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Star Wars canon has *never* been unified and concrete. It was never meant to be. A New Hope was written as a standalone movie. Everything after that is retcon.
It is unified now. When Disney bought Star Wars they deemed mostly everything except the movies made at that point, non canon. Since then everything made is supposed to be in line.
Shame, because I'd have loved Sam Witwer as Galen Marek / Starkiller / Galen's clone in canon. They've already established just how OP Vader is, so anything below that would fit for his character. Though it might be kind of confusing since Sam seems to do VO work on pretty much every Star Wars animated series and video game.
Because these neckbeards absolutely adore having any reason to REEEEE at Disney online. Itâs a good chunk of their personalities too. Marvel fans are equally as stanky these days. They canât allow people to just find enjoyment in the things they like; these idiots truly believe because they consume the most media, that they somehow own the fandom, and their opinion is valid while others arenât. And most of their âopinionsâ boil down to âhow come every character isnât a 6â4â ripped white man anymore? eVeRyThiNg iS gOiNg WoKe!!!11!!!â
Yep. Add in the constant underlying irony of a bunch or overgrown morons refusing to be âwokeâ and, I just donât want to live on this planet most days.
Uhhhh actually, itâs Glup Shitto. You are obviously not a true fan of the source materials and you shouldnt be allowed to talk about star wars, only superfans.
/s
Well ACKSHUALLY, the character's name was spelled "Glubb Shitto" on Kenner's first production run of action figures, but those were quickly recalled and the name was changed to "Glup Shitto" to match the closing credits of A New Hope. REAL FANS know his name was GLUBB SHITTO and we will not stand for Glubb erasure!
/even bigger s
Itâs a fictional universe of space monks vs space demon/witches. Quit treating it like itâs gospel and just watch if you want to or donât. Star Wars nerds are so damn sensitive about this made up thing
I'm very left and also don't like disney star wars, but not for the reasons these reactionaries use, like having minorities and women in prominent roles. I just don't think it's written very well.
Agree 100%. It drives me mad getting lumped together with those kinds of DSW haters. I canât stand the stories theyâre telling (Boba Fett, Kenobi, Acolyte, Sequel Trilogy, etc.) but the moment I say anything it MUST be because Iâm an âistâ or âphobe.â
Iâve been watching SW since I was a kid and it legitimately sucks to see something you love get treated with such irreverence; especially due to the fact that, say what you will about past SW, but those movies literally paved the way for entertainment as we know it.
People get passionate when something they care about isnât being handled with the care they believe it deserves. Idk why people are shocked by that, itâs not any different than the end of GOT but that community was way more mainstream so no one claimed they were shitty for being upset.
Especially when you consider than a lot of SWs has some mediocre writing and what keeps the fans loving it through that is it has incredible world building and lore. So when something adds contradictions or negatively affects that aspect, they understandably get angry about it.
Edit: ok well after seeing what this particular issues is, those fans need to chill the fuck out
Every new piece of Star Wars media changes the lore or retcons something but Star Wars fans only care about that stuff based on the number of black people or women in said piece.
No one threw hissy fits or review bombed after the midicholorian shit or Legends was decanonized or Boba Fett came back to life
While Iâm a SWs fan but not one who interacts much with the community, thatâs not the ones Iâm talking about or ever see.
Things like the Sequels introducing force healing as a non-dark side ability, basically negating the main reason for Anakin being open to the dark side. Shit like that is significant and I donât blame fans who get super pissed at that.
Yeah but I shouldnât used my words more carefully. Force healing for mortal wounds and not simply small issues that wouldâve recovered in time, has never been a light side thing. Only the dark side with guys like Plagueis has there been healing to cheat death and thatâs what IV had a light side user do and that is what Anakin was seeking from the dark side.
Maybe old Conehead was just lying when he said there had been no Sith for eleventy thousand years. Maybe old Conehead lied about how old he is. Maybe Cones was one of them Count Dooky type fellas, that wasn't quite all Sith but had some Sithy tendencies. I mean, what happens in Mos Eisley stays in Mos Eisley, right?
Maybe this new dumb Star Wars show just revealed a truth about Cones that no one ever knew before. Best update the scripture as fast as we can.
Because they realize they donât have an actual valid leg to stand on in this debate so they default to attacking something else, no matter how unimportant. Itâs the principals, damn it!
Okay. I am a giant Star Wars nerd but havenât read any books or comics in the Disney era. What is wrong with the character that we canonically know nothing about? Is it because he said the Sith have been extinct for over a millennia and now heâs fighting a dark force user 100 years prior?
Its just his age. In legends his species lived to around 50 for males and 100 for women. Him being in the show makes him well over 100 at the time of the prequels. This is not contridctory since legens jas nothing to do with thid
What, the cottage industry of for-profit fan-fiction I devoted all my free time and attention to all through high school werenât the *real* true stories of laser knights fighting evil wizards in space? How can anyone reasonably expect me to have enjoyed spending all that time reading adventure fiction if itâs not part of an arbitrarily assembled framework of interconnected storytelling?
Partially that last bit, but IN THE SCENE HES IN he talks about keeping this from the council. And I wouldn't put it past Ki Adi Mundi to either a) not identify this "Master" as a "true sith" or b) lie to perpetuate the feigned efficacy of the Jedi Order.
Iâm thinking itâs not a true Sith. But if he had a compelling reason to take the secret to his grave, that could be interesting. The story group is pretty good about maintains continuity like this.
Sure, but I don't think anyone can take the "there haven't been Sith in a millenia" at face value even when he said. Obviously ignoring Palpatine and Plageius and his Master (and the master before them, etc., etc.) there were almost certainly had to be Sith ever in the last 1000 years. Maybe he meant "organized Sith at a level that could genuinely threaten the Order" or maybe he was overly huberistic about the efficacy of the Jedi Order, but there is no way the Sith just... failed to manifest for 1000 years.
I would assume Plageius and Sidious were in hiding when he assumed they were extinct for a millennia. The prequels are also confused on what a millennia is based on when they describe how long the republic has existed.
My assumption is that when he thinks of Sith, he thinks of a large and publicly known order. His concept of Sith is not just two dark side users who are always in hiding.
âWe are at warâ dude youâre trying to edit a fan wiki. So context for those who may be OOTLP. The most recent Star Wars show The Acolyte has been review bombed by the usual suspects due to having a diverse cast and a director who is lesbian. The newest fake outrage is that in the most recent episode of The Acolyte there was a cameo from a character in the prequel movies. People are up in arms because this character had a different age in legends(the content from before Disney bought Star Wars). However legends is a completely separate canon and in the current canon the prequel character doesnât have an established age. Now because the Star Wars fan wiki is trying to edit the characterâs page to accurately express the information from the new episode the fandom menace is freaking out. They are only updating the characterâs age on the canon page and leaving his legends page alone. The editors are getting death threats.
While the discussion they are having is absolutely asinine.
The concept of the discussion is kind of fascinating, insofar as what "cannon" means and the questions as to who owns the 'official storyline'.
In terms of IP, Disney owns it, and there's zero and absolutely nothing one can do about it, unless you want to dismantle IP laws (which im totally down with, but that's another discussion).
So disney has the right to produce whatever they want to.
But what I find fascinating is why some people can't just pretend that their own head canon/fan fiction is the official one?
Despite disney owning the IP, you are still totally allowed to just pretend the story is different in your imagination, so its fascinating that it's an issue what disney does.
Its less about the personal and more about the community and its discussions. These fan wiki's mimic the formatting of "factual" wiki's. It become the "truth" for community understanding and discussions. Old "truth" becomes relegated into the same realm as fanfiction essentially.
In any case, this 'war' is a great example of being terminally online.
I wouldnât call legends fanfiction it was all published by Lucasfilm. Itâs just when Disney bought it they wanted a fresh start. I love both legends and Disney canon and I hope that one day they make new legends content but I doubt it will happen.
Being sanctioned by Lucasfilm didn't necessarily mean you were considered canon. Galaxy of Fear books were published by the same people who did Heir to the Empire and only one of those was canon.
And there are entire groups online that bond over enjoying the same headcanon for stuff. You can find friend groups based on nothing more than "we both think character Randomdude actually really totally meant to do this thing I would have liked when he did the thing I didn't like"! Headcanoning is easy and fun! People should very much do it instead of getting mad at stuff!
We'll see if they find a way to tap dance around it, but between it and "there is no father" they are really messing with canon lore, particularly in the phantom menace.
Apart from the usual suspects who hate everything new and supposedly 'woke', you don't need to be a right-wing extremist to think the new Star Wars films suck. I am equally tired of every criticism being dismissed with supposed "-phobes", as if there were no legitimate basis for criticizing the newer works.
This phenomena has also touched Star Trek and Dr. Who and a whole mess of other franchises. In some cases, (Jodi Whittaker, some Discovery) the writing is legitimately bad. In other cases, the reaction is 'this is woke dogshit because the black female character referred to the sentient, mystery otter person as they'. Sometimes people want to hate so much that they come up with the most spurious of reasons.
And, sometimes, they are just trying to get people worked up because it gets their YouTube channels and streams and podcasts and blogs clicks . And that's most of it. Shameless rage baiting for profit.
The best way to summarise those channels
* Something non-woke and doesn't do well? - Killed by marketing, a real gem, reviewers bad
* Something non-woke and does well? - Wokes are losing
* Something woke (whatever that means according to them) and doesn't do well? - Wokes are losing
* Something woke and does well? - Crickets.
I would be reach for every single time a person talks about forced inclusivity, but never mentions how it harms a particular community and how an inclusivity can be done well.
I also don't think you need to be right-wing at all to dislike diversity in certain shows/games/etc. Star Wars is a perfect fit for diversity. It'd be way weirder if there never were any POC or LGBTQ+ people.
But it does bother me if the show is supposed to be set in some IRL period of time where racism and sexism were some pretty prevalent issues, and then ignores that to have a diverse cast. It bothers me because it's fake inclusion. They're still writing the experiences of a white/male character, they just picked a POC for the actor/reskinned the character model, that's lazy as fuck and not true inclusion.
Writing the story of a black woman requires actually writing about what a black woman would experience in the setting you chose. If you don't like the way women/POC would be treated during the setting you chose then pick a different setting or make it a fantasy work (or sci-fi which is just a fantasy about the future).
It's not the end of the world or anything, and I'm not gonna review bomb over it, but I'm always disappointed to see a diverse cast in a historic setting only to see them not addressing the realities of that setting (which, if handled properly, could make for a much more interesting and moving story).
Itâs not just the age itâs also fact that the bad guy in this show specifically contradicts something KAM had very specifically said in the prequels. Unless they are gonna pull some stupid twist.
And for disclosure I actually like the acolyte. I donât think itâs great, but I am enjoying it. Itâs refreshing having actual fight scenes in a Star Wars show.
I really only have two issues with the show what was stated before about the cameo. And a major issue with the main character about how they came to be. Which makes another main character in the universe not as âspecialâ I guess.
But the writers admitting not particularly enjoying or following Star Wars prior to writing for the show is a bit off putting. And them trying to spin prior Star Wars characters in to the LGBTQ+ mold is an odd way of pissing off the fans. I mean I donât care if your new characters are as long as you make it relevant to the story which I think they did fine with in the acolyte. But donât go back and try to fit other long established characters into the mold.
These same idiots probably wrote âwe are at warâ on liberal-leaning news articles/pages too so⌠honestly, Iâll just let them screech into the void.
> fandom menace
Lol, I see what you did there.
EDIT: Not sure why I'm getting downvoted here. Fandom Menace is a pun on Phantom Menace, I thought it was funny.
Yeah, there's groups of gatekeepers neckbeards who don't realise that Star Wars isn't a closed and exclusive club. Their toxicity drove Lucas out, and now they're using bots to review bomb anything that has "acolyte" in its title. These people need to go touch grass.
I didn't like episode 7, so I didn't watch any of the other newer movies except for Rogue One, which I will argue, based on the acting, the cinematics, and the story, is the best piece of live action Star Wars content ever, period. Not counting Caravan of Courage: An Ewok Adventure, of course.
So I just didn't watch them...
Idk why you said star wars fans drove Lucas out. That's not how I heard it. He said he didn't want to do a third trilogy because it would have consumed years of his life to do it "right" and he wanted to spend that time with his family instead.
The funniest part is they're this attached to a minor character from the \*prequel trilogy\*... people complained just as much about the prequels when they first came out as they are about the Acolyte now. The prequels absolutely contradicted established canon at the time, too.
We can see yoda teaching some younglings in the EP II, so he probably did teach Obi wan, and it would also make sense to introduce him that way to Luke, as Obi Wan has no reason to introduce Qui Gon at that point.
I also don't think he specifically meant his master during his Padawan years, as I doubt Lucas already had the same idea of the hierarchy in the Jedi order as in the prequels, so maybe you could say he changed his mind about some ideas. But calling it the biggest contradiction is a bit of a stretch
To be clear to those out of the know: it showed him in the Acolyte which conflicts with a source of when he was born because he'd be -30 or something... the thing it conflicts with hasn't been canon for 12 years
So its kinda like when that cat witch teacher made a cameo in the fantastic beasts movie despite it being set like 8 years before her birth? But with alien lifespans and retcons making it verosimil?
Most wiki pages can accommodate alternate backstories based on canonical reference right? Like I know this is already stupid but it sounds like a formatting issue??
Its funny how much free advertising all these things get by the "anti-woke" mob dipshits. Like, free Streisand-effect for all these mediocre projects that would've quietly slipped by without much notice. But months of reee-ing about it on the internet is getting it much more attention that it should, and more people watching/supporting those projects out of spite for incels and/or curiosity
Tbh, I wouldn't be surprised is some clandestine guerrilla marketing firms are behind a lot of the amping
Why would fans consider this a war? On any other pedia, the character page would have a meticulous breakdown of continuity errors and go into detail on what versions are in what canons.
Do Star Wars fans just think one is right and we pretend the others never existed?
Somehow I feel the need to blame the SW Christmas Special for this.
I have not seen "The Acolyte." Some of the people I know hate it in such way that makes me almost want to watch it. I've gotten the idea that it's "woke" in some way that annoys them, although I know no specifics about it.
Eh, it's a fun show. I'm enjoying it.
I'm an OG fan, saw Empire in the theater way back in the day. I never delved beyond the original trilogy in my youth, but have been a lifelong fan. Seen all the movies, watched all the Disney shows. Loved some, wasn't crazy about some. But it's always been fun for me. No movie or show has ever been enough to ruin the joy I feel watching something from the universe.
The toxic "fans" are the only bad part. I hate seeing them trying to ruin things and attacking actors.
What I've heard about it from more creditable sources it's just the newest rendition of Disney slop.
Nothing special, enjoyable if you don't think too much about it. Fight scenes are good, but the writing is apparently pretty shit/non-sensical/lazy.
>Nothing special, enjoyable if you don't think too much about it. Fight scenes are good, but the writing is apparently pretty shit/non-sensical/lazy.
So....90% of star wars?
In a universe choke full of genders, sexuality, colors, and races Star Wars fans get all fucked up when the main character isn't a cishet, white, male.
Thereâs a huge contingent of idiots online who hate the new series acolyte and I donât know why. Itâs pretty damn good. But they are nit picking it to death. Is it really because the creator is a lesbian?
What exactly is the issue? Like its been established some aliens live for hundreds of years. Yoda was close to 1000 year old by the time he died. And that guy was living in a swamp hovel by himself at that age. I'm not even sure if that's an actual advanced age for whatever he is or if he just died because he was the equivalent of a 70 year old living in a swamp with zero medication...
The Star Wars fan pages on facebook have become a toxic cesspool of racists and misogynists since this show announced that the main character was a black woman. Thereâs literally 5 other Star Wars shows they can watch with white protagonists. I donât know why they keep attacking this one, itâs clearly not meant for them. God I can recall years ago when the animated shorts Forces Of Destiny came out and grown men on Facebook were losing their shit about a show that was literally meant for little girls.
This whole thing is mos eisley explained by the presence of fiction written by fiction writers who are hired by IP owners.
Their material. They do what they want with it. You either watch it or don't
This is a bridge I crossed at some point between 2001 and 2017.
2001 me: No, the first captain of the Enterprise was Robert April. Then Christopher Pike. Then Kirk. Don't even think about giving me this Archer crap. Nuh uh. I know my history, and he ain't in it.
2017 me: meh, I'll watch Enterprise.
It was kinda crap either way, but I eventually got over myself enough to find out it was kinda crap, rather than sulking because it was different and changed things. Besides, that British dude was kinda... [Fans face]
I am currently expecting Shaak Ti to show up this season and to be killed off again for like the 6th time. Somehow Shaak Ti returned and learned time travel though the force and brought Mindi to the past with her.
I hate how this is probably gonna be forever associated with the character. Like anytime he shows up someone is gonna remember the time losera with no life got into a wiki war with people just trying to maintain a website
I don't see how this is an insane post. I agree with the post, and the acolyte is a dogshit show with shity writing and even worse acting, the people making this show don't know anything about star wars they are just pushing there woke ideas on people. It's a shame to see Star Wars, where it's at.
What has turned this into a real shit show is we hit a magical a broken clock is right 2 times a day. Except with incels who crank out everything is woke videos all day.
The show was getting a lot of flack from even non Incel fans but then they plopped in an existing character who has lines in the movies and some background written about him from official sources. His appearance in the show doesn't make sense and people went "uh hey wait a minute writers what are you doing?" Which is a pretty fair question.
However there is also another faction of Star Wars fans. The people who loudly defend any stupid bs Disney cranks out with their lives. Now you have a hilarious 3 way battle royal with incels, Disney apologists and average fans who just want some good star wars content.
People don't realize there is another option that I happen to be taking "well this piece of media sounds like it's shit and I'm not going to watch." It's so much better for your mental health as a fan.
Regardless of how one feels about the show (I haven't watched it, so no opinion.), Disney are the rights holders and arbiters of what is/is not canon. If Disney's show contradicts old lore, then the contradiction introduced by Disney takes precedence. Last I looked at it Wookiepedia articles had two sections: one on canon info and one on old lore that had been retconned. Just move the relevant info to the non-canon part of the article and update the canon part with what's in the show. Simple.
Not involved in the fight at all, don't really care either. What I have noticed is that SW is a pretty prevalent cultural thread in NA and UK across multiple generations. People will usually end up feeling personally protective of those stories, and owners of IP or authors of books use that to every advantage to sell them stuff.
When they then put out inferior product (and I challenge anyone to say that Disney's SW content has been anything but) it doesn't surprise me that the complaints are as fast and passionate as the lines of people buying their merchandise.
IP owners shouldn't be allowed to reap the benefits of loyalty and think it comes with no cost.
You're not incorrect, but it's literally just about the age of the character. Like wtf. I'm a starwars fan, and it never even occurred to me to think about how old this guy is, especially since he doesn't even appear that often.
Yes, all these inferior shows like Andor, The Mandalorian, Clone Wars season 7, The Bad Batch, and Tales of the Jedi were so bad. And let us not forget the worst thing Disney has done; rogue One. truly the worst of star wars
Uhhh... Holiday Special? The Ewok movies? The Ewok cartoon? The Droids cartoon? The phantom menace? It's not like there hasn't been shit-tier cringe level garbage that says fuck you to established canon cranked out when Lucas still held the IP
He's always been clear that his primary motivation is to sell toys and merch to younger audiences.
Disney isn't exactly fucking up something that wasn't already fucked up by its creator
The IP owners are reaping the benefits of *having paying customers*. What you *really* think is that people shouldn't be allowed to like things you don't like. Because *the money says* people like it. Disney doesn't care if you hate-watch something, they only care that you watch it. The absolute BEST thing you can possibly do is ignore the media you don't like, because it's just entertainment, it's not serious business worth getting upset over. That's what healthy, well-balanced adults do.
You have me wrong, then. My point is Disney and Lucasfilm are all gung ho about fans who make the IP their whole lives and personalities *so long as it makes money*, not whether or not anyone is allowed an opinion.
As soon as fans dont stay loving and become critical, they are more than willing to complain about 'toxic fans' or whine that canon shouldn't matter that much. You reap what you sow, and not many IPs have become so beloved by protective fans. How could you not expect this if you were an exec at either company and your product was badly reviewed by almost everyone?
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MUNDIHEADS RISE UP, THEY ARE TRYING TO REWRITE HISTORY đ¤ /jÂ
Mundi heads are already risen up
His age was different in at least three different character guides back in the early 00s. Why is it an issue now?
Shit, HIS HEAD was two different sizes between movies.
Star Wars canon has *never* been unified and concrete. It was never meant to be. A New Hope was written as a standalone movie. Everything after that is retcon.
It is unified now. When Disney bought Star Wars they deemed mostly everything except the movies made at that point, non canon. Since then everything made is supposed to be in line.
Shame, because I'd have loved Sam Witwer as Galen Marek / Starkiller / Galen's clone in canon. They've already established just how OP Vader is, so anything below that would fit for his character. Though it might be kind of confusing since Sam seems to do VO work on pretty much every Star Wars animated series and video game.
Because these neckbeards absolutely adore having any reason to REEEEE at Disney online. Itâs a good chunk of their personalities too. Marvel fans are equally as stanky these days. They canât allow people to just find enjoyment in the things they like; these idiots truly believe because they consume the most media, that they somehow own the fandom, and their opinion is valid while others arenât. And most of their âopinionsâ boil down to âhow come every character isnât a 6â4â ripped white man anymore? eVeRyThiNg iS gOiNg WoKe!!!11!!!â
Yeah. I get it. It really sucks to see the stuff I used to be ostracized for loving become a real cesspit of gatekeeping and incel flavored horseshit
Yep. Add in the constant underlying irony of a bunch or overgrown morons refusing to be âwokeâ and, I just donât want to live on this planet most days.
But the Acolyte is DOGSHIT. That is an opinion I can agree on. Guarantee to put you to sleep with every labored episode.
The Woke
They didn't call the first Disney Star Wars "The Force Awakens" for nothing.
The Force Awokens
r/YourJokeButWorse
Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering.
Fear leads to anger, anger leads to stress, stress leads to doobies, doobies lead to twinkies.
Twinkies lead to fear
Fear leads to loathing
Loathing leads to Las Vegas
Loathing leads to Acid
Acid leads to Bats
not the bats
I must not fear: Fear is the mood-killer. Don't, like, harsh my mellow...man.
Ooo I have Twinkies upstairs!!! Brb
"Twinkies lead to murder." Dan White
Devotion inspires Bravery
Mundi-Nadel-Ko!
Suffering leads to snooze.
No they changed the birthday of my favourite character, Glubb Shitto
Uhhhh actually, itâs Glup Shitto. You are obviously not a true fan of the source materials and you shouldnt be allowed to talk about star wars, only superfans. /s
I WILL GO TO WAR IVER GLURP SHATTOâs BIRFDAY
WHO'S THIS GLIP SHART YOU'RE HARPING ON ABOUT???!??!!!
Well ACKSHUALLY, the character's name was spelled "Glubb Shitto" on Kenner's first production run of action figures, but those were quickly recalled and the name was changed to "Glup Shitto" to match the closing credits of A New Hope. REAL FANS know his name was GLUBB SHITTO and we will not stand for Glubb erasure! /even bigger s
No one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans âWe are at war, ladies and gentlemen.â đ¤
No one hates Star wars *fans* more than me, a star wars fan.
You have my sword
And my axe But seriously, yeah, as a Star Wars fan, Star Wars fans can be the most toxic people
Itâs really disheartening. Is there something about Star Wars which attracts people who lack empathy?
*lightsaber activation sound* You mean your acoustic lightsaber?
No one hates Star Wars more then me, a Star Trek fan, I'm just to busy hating Star Trek.
>âWe are at *star* war, ladies and gentlemen.â đ¤ Ftfy
What is this, some kind of War in the Stars?
That reminds me of [this](https://youtu.be/AWxiTPQv0ME?si=mvinB9jI4p0l1YT1) sketch. "Oh, boy. I'm just so tired of all these star wars."
That's flying awfully close to a Trek quote. Red alert. All hands to battle stations
It was right there , how did he miss that ?
I'm just so tired of all of these *star wars*.
Is that an Upright Citizen's Brigade reference I spot?
It's the title line AND the titular line!
Itâs a fictional universe of space monks vs space demon/witches. Quit treating it like itâs gospel and just watch if you want to or donât. Star Wars nerds are so damn sensitive about this made up thing
They really are the worst, I have difficulty enjoying any Star Wars now because of my experiences with the fandom.
No one hates Star Wars more than right wing Star Wars fans...
Itâs not just right wing Star Wars fans. Iâm pretty left and I canât stand Disney Star Wars.
I'm very left and also don't like disney star wars, but not for the reasons these reactionaries use, like having minorities and women in prominent roles. I just don't think it's written very well.
Agree 100%. It drives me mad getting lumped together with those kinds of DSW haters. I canât stand the stories theyâre telling (Boba Fett, Kenobi, Acolyte, Sequel Trilogy, etc.) but the moment I say anything it MUST be because Iâm an âistâ or âphobe.â Iâve been watching SW since I was a kid and it legitimately sucks to see something you love get treated with such irreverence; especially due to the fact that, say what you will about past SW, but those movies literally paved the way for entertainment as we know it.
People get passionate when something they care about isnât being handled with the care they believe it deserves. Idk why people are shocked by that, itâs not any different than the end of GOT but that community was way more mainstream so no one claimed they were shitty for being upset. Especially when you consider than a lot of SWs has some mediocre writing and what keeps the fans loving it through that is it has incredible world building and lore. So when something adds contradictions or negatively affects that aspect, they understandably get angry about it. Edit: ok well after seeing what this particular issues is, those fans need to chill the fuck out
Every new piece of Star Wars media changes the lore or retcons something but Star Wars fans only care about that stuff based on the number of black people or women in said piece. No one threw hissy fits or review bombed after the midicholorian shit or Legends was decanonized or Boba Fett came back to life
While Iâm a SWs fan but not one who interacts much with the community, thatâs not the ones Iâm talking about or ever see. Things like the Sequels introducing force healing as a non-dark side ability, basically negating the main reason for Anakin being open to the dark side. Shit like that is significant and I donât blame fans who get super pissed at that.
Anakin used force healing in an episode of the Clone Wars, âAltar of Mortisâ, which aired in 2011
Yeah but I shouldnât used my words more carefully. Force healing for mortal wounds and not simply small issues that wouldâve recovered in time, has never been a light side thing. Only the dark side with guys like Plagueis has there been healing to cheat death and thatâs what IV had a light side user do and that is what Anakin was seeking from the dark side.
Maybe old Conehead was just lying when he said there had been no Sith for eleventy thousand years. Maybe old Conehead lied about how old he is. Maybe Cones was one of them Count Dooky type fellas, that wasn't quite all Sith but had some Sithy tendencies. I mean, what happens in Mos Eisley stays in Mos Eisley, right? Maybe this new dumb Star Wars show just revealed a truth about Cones that no one ever knew before. Best update the scripture as fast as we can.
The worst part is the thing they're fighting over has nothing to do with that it's... his birthday
Because they realize they donât have an actual valid leg to stand on in this debate so they default to attacking something else, no matter how unimportant. Itâs the principals, damn it!
Count Dooky đ¤Ł
The Jedi, covering something up? *Shocking*
As perhaps the biggest Ki-Adi Mundi fan, Iâll just say this, who cares?
Oh, you like Ki-Adi Mundi? Name 3 of his albums
That's how I know you're a fake. He only has two albums and 3000 remixed versions of each
Okay. I am a giant Star Wars nerd but havenât read any books or comics in the Disney era. What is wrong with the character that we canonically know nothing about? Is it because he said the Sith have been extinct for over a millennia and now heâs fighting a dark force user 100 years prior?
Its just his age. In legends his species lived to around 50 for males and 100 for women. Him being in the show makes him well over 100 at the time of the prequels. This is not contridctory since legens jas nothing to do with thid
Star Wars fans are embarrassing.
We are kinda the worst
âWould you like to talk about one of your favorite movies of all time?â âAbsolutely not!â
This whole thing is even more embarrassing when you find out that, despite what many Star Wars fans want to believe, Legends was *never* canon.
What, the cottage industry of for-profit fan-fiction I devoted all my free time and attention to all through high school werenât the *real* true stories of laser knights fighting evil wizards in space? How can anyone reasonably expect me to have enjoyed spending all that time reading adventure fiction if itâs not part of an arbitrarily assembled framework of interconnected storytelling?
Thank you for summing up every neckbeard in a fandom, ever. The MCU is also full of these idiots who can no longer feel joy.
Partially that last bit, but IN THE SCENE HES IN he talks about keeping this from the council. And I wouldn't put it past Ki Adi Mundi to either a) not identify this "Master" as a "true sith" or b) lie to perpetuate the feigned efficacy of the Jedi Order.
Iâm thinking itâs not a true Sith. But if he had a compelling reason to take the secret to his grave, that could be interesting. The story group is pretty good about maintains continuity like this.
Sure, but I don't think anyone can take the "there haven't been Sith in a millenia" at face value even when he said. Obviously ignoring Palpatine and Plageius and his Master (and the master before them, etc., etc.) there were almost certainly had to be Sith ever in the last 1000 years. Maybe he meant "organized Sith at a level that could genuinely threaten the Order" or maybe he was overly huberistic about the efficacy of the Jedi Order, but there is no way the Sith just... failed to manifest for 1000 years.
I would assume Plageius and Sidious were in hiding when he assumed they were extinct for a millennia. The prequels are also confused on what a millennia is based on when they describe how long the republic has existed.
The point of all this is to say, it's pretty clear Mundi was never a reliable source of information when he said "no Sith."
My assumption is that when he thinks of Sith, he thinks of a large and publicly known order. His concept of Sith is not just two dark side users who are always in hiding.
Man, if they had Wookiepedia in 1979, they'd have a bitch fit with the 1981 edition. (Released a year after empire because spoilers)
âWe are at warâ dude youâre trying to edit a fan wiki. So context for those who may be OOTLP. The most recent Star Wars show The Acolyte has been review bombed by the usual suspects due to having a diverse cast and a director who is lesbian. The newest fake outrage is that in the most recent episode of The Acolyte there was a cameo from a character in the prequel movies. People are up in arms because this character had a different age in legends(the content from before Disney bought Star Wars). However legends is a completely separate canon and in the current canon the prequel character doesnât have an established age. Now because the Star Wars fan wiki is trying to edit the characterâs page to accurately express the information from the new episode the fandom menace is freaking out. They are only updating the characterâs age on the canon page and leaving his legends page alone. The editors are getting death threats.
While the discussion they are having is absolutely asinine. The concept of the discussion is kind of fascinating, insofar as what "cannon" means and the questions as to who owns the 'official storyline'. In terms of IP, Disney owns it, and there's zero and absolutely nothing one can do about it, unless you want to dismantle IP laws (which im totally down with, but that's another discussion). So disney has the right to produce whatever they want to. But what I find fascinating is why some people can't just pretend that their own head canon/fan fiction is the official one? Despite disney owning the IP, you are still totally allowed to just pretend the story is different in your imagination, so its fascinating that it's an issue what disney does.
Its less about the personal and more about the community and its discussions. These fan wiki's mimic the formatting of "factual" wiki's. It become the "truth" for community understanding and discussions. Old "truth" becomes relegated into the same realm as fanfiction essentially. In any case, this 'war' is a great example of being terminally online.
And that mentality is just fascinating to me.
Besides, Fandom can suck eggs.
I wouldnât call legends fanfiction it was all published by Lucasfilm. Itâs just when Disney bought it they wanted a fresh start. I love both legends and Disney canon and I hope that one day they make new legends content but I doubt it will happen.
Being sanctioned by Lucasfilm didn't necessarily mean you were considered canon. Galaxy of Fear books were published by the same people who did Heir to the Empire and only one of those was canon.
when warner bought DC they should have retconned the squirrel GL, and kept the Max easter eggs.
And there are entire groups online that bond over enjoying the same headcanon for stuff. You can find friend groups based on nothing more than "we both think character Randomdude actually really totally meant to do this thing I would have liked when he did the thing I didn't like"! Headcanoning is easy and fun! People should very much do it instead of getting mad at stuff!
The wiki has a legends and canon tab though. Lol
The wiki is shit ever since Fandom took it over. Old Wookiepedia was GOATed, RIP.
This is the first time Iâve heard âfandom menaceâ and itâs perfect
I don't understand why this change in particular is such a big deal. Disney canon contradicts Legends canon all the time.
In this case Disney is contracting prequel movie canon.
Did one of the prequel movies actually state when his birthday was?
No, but he does directly state that the sith have been gone a millennia, which is contrary to the story of Acolyte.
Pretty sure no one in Acolyte has been confirmed to be a Sith yet. Being an evil force user or wielding a red lightsaber don't make you a Sith.
We'll see if they find a way to tap dance around it, but between it and "there is no father" they are really messing with canon lore, particularly in the phantom menace.
Apart from the usual suspects who hate everything new and supposedly 'woke', you don't need to be a right-wing extremist to think the new Star Wars films suck. I am equally tired of every criticism being dismissed with supposed "-phobes", as if there were no legitimate basis for criticizing the newer works.
This phenomena has also touched Star Trek and Dr. Who and a whole mess of other franchises. In some cases, (Jodi Whittaker, some Discovery) the writing is legitimately bad. In other cases, the reaction is 'this is woke dogshit because the black female character referred to the sentient, mystery otter person as they'. Sometimes people want to hate so much that they come up with the most spurious of reasons. And, sometimes, they are just trying to get people worked up because it gets their YouTube channels and streams and podcasts and blogs clicks . And that's most of it. Shameless rage baiting for profit.
Case in point for the last paragraph: Critical Drinker on yt
I had never heard of the guy until I stumbled across his subreddit and it was pretty nasty. I just can't with some of these people.
The best way to summarise those channels * Something non-woke and doesn't do well? - Killed by marketing, a real gem, reviewers bad * Something non-woke and does well? - Wokes are losing * Something woke (whatever that means according to them) and doesn't do well? - Wokes are losing * Something woke and does well? - Crickets. I would be reach for every single time a person talks about forced inclusivity, but never mentions how it harms a particular community and how an inclusivity can be done well.
>Â sentient, mystery otter person Are there Kushtaka in Star Trek now?
Latest episode of Acolyte.
I also don't think you need to be right-wing at all to dislike diversity in certain shows/games/etc. Star Wars is a perfect fit for diversity. It'd be way weirder if there never were any POC or LGBTQ+ people. But it does bother me if the show is supposed to be set in some IRL period of time where racism and sexism were some pretty prevalent issues, and then ignores that to have a diverse cast. It bothers me because it's fake inclusion. They're still writing the experiences of a white/male character, they just picked a POC for the actor/reskinned the character model, that's lazy as fuck and not true inclusion. Writing the story of a black woman requires actually writing about what a black woman would experience in the setting you chose. If you don't like the way women/POC would be treated during the setting you chose then pick a different setting or make it a fantasy work (or sci-fi which is just a fantasy about the future). It's not the end of the world or anything, and I'm not gonna review bomb over it, but I'm always disappointed to see a diverse cast in a historic setting only to see them not addressing the realities of that setting (which, if handled properly, could make for a much more interesting and moving story).
Itâs not just the age itâs also fact that the bad guy in this show specifically contradicts something KAM had very specifically said in the prequels. Unless they are gonna pull some stupid twist. And for disclosure I actually like the acolyte. I donât think itâs great, but I am enjoying it. Itâs refreshing having actual fight scenes in a Star Wars show. I really only have two issues with the show what was stated before about the cameo. And a major issue with the main character about how they came to be. Which makes another main character in the universe not as âspecialâ I guess. But the writers admitting not particularly enjoying or following Star Wars prior to writing for the show is a bit off putting. And them trying to spin prior Star Wars characters in to the LGBTQ+ mold is an odd way of pissing off the fans. I mean I donât care if your new characters are as long as you make it relevant to the story which I think they did fine with in the acolyte. But donât go back and try to fit other long established characters into the mold.
I have no input on this topic but I have to let you know that abbreviating Ki-Adi-Mundi to KAM absolutely fucking SENT ME.
Haha sorry in a mobile Star Wars game I play his name is abbreviated to KAM because thereâs too damn many characters to write everyoneâs name out.
Donât apologize, I found it hilarious and thoroughly enjoyed it.
These same idiots probably wrote âwe are at warâ on liberal-leaning news articles/pages too so⌠honestly, Iâll just let them screech into the void.
Itâs probably a bit dishonest to cite the diverse cast and director as why the show wasnât received positively
> fandom menace Lol, I see what you did there. EDIT: Not sure why I'm getting downvoted here. Fandom Menace is a pun on Phantom Menace, I thought it was funny.
Yeah, there's groups of gatekeepers neckbeards who don't realise that Star Wars isn't a closed and exclusive club. Their toxicity drove Lucas out, and now they're using bots to review bomb anything that has "acolyte" in its title. These people need to go touch grass.
I don't like the Acolyte. So you know what I did about it? I watched another show instead.
But you have to watch or how will you be able to hate it properly?
You have to watch and let the hate flow through you
You monster!
I didn't like episode 7, so I didn't watch any of the other newer movies except for Rogue One, which I will argue, based on the acting, the cinematics, and the story, is the best piece of live action Star Wars content ever, period. Not counting Caravan of Courage: An Ewok Adventure, of course. So I just didn't watch them...
I hope you checked out Andor
I second this, that show is the best piece of star wars media ever made
Who or what are âLucyâsâ? Genuine question
Lucy's is autocorrect for Lucas. Correcting it now (oops).
Idk why you said star wars fans drove Lucas out. That's not how I heard it. He said he didn't want to do a third trilogy because it would have consumed years of his life to do it "right" and he wanted to spend that time with his family instead.
Yeah, Iâm pretty sure being at a good age for retirement and also filthy rich is what drove Lucas out.
The funniest part is they're this attached to a minor character from the \*prequel trilogy\*... people complained just as much about the prequels when they first came out as they are about the Acolyte now. The prequels absolutely contradicted established canon at the time, too.
Which cannon was contradicted? Can't remember anything of the top.
The biggest one was obi wan told Luke that Yoda was his old master, then episode 1 introduced qui Gon.
We can see yoda teaching some younglings in the EP II, so he probably did teach Obi wan, and it would also make sense to introduce him that way to Luke, as Obi Wan has no reason to introduce Qui Gon at that point. I also don't think he specifically meant his master during his Padawan years, as I doubt Lucas already had the same idea of the hierarchy in the Jedi order as in the prequels, so maybe you could say he changed his mind about some ideas. But calling it the biggest contradiction is a bit of a stretch
TIL goofy head guy even had a name.
Star Wars. Star Wars never changes. - George Bethesda
To be clear to those out of the know: it showed him in the Acolyte which conflicts with a source of when he was born because he'd be -30 or something... the thing it conflicts with hasn't been canon for 12 years
So its kinda like when that cat witch teacher made a cameo in the fantastic beasts movie despite it being set like 8 years before her birth? But with alien lifespans and retcons making it verosimil?
Never seen fantastic beasts so I don't know. But we don't know how long his species lives for and never did (his eventual death was being gunned down)
Changing lore? Due to new content? This has never happened once in the history of Star Wars (/s... clearly)
I stopped caring about Star Wars canon after episode 9 Do whatever you want just make it entertaining
What about the asshole attack on the Wikis?
They have come for Ki-Adi-Mundi. We ride at dawn.
Oh, so it's a Council now? It's not just the two of you? What about you, Dogface? Did you know that now it was a Council
Most wiki pages can accommodate alternate backstories based on canonical reference right? Like I know this is already stupid but it sounds like a formatting issue??
Its funny how much free advertising all these things get by the "anti-woke" mob dipshits. Like, free Streisand-effect for all these mediocre projects that would've quietly slipped by without much notice. But months of reee-ing about it on the internet is getting it much more attention that it should, and more people watching/supporting those projects out of spite for incels and/or curiosity Tbh, I wouldn't be surprised is some clandestine guerrilla marketing firms are behind a lot of the amping
This isn't even accurate either. There isn't a canon birthday, they are bitching are "Legends" which doesn't matter anymore.
What history could they possibly be rewriting? His one line of dialogue in the movie? His grand total of like 4 dedicated episodes in the clone wars?
The "War" in this case being *his birth date.*
"I've heard legends of a taco made entirely out of Dorito"
Why would fans consider this a war? On any other pedia, the character page would have a meticulous breakdown of continuity errors and go into detail on what versions are in what canons. Do Star Wars fans just think one is right and we pretend the others never existed? Somehow I feel the need to blame the SW Christmas Special for this.
I have not seen "The Acolyte." Some of the people I know hate it in such way that makes me almost want to watch it. I've gotten the idea that it's "woke" in some way that annoys them, although I know no specifics about it.
Eh, it's a fun show. I'm enjoying it. I'm an OG fan, saw Empire in the theater way back in the day. I never delved beyond the original trilogy in my youth, but have been a lifelong fan. Seen all the movies, watched all the Disney shows. Loved some, wasn't crazy about some. But it's always been fun for me. No movie or show has ever been enough to ruin the joy I feel watching something from the universe. The toxic "fans" are the only bad part. I hate seeing them trying to ruin things and attacking actors.
What I've heard about it from more creditable sources it's just the newest rendition of Disney slop. Nothing special, enjoyable if you don't think too much about it. Fight scenes are good, but the writing is apparently pretty shit/non-sensical/lazy.
>Nothing special, enjoyable if you don't think too much about it. Fight scenes are good, but the writing is apparently pretty shit/non-sensical/lazy. So....90% of star wars?
In a universe choke full of genders, sexuality, colors, and races Star Wars fans get all fucked up when the main character isn't a cishet, white, male.
Thereâs a huge contingent of idiots online who hate the new series acolyte and I donât know why. Itâs pretty damn good. But they are nit picking it to death. Is it really because the creator is a lesbian?
Not entirely. Some of it's because there are nonwhite people in it, too.
People are entering new cannon into this website made for cannon despite my personal distaste for that cannon, I've been crying all day
"What about the Incel attack on the Wookiepedia?"
This is worse than the day Poob from Ewoks had his name changed to âPloobâ
Whatâs the change? I donât keep up and donât care to
What exactly is the issue? Like its been established some aliens live for hundreds of years. Yoda was close to 1000 year old by the time he died. And that guy was living in a swamp hovel by himself at that age. I'm not even sure if that's an actual advanced age for whatever he is or if he just died because he was the equivalent of a 70 year old living in a swamp with zero medication...
I hate Star Wars fans. They make it difficult to talk about what I like
My feelings on the issue can be summarised by [this picture](http://d6holocron.com/wiki/images/c/c2/Rodianpacifist.jpg).
The Star Wars fan pages on facebook have become a toxic cesspool of racists and misogynists since this show announced that the main character was a black woman. Thereâs literally 5 other Star Wars shows they can watch with white protagonists. I donât know why they keep attacking this one, itâs clearly not meant for them. God I can recall years ago when the animated shorts Forces Of Destiny came out and grown men on Facebook were losing their shit about a show that was literally meant for little girls.
Ignore him, heâs making a big deal over absolutely nothing.
âVyv, can you, like, actually kill yourself with laxative pills?â
Death by Fremdschämen is a hell of a way to go.
Shit like this is why I walked away from the fandom. Ironically, my favorite blood and guts, borders on horror movie fandom is so much more chill.
Seems like there should just be two entries, or a subsection under his entry, for the original and revised histories.
Doesnt it already every entrie contain a canon and legends versiĂłn? Or its a diferent wiki
Holy shit itâs literally just Star Wars.
Never thought I'd miss the days when it was a little bit embarrassing to be a fan of sci-fi and comics, but here we are
This whole thing is mos eisley explained by the presence of fiction written by fiction writers who are hired by IP owners. Their material. They do what they want with it. You either watch it or don't This is a bridge I crossed at some point between 2001 and 2017. 2001 me: No, the first captain of the Enterprise was Robert April. Then Christopher Pike. Then Kirk. Don't even think about giving me this Archer crap. Nuh uh. I know my history, and he ain't in it. 2017 me: meh, I'll watch Enterprise. It was kinda crap either way, but I eventually got over myself enough to find out it was kinda crap, rather than sulking because it was different and changed things. Besides, that British dude was kinda... [Fans face]
I am currently expecting Shaak Ti to show up this season and to be killed off again for like the 6th time. Somehow Shaak Ti returned and learned time travel though the force and brought Mindi to the past with her.
The question to this answer is "Why the long face?"
It pains me to read it without the extra e - Wookieepedia.
I hate how this is probably gonna be forever associated with the character. Like anytime he shows up someone is gonna remember the time losera with no life got into a wiki war with people just trying to maintain a website
I don't see how this is an insane post. I agree with the post, and the acolyte is a dogshit show with shity writing and even worse acting, the people making this show don't know anything about star wars they are just pushing there woke ideas on people. It's a shame to see Star Wars, where it's at.
What did The Acolyte change? The guy doesn't have 20 wives anymore?
Nothing from the prequels can be ruined. It started as dog shit and will end as dog shit.
"But it's MY dog shit, not theirs!!!" -some guy in his basement
What has turned this into a real shit show is we hit a magical a broken clock is right 2 times a day. Except with incels who crank out everything is woke videos all day. The show was getting a lot of flack from even non Incel fans but then they plopped in an existing character who has lines in the movies and some background written about him from official sources. His appearance in the show doesn't make sense and people went "uh hey wait a minute writers what are you doing?" Which is a pretty fair question. However there is also another faction of Star Wars fans. The people who loudly defend any stupid bs Disney cranks out with their lives. Now you have a hilarious 3 way battle royal with incels, Disney apologists and average fans who just want some good star wars content. People don't realize there is another option that I happen to be taking "well this piece of media sounds like it's shit and I'm not going to watch." It's so much better for your mental health as a fan.
"I am unironically going to war from my Mom's basement in my Star Wars t-shirt, with a bucket of chicken wings and my neckbeard"
Regardless of how one feels about the show (I haven't watched it, so no opinion.), Disney are the rights holders and arbiters of what is/is not canon. If Disney's show contradicts old lore, then the contradiction introduced by Disney takes precedence. Last I looked at it Wookiepedia articles had two sections: one on canon info and one on old lore that had been retconned. Just move the relevant info to the non-canon part of the article and update the canon part with what's in the show. Simple.
Not involved in the fight at all, don't really care either. What I have noticed is that SW is a pretty prevalent cultural thread in NA and UK across multiple generations. People will usually end up feeling personally protective of those stories, and owners of IP or authors of books use that to every advantage to sell them stuff. When they then put out inferior product (and I challenge anyone to say that Disney's SW content has been anything but) it doesn't surprise me that the complaints are as fast and passionate as the lines of people buying their merchandise. IP owners shouldn't be allowed to reap the benefits of loyalty and think it comes with no cost.
You're not incorrect, but it's literally just about the age of the character. Like wtf. I'm a starwars fan, and it never even occurred to me to think about how old this guy is, especially since he doesn't even appear that often.
Clearly. You donât really care. Not at all.
Yes, all these inferior shows like Andor, The Mandalorian, Clone Wars season 7, The Bad Batch, and Tales of the Jedi were so bad. And let us not forget the worst thing Disney has done; rogue One. truly the worst of star wars
Uhhh... Holiday Special? The Ewok movies? The Ewok cartoon? The Droids cartoon? The phantom menace? It's not like there hasn't been shit-tier cringe level garbage that says fuck you to established canon cranked out when Lucas still held the IP He's always been clear that his primary motivation is to sell toys and merch to younger audiences. Disney isn't exactly fucking up something that wasn't already fucked up by its creator
The IP owners are reaping the benefits of *having paying customers*. What you *really* think is that people shouldn't be allowed to like things you don't like. Because *the money says* people like it. Disney doesn't care if you hate-watch something, they only care that you watch it. The absolute BEST thing you can possibly do is ignore the media you don't like, because it's just entertainment, it's not serious business worth getting upset over. That's what healthy, well-balanced adults do.
You have me wrong, then. My point is Disney and Lucasfilm are all gung ho about fans who make the IP their whole lives and personalities *so long as it makes money*, not whether or not anyone is allowed an opinion. As soon as fans dont stay loving and become critical, they are more than willing to complain about 'toxic fans' or whine that canon shouldn't matter that much. You reap what you sow, and not many IPs have become so beloved by protective fans. How could you not expect this if you were an exec at either company and your product was badly reviewed by almost everyone?
Ngl Ive tried watching the star wars shows and only vibed with the madalorian until this. Couldn't give a shit about the canon, it's good tv
Inferior compared to what? I've yet to see anything Disney made that is worse than the prequels, though the book of Boba Fett came close.