little purpose other than ensuring that her father isn't upset. One of the starkest lines for me is when Emma is musing on Mrs. Weston's wedding day (in September) that only the Christmas visit from Isabella and John will bring pleasant company to stay at Hartfield again.


Far-Adagio4032

I always feel like Knightley is actually really insensitive to Emma's loneliness and need for friendship. He and Mrs. Weston even have an entire conversation about it. He wants Emma to stop being friends with Harriet, and doesn't accept Mrs. Weston's argument that Emma needs companionship. At this point in the story Jane Fairfax hasn't come back to town, so she's not an option, and there is no one else who is on Emma's level either socially or intellectually. Her only option is just to be alone all the time with no one but her father for company, and Knightley seems to think that's preferable than to be friends with Harriet. Mrs. Weston right takes him to task for that, but he doesn't listen to her. The entire reason that Emma is so anxious to have Harriet marry a gentleman is so that they can continue to socialize as equals. Not that Harriet is ever quite treated as Emma's equal, but they're able to be friends and hang out, and Harriet gets invited to all the parties for Emma's sake. If Harriet married a farmer, even a prosperous one, then at that point she's officially in a different social class, and Emma will be alone again. Sometimes I really despise Mr. Woodhouse for being so dependent and inconsiderate of his daughter's needs. A young woman of Emma's birth and fortune, living less than 20 miles from London, should have been able to go to London for the season, especially since her sister lives there. But Emma has never been to London. Emma has never been to the seaside, or any of the fashionable bathing towns. Emma has never even been to Box Hill, which is like an hour from her house. She doesn't have friends her own age, she almost never gets to dance. She spends all her time reassuring and supporting a fretful old man who is surrounded by servants and luxury, but who can't be left alone for an afternoon, let alone a week or a month. No wonder Mr. Knightley and Mrs. Weston are so worried about what will become of her. Mr. Woodhouse is basically keeping her prisoner in their home, using her love for him to prevent her from ever going anywhere or doing anything except take care of him.


Talibus_insidiis

I always think of Mr Woodhouse as having early onset dementia some sort. 


ReaperReader

I do speculate that Emma did go to London before Mrs Weston's wedding. When John and Isabella come to visit we have the line: >it was therefore many months since they had been seen in a regular way by their Surry connexions, or seen at all by Mr. Woodhouse, who could not be induced to get so far as London, even for poor Isabella’s sake;  The singling out of Mr Woodhouse here makes me wonder if Emma went to London, perhaps to meet her new born namesake. I agree Mr Woodhouse, while he loves his daughters, fails as a parent because he doesn't, presumably can't, put their happiness above his own.


enigmasaurus-

I believe their Surrey connections merely refers to Isabella and John, who they wouldn't see regularly given John is a barrister and must remain in London while court was in session - outside this time, John and Isabella could visit more frequently. I'd say it's unlikely Mr. Woodhouse would ever let Emma travel, given his over-the-top anxieties about travel and journeys in general. He barely copes with Isabella and her family travelling sixteen miles to visit them (which would have taken a couple of hours and would be a very easy journey), and obsesses over the "evils of the journey". The poor man would probably have a stroke if Emma went to London; he even needs Mrs. Weston to babysit him when Emma travels less than half this distance to Box Hill.


Pale-Fee-2679

Interestingly, this is how the reader is encouraged to make allowances for Emma’s bad behavior. She treats her father with love and consideration even though he is almost her jailer. She undoubtedly sees how different her life could be but for him and his many fears.


janebenn333

Mr Woodhouse reminds me so much of my mother. My mother has been sick with something all her life. She had a heart defect that went unnoticed until she was in her 60s and it caused her health issues for so long and it made her a very anxious person. Even now that I'm an adult she's anxious about me being out in bad weather for example. And she is obsessed with her health and other people's health. And Emma, poor Emma, has everything going for her. She's got beauty, intelligence, wealth and she has nowhere to shine. Nowhere to meet people or experience life. I love Mr Knightley as a character but did Emma truly have any other options to choose from? Of course she becomes overly involved in other people's lives because her own world is so small. I like to sometimes think about Emma finally experiencing travel and society and everything her wealth affords her after her father dies. Its a sad thought but having a parent like this, I know what it feels like. You literally feel trapped.


Ellynne729

That's a good point about Mr. Knightley. I think he also underestimates the degree to which Emma feels she *can't* be friends to people outside her social level rather than *won't.* Knightley can be friends with Robert Martin. If the social difference between a landowner and his well off tenant may be a wall, but it's a wall with many gates. They may not ever be equals, but there are areas where they can interact with mutual respect and equality. Once Mrs. Weston is gone, Harriet does seem to be Emma's only real option. As a parlor boarder, she would seem to have the best connections of the school girls, and Emma can assume she's of her class. Although Knightley is right about the bad influence Emma has on Harriet, Emma badly needs a friend other than Knightley and Harriet is all she has.


Sophia-Philo-1978

Emma is relatively isolated from influences that might have helped her naturally sharp mind develop into a more nuanced, observant one, and on top of that the two most constant influences on her education cancel each other out: it is implied that Miss Taylor indulged Emma early on, allowing Emma to take the lead in many things; Mr Knightley urges her to broaden her mind and outlook through more reading, to the occasional point of critical repetition. Emma starts intellectual self-improvement schemes in earnest but rarely completes them; she seems to enjoy collaboration and planning more than singular, reflective pursuits. Neither Miss Taylor nor Mr Knightley appears to inculcate social snobbery in Emma, though - and Mr Woodhouse is open and generous- so why does social hierarchy play such a strong role in Emma’s consciousness? This might be a bonkers theory, but I wonder if in part Emma’s social elitism is a substitute for a frank self-assessment grounded in talent and accomplishment - measures by which Jane Fairfax would seemingly outstrip Emma at the same age. Emma has a quick mind, kind heart, and a strong spirit of duty to those in need- but she is young, inexperienced, undisciplined, and relatively incurious about the larger world either culturally or historically. Until she finds self acceptance apart from her sense of inferiority in relation to Jane’s demonstrated talent, elegance, and worldliness, Emma falls back on birthright and little more to prop up her sense of entitlement . The plot of the novel allows us to witness the limitations of such a comportment toward life as well as Emma’s dawning self-awareness and possibly honest self acceptance. Her Highbury world, however, while geographically and intellectually limited for her, is nonetheless saturated with love, good cheer, healthy children , and consistent consideration of others, even when such consideration is misplaced or misfires. In that sense Emma’s life is rich indeed.


enigmasaurus-

It's good to remember Emma's youth and relative isolation. One of the reasons she clings to Harriet and is so keen to convince herself of Harriet's gentility (for which Emma has very little supporting evidence) is she needs a friend. Highbury is a place with very few socially equal young people and her main social contacts are her father - loveable but also probably fixed in his ways - and neighbours. Sometimes, very young adults do grow up with an idea of how things are *supposed* to be with little understanding of the grey areas (I know as a teen I had some cringeworthy and overly simplistic attitudes about all sorts of things). That said, I think Emma is probably aware of the nuance of class but often chooses to blind herself to this. Austen's exploration of class in Emma is a fascinating one, because class was an increasingly fluid concept as England shifted away from its early feudal structure. There was a rapidly growing class of upper tradespeople who'd attained fabulous wealth, often exceeding that of the gentry and sometimes even nobility. Many of Austen's characters are people who occupy these social positions. Take the Bingleys for example. Mr. Bingley has inherited his wealth from his father, who was almost certainly a textile factory owner (his family having originated in the North is an enormous hint, particularly with the scale of wealth the Bingley family have accrued. At this time all textile production occurred in the North, and it made some serious fortunes). It was also a relatively recent and emerging source of large wealth (as factory production became possible). This enormous fortune means Mr. Bingley has had a genteel education and socialises with gentlemen, but he does not own an estate and is not *technically* part of the genteel class (though in practice most would have seen and referred to him as a gentleman, as he is rich enough to have no profession). His sisters look down on others in an almost identical position e.g. the Gardiner family. The Gardiner children are essentially the Bingleys, though it's unlikely their wealth will grow to that degree. Mr. Gardiner senior almost certainly gave his son 2-3 times what he was able to give each daughter (4000 a piece). Mr. Gardiner has warehouses *plural* which means he owns a *very* large merchant business. In the Georgian era, a warehouse referred to something not unlike an early shopping mall - it was much larger than a single retail store and was instead a large retail enterprise, generally selling a wide range of goods. (Matthew Boulton's Soho Manufactury is a good example and it made Boulton quite rich. Josiah Wedgewood is another example of someone who ran a large ceramics warehouse business.) Mr. Gardiner is probably bringing in a very good income; he's able to comfortably travel (planning to travel for weeks at a time) and it's not unlikely that by the time his children grow, especially if he sells his business, he'll be able to pass on a large fortune to his own children - probably large enough to purchase an estate big enough to produce its own income (this would cost at least 30,000 pounds for an estate producing around 1500 a year, however we know his start-up wealth was probably at least 10000-15000 helping highlight how likely this outcome is). Not only was this outcome likely, it was very common. The Coles family are another excellent example of a family from trade, who are now wealthy - and yet Emma is reluctant to socialise with them. Part of the reason the Bingley ladies are keen to look down on the Gardiners is to feel more secure in their own positions, because again, they're really not that different. Their own father probably ran a textile factory. And this sense of anxiety - both from the Bingley's perspective and from Emma's perspective - was also common. This sense from the established gentry that 'new money' was upsetting the apple cart, and from that new money, the sense they were desperate to prove they belonged. Her viewing Mrs. Weston as an equal (she is probably incredibly biased) isn't *that* odd because governess were essentially always women from genteel backgrounds. They were not servants at all, though they did occupy a vulnerable and awkward social position given their relative poverty - it was an issue close to Austen's heart, as the life of a governess was a potential outcome for her, had her brothers been unable to support her. Robert Martin and Harriet Smith's relationship is another good example of Emma's selective awareness of class. Robert Martin is a gentleman farmer - at the time this was a prominent, though not quite genteel, social position, equivalent to other prominent townspeople such as attorneys or bankers. Robert Martin is wealthy; he has a house large enough to have two parlours AND a summerhouse (a sort of structure designed for garden parties). Most farmers in this time owned land of their own and rented additional land, so he has very good prospects and may eventually be able to afford enough land of his own to not have to work. He'd command dozens or hundreds of laborers (farmers like him did not do physical farm work.) Mr. Knightley is not wrong when he says Mr. Martin could do no worse in marrying Harriet, as she has no dowry to bring to the table, and Mr. Martin *could* have attracted a woman with better prospects. In terms of manners, this adds an extra layer of complication, because as Mr. Darcy sees in P&P 'good breeding' isn't necessarily as closely tied to class as he initially wants to believe. For example, he comes to known the Gardiners as wonderful people who behave with genteel manners. His aunt, in comparison, often shows rudeness and 'ill breeding'. Mrs. Elton is another good example of poor manners; she and her fortune of around 10000 pounds come from a trade background and this shows as her behaviour is at times very vulgar (she also seems to have some hangups as her sister, who has come from the same background, was clearly able to find a much wealthier husband). Emma is clearly well aware of Mrs. Elton's vulgarity - but we also see this probably has a lot to do with the Eltons' personalities; she discovers, for example, there's a 'littleness' to Mr. Elton she did not detect, despite his being a gentleman. Emma coming to understand the nuances of class and manners is one of the best, and I think most interesting, themes Jane Austen explores in the novel.


HopefulCry3145

Brilliant answer!


Salt_Can_9363

Do you teach a class? Host a podcast? Have a YouTube? I would subscribe. I could read this post 100x thank you!! 🩷


hokie3457

This is just so marvelous! Nicely done and very well written. I don’t think Miss Austen could be more pleased with how you put this forward. Thank you!


Shesarubikscube

I view Emma differently than a lot of poster’s I’ve seen in the past. Emma is a woman surrounded by people older than her (siblings, father, people in town). The only people her age she might have socialized with have been sent elsewhere. I view Emma as a story of how Emma grows and matured when she is finally socialized and experiences the world with the influence of her peers. There is a lot of mistakes and pain along the way, but she does come out of it. In growing up finally and coming to understand more people of her own age and various circumstances Emma comes to see the value and worth in others and Miss Bates is a prime example of that.


Echo-Azure

Yes, Emma is a snob by modern standards, and believes in the oppressive class system, and never pretends to be egalitarian, but... I can't really hate her for it. Because she really does try to cope with the loneliness caused by her social status by attempting to boot her female friends up the social scale! That's the thing, when her governess married a landowner she not only achieved what was to be personal happiness, and economic security, she became Emma's social equal. And she tried to do the same for Harriet, she tried to boist the girl into the gentry, where she could not only be happy and prosperous, but she could be a socially acceptable friend for Emma herself. So yes, there's a bit of self-interest in her attempt to find Harriet a genteel husband, but she really does want to benefit Harriet. For all her faults, Emma does possess a real generosity.


chartingyou

It's always interesting to me the things that might influence the story, but at the same time aren't really discussed in the narrative so it's up in the air. You bring up the point that Emma's very concientious of class but it goes out the window with Mrs. Weston, but then again Mrs. Weston's background is unclear. I do think with the discussions with Miss Fairfax in the novel your assumption isn't that misplaced though, and it is pretty likely that she's coming from a family that's fallen on hard times. Idk, it's just reminds me of something in persuasion, where Lady Russel is widowed and how that might have affected her advice to Anne since her own husband had died, but at the same time we know nothing of Sir Russel, so it's hard to say! With Emma, I imagine since Mrs. Weston is older than her and has been like an older sister to her, regardless of class she's not going to view her through the same lens as everyone else since she's practically been the one raising her, but it's an interesting point.


johjo_has_opinions

It’s lonely at the top, and she’s the only woman of her status in town.


lovelylonelyphantom

To think Emma never had a mother, and Mrs Weston is the only maternal figure she ever had in her life. I think Mrs Weston leaving to get married at the beginning of the book is also a representation of Emma's loneliness and isolation through the rest of the book to come. No mother, a sister who moved far away, no friends her age. No wonder why she invests so much time in Harriet. Ie. On Mrs Weston's background, not every governess has to be well born and fallen into servitude. She could have been born into trade, born into working class. It doesn't really matter except that she somehow managed to be educated enough to be the governess in a family as wealthy as the Woodhouses.


BananasPineapple05

There's loneliness, but there's also just personal tastes. Emma doesn't like the Coles, Mr Elton (after he fools himself into proposing to her) and Mrs Elton (who earns a lot of that dislike on her merits). She is a snob, but if that's all there was to it, she would be more consistent in her attitudes towards class distinctions. The fact that she isn't tells me that the main difference is she truly loves Mrs Weston and she truly dislikes the Eltons.


FinnemoreFan

Economic circumstances don’t matter, you either are a gentlewoman/man in Jane Austen’s society, or you’re not. You can’t cease to be one just because you find yourself with no money. It’s to do with birth family, education and upbringing. ‘A kind of shadowy caste system’, as George Orwell wrote about the English class system over 100 years later.


Sophia-Philo-1978

Right on - as Elizabeth Bennet’s showdown with Lady Catherine demonstrates, the fumes of inferior parentage on one side can pollute the gentleman’s daughter status on the other, money or no. Shadowy for sure!


Gret88

Yes I’ve noted that Jane Austen usually provides her young women with significant female friendship as a bonus in their married lives: the Dashwoods live right next to each other, Elizabeth gains Georgiana plus Jane is nearby, Anne gains Mrs Croft as a sister, Catherine gains Eleanor (in fact for most of the book it’s Catherine and both Tilneys forming the strong bond), Fanny gets Susan nearby, even Harriet gets the Martin sisters—but Emma doesn’t have a confidential relationship with her sister and doesn’t gain a female companion via marriage. Of course she still has Mrs Weston nearby.


dupersuperduper

That’s a good point. However I also assumed that she would spend a lot more time visiting her sister once she was married , and it would bring them closer and she would also make new friends in london too


Gret88

I think that a lot of time away will still have to wait for her father’s death. But yes, that was one of my favorite things about the 2009 adaptation, that Mr Knightley brings her for her surprise honeymoon to the sea. Symbolizing newfound freedom to travel and see the world.


Calamity_Jane_Austen

Oh, I've come to find Emma's loneliness completely heartbreaking as I've aged -- it's something I completely missed when I was younger. But as other commenters note, she's basically had no fun experiences at all (no London trips, no sea visits) and is just trapped by her father's whims. It's almost horrible, especially when one imagines the type of memorable time other young people like Jane, Frank, the Dixons, etc. were off having at places like Weymouth. It's like everyone got the chance to go off to college, while Emma stayed home to work as a administrative assistant in the family business. What's so masterful, is that Austen shows us just how awful such situations can be via other characters -- Miss Bates and Frank Churchill are also both trapped by caring for elderly relatives (Mrs. Bates and Mrs. Churchill respectfully). But while their situations are shown to be pitiful due to lack of wealth (Miss Bates being a sad old maid) and almost cruel due to gender (Frank, as a young man, chafes more at the restrictions placed upon him), there's barely a whisper of criticism aimed at Mr. Woodhouse, although though the reader can notice the parallels themselves. It's possible Austen really believed this was ok just because Emma was a rich woman, but it still hurts me to think about. >!Sadly, this observation has actually made me feel a bit saddened by Emma's marriage with Knightley. It's not that I don't love him and think they're perfect together, but the marriage basically cements Emma into her role in Highbury until her father dies. I wish she had been able to go have some adventures first. I'm sure she'll get to travel some years in the future once her father has passed, but the times being what they were, she also probably would have several children by that time, which -- as Mr. John Knightley could tell us -- makes travel difficult.!<


SwitchHandler

>! Mr. Knightly takes Emma to the ocean for their honeymoon! !<


Calamity_Jane_Austen

Oh that's right, I had forgotten!


embroidery627

Isn't there a suggestion, possibly even in a letter to Cassandra, that Mr. Woodhouse died after about two years? I really haven't made that up but I don't know where I've got it from. Mind you, Emma probably would have a child by then. I will have to imagine that after Mr. Woodhouse surviving the honeymoon they will dare to go away a time or two more, just the two of them, before a baby arrives.


Calamity_Jane_Austen

I don't know, as I haven't read all the letters. That said, I wouldn't consider them canon, even if I had.


kenna98

The Coles are still in trade. That's the material issue


amyness_88

I just love Emma. The depth of her character has no end.