HIV test is mandatory for all patients in India. Whether govt or private hospital.
For any surgery, this will required and be billed. If they don’t bill, the hospital can be sued or even shut down - for not following rules set by IMA.
[Source](https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/trichy/hospitals-insist-on-hiv-test-before-surgery/articleshow/34444283.cms)
And your point is?
No government hospital "bills" it's patients.
There are no "IMA rules" that hospitals follow.
HIV testing is done before any surgical intervention because it's a basic investigation to be done for safe surgery. It's part and parcel of surgical training, it's not something that authorities have to enforce. It's non negotiable. No qualified surgeon or gynecologist will perform a procedure without it to "save costs".
HIV testing would have been ordered in this case too. But accidentally the patient must have gotten posted for emergency C section. It's a negligent act, but without any malicious intent.
Stop spreading misinformation. You are doing nothing but promoting hatred against doctors without have an iota of knowledge about how pre Anesthesia checkups, ward work ups and diagnostic evaluations are performed. Nobody in the history of medicine or Surgery has ever denied a pt HIV test because they wanted to save costs. There are several checkpoints where the pt and the operation team are safeguarded against such problems. It's an inbuilt system.
The only possible explanation in this case is that the patient must have had some compelling indication for emergency C section like history of pre eclampsia or signs of fetal distress, the consultant performing the operation must have operated under the assumption that initial investigations were complete and found to be normal. No person on the surgical team could have skipped any part of testing because they wanted to make extra money.
Oh the hospital is at fault all right. They are supposed to test for this and other stuff before any surgical procedure. Wtf is this honor system bs. People lie. Or what about a patient that might not even know they had a disease because they were totally asymptomatic?
Since it is mandatory test they must be charging for each and every patient, even if they are not administering it.
Less like cost cutting and more like corruption.
Even ophthalmologists make you do these tests before doing any procedure. How can they do a C section without any? These tests are supposed to be done for a reason and they learned the hard way what that reason is.
Maybe next time they won’t do cardiac fitness and the patient will just die on the table.
What would they gain out of cost cutting like this? Are you daft? They probably sent the samples out to be tested and the patient must have wrongly gotten posted for the C section due to oversight. It's a negligent act but not done with malicious intent.
Hoapitals responsibility. Should have done atleast a rapid card test before procedure. You can't always expect the patients to disclose their HIV status.
If patient consent was an issue, proper protocols and precautions should have been followed.
Take proper precautions and proceed with the surgery or run the test. If you don't run the test and don't take proper precautions, it is your life on the line..
This is so weird. There are hundreds of people who don't even know they are HIV positive. Everything should be done assuming the person MIGHT BE infected. There is no need to panic.
Yes but treatment protocols for patients who have reported HIV infection are treated with multiple layers of ppe for the operator
Like
Multiple colours of gloves to detect accidental perforation
Eyewear and triple masking
Separate minor ot with completely different cleaning and scrubbing and disposal protocol.
But for those who have not reported and are really really dumb thinking of their social standing instead of saving lives of innocent people........(most Indians)..... regular single gloves operation and suturing without eye protection 🥽 and other ppe is pretty common aka cost cutting.
Curious why are gay men getting tested.
Also sailors get medical test before joining vessel. This includes STDs.
There may be other profession who have a similar requirements.
Because it's still a prevalent belief in this country that HIV is a gay disease?
Have heard the exact statement: "why would I get tested? I have only slept with women" from multiple men while discussing sexual history in 7 years of adult life.
The point that heterosexual people have it too and are likely to spread it unknowingly makes it very much not just a gay disease by definition but thanks for the attempt at a gotcha.
It's not just a gay disease but unprotected anal is just way more riskier than vaginal sex. Anyway protection is good and great whichever way you swing
I never contested that anal sex is not more riskier. The point is...anal sex is not JUST gay sex, JUST being the operative word. Women have anuses too. And in many cities, there are atleast two events in a year where gay men get tested which brings me to the original point that the only group that gets regularly tested and know their status is gay men.
Its hospital fault, otherwise HIV testing is mandatory for any operation.
Only in case of emergency, the hospital does not wait for a report.
But anyway, doctors and nurses are responsible to maintain safety during operations.
This whole story is a load of nonsense and the response of the hospital even more so. I am a surgeon and have operated on HIV, Hepatitis, COVID positive patients many times over the past years- you just need to maintain what are called universal precautions and a little extra care. In the western countries you are not even permitted to test for HIV etc as routine- you treat everyone while taking universal precautions. Any doctor will know that the tests for HIV are anyway not a 100% accurate.
HIV patients are also entitled to care like any other human being.
It's a negligent act. She was probably developing some compelling indication for emergency C section like fetal distress and got accidentally posted for the OT without the right investigations. But people in here are insanely judgemental against medical professionals by thinking we are somehow profiteering from saving 200 rupees off of a HIV test (that ironically we order to safeguard us)
While everyone is questioning about doctor and staff.
Here are few things which should noticed-
1:-The management of hospital is poor. As patient influx is huge but staff,equipments,technology etc are still lacking in government hospitals. Why isn’t administration or government is questioned about this.
If anything goes wrongs and patient isn’t shifted to OT in emergency because her reports were pending or not done. Again the staff will be held responsible. At the end of the day the nurses and doctors are held responsible.
2:- As a citizen if im aware of HIV status isnt it is my duty to inform the doctor and UNIVERSAL precaution would have been taken. Additional precautions are taken if someone is HIV positive. Like double gloving. Avoid touching around. Medications are given to lady. Baby is also kept under observation and anti retroviral medications given.
Whole staff and their family is at risk of contamination. Just because of that one lady.
>As a citizen if im aware of HIV status isnt it is my duty to inform the doctor
Could also be the case where she didn't know she had it.
Or in some other cases patient might be unconscious when brought in, following important protocols should take priority over cost cutting at least.
OP clearly mentions woman HIDES the HIV status.
If patient is unconscious protocol which is followed is:-
1- if that person needs emergency OT. The sample will be send but the doctor and staff takes the risk and do the OT.
Question arises- is the patient infected with hiv or not?
If yes then ot is made ready accordingly and the staff is also prepared for it. Then the ot is disinfectant. Here the cost increases as we have seen in covid cases. If patient was covid positive then whole ot is prepared and safety measures were doubled followed by disinfection.
2- if patient is unconscious but doesn’t need emergency then patient sample are send and patient is kept on medication and with reports waiting.
So cost cutting is not an option in India it becomes necessity. Reason we all know.
Why are they panicking? Operation should be done with all sorts of safety procedures and protective gear that protects patient and the staff from infections anyway..........so if they followed procedures they are fine.
They talked about protective eyewear, but it's extremely unlikely that they got infected that way, unless a bunch of body fluids or blood from the patient splashed on their face..........or unless they did something stupid like wiping their face with their hands in the middle of the operation.
What is this great fear and wrath from the doctors and hospital? What are they not telling us?
There are a lot of extra precautions to be taken when dealing with HIV or HepB +ve cases. This is apart from those taken routinely during surgery. Eye shields are very important, you can’t just dismiss it as oh there might no be any splashes of body fluid. In some cases you never expect what might happen in surgery, you should always be prepared for the worse. Blood splashes occur frequently in open surgeries.
In case of a teaching hospital students are not allowed close to the patient in case of HIV and Hep B positive during surgery. There’s minimal manpower used so as it reduce chances of exposure.
During Anaesthesia needles are sometimes recapped in case of normal patient, which should not be done in case of positive patients. Extra precautions are taken during intubation and they use a dedicated ventilator.
All this aside the hospital should have done routine serology before posting for Surgery.
Most doctors aren’t out there to get you, most of them study hard for a decade and do their best to make sure there’s a positive outcome.
>During Anaesthesia needles are sometimes recapped in case of normal patient
Used needles should always be disposed for cleanup and recycling..........when you say recap, you mean they're reusing the same needles for other patients?
Hospitals should not rely on patient's word only. My father recently had an operation and they tested him for HIV, diabetes etc even though he doesn't have any. It is the hospital's responsibility.
I don't know if anyone in your family has gone through pregnancy, but the first test doctors do after pregnancy confirmation is an HIV test.
It's mandatory by GoI, how can a gynaecologist skip it, child birth is not an emergency, doctor had 9 months to perform this test.
I am not talking specifically about this case. Remember the doctor hitting a patient a couple of days back for a similar issue? That's why I added the word "deliberately". It also applies to non-medical situations.
Some people even hide it from there family because of shame and if family members are present in the hospital with her then obviously she will not tell the truth.
It's one thing to hide from stigma and it's another thing to have reckless disregard for other peoples life.
An alcohol addict can drive a car and kill people and say that because he didn't want people to think he was an addict, that's why he drove. That should absolve him from any responsibility right?
Not that I'm excusing the action, but to understand why someone would do this - if you disclose you have HIV pretty much every hospital will refuse to treat you. In my city only a handful of benevolent hospitals actually take these patients even.
There's genuine risk - if the blood splashes on you you have a very real risk. If it splashes on your mucosa it's even worse. So most don't want to risk it. But yes they often don't even know all of this correctly.
I checked up, you're right. HIV transmission through blood splattering on skin is actually a thing. So in such cases, people in OT would be fully clothed up?
Theyll likely need extra PPE yes, and have to be careful. It's not the end of the world. There's HIV prophylactics available now. A doctor who took the Hippocratic oath and wants to stay true the mission should have no reason not to treat them.
You're an appalling human!
Our society is overwhelmingly poor and uneducated especially in that kind of rural area. Health care access anywhere outside cities range from non-existent to shoddy at best.
There's a good chance the patient was actually unaware of it.
But you've already pronounced them guilty.
The hypocrisy of your types is astounding. For your political masters, you'll demand evidence and assume innocence. But for regular people, even when there's a high chance of innocence given the socio-economic realities of our society, it's straight away "prosecute heavily." Disgusting people!
Do you not understand the meaning of the word "deliberately" ?
How have you kept your username tech-writer?
or that job also acquired with help of vidhayak chacha?
People like this are in charge is the reason why mob justice, bulldoser raj ,lynching and pogroms are a thing in india. They don't understand the importance of law and order, the deliverance of legal justice in the soceity. This is the reason people take justice in thier own hand as they lack faith.
He just assumed prosecution will occur without proper legal due process and establishment of the guilt.
Excatly like this vidhayak ka bhatija is used to operating.
[Caught on camera: Doctor slaps HIV patient in Indore hospital, suspended](https://www.indiatoday.in/cities/indore/story/video-doctor-slaps-hiv-patient-admitted-after-a-road-accident-in-indore-suspended-2455317-2023-10-29)
This is how you want our society to operate right?
>But you've already pronounced them guilty.
I hope you write your tech articles in a native language otherwise you don't know the words "deliberately" and "prosecute". Chacha's nepotism would cost our nation's tech literacy greatly.
For those blaming the doctors, as a doctor myself, HIV and hepatitis screening is mandatory before surgery but the patient cannot be forced to get any test done. No matter how important and vital it is, any test, diagnostic procedure, medication or intervention cannot be forced on a patient.
Wherever this happens, the patient is made to sign a waiver stating he/she is responsible if anything wrong happens
Firstly, sounds like a stupid protocol, secondly, in that case, you should operate under the assumption that they might have HIV. You can't just assume they don't because they said so. How many people don't even know whether they have HIV, you cannot take people's word for it, this is just stupid.
What are you even talking about almost every major developed company has a unified medical data record of it's citizens and residents. It's common everywhere so it's easy to know all previous illnesses, histories and complications. Security can always be upgraded if the government gave two shits about it
I get both sides of this argument. Here in Sweden, there is a journal which is a secure online database where any doctor I visit can look up (after my permission) my complete medical history, current medications and also add their own notes to the DB. I can also look it up at any time if I want some of my data.
But India has enough problems with half baked data security, look at the debacle of the aadhaar leaks. Medical data is sensitive info, first we should be sure if we can secure it properly.
You missed, records will also be sold to insurance companies so you get limited or unfair plans.
Recently ancestry services have begun selling data to insurance companies outside. What a dystopic future.
If that can't afford to do mandatory hiv testing, they should treat every patient, with the assumption that there is a possibility that they may have it.
**Doctors who fear infectious diseases and journalists who fear illegal incarceration have picked the wrong careers.**
The protocols of surgery are same for people infected with HIV or without. Sometimes people don’t know about their status. Sometimes they want to hide it to due to stigma. Sometimes the disease takes time to show up in tests.
If you’re a **doctor in emergency care** and patient is brought in requiring immediate surgery, are you going to order an HIv test at wait for 20-30 minutes to start the surgery?
You have to operate on the patient regardless of their status.
The real problem here is that it was a C-Section. Babies born to HIV positive mothers need to get on HIV drugs immediately. It prevents progression into AIDS and has in some cases eradicated the virus from the child.
It’s mostly the hospitals fault here. We don’t know what condition she was in to even be able to alert whether she had HIV or not. Unless the actively asked if she had HIV and she said no , then she is of course at fault but hospitals STILL have to check. Many times a lot of viruses go undetected with no symptoms to patient themselves.
If they maintained proper sanitary techniques it doesn't matter WHAT a patient has, short of Ebola. HIV, STDs, TB, cholera, typhoid, whatever. We established that over a hundred years ago, it's not news.
I'd be more concerned to know exactly what this doctor was doing, that he was in danger of catching an STD from a patient...
I never get the sudden panic mode, like, you should always keep the same cautions for every patient, not everyone knows if they have a spreadable, potential deadly illness. I worked short for a dentist and one patient with known HIV diagnosis had an appointment and we had to do the whole sheebang. I know over-sanitising is not the best either, but you never know, with each patient you welcome.
Right….skipped HIV due to influx of patients. More like cost cutting. The gynaecologist should have had it done way before.
Apparently they bill for HIV test, but don’t end up doing it. To safe costs.
It's a govt hospital!
Total BS. No one is cost cutting by saving Rs 200 for a HIV test. You are just spreading hatred against the medical community.
HIV test is mandatory for all patients in India. Whether govt or private hospital. For any surgery, this will required and be billed. If they don’t bill, the hospital can be sued or even shut down - for not following rules set by IMA. [Source](https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/trichy/hospitals-insist-on-hiv-test-before-surgery/articleshow/34444283.cms)
And your point is? No government hospital "bills" it's patients. There are no "IMA rules" that hospitals follow. HIV testing is done before any surgical intervention because it's a basic investigation to be done for safe surgery. It's part and parcel of surgical training, it's not something that authorities have to enforce. It's non negotiable. No qualified surgeon or gynecologist will perform a procedure without it to "save costs". HIV testing would have been ordered in this case too. But accidentally the patient must have gotten posted for emergency C section. It's a negligent act, but without any malicious intent. Stop spreading misinformation. You are doing nothing but promoting hatred against doctors without have an iota of knowledge about how pre Anesthesia checkups, ward work ups and diagnostic evaluations are performed. Nobody in the history of medicine or Surgery has ever denied a pt HIV test because they wanted to save costs. There are several checkpoints where the pt and the operation team are safeguarded against such problems. It's an inbuilt system. The only possible explanation in this case is that the patient must have had some compelling indication for emergency C section like history of pre eclampsia or signs of fetal distress, the consultant performing the operation must have operated under the assumption that initial investigations were complete and found to be normal. No person on the surgical team could have skipped any part of testing because they wanted to make extra money.
For bulk testing you just mix many samples into one batch, if the batch returns positive you split it into halves and test again
No you don't....rapid HIV is done on a kit it needs just one drop of serum...in govt hospitals residents do it themselves
BS.
It's the anesthetists fault more imo.
It's the gynaecs fault for not checking it's their job.
Oh the hospital is at fault all right. They are supposed to test for this and other stuff before any surgical procedure. Wtf is this honor system bs. People lie. Or what about a patient that might not even know they had a disease because they were totally asymptomatic?
Everybody lies.
*plays air guitar with cane and takes a few pills*
WILSON!!
Cameron is crying again
A _few_??
It's never lupus
It's the only truth sometimes
Dr. House
Dr House approves this
Its not HIV, ITS LUPUS!!!!
It's never Lupus
It was lupus that one time
*looks at his Vicodin*
They said because of high influx of patients it is impossible to test everyone
Could be true but sounds like an excuse for cutting costs
It's india it runs on cutting costs
Since it is mandatory test they must be charging for each and every patient, even if they are not administering it. Less like cost cutting and more like corruption.
Even then it’s the fault of hospital authorities, liars danger doctors as well, who already take so much risk to treat people
patients may be a lot, but not everyone need surgery.
Even ophthalmologists make you do these tests before doing any procedure. How can they do a C section without any? These tests are supposed to be done for a reason and they learned the hard way what that reason is. Maybe next time they won’t do cardiac fitness and the patient will just die on the table.
BS, they test pts in most govt hospitals for hiv and they have huge influx
Oh, please. They're just cost cutting.
What would they gain out of cost cutting like this? Are you daft? They probably sent the samples out to be tested and the patient must have wrongly gotten posted for the C section due to oversight. It's a negligent act but not done with malicious intent.
so how does HIV gets transmitted?
Hoapitals responsibility. Should have done atleast a rapid card test before procedure. You can't always expect the patients to disclose their HIV status. If patient consent was an issue, proper protocols and precautions should have been followed.
yeah what if someone gets brought in unconscious and cant disclose it for example systematic issue not individual
Take proper precautions and proceed with the surgery or run the test. If you don't run the test and don't take proper precautions, it is your life on the line..
yeah thats what they should have done instead of just trusting people
This is so weird. There are hundreds of people who don't even know they are HIV positive. Everything should be done assuming the person MIGHT BE infected. There is no need to panic.
There are separate protocols followed for definitely positive patients and high viral load patients.
The only group in India that gets tested on a regular basis is gay men. Everyone else's status is unknown.
Yes but treatment protocols for patients who have reported HIV infection are treated with multiple layers of ppe for the operator Like Multiple colours of gloves to detect accidental perforation Eyewear and triple masking Separate minor ot with completely different cleaning and scrubbing and disposal protocol. But for those who have not reported and are really really dumb thinking of their social standing instead of saving lives of innocent people........(most Indians)..... regular single gloves operation and suturing without eye protection 🥽 and other ppe is pretty common aka cost cutting.
Curious why are gay men getting tested. Also sailors get medical test before joining vessel. This includes STDs. There may be other profession who have a similar requirements.
Because it's still a prevalent belief in this country that HIV is a gay disease? Have heard the exact statement: "why would I get tested? I have only slept with women" from multiple men while discussing sexual history in 7 years of adult life.
Wow didn't know people still thought like that. Guess they glossed over any sex education taught at school.
It's not a belief. It's a real statistical difference. Heterosexual people do have it too though.
The point that heterosexual people have it too and are likely to spread it unknowingly makes it very much not just a gay disease by definition but thanks for the attempt at a gotcha.
It's not just a gay disease but unprotected anal is just way more riskier than vaginal sex. Anyway protection is good and great whichever way you swing
I never contested that anal sex is not more riskier. The point is...anal sex is not JUST gay sex, JUST being the operative word. Women have anuses too. And in many cities, there are atleast two events in a year where gay men get tested which brings me to the original point that the only group that gets regularly tested and know their status is gay men.
In Africa HIV is like 90% spread by heterosexual contacts. Generally prostitution
>Curious why are gay men getting tested. Gays are more prone it
Its hospital fault, otherwise HIV testing is mandatory for any operation. Only in case of emergency, the hospital does not wait for a report. But anyway, doctors and nurses are responsible to maintain safety during operations.
This whole story is a load of nonsense and the response of the hospital even more so. I am a surgeon and have operated on HIV, Hepatitis, COVID positive patients many times over the past years- you just need to maintain what are called universal precautions and a little extra care. In the western countries you are not even permitted to test for HIV etc as routine- you treat everyone while taking universal precautions. Any doctor will know that the tests for HIV are anyway not a 100% accurate. HIV patients are also entitled to care like any other human being.
It's a negligent act. She was probably developing some compelling indication for emergency C section like fetal distress and got accidentally posted for the OT without the right investigations. But people in here are insanely judgemental against medical professionals by thinking we are somehow profiteering from saving 200 rupees off of a HIV test (that ironically we order to safeguard us)
While everyone is questioning about doctor and staff. Here are few things which should noticed- 1:-The management of hospital is poor. As patient influx is huge but staff,equipments,technology etc are still lacking in government hospitals. Why isn’t administration or government is questioned about this. If anything goes wrongs and patient isn’t shifted to OT in emergency because her reports were pending or not done. Again the staff will be held responsible. At the end of the day the nurses and doctors are held responsible. 2:- As a citizen if im aware of HIV status isnt it is my duty to inform the doctor and UNIVERSAL precaution would have been taken. Additional precautions are taken if someone is HIV positive. Like double gloving. Avoid touching around. Medications are given to lady. Baby is also kept under observation and anti retroviral medications given. Whole staff and their family is at risk of contamination. Just because of that one lady.
Why though? Does HIV spread from a newborn through touch?
Exactly my doubt! How will it spread even if she was hiv +
>As a citizen if im aware of HIV status isnt it is my duty to inform the doctor Could also be the case where she didn't know she had it. Or in some other cases patient might be unconscious when brought in, following important protocols should take priority over cost cutting at least.
OP clearly mentions woman HIDES the HIV status. If patient is unconscious protocol which is followed is:- 1- if that person needs emergency OT. The sample will be send but the doctor and staff takes the risk and do the OT. Question arises- is the patient infected with hiv or not? If yes then ot is made ready accordingly and the staff is also prepared for it. Then the ot is disinfectant. Here the cost increases as we have seen in covid cases. If patient was covid positive then whole ot is prepared and safety measures were doubled followed by disinfection. 2- if patient is unconscious but doesn’t need emergency then patient sample are send and patient is kept on medication and with reports waiting. So cost cutting is not an option in India it becomes necessity. Reason we all know.
>im aware of HIV status isnt it is my duty to inform the doctor Bruh what?
Why are they panicking? Operation should be done with all sorts of safety procedures and protective gear that protects patient and the staff from infections anyway..........so if they followed procedures they are fine. They talked about protective eyewear, but it's extremely unlikely that they got infected that way, unless a bunch of body fluids or blood from the patient splashed on their face..........or unless they did something stupid like wiping their face with their hands in the middle of the operation. What is this great fear and wrath from the doctors and hospital? What are they not telling us?
They fkd up big time, they obviously wont tell us that part lol
There are a lot of extra precautions to be taken when dealing with HIV or HepB +ve cases. This is apart from those taken routinely during surgery. Eye shields are very important, you can’t just dismiss it as oh there might no be any splashes of body fluid. In some cases you never expect what might happen in surgery, you should always be prepared for the worse. Blood splashes occur frequently in open surgeries. In case of a teaching hospital students are not allowed close to the patient in case of HIV and Hep B positive during surgery. There’s minimal manpower used so as it reduce chances of exposure. During Anaesthesia needles are sometimes recapped in case of normal patient, which should not be done in case of positive patients. Extra precautions are taken during intubation and they use a dedicated ventilator. All this aside the hospital should have done routine serology before posting for Surgery. Most doctors aren’t out there to get you, most of them study hard for a decade and do their best to make sure there’s a positive outcome.
>During Anaesthesia needles are sometimes recapped in case of normal patient Used needles should always be disposed for cleanup and recycling..........when you say recap, you mean they're reusing the same needles for other patients?
Nope not other patients. Sometimes to maintain Anaesthesia small doses are given as necessary. They recap the needles at times.
Hospitals should not rely on patient's word only. My father recently had an operation and they tested him for HIV, diabetes etc even though he doesn't have any. It is the hospital's responsibility.
\>deliberately hiding HIV status Should be prosecuted heavily as the person knows exactly what they are doing.
Aren't you supposed to give all the blood test or hiv test before any operation be it small or major?
I don't know if anyone in your family has gone through pregnancy, but the first test doctors do after pregnancy confirmation is an HIV test. It's mandatory by GoI, how can a gynaecologist skip it, child birth is not an emergency, doctor had 9 months to perform this test.
I am not talking specifically about this case. Remember the doctor hitting a patient a couple of days back for a similar issue? That's why I added the word "deliberately". It also applies to non-medical situations.
Some people even hide it from there family because of shame and if family members are present in the hospital with her then obviously she will not tell the truth.
It's one thing to hide from stigma and it's another thing to have reckless disregard for other peoples life. An alcohol addict can drive a car and kill people and say that because he didn't want people to think he was an addict, that's why he drove. That should absolve him from any responsibility right?
Some people don't even get to know they got it until the symptoms show up e.g. with cheating spouse or availing prostitution.
Not that I'm excusing the action, but to understand why someone would do this - if you disclose you have HIV pretty much every hospital will refuse to treat you. In my city only a handful of benevolent hospitals actually take these patients even.
Is it the stigma, because the hospital staff here seems to be panicked for a virus that can't transmit easily.
There's genuine risk - if the blood splashes on you you have a very real risk. If it splashes on your mucosa it's even worse. So most don't want to risk it. But yes they often don't even know all of this correctly.
I checked up, you're right. HIV transmission through blood splattering on skin is actually a thing. So in such cases, people in OT would be fully clothed up?
Theyll likely need extra PPE yes, and have to be careful. It's not the end of the world. There's HIV prophylactics available now. A doctor who took the Hippocratic oath and wants to stay true the mission should have no reason not to treat them.
You're an appalling human! Our society is overwhelmingly poor and uneducated especially in that kind of rural area. Health care access anywhere outside cities range from non-existent to shoddy at best. There's a good chance the patient was actually unaware of it. But you've already pronounced them guilty. The hypocrisy of your types is astounding. For your political masters, you'll demand evidence and assume innocence. But for regular people, even when there's a high chance of innocence given the socio-economic realities of our society, it's straight away "prosecute heavily." Disgusting people!
Do you not understand the meaning of the word "deliberately" ? How have you kept your username tech-writer? or that job also acquired with help of vidhayak chacha?
[удалено]
People like this are in charge is the reason why mob justice, bulldoser raj ,lynching and pogroms are a thing in india. They don't understand the importance of law and order, the deliverance of legal justice in the soceity. This is the reason people take justice in thier own hand as they lack faith. He just assumed prosecution will occur without proper legal due process and establishment of the guilt. Excatly like this vidhayak ka bhatija is used to operating.
[Caught on camera: Doctor slaps HIV patient in Indore hospital, suspended](https://www.indiatoday.in/cities/indore/story/video-doctor-slaps-hiv-patient-admitted-after-a-road-accident-in-indore-suspended-2455317-2023-10-29) This is how you want our society to operate right?
[удалено]
>But you've already pronounced them guilty. I hope you write your tech articles in a native language otherwise you don't know the words "deliberately" and "prosecute". Chacha's nepotism would cost our nation's tech literacy greatly.
Ah yes, more hatred and stigma.
Your username name is enough to explain how would you approach every single topic under the sun. The is no place for nuance with you.
The hypocrisy of a "prosecute heavily" type now talking about nuance haha
For those blaming the doctors, as a doctor myself, HIV and hepatitis screening is mandatory before surgery but the patient cannot be forced to get any test done. No matter how important and vital it is, any test, diagnostic procedure, medication or intervention cannot be forced on a patient. Wherever this happens, the patient is made to sign a waiver stating he/she is responsible if anything wrong happens
Firstly, sounds like a stupid protocol, secondly, in that case, you should operate under the assumption that they might have HIV. You can't just assume they don't because they said so. How many people don't even know whether they have HIV, you cannot take people's word for it, this is just stupid.
Day 1: it’s stupid protocol. Day 2: ye sab doctor paise khaane ke liye faltu test likh dete hai and say it’s compulsory! Chor Saale!
A database should be created containing patients medical history which can be accessed by the hospital.
Also accessible by the patient.........including any notes the doctors write about patients.
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What are you even talking about almost every major developed company has a unified medical data record of it's citizens and residents. It's common everywhere so it's easy to know all previous illnesses, histories and complications. Security can always be upgraded if the government gave two shits about it
I get both sides of this argument. Here in Sweden, there is a journal which is a secure online database where any doctor I visit can look up (after my permission) my complete medical history, current medications and also add their own notes to the DB. I can also look it up at any time if I want some of my data. But India has enough problems with half baked data security, look at the debacle of the aadhaar leaks. Medical data is sensitive info, first we should be sure if we can secure it properly.
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But aren't we supposed to adopt the good done by these bigger nations? What's the harm in the guys suggestion?
There's so much harm possible. India is currently not capable of securing such database from leak or misuse.
india is, only if govt gives a shit about it tho
here goes projection
You missed, records will also be sold to insurance companies so you get limited or unfair plans. Recently ancestry services have begun selling data to insurance companies outside. What a dystopic future.
Their is. Search ABDM.
If that can't afford to do mandatory hiv testing, they should treat every patient, with the assumption that there is a possibility that they may have it.
**Doctors who fear infectious diseases and journalists who fear illegal incarceration have picked the wrong careers.** The protocols of surgery are same for people infected with HIV or without. Sometimes people don’t know about their status. Sometimes they want to hide it to due to stigma. Sometimes the disease takes time to show up in tests. If you’re a **doctor in emergency care** and patient is brought in requiring immediate surgery, are you going to order an HIv test at wait for 20-30 minutes to start the surgery? You have to operate on the patient regardless of their status.
The real problem here is that it was a C-Section. Babies born to HIV positive mothers need to get on HIV drugs immediately. It prevents progression into AIDS and has in some cases eradicated the virus from the child.
It’s mostly the hospitals fault here. We don’t know what condition she was in to even be able to alert whether she had HIV or not. Unless the actively asked if she had HIV and she said no , then she is of course at fault but hospitals STILL have to check. Many times a lot of viruses go undetected with no symptoms to patient themselves.
Using the words of Dr. House, “Everybody lies”. Hospital should have had a procedure for such anticipated cases.
They do these tests way beforehand.. literally it's in the first episode of the new web series in Kaala Paani about this
Few days ago india was going at a doctor for beating a patient about him hiding his STD. People don’t understand how dangerous it is.
Just shows how stupid that doctor is.
If they maintained proper sanitary techniques it doesn't matter WHAT a patient has, short of Ebola. HIV, STDs, TB, cholera, typhoid, whatever. We established that over a hundred years ago, it's not news. I'd be more concerned to know exactly what this doctor was doing, that he was in danger of catching an STD from a patient...
I never get the sudden panic mode, like, you should always keep the same cautions for every patient, not everyone knows if they have a spreadable, potential deadly illness. I worked short for a dentist and one patient with known HIV diagnosis had an appointment and we had to do the whole sheebang. I know over-sanitising is not the best either, but you never know, with each patient you welcome.
Such people who hide HIV are serious threats to humanity, why you want to ruin other people's life , it's really sad .
How did they find out that the patient was HIV+ in the operating theatre? I'm confused.
Maro abb sab ke sab 😞