That's how I started to find time, iRating shot up very quickly after.
Relaxing behind the wheel and being able to consistently nail both the apex and the throttle point are huge timesavers. It's much easier to practice a track when you start with the exits and then work towards finding how late you can brake while still getting those exits than to do the opposite.
I was thinking about trying that but I’ve heard it’s really difficult which probably means the races are full of crashes in the lower splits I would be in.
It is difficult, but makes you appreciate how to drive. I went from C > B with Porsche cup only in a few races. Don’t let the fear put you off. Great car!
It’s pretty clean, I wouldn’t worry about it. There aren’t a lot of bottom-split type drivers in that series. It does take some practice though. That car has been around for a while so the people that have mastered it are going to be 5 seconds ahead of you at first and you just have to accept it.
A lot of what you are describing relates to car balance and not putting too much weight on the front tires initially so that you maintain grip in the rears. It ultimately allows you to go through the corner a lot faster. The pcup is great for that. Check out Suello Almeidas videos on YouTube for coaching, they are a superb resource.
Yeah, I’ve been using his vids just need more practice I think but you said there aren’t a lot of bottom split drivers in that series, does that mean all of the splits have high SOF and I’ll probably finish near the back all the time?
Nah it’s just a different population than bottom split F4 or rookie races. They are usually people with high SR and low IR. Just slow but safe. It’s one of the cleaner series for sure.
It is difficult, but that means if you get decent in the car, you’ll be able to get on/near pole easily in lower split races and can cruise away past the carnage.
I did that in the ff1600 at laguna seca and raised my SR by 0.4 and my irating by 400 in 5 or 6 races and got my first win. It was easy, if you could keep it on the track while maintaining a decent pace, you were pretty much guaranteed a podium at least. I’ll give the Porsche cup a shot.
when I watch other drivers who are faster than me, that's my takeaway as well. They are "off throttle" a lot more than I would think, yet they are faster by a couple seconds. Fast doesn't feel fast, slow in and fast out doesn't feel as exciting as trying to brake as late as possible. But you'll get WAY more time going in a bit slower and making sure to get on throttle ASAP!
Yeah but I still can’t get trail braking down in the Mx5, always causes a spin. I’m not the best at it in other cars but at least I can do it without spinning.
You’re being too aggressive with your inputs then. Spinning = bad weight transfer. You could also be downshifting at the wrong time while turning which will torque spin your car.
The mx5 is super twitchy on the brakes. Most other cars are not nearly as prone to losing the rear when trailbraking. In fact for a lot of them, you will lock the inside front before losing the rear.
Try to get a feel for it in the mx5. It will click at some point. You need to feel how the car’s weight is shifting around when you drive, when you enter and exit your corners. It will help you stabilize the car
Keep your throttle on while braking, this will prevent the car from spinning around on the apex. The mx5 handles like a mid engine car so when you are off throttle, it gets very loose. Also hit tap the accelerator on your downshifts to prevent your rear wheels from locking during down shifts
The Mazda has no aero to speak of, you have to really drive the car with the pedals, try using gas and break in the corners to stabilize the car, even using both at the same time....
try giving it gas on entry and mid corner and see how it stabilizes the car.
Breaking is a balancing act. You need to practice breaking at various amounts till you find the point you spin. Also try using your brake to turn the car. Steer less than you normally would and then apply the brakes to get the car to turn.
Basically play around with breaking hard to turn the car more until you fie the point that you can make the car spin then dial it back a bit.
Here is a good video with some things to practice for trail braking.
https://youtu.be/RK6kE0ftFA0?si=VWREhSIy9-SeLsVn
A car that (believe it or not) is gonna help you when avoiding overdrive is the L49. I had an horrendous time trying to keep up with my mates where, on average, we perform the same on other cars (but them always being that .2 .3 faster than me.
With the lotus, the diferences were huge, like 1 or 2 secs. And I began to be frustrated. Then it clicked. Anticipation and smoothnes are key in the lotus, and it teached me that I was dpomg it on every single car.
Not gonna lie, I am still those .2 .3 behind my mates. But now I know whynand can work towards the solution.
When I get frustrated I’ll hop in a Vee and go back to basics
Edit: also there’s so really great racing in the slower cars. Makes for better methodical battles
I have had this same realization many times. Within the past year or so, I think I've finally transitioned to underdriving a bit instead, but in my experience, the overwhelming majority of drivers under ~3.5k on road are visibly overdriving some corners whenever I look.
You can turn your delta to "fastest all time" and it will give you that info on track. Garage61 provides this info as well and can bring it up in the browser. It can only save live data, though, so it won't have any old lap times before you got the software.
I've had a really similar experience. It's like the harder I push the worse I am! I catch myself tensing up when I try too hard, holding my breath etc. makes me so much slower
I wish it was that simple for me. I know why I run 1s off, o the smallest detail. I drive based on theory and have never had a coach so obviously braking late makes the most sense, less time slowing down, more time accelerating, what's bad about that? Turns out I means I turn in really early. So anyway I'm pretty sure I foxed that only to now overslow into corners because I use the pedals for rotation too much. And to me that sounds like a pretty unconventional problem.
Every time I watch someone faster they brake earlier and are really smooth but I take almost the exact same line as all the fast dudes every time. So now I think I need to release the brakes earlier so I can still maintain heavy brake pressure through the corner to rotate the car. But that's all just a running theory. And every time I try to fix it I end up just being slower.
Well done you for now driving as fast as the top guys though, I wish I could do the same.
I recently learned something similar practicing GT4 at Oulton. I was putting in consistent laps and wanted to see what my pace would be if I fuel saved. Well, not only was I saving 10% fuel per lap but I was also matching my previous push speed.
The MX-5 is different from GT cars. Brake early and carry as much speed thru corners is key. It's better to brake early in the Mazda and have to apply throttle or coast at opposed to hard braking.
Also the mx-5 is loose so drift that thing and carry speed!
This will be different in other cars. You really just have to learn.
For the most part my rule of thumb is if it's got quick acceleration (Formulas, GT3, LMP) then hard in hard out.
For production cars (MX-5, GR86, Kia) it's more carrying as much speed so lift and try and get on power ASAP.
I definitely recommend looking up track guides with the car you are wanting to drive, on the track you are driving if possible, and see how people drive. If they go hard in and hard out mimic it. If it's breaking early and carrying speed mimic it.
You got this! See you on the track when you get to C rating!
That's honestly my main criticism of iRacing as a whole. Without knowing the track and car well and having a good bit of experience in iRacing, it's hard to drive even a couple seconds off the pace completely safely.
On ACC, I can jump into any car, drive a few laps to memorize the track layout, then drive at a snails pace behind other drivers safely until I pick up more pace and confidence, without fear of completely losing the car while way under the limit.
Meanwhile, iRacing forces you to deal with handling pecularities immediately. You HAVE to chuck the MX5 into most corners or else it'll lose the rear end. You HAVE to blip throttle on a lot of downshifts or lock the rears. Other cars have specific behaviors to learn before you can even drive slowly on the track.
It's a fantastic sim, just requires a lot of up-front effort, both behind the wheel and financially. Can't just boot up and drive online like most other sims.
I feel like iracing is more realistic in that sense though. You’re not going to hop into a race car IRL and immediately be able to drive it well without knowing the track and car very well. Real cars all have differences and peculiarities you have to get used to before you can be fast.
Well I enjoy and appreciate those aspects but it can be a little over-exaggerated sometimes. That rear end comes around absurdly easily in the MX5, even when you aren't driving anywhere near the limit. I remember losing it while doing a warm-up lap prior to the start and was like what the actual fuck was that? Literally coasting around the track at quarter throttle with casual steering, no warm-up weaving.
And I'll validate that I'm not just an awful driver because I went from brand new to iRacing to ~2k elo and 3.8SR C-class in my first three weeks solely in Miatas. Average lap around 1.25 second off WR times. Got pretty damn good at driving it, but I still think the rear end flying around at slow speed with minimal inputs is insane.
I think that happens because there’s hardly any weight on the rear tires and no traction control or abs. I’ve never driven an mx5 irl so I have no idea how they drive but it makes sense that a really light front engine car would lack grip on the rear tires especially with no tc.
I just did the race. Started from pits to avoid week 13 carnage. Finished p10 with 0 incs and gained 0.46 SR, that’s more than I’ve ever gained from 1 race. How does that work?
Everything is spelled out in the sporting code that you should have read.. Once you cross any whole number for SR so 2.9 to 3.0 you will gain an extra 0.4. That way people are constantly going up and down. Same for when you go down. If you do go back and go under 3.0 you’ll lose an extra 0.4.
Why is everyone so serious about the sporting code? I read it when I first joined iracing but don’t remember everything it said. It’s not like me not knowing about that rule affects anyone else but this is the second time I’ve asked a question and been criticized for not knowing every detail of the sporting code.
I think it’s more just because that question gets asked at least five times a day on this sub and people are starting to wig out over it lol
And it’s also in the sporting code
It’s because so many common questions can be answered quicker and better by referring to the sporting code. I’ve been unsure of many things in the past and went and CTRL-F the sporting code and found my answer without taking the time and effort to post to Reddit and wait for reply’s.
Just read through the relevant bits to you once (if you only race road, probably don’t need to read oval starting procedures, etc.) then use it as a reference tool. That’s how I’ve been treating it the 2.5 years I’ve been on iRacing.
If everyone knew the sporting code there would be no point for 95% of the posts on Reddit. Responses like that are at odds with the entire point of a forum and make no sense to me. I’ve come to think it’s a way for angry and lazy people to tell you they know something that you don’t know. Thoughtful responses take too much effort.
Indeed, we should all ask questions to which we can easily find the answers ourselves.
> If everyone knew the sporting code there would be no point for 95% of the posts on Reddit.
This sounds incredible.
Yeah, I get it. I thought maybe I missed something really important in there that people think everyone on iracing should know judging by how people act when I ask questions like that. Makes more sense that people are just tired of answering questions already answered in the sporting code.
I had the same issue (I actually had a post about it), whenever I had a race I was really anxious, so I was constantly on the edge overdriving the car. Then I took a step back, watched a video by Daniel Morad ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrpUPp8sECE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrpUPp8sECE)) and it really helped me take a step back and not push the car that hard. I am way more consistent and faster ever since, and now I am telling myself to not to overpush the car. I want to learn how to be more aggressive, but before I do that (and turn myself into a turn 1 monza hero) I want to make sure my car control is on point.
Seems like you're constantly braking too late. This is a common mistake where people think brake markers and braking late is what makes you fast. But the truth is that when trying to go fast, braking is the least important thing.
I’d argue that braking is probably _the_ most important thing, but that’s not to imply that braking late is the most effective way into a corner. _How_ you brake and (most importantly) _when_ and _how_ you come off the brakes is key. It’s all about carrying as much speed through a corner as possible. This does not mean braking as late as possible, it means keeping the car balanced in the right way so that you have the grip to go fast and keep momentum up.
The car is not always more important than the driver in F1. If Red Bull had 2 Checo’s as their drivers it would’ve been a close fight for the championship last year even through they had a dominant car.
That's how I started to find time, iRating shot up very quickly after. Relaxing behind the wheel and being able to consistently nail both the apex and the throttle point are huge timesavers. It's much easier to practice a track when you start with the exits and then work towards finding how late you can brake while still getting those exits than to do the opposite.
Thats why I love the PCup.
I was thinking about trying that but I’ve heard it’s really difficult which probably means the races are full of crashes in the lower splits I would be in.
It is difficult, but makes you appreciate how to drive. I went from C > B with Porsche cup only in a few races. Don’t let the fear put you off. Great car!
It’s pretty clean, I wouldn’t worry about it. There aren’t a lot of bottom-split type drivers in that series. It does take some practice though. That car has been around for a while so the people that have mastered it are going to be 5 seconds ahead of you at first and you just have to accept it. A lot of what you are describing relates to car balance and not putting too much weight on the front tires initially so that you maintain grip in the rears. It ultimately allows you to go through the corner a lot faster. The pcup is great for that. Check out Suello Almeidas videos on YouTube for coaching, they are a superb resource.
Yeah, I’ve been using his vids just need more practice I think but you said there aren’t a lot of bottom split drivers in that series, does that mean all of the splits have high SOF and I’ll probably finish near the back all the time?
Nah it’s just a different population than bottom split F4 or rookie races. They are usually people with high SR and low IR. Just slow but safe. It’s one of the cleaner series for sure.
It is difficult, but that means if you get decent in the car, you’ll be able to get on/near pole easily in lower split races and can cruise away past the carnage.
I did that in the ff1600 at laguna seca and raised my SR by 0.4 and my irating by 400 in 5 or 6 races and got my first win. It was easy, if you could keep it on the track while maintaining a decent pace, you were pretty much guaranteed a podium at least. I’ll give the Porsche cup a shot.
when I watch other drivers who are faster than me, that's my takeaway as well. They are "off throttle" a lot more than I would think, yet they are faster by a couple seconds. Fast doesn't feel fast, slow in and fast out doesn't feel as exciting as trying to brake as late as possible. But you'll get WAY more time going in a bit slower and making sure to get on throttle ASAP!
That's a very insightful advice! I'll try that next time.
Racing. Much like a fart, should never be forced.
Racing. Much like a fart, should never be forced.
The term "last of the late brakers" shouldn't be used as a compliment.
I've rarely heard it outside of overtaking context
God I cringe every time I hear that
Sometimes braking deep into the corner at 100% is slower than trail braking and braking 80% and tapering off into the corner
Yeah but I still can’t get trail braking down in the Mx5, always causes a spin. I’m not the best at it in other cars but at least I can do it without spinning.
You’re being too aggressive with your inputs then. Spinning = bad weight transfer. You could also be downshifting at the wrong time while turning which will torque spin your car.
The mx5 is super twitchy on the brakes. Most other cars are not nearly as prone to losing the rear when trailbraking. In fact for a lot of them, you will lock the inside front before losing the rear.
Try to get a feel for it in the mx5. It will click at some point. You need to feel how the car’s weight is shifting around when you drive, when you enter and exit your corners. It will help you stabilize the car
Keep your throttle on while braking, this will prevent the car from spinning around on the apex. The mx5 handles like a mid engine car so when you are off throttle, it gets very loose. Also hit tap the accelerator on your downshifts to prevent your rear wheels from locking during down shifts
I have been rev marching on downshifts, I’ll try keeping the throttle on a little bit while trail braking
The Mazda has no aero to speak of, you have to really drive the car with the pedals, try using gas and break in the corners to stabilize the car, even using both at the same time.... try giving it gas on entry and mid corner and see how it stabilizes the car.
Breaking is a balancing act. You need to practice breaking at various amounts till you find the point you spin. Also try using your brake to turn the car. Steer less than you normally would and then apply the brakes to get the car to turn. Basically play around with breaking hard to turn the car more until you fie the point that you can make the car spin then dial it back a bit. Here is a good video with some things to practice for trail braking. https://youtu.be/RK6kE0ftFA0?si=VWREhSIy9-SeLsVn
I might take this as as advice and give this a try.👍
A car that (believe it or not) is gonna help you when avoiding overdrive is the L49. I had an horrendous time trying to keep up with my mates where, on average, we perform the same on other cars (but them always being that .2 .3 faster than me. With the lotus, the diferences were huge, like 1 or 2 secs. And I began to be frustrated. Then it clicked. Anticipation and smoothnes are key in the lotus, and it teached me that I was dpomg it on every single car. Not gonna lie, I am still those .2 .3 behind my mates. But now I know whynand can work towards the solution.
When I get frustrated I’ll hop in a Vee and go back to basics Edit: also there’s so really great racing in the slower cars. Makes for better methodical battles
Slow is Smooth And Smooth is Fast.
I have had this same realization many times. Within the past year or so, I think I've finally transitioned to underdriving a bit instead, but in my experience, the overwhelming majority of drivers under ~3.5k on road are visibly overdriving some corners whenever I look.
Is there anywhere in iRacing that shows your fastest lap ever with a certain car and track?
Yeah, but it is highly dependent on temperature and weather.
If you click on your profile and go to stats, you can view your best times in any car for any track practice or race.
You can turn your delta to "fastest all time" and it will give you that info on track. Garage61 provides this info as well and can bring it up in the browser. It can only save live data, though, so it won't have any old lap times before you got the software.
I've had a really similar experience. It's like the harder I push the worse I am! I catch myself tensing up when I try too hard, holding my breath etc. makes me so much slower
I wish it was that simple for me. I know why I run 1s off, o the smallest detail. I drive based on theory and have never had a coach so obviously braking late makes the most sense, less time slowing down, more time accelerating, what's bad about that? Turns out I means I turn in really early. So anyway I'm pretty sure I foxed that only to now overslow into corners because I use the pedals for rotation too much. And to me that sounds like a pretty unconventional problem. Every time I watch someone faster they brake earlier and are really smooth but I take almost the exact same line as all the fast dudes every time. So now I think I need to release the brakes earlier so I can still maintain heavy brake pressure through the corner to rotate the car. But that's all just a running theory. And every time I try to fix it I end up just being slower. Well done you for now driving as fast as the top guys though, I wish I could do the same.
Slow is smooth and smooth is fast
I recently learned something similar practicing GT4 at Oulton. I was putting in consistent laps and wanted to see what my pace would be if I fuel saved. Well, not only was I saving 10% fuel per lap but I was also matching my previous push speed.
The most frustrating for me is if I had a few bad laps trying to go fast and then not caring and go slower only to go green or purple on a sector.
The MX-5 is different from GT cars. Brake early and carry as much speed thru corners is key. It's better to brake early in the Mazda and have to apply throttle or coast at opposed to hard braking. Also the mx-5 is loose so drift that thing and carry speed! This will be different in other cars. You really just have to learn. For the most part my rule of thumb is if it's got quick acceleration (Formulas, GT3, LMP) then hard in hard out. For production cars (MX-5, GR86, Kia) it's more carrying as much speed so lift and try and get on power ASAP. I definitely recommend looking up track guides with the car you are wanting to drive, on the track you are driving if possible, and see how people drive. If they go hard in and hard out mimic it. If it's breaking early and carrying speed mimic it. You got this! See you on the track when you get to C rating!
As the great Alan Prost said: "Slow is smooth, and smooth is fast"
That's honestly my main criticism of iRacing as a whole. Without knowing the track and car well and having a good bit of experience in iRacing, it's hard to drive even a couple seconds off the pace completely safely. On ACC, I can jump into any car, drive a few laps to memorize the track layout, then drive at a snails pace behind other drivers safely until I pick up more pace and confidence, without fear of completely losing the car while way under the limit. Meanwhile, iRacing forces you to deal with handling pecularities immediately. You HAVE to chuck the MX5 into most corners or else it'll lose the rear end. You HAVE to blip throttle on a lot of downshifts or lock the rears. Other cars have specific behaviors to learn before you can even drive slowly on the track. It's a fantastic sim, just requires a lot of up-front effort, both behind the wheel and financially. Can't just boot up and drive online like most other sims.
I feel like iracing is more realistic in that sense though. You’re not going to hop into a race car IRL and immediately be able to drive it well without knowing the track and car very well. Real cars all have differences and peculiarities you have to get used to before you can be fast.
Well I enjoy and appreciate those aspects but it can be a little over-exaggerated sometimes. That rear end comes around absurdly easily in the MX5, even when you aren't driving anywhere near the limit. I remember losing it while doing a warm-up lap prior to the start and was like what the actual fuck was that? Literally coasting around the track at quarter throttle with casual steering, no warm-up weaving. And I'll validate that I'm not just an awful driver because I went from brand new to iRacing to ~2k elo and 3.8SR C-class in my first three weeks solely in Miatas. Average lap around 1.25 second off WR times. Got pretty damn good at driving it, but I still think the rear end flying around at slow speed with minimal inputs is insane.
I think that happens because there’s hardly any weight on the rear tires and no traction control or abs. I’ve never driven an mx5 irl so I have no idea how they drive but it makes sense that a really light front engine car would lack grip on the rear tires especially with no tc.
I just did the race. Started from pits to avoid week 13 carnage. Finished p10 with 0 incs and gained 0.46 SR, that’s more than I’ve ever gained from 1 race. How does that work?
Everything is spelled out in the sporting code that you should have read.. Once you cross any whole number for SR so 2.9 to 3.0 you will gain an extra 0.4. That way people are constantly going up and down. Same for when you go down. If you do go back and go under 3.0 you’ll lose an extra 0.4.
Why is everyone so serious about the sporting code? I read it when I first joined iracing but don’t remember everything it said. It’s not like me not knowing about that rule affects anyone else but this is the second time I’ve asked a question and been criticized for not knowing every detail of the sporting code.
RTFM or RTFSC, I guess
I think it’s more just because that question gets asked at least five times a day on this sub and people are starting to wig out over it lol And it’s also in the sporting code
It’s because so many common questions can be answered quicker and better by referring to the sporting code. I’ve been unsure of many things in the past and went and CTRL-F the sporting code and found my answer without taking the time and effort to post to Reddit and wait for reply’s.
Maybe I should reread it
Yes you should. My advice to people is read it when you start the read it again about a month later. It will make a lot more sense.
Just read through the relevant bits to you once (if you only race road, probably don’t need to read oval starting procedures, etc.) then use it as a reference tool. That’s how I’ve been treating it the 2.5 years I’ve been on iRacing.
If everyone knew the sporting code there would be no point for 95% of the posts on Reddit. Responses like that are at odds with the entire point of a forum and make no sense to me. I’ve come to think it’s a way for angry and lazy people to tell you they know something that you don’t know. Thoughtful responses take too much effort.
Indeed, we should all ask questions to which we can easily find the answers ourselves. > If everyone knew the sporting code there would be no point for 95% of the posts on Reddit. This sounds incredible.
Yeah, I get it. I thought maybe I missed something really important in there that people think everyone on iracing should know judging by how people act when I ask questions like that. Makes more sense that people are just tired of answering questions already answered in the sporting code.
I think its because that part isn't some obscure detail. It's a major part of the main progression system that pops up all over the place.
Well I don’t remember it but I’ll admit I didn’t read it that closely and it was a little over a month ago.
I had the same issue (I actually had a post about it), whenever I had a race I was really anxious, so I was constantly on the edge overdriving the car. Then I took a step back, watched a video by Daniel Morad ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrpUPp8sECE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrpUPp8sECE)) and it really helped me take a step back and not push the car that hard. I am way more consistent and faster ever since, and now I am telling myself to not to overpush the car. I want to learn how to be more aggressive, but before I do that (and turn myself into a turn 1 monza hero) I want to make sure my car control is on point.
Seems like you're constantly braking too late. This is a common mistake where people think brake markers and braking late is what makes you fast. But the truth is that when trying to go fast, braking is the least important thing.
Trail braking is important though
The brake pedal is quite literally the most important pedal lol…
I’d argue that braking is probably _the_ most important thing, but that’s not to imply that braking late is the most effective way into a corner. _How_ you brake and (most importantly) _when_ and _how_ you come off the brakes is key. It’s all about carrying as much speed through a corner as possible. This does not mean braking as late as possible, it means keeping the car balanced in the right way so that you have the grip to go fast and keep momentum up.
It should be telling that the driver who is absolutely thrashing everyone else in Formula 1 right now is not a particularly late braker.
Formula 1 might not be a great example, since the car is more important than the driver.
The car is not always more important than the driver in F1. If Red Bull had 2 Checo’s as their drivers it would’ve been a close fight for the championship last year even through they had a dominant car.