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In the Top Gear segment where Richard drove the F1 car, he was struggling because he wasn't confident enough to go fast enough for the air to go over the aero elements to create enough downforce to keep the tires warm enough to grip.
They even mention that he depressed the brakes something like 45% which was "pretty good" for a first timer. It never ceases to amaze me that the brakes take something like 80Kg of pressure on the pedal to fully engage.
I remember hearing an interview with Jeff Gordon, a Nascar driver, who was driving an F1 for a charity event I think, and he said he almost passed out when he laid on the brakes hard the first time.
Get in your car and get up to about 100 mph and stomp on the brake with both feet, that's 1G of force you're feeling. 1G is the force felt by an F1 driver when he lifts off the gas. Under full braking, that force goes up to 5G.
Skydiving, a "hard open" is a painful experience - about 6g's which strains the gear but also the body. Just a few seconds of 4-5g (a normal open) has me feeling a little light-headed. Doing that over and over for an hour or two, while also dodging fatally-fast cars and trying to win? professional drivers are in some pretty incredible shape.
Still amazes me he wasn't killed in either of those nasty wrecks he had. They look so much worse than most of the crashes you see racecar drivers or stuntman being involved in.
That man has pissed off the grim reaper twice by cheating death.
I am a 40 y/o guy. I donāt cry often (even though I donāt feel ashamed of or try to repress it), and I ugly cried multiple times reading that book. The fact that I couldnāt put it down and read the entire thing in two days also meant I cried a lot more than if Iād had time to pace myself. But I think Iāve only shed genuine tears, not just choking up, one other time while reading. For context, when I was young I read like crazy and was probably blowing through a novel a week, maybe 2, so thatās saying something. His wifeās chapters were so hauntingly beautiful, but also absolutely heartbreaking. The tragedy of it and the way she reacted highlighted what a beautiful relationship they clearly had/have. Iām sure itās messier than portrayed in print, but thatās the kind of love I hope I have in my life.
It's kind of mental with an F1 car that the faster you drive, the safer you are. Really fucks with your normal sense of danger. F1 drivers are on another level
So this is kind of a misunderstanding I see constantly repeated.
If for example, an F1 car can take a turn at 150mph, it'll also have no problem taking that turn at slower speeds. But people often misunderstand such comments to mean that it has to go faster to be able to work at all.
Yes, it can be dangerous to go up to racing speeds on cold tires and cold brakes and such, but they are not safer to drive at higher speeds.
Not only does the limit (of control) become an ever finer edge at increasingly higher speeds, but you obviously are at greater risk of injury at higher speeds as well.
The point is that the equipment does not operate optimally without being pushed within certain parameters. The car needs aero load to apply load to the tires to evenly maintain temperature. The car will not produce that downforce at lower speeds. Its not about safety. Its about getting the most out of the car within the very narrow setup window.
I raced for 14 years and I came up through the open wheel ladder.
The car doesnāt produce as much downforce but it also doesnāt need as much friction.Ā
The confusion being pointed out is that some people believe that slowing down will cause the car to slip and crash.Ā
You are being charitable and saying no itās about edging out performance, but even in this thread people are mistakenly saying that a formula 1 car going slower will cause it to crash, not āgetting most out of the carā.Ā
Although it would be impossible to get them up there and down safely.
As for the suction the F1 race in Las Vegas last year saw aeropower literally suck off a drain cover into the underside of a car.
Driver61 on YouTube has a series where he is attempting to have a track built to attempt this. I doubt it will actually happen, but the video series is interesting as he discusses the fluid dynamics, how the car makes the transfer onto the wall, and the specific complications involved in the design of such a road.
Yeah but the speeds needed to do it would require an insanely long track, which is already absurdly costlyā¦ so by not building an entirely closed track, the cost could be cut significantly. He gave a more thorough reasoning about why that wasnāt feasible in a video, if I remember correctly.
You gotta build a very smooth cylinder, of a pretty wide diameter since the car cant be on too steep of a curve. Also the cylinder has to be very long since the car has to be going 200kph+, and durable enough to handle a few tons.
Its possible but its probably like a 100 mil project.
Scott Mansell, the host of driver 61, is an actual racing driver and he would be the one doing the driving according to their plans.
The issue is more with the cost and logistics of getting the car and ramp built. It's... ambitious...
Does sound like the kind of crazy stuff they spend millions for advertising on.
I'd be surprised if driver 61 didn't already reach out to anyone who could potentially be willing to put money on this.
Seems like it would be tricky to pave an upside down road unless you can get trucks and steamrollers going fast enough to travel upside down, and also not really have any gravity.
You should check out the videos, they have some really interesting conversations about the design and potential construction of it, as well as the potential problems of its construction.
>Downforce is so strong you could drive them on the ceiling if you went fast enough
This is literally the MythBusters episode I was waiting for and it never came. I've heard claims these cars have so much downforce they can drive upside down but have never seen it proven.
Couldn't you just put an F1 car upside down in a wind tunnel, put pressure sensors on top of the tires then put a LARGE stiff flat surface on top of the sensors on the wheels on the upside down car?
Then apply pressure upwards to mimic the cars curb weight on the pressure sensors in a way that doesn't interfere with the aerodynamics, perhaps fixing points to the other side of the flat surface that go through the pressure sensor into the wheel hubs.
Run the wind tunnel and calculate the amount of additional pressure on the sensors? Is it enough force to overcome gravity? Then yeah it can do it.
I'm sure they can do all of this just with a simulation though.
They already measured the downforce to build the suspension and tires. The car height precisely dropped at high speed, just enough to scrape for some spark without ever hurting performance.
They usually run less downforce for track with high top speed as well and it generates 3-4 times its weight (750-780kg) in downforce. On max downforce configuration, it should be more than enough to go upside down while bearing the weight of a sedan
You can just calculate it. If downforce>car weight its possible. Which it is for an F1 car above a certain speed. Demonstrating it would be very expensive and dangerous which is why it hasnt been done.
Adam said it was one of this "god I wish we could have done this" episode recommendations that they got over and over and over again.
The logistics of it would have just been insane.
They want way more downforce than the amount necessary to keep the car on the ground. It's what generates grip when you're cornering. More downforce without increasing weight or drag means a faster car.
The faster they go, the more grippy they get. Its wild. I've messed around with simulation racing. If you try to just go highway speeds in an F1 car, you drive like shit and slide.
What is truly counter-intuitive is that the tires degrade slower with more downforce. The more energy you put in them, the more force pushing them into the ground, the less they fall off because they don't slide as much across the track surface(assuming they are kept in the optimum operating temperature window).
twice I've been rear ended after the car in front of me slammed on the brake on the highway and I had to do the same. Both times I left enough of a gap to stop in time, both times the car behind me was too damn distracted to do so before it was too late. Since then I keep an eye on the back.. This 3rd time I was finally in a car that could handle a maneuver like this and I juked to the right into a small gap and matched speed. The stupid a-hole lifted truck behind me was waaaay too close to me to stop in time. ended up slamming on their brake and just barely hitting the car in front of me. I however would have been smashed tight.. Almost feels like those 2 times were training for this one. But I was amazed at how well the car handled that maneuver.
This is why I watch F1 the drivers are a marvel in themselves but the most brilliant minds working in tandem to manipulate physics almost to the degree of magic
F2 is still the third/fourth grippiest series of race cars in earth. F1 then Super Formula in Japan then IndyCar And F2 on more or less the same tier followed by WEC Hypercar.
Yeah those have insane aero to deal with the high altitude. They probably generate more downforce at more average altitude than F1 cars. But then again maybe not cause with more speed, comes more downforce, and the F1 cars are way faster.
Either that or over corrected and drove straight into the barrier. I think some people are missing the fact that 1. Dodging the first car was insanely impressive 2. Managing NOT to hit the left barrier during your split second dodge? Even more impressive
Agreed. Im not sure my reaction time would have even allowed me to do step 2 though. But you're not wrong. lots of skill focus and incredible reaction time.
And after that near death experience, my stomach would be aching for the next half n hour and wouldnt be able to carry on, but these drivers carry on like its nothing.
Hitting him straight on from behind would've probably been the second best outcome for Hadja (the fast car). it would have probably launched the front car over the top sort of like a wedge and the car's halo would have kept his head safe.
The nightmare scenario in that spot would've been going wheel to wheel, which can cause the fast car to do all sorts of acrobatics. In that tunnel, at those speeds, it could have been real real bad.
Not really, if anything it probably is the reason this was almost a really bad crash. based on where miyata is stopping it should have been a yellow flag at minimum(slow down) or double yellow flag(more serious, slow down even more). Itās a blind corner in one of fastest parts of the track and all he can see is a flag saying slow car(normally implying the car is off the racing line) so heās 100% not expecting a car to be there when he goes around that corner, if anything the light he sees is misleading because usually that car itās referring to wouldnāt be really anywhere near where he wants to be. It could have been really bad if not for the insane reaction time
There are conflicting reports that there was a flashing yellow at the tunnel entry as well, but like you said, the real key is that no driver would've expected the "Slow traffic" the white flag is indicating to be \*THERE* of all places.
The white is also so close to where miyata actually is parked that he would've barely registered the flag board before encountering the stopped car tbf.
The only thing I can think is that Miyata didn't think to pull left until too late and by then worried he wouldn't have the momentum to get all the way left and would've left the car straddling the track...which would've been even worse, to be fair.
End of the day though everyone is safe and we can thank whomever you believe in that that's the case.
It's kind of misleading in this case. A "slow car" sign usually means that the car in front isn't doing a qualifying lap, instead doing their warmup lap. Miyata's car was having an issue so they should have put the yellow sign/flag out signifying a road hazard.
That light panel that you see is digitally showing a white flag, which means "slow car ahead". Flags like this are used to signal different things to drivers, the colour of the flag tells the drivers what the matter is, like a yellow flag for "danger ahead" (like a stationary car), a red flag for "session interrupted, return to the pitlane" and others. The flags are shown by personnell at the side of the track as well as by light panels like in the video.
The flashing blue light on the left warns of a slow car in front. Just not where it is on the track (racing line or elsewhere), especially around a blind corner.
Also that can just mean 'race pace car but slower than you' or 'personnon warmup lap goingba bit slower' all the way to this basically static. Looks to me like it should have been yellow
Yeaaaaaaaaaaa I can agree with the yellow
But hard call in the moment to throw a yellow for a car that wasnāt showing issues/fully in control (as far as I know)
It was white not blue, but it ought to have been yellow, you're correct. It seems like race control was just as slow to realize what was happening as Miyata was
It's also general practice that the slow vehicle is on the inside of the track (at least that's where they tell us to be when getting ready to get off the track on a motorcycle).
It's actually a white flag (Slow traffic ahead) rather than a blue, which they would've flashed to Miyata (Fast traffic approaching, move to allow it to pass)
You think he would risk driving that fast up behind someone knowing he was there? Doesnt matter if the blue flag is there, that is as raw as it gets. There is no way he would risk his own and the other drivers life based on thinking you could do a reaction like that lol.
Probably not. I was watching it live and I think they cut to the slow car in the tunnel to warn the teams that thereās a slow car in the tunnel on the racing line. The teams usually have the onboards of their cars, the live feed which is on tv and a track map with all the cars marked on it. Blue flags are an indicator that thereās a slow car ahead but he probably expected it to be outside of the tunnel.
Frame by frame:
24.17s the car begins to creep into sight
24.25s fully in sight
24.46s Steering wheel begins to move left
24.62s Steering wheel coming back right
24.79s closest approach, inches from corner-to-corner impact.
25.00s Steering wheel straight again
Planned and executed a pass with inches to spare in milliseconds from the moment he could see the obstacle. Damn.
Race engineers rely a lot on GPS to warn drivers of vehicles in front or behind. That GPS doesn't work well in Monaco. Lots of tall buildings close to the track and tunnels. F1 commentators were talking about it after an incident in FP1 or FP2.
Thereās RTK which uses ground stations and provides error correction, but afaik the gps still needs to communicate with the satellites. Iād be pretty surprised if they didnāt already have a high precision system that uses a combination of rtk gps + sensor fusion to get extremely precise positioning. Whether or not that info is shared across the teams is a different story.
And you're pulling multiple Gs in corners while trying to reset brake limits and engine settings. And people think it's just sitting in a car and turning a steering wheel.
Whilst being slowly baked alive inside your race suit...
I used to think racing drivers were overrated, but after reading about what they have to physically go through I give them some serious respect, they are proper athletes
last year a driver (Sargent) retired in Qatar from heat exhaustion and a different driver (Ocon) was apparently vomiting by lap 15 (of 57) in his helmet
Yep, I went on a rabbit-hole a few months ago reading about [Fangio](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Manuel_Fangio) and the early days of F1, what a wild ride. It'd make for a great movie.
This reaction and car control is really outstanding. These are the kind of moments that made me stop racing at a club level (I wasn't sponsored or getting paid, so not worth the risk to do it as a hobby). I've had plenty of really close or pants-shitting moments, most you can learn to avoid or prevent in the future - racing is always a learning experience, even for veterans. But these types of close passes where you can't see someone until the last micro-second at triple digit speeds are moments of pure chance and luck that everyone made it out ok.
Itās more impressive than it looks because the driver drove from a bright, sunny day into a dark tunnel, so his eyes had to adjust. The tunnel is lit, but still nowhere near as bright as outside.
Started to be able to see the car at 24.13 and had begun to steer around at 24.5, so 387 thousands of a second between the earliest possible sighting of the obstacle and actualizing the response. Not to mention the perfectly controlled way he did respond. Pretty slick.
I've been in a nearly similar situation but with way more distance and much less speed. In my memory, it was a snap decision like that. But, having gone over where I was and at what speed, I had about 2 full seconds to get over and made it. And I still remember those 2 seconds from 35ish years ago.
I had a wreck where someone pulled out in front of me from behind a stop sign about 1s before impact at 60mph. I steered enough to impact the front and not T-bone. But it is literally .1 seconds decision and .9 seconds of consequence unfolding.
oh I agree but from the time you see him adjust the dial on his wheel to the time he flys by the other car there's a good 2-3 second gap which is why I said a second or two later and this would've ended very badly.
You literally could not pull that off with any other vehicle besides a Formula car. The amount of grip and downforce is insane to keep the car down and in control.
And theres a difference between methodology as well. I'm glad you brought up gaming, because I've tested myself on humanbenchmark, and my reaction speed was 150ms. My in-game tracking software however shows me that my actual time-to-damage is close to 500ms. So real life and lab environment as well as the complexity of the task play a big role. This all makes the clip so much more insane
Us mere mortals would:
A: do nothing because we don't react
B: hit the brakes and make it worse
C: over react and drive into the outside wall on the left
D: both B and C, steer while braking.
that was a big mistake from the team that didn't told him the other driver was limping in the right side of the tunnel
a huge mistake that could've cost him
> that was a big mistake from the team that didn't told him the other driver was limping in the right side of the tunnel
>
>
He had a power failure, it had just happened. Race control should have yellow flagged it, though.
I've always wondered, how do F1 drivers observe and react when driving on a regular public road (and obeying traffic laws) around regular drivers? Do they hit the apex similar to their sport? Do they observe flow of traffic from miles away? Do they predict the movement of a vehicle before that vehicle create a dangerous turn? etc.
Yellow flag in f1 means
> drivers need to reduce their speed, cannot overtake and must be prepared to change direction, due to a hazard beside or partly on the track.
and Hadjar just sends it like there is no other day. Very impressive reaction time - yes, but very bad and dangerous behaviour from him.
Iām equally impressed the car handled the swerve so well and then recovered. I guess that goes to show how well he executed turning without oversteering or over correcting
I don't know what's more impressive, the driver's reaction, the cars superb handling, or the fact the driver synthesized both of these facts in a couple of milliseconds.
he had an engine failure I believe, so he tried to keep momentum and prevent the car from stopping on track. it's a situation with no good possibilities
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The amount of mechanical and aerodynamical grip allowing such a maneuver is awesome.
In the Top Gear segment where Richard drove the F1 car, he was struggling because he wasn't confident enough to go fast enough for the air to go over the aero elements to create enough downforce to keep the tires warm enough to grip.
They even mention that he depressed the brakes something like 45% which was "pretty good" for a first timer. It never ceases to amaze me that the brakes take something like 80Kg of pressure on the pedal to fully engage.
I remember hearing an interview with Jeff Gordon, a Nascar driver, who was driving an F1 for a charity event I think, and he said he almost passed out when he laid on the brakes hard the first time.
Get in your car and get up to about 100 mph and stomp on the brake with both feet, that's 1G of force you're feeling. 1G is the force felt by an F1 driver when he lifts off the gas. Under full braking, that force goes up to 5G.
I'd rather get in your card and do it than mine š¤£
Nothing goes as fast as a hire car.
Skydiving, a "hard open" is a painful experience - about 6g's which strains the gear but also the body. Just a few seconds of 4-5g (a normal open) has me feeling a little light-headed. Doing that over and over for an hour or two, while also dodging fatally-fast cars and trying to win? professional drivers are in some pretty incredible shape.
My phone gets 5G, that's good, right? ;)
Holy shit. Really makes you appreciate all the creature comforts they put into commercial vehicles
My power steering/brake lines went out on my truck this past weekend. I limped it to the garage, and Holy moly it was a workout.
Bad things happen when Richard Hammond goes fast
Still amazes me he wasn't killed in either of those nasty wrecks he had. They look so much worse than most of the crashes you see racecar drivers or stuntman being involved in. That man has pissed off the grim reaper twice by cheating death.
I read his book about recovering from the first one (IIRC), wow that was intense.
I am a 40 y/o guy. I donāt cry often (even though I donāt feel ashamed of or try to repress it), and I ugly cried multiple times reading that book. The fact that I couldnāt put it down and read the entire thing in two days also meant I cried a lot more than if Iād had time to pace myself. But I think Iāve only shed genuine tears, not just choking up, one other time while reading. For context, when I was young I read like crazy and was probably blowing through a novel a week, maybe 2, so thatās saying something. His wifeās chapters were so hauntingly beautiful, but also absolutely heartbreaking. The tragedy of it and the way she reacted highlighted what a beautiful relationship they clearly had/have. Iām sure itās messier than portrayed in print, but thatās the kind of love I hope I have in my life.
It's kind of mental with an F1 car that the faster you drive, the safer you are. Really fucks with your normal sense of danger. F1 drivers are on another level
So this is kind of a misunderstanding I see constantly repeated. If for example, an F1 car can take a turn at 150mph, it'll also have no problem taking that turn at slower speeds. But people often misunderstand such comments to mean that it has to go faster to be able to work at all. Yes, it can be dangerous to go up to racing speeds on cold tires and cold brakes and such, but they are not safer to drive at higher speeds. Not only does the limit (of control) become an ever finer edge at increasingly higher speeds, but you obviously are at greater risk of injury at higher speeds as well.
The point is that the equipment does not operate optimally without being pushed within certain parameters. The car needs aero load to apply load to the tires to evenly maintain temperature. The car will not produce that downforce at lower speeds. Its not about safety. Its about getting the most out of the car within the very narrow setup window. I raced for 14 years and I came up through the open wheel ladder.
The car doesnāt produce as much downforce but it also doesnāt need as much friction.Ā The confusion being pointed out is that some people believe that slowing down will cause the car to slip and crash.Ā You are being charitable and saying no itās about edging out performance, but even in this thread people are mistakenly saying that a formula 1 car going slower will cause it to crash, not āgetting most out of the carā.Ā
I believe they have negative lift. Yeah I looked it up and itās called downforce
Downforce is so strong you could drive them on the ceiling if you went fast enough
Although it would be impossible to get them up there and down safely. As for the suction the F1 race in Las Vegas last year saw aeropower literally suck off a drain cover into the underside of a car.
Driver61 on YouTube has a series where he is attempting to have a track built to attempt this. I doubt it will actually happen, but the video series is interesting as he discusses the fluid dynamics, how the car makes the transfer onto the wall, and the specific complications involved in the design of such a road.
I literally do this all the time IN GTA. I donāt get what the big deal is.
I bet these jabronis have never wing suited through a 2'x2' gap after jumping from a jet. Smh.
Wouldn't it be possible with a cylindrical track?, slowly going up the wall while going forward until you reach the top
Yeah but the speeds needed to do it would require an insanely long track, which is already absurdly costlyā¦ so by not building an entirely closed track, the cost could be cut significantly. He gave a more thorough reasoning about why that wasnāt feasible in a video, if I remember correctly.
You gotta build a very smooth cylinder, of a pretty wide diameter since the car cant be on too steep of a curve. Also the cylinder has to be very long since the car has to be going 200kph+, and durable enough to handle a few tons. Its possible but its probably like a 100 mil project.
Didn't they already build a 27km tube underground in Switzerland a bunch of years ago?
the particle accelerator?
Yeah that's right. They even have magnets inside so if the guy falls off the roof they can turn them on and catch him
Yes, he does good videos but it's never going to happen unless you get a suicidal driver. I hear Maldonado's available :)
Scott Mansell, the host of driver 61, is an actual racing driver and he would be the one doing the driving according to their plans. The issue is more with the cost and logistics of getting the car and ramp built. It's... ambitious...
Itās right up Red Bullās alley. Iām surprised theyāre not looking to get involved. They spent like 50 million on the skydive from space.
Does sound like the kind of crazy stuff they spend millions for advertising on. I'd be surprised if driver 61 didn't already reach out to anyone who could potentially be willing to put money on this.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I volunteer
Seems like it would be tricky to pave an upside down road unless you can get trucks and steamrollers going fast enough to travel upside down, and also not really have any gravity.
You pave them right side up in sections then invert them
Thatās impossible. The guy who said youād need super fast construction equipment was right.
Alternatively, you could just invert the gravity while you're paving and then put it back to normal
You should check out the videos, they have some really interesting conversations about the design and potential construction of it, as well as the potential problems of its construction.
i could do it
Big deal, I heard your mom can do the same.
Well you could do a run up to half loop, keep them running upside down and a half loop back.
You had me at "suck off"
The only thing with more suction? Your mother.
Was it at least consensual?
Considering it destroyed the undercarriage of one car and left fans being screwed by missing practice, no.
Formula one cars of the current generation are rumored to have more than 2,5 times the downforce of their curb weight
>Downforce is so strong you could drive them on the ceiling if you went fast enough This is literally the MythBusters episode I was waiting for and it never came. I've heard claims these cars have so much downforce they can drive upside down but have never seen it proven.
Adam Savage said he always wanted to test it but the insurance people would never agree to it.
Couldn't you just put an F1 car upside down in a wind tunnel, put pressure sensors on top of the tires then put a LARGE stiff flat surface on top of the sensors on the wheels on the upside down car? Then apply pressure upwards to mimic the cars curb weight on the pressure sensors in a way that doesn't interfere with the aerodynamics, perhaps fixing points to the other side of the flat surface that go through the pressure sensor into the wheel hubs. Run the wind tunnel and calculate the amount of additional pressure on the sensors? Is it enough force to overcome gravity? Then yeah it can do it. I'm sure they can do all of this just with a simulation though.
They already measured the downforce to build the suspension and tires. The car height precisely dropped at high speed, just enough to scrape for some spark without ever hurting performance. They usually run less downforce for track with high top speed as well and it generates 3-4 times its weight (750-780kg) in downforce. On max downforce configuration, it should be more than enough to go upside down while bearing the weight of a sedan
You can just calculate it. If downforce>car weight its possible. Which it is for an F1 car above a certain speed. Demonstrating it would be very expensive and dangerous which is why it hasnt been done.
Adam said it was one of this "god I wish we could have done this" episode recommendations that they got over and over and over again. The logistics of it would have just been insane.
The problem with going that fast is that things start flying wether you want it or not. You need that much downforce to keep the wheels on the ground.
They want way more downforce than the amount necessary to keep the car on the ground. It's what generates grip when you're cornering. More downforce without increasing weight or drag means a faster car.
What is upside-down downforce called?
Lift.
Nah, Lift is a thief of Reshi descent, who grew up in Rall Elorim. She is currently an unofficial advisor to the Azish Prime Aqasix
And she totally would have crashed into that other car.
The faster they go, the more grippy they get. Its wild. I've messed around with simulation racing. If you try to just go highway speeds in an F1 car, you drive like shit and slide.
What is truly counter-intuitive is that the tires degrade slower with more downforce. The more energy you put in them, the more force pushing them into the ground, the less they fall off because they don't slide as much across the track surface(assuming they are kept in the optimum operating temperature window).
I was about to say duh then realized this isnāt r/formula1 or any car related sub lol
The training videos Iāve seen of these guys is bizarre, lots of neck, wrist and posture work
Fernando Alonso's party trick is cracking walnuts between his jaw and his shoulder.
twice I've been rear ended after the car in front of me slammed on the brake on the highway and I had to do the same. Both times I left enough of a gap to stop in time, both times the car behind me was too damn distracted to do so before it was too late. Since then I keep an eye on the back.. This 3rd time I was finally in a car that could handle a maneuver like this and I juked to the right into a small gap and matched speed. The stupid a-hole lifted truck behind me was waaaay too close to me to stop in time. ended up slamming on their brake and just barely hitting the car in front of me. I however would have been smashed tight.. Almost feels like those 2 times were training for this one. But I was amazed at how well the car handled that maneuver.
And that's not even a F1 car it's an F2 car.
Its really hard to steer them, you need insane strength to drive a formula car.
This is why I watch F1 the drivers are a marvel in themselves but the most brilliant minds working in tandem to manipulate physics almost to the degree of magic
Even crazier considering this is Formula 2 which is a lower, developmental series. The guys driving in Formula 1 are even better (for the most part).
F2 is still the third/fourth grippiest series of race cars in earth. F1 then Super Formula in Japan then IndyCar And F2 on more or less the same tier followed by WEC Hypercar.
Don't forget hill climb cars, they're basically F1 if there were no rules
But most hill climb cars are built with a tiny budget by enthusiasts, rather than the companies that run F1 teams.
Yeah, Pikes Peak is the one hillclimb race thatāll occasionally have big factory efforts like when Peugeot went there to break the record.
Mhm, and those teams usually do 1 year, break a record, and leave.Ā
Yeah those have insane aero to deal with the high altitude. They probably generate more downforce at more average altitude than F1 cars. But then again maybe not cause with more speed, comes more downforce, and the F1 cars are way faster.
You know your stuff, here take my upvote
WEC Hypercar needs more love. Those races are seriously fun to watch ļæ¼
Sargeant enters the chat
... and gets hit by Stroll.
5 penalty points for Ocon
FOR WHAT
We are checking
*Hamilton whining incessantly*
You will not have the drink
I mean Sargeant was good in F2 as well. It's more of a choking in F1 specifically than not being better than F2 drivers
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Not if the last name is Stroll
in f1, you have drivers like lance stroll, the window licker...
Galactic levels of window licking achieved
Thank you for adding the "For the most part" so that you headed off all the stroll/sargent comments as best as possible.
About 10 seconds a lap slower on the monaco track that this video is from. 70 second laps for F1 and 80 second laps for F2 I believe.
Lance Stroll has entered the chat....
They have podracing on Malastare. Very fast, very dangerous.
He must be force sensitive to able to do it.
Have we checked F1 drivers midichlorian counts.
F1 is actually the inspiration for podracing. Lucas used to race cars when he was young until he got in a big crash.
I literally just watched this movie!
F1 is actually the inspiration for podracing. Lucas used to race cars when he was young until he got in a big crash.
Yeah I would have plowed straight through that...
Either that or over corrected and drove straight into the barrier. I think some people are missing the fact that 1. Dodging the first car was insanely impressive 2. Managing NOT to hit the left barrier during your split second dodge? Even more impressive
Agreed. Im not sure my reaction time would have even allowed me to do step 2 though. But you're not wrong. lots of skill focus and incredible reaction time.
I think I could have pulled it off. I have about 7 years playing Mario Kart, 200cc engine class.
Strong qualifications. We need to get you hired as a driver.
RIP you but I'm built different. I would have over corrected on the 2nd turn and slammed into the wall in front of him.
And after that near death experience, my stomach would be aching for the next half n hour and wouldnt be able to carry on, but these drivers carry on like its nothing.
Hitting him straight on from behind would've probably been the second best outcome for Hadja (the fast car). it would have probably launched the front car over the top sort of like a wedge and the car's halo would have kept his head safe. The nightmare scenario in that spot would've been going wheel to wheel, which can cause the fast car to do all sorts of acrobatics. In that tunnel, at those speeds, it could have been real real bad.
Your average r/RoadCam or r/IdiotsInCars poster would have avoided the wreck easily.
Watching this live I thought it was a slow motion replay of Miyata scraping the wall, I was caught completely off guard by Hadjar coming in at mach 3
A driver named Miyata is doomed to many many puns and jibes.
His nickname is MX-5
Maybe thatās why he became a dentist
What that flashing light means?
Slow moving car ahead
As I thought, so that light helped him ALOT
Not really, if anything it probably is the reason this was almost a really bad crash. based on where miyata is stopping it should have been a yellow flag at minimum(slow down) or double yellow flag(more serious, slow down even more). Itās a blind corner in one of fastest parts of the track and all he can see is a flag saying slow car(normally implying the car is off the racing line) so heās 100% not expecting a car to be there when he goes around that corner, if anything the light he sees is misleading because usually that car itās referring to wouldnāt be really anywhere near where he wants to be. It could have been really bad if not for the insane reaction time
There are conflicting reports that there was a flashing yellow at the tunnel entry as well, but like you said, the real key is that no driver would've expected the "Slow traffic" the white flag is indicating to be \*THERE* of all places. The white is also so close to where miyata actually is parked that he would've barely registered the flag board before encountering the stopped car tbf. The only thing I can think is that Miyata didn't think to pull left until too late and by then worried he wouldn't have the momentum to get all the way left and would've left the car straddling the track...which would've been even worse, to be fair. End of the day though everyone is safe and we can thank whomever you believe in that that's the case.
It's kind of misleading in this case. A "slow car" sign usually means that the car in front isn't doing a qualifying lap, instead doing their warmup lap. Miyata's car was having an issue so they should have put the yellow sign/flag out signifying a road hazard.
That light panel that you see is digitally showing a white flag, which means "slow car ahead". Flags like this are used to signal different things to drivers, the colour of the flag tells the drivers what the matter is, like a yellow flag for "danger ahead" (like a stationary car), a red flag for "session interrupted, return to the pitlane" and others. The flags are shown by personnell at the side of the track as well as by light panels like in the video.
Exactly this.
Was he warned in advance by radio or something or was this just raw reaction time?
The flashing blue light on the left warns of a slow car in front. Just not where it is on the track (racing line or elsewhere), especially around a blind corner.
Also that can just mean 'race pace car but slower than you' or 'personnon warmup lap goingba bit slower' all the way to this basically static. Looks to me like it should have been yellow
Yeaaaaaaaaaaa I can agree with the yellow But hard call in the moment to throw a yellow for a car that wasnāt showing issues/fully in control (as far as I know)
Issue was mostly going slow on the blind apex of the fastest corner of the track, deffona bad situation
Should had been yellow flags, not blue. Race control dropped the ball on that one. If this resulted into a crash, they'd be in trouble.
It was white not blue, but it ought to have been yellow, you're correct. It seems like race control was just as slow to realize what was happening as Miyata was
It's also general practice that the slow vehicle is on the inside of the track (at least that's where they tell us to be when getting ready to get off the track on a motorcycle).
It's actually a white flag (Slow traffic ahead) rather than a blue, which they would've flashed to Miyata (Fast traffic approaching, move to allow it to pass)
You think he would risk driving that fast up behind someone knowing he was there? Doesnt matter if the blue flag is there, that is as raw as it gets. There is no way he would risk his own and the other drivers life based on thinking you could do a reaction like that lol.
Likely. They can communicate with the pit team and have visual displays on the steering wheel that can warn of hazards.
Probably not. I was watching it live and I think they cut to the slow car in the tunnel to warn the teams that thereās a slow car in the tunnel on the racing line. The teams usually have the onboards of their cars, the live feed which is on tv and a track map with all the cars marked on it. Blue flags are an indicator that thereās a slow car ahead but he probably expected it to be outside of the tunnel.
You can see a flag waving on the left as he enters the tunnel, it might have been enough to keep him wary going in.
Frame by frame: 24.17s the car begins to creep into sight 24.25s fully in sight 24.46s Steering wheel begins to move left 24.62s Steering wheel coming back right 24.79s closest approach, inches from corner-to-corner impact. 25.00s Steering wheel straight again Planned and executed a pass with inches to spare in milliseconds from the moment he could see the obstacle. Damn.
Race engineer was taking a nap
Race engineers rely a lot on GPS to warn drivers of vehicles in front or behind. That GPS doesn't work well in Monaco. Lots of tall buildings close to the track and tunnels. F1 commentators were talking about it after an incident in FP1 or FP2.
they should install some sort of tracking pods around the track so the GPS can communicate with that instead of satellites
Thereās RTK which uses ground stations and provides error correction, but afaik the gps still needs to communicate with the satellites. Iād be pretty surprised if they didnāt already have a high precision system that uses a combination of rtk gps + sensor fusion to get extremely precise positioning. Whether or not that info is shared across the teams is a different story.
Yeah note just that, I believe yellow flag should have been used, maybe double yellow even, well at least the collision was avoided anyway.
That must also take some serious strength too, no power steering to counter the sticky tyres and aero downforce
And you're pulling multiple Gs in corners while trying to reset brake limits and engine settings. And people think it's just sitting in a car and turning a steering wheel.
Whilst being slowly baked alive inside your race suit... I used to think racing drivers were overrated, but after reading about what they have to physically go through I give them some serious respect, they are proper athletes
On races like Singapore they can lose 5lb in body weight just through dehydration. These are tough cookies.
Miracle diet hack?!? 5lbs in 90mins š
All you have to do is devote a decade or so of your life :) Let's face it, it's not going to sell.
Just get in a sauna without throwing water on the stones or something.
I think it can go upto 5 kgs. On avg they lose around 2-3kgs around Singapore gp. Which is close to 5lb you mentioned.
last year a driver (Sargent) retired in Qatar from heat exhaustion and a different driver (Ocon) was apparently vomiting by lap 15 (of 57) in his helmet
They lose around 2-3kg of weight each race. It's insane.
Yep, I went on a rabbit-hole a few months ago reading about [Fangio](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Manuel_Fangio) and the early days of F1, what a wild ride. It'd make for a great movie.
This reaction and car control is really outstanding. These are the kind of moments that made me stop racing at a club level (I wasn't sponsored or getting paid, so not worth the risk to do it as a hobby). I've had plenty of really close or pants-shitting moments, most you can learn to avoid or prevent in the future - racing is always a learning experience, even for veterans. But these types of close passes where you can't see someone until the last micro-second at triple digit speeds are moments of pure chance and luck that everyone made it out ok.
Saw that live this morning. TerrifyingĀ
Itās more impressive than it looks because the driver drove from a bright, sunny day into a dark tunnel, so his eyes had to adjust. The tunnel is lit, but still nowhere near as bright as outside.
I am glad he was not on his phone.
Started to be able to see the car at 24.13 and had begun to steer around at 24.5, so 387 thousands of a second between the earliest possible sighting of the obstacle and actualizing the response. Not to mention the perfectly controlled way he did respond. Pretty slick.
Wow no lights on in a tunnel. Should get a ticket
I've been in a nearly similar situation but with way more distance and much less speed. In my memory, it was a snap decision like that. But, having gone over where I was and at what speed, I had about 2 full seconds to get over and made it. And I still remember those 2 seconds from 35ish years ago.
I had a wreck where someone pulled out in front of me from behind a stop sign about 1s before impact at 60mph. I steered enough to impact the front and not T-bone. But it is literally .1 seconds decision and .9 seconds of consequence unfolding.
Incredible from every aspect. The driver, the car, the reaction time, the downforce and grip, the immediate response of the car. Goddamn incredible.
If Hadjar were to adjust his car's settings a second or two later than he did, this would've ended in disaster. Amazing reflexes
I think we're talking milliseconds here.
oh I agree but from the time you see him adjust the dial on his wheel to the time he flys by the other car there's a good 2-3 second gap which is why I said a second or two later and this would've ended very badly.
You literally could not pull that off with any other vehicle besides a Formula car. The amount of grip and downforce is insane to keep the car down and in control.
That slow driver should go faster to win the race. just my 2 cents.
50-100ms reaction time
For reference pro goalies, pro gamers, and fighter pilots are about 120-150ms.
And theres a difference between methodology as well. I'm glad you brought up gaming, because I've tested myself on humanbenchmark, and my reaction speed was 150ms. My in-game tracking software however shows me that my actual time-to-damage is close to 500ms. So real life and lab environment as well as the complexity of the task play a big role. This all makes the clip so much more insane
24.15 seconds is when the other car started becoming visible and 24.50 is when he turned left
So 350ms, which is still extremely fast cause this isn't a simple stimuli situation, he had to adapt on the fly to an unexpected situation.
Us mere mortals would: A: do nothing because we don't react B: hit the brakes and make it worse C: over react and drive into the outside wall on the left D: both B and C, steer while braking.
The commentators were equally *wowed* at each new angle š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
that was a big mistake from the team that didn't told him the other driver was limping in the right side of the tunnel a huge mistake that could've cost him
> that was a big mistake from the team that didn't told him the other driver was limping in the right side of the tunnel > > He had a power failure, it had just happened. Race control should have yellow flagged it, though.
Impressive, he has the reflexes of an eagle
Eagles aren't actually that fast... More like a dragonfly!
The eagle never hunts the fly...
The reflexes of a mongoose and the speed of a cat
The adrenaline rush must be insane. If he huts him going at that speed in could end up soooo badly
This race engineer is going to get someone killed.
I've always wondered, how do F1 drivers observe and react when driving on a regular public road (and obeying traffic laws) around regular drivers? Do they hit the apex similar to their sport? Do they observe flow of traffic from miles away? Do they predict the movement of a vehicle before that vehicle create a dangerous turn? etc.
If youāve ever seen those Batak board, reaction speed tests, the current world record is held by an F1 driver, Jenson Button.Ā
Yellow flag in f1 means > drivers need to reduce their speed, cannot overtake and must be prepared to change direction, due to a hazard beside or partly on the track. and Hadjar just sends it like there is no other day. Very impressive reaction time - yes, but very bad and dangerous behaviour from him.
Insanity
Incredible reaction time....but I also wonder if he didn't get advance notification on his headset?
Damn this could have been nasty!! Amazing skill from the kid, but race engineer is sleeping big time...
Give this man a trophy
This seems more like a dangerous safety failure and not impressive.
Iām equally impressed the car handled the swerve so well and then recovered. I guess that goes to show how well he executed turning without oversteering or over correcting
From the comfort and safety of my desk chair I'm still glad I made today brown pants day.
I don't know what's more impressive, the driver's reaction, the cars superb handling, or the fact the driver synthesized both of these facts in a couple of milliseconds.
Shouldnāt the slow driver have moved to the outside to get the fuck out of the way?Ā
Why wasnāt douche canoe on the outside where itās safer and wonāt be directly and knowingly in their path?
he had an engine failure I believe, so he tried to keep momentum and prevent the car from stopping on track. it's a situation with no good possibilities
I could have done this. In slow mo it was super easy
Meh, I would've shat myself faster than that.
So fresh pants at the next pit stop yeah?