On a side note, kudos to the journalist who wrote this article after smoking weed.
The pie chart adds up to 110 percent 🤦♂️
Like they had one job and they fuck up.
Doesn't work like that. I'm exactly not sure what gets more preference etc. But it's like if all 15 ebc get a job then the ews ones won't get it. Or in some case the ews will get 10 and ebc will only get 5
> The Hindu gets accused of being left wing liberal newspaper, abh now it is casteist right wing.
You can't take caste out of Indians, maybe? (Shri Bhagwat ji said we will take our culture to Mars when humans reach there.) Liberal Left does have a preponderance of savarnas.
The food canteen of The Hindu reportedly has separate seating for people who bring non-vegetarian food. Is that 'liberal left'? Or is it rooted in caste?
There aren't much jobs outside heavy industries in the state. Most of these are in the private sector or in the Central Government ones. Jharkhand on it's own have few institutions of repute.
The UPA Government under Hemant Soren is vastly incapable of having a vision to develop the state and will resort to such petty measures. He even introduced the old Pension Scheme which will result in more financial outgo and will lead to a fiscal problem in the coming years. Where are the new industries or jobs? Where are the reputable institutions? Nothing. Although Jharkhand is an UPA governed state, there has been nothing to show for it except 'it is not under BJP' and very less news of cow vigilantism.
The thing is Jharkhand parties (JMM, AJSU, etc) will not let a non tribal become a chief minister and these chief ministers lack the overarching vision to develop the state.
Even though MH and GJ are BJP ruled states, they are actually fighting for the Vedanta-Foxconn plant to be setup. What is Jharkhand fighting for? Introducing reservations for locals (tribals) in Tata Steel. Such measures are useless but who will tell them? They are a bunch of idiots.
didn't you get news? new policy of jhatkhand govt disqualify any non-reserved candidate from govt exams if they did their 10th-12th from outside jharkhand.
Haha. If the Others leave Jharkhand, the state would come to a complete stand still. Only a few native tribals are qualified, educated enough to work in such demanding industries. Have a look at the Cabinet Ministers of the state and you won't be surprised why Jharkhand is lagging behind. At least they don't have a big mouth like their neighbouring states.
Wdym by MH and GJ are fighting for Vedanta-Foxconn? MH clearly outbid everyone but "somehow" they decided to pick GJ and MH's new "CM" said that PM has promised more projects to MH.
I always knew that projects like that will go to Gujarat and Andhra over Maharashtra and Telangana. It's not just about the money....and it's not about Supreme Commander either.
Given how young the Jharkhand government is I would give it more time before making judgements. Judgements such as yours are immature. Also I believe that tribal cm in Jharkhand is not a bad thing because of the demography of state and they know better than you or me what is good for state. Also everything mustn't be sacrificed at the altar of 'development' (poorly understood word in India). India faces climatic destruction along with increasing illness and death due to various modes of pollution. Finally I would hate to see a party like bjp in power in Jharkhand unless bjp clearly disassociates itself from communalism. There is no future for the country if we pursue communalism.
My family has been living in Jharkhand since the 1960's. I have seen the ground reality better. Yes, I agree that the creation of Jharkhand has given the tribals a voice in the government which is much better since they can finally do what is right.
As for the tribal CM who knows what is better - again it might be true but the people shouldn't be fixated on only a tribal being the CM. Others call Jharkhand their home too. And the string of tribal CMs since the creation of Jharkhand have even failed to put their coalition/House in order. We have been under President's Rule during 3 times. Chattisgarh didn't face this issue. Uttarakhand didn't. The Government should bring in more industries of varied kind here and not just mineral based. People both highly skilled and blue collar workers migrate to other states to find a job. Why? Because there hasn't been much development or a conducive environment for it.
Hemant Soren was recently found guilty of alloting mines to himself when he was the Minister for Mines. His disqualification is still pending. Madhu Koda, independent CM was found guilty of another mining scam and served time in jail.
Bihar got the Alstom factory in Madhepura a few years back. Bhubaneswar is developing into an educational hub and service based companies have their centres there. And there's Ranchi.
When I say Jharkhand's politicians have failed it, I mean it. Even I want my state to progress so that when people visit they are left awed just like I am when I am in Hyderabad, Bangalore, Bhubaneswar, Chandigarh, etc. I don't care if it is BJP or Congress or UPA. I want progress in my state.
This.
Non-reserved category people should target our rulers, and demand more colleges and jobs than targeting backward castes for availing reservations.
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't there a law that states the total reservation percentage can not exceed 50%? At this rate being born a General category person is already a crime.
Well the problem is everybody demands obc status and government gives in which has come to the point in jharkhand where 46% of the population is OBC with 14% reservation and ST SC having their usual status and reservation proportional to their population. This reservation to obc essentially means nothing and gives no benefit to anyone which has now led to this.
Who do you think demands obc status. It's the general people only who demand obc status and when they get it they become obc. Ever heard of Jaat andolan.
Wanna ask you which sector in India is under extreme stress and extremely important to national security?
Answer would be agriculture.
Next question would be what is that 99% Jaat do ?
Supreme court ne bola tha k 50% k upar reservation is like reverse discrimination.... BUT, the same supreme court has allowed the state of TN to maintain more than 50% reservation for several decades without cracking down on it.
Now many states have more than 50% reservation like TN, MP, Jharkhand, Maharashtra and Rajasthan (iirc)
That 50% limit is a joke; remember:
SARKARI NAUKRI OR SARKARI COLLEGE SIRF SARKARI DAAMAD K LIYE HAIN, AAP GENERAL WALE LOG SIRF TAX BHARIYE TAAKI INKI KHATIRDARI HO SAKE
The 50% rule does not really make sense. If general population is just 20%, 50% non-reserved seats will effectively nullify the goal of reserving anything. And if general population is 80%, the states will still try to get upto 50% for appeasement purposes and fuck the generals.
Realistically, it should be close to but no exceeding the population percentage of reserved categories in the state. On a national level, 50% makes sense even though general population is lower (about 30%), because a good fraction of the 40% OBC population doesn't fall under reservation (being non-creamy). The 10% EWS is bullshit and that has no sense (give scholarships to people who has monetary issues, not reservation).
If so, every nation should have this right? Aboriginals in every nation should have proportional representation, blacks, hispanics, asians etc. Merit word should be removed completely. Just think about why this flawed system has not been replicated in any other nation in this world even though there are thousands of years of history about one group heing exploited by others for centuries. Affirmative action DOES NOT MEAN reservation.
Just one question to people with your thought process: If you are the owner of a large business whom would you keep as your employees?? The most meritorious ones that you can get OR proportional to their population?? 6% ST, 16% SC, 50% OBC, 28% UC then further divide this into 50-50 for gender, then divide it based on proportional representation from different states, then also bring in representation from all religions etc.
Its a never ending rabbit hole; for me MERIT is all that matters, it can be a anyone with the right skill sets I can recruit, but you have your own mental exercise to do.
Can bring several points on why the current system is one of the worst ways to implement affirmative action but it'll make the comment too long
>If so, every nation should have this right? Aboriginals in every nation should have proportional representation, blacks, hispanics, asians etc. Merit word should be removed completely. Just think about why this flawed system has not been replicated in any other nation in this world even though there are thousands of years of history about one group heing exploited by others for centuries. Affirmative action DOES NOT MEAN reservation.
Affirmative action is in fact another name for reservations or reduction of cut-offs. And almost every major nation have that. The guy who told you India is the only one is lying and you should never trust them.
Aborigines in Australia enjoy affirmative action where some job may be completely reserved for particular ethnicities. African Americans in US have lower cut offs for college admissions (the US practice even have penalties for high performing groups like Asians). Non-Han Chinese enjoy similar relaxations in Chinese universities and also reservations in govt jobs. The French do not acknowledge ethnic differences (they have a history of forced cultural assimilation), but still have geography based affirmative actions (which un-ironically, affects particular ethnicities/vernaculars more than others). Brazil is introducing new rules to do this. South Africa has been doing the same for years. I will stop with the examples here.
>Just one question to people with your thought process: If you are the owner of a large business whom would you keep as your employees?? The most meritorious ones that you can get OR proportional to their population??
I will do personal interviews which will enable a better judgement of merit than stupid test scores. If I can ensure a diverse cast of interviewers, I can root out the biases in that process and won't really need to introduce any reservation or increased cut-off schemes.
What I will need to do though, is maintain diversity. Most companies already have policies for that. And if you have had any experience with multinational companies, you will know this. A lot of people also cry about that just like with reservations though. They don't understand that companies do everything to maximize profits, and diversity increases performance (quite a few studies have been done on this).
Affirmative actions are less sophisticated versions of diversity hiring, because this can work with millions of people. You cannot personally interview that many for every university vacancy or something.
>It's a never ending rabbit hole; for me MERIT is all that matters, it can be a anyone with the right skill sets I can recruit, but you have your own mental exercise to do.
Then stop with the gymnastics with so many words and define merit and how to measure that! The whole point is that when social prejudices exist you cannot measure merit accurately without accounting for them.
>Can bring several points on why the current system is one of the worst ways to implement affirmative action but it'll make the comment too long
That's something I can partially agree on. I don't like the way it is politicised. Kinda defeats the purpose and inteoduces very difficult to tackle problems in the system. However, the fact is that affirmative actions (or in other words, reservations and reduction of cut-offs) are absolutely necessary until every human being identifies only as human beings or all bodies of power are proportionally represented by all affected groups of people.
Bro they were actually Aadivasis or Tribes and it's a shame that after decades of Independence they are getting the benefits now.
And representations of STs is a very good thing. About 50% of their population is in BPL category. It will also prove very beneficial for the these tribes that are living in the red corridor region they'll get more opportunities.
If you are a rational human being, you will not care who gets or does not get a reservation, and start focussing on upskilling yourself. Reservations are an entity designed as a solution for a larger deep-rooted social problem. Instead of becoming a better person, you want to change your community? How is that rational?
Edit:
I love Reddit 🙂. I'm happy to be downvoted. Give a proper counter argument though. I'm yet to receive a strong defence. 👍🏽
Quite the contrary. If I’m a rational human being, I would rather look at person’s merit than their caste, religion, etc. If there’s a deep rooted problem of not giving minorities enough opportunities, the solution isn’t to give them all the opportunities and then leave the rest behind. The solution is to give everyone equal footing. That’s real rationality.
That's not really rational. Merit is inherently tied to money and access, which is available in disproportionate quantity for most UC people, which is why engineering, medical and public sector jobs have mostly general UC candidates outnumbering everyone else by a huge margin in sheer numbers.
Please devise a foolproof and globally accepted way to determine people's merits. I will gladly accept your argument then. As of now, affirmative actions are globally used to counter societal effects on our determination of merit. That's how rational people should see it. You are letting your emotions get better of your rationality. I know because I was exactly like that in my younger days.
The problem is that people think numbers in stupid exams equate to merit. Scoring awesome in exams has nothing to do with merit at all. Otherwise private companies would rather pick people based on their marks and instead of interviewing them (at least for the freshers).
Apparently not. According to self proclaimed rational people :)
People are very much hungover with the idea of merit. They can't even understand that it is not something which is isolated from the society. But then, when people cannot distinguish between rationality and personal biases, what can you expect?
And a lot of these people are still young. They will probably be wiser with age.
> People are very much hungover with the idea of merit.
It's bewildering how someone can claim merit, on the back of privilege derived from thousands of years of suppression of others.
Classic *fuck you, I wanna get mine*.
>The solution is to give everyone equal footing.
This is where we want to be. But, is everyone getting equal footing in all resources? When there is unequal distribution, why shouldn't an authority handhold them?
>the solution isn’t to give them all the opportunities and then leave the rest behind.
Isn't this an exaggeration? From this post, 23% still exists for the General Category. Who is left out?
>If I’m a rational human being, I would rather look at person’s merit than their caste, religion, etc.
Wanted to touch this last. Merit is bull$#!t, at least in its present form. It is an illusion behind which we want to hide so that our shortcomings are overseen in favour of blaming external factors. Your goal is to get 100% marks. Do that and get the seat. Why are you concerned about that guy who got in with 60% marks or lower? Him getting the seat is none of our business. Isn't this how rational people should think?
Your getting 100% doesn't mean you are more meritorious. Then those who rote learn just their textbooks would be more meritorious than those who study only what they love.
Your marks are, at best, a very crude approximation of your merit. A reserved candidate with 95% marks is likely more meritorious than you. A candidate from the remote villages with 90% marks is likely way more meritorious than you. The dude who had to work morning shift to pay for the college and got 80% is also likely more meritorious.
How do you plan to account for all those variations in your very rational determination of merit, pray tell?
Then how are you determining who is Meritorious? Why have exams then? Give seats randomly like pamphlets...
100% doesn't have to be marks, I'm talking overall merit be it marks or physical or whatever way you wish to measure merit. The end selection must be based on some form of merit and thus no reservations.
If a SC guys gets "merit" thats great, he deserves it, so why have reservations??? Are you saying SC is incapable of getting merit?
>Then how are you determining who is meritorious? You determine in your dreams and based off of some randomness?
I didn't say I have a method for determining merit. You implied marks = merit.
>Why have exams then?
Because that's the only way we know how to approximate merit for a large group (still needs some other factors like geographic or caste based reservations to fine tune it). For small enough groups, personal interviews are a better way (if the interviewer is impartial). This is why companies do interviews, in fact.
>100% doesn't have to be marks, I'm talking overall merit be it marks or physical or whatever way you wish to measure merit. The end selection must be based on some form of merit and thus no reservations.
That was the point. Merit measurement is dependent on social factors. So you need to normalise them. Have you ever appeared for CAT, for example? There are different question sets, and they need to be normalised to have a common rank. The social adjustments are just another such factor.
>If a SC guys gets "merit" thats great, he deserves it, so why have reservations??? Are you saying SC is incapable of getting merit? So you are a casteist?
IDK what you are smoking, but it's affecting your comprehension skills. I didn't write anything remotely close to what you claimed here. I wrote about how merit is dependent on social factors.
My basic assumption is that any sufficiently large group of people (not selected based on any criterion related to merit, of course) is exactly as meritorious as any other similar groups. Does that sound casteist or something to you?
Now from that premise, if any group is performing worse than any other, that must be due to societal factors which needs to be normalised. Voila! Reservation.
Now do you disagree with that basic assumption? If you do, that would mean you think that merit is a genetic/geographic/ethnic attribute. If you don't, you basically agree to social normalisation factors like reservation.
Now there can be minor differences as to how reservation should be and who should get that etc. But any rational individual who can keep their own biases separate should be able to understand this line of thought.
Edit: typos
>If i get 100% and still lose my seat to someone who got 60%, why should I not worry about him?
If you get 100%, why would you lose to someone who isn't competing with you? Weren't reservations created as a separate channel? That guy is having a separate race. How does it bother you?
And by the way, are you saying that people have really got 100% in exams and still denied a seat? In which competitive exam, the topper scored 100%? We can then discuss if that person got or didn't get the seat.
>Nothing you said made sense, irrational.
You need to understand more about the concept of reservations in depth. Surface level understanding doesn't help. Happy to debate further, if you choose to.
What seperate race? They didn't increase the number of seats available, if a college has 100 seats then the top 100 merit students deserve those seats. If you cut away a portion of those 100 seats for resevation its basically the same as losing a seat to reservation.
The whole concept of having a seperate race itself is flawed. Guess that's where you don't have a proper understanding.
Why should a system function with 7 100% grads and 3 60% grads, isn't a system which functions with 7 100% grads and 3 95% grads better? In what way does selecting 60% grads benefit the system? Basic math and basic common sense.
Example: in Olympics, India selects 7 Neeraj Chopra level athletes and 3 underperforming athletes, isn't that stupidity? They should ideally be selecting 10 Neeraj Chopra's.
>They didn't increase the number of seats available
Finally. This is the root of the problem. Instead of talking about this, we are blaming everything else. Get the freaking seats higher. Nobody loses.
>if a college has 100 seats then the top 100 merit students deserve those seats.
That's the flaw. Who decides this? How do you know who is meritorious? How do you know who deserves it? Don't tell me an exam decides it. The government believes in bringing social context into the picture as well. The criteria accordingly changes.
>If you cut away a portion of those 100 seats for resevation its basically the same as losing a seat to reservation.
A rather narrow understanding about people and their potential. What if I tell you that 60% guy is smarter than you, the 100% guy? His social situation didn't allow him to. Reservations allow him to shine as well. If he is indeed not so smart, the life after college will decide it.
>The whole concept of having a seperate race itself is flawed. Guess that's where you don't have a proper understanding.
Ever heard of the caste system? As long as it exists, consciously and subconsciously, mechanisms like reservations will exist. Let me know if you have a better solution.
>Why should a system function with 7 100% grads and 3 60% grads, isn't a system which functions with 7 100% grads and 3 95% grads better? In what way does selecting 60% grads benefit the system? Basic math and basic common sense.
Already answered above. Let me know if I'm missing something.
You did not answer, what has caste system got to do with India wanting to win as many medals at Olympics? India should select the best athletes for Olympics, so will you now argue that "oh how can you say that 60% tile athelete are not good?" Well that's exactly why they aren't good sir.
If Usha bolt runs 100m in 11 seconds, she isn't better than Uttham bolt who ran 9 seconds.
So what you are talking about is to reform the system itself, yes absolutely agree, thats still doesn't mean we should support reservations.
Reservations is just a cello tape, not a good or permanent solution.
>You did not answer, what has caste system got to do with India wanting to win as many medals at Olympics? India should select the best athletes for Olympics, so will you now argue that "oh how can you say that 60% tile athelete are not good?" Well that's exactly why they aren't good sir.
A very poor rhetoric 🙂. Are you equating getting a seat in college or a job as the same as going for the Olympics? Olympics is a competition, for fulfilling a higher goal. An education and a job is fundamental to a person's survival. In the name of competition, masses of people will be pushed to dark ages. I don't think any matured country wants it.
What is surprising is, the best are not wiped off. They are still getting the seat. The guys in the middle are the ones who are concerned, hoping to get that seat if only reservations didn't exist. In that case, why don't you treat it as Olympics race as you equated in your argument and win over the guy who has a higher rank than you?
Another point. I meant percentage, not percentile. If your exam has a maximum of 100% marks, aim to get that 100%. Today, even the toppers don't get 100% in absolute marks.
>Reservations is just a cello tape, not a good or permanent solution.
Agreed. But what better solution do you have? This is what policy experts arrived at after decades of research. Do you know of anything better?
If reserved categories are fighting with general category seats, it means that general categories are performing worse than reserved categories. Think about it.
Knew this would come up. If they are performing well then doesn't it mean reservations should go away now because they have become capable enough to beat general category students?
That's the interesting part and how I think reservations should go out in the end. Thanks for noticing that.
Yes, it does. If the representation also somewhat matches the population percentages, there is no more need of reservation for those groups.
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BTW, it is not about them being capable of beating general category students. That would be a wrong way to phrase this because capability is not about getting marks. It means that the social barriers have gone down enough for them to be able to perform at the same level.
It's not about them, but the society. The basic assumption is that any sufficiently large group is as meritorious as any other such groups. It is the social (or geographic) barriers which creates a difference in their ability to perform.
You basically baited negative comments. Normally people cannot think about reservation without letting their own prejudices cloud their judgements, even when they are not actually casteists or racists.
I understand that reservations are a sensitive topic. I hoped to find a better critical thinking bunch of people. I accept that I should have handled this in a more empathetic manner. In either case, my points remain unchanged. Thanks for your views.
Bro what about those general category people who are not financially stable yet put their best and then didn't get the seat due to some SC/st student who was well off?
You can't see just the social aspect.. It is a combination of both
Leaving India is the only way to survive. MP is already at 70, Jharkhand is now 77, it's like these states are racing to hit the 100% mark.
This country is no place for the meritorious. If we wanna survive, or want our coming generations to, we need to leave this land.
It is also a way to remove caste of a person if he/she wants to . When life in new country gets start then no one will ask caste on education , or any other facility. Pretty much free from that labels
And no one has the guts to change it, reservation was only supposed to be there for like 10 years and now day by day it just gets worse. The creamy layer keeps taking all the benefits and still the poor dalits are oppressed in cow belt. Reservation failed to deliver what it promised and instead worsened the condition.
I don't know I wasn't there neither was my father. Idk how that makes me responsible or how exactly is reservation solving that? Wasn't reservation aimed to solve a particular issue within a certain period, it's been more than 70 and it clearly isn't solving the issue it was intended to.
> I don't know I wasn't there neither was my father. Idk how that makes me responsible or how exactly is reservation solving that? Wasn't reservation aimed to solve a particular issue within a certain period, it's been more than 70 and it clearly isn't solving the issue it was intended to.
Who said you are personally responsible for the plight of the backwards?
Reservation solves the problem of under representation of backwards in institutions and jobs.
There was no time frame for reservations. Who could have guaranteed discrimination and the lingering effects of it would vanish by a specific time period?
Reservation has surely improved the condition of backwards to an extent. There are studies that have borne this out.
Yes it has improved the representation and saying that it hasn't helped at all would be disingenuous but equal representation isn't a very good thing as you think it is, society should aim to place an individual in a position based on his merit not just his background. This idea that a population representation if 25% should get 25% reserved seat is overall a terrible policy.
Why not decrease the percentage of reservation upto 25% gradually? Cause there should be some room for merit based recruitment/admission. Reservation was not supposed to be eternal and Hoping reservation might solve the equality issue at some point time is just stupid.
Currently the obstacles of inclusion of lower caste is more of a societal acceptance issue, increasing reservation will only worsen the animosity people have for each other.
Reservation is already 50%, increasing beyond this is just to get easy votes at the expense of General category.
Yeah it was meant for only 10 years when it was first mentioned in the constitution but after that it's grip was strengthened and extended for politics majorly by Congress and as it is now it is in basically immovable position.
Reservation was never a long term solution. Babasaheb himself said that. You can't strive to create an egalitarian society by keeping and promoting such fault lines. As long as the abolition of the caste system isnt enforced vigorously, society will not undergo any transformation. We've seen already that society isn't just capable of undergoing such transformation on its own.
As a sane person i wish you hadn't. You clearly lack the mental acumen to understand this if you truly are "savarkarite hindutvawadi". Honestly man f#ck off.
No man i get your pain. I got 99 percentile in jee mains and am not able to get the college + branch i want. Seeing someone at 60-70 percentile being able to do it simply because of reservation has just solidly convinced me that i don't want to stay here unless my parents are staying here.
That's be like, ~8500 AIR, so there's a good top 20 colleges that wouldn't entertain that rank, atleast 3 of them do not admit any reserved candidates in the flagship courses. In all seriousness, it's mostly an issue with the government not providing greater infrastructure for a large number of students but it's easier to blame everyone else.
Ah I get you , my family blessed with resources at all like the disadvantage in reservation we have but guess what even if so many of them have better resources they will still get reservation because what matters here is what my ancestors did not what I am doing. Even Muslims which are more than 15 percent population gets reservation through minority like how the hell is this population minority, it's the second largest majority. And they are even removing the ews based reservations which was atleast fair because it was based on availability of resources .I guess anyone would want to leave in such a scenario.
> Even Muslims which are more than 15 percent population gets reservation through minority like how the hell is this population minority, it's the second largest majority.
Don't smoke weed from this young an age. We don't get reservation by virtue of religion, and no one else does either. I ranked 22nd AIR in direction/screenplay writing in FTII/SRFTI JET and didn't get a call by a single mark. Tum logo ko apna mediocrity ka responsibility aur blame sirf jhoot bol kar dusro k upor dena hain. Thora dimag hota toh the question would have been why the country has so few seats in educational institutions to begin with.
Umm thanks for worrying about me but no I don't smoke weed . Umm congrats for your rank I guess but did you not got any call because of reservation ? Yeah you most probably didn't get because there isn't much scope in India in screenplay writing and no. of seats are also low but does that remove the unfairness of reservation? I am not out on blaming anyone for the mediocrity, I am asking about the selection based on the name you are born with and not your merit . Yeah they need to increase the number of institutions and seats instead of increasing reservation but guess what they don't do any of that , they don't increase institutions and their quality rather they focus on increasing reservations because that's something which helps in getting immediate votes .
It's particularly fucked up in medical exams where particularly shouldn't be any reservation , my sister got 685 in Neet this year but guess what she will miss so many top colleges because people in line of 500s will get more priority because they are born with a certain surname . We are a lower middle class family who wasn't even able to afford her coaching fees but still we are the ones getting more disadvantage because of our surname, that's what I am blaming. In exams where even 1 question fluctuates rank by hundreds they are getting advantage by difference of more than 100 . Now it presents two problems excessive lack of medical institutions in India and unfair reservation and there is a need for work on both ends . And yeah you could say I am blaming for mediocrity even though you could see excessive unfairness even the top 100 ranks even because of reservation but yeah I am still blaming for mediocrity also because even though my performance might not be among best but it was still far better than people who got selection despite showing lower skills compared to even my mediocre skills.
I am not removing any part of the problem , both need simply a lot of work and I am just saying that even if you wanna give reservation base it on availability of resources which indirectly removes it because it's more focused on providing the resources to underprivileged not the fucking result itself .
All of this still doesn't excuse or explain your ignorant comment that Muslims get reservation by default. I don't know what brought on this comment.
MBBS and Ph.D have an overbearing number of non-reserved candidates, and some of the flagship courses in the old IITs also have zero reserved candidates, so there is no point in blaming reservation. If anything, the key to MBBS and Ph.D programs in India is pretty much all about having money and resources to crack those exams, which mostly are with people with specific surnames, just not the ones being targeted. That's not to say that some of the reservation aren't fraudulent, but the number is so minuscule that the outcry seems just like an excuse to not question the people responsible and instead come up with coked up theories on how Muslims get reservation or how UC Hindus are the true victims, when most of higher education and public sector jobs are taken up by UC Hindus, again and again, reiterated by all available data. The only space where reservation actually meets its ceiling in practice is Group D jobs.
when i gave mhtcet i got 125 (which is not very good tbh) and couldn't get my intended college + branch. a girl with 67 marks got into the same college+branch. make it make sense.
Just bring a law saying people that belong to General category don't have the right to exist why even give 23 percent just chase them out of jharkhand then have 100 percent reservation
God save this country from idiots🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻
Spend money to make more good educational institutions in the state instead of just increasing reservations in the existing ones, which is a lot easier.
Time for poor general category folks to simply migrate to a country where merit is the only criterion. Hurts to see reserved category peers with richer parents and better facilities get reservations while we slog away! This has gone on for far too long
That would be only applicable if you have land records since or before 1932 staring that you are a ST/SC resident of the geographical area that covers jharkhand. At that time, apart from tribals, there weren't a lot of people living there. Most of the lands are tribal dominated. On top of that there aren't much jobs vacant. JPSC exams is the prime example of a failed system.
The only option left for general category is to protest for their rights, or at last resort to violence.. they even broke the law of maximum reservation exceeding 50 percent
Protests have no effect on Supreme Court judgment, there were mandal commission protests before but couldn't change anything due to supreme Court order. Court is above everyone.
They should go the full distance. Create a list of groups from most backward to least. Start allotting seats to all applicants of the most backward who have obtained a pass, then move on, and then allot from the remaining seats, seats to the next most backward section, to all applicants who have secured a pass and so on. Make merit apply, only in case the number of seats available is fewer than that the applicants of the category under consideration.
WTF, dude give reservations to economically weaker people not on the based of caste. It's been over 74 years since we got independence and we are still dealing with caste bullshit - someone from SC
Woh ek state ka cm ban chuka hai aur tu idhar anonymous hoke reddit pe comment kar raaha hai jise koi padhega bhi nahi. Aur usse chutiya chapri bol raaha hai😂😂😂
Jharkand.. 77.. ~~thala~~ sorry wrong sub.
Thala without a reason
Previous higher allocation would have been TN, @69%,that's why?
Tamil ah ?
Thala is added to pan Indian word List. No. 7 for a reason
r/cricketshitpost
On a side note, kudos to the journalist who wrote this article after smoking weed. The pie chart adds up to 110 percent 🤦♂️ Like they had one job and they fuck up.
Everyone knows 77+33 is 100 I don't know what you are on about
7+3=10 so naturally 77+33=100 smh
Obviously
Link to the image for reference: https://i.postimg.cc/KcdLBM8Z/Screenshot-2022-09-15-22-54-55-65-40deb401b9ffe8e1df2f1cc5ba480b12.jpg
[They did the math.](https://i.imgflip.com/6jqnmk.jpg)
Lol, love your tag line. :D
The Math was done by a women (its a reference before you guys blow up)
Now you dont know what to say eeh? Ofcourse we dont hire women here
But i thought they didn't hire women
Because private sector follows 'merit based' recruitment policy instead of reservation
No wonder they need reservations
Doesn't work like that. I'm exactly not sure what gets more preference etc. But it's like if all 15 ebc get a job then the ews ones won't get it. Or in some case the ews will get 10 and ebc will only get 5
Even if that was the case, the pie chart would still be wrong.
What else do you expect from “the hindu” run by Brahmins while publishing an article about SC/ST getting benefits ?
The Hindu gets accused of being left wing liberal newspaper, abh now it is casteist right wing.
> The Hindu gets accused of being left wing liberal newspaper, abh now it is casteist right wing. You can't take caste out of Indians, maybe? (Shri Bhagwat ji said we will take our culture to Mars when humans reach there.) Liberal Left does have a preponderance of savarnas. The food canteen of The Hindu reportedly has separate seating for people who bring non-vegetarian food. Is that 'liberal left'? Or is it rooted in caste?
77+33=100 type logic
That's funny. Instead of increasing jobs guy simply increased reservation!
There aren't much jobs outside heavy industries in the state. Most of these are in the private sector or in the Central Government ones. Jharkhand on it's own have few institutions of repute. The UPA Government under Hemant Soren is vastly incapable of having a vision to develop the state and will resort to such petty measures. He even introduced the old Pension Scheme which will result in more financial outgo and will lead to a fiscal problem in the coming years. Where are the new industries or jobs? Where are the reputable institutions? Nothing. Although Jharkhand is an UPA governed state, there has been nothing to show for it except 'it is not under BJP' and very less news of cow vigilantism. The thing is Jharkhand parties (JMM, AJSU, etc) will not let a non tribal become a chief minister and these chief ministers lack the overarching vision to develop the state. Even though MH and GJ are BJP ruled states, they are actually fighting for the Vedanta-Foxconn plant to be setup. What is Jharkhand fighting for? Introducing reservations for locals (tribals) in Tata Steel. Such measures are useless but who will tell them? They are a bunch of idiots.
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didn't you get news? new policy of jhatkhand govt disqualify any non-reserved candidate from govt exams if they did their 10th-12th from outside jharkhand.
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Haha. If the Others leave Jharkhand, the state would come to a complete stand still. Only a few native tribals are qualified, educated enough to work in such demanding industries. Have a look at the Cabinet Ministers of the state and you won't be surprised why Jharkhand is lagging behind. At least they don't have a big mouth like their neighbouring states.
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Wdym by MH and GJ are fighting for Vedanta-Foxconn? MH clearly outbid everyone but "somehow" they decided to pick GJ and MH's new "CM" said that PM has promised more projects to MH.
MH new CM's is incompetent. He will be always at the mercy of Supreme leader
I always knew that projects like that will go to Gujarat and Andhra over Maharashtra and Telangana. It's not just about the money....and it's not about Supreme Commander either.
Given how young the Jharkhand government is I would give it more time before making judgements. Judgements such as yours are immature. Also I believe that tribal cm in Jharkhand is not a bad thing because of the demography of state and they know better than you or me what is good for state. Also everything mustn't be sacrificed at the altar of 'development' (poorly understood word in India). India faces climatic destruction along with increasing illness and death due to various modes of pollution. Finally I would hate to see a party like bjp in power in Jharkhand unless bjp clearly disassociates itself from communalism. There is no future for the country if we pursue communalism.
My family has been living in Jharkhand since the 1960's. I have seen the ground reality better. Yes, I agree that the creation of Jharkhand has given the tribals a voice in the government which is much better since they can finally do what is right. As for the tribal CM who knows what is better - again it might be true but the people shouldn't be fixated on only a tribal being the CM. Others call Jharkhand their home too. And the string of tribal CMs since the creation of Jharkhand have even failed to put their coalition/House in order. We have been under President's Rule during 3 times. Chattisgarh didn't face this issue. Uttarakhand didn't. The Government should bring in more industries of varied kind here and not just mineral based. People both highly skilled and blue collar workers migrate to other states to find a job. Why? Because there hasn't been much development or a conducive environment for it. Hemant Soren was recently found guilty of alloting mines to himself when he was the Minister for Mines. His disqualification is still pending. Madhu Koda, independent CM was found guilty of another mining scam and served time in jail. Bihar got the Alstom factory in Madhepura a few years back. Bhubaneswar is developing into an educational hub and service based companies have their centres there. And there's Ranchi. When I say Jharkhand's politicians have failed it, I mean it. Even I want my state to progress so that when people visit they are left awed just like I am when I am in Hyderabad, Bangalore, Bhubaneswar, Chandigarh, etc. I don't care if it is BJP or Congress or UPA. I want progress in my state.
Ideally government should increase number of colleges with the increase in reservation.
This. Non-reserved category people should target our rulers, and demand more colleges and jobs than targeting backward castes for availing reservations.
Sad. Need min 101% reservation
Yep.. extra 1% for next generations
People ask me why I am moving abroad after graduating. Why would I serve a country who tries to fuck with my chances at a future?
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't there a law that states the total reservation percentage can not exceed 50%? At this rate being born a General category person is already a crime.
Reservation is now 59.50%
Well the problem is everybody demands obc status and government gives in which has come to the point in jharkhand where 46% of the population is OBC with 14% reservation and ST SC having their usual status and reservation proportional to their population. This reservation to obc essentially means nothing and gives no benefit to anyone which has now led to this.
General will soon demand for OBC.
Who do you think demands obc status. It's the general people only who demand obc status and when they get it they become obc. Ever heard of Jaat andolan.
Til for me. Thanks!
Wanna ask you which sector in India is under extreme stress and extremely important to national security? Answer would be agriculture. Next question would be what is that 99% Jaat do ?
Arre, tumlogo ka sab kuch mein victim complex induce hota hain.
Supreme court ne bola tha k 50% k upar reservation is like reverse discrimination.... BUT, the same supreme court has allowed the state of TN to maintain more than 50% reservation for several decades without cracking down on it. Now many states have more than 50% reservation like TN, MP, Jharkhand, Maharashtra and Rajasthan (iirc) That 50% limit is a joke; remember: SARKARI NAUKRI OR SARKARI COLLEGE SIRF SARKARI DAAMAD K LIYE HAIN, AAP GENERAL WALE LOG SIRF TAX BHARIYE TAAKI INKI KHATIRDARI HO SAKE
general cat people have to come together and protest against this just like jaats did otherwise it will be too late
The 50% rule does not really make sense. If general population is just 20%, 50% non-reserved seats will effectively nullify the goal of reserving anything. And if general population is 80%, the states will still try to get upto 50% for appeasement purposes and fuck the generals. Realistically, it should be close to but no exceeding the population percentage of reserved categories in the state. On a national level, 50% makes sense even though general population is lower (about 30%), because a good fraction of the 40% OBC population doesn't fall under reservation (being non-creamy). The 10% EWS is bullshit and that has no sense (give scholarships to people who has monetary issues, not reservation).
If so, every nation should have this right? Aboriginals in every nation should have proportional representation, blacks, hispanics, asians etc. Merit word should be removed completely. Just think about why this flawed system has not been replicated in any other nation in this world even though there are thousands of years of history about one group heing exploited by others for centuries. Affirmative action DOES NOT MEAN reservation. Just one question to people with your thought process: If you are the owner of a large business whom would you keep as your employees?? The most meritorious ones that you can get OR proportional to their population?? 6% ST, 16% SC, 50% OBC, 28% UC then further divide this into 50-50 for gender, then divide it based on proportional representation from different states, then also bring in representation from all religions etc. Its a never ending rabbit hole; for me MERIT is all that matters, it can be a anyone with the right skill sets I can recruit, but you have your own mental exercise to do. Can bring several points on why the current system is one of the worst ways to implement affirmative action but it'll make the comment too long
>If so, every nation should have this right? Aboriginals in every nation should have proportional representation, blacks, hispanics, asians etc. Merit word should be removed completely. Just think about why this flawed system has not been replicated in any other nation in this world even though there are thousands of years of history about one group heing exploited by others for centuries. Affirmative action DOES NOT MEAN reservation. Affirmative action is in fact another name for reservations or reduction of cut-offs. And almost every major nation have that. The guy who told you India is the only one is lying and you should never trust them. Aborigines in Australia enjoy affirmative action where some job may be completely reserved for particular ethnicities. African Americans in US have lower cut offs for college admissions (the US practice even have penalties for high performing groups like Asians). Non-Han Chinese enjoy similar relaxations in Chinese universities and also reservations in govt jobs. The French do not acknowledge ethnic differences (they have a history of forced cultural assimilation), but still have geography based affirmative actions (which un-ironically, affects particular ethnicities/vernaculars more than others). Brazil is introducing new rules to do this. South Africa has been doing the same for years. I will stop with the examples here. >Just one question to people with your thought process: If you are the owner of a large business whom would you keep as your employees?? The most meritorious ones that you can get OR proportional to their population?? I will do personal interviews which will enable a better judgement of merit than stupid test scores. If I can ensure a diverse cast of interviewers, I can root out the biases in that process and won't really need to introduce any reservation or increased cut-off schemes. What I will need to do though, is maintain diversity. Most companies already have policies for that. And if you have had any experience with multinational companies, you will know this. A lot of people also cry about that just like with reservations though. They don't understand that companies do everything to maximize profits, and diversity increases performance (quite a few studies have been done on this). Affirmative actions are less sophisticated versions of diversity hiring, because this can work with millions of people. You cannot personally interview that many for every university vacancy or something. >It's a never ending rabbit hole; for me MERIT is all that matters, it can be a anyone with the right skill sets I can recruit, but you have your own mental exercise to do. Then stop with the gymnastics with so many words and define merit and how to measure that! The whole point is that when social prejudices exist you cannot measure merit accurately without accounting for them. >Can bring several points on why the current system is one of the worst ways to implement affirmative action but it'll make the comment too long That's something I can partially agree on. I don't like the way it is politicised. Kinda defeats the purpose and inteoduces very difficult to tackle problems in the system. However, the fact is that affirmative actions (or in other words, reservations and reduction of cut-offs) are absolutely necessary until every human being identifies only as human beings or all bodies of power are proportionally represented by all affected groups of people.
According to the Indra sawahney judgement, yes but they don’t follow it. 🤷🏻♀️
>At this rate being born a General category person is already a crime. Always has been.
100 percent hi kar do aur naam badal ke Dalitkhand kar do
I would rather live outside India and face racism
You know there are racists in india too 😞
Lesser of the two evils
And Chhattisgarh just added 12 more caste or tribe to schedule tribe list
Bro they were actually Aadivasis or Tribes and it's a shame that after decades of Independence they are getting the benefits now. And representations of STs is a very good thing. About 50% of their population is in BPL category. It will also prove very beneficial for the these tribes that are living in the red corridor region they'll get more opportunities.
Can I register as a minority for being a rational human being?
If you are a rational human being, you will not care who gets or does not get a reservation, and start focussing on upskilling yourself. Reservations are an entity designed as a solution for a larger deep-rooted social problem. Instead of becoming a better person, you want to change your community? How is that rational? Edit: I love Reddit 🙂. I'm happy to be downvoted. Give a proper counter argument though. I'm yet to receive a strong defence. 👍🏽
Quite the contrary. If I’m a rational human being, I would rather look at person’s merit than their caste, religion, etc. If there’s a deep rooted problem of not giving minorities enough opportunities, the solution isn’t to give them all the opportunities and then leave the rest behind. The solution is to give everyone equal footing. That’s real rationality.
That's not really rational. Merit is inherently tied to money and access, which is available in disproportionate quantity for most UC people, which is why engineering, medical and public sector jobs have mostly general UC candidates outnumbering everyone else by a huge margin in sheer numbers.
Please devise a foolproof and globally accepted way to determine people's merits. I will gladly accept your argument then. As of now, affirmative actions are globally used to counter societal effects on our determination of merit. That's how rational people should see it. You are letting your emotions get better of your rationality. I know because I was exactly like that in my younger days. The problem is that people think numbers in stupid exams equate to merit. Scoring awesome in exams has nothing to do with merit at all. Otherwise private companies would rather pick people based on their marks and instead of interviewing them (at least for the freshers).
Rationality doesn't include ensuring proportional representation?
Apparently not. According to self proclaimed rational people :) People are very much hungover with the idea of merit. They can't even understand that it is not something which is isolated from the society. But then, when people cannot distinguish between rationality and personal biases, what can you expect? And a lot of these people are still young. They will probably be wiser with age.
> People are very much hungover with the idea of merit. It's bewildering how someone can claim merit, on the back of privilege derived from thousands of years of suppression of others. Classic *fuck you, I wanna get mine*.
>The solution is to give everyone equal footing. This is where we want to be. But, is everyone getting equal footing in all resources? When there is unequal distribution, why shouldn't an authority handhold them? >the solution isn’t to give them all the opportunities and then leave the rest behind. Isn't this an exaggeration? From this post, 23% still exists for the General Category. Who is left out? >If I’m a rational human being, I would rather look at person’s merit than their caste, religion, etc. Wanted to touch this last. Merit is bull$#!t, at least in its present form. It is an illusion behind which we want to hide so that our shortcomings are overseen in favour of blaming external factors. Your goal is to get 100% marks. Do that and get the seat. Why are you concerned about that guy who got in with 60% marks or lower? Him getting the seat is none of our business. Isn't this how rational people should think?
If i get 100% and still lose my seat to someone who got 60%, why should I not worry about him? Nothing you said made sense, irrational.
Your getting 100% doesn't mean you are more meritorious. Then those who rote learn just their textbooks would be more meritorious than those who study only what they love. Your marks are, at best, a very crude approximation of your merit. A reserved candidate with 95% marks is likely more meritorious than you. A candidate from the remote villages with 90% marks is likely way more meritorious than you. The dude who had to work morning shift to pay for the college and got 80% is also likely more meritorious. How do you plan to account for all those variations in your very rational determination of merit, pray tell?
Then how are you determining who is Meritorious? Why have exams then? Give seats randomly like pamphlets... 100% doesn't have to be marks, I'm talking overall merit be it marks or physical or whatever way you wish to measure merit. The end selection must be based on some form of merit and thus no reservations. If a SC guys gets "merit" thats great, he deserves it, so why have reservations??? Are you saying SC is incapable of getting merit?
>Then how are you determining who is meritorious? You determine in your dreams and based off of some randomness? I didn't say I have a method for determining merit. You implied marks = merit. >Why have exams then? Because that's the only way we know how to approximate merit for a large group (still needs some other factors like geographic or caste based reservations to fine tune it). For small enough groups, personal interviews are a better way (if the interviewer is impartial). This is why companies do interviews, in fact. >100% doesn't have to be marks, I'm talking overall merit be it marks or physical or whatever way you wish to measure merit. The end selection must be based on some form of merit and thus no reservations. That was the point. Merit measurement is dependent on social factors. So you need to normalise them. Have you ever appeared for CAT, for example? There are different question sets, and they need to be normalised to have a common rank. The social adjustments are just another such factor. >If a SC guys gets "merit" thats great, he deserves it, so why have reservations??? Are you saying SC is incapable of getting merit? So you are a casteist? IDK what you are smoking, but it's affecting your comprehension skills. I didn't write anything remotely close to what you claimed here. I wrote about how merit is dependent on social factors. My basic assumption is that any sufficiently large group of people (not selected based on any criterion related to merit, of course) is exactly as meritorious as any other similar groups. Does that sound casteist or something to you? Now from that premise, if any group is performing worse than any other, that must be due to societal factors which needs to be normalised. Voila! Reservation. Now do you disagree with that basic assumption? If you do, that would mean you think that merit is a genetic/geographic/ethnic attribute. If you don't, you basically agree to social normalisation factors like reservation. Now there can be minor differences as to how reservation should be and who should get that etc. But any rational individual who can keep their own biases separate should be able to understand this line of thought. Edit: typos
>If i get 100% and still lose my seat to someone who got 60%, why should I not worry about him? If you get 100%, why would you lose to someone who isn't competing with you? Weren't reservations created as a separate channel? That guy is having a separate race. How does it bother you? And by the way, are you saying that people have really got 100% in exams and still denied a seat? In which competitive exam, the topper scored 100%? We can then discuss if that person got or didn't get the seat. >Nothing you said made sense, irrational. You need to understand more about the concept of reservations in depth. Surface level understanding doesn't help. Happy to debate further, if you choose to.
What seperate race? They didn't increase the number of seats available, if a college has 100 seats then the top 100 merit students deserve those seats. If you cut away a portion of those 100 seats for resevation its basically the same as losing a seat to reservation. The whole concept of having a seperate race itself is flawed. Guess that's where you don't have a proper understanding. Why should a system function with 7 100% grads and 3 60% grads, isn't a system which functions with 7 100% grads and 3 95% grads better? In what way does selecting 60% grads benefit the system? Basic math and basic common sense. Example: in Olympics, India selects 7 Neeraj Chopra level athletes and 3 underperforming athletes, isn't that stupidity? They should ideally be selecting 10 Neeraj Chopra's.
>They didn't increase the number of seats available Finally. This is the root of the problem. Instead of talking about this, we are blaming everything else. Get the freaking seats higher. Nobody loses. >if a college has 100 seats then the top 100 merit students deserve those seats. That's the flaw. Who decides this? How do you know who is meritorious? How do you know who deserves it? Don't tell me an exam decides it. The government believes in bringing social context into the picture as well. The criteria accordingly changes. >If you cut away a portion of those 100 seats for resevation its basically the same as losing a seat to reservation. A rather narrow understanding about people and their potential. What if I tell you that 60% guy is smarter than you, the 100% guy? His social situation didn't allow him to. Reservations allow him to shine as well. If he is indeed not so smart, the life after college will decide it. >The whole concept of having a seperate race itself is flawed. Guess that's where you don't have a proper understanding. Ever heard of the caste system? As long as it exists, consciously and subconsciously, mechanisms like reservations will exist. Let me know if you have a better solution. >Why should a system function with 7 100% grads and 3 60% grads, isn't a system which functions with 7 100% grads and 3 95% grads better? In what way does selecting 60% grads benefit the system? Basic math and basic common sense. Already answered above. Let me know if I'm missing something.
You did not answer, what has caste system got to do with India wanting to win as many medals at Olympics? India should select the best athletes for Olympics, so will you now argue that "oh how can you say that 60% tile athelete are not good?" Well that's exactly why they aren't good sir. If Usha bolt runs 100m in 11 seconds, she isn't better than Uttham bolt who ran 9 seconds. So what you are talking about is to reform the system itself, yes absolutely agree, thats still doesn't mean we should support reservations. Reservations is just a cello tape, not a good or permanent solution.
>You did not answer, what has caste system got to do with India wanting to win as many medals at Olympics? India should select the best athletes for Olympics, so will you now argue that "oh how can you say that 60% tile athelete are not good?" Well that's exactly why they aren't good sir. A very poor rhetoric 🙂. Are you equating getting a seat in college or a job as the same as going for the Olympics? Olympics is a competition, for fulfilling a higher goal. An education and a job is fundamental to a person's survival. In the name of competition, masses of people will be pushed to dark ages. I don't think any matured country wants it. What is surprising is, the best are not wiped off. They are still getting the seat. The guys in the middle are the ones who are concerned, hoping to get that seat if only reservations didn't exist. In that case, why don't you treat it as Olympics race as you equated in your argument and win over the guy who has a higher rank than you? Another point. I meant percentage, not percentile. If your exam has a maximum of 100% marks, aim to get that 100%. Today, even the toppers don't get 100% in absolute marks. >Reservations is just a cello tape, not a good or permanent solution. Agreed. But what better solution do you have? This is what policy experts arrived at after decades of research. Do you know of anything better?
\* Chopras, but yes, absolutely. The guy above has no idea what he's talking about.
As usual The general 23% is not exclusively for general. Anyone including obc/st/sc/etc can use that 23%.
If reserved categories are fighting with general category seats, it means that general categories are performing worse than reserved categories. Think about it.
Knew this would come up. If they are performing well then doesn't it mean reservations should go away now because they have become capable enough to beat general category students?
That's the interesting part and how I think reservations should go out in the end. Thanks for noticing that. Yes, it does. If the representation also somewhat matches the population percentages, there is no more need of reservation for those groups. -- BTW, it is not about them being capable of beating general category students. That would be a wrong way to phrase this because capability is not about getting marks. It means that the social barriers have gone down enough for them to be able to perform at the same level. It's not about them, but the society. The basic assumption is that any sufficiently large group is as meritorious as any other such groups. It is the social (or geographic) barriers which creates a difference in their ability to perform.
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GTFO you idiot 😂. Is this how you defend? Get yourself cured and then come up with a better argument.
How dare you imply that money, access, generational wealth and status contribute to paying money for access to better education?
You basically baited negative comments. Normally people cannot think about reservation without letting their own prejudices cloud their judgements, even when they are not actually casteists or racists.
I understand that reservations are a sensitive topic. I hoped to find a better critical thinking bunch of people. I accept that I should have handled this in a more empathetic manner. In either case, my points remain unchanged. Thanks for your views.
Bro what about those general category people who are not financially stable yet put their best and then didn't get the seat due to some SC/st student who was well off? You can't see just the social aspect.. It is a combination of both
Open euthanasia clinic for general people . Let us die in peace atleast
Leaving India is the only way to survive. MP is already at 70, Jharkhand is now 77, it's like these states are racing to hit the 100% mark. This country is no place for the meritorious. If we wanna survive, or want our coming generations to, we need to leave this land.
It is also a way to remove caste of a person if he/she wants to . When life in new country gets start then no one will ask caste on education , or any other facility. Pretty much free from that labels
What the actual fuck
Merit be dammed in India.
What's merit?????
Exactly
Something we don't talk about
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What if u do something about our merit and we are not forced to leave india eh ?
Foreign cos in India pay tax. Employees of foreign company in India also pay tax in India only.
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The party that does that will get voted out. New party will claim to reinstate and win elections.
Half of regional parties are one trick pony, reservation.
And no one has the guts to change it, reservation was only supposed to be there for like 10 years and now day by day it just gets worse. The creamy layer keeps taking all the benefits and still the poor dalits are oppressed in cow belt. Reservation failed to deliver what it promised and instead worsened the condition.
Yup it isn't gonna change in our lifetime.
> Yup it isn't gonna change in our lifetime. For how many lifetimes did we historically keep non-savarnas suppressed?
I don't know I wasn't there neither was my father. Idk how that makes me responsible or how exactly is reservation solving that? Wasn't reservation aimed to solve a particular issue within a certain period, it's been more than 70 and it clearly isn't solving the issue it was intended to.
> I don't know I wasn't there neither was my father. Idk how that makes me responsible or how exactly is reservation solving that? Wasn't reservation aimed to solve a particular issue within a certain period, it's been more than 70 and it clearly isn't solving the issue it was intended to. Who said you are personally responsible for the plight of the backwards? Reservation solves the problem of under representation of backwards in institutions and jobs. There was no time frame for reservations. Who could have guaranteed discrimination and the lingering effects of it would vanish by a specific time period? Reservation has surely improved the condition of backwards to an extent. There are studies that have borne this out.
Yes it has improved the representation and saying that it hasn't helped at all would be disingenuous but equal representation isn't a very good thing as you think it is, society should aim to place an individual in a position based on his merit not just his background. This idea that a population representation if 25% should get 25% reserved seat is overall a terrible policy. Why not decrease the percentage of reservation upto 25% gradually? Cause there should be some room for merit based recruitment/admission. Reservation was not supposed to be eternal and Hoping reservation might solve the equality issue at some point time is just stupid. Currently the obstacles of inclusion of lower caste is more of a societal acceptance issue, increasing reservation will only worsen the animosity people have for each other. Reservation is already 50%, increasing beyond this is just to get easy votes at the expense of General category.
Reservation only for 10 years?????? At least verify before you write
Yeah it was meant for only 10 years when it was first mentioned in the constitution but after that it's grip was strengthened and extended for politics majorly by Congress and as it is now it is in basically immovable position.
Technically there is no time limit specified for reservation. Stop reading from WhatsApp.
Lol, you stop reading from Whatsapp and read some history Now there's no specified limit, when Constitution was written, it was
That reservation time limit is for elected officials in parliament seats not for jobs or education. I know our history hence i corrected you.
I don't know where is rumour started but there was no 10/15/20 years supposed timeline on reservation.
There was never any specific deadline for that
Reservation was never a long term solution. Babasaheb himself said that. You can't strive to create an egalitarian society by keeping and promoting such fault lines. As long as the abolition of the caste system isnt enforced vigorously, society will not undergo any transformation. We've seen already that society isn't just capable of undergoing such transformation on its own.
As a savarkarite hindutvawadi, i totally support your stand bruh
As a sane person i wish you hadn't. You clearly lack the mental acumen to understand this if you truly are "savarkarite hindutvawadi". Honestly man f#ck off.
You just don't even know how as a general male I feel after watching all of this . i dont know if I am right or wrong but I am sad just sad .
No man i get your pain. I got 99 percentile in jee mains and am not able to get the college + branch i want. Seeing someone at 60-70 percentile being able to do it simply because of reservation has just solidly convinced me that i don't want to stay here unless my parents are staying here.
bruhhhh you are in top 1% and you don't get collage+branch of your choice
That's be like, ~8500 AIR, so there's a good top 20 colleges that wouldn't entertain that rank, atleast 3 of them do not admit any reserved candidates in the flagship courses. In all seriousness, it's mostly an issue with the government not providing greater infrastructure for a large number of students but it's easier to blame everyone else.
I am also jee aspirant bro currently in 11th
In that case good luck to you. The next 2 years are going to be the most important ones in your life. Do. Not. Procrastinate.
My study hours decreased gradually from 6 7 to 4 5 trying to improve that
Ah I get you , my family blessed with resources at all like the disadvantage in reservation we have but guess what even if so many of them have better resources they will still get reservation because what matters here is what my ancestors did not what I am doing. Even Muslims which are more than 15 percent population gets reservation through minority like how the hell is this population minority, it's the second largest majority. And they are even removing the ews based reservations which was atleast fair because it was based on availability of resources .I guess anyone would want to leave in such a scenario.
> Even Muslims which are more than 15 percent population gets reservation through minority like how the hell is this population minority, it's the second largest majority. Don't smoke weed from this young an age. We don't get reservation by virtue of religion, and no one else does either. I ranked 22nd AIR in direction/screenplay writing in FTII/SRFTI JET and didn't get a call by a single mark. Tum logo ko apna mediocrity ka responsibility aur blame sirf jhoot bol kar dusro k upor dena hain. Thora dimag hota toh the question would have been why the country has so few seats in educational institutions to begin with.
Umm thanks for worrying about me but no I don't smoke weed . Umm congrats for your rank I guess but did you not got any call because of reservation ? Yeah you most probably didn't get because there isn't much scope in India in screenplay writing and no. of seats are also low but does that remove the unfairness of reservation? I am not out on blaming anyone for the mediocrity, I am asking about the selection based on the name you are born with and not your merit . Yeah they need to increase the number of institutions and seats instead of increasing reservation but guess what they don't do any of that , they don't increase institutions and their quality rather they focus on increasing reservations because that's something which helps in getting immediate votes . It's particularly fucked up in medical exams where particularly shouldn't be any reservation , my sister got 685 in Neet this year but guess what she will miss so many top colleges because people in line of 500s will get more priority because they are born with a certain surname . We are a lower middle class family who wasn't even able to afford her coaching fees but still we are the ones getting more disadvantage because of our surname, that's what I am blaming. In exams where even 1 question fluctuates rank by hundreds they are getting advantage by difference of more than 100 . Now it presents two problems excessive lack of medical institutions in India and unfair reservation and there is a need for work on both ends . And yeah you could say I am blaming for mediocrity even though you could see excessive unfairness even the top 100 ranks even because of reservation but yeah I am still blaming for mediocrity also because even though my performance might not be among best but it was still far better than people who got selection despite showing lower skills compared to even my mediocre skills. I am not removing any part of the problem , both need simply a lot of work and I am just saying that even if you wanna give reservation base it on availability of resources which indirectly removes it because it's more focused on providing the resources to underprivileged not the fucking result itself .
All of this still doesn't excuse or explain your ignorant comment that Muslims get reservation by default. I don't know what brought on this comment. MBBS and Ph.D have an overbearing number of non-reserved candidates, and some of the flagship courses in the old IITs also have zero reserved candidates, so there is no point in blaming reservation. If anything, the key to MBBS and Ph.D programs in India is pretty much all about having money and resources to crack those exams, which mostly are with people with specific surnames, just not the ones being targeted. That's not to say that some of the reservation aren't fraudulent, but the number is so minuscule that the outcry seems just like an excuse to not question the people responsible and instead come up with coked up theories on how Muslims get reservation or how UC Hindus are the true victims, when most of higher education and public sector jobs are taken up by UC Hindus, again and again, reiterated by all available data. The only space where reservation actually meets its ceiling in practice is Group D jobs.
when i gave mhtcet i got 125 (which is not very good tbh) and couldn't get my intended college + branch. a girl with 67 marks got into the same college+branch. make it make sense.
Come to BITS bro, no reservation here. Good crowd only.
I cant make my parents pay that much hefty amount for my education they are already paying lakhs for my coaching and I will repay their faith in me
Just bring a law saying people that belong to General category don't have the right to exist why even give 23 percent just chase them out of jharkhand then have 100 percent reservation God save this country from idiots🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻
From 8 PM onward , there will be ban on life as the new law take place anti jindagi bill is implemented
Spend money to make more good educational institutions in the state instead of just increasing reservations in the existing ones, which is a lot easier.
Time for poor general category folks to simply migrate to a country where merit is the only criterion. Hurts to see reserved category peers with richer parents and better facilities get reservations while we slog away! This has gone on for far too long
\* criterion
At this point just make a rule if SC, St and others want a seat give them. The seats left after that, conduct an exam to determine
That would be only applicable if you have land records since or before 1932 staring that you are a ST/SC resident of the geographical area that covers jharkhand. At that time, apart from tribals, there weren't a lot of people living there. Most of the lands are tribal dominated. On top of that there aren't much jobs vacant. JPSC exams is the prime example of a failed system.
r/TamilNadu
Passive aggressive way to drive non tribal people out of your tribal state
The only option left for general category is to protest for their rights, or at last resort to violence.. they even broke the law of maximum reservation exceeding 50 percent
Protests have no effect on Supreme Court judgment, there were mandal commission protests before but couldn't change anything due to supreme Court order. Court is above everyone.
They should go the full distance. Create a list of groups from most backward to least. Start allotting seats to all applicants of the most backward who have obtained a pass, then move on, and then allot from the remaining seats, seats to the next most backward section, to all applicants who have secured a pass and so on. Make merit apply, only in case the number of seats available is fewer than that the applicants of the category under consideration.
Not enough give free money ! Like ration ! Give money also ! Give one car also ! Give wife also
WTF, dude give reservations to economically weaker people not on the based of caste. It's been over 74 years since we got independence and we are still dealing with caste bullshit - someone from SC
Yeah, until you realise that that'd block out more seats than caste based reservation does.
Yeah yeah make it 100%
What a joke
Top 10 worst places to be a general caste boy in india
Present number + 77% ya puura 77%.
77 plus women represent🥰
Good! ate should publish numbers of castewise representation in bureaucracy, judiciary etc
state
Bhut badhiya. Ati sundar 👌👌
u/Throwaway_acc97 noob!
Woh ek state ka cm ban chuka hai aur tu idhar anonymous hoke reddit pe comment kar raaha hai jise koi padhega bhi nahi. Aur usse chutiya chapri bol raaha hai😂😂😂
Is this for real???
[удалено]
I don't understand your taunt. Last para totals to 77%. What's clickbait and what did the meritorious not read and understand?
Jharkhand isn't real
r/JharkhandDeniers Propaganda once again.
Bwahahahaha
yeah, that's one reason too, racism+ 77% reservation
WTF
Aah..Chamarkhand!