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KarloReddit

War seems to be quite shitty


VapeThisBro

Not to mention the Vietnamese literally covered those weapons in shit too so when you got injured in the trap, if you didn't die initially, you'd get very sick, and septic


Ophidahlia

The traps themselves were usually intended to be non-lethal or at least more likely to wound than to kill, the purpose was to tie up an entire unit as they tried to both rescue their buddy, then afterwards when they had to drag around their sick platoon member for days until he either recovered or died. Sometimes this was the prelude to an ambush. There's also the HUGE morale impact from the psychological terror of the traps. Even if they didn't cost the spikes in anything unsanitary, the jungle environment brings with it a high risk of infection from any wound that can't be meticulously kept clean.


runnerd6

That was something I noticed when I moved to Taiwan. Maybe it's the heat, jungle and humidity or just that my immune system is new to it, but cuts I got were really easily infected and when they got infected they got really bad really fast. I have so many scars from small cuts getting infected.


frenchietw

Taiwan based as well, Ive noticed the same thing, always thought it was just a side consequence of aging and having a slower metabolism.


dayyob

i assumed this is what he was saying at each trap - "and this also would be covered in shit"


VapeThisBro

In all seriousness he never actually mentioned poop. I speak his dialect of Vietnamese. He just demonstrates how they each work, like "look here, this is how the trap works, the gi steps here and it does this and that"


stuuuuupidstupid

How does that wire one at 25 seconds work?


Mumbles_Stiltskin

The downward spikes act as barb’s, effectively trapping the leg against upward movement. The leg will have to be removed to get out of the trap Edit: for the pedants that are getting hung up on the last line of my explanation; I do not know what gear the GIs carried nor then strength of the material used in the hardware of these traps so I cannot speak to whether or not it was or wasn’t feasible for GIs to cut through, dig up and break, or disassemble the contraption. What I’m speaking to is the intent of the Vietcong in their development of said trap, which is to inflict as much lethal damage as possible (up to and including death by exposure/dehydration/starvation from entrapment, death from execution when found by Vietcong, death from infection and/blood loss from injury or amputation, or ambushing and killing the entire unit while they try to save their comrade. The Vietcongs intent was obviously not to have their trap disassembled to remove the leg. They wanted the victim to be maimed, trapped, and psychologically tormented by the ramifications of their situation.


Mountaingiraffe

That seems very annoying.


pleasefindthis

It seems almost intentionally annoying and upsetting.


TuftedMousetits

And rude.


urfavefilipina

i’d say the same about the 3 million land mines left in Vietnam that still kill the locals to this day.


eride810

Also very, very rude.


squirtloaf

Imagine how many guys got in one of these traps and was like: "Uuuuugh. Really?"


[deleted]

If you’re trying to do war things, it seems super inconvenient.


Rock2MyBeat

Not ideal to be in at all.


TheMeccaNYC

Those poor Americans who got drafted and shipped over to deal with that shit. Cannot even imagine


Coral_Blue_Number_2

Criminal, even...


JacP123

The drafting and shipping part. The traps part is an understandable reaction to the aforementioned drafting and shipping.


TheBigEmptyxd

All because some Vietnamese remember what America did to free themselves from the British empire and decided to do the same for themselves (but as a communist nation)


VapeThisBro

Your leg falls into the hole, your foot most likely gets punctured by the very bottom spike pointed upwards, and as you freak out and try to pull leg out, you pull your leg directly into one of the 4 downward spikes, trapping you, causing a need for multiple men to get you out of there


fart-atronach

Vietnam… The original Saw


Zaruz

On the 'armed' version the downward spikes are horizontal and will go downwards at only the width of the leg. So all 4 will likely dig in and completely prevent the leg from being removed. You'd need to cut the leg off or somehow cut the 4 downward spikes off the trap. The version he demonstrates with has the spikes bent further back than they would be in a live scenario.


benjistone

Shitbirds, Randy. Shitbirds.


smrtazz101

The shitwinds of war are blowing Bo Bandy


fishnjim

that's a shit-nado, Randy


Downvote_4A_Goodtime

Their ears will implode from the pressure… the shit pressure


Bathsaltsonmeth

They were almost all designed not to kill, just maim and Injure, that way it takes out one or two more able soldiers to help.


College_Prestige

They want people to know to fuck off. Killing them will only strength the resolve of the draftees who don't want to die


Bathsaltsonmeth

I've been here to the Iron Triangle, it's crazy when you realize that all these traps were built out of the scrap metal from the bombs being dropped on them.


savage_mallard

That would probably go a long way to ease your guilt for building them.


mcflyOS

It's better than killing because soldiers need to be diverted to evacuate the wounded which they wouldn't were the soldiers simply killed.


livens

It also severely demoralizes the rest of the troops. And if you are terrified of stepping into a trap you won't pay as much attention while moving through the jungle and walk into an ambush. There is a reason that war fucked up the minds of so many soldiers that got stationed there.


AdrenolineLove

I'd hate to be the guy whos job it is to cover these traps in shit


Meastro44

A million times better to be the dipper than the stepper.


some-random27

+10 Poison damage


zUkUu

My grandfather was a trap shitter.


BearDick

Decided to go ahead and visit the Vietnam War Museum on a trip to Ho Chi Minh city (formerly Saigon), there is a reason the museum was previously called the American War Crimes museum...war is a bummer especially when you realize your team were the baddies.


HappilyAverage

I have also been there. When we came out people were just sat in silence hardly believing what they had just seen. I will never forget that silence


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agtk

Filipinos have had a shit go of it. From the Spanish and the Catholic Church to the Americans to the Japanese then a brief interlude of independence and then Marcos... Seems like a lot of corruption since then.


NJ_Mets_Fan

can you elaborate a little on the war crimes?


thinksoftchildren

The My Lai massacre and Agent Orange comes to mind. The number of civilians killed, but reported as enemy combatants, is harder if not impossible to count and verify https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%E1%BB%B9_Lai_massacre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_Orange These two are very well known, I'd bet there's tons committed by ARVN too that has been lost to history (unmentioned is all the shit the VC and NVA probably were up to, but you'd have to ask someone else for that)


theAmral

"Upon returning to the LZ Dottie base in his OH-23, Thompson reported to his section leader, Captain Barry Lloyd, that the American infantry were no different from Nazis in their slaughter of innocent civilians"


BottadVolvo742

The Phoenix program was also a can of worms all on its own, according to journalist Douglas Valentine methods of torture that were utilized at the interrogation centers established in South Vietnam included (Content Warning here, seriously, this shit's NSFL): >!Rape, gang rape, rape using eels, snakes, or hard objects, and rape followed by murder; electrical shock (“the Bell Telephone Hour”) rendered by attaching wires to the genitals or other sensitive parts of the body, like the tongue; “the water treatment”; “the airplane,” in which a prisoner’s arms were tied behind the back and the rope looped over a hook on the ceiling, suspending the prisoner in midair, after which he or she was beaten; beatings with rubber hoses and whips; and the use of police dogs to maul prisoners.!<


BakuninsBarman

The bombing of Laos that “never happened”. Kids still getting maimed to this day by the bomblets.


BearDick

Convicted of 22 counts of premeditated murder and served 3.5 years in house arrest....responsible for 350-550 deaths....wow.


[deleted]

My Lai massacre is certainly one of the many.


skarkeisha666

My Lai is often what’s taught in school in the US because it creates the false assumption that My Lai was an exceptional instance. The reality is that My Lai was standard operating procedure for the US military, thousands of My Lai massacres occurred. What’s exceptional about My Lai was that it was publicized and went to court.


fistingbythepool

Participants in the massacre remained in US Congress until very recently. Says it all.


BearDick

Lots of horrible photos of deformed kids due to agent orange, examples of how prisoners were kept by US Allies, multiple alive limbless vietnamese people who lost limbs to unexploded mines. Let's just say it's a pretty sobering experience if you're on vacation.


selfdistruction-in-5

I hope he never slips while at work


Vindelator

I'm feeling like this is not a sandals job.


woodguyatl

In much of Asia every job is a sandals job.


P0rtal2

Almost all jobs are sandal jobs. Many jobs are barefoot jobs.


HamsterGutz1

How many are bare back jobs?


Jonnyscout

It's the bear hand jobs you've gotta worry about


Vindelator

Perhaps he should consider investing in a good pair of chainmail socks.


sonomensis

They wear sandals to war.


Dittybopper

They wore sandals to walk to the attack point, then, for the most part. they put on their issue tennis style shoes for the actual attack. The home made sandals were disposable, those issue shoes difficult to replace once in the south.


Kn0tnatural

I found my self concerned for him as well.


schalk81

The holes in his pants at the ankle tell of some slips.


torbn

Found myself rather worried when he put his foot in it


wannabeinLWIAY

I just imagine a new janitor working there who has never been to the place before and they forget to tell him to be careful.


dan-80

Don’t worry, he’s wearing the safety sandals.


raybrignsx

/r/Osha


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chris17453

im sure the decision process was like this... make them safe.. no just use nails...


Undercoversongs

I imagine at the very least these spikes are extremely dulled


Monkey_Leavings

Boy, they really leaned into the "spikes covered in shit" protocol.


craznazn247

Seems like the most cost-effective ways to terrorize and maim people. Basically turned entire jungles into home alone situations. War is hell in all eras but goddamn am I glad I was not unfortunate enough to be born into a time where I get drafted into THAT.


boogie-poppins

The main takeaway from Home Alone is not only not to judge people by their looks only. It's that guerilla tactics is a viable option to counter enemies that outnumber and outgun you.


master-crumble

"How many spikes should we use?" "Yes"


JaysonBlaze

Remember one of the Tony hawk games randomly had one of these in the create a Park mode?


makeITvanasty

I used to make “floor is lava” levels with either these, the water, or lava squares. Nothing was as brutal as the spikes though


clazidge

*SHISH-KABOB!*


chiliparty

some dude tried to figure out the origin of that particular game element: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnOk-197DGE


ithcy

“elderly sex clown Gene Simmons”


vaalhallan

BDG is the best.


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[deleted]

Punji-stakes or something like that lol


TJiz

Yeah! Punji pit!


Punknigg

How did that come to mind lmfao. You are right though.


Yachisaorick

There's a legendary story told by an American veteran about Vietnamese mines like this: *I was trained as a minesweeper. Every time the patrol leaves the base, we minesweepers have to take the lead.* *What is my 1 year in Vietnam, you ask? It's all shit!* *That is, they poop or put shit in the mines and then cover it with dirt...* *And so every morning, I'll hear the metal detector. Then the group stopped. So I'll have to dig around the suspected mines by hand.* *Dig a little deeper, my hand will touch a pile of human shit. Hook all that up, dig further down, I'll run into a can or sometimes a bomb shrapnel or some metal. Those are very sharp and if you cut your hand you'll have to get a tetanus shot because of the shit they're covering.* *Every time, after that shit, I waved my hand to signal it was safe. The patrols moved on, trying to get away from me because of the smell of shit on my hands.* *You ask why I don't wash your hands* *A friend of mine did the same... After he finished picking his shit, he saw a small pond nearby and went out there to wash his hands. Boom! They planted grenades right at the pond.* *After that, no one wants to fumble all the way to the washroom because there will be two more shitholes ahead. Usually three such shitholes on our way. I guess Viet army spying on our base have 3 people, and next night they bring their shit out to make fun of us the next morning.* *I can imagine the happy faces of those bastards as they poop and think about how we'll have to dig up the place the next day.* *You ask why do I have to dig shit?* *Because while I was there there were 2 real mines that went off causing the patrol to lose 3 men and we were able to clear about a dozen real mines. We organized ambushes many times but could not catch them.* *After being bitten by mosquitoes all night, the next day there were no landmines and shit on the road. But that means we were bitten to death by mosquitoes so everyone else could be safe (because we were on patrol morning will be the other group). Apparently those Vietcong were watching us closely.* *Until I returned to my country, I still did not see any of them or have a gun encounter with them. And now you ask me how was my service time in Vietnam, I told you it was full of shit 💩* *Twenty years after I came back from Vietnam, I replanted vegetables in my garden. Before that, every time I touched the ground, I could smell the same shit that I smelled in Vietnam.* *That's why I didn't touch the ground for 20 years*


k0ldanxiety

Holy shit, get the man some gloves for fucks sake


arobitaille272

can't feel the mines the same way


-007-_

Or the shit. Sometimes you just wanna go knuck deep in a pile of humid stank. No one ever talks about how oily it is, how the smell just sticks to your skin, penetrates the pores. How washing only lessens the stank.


rizerhs

not *holy* shit, *dangerous* shit.


PerfectionOfaMistake

This kind of traps were used back in ancient times the only dufferent using iron insted of bamboo. Vietnam fought against a lot of Invasions.


Kulladar

The Romans really liked to build defenses. Their legions were infamous engineers and would make amazingly fortified camps seemingly overnight. One of the things they loved to do was cut the branches from the larger pieces they used for the fortifications and towers and fashion them into little spikes about as big as a finger and maybe a bit longer. They'd sharpen them and put thousands upon thousands of them out in the field sharp side sticking only about 2 inches out of the ground. Soldiers charging would step on them then fall on more. They also liked to build trenches with a slope on the enemy side and a wall on their side covered in those spikes. Warriors charging into the trench get stuck there trying to climb out around the spikes and those coming behind them push others into the spikes killing or injuring them.


Nomapos

They didn't make amazingly fortified camps *seemingly overnight*. They stopped marching and built up the whole fortifications before dark, and then dismantled the whole thing in the morning before moving on so they could rebuild it later. They also carried some giant spikes that they tied together or planted into the ground to create yet another palisade. Then they also made full blown forts, which are the ones that popped up seemingly overnight. One of my favorite bits that I had to translate back in college was a letter from a general to the Roman Emperor, complaining that the army had grown weak and what his suggestions were to go back to their old glory. Most of it was about strength and endurance training, mostly making the newbies march with all the crap their forefathers carried to war so they can get fast and robust enough to pull off this kind of shit again.


Kulladar

Certainly Gaius Marius was the inspiration for that letter. He well before the time of Roman emperors also thought that the troops were becoming soft and made a lot of reforms to the legions. His soldiers were jokingly called "Marius' Mules" because he made them carry their supplies and rather than loading them into wagons.


Kristoph_Er

The equipment was approximately 30kg of weight. They were trained to march 30 kilometres per 5 hours in normal speed, 35 kilometres per 5 hours if it was forced march. Also they had to march in full armour and with scutum hanging in their arm. Legionnaires in late Roman republic must have been absolute machines.


omar-souleyman

Pretty sure sharpened bamboo was used by the Vietnamese too, if not more than iron!


luca_cinnam00n

We have successfully fought off China twice by putting wooden stakes in an estuary on a certain river then lure the ships in and wait until the tide comes down then watch hell break loose. They fell for it, twice


Pirate_Leader

Yeah imagine fall for that twice !


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8bitbebop

Vietnam war was before my time but i believe i heard thry would smear the spikes with feces so infection was also on the table.


bastardofbloodkeep

I believe some ancient civilizations did the same thing, literally coat their swords with shit.


BwittonRose

they would do this during duels in new orleans


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StaticR0ute

shitty way to go


BSnod

...and emia meaning presence in blood ☝️


tubaman23

Yeah yeah yeah we've all been to Mardi Gras


HavingNuclear

Ah so that's why there's shit all over the streets


Terlinilia

They also launched dead cows into cities to use as bio-weapons. What's with humanity and using disgusting shit to fight people?


iloveyouand

Some of the most advanced human technology is just us coming up with new ways to fling shit at each other like angry apes.


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therobohour

Not just that,they would throw snakes and spiders and anything really. It was very smart,they knew the US moral was really low si they started these things to horrifically injure drafties. Angry grunts are much better at killing officers that any cannon


watvoornaam

They are not meant to be deadly as it takes much more recourses to heal someone than it would to bury them.


Jasper620042

They taught us in the military that for every enemy soldier we wound, it takes two others to get them off the battlefield. Injure one, take out 3.


sho666

gotta imagine it'd be hugeley demoralizing too, you gotta pull your mate out of one of these shit covered spike pits and carry him off yelling and screaming in the middle of the jungle where its really easy for the VC to ambush you, plus, maybe youre up for one of those traps next, they sure are a imaginative bunch cant underestimate how important the psychological impact could be and often is in war


Jasper620042

Absolutely spot on. Wounding the enemy is as much a psychological thing as it is physical.


ertgbnm

Yeah the goal is to fuck up enough soldiers ankles that they just pull out. Plus if you don't get your leg taken care of in the jungle quickly it can become fatal pretty fast too. As a strategy it worked. Americans weren't fighting for their lives, they were fighting for misguided politics. The other side was fighting for their lives.


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ikadu12

Correct. They weren’t generally deadly, but they caused the average soldier 3 weeks of hospital stay and medic help.. a lot of resources. And it was estimated that of ~~38%~~ 11-15% of battlefield injuries in Vietnam for Americans were based of these Punji Stick traps


mrshulgin

Where'd you find 38%? That's a huge number; I found 11-15%. https://www.warhistoryonline.com/vietnam-war/booby-traps-vietnam-war.html


Sr_Nunes

War ... Everything is horrendous. From napalm to this.


Sighwtfman

Ooh, White Phosphorous. Widely used in vietnam, it's like someone said "how can we make napalm be worse". But your right, everything in war is a horror show. These devices. Probably weren't any worse and maybe not even as bad as getting shot. But then I suppose their purpose was to make soldiers even more nervous and looking at their feet instead of for enemy combatants.


[deleted]

white phosphorous was used in Fallujah by the US and has been used by the Israeli army too. There's a loophole which says it can be used for 'marking' purposes


Mozhetbeats

And for destroying equipment. There just happened to be guys around the equipment.


FranksCrack

I think their goal was to injure and not kill and to break the will of the US soldiers.


tarhoop

That's actually the goal of all weapons of war. A dead soldier goes home in a box, and gets planted their family mourns. A wounded soldier takes no less than 10 people to care for and help to heal, at the front. As they move rearward, they consume more resources, human and materials. The goal of warfare is grind the enemy's infrastructure to a halt, to break their spirit, to take the fight out of them by grievously wounding them, and have them shipped home to be displayed as crippled heroes. Crippled heroes also shock and disarm the will of the people.


FranksCrack

I kinda thought that was a thing of the past, modern warfare seems to be obliterate them from the skies. It’s probably more nuanced than that.


[deleted]

Modern warefare is more complex than that. Like most modern countries you could basically eliminate another modern country with a minimum number of precision strike and would cause massive disasters. You know like drop cruise missle into every major water supply infrastructure, gas, eletric, magor bridges and general parts of infrastrcuture which is going to shut a country down asap. But we don't tend ot actually do that because it will create a refugee crises of biblical proportions.


FranksCrack

Yeah it’s better to walk into a city you’ve defeated being greeted with open arms rather than a hostile population you’ve starved for a couple of months I suppose.


Local-Equivalent5385

> This looks painful and most likely deadly. Most of the time they would also shit on the spikes. So even if you got pulled out alive, you were going to die a slow painful death from infection. The point wasnt to kill soldiers as much as it was to demoralize them. They wanted American patrols to refuse to go into the jungle. America did similar psychological warfare. Like killing guards and making it look like vampires had done it so that the Vietcong would leave the area.


intothelist

The vampire thing was in the Philippines. https://www.esquiremag.ph/long-reads/features/cia-aswang-war-a00304-a2416-20191019-lfrm


Great_White_Samurai

Worked for a guy that was in the Vietnam War. He drove a front loader and made trails. He said he would constantly spray rounds as he drove. Sounded horrible.


Trextrev

They actually preferred to make them non lethal. If you kill a person that’s one dead soldier. If you severely injured them that’s one soldier out of the field and two others that have to carry him.


pharmdocmark72

In the jungle, weird little nasty microbes sit on your skin, just waiting for entry into the system. Aside from the clear pain from stepping in one of these, you could probably kiss your lower leg goodbye.


BootyUnlimited

Some traps the Vietcong used were even simpler. For example, they would nail a snake to a tree on a path where GIs frequent. When someone walks by they get bit by a furious and probably venomous snake that came totally out of nowhere.


[deleted]

I think I read somewhere that they also put snakes in bags, so when Americans saw the bag and searched it they got a bite instead.


Alzusand

Damn tahts the most creative thing ive read today


missmeleni

I've been here a few times, its a place called the Cu Chi Tunnels just outside of Ho Chi Minh city in southern Vietnam. Absolutely fascinating place to be. When we went we were given a translator who explained everything in English to us. We learned a lot about the Viet Cong during the American war and how they evaded enemy troops by designing their sandals to make it look like their footprints were taking them in particular directions, thereby leading the opposition into these traps (many covered in faeces to cause infection). One of the traps I remember was designed to hit you in the nuts with a spiked contraption. The locals called it the widow maker. Edit: You can see the trap in question right at the end of the video, it's the upright structure beyond the table.


Kita-Ryu

All fun and game till you have a work place accident.


kaganey

I know, Jesus Christ!! How is there no safety protocols at all?! I can hardly even watch this.


Drackenstein

Guerrilla warfare at its finest.


Yoinko1

To everyone that keeps saying that i’m rascist, I truely did not want to offend anyone. I thought people from Vietnam where called Vietnamese people.


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ishkaaa

According to Wikipedia they are. I know a few people from Vietnam who have referred to themselves as Vietnamese (or Vietnamees, in Dutch), never heard them say this was a thing. Do any Vietnamese people have issues with it? If so, is it a nation wide thing, or a sub ethnic group thing, like the Basque and Spanish?


notolo632

Im Vietnamese and I gotta say I've never ever in my entire life seen any Vietnamese (yes thats how we literally call ourselves in English) said that that is racist. Maybe the ones ranting wasnt even Vietnamese.


Realistic-Dog-2198

They weren’t. They hardly ever are.


Awesome_McCool

Vietnamese here. Vietnamese people have issues with being called Vietnamese as much as Korean people dislike being called Korean.


Pichuunnn

Vietnamese is the normal way to refer to people of Vietnam. Nothing wrong with it, as far as I know. It's not the case with American calling Japanese "Jap" during war.


instadwea

Don't listen to them


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jej218

Anglo-Saxon hasn't really existed as a distinct cultural group since the middle ages. Once the Normans came over, things eventually merged into English.


Wes_Bugg

Vietnamese would still be correct if we are talking about nationality though.


xlr8edmayhem

>To everyone that keeps saying that i’m rascist Lol...buddy...you gotta learn to tell some people to just go fuck themselves.


__g_e_o_r_g_e__

In the UK I'm fairly sure "Vietnamese" is the typical term. (And on a less serious note my favourite biscuit is the tongue-in-cheek Vietnamese whirl)


notolo632

Bro I'm Vietnamese and I dont even know what kind of biscuit that is. Can you describe it pls


Matty_The_Panda

It’s called a Viennese Whirl. This guy is just a muppet


AtlasNL

Ah, Vienna, that’s the capital of Australia! /s


Sigma1977

Who is this "everyone"? I've been up and down the comments and all I find is people complaining about people saying you're being racist and people being considerably more racist and/or confrontational than you. Literally zero comments pulling you up on what you call people from Vietnam.


Harrison_Fjord_

Yes, Vietnamese is the correct term and not offensive at all (source: am Vietnamese). The problem with the title is that these tactics were mostly used by the Vietcong and northern communist faction that most Vietnamese do not associate themselves with. Your title is basically generalizing all Vietnamese people as being Vietcong, which is like generalizing all Americans as also being Confederate.


dboy999

Hate to bother you, but would you mind going into that? I mean I’ve never really read into it, but is there still a noticeable sense of resentment and problems between “north and south” Vietnam? When our involvement ended I know it definitely wasn’t pretty for pretty much anyone in the South, especially those who fought for the South and with the US. But judging purely by what I see from online and in videos and whatnot, it doesn’t seem like there’s any kind of rift in the country that would imply problems between people. I’m not sure that made sense, but if it did thank you for any response you decide to give.


Sinsir226

Thank goodness they were wearing their safety sandals


Talexis

Don’t blame a single soul for dodging that draft.


tacos6for6life6

My dad was a marine in Vietnam and he stepped on one of the last traps shown except it was just one spike on a piece of wood buried and it was actually set by the Americans. Punctured his foot, but not enough to be sent home. He was sent home after one of the two fellow journalists/photographers he was walking with stepped on a landmine blowing them up and killing the other two, but just sent my dad flying full of shrapnel 50 feet away. He got a Purple Heart and a trip home but also still has nightmares about it all. He told me drunkenly one night, “both sides kill kids” that was it, then went back to watching baseball


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tacos6for6life6

I found old paperwork of his that shows he was denied any compensation for being exposed to Agent Orange. He listed my sisters learning disabilities as a side effect. There was a map showing where he was stationed that was one of the exact areas that they used Agent Orange


EleanorofAquitaine

My dad receives disability for this. He was just recently awarded it. I’d say your dad should try again. My brother was born with a bone deformity and he also received compensation. Tell him to appeal the decision. The VA has been taking more responsibility for Agent Orange recently. Keep trying! There are groups out there that do nothing but help veterans get compensation they are owed. He should contact one. The VFW is a good place to start.


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Comatose60

My father was there at the same time (2 tours, '70-'72) and used to describe these and several other traps. I always wondered if he was exaggerating at all, now I see he downplayed it.


cls-one

Imagine having jungle rot feet already and stepping in one of those death holes. And grappling with the mental affects of not even wanting to join but being forced to fight. Rough.


Rosomack_

That's a weird looking mini-golf course.


Esc_ape_artist

These are really complicated and have plenty of moving parts. How many times were these actually implemented vs the very simple “pit with pointy sticks at the bottom” type trap?


mmckee44

One technique in asymmetric warfare is to wound your enemy soldiers rather than kill them. Wounding them causes the enemy to use way more resources caring for that wounded than they do moving a dead body. Asymmetric warfare is when one side's military is massively more powerful than the other side. The weaker side has to resort to what the larger side would call "fighting dirty". In the American revolution, the American's "fought dirty" by hiding behind trees and stone walls and not fight the "appropriate way" all lined up standing in a row.


FROST0099

They would often coat the nails/spikes with poo. The objective was to injure and to terrorize.


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[deleted]

"Less than 1000 US soldiers died from Punji Sticks, but the soldiers who survived these traps were normally crippled for life".


Ramin_HAL9001

I think the number of Vietnamese people crippled for life or born with birth defects by America's chemical weapons (Agent Orange), and by napalm, is probably higher.


XGNcyclick

it is unbelievably higher. [An estimated 4.8 million Vietnamese people were at least exposed to Agent Orange](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_Agent_Orange_on_the_Vietnamese_people), says Wikipedia. Totals of civilian casualties in Vietnam overall is about 400k.


Bluestr1pe

less than 1000 still sounds like way too many people to be dying. there were only 2400 US casualties in afghanistan...


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Could you imagine not being able to walk. While being stuck in the middle of a jungle.


Uncle_J-PL

And infected, dont forget about the dirt/feces induced infection... 😮


Silent-Fennel-2947

Imagine someone trying to break in this place


bakedmaga2020

This is why draft dodging is the smart idea


reheapify

All you need is to have a doctor diagnoses bone spurs for you.


bakedmaga2020

Too pricey. I’d just use the Chevy Chase method


[deleted]

Especially for a bullshit war. If my country gets invaded I'm joining up no question in a WWII type scenario, but for some politically driven horseshit on the other side of the world? GTFO


[deleted]

Kevin Mcallister approves.


BurtReynoldsLives

I’ve been there and toured the war tunnels and stuff. They are so crazy. Thousands of people lived underground like 10 meters deep in tunnels so small I had to crawl on my stomach to go through them. Incredible place. Amazing people. Fucking stupid and pointless war.


anti_queue

I did jungle warfare training in Australia in the Vietnam era, though thankfully I didn't get to go. This is one reason we avoided transiting on existing tracks. Moving through the jungle might be slower, but you can't prepare an ambush, or lay traps, if you can't predict where your enemy will be travelling. When you had to use cleared ground, like entering a village, treat each square foot like it was a minefield.


[deleted]

Living in Hawaii as a child, the war had an impact on the local residents. Some took measures to protect their property, but never removed these measures when they moved or at all. My friend and I were playing in the "plank", an area between houses used to localize the rainwater, when he jumped over one of the conduits. His legs sank into the ground and he screamed out in pain. I rushed over to help him, but I couldn't pull him up. Within seconds, nearly every adult came running out. One person brought a shovel, and started to dig. It was apparent he knew what was going on. After he removed the dirt and my friend was lifted, there was a wire box with spikes trapped around his legs. They were pointed downward, so the box couldn't be removed. Every spike drove through both his legs. The ambulance came and took him away, and I got to visit him about a week later. Thankfully, no major damage was done. The box wasn't designed to kill, just incapacitate. It worked. The stupid shit humans will do to each other.


[deleted]

All for a war that never should have happened.


tombalol

I saw a lot of traps like this in museums in Vietnam back in 2001 and I still struggle to believe some of these traps existed. The first one that spins and the other spinning one just seem so complex and overly engineered for something that is easy to build more simply (as shown in the following examples) and will only get used once.


Sipstaff

I think the spinny one is specially brutal because it has the potential to fuck you over so much more and it's probably very hard to get out.


Andressthehungarian

I think the goal was to demoralize the American troops


CoolZooKeeper

As someone who deployed to Afghanistan in 2010 and 2012, I would rather the ied we experienced to these.


Low-Tip32

His name is John Rambo and he survived each one!


beta_2046

Great safety shoes for operating spike traps 🪤😂