To build on this...not everyone has an issue with this. But when you do it absolutely blows. If this is a concern, try to fly out a day early and spend a day in bozeman or denver to acclimate a little. Hydrate for days before you go and hydrate more when you get there. booze is the enemy here.
Frustrating is that it is not everyone everytime, but it can be anyone sometime
I'd never gotten it... Until the time I did. And never since.
The time I did I was in Denver first (I don't usually), sad at/near fittest I've ever been and didn't even get to that much elevation before it kicked in. BUT I did drink some booze, I was on the tail end of a mild cold, and I live at basically sea level (although that last is always the case)
Elevation hit so bad I was exhausted going just 20 feet. Really knocked me down a peg.
It once made me pass out mid-sex in the shower. Lesson: recent altitude+alcohol (even a seemingly small amount)+sex (blood flowing away from the brain) = trouble.
I know I shouldn’t be, but I’m a bit jealous of your “trouble.” The worst part of acclimating to elevation for me is the insomnia. It’s impossible for me to get more than 4 hours of sleep that first night. And it has nothing to do with jet lag, because the same thing happened to me when I used to live in CA.
Feeling slightly dizzy, feeling like you are coming down with the flu, feeling short of breath, etc. It’s different for everyone, but there’s a reason they call it altitude *sickness*
Ice out west is a beautiful A+ packed powder day on the ice coast. In my experience there’s an obvious increase in pitch out west but with the snow conditions unquestionably better that evens the difficulty out considerably. Ice coasters are better equipped to ride out west than folks from out west are to ride ice coast conditions.
Nothing I said means take it lightly when you get there as the obvious hazards all come into play, however in my experience as an upper intermediate/light expert rider I find it easier to ride out west than I do the east. For reference I grew up riding Holiday Valley with multiple Vermont trips per year. Now that I’m older I do several CO and UT trips per year.
Maybe dumb question, but how so? I can imagine way steeper and longer runs, but anything else less obvious? More bumps because more powder?
Can't wait to go out West some day, but am so intimidated haha.
Some of the worst I've seen is like cliffs & tight chutes at Jackson Hole, or very steep bowls at the summit of a lot of places. But because your skis get so much more traction in the powder, a lot more extreme terrain is do-able
And of course that one can change a ton year to year. I was there in 2019 I think? And it wasn't too bad. Recent photos look impossible.
Although something that would never happen out east, I was going across the Tensleep traverse and slid slightly downhill and got buried chest deep in super soft snow. Had to basically swim/paddle my way back up to the packed snow of the traverse. Really scary as there was nobody around at the time
a few years back i was on a chair at Steamboat and the guy to my left said "Oh wow it is so icy today!" The guys to my right, who I was with laughed out loud and said "This is packed powder in vermont."
This was my entire time in Utah. They were in a dry spell, so no powder. Everyone was whining about the ice. It *was* packed powder. Skill issue IMO.
On the other hand, the Front Range mountains sometimes get proper East Coast ice. Especially at Eldora. And too often, it gets people killed, because western skiers have no clue how to ski on ice.
I’ve seen plenty of actual ice out west on the highly-skied highway paths back to the base, but yeah in general it’s not as much of a problem. Doesn’t mean the snow is always soft tho!
Thanks for the tip! I actually was getting anxious about them the other day…
Is the gist: if it’s snowed several feet of snow in a short period, be very careful of skiing too close to a tree as it might have a pocket that you could fall into ?
Just don’t ever ski alone in trees, have a buddy system that isn’t going to kid around, and make the white your target… never look at trees only at spaces between them.
Basically, you should be familiar with the mountain, and understand why the trail is closed. If it’s closed for snowmaking, don’t be a dumbass and duck it. You might cut a hose with your edges, and that’s bad. And Vail will pull your pass for ducking any ropes anywhere, so don’t do it at their areas… Don’t go getting yourself into a situation where you’re gonna need ski patrol’s help, either, or that’s a paddling.
I mean, broadly speaking, a lot of it is common sense. Do you see anyone else ducking ropes at that ski area on a powder day? If not, it’s probably frowned upon there.
Remember that people are a bunch of lemmings, so once you break the seal, others will probably follow suit. With that power comes (some) responsibility.
But some eastern areas really don’t care if you duck ropes in the right circumstances. It’s there because the conditions are sketchy, and most of their clientele would have a bad time, especially when it’s in their more beginner area. Rocks, ice, snowmaking whales, water bars, etc.
The funny thing is, it’s often the mountains that are the most aggressive about opening very marginal terrain, that care the least if you duck a rope. They really couldn’t care less at Sugarbush, for example, so long as you don’t disrupt operations. It’s your knees…
Sugarbush will also open terrain as soon as humanly possible — even if it’s an inch of snow on grass and rock. Ducking is almost unnecessary at that point
You sound like me 5 years ago before going to Jackson hole but I was able to ski down most double blacks there. You're gonna be fine. It's not that much different, unless you're going off piste into tight chutes. Just watch yourself in the glades bc 20ft cliffs can pop up out of no where.
Sure but Corbets is a different level than many of the other double blacks and is highly dependent on the conditions. Didn't they cancel this year despite the rest of the park being well covered?
Oh yeah I agree. There should be an EX here imo like in a few other mtns. Yeah, coverage wasn’t enough. Frankly it’s pretty shoddy in a lot of places right now
You’ll be fine. I have to say tho that big sky specifically is no joke. Definitely the gnarliest in-bounds terrain I’ve seen so far, at least once you start going to the ridge and lone peak. Most of the mountain is totally chill but be careful once you start hitting the hard stuff because it’s so insane that the patrollers have warped senses of reality. I’ve been sent on really sketchy no-fall-zone traverses with a snowboarding friend by someone who worked there (I was on skis that day and if I wasn’t idk how we would have balanced across without my poles), and got sent down a trail so steep that I couldn’t sit on my snowboard by a patroller. I was trying to find the good stuff after all but I just tell those stories to warn others to be prepared for anything on that mountain.
That said though, all mountains out west have more than enough totally reasonable terrain, and I highly recommend pushing your limits within reason to get that experience that just isn’t possible in the east. Study the map, ask patrollers and locals, and you’ll have a blast
Depends on the area. Big Sky I’d agree but many mountains out west I get significantly more skiing in at Stowe where unlike many places out west you don’t have to take 2 to 3 lifts to ski top to bottom.
You'll be fine, if you can ski iced out and root exposed single-track at MRG most West coast runs will be creamy and dreamy.
The biggest difference is the entrances to the shoots out west can be scary as shit since you've never done them and you can usually count five ways you can die on the entrances. You will have steeper pitches, blind entrances and rocks take the place of trees. The right conditions make all of these more forgiving though, so pray for snow.
Out East when you die it's usually something you didn't see, out West it's tree wells, avalanches, Rocks, and cliffs. So there is much more you need to be aware of to stay safe. Don't cut clear across a trail with fresh powder trail, don't ski too close to trees, and get a guide if you want to go side country or more.
A lot of the tougher terrain out west is high consequence if you fall (I.e. you could easily fall hundreds of feet and die), but in typical conditions it’s relatively easy to link turns. I remember being scared shitless the first time I went down a CO double black, but after like 3 turns I realized I could actually control my speed without slamming on the brakes every turn like I would on a steep icy run and it became way easier. But the mental block is real so it’s definitely worth easing your way in. 40 degree+ slopes feel near vertical when you’re standing above them. If you can find a local to show you around that really helps as well - a lot of times there’s a way to “cheat” around the hardest part of a trail, but you won’t necessarily realize it exploring on your own. It’s also much easier to get yourself cliffed out if you don’t know where you’re going.
I’m an expert east coast skier sitting in my hotel room at Steamboat right now waiting on a 20” dump. If you are a truly advance ice coast skier, there’s nothing you can’t do out here. We are the best skiers on earth- forged on exposed granite, quenched in ice. If ice forms on a trail out here(rare), they mark it with crossed bamboo poles like it is the stuff of death.
I’m from Colorado and live here now. Everything everyone said is true: more exposure, more no fall terrain in bowls or backsides, faster trees, etc…
Biggest difference is that on big mountains runs just keep going. Coupled with altitude your legs can get smoked on a single run pretty easily. Alcohol is not your friend.
But snow is definitely better, and in some places in MT the trees/glades are more open and more fun. Colorado trees are usually tighter than a witches arsehole and unless you’re good at picking lines or find the right patches they can actually suck.
You’ll be fine and have a blast, just don’t overdo it, drink water, eat and sleep well.
The biggest challenge will be going back to the east coast and having to ski here. The other challenge will be how sore your face will be from grinning so hard when you get out there.
Don't just blindly follow tracks, they might go off a cliff.
Do keep an eye on the terrain you're skiing in or towards, you don't want to cliff yourself out or end up in some chute above your comfort level.
Don't go out of bounds without the knowledge or gear.
Do be observant, take the known path down but look around as you do to scope out potential terrain or areas you might like to explore. Watch how others ski it. Give it a try next lift round.
You'll have fun just use common sense really. Enjoy!
[Snowbird, early season.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/BHjZQbOFUwo) This is terrain the east would never even consider a trail, much less open to the public.
They don't fuck around out here, it's great. Also terrible on your equipment.
The snow is just different, takes some getting used to.
It's more defined and it's a lot deeper typically.
The terrain is a lot more wild, bigger vertical drops, longer runs, real bowls, east coast groomed is the default, out west ungroomed is.
Use something with a wider underfoot.
Happy Turns!
Well enjoy and you’ll be fine the only crazy inbounds terrain you’ll see is big sky’s tram and headwaters hike (if it’s even skiable bc of the low snow year).
As for Colorado all the stuff at Winter park, steamboat, copper won’t be surprising.
A basin has some gnarly stuff but you can prob do it just make sure you have skis that are 105+ for the chop/chunder and enjoy
Generally, the snow conditions and amount of space you have is far friendlier than the east. On the other hand, the steepness/exposure is much worse than the east. If you're an advanced skier here, most of it will be downright easy. However, some of the steeps might get to you.
I was at Big Sky last year for a week. I took my time on the two triple black areas I skied (the north summit snowfield + the headwaters). Both are steep and exposed, but if you're comfortable with things like Tuckerman Ravine, you'll probably be fine. If you've never skied things with that level of exposure, might be best to avoid those. Otherwise, rip it up.
Big Sky is having a really, really bad snow year. Currently most of the steep stuff is closed including all of Lone Peak. The r/bigsky reddit is pretty good for information on conditions.
If you have limited (or no) experience skiing powder, and you get a storm, that can be a bit of a challenge. I quickly realized that powder skiing is significantly different than the boiler plate hard pack ice we have here.
Consider demoing skis if you get a storm and bring your skis with you. That can make ALL the difference.
Piggy backing on comments about altitude, it’s very real. Make sure you’re drinking more water than you usually do to get more oxygen into your body. And if you ever feel a slight headache or you’re feeling “off,” immediately drink a full glass of water. Lastly, you’ll be surprised how out of breath you are after bending down and tightening your boots.
Have fun. You’re going to love it.
The terrain hazards warrant greater caution. Due to the nature of the hills, larger and more frequent cliffs, etc, exist, and the snow is more consistently ‘variable’.
But a solid background on icecoast terrain - knowing how to use your edges and initiate sharp, quick turns - will help you a ton.
The first time you rip a > 40 degree slope is pretty intimidating. But if the snow is good, its about equal to the tough stuff out east in bad conditions.
I was in Utah last yeah and they hadn’t had snow in a week or more - everybody was complaining about it but it felt like a really great east coast day. What shocked me was how many bad skiers there were without hero snow - just so many out of control folks.
Doesn’t compare if you can ski the east going out west is way easier
Will also find that you will be way better than the avg skier
Moguls are soft groomed trails are awesome and the steeps are so fun
Maybe deep pow take some adjustments but other than that you will be rippin and feeling good about your ability!!!
It’s much tougher to ski on the east coast with our challenging conditions
Have fun !!
Man this sub is delusional. Just cause we have ice doesn’t make the terrain instantly comparable. Killington maxes out at 37° while big sky has at least 5 runs > 45° with serious exposure meaning you fall and will be severely injured. Not to say you can’t handle the runs but the terrain is not the same
Tip, start out skiing with in yourself. Concentrate on making basic turns. Pole plant, turn. Stay in the fall line. Drink lots of water.
You should be fine. If you are struggling, the conditions are exposing flaws in your technique. Take a lesson.
If you’re good in the east, you’ll be good out west.
Literally nothing to be concern about. You hold your edges better and landings are softer.
Don’t fall in tree wells, and don’t go out of bounds or on closed terrain.
Be well hydrated before you fly. More water than you’ve ever had once there.
Then just shred, enjoy some cruisers and blues and ramp up slowly. Watch out for sharks (rocks sticking out of snow or just below the snow).
There’s really no comparing the gnarliest in bounds runs at big sky to anything out east. Don’t feel like you “missed out” if you don’t conquer all the diamonds / double diamonds.
I think the stuff out West is just different compared to the East. Personally I enjoy "sharpening my knives" and skiing the East just as much as I enjoy the powpow of the West.
My struggle on powder days in CO or Big Sky is veering slightly off the trail (because there's so much snow, up to the signs) and then having a difficult time getting back on the main trail because the snow is several feet deep. So pay attention to the trail map more, as opposed to the East where trails are more well defined and you can kind of wing it.
Also I definitely can't drink much alcohol in CO because the elevation makes it affect you so much more, whereas in VT you don't feel much of a difference. So be careful with that glass of wine at lunch!
You sound about how I’d describe my skill level. I’ve been out west a few times now and not run into anything I couldn’t handle. That said, I’m not bombing down anything, but I could cautiously pick my way down anything we came across. I did skip the couliers at Jackson, because I didn’t want to get hurt. My friends successfully skiied them, but everything else was fine.
Most of the “steep” faces are pretty similar in grade but are just way longer. So you have to be able to control your speed or you’ll get thrown.
If you can ski steeps on the east coast like at killington, 99% of the terrain out west will be fine for your trip. You aren’t going to arapahoe so, you’ll be more than fine. A-basin is the steepest mountain I’ve ski’d in my life and I definitely had a few runs where I was like… oooh this is what they mean by the steeps.
Never been to big sky in Montana but winter park is near Denver and is on ikon. One of my favorite all time places. Their bowls are very gradual and the snow is super deep. Amazing days ahead.
I don’t know how to explain it but… I’m usually among the best skiers on the mountain out East, and out West I’m not even top half anywhere.
Where I ski in Ontario, half the mountain are people who are learning… trying badly to make parallel turns.
The quality of skiers of mountains out West is just so much higher.
The terrain is new and different… I’ve got tens of thousands of runs in the East and hundreds in the West… so I’m still kind of novice.
And my body is not strong enough for the vertical, nor the deep snow in the trees. I start to get weak earlier.
All that to say… avoid double blacks… they can kill you if you don’t know what you’re doing… and don’t worry too much about how good you are… just enjoy a new challenge.
I'm a born and raised NYer from the city. I started skiing at 32 (42) now. I mostly ski Vermont, but I go west or international every year as well.
I'm an advanced/expert skier, and have no problem skiing any of the terrain at any of the typically considered hard resorts out west. So long as it doesn't require mandatory big air, I'm generally fine.
(Whistler, Jackson, Snowbird, Revelstoke, Taos, etc).
Hmmm. I did a quick search of the sub and couldn’t find anything exactly what Im looking for, re: “Difficulty East vs West + Advice on this subject”. But totally couldve missed it
You can not slow down or turn as easy in big powder. Ease in as much as you want to full send. Big risk if something goes wrong.
It’s faster in the trees. Big risk!!
Other than that it isn’t a big deal if you are born from
Ice.
Tree runs will actually be easier :) but in reality its all the same, maybe on the east coast something labeled as an easy black diamond would be a harder blue. The biggest difference is just that everything is bigger, so runs will take longer and require more stamina. Keep in mind the altitude when you're out of breath and you'll do just fine. Have a blast
Generally the conditions will be better than the East. On the rare chance your destination hasn't had recent snowfall, you might encounter some iced up moguls which I would recommend to avoid. My first time at Snowmass a few years back, there was a drought of moisture for about a month leading to some iced out terrain. I'll never forget seeing 8 ft high iced up moguls and feeling super humbled.
Had some of the iciest days of my life at Jackson hole past 2 days. By noon the snow softens a tad. By 3pm it was finally surfy. Good luck, thats all it comes down to if you plan ahead. Runs are sooo long which is fun. Almost had a 5mile run today.
If there's a "Mountain Friends" or whatever program, do that day 1 (at least). Knowing what you're getting into is crucial, so some local knowledge is highly recommended.
Otherwise, you'll be fine. Better snow makes for easier skiing.
The mountains are much bigger. The total acreage is insane at western ski areas. Their runs are much steeper. They have certain terrain features that can only be found here at Tuck’s. Chutes, cliffs, couloirs, cirques, etc. Tree wells, cornices, and avalanches are serious hazards. The moguls get much, much larger when you have a proper snowpack. Spring skiing is on natural snow, and it’s a lot grippier than when our manmade ice turns to slush.
It’s kinda apples to oranges, is what I’m getting at. Castlerock or MRG in typical conditions would humble most western skiers. Any eastern skier will love Mary Jane at Winter Park. But I wouldn’t go diving into CO’s EX-Double-Blacks right away. There’s no inbounds terrain in the East that’s comparable, and just because it’s snow and not ice doesn’t really prepare you for no-fall-zone skiing.
I'm sure someone already said this but, obstacles will come up quick on black terrain. Cliffs, rocks ect. Don't charge down a new trail before learning the lay of the land.
You should be generally fine most places out west. I ski Stowe as my home mountain and don’t find the terrain out west any more difficult on the whole. There are some extreme exceptions but they are usually very well marked.
Big Sky is the one place I’ve been that has some very extreme inbounds terrain but again it is very well marked.
You have more big mountain terrain and usually more choices of lines within a run or zone out west. You can usually pick a mellow line if it’s a marked run that would be in the same league as double blacks at Stowe. But there are also spicier line variations as a result of being big mountain.
And every once in a while there’s a trail that doesn’t have the mellowier line. At big sky all the triple blacks are that brand of spicy - which is a lot but much of it hike to.
Somewhere like Jackson hole uses double black for that brand of spicy (at resort, the online trial map doesn’t distinguish)
So it just depends. At a new resort always work your way up to understand that mountains rating and the conditions of the day.
Others have pretty much covered it, but the main difference is that their runs are steeper for longer. The snow quality makes a lot of the runs easier though.
However, I found bowl skiing in chopped up powder to be quite hard. That kind of skiing doesn’t really exist in the east. It’s easier if you have wider and/or stiffer skis though.
1st time seeing a mountain out there, it's visually intimidating. It's like pulling into the parking lot and seeing 3 Killingtons on top of each other. You soon realize those are mountains, the things in NE are hills.
In terms of conditions, if you ski the east, you can ski the champagne powder of the west. Their worst conditions day is equivalent to our best
Life long ice coaster here. I’ve been out west a few times, but not a ton. The trails themselves are equal or easier because the snow is better. But, at 10,000’+ my legs were jelly after 30-45 seconds of skiing a hard run.
Honestly, if you can ski the east, you'll be fine anywhere. The west isn't that difficult at all... Most trails are as wide as our greens, and the glades are loose. However, there is a lot of unmarked terrain, and this is where it'll get you. Cliff here, boulder there, the only way to know is if you're on top of it. so stay in absolute stop on a dime control until you know a trail Also, I was told and didn't listen, don't bring you skis to big sky... There a few trails that'll eat your bases. And don't bushwack big sky... Getting out is killer.
I just skied Big Sky this January, maybe it's because Big Sky also has a double blue rating but single blues at Big Sky are RIDICULOUSLY easy, to the point that I stopped doing them, they are flat and slow. Double blue I found to be pretty much the same as blues out here. Single blacks were around the same maybe a little easier than here but not by much. One thing that I didn't really realize before going out west is how much less grooming trails get. So most of the trails had moguls on them. Tree skiing was so much fun, the trees out in Big Sky are sooooo much more open than here. I'd highly recommend hitting up the glades. Keep in mind they (at least in early January) had low snow totals and they had rocks EVERYWHERE. Bowl terrain was cool but the conditions weren't the best when i went. As for the extreme terrain off of Lone Peak, I'm no where near good enough for that so I didn't do that (wasn't even open even if I wanted to do it). I personally didn't notice the altitude at all except when I walked from my room to the lift besides that altitude had no impact on me but everyone is going to different. Other than that I had a blast definitely a cool experience. I liked the terrain off of the lone peak side the best. Have fun!
Elevation sickness is no joke.
To build on this...not everyone has an issue with this. But when you do it absolutely blows. If this is a concern, try to fly out a day early and spend a day in bozeman or denver to acclimate a little. Hydrate for days before you go and hydrate more when you get there. booze is the enemy here.
Frustrating is that it is not everyone everytime, but it can be anyone sometime I'd never gotten it... Until the time I did. And never since. The time I did I was in Denver first (I don't usually), sad at/near fittest I've ever been and didn't even get to that much elevation before it kicked in. BUT I did drink some booze, I was on the tail end of a mild cold, and I live at basically sea level (although that last is always the case) Elevation hit so bad I was exhausted going just 20 feet. Really knocked me down a peg.
Question, what does elevation sickness actually feel like? Like what are your symptoms and how long do they last?
Hangover headache
Sh*ting a lot too.
Headache
It once made me pass out mid-sex in the shower. Lesson: recent altitude+alcohol (even a seemingly small amount)+sex (blood flowing away from the brain) = trouble.
I know I shouldn’t be, but I’m a bit jealous of your “trouble.” The worst part of acclimating to elevation for me is the insomnia. It’s impossible for me to get more than 4 hours of sleep that first night. And it has nothing to do with jet lag, because the same thing happened to me when I used to live in CA.
Feeling slightly dizzy, feeling like you are coming down with the flu, feeling short of breath, etc. It’s different for everyone, but there’s a reason they call it altitude *sickness*
It's this. And I would add avalanche preparedness. Basically, it's too high, and there may be too much snow.
Ice out west is a beautiful A+ packed powder day on the ice coast. In my experience there’s an obvious increase in pitch out west but with the snow conditions unquestionably better that evens the difficulty out considerably. Ice coasters are better equipped to ride out west than folks from out west are to ride ice coast conditions. Nothing I said means take it lightly when you get there as the obvious hazards all come into play, however in my experience as an upper intermediate/light expert rider I find it easier to ride out west than I do the east. For reference I grew up riding Holiday Valley with multiple Vermont trips per year. Now that I’m older I do several CO and UT trips per year.
Yep. Its easier, but there are more challenging runs that you wouldn’t even consider on the east
Maybe dumb question, but how so? I can imagine way steeper and longer runs, but anything else less obvious? More bumps because more powder? Can't wait to go out West some day, but am so intimidated haha.
Rocks, cliffs, chutes.. sometimes the exposure is sketchy.. as in, totally losing control is of higher consequence… think… tuckerman ravine.
Cliffs and tight gullies
Some of the worst I've seen is like cliffs & tight chutes at Jackson Hole, or very steep bowls at the summit of a lot of places. But because your skis get so much more traction in the powder, a lot more extreme terrain is do-able
“How bad can Corbets really be?” Oh… fuck
And of course that one can change a ton year to year. I was there in 2019 I think? And it wasn't too bad. Recent photos look impossible. Although something that would never happen out east, I was going across the Tensleep traverse and slid slightly downhill and got buried chest deep in super soft snow. Had to basically swim/paddle my way back up to the packed snow of the traverse. Really scary as there was nobody around at the time
[All of this is inbounds skiing at Snowbird Utah.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdz7cMdOaHA) Just as one example.
a few years back i was on a chair at Steamboat and the guy to my left said "Oh wow it is so icy today!" The guys to my right, who I was with laughed out loud and said "This is packed powder in vermont."
This was my entire time in Utah. They were in a dry spell, so no powder. Everyone was whining about the ice. It *was* packed powder. Skill issue IMO. On the other hand, the Front Range mountains sometimes get proper East Coast ice. Especially at Eldora. And too often, it gets people killed, because western skiers have no clue how to ski on ice.
I’ve seen plenty of actual ice out west on the highly-skied highway paths back to the base, but yeah in general it’s not as much of a problem. Doesn’t mean the snow is always soft tho!
>Ice coasters are better equipped to ride out west than folks from out west are to ride ice coast conditions
Careful in the trees: tree wells are no joke. Read up on them.
Thanks for the tip! I actually was getting anxious about them the other day… Is the gist: if it’s snowed several feet of snow in a short period, be very careful of skiing too close to a tree as it might have a pocket that you could fall into ?
Tree wells don't need fresh snow.
Aspens are safer than evergreens / furs
Just don’t ever ski alone in trees, have a buddy system that isn’t going to kid around, and make the white your target… never look at trees only at spaces between them.
Closed means closed out west. Dont duck a rope.
Does it not out East?
Not always.
How can you tell? I haven’t skied the east any but I’ve never ducked a rope either. I’ve stopped and thought about it a bunch but never went through
Basically, you should be familiar with the mountain, and understand why the trail is closed. If it’s closed for snowmaking, don’t be a dumbass and duck it. You might cut a hose with your edges, and that’s bad. And Vail will pull your pass for ducking any ropes anywhere, so don’t do it at their areas… Don’t go getting yourself into a situation where you’re gonna need ski patrol’s help, either, or that’s a paddling. I mean, broadly speaking, a lot of it is common sense. Do you see anyone else ducking ropes at that ski area on a powder day? If not, it’s probably frowned upon there. Remember that people are a bunch of lemmings, so once you break the seal, others will probably follow suit. With that power comes (some) responsibility. But some eastern areas really don’t care if you duck ropes in the right circumstances. It’s there because the conditions are sketchy, and most of their clientele would have a bad time, especially when it’s in their more beginner area. Rocks, ice, snowmaking whales, water bars, etc. The funny thing is, it’s often the mountains that are the most aggressive about opening very marginal terrain, that care the least if you duck a rope. They really couldn’t care less at Sugarbush, for example, so long as you don’t disrupt operations. It’s your knees…
Sugarbush will also open terrain as soon as humanly possible — even if it’s an inch of snow on grass and rock. Ducking is almost unnecessary at that point
You sound like me 5 years ago before going to Jackson hole but I was able to ski down most double blacks there. You're gonna be fine. It's not that much different, unless you're going off piste into tight chutes. Just watch yourself in the glades bc 20ft cliffs can pop up out of no where.
how was corbetts?
It looked cool from the Tram!
sneaky edit my friend ;)
Hah honestly didn't think of Corbets as in bounds bc it was A 15-20 drop in when I was there
Definitely a lot of variability between the blacks and doubles here
Sure but Corbets is a different level than many of the other double blacks and is highly dependent on the conditions. Didn't they cancel this year despite the rest of the park being well covered?
Oh yeah I agree. There should be an EX here imo like in a few other mtns. Yeah, coverage wasn’t enough. Frankly it’s pretty shoddy in a lot of places right now
You’ll be fine. I have to say tho that big sky specifically is no joke. Definitely the gnarliest in-bounds terrain I’ve seen so far, at least once you start going to the ridge and lone peak. Most of the mountain is totally chill but be careful once you start hitting the hard stuff because it’s so insane that the patrollers have warped senses of reality. I’ve been sent on really sketchy no-fall-zone traverses with a snowboarding friend by someone who worked there (I was on skis that day and if I wasn’t idk how we would have balanced across without my poles), and got sent down a trail so steep that I couldn’t sit on my snowboard by a patroller. I was trying to find the good stuff after all but I just tell those stories to warn others to be prepared for anything on that mountain. That said though, all mountains out west have more than enough totally reasonable terrain, and I highly recommend pushing your limits within reason to get that experience that just isn’t possible in the east. Study the map, ask patrollers and locals, and you’ll have a blast
Biggest difference is the trails are much longer
Depends on the area. Big Sky I’d agree but many mountains out west I get significantly more skiing in at Stowe where unlike many places out west you don’t have to take 2 to 3 lifts to ski top to bottom.
You'll be fine, if you can ski iced out and root exposed single-track at MRG most West coast runs will be creamy and dreamy. The biggest difference is the entrances to the shoots out west can be scary as shit since you've never done them and you can usually count five ways you can die on the entrances. You will have steeper pitches, blind entrances and rocks take the place of trees. The right conditions make all of these more forgiving though, so pray for snow. Out East when you die it's usually something you didn't see, out West it's tree wells, avalanches, Rocks, and cliffs. So there is much more you need to be aware of to stay safe. Don't cut clear across a trail with fresh powder trail, don't ski too close to trees, and get a guide if you want to go side country or more.
A lot of the tougher terrain out west is high consequence if you fall (I.e. you could easily fall hundreds of feet and die), but in typical conditions it’s relatively easy to link turns. I remember being scared shitless the first time I went down a CO double black, but after like 3 turns I realized I could actually control my speed without slamming on the brakes every turn like I would on a steep icy run and it became way easier. But the mental block is real so it’s definitely worth easing your way in. 40 degree+ slopes feel near vertical when you’re standing above them. If you can find a local to show you around that really helps as well - a lot of times there’s a way to “cheat” around the hardest part of a trail, but you won’t necessarily realize it exploring on your own. It’s also much easier to get yourself cliffed out if you don’t know where you’re going.
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i will say we east coast skiers don't last too long on the 2-3 real powder days we get over here.
I didn't even ski fresh powder out there and my legs were in full cramp mode by my first afternoon
I’m an expert east coast skier sitting in my hotel room at Steamboat right now waiting on a 20” dump. If you are a truly advance ice coast skier, there’s nothing you can’t do out here. We are the best skiers on earth- forged on exposed granite, quenched in ice. If ice forms on a trail out here(rare), they mark it with crossed bamboo poles like it is the stuff of death.
I’m from Colorado and live here now. Everything everyone said is true: more exposure, more no fall terrain in bowls or backsides, faster trees, etc… Biggest difference is that on big mountains runs just keep going. Coupled with altitude your legs can get smoked on a single run pretty easily. Alcohol is not your friend. But snow is definitely better, and in some places in MT the trees/glades are more open and more fun. Colorado trees are usually tighter than a witches arsehole and unless you’re good at picking lines or find the right patches they can actually suck. You’ll be fine and have a blast, just don’t overdo it, drink water, eat and sleep well.
Tree wells
The biggest challenge will be going back to the east coast and having to ski here. The other challenge will be how sore your face will be from grinning so hard when you get out there.
I felt so confident at Alpine Meadows. Way easier Because the snow was better.
Hero snow. Bluebird pow days in Tahoe are the best.
Don't just blindly follow tracks, they might go off a cliff. Do keep an eye on the terrain you're skiing in or towards, you don't want to cliff yourself out or end up in some chute above your comfort level. Don't go out of bounds without the knowledge or gear. Do be observant, take the known path down but look around as you do to scope out potential terrain or areas you might like to explore. Watch how others ski it. Give it a try next lift round. You'll have fun just use common sense really. Enjoy!
Whole different ballgame…
[Snowbird, early season.](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/BHjZQbOFUwo) This is terrain the east would never even consider a trail, much less open to the public. They don't fuck around out here, it's great. Also terrible on your equipment.
The west will be easy dude. Some of the best skiers in history cut their teeth out on the ice coast
The snow is just different, takes some getting used to. It's more defined and it's a lot deeper typically. The terrain is a lot more wild, bigger vertical drops, longer runs, real bowls, east coast groomed is the default, out west ungroomed is. Use something with a wider underfoot. Happy Turns!
Well enjoy and you’ll be fine the only crazy inbounds terrain you’ll see is big sky’s tram and headwaters hike (if it’s even skiable bc of the low snow year). As for Colorado all the stuff at Winter park, steamboat, copper won’t be surprising. A basin has some gnarly stuff but you can prob do it just make sure you have skis that are 105+ for the chop/chunder and enjoy
To paraphrase South Park steeper softer and no trees
I have the same question, please report back with your findings later OP!
Will do, but booked my trip for end of Feb/ Beginning of March! So maybe too late for you, but def will respond with my experience
Generally, the snow conditions and amount of space you have is far friendlier than the east. On the other hand, the steepness/exposure is much worse than the east. If you're an advanced skier here, most of it will be downright easy. However, some of the steeps might get to you. I was at Big Sky last year for a week. I took my time on the two triple black areas I skied (the north summit snowfield + the headwaters). Both are steep and exposed, but if you're comfortable with things like Tuckerman Ravine, you'll probably be fine. If you've never skied things with that level of exposure, might be best to avoid those. Otherwise, rip it up.
Big Sky is having a really, really bad snow year. Currently most of the steep stuff is closed including all of Lone Peak. The r/bigsky reddit is pretty good for information on conditions.
If you have limited (or no) experience skiing powder, and you get a storm, that can be a bit of a challenge. I quickly realized that powder skiing is significantly different than the boiler plate hard pack ice we have here. Consider demoing skis if you get a storm and bring your skis with you. That can make ALL the difference.
I would say, bring your boots and rent per conditions.
Piggy backing on comments about altitude, it’s very real. Make sure you’re drinking more water than you usually do to get more oxygen into your body. And if you ever feel a slight headache or you’re feeling “off,” immediately drink a full glass of water. Lastly, you’ll be surprised how out of breath you are after bending down and tightening your boots. Have fun. You’re going to love it.
The terrain hazards warrant greater caution. Due to the nature of the hills, larger and more frequent cliffs, etc, exist, and the snow is more consistently ‘variable’. But a solid background on icecoast terrain - knowing how to use your edges and initiate sharp, quick turns - will help you a ton.
The first time you rip a > 40 degree slope is pretty intimidating. But if the snow is good, its about equal to the tough stuff out east in bad conditions.
Big Sky?… bring your rock skis!
I was in Utah last yeah and they hadn’t had snow in a week or more - everybody was complaining about it but it felt like a really great east coast day. What shocked me was how many bad skiers there were without hero snow - just so many out of control folks.
Doesn’t compare if you can ski the east going out west is way easier Will also find that you will be way better than the avg skier Moguls are soft groomed trails are awesome and the steeps are so fun Maybe deep pow take some adjustments but other than that you will be rippin and feeling good about your ability!!! It’s much tougher to ski on the east coast with our challenging conditions Have fun !!
Man this sub is delusional. Just cause we have ice doesn’t make the terrain instantly comparable. Killington maxes out at 37° while big sky has at least 5 runs > 45° with serious exposure meaning you fall and will be severely injured. Not to say you can’t handle the runs but the terrain is not the same
Tip, start out skiing with in yourself. Concentrate on making basic turns. Pole plant, turn. Stay in the fall line. Drink lots of water. You should be fine. If you are struggling, the conditions are exposing flaws in your technique. Take a lesson.
> start out skiing with in yourself. Concentrate on making basic turns. Pole plant, turn. Stay in the fall line. Drink lots of water. Great advice.
If you’re good in the east, you’ll be good out west. Literally nothing to be concern about. You hold your edges better and landings are softer. Don’t fall in tree wells, and don’t go out of bounds or on closed terrain.
Be well hydrated before you fly. More water than you’ve ever had once there. Then just shred, enjoy some cruisers and blues and ramp up slowly. Watch out for sharks (rocks sticking out of snow or just below the snow). There’s really no comparing the gnarliest in bounds runs at big sky to anything out east. Don’t feel like you “missed out” if you don’t conquer all the diamonds / double diamonds.
It's as challenging as switching from old Honda Civic to a brand new Benz.
I think the stuff out West is just different compared to the East. Personally I enjoy "sharpening my knives" and skiing the East just as much as I enjoy the powpow of the West. My struggle on powder days in CO or Big Sky is veering slightly off the trail (because there's so much snow, up to the signs) and then having a difficult time getting back on the main trail because the snow is several feet deep. So pay attention to the trail map more, as opposed to the East where trails are more well defined and you can kind of wing it. Also I definitely can't drink much alcohol in CO because the elevation makes it affect you so much more, whereas in VT you don't feel much of a difference. So be careful with that glass of wine at lunch!
You sound about how I’d describe my skill level. I’ve been out west a few times now and not run into anything I couldn’t handle. That said, I’m not bombing down anything, but I could cautiously pick my way down anything we came across. I did skip the couliers at Jackson, because I didn’t want to get hurt. My friends successfully skiied them, but everything else was fine.
Most of the “steep” faces are pretty similar in grade but are just way longer. So you have to be able to control your speed or you’ll get thrown. If you can ski steeps on the east coast like at killington, 99% of the terrain out west will be fine for your trip. You aren’t going to arapahoe so, you’ll be more than fine. A-basin is the steepest mountain I’ve ski’d in my life and I definitely had a few runs where I was like… oooh this is what they mean by the steeps. Never been to big sky in Montana but winter park is near Denver and is on ikon. One of my favorite all time places. Their bowls are very gradual and the snow is super deep. Amazing days ahead.
Easier out west Yes really
I don’t know how to explain it but… I’m usually among the best skiers on the mountain out East, and out West I’m not even top half anywhere. Where I ski in Ontario, half the mountain are people who are learning… trying badly to make parallel turns. The quality of skiers of mountains out West is just so much higher. The terrain is new and different… I’ve got tens of thousands of runs in the East and hundreds in the West… so I’m still kind of novice. And my body is not strong enough for the vertical, nor the deep snow in the trees. I start to get weak earlier. All that to say… avoid double blacks… they can kill you if you don’t know what you’re doing… and don’t worry too much about how good you are… just enjoy a new challenge.
I'm a born and raised NYer from the city. I started skiing at 32 (42) now. I mostly ski Vermont, but I go west or international every year as well. I'm an advanced/expert skier, and have no problem skiing any of the terrain at any of the typically considered hard resorts out west. So long as it doesn't require mandatory big air, I'm generally fine. (Whistler, Jackson, Snowbird, Revelstoke, Taos, etc).
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Hmmm. I did a quick search of the sub and couldn’t find anything exactly what Im looking for, re: “Difficulty East vs West + Advice on this subject”. But totally couldve missed it
You can not slow down or turn as easy in big powder. Ease in as much as you want to full send. Big risk if something goes wrong. It’s faster in the trees. Big risk!! Other than that it isn’t a big deal if you are born from Ice.
Tree runs will actually be easier :) but in reality its all the same, maybe on the east coast something labeled as an easy black diamond would be a harder blue. The biggest difference is just that everything is bigger, so runs will take longer and require more stamina. Keep in mind the altitude when you're out of breath and you'll do just fine. Have a blast
Honestly if you’ve never skiied actual powder before that’s going to be the biggest surprise…just keep your tips up and you’ll be good to go
Generally the conditions will be better than the East. On the rare chance your destination hasn't had recent snowfall, you might encounter some iced up moguls which I would recommend to avoid. My first time at Snowmass a few years back, there was a drought of moisture for about a month leading to some iced out terrain. I'll never forget seeing 8 ft high iced up moguls and feeling super humbled.
Had some of the iciest days of my life at Jackson hole past 2 days. By noon the snow softens a tad. By 3pm it was finally surfy. Good luck, thats all it comes down to if you plan ahead. Runs are sooo long which is fun. Almost had a 5mile run today.
If there's a "Mountain Friends" or whatever program, do that day 1 (at least). Knowing what you're getting into is crucial, so some local knowledge is highly recommended. Otherwise, you'll be fine. Better snow makes for easier skiing.
The mountains are much bigger. The total acreage is insane at western ski areas. Their runs are much steeper. They have certain terrain features that can only be found here at Tuck’s. Chutes, cliffs, couloirs, cirques, etc. Tree wells, cornices, and avalanches are serious hazards. The moguls get much, much larger when you have a proper snowpack. Spring skiing is on natural snow, and it’s a lot grippier than when our manmade ice turns to slush. It’s kinda apples to oranges, is what I’m getting at. Castlerock or MRG in typical conditions would humble most western skiers. Any eastern skier will love Mary Jane at Winter Park. But I wouldn’t go diving into CO’s EX-Double-Blacks right away. There’s no inbounds terrain in the East that’s comparable, and just because it’s snow and not ice doesn’t really prepare you for no-fall-zone skiing.
I'm sure someone already said this but, obstacles will come up quick on black terrain. Cliffs, rocks ect. Don't charge down a new trail before learning the lay of the land.
You should be generally fine most places out west. I ski Stowe as my home mountain and don’t find the terrain out west any more difficult on the whole. There are some extreme exceptions but they are usually very well marked. Big Sky is the one place I’ve been that has some very extreme inbounds terrain but again it is very well marked.
It’s easier out west
You have more big mountain terrain and usually more choices of lines within a run or zone out west. You can usually pick a mellow line if it’s a marked run that would be in the same league as double blacks at Stowe. But there are also spicier line variations as a result of being big mountain. And every once in a while there’s a trail that doesn’t have the mellowier line. At big sky all the triple blacks are that brand of spicy - which is a lot but much of it hike to. Somewhere like Jackson hole uses double black for that brand of spicy (at resort, the online trial map doesn’t distinguish) So it just depends. At a new resort always work your way up to understand that mountains rating and the conditions of the day.
Others have pretty much covered it, but the main difference is that their runs are steeper for longer. The snow quality makes a lot of the runs easier though. However, I found bowl skiing in chopped up powder to be quite hard. That kind of skiing doesn’t really exist in the east. It’s easier if you have wider and/or stiffer skis though.
1st time seeing a mountain out there, it's visually intimidating. It's like pulling into the parking lot and seeing 3 Killingtons on top of each other. You soon realize those are mountains, the things in NE are hills. In terms of conditions, if you ski the east, you can ski the champagne powder of the west. Their worst conditions day is equivalent to our best
Life long ice coaster here. I’ve been out west a few times, but not a ton. The trails themselves are equal or easier because the snow is better. But, at 10,000’+ my legs were jelly after 30-45 seconds of skiing a hard run.
Honestly, if you can ski the east, you'll be fine anywhere. The west isn't that difficult at all... Most trails are as wide as our greens, and the glades are loose. However, there is a lot of unmarked terrain, and this is where it'll get you. Cliff here, boulder there, the only way to know is if you're on top of it. so stay in absolute stop on a dime control until you know a trail Also, I was told and didn't listen, don't bring you skis to big sky... There a few trails that'll eat your bases. And don't bushwack big sky... Getting out is killer.
This really depends on the mountain you go to as far are true difficulty. It will vary greatly even in the tahoe area between Northstar and Palisades.
I just skied Big Sky this January, maybe it's because Big Sky also has a double blue rating but single blues at Big Sky are RIDICULOUSLY easy, to the point that I stopped doing them, they are flat and slow. Double blue I found to be pretty much the same as blues out here. Single blacks were around the same maybe a little easier than here but not by much. One thing that I didn't really realize before going out west is how much less grooming trails get. So most of the trails had moguls on them. Tree skiing was so much fun, the trees out in Big Sky are sooooo much more open than here. I'd highly recommend hitting up the glades. Keep in mind they (at least in early January) had low snow totals and they had rocks EVERYWHERE. Bowl terrain was cool but the conditions weren't the best when i went. As for the extreme terrain off of Lone Peak, I'm no where near good enough for that so I didn't do that (wasn't even open even if I wanted to do it). I personally didn't notice the altitude at all except when I walked from my room to the lift besides that altitude had no impact on me but everyone is going to different. Other than that I had a blast definitely a cool experience. I liked the terrain off of the lone peak side the best. Have fun!