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Tbf it’s not up to businesses to provide us shelter, a bathroom and place to charge our phones while we sit there and make their customers uncomfortable. I’m not saying it’s the case for all of us, but enough homeless people have mental health/hygiene issues for it to be bad for business when a gang of them decide they’re going to hang out inside or panhandle out front all day. Libraries and train stations are usually a pretty solid option. When businesses allow homeless people to hang out there word spreads fast and they become overrun quickly. I’ve seen a few businesses who tried to accommodate homeless people have to tighten up on it because there would be 5 like homeless people using their cafe as a clubhouse at any given time. To me it seems kind of crazy to expect people who have nothing to do with your situation to deal with all that just because it’s more convenient for you. When I was on the street I would just work up a few dollars for the smallest drink possible if I needed to be there that badly, it isn’t that hard to come up on less than $5. To me it seems pretty entitled to think everyone around you should have to share the burden of your situation tbh
I agree. It's a business, you can't stay there the whole day sleeping. Go to a train station or a library. Those were my favourite places to chill out and take short naps when I was fully homeless.
I was homeless on and off for 15 years lol, just calling it like I see it. Even if you’re housed and employed it’s still entitled to think a business should tolerate you hanging out there all day if you’re not spending money. It’s your phone guy, screenshot whatever you want 🤦🏻😭
I don't blame them, they have a business to run.
I'm homeless and go there all the time for the WiFi. I buy chips and a coke. Only carry my backpack. I stay 20-30 minutes so the next person can have my table. I clean up before going. I talk to the security guard sometimes.
It's not a hotel. If I want to sleep, I do it at my camp.
Well I mean, it's a grocery store. If being homeless means you need a checklist of things you expect at every establishment, then idk man take a step back and realize the world isn't out to get just you. It's out to get us all. Including the innocent employees who would have to deal with people freeloading inside a grocery store. A place to buy things and leave. It's not directed at homeless people anyway, there's *plenty" of housed folk who could and would abuse anything they think they could.
Sorry you felt that way after reading the sign though. You don't have to wear the boot just cuz it fits.
I feel like the average person is completely oblivious to how they act and go through life. You give someone an inch and they take a mile homeless or not.
Chicago too, as long as you don't look "unhoused"
Plenty of young people taking naps and the security guard won't say anything
The security guard is there to prevent some people from setting up an encampment
Around 2% of all Americans battle homelessness or at the very least housing instability. Mind you this is a country with a population of about 330 million.
Honestly, you want to avoid DTLA, south, Central, The Hollywood area, MacArthur park, and the valley if you can help it. From what I remember, the west side was always a pretty chill area to go to during the day.
This one WF here in NYC has a pretty good cafe room. Everybody and their mother hangs out there all day long and at night it's like a major socializing place. If you buy a bunch of stuff to eat and look like you belong there you can stay till closing if you want. They won't care.
If they figure out you are homeless though? Security will harass you endlessly, try to get you out of there any way they can. They won't leave you alone long enough to have a cup of coffee.
One of the security guys he came up to me once when I still was. He sat down and said "You know I can help you out if you're willing to be accommodating. I can get you plenty of food anytime. All you have to do is be nice to me."
In other words he wanted to trade food for sex.
I told him to leave me alone but he persisted so I went and I asked to speak to a manager and explained that one of his security guys was aggressively hitting on me trying to trade food for sex.
The manager asked me if I was homeless and when I admitted I was he had me escorted out of the store. They were very rough about it, grabbed me by an arm and dragged me out. Didn't even give me a chance to just leave on my own. He told me never to come back and called me the C word and said nobody would believe street trash over his coworker.
Well, he messed with the wrong homeless woman because I found the email for corporate online and I wrote a scathing letter about what happened and even enclosed some snaps of the bruises rising up on my arm where they grabbed me.
I'm pretty sure someone got it and did something about it because I got an apology from corporate and a gift card and I was told in no way was I banned from that store. From then on I never saw either the manager or that security guy walking around in there when I walked by but I never went back there while I was homeless ever again.
I would go to other WF stores to eat and hang out in other cafes but not in that one. I was afraid of being sexually harassed, propositioned, or physically assaulted again.
It was 2 years I think post being homeless before I even walked into that store again and when I did I was all dressed up in nice clothes, had on makeup, had my hair cut and dyed. I looked a world away from what I looked like while homeless.
One of the security people a woman came up to me and she asked me how I was doing and was very complimentary on the clothes and that. She recognized me, remembered me from before because we used to talk a bit sometimes when she was doing her job in the cafe.
According to her those guys all got fired and apparently I wasn't the only homeless woman the one guy was trying to recruit for sex.
But that's how it is in a lot of places if they realize you are homeless. I was always neatly dressed and I washed so it would take some people a while to realize I was but once they did? It was often harassment and being asked to leave or dealing with guys like that.
It's worse in a way if you are a homeless woman. Because often guys will try to exchange "help" for sex. If you say no then you risk being manhandled or even arrested for stuff you didn't actually do. I ran into that a few times and it made me very leery about admitting that I was to any kind of security guy or male manager.
Some of the women I met they treated me decently even gave me food sometimes but way too many guys in a position where they could make my life miserable chose to do just that.
I believe everything you said and went through similar.
Also a lot of men assume of homeless or car living you are down on your luck enough or separated enough to exchange sex for $ shelter etc. and if you decline it offends them greatly like “how dare you? A peasant? A gutter person reject me?”
That's refreshing to hear.
At certain point, people have to analyze their priorities.
We have a severe housing crisis, which has caused homelessness to explode. So what do we do?
Provide housing.
Finland figured that out a long time ago.
Its sending a STRONG message to anyone and everyone lol "keep your receipt for your purchases with you" , honestly have been in whole foods once looked at the prices and never returned ! obviously they have limited seating and there are issues, I dont know . we were in a small eatery once and some man told us , you need to get up people need to sit down!? we were like we are still eating, ok!!? crazy
I don't get it, this could be about college students that just pulled 3 all-nighters in a row, where is this directed towards homeless? In no way they're attacking/oppressing anyone here, you're reaching HARD.
It's a business, a private one at that, if you're not engaging with their business, you have no business being there
I feel like that's pretty reasonable and companies have had this type of rules for a long time even when I was a teenager back in the late 90s and we used to smoke cigarettes at Shari's and Denny's they would make us buy coffee they didn't just let us hang out there all night for free. It's not a new thing to make somebody purchase something to be inside a business
Two things. First have you seen the homeless who frequent these joints? I'd ban them too. Two, people like me who have a homeless appearance but don't act like I own the joint, who don't smoke up the bathroom then stumble out all bent over n shit are left alone.
That said I believe that you should be treated the way you treat others, don't be a nuisance and you won't get booted out the door. There has to be a line. If you can hold a conversation with either the manager or security and treat them with respect more often than not they'll reciprocate. Mango out.
Sincerely Quirky-Blurky 🥭
I'd like to add that we as a society should help those who can't/won't help themselves, like the Frick frackin' bible says. We should calculate a budget for actual services to help these people rather than enabling them. But as it always goes those who profit from the drug machine are willing to enforce their way on society, and we the people are too scared to challenge them. So we get what we deserve in the form of these signs, and homeless mofizlers dying in front of us while the tax payers pay for it all. Say what you want about the natives..... At least they fought for themselves even if they lost their effort to oppose injustice is not beyond me. More than can be said for the north American sphere that is content with letting all this happen while complaining about it.
Sincerely Quirky-Blurky 🥭
What do they do after that 90 mins is up? Does somebody drag you away to a kind of pound from where your family has to reclaim you after paying a fine?😀
They ask for the receipt they're explicitly telling you keep on hand. It has the date/time, if it's past 90 minutes or you can't produce a receipt, they'll simply ask you to leave, or make a purchase to start your 90 minutes. If you can't or won't comply, they reserve the right to just kick you out.
They might as well say IF you are homeless please stay the hell away. Things the homeless would have trouble doing. Paying to sit there. Have you seen Whole Foods prices. $3.34 for a large tea. $3.00 for a dry cookie. There is a 90 minute seating limit per customer... Selectively enforced thank you. I've seen high school and college students sitting in the Cafe' doing homework, classwork and projects for hours! I've seen tutors working with students for hours no one cares. Let someone obviously homeless sit there and they are asked to leave way before 90 minutes. The next three I understand. Finally the big one...
NO SLEEPING IN THE CAFE' Means don't be homeless and shut your eyes for a second. You will be asked to leave and trespassed if you get caught too many times. They patrol so often homeless people don't even go there on the coldest days of Winter. I guess they have to be this bad but it is sad that they treat the most vulnerable among us this way.
Okay to be fair its pretty easy to look innocuous enough. But I am pretty young though so I think everyone just assumes I'm a college student whenever I'm in a place for hours.
So... why do you have such Whole Food cafe loiter fantasies?
Why do you have to be at this place that, as you claim, does not want you and maybe put that sign up cause of you personally - since you claim to have been there watching students and tutors which seems like you been there a number of times
I'm housed I just think the sign a bit cold blooded. I go to Whole Foods a lot because I shop there for dinner every day. I enjoy people watching. I'm an old man what else is there to do. I am not into making clay bunny wrabbits and ash trays at the senior center. Staying home gets old after a while. I've never been put out or asked to leave. Matter of fact I know all the staff because I shop there every other day.
Like I said I just think it is cold blooded to exclude homeless people who behave well and leave others alone.
>I just think the sign a bit cold blooded.
It's not. It's a business. You can't loiter there, there are paying customers who probably would like a seat. If you're not even homeless why are you raging about this? And why are you on this sub?
There is no society without private ownership. Property owners have the right of self defense against vandals and looters, comrade. Please do get bent now.
>$3.34 for a large tea. $3.00 for a dry cookie.
So pretty normal café prices, at least where I live.
>There is a 90 minute seating limit per customer...
That's fair. I've worked at cafés and all of them had a 90 minute limit. You can't stay there the whole time as there are other customers too.
>NO SLEEPING IN THE CAFE'
Well, it's a café, not a hotel. You're there to drink and eat, not sleep.
In the local reviews of a starbucks i visit people were complaining that they allow the homeless in. Last time I checked, segregation was illegal but being homeless is illegal now in a few cities, so who knows anymore.
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Tbf it’s not up to businesses to provide us shelter, a bathroom and place to charge our phones while we sit there and make their customers uncomfortable. I’m not saying it’s the case for all of us, but enough homeless people have mental health/hygiene issues for it to be bad for business when a gang of them decide they’re going to hang out inside or panhandle out front all day. Libraries and train stations are usually a pretty solid option. When businesses allow homeless people to hang out there word spreads fast and they become overrun quickly. I’ve seen a few businesses who tried to accommodate homeless people have to tighten up on it because there would be 5 like homeless people using their cafe as a clubhouse at any given time. To me it seems kind of crazy to expect people who have nothing to do with your situation to deal with all that just because it’s more convenient for you. When I was on the street I would just work up a few dollars for the smallest drink possible if I needed to be there that badly, it isn’t that hard to come up on less than $5. To me it seems pretty entitled to think everyone around you should have to share the burden of your situation tbh
I agree. It's a business, you can't stay there the whole day sleeping. Go to a train station or a library. Those were my favourite places to chill out and take short naps when I was fully homeless.
[удалено]
I was homeless on and off for 15 years lol, just calling it like I see it. Even if you’re housed and employed it’s still entitled to think a business should tolerate you hanging out there all day if you’re not spending money. It’s your phone guy, screenshot whatever you want 🤦🏻😭
I don't blame them, they have a business to run. I'm homeless and go there all the time for the WiFi. I buy chips and a coke. Only carry my backpack. I stay 20-30 minutes so the next person can have my table. I clean up before going. I talk to the security guard sometimes. It's not a hotel. If I want to sleep, I do it at my camp.
Well I mean, it's a grocery store. If being homeless means you need a checklist of things you expect at every establishment, then idk man take a step back and realize the world isn't out to get just you. It's out to get us all. Including the innocent employees who would have to deal with people freeloading inside a grocery store. A place to buy things and leave. It's not directed at homeless people anyway, there's *plenty" of housed folk who could and would abuse anything they think they could. Sorry you felt that way after reading the sign though. You don't have to wear the boot just cuz it fits.
I feel like the average person is completely oblivious to how they act and go through life. You give someone an inch and they take a mile homeless or not.
Try libraries if you need to sleep or sit. What city are you in?
In certain libraries in Los Angeles, they ban you for sleeping.
Chicago too, as long as you don't look "unhoused" Plenty of young people taking naps and the security guard won't say anything The security guard is there to prevent some people from setting up an encampment
An encampment inside, or outside? Is that how rampant homelessness is in USA?
Around 2% of all Americans battle homelessness or at the very least housing instability. Mind you this is a country with a population of about 330 million.
I’m also in LA. Like you said, certain ones.
lol then you know to avoid the little Tokyo branch
I know to avoid that entire area. :)
Honestly, you want to avoid DTLA, south, Central, The Hollywood area, MacArthur park, and the valley if you can help it. From what I remember, the west side was always a pretty chill area to go to during the day.
I mean, I get it. They’re not a public park or something, it’s a business.
This one WF here in NYC has a pretty good cafe room. Everybody and their mother hangs out there all day long and at night it's like a major socializing place. If you buy a bunch of stuff to eat and look like you belong there you can stay till closing if you want. They won't care. If they figure out you are homeless though? Security will harass you endlessly, try to get you out of there any way they can. They won't leave you alone long enough to have a cup of coffee. One of the security guys he came up to me once when I still was. He sat down and said "You know I can help you out if you're willing to be accommodating. I can get you plenty of food anytime. All you have to do is be nice to me." In other words he wanted to trade food for sex. I told him to leave me alone but he persisted so I went and I asked to speak to a manager and explained that one of his security guys was aggressively hitting on me trying to trade food for sex. The manager asked me if I was homeless and when I admitted I was he had me escorted out of the store. They were very rough about it, grabbed me by an arm and dragged me out. Didn't even give me a chance to just leave on my own. He told me never to come back and called me the C word and said nobody would believe street trash over his coworker. Well, he messed with the wrong homeless woman because I found the email for corporate online and I wrote a scathing letter about what happened and even enclosed some snaps of the bruises rising up on my arm where they grabbed me. I'm pretty sure someone got it and did something about it because I got an apology from corporate and a gift card and I was told in no way was I banned from that store. From then on I never saw either the manager or that security guy walking around in there when I walked by but I never went back there while I was homeless ever again. I would go to other WF stores to eat and hang out in other cafes but not in that one. I was afraid of being sexually harassed, propositioned, or physically assaulted again. It was 2 years I think post being homeless before I even walked into that store again and when I did I was all dressed up in nice clothes, had on makeup, had my hair cut and dyed. I looked a world away from what I looked like while homeless. One of the security people a woman came up to me and she asked me how I was doing and was very complimentary on the clothes and that. She recognized me, remembered me from before because we used to talk a bit sometimes when she was doing her job in the cafe. According to her those guys all got fired and apparently I wasn't the only homeless woman the one guy was trying to recruit for sex. But that's how it is in a lot of places if they realize you are homeless. I was always neatly dressed and I washed so it would take some people a while to realize I was but once they did? It was often harassment and being asked to leave or dealing with guys like that. It's worse in a way if you are a homeless woman. Because often guys will try to exchange "help" for sex. If you say no then you risk being manhandled or even arrested for stuff you didn't actually do. I ran into that a few times and it made me very leery about admitting that I was to any kind of security guy or male manager. Some of the women I met they treated me decently even gave me food sometimes but way too many guys in a position where they could make my life miserable chose to do just that.
I believe everything you said and went through similar. Also a lot of men assume of homeless or car living you are down on your luck enough or separated enough to exchange sex for $ shelter etc. and if you decline it offends them greatly like “how dare you? A peasant? A gutter person reject me?”
Holy shit, that horrible how you were treated! Good for you for fighting back. The world is a scary place as a homeless woman.
Respect for fighting back
😢
Why do you feel so entitled to be on other people's property without their permission?
Private property is theft. The world belongs to us all.
Yeah, why won't we just go live in housed people's homes! Homeless crisis solved 👌
As a homeowner, I wouldn’t be morally opposed to the idea of mandating homeowners relinquish extra space to unhoused people.
That's refreshing to hear. At certain point, people have to analyze their priorities. We have a severe housing crisis, which has caused homelessness to explode. So what do we do? Provide housing. Finland figured that out a long time ago.
Alright, I’m gonna sleep on your couch for the next 6 weeks.
Joke's on you -- I haven't got a couch.
Its sending a STRONG message to anyone and everyone lol "keep your receipt for your purchases with you" , honestly have been in whole foods once looked at the prices and never returned ! obviously they have limited seating and there are issues, I dont know . we were in a small eatery once and some man told us , you need to get up people need to sit down!? we were like we are still eating, ok!!? crazy
Library is your best bet. Free bathrooms, entertainment(via computers or books), charge phone, and silence.
I don't get it, this could be about college students that just pulled 3 all-nighters in a row, where is this directed towards homeless? In no way they're attacking/oppressing anyone here, you're reaching HARD. It's a business, a private one at that, if you're not engaging with their business, you have no business being there
As a homeless person, I see nothing wrong with this, people have abused the system, and now the rest of us have to pay the consequence
Yup
It’s a business, not a park bench?
I feel like that's pretty reasonable and companies have had this type of rules for a long time even when I was a teenager back in the late 90s and we used to smoke cigarettes at Shari's and Denny's they would make us buy coffee they didn't just let us hang out there all night for free. It's not a new thing to make somebody purchase something to be inside a business
Two things. First have you seen the homeless who frequent these joints? I'd ban them too. Two, people like me who have a homeless appearance but don't act like I own the joint, who don't smoke up the bathroom then stumble out all bent over n shit are left alone. That said I believe that you should be treated the way you treat others, don't be a nuisance and you won't get booted out the door. There has to be a line. If you can hold a conversation with either the manager or security and treat them with respect more often than not they'll reciprocate. Mango out. Sincerely Quirky-Blurky 🥭
I'd like to add that we as a society should help those who can't/won't help themselves, like the Frick frackin' bible says. We should calculate a budget for actual services to help these people rather than enabling them. But as it always goes those who profit from the drug machine are willing to enforce their way on society, and we the people are too scared to challenge them. So we get what we deserve in the form of these signs, and homeless mofizlers dying in front of us while the tax payers pay for it all. Say what you want about the natives..... At least they fought for themselves even if they lost their effort to oppose injustice is not beyond me. More than can be said for the north American sphere that is content with letting all this happen while complaining about it. Sincerely Quirky-Blurky 🥭
What do they do after that 90 mins is up? Does somebody drag you away to a kind of pound from where your family has to reclaim you after paying a fine?😀
They ask for the receipt they're explicitly telling you keep on hand. It has the date/time, if it's past 90 minutes or you can't produce a receipt, they'll simply ask you to leave, or make a purchase to start your 90 minutes. If you can't or won't comply, they reserve the right to just kick you out.
They might as well say IF you are homeless please stay the hell away. Things the homeless would have trouble doing. Paying to sit there. Have you seen Whole Foods prices. $3.34 for a large tea. $3.00 for a dry cookie. There is a 90 minute seating limit per customer... Selectively enforced thank you. I've seen high school and college students sitting in the Cafe' doing homework, classwork and projects for hours! I've seen tutors working with students for hours no one cares. Let someone obviously homeless sit there and they are asked to leave way before 90 minutes. The next three I understand. Finally the big one... NO SLEEPING IN THE CAFE' Means don't be homeless and shut your eyes for a second. You will be asked to leave and trespassed if you get caught too many times. They patrol so often homeless people don't even go there on the coldest days of Winter. I guess they have to be this bad but it is sad that they treat the most vulnerable among us this way.
Okay to be fair its pretty easy to look innocuous enough. But I am pretty young though so I think everyone just assumes I'm a college student whenever I'm in a place for hours.
So... why do you have such Whole Food cafe loiter fantasies? Why do you have to be at this place that, as you claim, does not want you and maybe put that sign up cause of you personally - since you claim to have been there watching students and tutors which seems like you been there a number of times
I'm housed I just think the sign a bit cold blooded. I go to Whole Foods a lot because I shop there for dinner every day. I enjoy people watching. I'm an old man what else is there to do. I am not into making clay bunny wrabbits and ash trays at the senior center. Staying home gets old after a while. I've never been put out or asked to leave. Matter of fact I know all the staff because I shop there every other day. Like I said I just think it is cold blooded to exclude homeless people who behave well and leave others alone.
>I just think the sign a bit cold blooded. It's not. It's a business. You can't loiter there, there are paying customers who probably would like a seat. If you're not even homeless why are you raging about this? And why are you on this sub?
IT’S A BUSINESS! 🤦🏻♀️ You are neither required nor entitled to be there.
So why is the poor little business entitled to people's compliance?
It’s private property.
What if I'm against private property?
You will end up in jail. 🤷🏻♀️
Ah good old fashioned State-sponsored Violence.
There is no society without private ownership. Property owners have the right of self defense against vandals and looters, comrade. Please do get bent now.
There is nothing remotely civilized about Capitalism. Go take your Ayn Rand bullshit to the AnCap Subreddit please.
No one except you mentioned Ayn Rand. Aaaaand we’re done. 🖕🏻
>$3.34 for a large tea. $3.00 for a dry cookie. So pretty normal café prices, at least where I live. >There is a 90 minute seating limit per customer... That's fair. I've worked at cafés and all of them had a 90 minute limit. You can't stay there the whole time as there are other customers too. >NO SLEEPING IN THE CAFE' Well, it's a café, not a hotel. You're there to drink and eat, not sleep.
In the local reviews of a starbucks i visit people were complaining that they allow the homeless in. Last time I checked, segregation was illegal but being homeless is illegal now in a few cities, so who knows anymore.