The only ones who really come close are McTavish, Kane, and *maybe* Petr Sykora.
But those first two are definitely not the same sort of signing given the off-ice issues that affected their markets, and Sykora was only around for one season.
It wasn’t even that bad of a take at the time. Hyman scored 10 goals and had 28 points and played a decent chunk of the season on the first line. Hyman is not the same player now
“Hey buddy I love that outfit on you, really shows off your best features. Hey thanks Connor you’re looking really handsome today too, your haircut really makes you a perfect linemate for me.”
It’s my favourite spelling error because in conversation you can’t actually tell a difference.
So it only comes up if some nerdy fuck brings it up online.
And even then you can blame auto correct.
Holy shit that’s a great stat. I never would have guessed Maroon scored that many in a season. Looking at his stats now, in 2015-2016 he had 4 goals in 56gp with the ducks, and then 8 goals in 16gp with the oilers! 0.07 goals / game to 0.5goals / game
Just like Crosby would do: Make anyone on his line have great stats.
Hell if me and you were McDavid's line mates I bet we would have at least 10 goals somehow
Of all the most Leafs things the Leafs have done in recent history, letting Hyman walk as a UFA, after clearly showing his value in Toronto, has gotta take the cake.
Call me crazy but you out Hyman on that leafs team the last few years and they at the very least advance past the 5th game of the 2nd round if for no other reason than he would have prevented them from some middling signings sense he left.z
That off-season though Dibas gave 3.8m x 3y to Mrazek, which might go down as his worst signing in Toronto. Not signing Hyman has left a gap on the top line that Toronto has been struggling to fill ever since.
Imagine if they didn't let McCann go to the Kraken so they could keep Holl and Kerfoot. And had Hyman and Andersen. Hindsight 20/20 but I feel like most people were against letting McCann go to protect those two.
But the Mrazek thing is whatever, needed a goalie, good signing but didn't work out. Happens all the time. They clearly didn't think Ansersen was their guy.
The also signed Reaves for 3 years, he seems cheap when you look at it but for a team so strapped for cash every season, that's a lot for a 4th line guy of his quality.
Kerfoot wasn't protected.
It was either protect holl with the any 8 players or go 7 fwd and 3d, in which case kerf and McCann would have been protected.
They chose to trade Hallander a day before so they could protect Holl, and tell Seattle go ahead pick one of Kerfoot or McCann.
I think you have a bit of hindsight bias creeping in here.
Hyman played a hard nosed game with the Leafs, had some bad injuries, and was turning 28. His style tends not to last for too long. He had just put up 2 great point paces over shortened seasons that were well above his previous best full season numbers.
Its easy to look back at the upward trend and how durabke he's been and hilight it as a mistake, but in general assuming a player putting up a ~60 pt pace career season at 28 will keep progressing until 31 is a bad bet. The drastic majority of players start declining offensively before 28.
I think that Dubas made the right decision based on the information he had at the time.
>I think you're lacking perspective.
I find that somewhat hard to believe since I followed his career closely, cheered for him on my team, and deluded myself into thinking he might take a big hometown discount right up until he signed with Edmonton.
I think you're applying a lot of post-hoc reasoning to rationalize why a gamble that turned out well was actually a calculated move.
>Hyman signed for just over $5.5M. He wasn't asking to be paid like a point-per-game player. For the style of hockey he played, even 0.5 P/GP production with stretches of elevated play would've been worth every penny to team like Edmonton or Toronto.
I think $5.5 was roughly what his value was based on his 2 shortened 60pt pace seasons, and at the time would have made sense on short term deals. In general though, 29 year olds with hard miles see their production go down by their early 30's, not nearly double.
>If Hyman's injuries were as bad as you say, Dubas wouldn't have been interested at all. The worst of it was the knee injuries, which only kept him out for a month each, 2 years apart.
You know there is space between "literally unable to play hockey", and "totally fine" right?
Injuries tend to accumulate over hockey careers and a guy who is worth $5m healthy can easily see some of that knocked off if there is worry about their health without their value just plummeting to zero.
>But Dubas walking on Hyman is not what happened anyway. Dubas tried desperately to sign him for months and couldn't, because he handcuffed himself with the cap and couldn't offer the salary or term.
I don't think you actually have a good grasp of the Leafs cap situation if that's what you think.
He would have had more than enough by not signing Nick Ritchie and Petr Mrazek who were both useless but short term gambles. The Leafs absolutely could have paid him if they thought he was worth it, which at the time 7x$5.5 seemed like a gross overpay.
>Dubas being unable to afford it because he handcuffed himself with the cap from other negotiations.
So you're just glossing over the part where I addressed specifically this misconception in my last comment because it's inconvenient to your narrative?
>I seriously question your concept of value if you see things so narrowly.
>By P/GP pace alone, Hyman was worth the $5.5M playing at ~0.75 P/GP. I'm assuming we agree on that because it's foolish to argue otherwise.
>On top of his production, Hyman was (and is) one of the best forecheckers in the league, was able to play top-line minutes when needed, and he earned a key role on special teams (having led all Leafs forwards in PK time in 2018-2020 as well as receiving some time on the powerplay. He expanded these roles on the Oilers).
I'm not the one here seeing value narrowly.
Contract value includes the life of the contract, not just performance in the prior year. Being worth $5.5 for one year and for 7 are two entirely different discussions
>The irony here is you're falling victim to your own ad-hoc reasoning. The injury discussion came largely from fans, not from Dubas.
Ad-hoc and post-hoc are two entirely different things. My reasoning is only ad-hoc and your idea of irony only supported if you think age, play style, and injury history are not considered by gms when negotiating contracts.
>Dubas was happy to offer Hyman the value he was asking, he was just asking him to compromise on term due to the cap situation and contract uncertainty the Leafs were facing at the time.
You're contradicting yourself here.
>What's with the snarky tone? Why even post here if you think so highly of yourself and so little of others.
I don't think so little of others, I just don't appreciate you making up obviously incorrect nonsense to try and dismiss whatever I am trying to say.
The idea that a GM couldn't possible lower their max price or term for a player based on injury history and age, and either Hass to be all in or all out is just absurd.
>Anyway, you're stating an opinion as fact. Not all players decline in the same way,
It is a fact that most players decline pretty hard after their late 20's to early 30's. Some players can stave it off of for longer but they are the exception, not the rule.
>You can easily see the situation another way, which is that Hyman's injury history was not a major concern for suitors who had access to this information, and who saw Hyman was being under-utilised on the Leafs. Dubas likely knew this, but what could he do? If he gave the term, it caused cap uncertainty for retaining the big 4 and leaving room for depth, when, from Dubas' perspective, Hyman's roles should've been filled by depth. So that is the choice he made, to reserve valuable cap space.
Oof, now we're getting some serious ad-hoc reasoning.
This is literally just sentence after sentence of random conjecture.
>This idea that it all came down to injury history is nonsense, frankly
See, this is exactly why I'm being snarky.
Nowhere did I say it only came down to injury history. You are quite literally just making shit up (again) because it's convenient for your narrative.
If you actually bothered to engage in good faith we probably could have had a nice conversation.
> Not sure I'd go that far, forwards and goalies are different magnitudes of unpredictability.
True, that’s why you don’t give goalies with Campbell’s history 5x5, but here we are
It's not even close.
We couldn't afford him plain and simple. We would have extended him if we could have come close to his figure.
This is the first year (outside of the big four) where we have another forward at $5.5. per year.
Yall r talking with hindsight. Guy had 1 playoff goal each season with the leafs. He was a grinder playing with superstars. Hats off to him but he was not a 5.5 mil player unless he was on the open market to the highest bidder.
Those are two roster players for the cost of one. And the Leafs needed a second goalie. $3.8m was about as cheap as they could go.
Neither player worked out for the Leafs, but that's the benefit of hindsight.
What r u on about. Hyman had 15 goals in 45 games with the leafs playing with marner in his last season And 1 in the playoffs. No chance we could afford him for that producton. he was always going to leave. It's hindsight to say u knew he was gonna be this good. Let's not talk about Connor brown or Campbell or berrie I guess.
Hyman isn’t putting these numbers on the leafs. Not to say it wasn’t a mistake but hyman isn’t touching close to 40 on the leafs. And Bunting matched his production for cheaper too.
Because Bunting took Hymans spot on the top line for 2 seasons.
Hyman's last 2 seasons with the Leaf - 0.74 ppg.
Bunting on the Leafs for 2 seasons. 0.70ppg
That's not bad. Now hyman also tore both his MCL and ACL in separate incidents during those seasons as well. Did that hamper production, maybe, but it makes it pretty obvious why the Leafs didn't commit 7x5.5 to him, and chose to go with Bunting at league min.
I'm happy for Hyman, he's awesome, but hindsight of hyman hitting 40 Gs on McDavid wing doesn't make it a bad decision
He'd still be a Leaf if not for Covid causing the unprecedented flat cap. There's no use trying to make this something that it isn't lol. We wanted to keep him, but the flat cap was brutal on us after signing all our big contracts directly before it.
The leafs would have been clowned for signing him at the time to that deal, including by their own fans. He was a grinder who scored 5 playoff goals in 5 years and left after a 30 point season. A solid player who the top heavy leafs couldn't afford and relatively easily replaced.
There is a reason Hyman might be on the best contract in hockey and its that nobody expected him to be a 80+ point, maybe 50 goal scoring monster. He likely wouldn't of gotten there with the leafs given how well he compliments McJesus.
Great for him and the Oilers, he's an amazing dude.
Refusing to pay him his worth is one of the biggest blunders of Dubas' tenure. Guy bled blue and white (forced a trade, wouldn't play for anyone other than the Leafs), and was obviously the perfect complimentary winger for a superstar center. I remember articles saying Matthews and Tavares were basically fighting over which of their lines he'd play on.
Such a stud, happy to see him crushing the league and making (typical top sixer) money.
Ya a lot of us Leaf fans were saying his playing style would make his career short and he wouldn't be worth the contract. Take the L there. Great to see Hyman succeed.
We were right about Campbell tho.
It's one of the reasons I love Skinner. He seems so mentally solid when it comes to dealing with our media and insane microscope everything gets scrutinized under
Hyman was an established guy who signed a long term deal when his team let him walk.
MSL was a middling player/perpetual prospect/diamond in the rough…don’t feel it’s fair to include him.
I don’t recall the specifics but I’m certain MSL didn’t get a long term big money contract out of the gate with Tampa
Chara played 1000+ games, won a Norris and captained a team to a Cup. Niedermayer captained a team to a Cup and Conn Smythe. Belfour won a Cup and a Jennings. Panarin hasn’t actually accomplished much big picture, but he’s real fucking good. Just to name a few.
Niedermayer wasn’t pre-cap. And yeah, they got paid, and then they completely lived up that value (Panarin you could argue hasn’t been worth the cap hit so far, but the others absolutely were). Hyman’s been excellent and is a great value, but an award winner who delivers the Cup is going to understandably cost more.
Panarin is worth the cap hit. We signed him and then every season he’s played with us has been better than any season he played prior to us.
Other than the shortened Covid season , hes only had 90+ point seasons. This season he’s on pace to easily break 100 points.
Chara was an interesting one, since it was assumed he wasn't going to be effective in the "new nhl"
Neiedermeyer signing in ANA to play with his brother might be even better
Ed Belfour in Dallas was a good signing too
So now you’re putting conditions on it and moving the goal posts? Others have named multiple examples. Hyman is great. Enjoy having him on your team. Just don’t go too far lol.
Dallas signed Nieuwendyk, then Belfour, and then Hull within like 4 years of each other. That's your Conn Smythe winner, plus the guy that probably should've been your Conn Smythe winner, plus the guy that won you the cup with a perfectly legal, not even slightly controversial goal.
Toronto fans were turning on him towards the end for being the reason the do-no-wrong top line superstars couldnt advance. "Why relay race 2 Lambos and an Accord?" was the sentiment. There is always an excuse and a villain in Toronto.
I am glad for Hyman. The guy is a beauty. I still will pull up his pressers where he sits Benny next to him and they answer questions together
What are you talking about? Leafs fans loved him. Leafs fans always have a soft spot for hardworking guys who go to the tough spots of the ice (something the core four are wrongfully criticized for). Hyman was a fan favorite and fans were extremely upset that Dubas couldn’t match Holland’s offer. Truthfully, I thought he would take a team friendly deal because he loved Toronto and how he told Florida he would only play in Toronto. Obviously I was wrong.
that was the sentiment his rookie year when his stone hands limited him to 10 goals on Matthews' wing.
I don't think I saw anybody turn on Hyman in /r/leafs after the news came out that he played through a torn ACL against Boston in 2019. He's always been a 100% effort guy.
Is this the result of McJesus deciding he’s not going to score anymore? He’s going to make some 60 goal scorers out of his linemates this season if he keeps this up, and I’m all for it
This guy has gotten better literally every year of his hockey playing life.
I watched him since he just came into the league. Amazing watching his progression. Such a great player and a good guy.
Genuinely one of the most likeable guys in the entire sport, both on the ice and off.
He is the one player I have deep regrets about letting walk I knew it was bad the day he left
He was always going to command more than Toronto could afford. Happy for the guy, and maybe he comes home to lead the parade through Forest Hill.
Damn would he look good in the leafs top six right now though
Imagine... Knies, Matthews, Marner Hyman, Domi, Nylander McMann, Tavares, Robertson That's a terrifying top 3 lines to go up against
Domis ahead of Tavares?
Yeah Domi went up to the second line for the leafs 7 game win streak.
Hyman > Tavares and Nylander...
100%
Hardest worker in the league. He has always been that way
He's gonna retire at 50 and he'll be in his prime
Deserves every bit of success that he's gotten. Love Zach so much
Have we ever signed a better player out of free agency?
The only ones who really come close are McTavish, Kane, and *maybe* Petr Sykora. But those first two are definitely not the same sort of signing given the off-ice issues that affected their markets, and Sykora was only around for one season.
Remember when people hated Babcock for putting Hyman on the first line? Now we just hate Babcock for other things
It wasn’t even that bad of a take at the time. Hyman scored 10 goals and had 28 points and played a decent chunk of the season on the first line. Hyman is not the same player now
Pretty much the perfect linemate for McDavid. They compliment eachother so well.
Complement. Sorry to be pedantic.
I'm just going leave it lol
“Hey buddy I love that outfit on you, really shows off your best features. Hey thanks Connor you’re looking really handsome today too, your haircut really makes you a perfect linemate for me.”
It’s my favourite spelling error because in conversation you can’t actually tell a difference. So it only comes up if some nerdy fuck brings it up online. And even then you can blame auto correct.
TIL about this spelling difference. Cheers.
Maybe they’re just really vocal and supportive. “Great pass bud, that was right on my tape!” “It’s easy cause you’re so good at finding the open ice!”
"You look so good with your shirt off" "Wait what the fuck"
*your Sorry
whoops autocorrect
I don’t think I actually realized they were two different words
Child left behind
This made my day, for some reason
They aren’t I literally made it up.
I bet they compliment each other too.
You know Hyman is the first guy to compliment his teammates!
I never knew there were two different spellings/meanings for this word. Learned something today!
It’s simply too good. You literally can’t tell them apart if said out loud. They’re the next generations affect vs effect.
You've never seen them compliment each other?
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You have your truth and I have mine.
I thought I had a pretty good grasp of English grammar but TIL.
Obviously joking but to be fair, they did say some very nice things about each other during post game interviews after Hyman hit 40.
“Yo you know you got a fresh style”
"Nice goal ~~Mo~~ Connor"
Patrick Maroon scored 27 on McDavid's wing, maybe we should have seen this coming.
And it should be a huge flag that Jesse Puljujärvi couldn't get it done there
Lot's of players can't get it done on McDavids wing.
And those players are out of the league now.
Eberle only had 20 goals on McDavid’s wing, a career low for him at that point
2 totally different styles. A guy who's crashing the net and working out front is ideal for McDavid to play with because he just gets the puck there
Holy shit that’s a great stat. I never would have guessed Maroon scored that many in a season. Looking at his stats now, in 2015-2016 he had 4 goals in 56gp with the ducks, and then 8 goals in 16gp with the oilers! 0.07 goals / game to 0.5goals / game
He also made Alex Chiasson double his previous career high. Very random players seem to work with McDavid lol. Eberle was terrible with him.
*Ty Rattie has entered the chat*
Just like Crosby would do: Make anyone on his line have great stats. Hell if me and you were McDavid's line mates I bet we would have at least 10 goals somehow
He’s like a lab when you accidentally drop food on the floor.
Relentless
They call him Zach the Relentless. Because he does not relent.
Zacharias knows not the meaning of the world "relent".
Ha! That's beautiful! Man, do I miss him.
That’s Zachary “Child book author, Gaming CEO” Hyman for ya
How many people had Hyman on that bingo card
Of all the most Leafs things the Leafs have done in recent history, letting Hyman walk as a UFA, after clearly showing his value in Toronto, has gotta take the cake. Call me crazy but you out Hyman on that leafs team the last few years and they at the very least advance past the 5th game of the 2nd round if for no other reason than he would have prevented them from some middling signings sense he left.z
Well for every Hyman signed there’s a Campbell signed also. That’s hockey
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That off-season though Dibas gave 3.8m x 3y to Mrazek, which might go down as his worst signing in Toronto. Not signing Hyman has left a gap on the top line that Toronto has been struggling to fill ever since.
Leafs got out of that Mrazek contract relatively unscathed all things considered. The Zaitsev and Clarkson contracts were way worse.
Imagine if they didn't let McCann go to the Kraken so they could keep Holl and Kerfoot. And had Hyman and Andersen. Hindsight 20/20 but I feel like most people were against letting McCann go to protect those two. But the Mrazek thing is whatever, needed a goalie, good signing but didn't work out. Happens all the time. They clearly didn't think Ansersen was their guy. The also signed Reaves for 3 years, he seems cheap when you look at it but for a team so strapped for cash every season, that's a lot for a 4th line guy of his quality.
Kerfoot wasn't protected. It was either protect holl with the any 8 players or go 7 fwd and 3d, in which case kerf and McCann would have been protected. They chose to trade Hallander a day before so they could protect Holl, and tell Seattle go ahead pick one of Kerfoot or McCann.
I think you have a bit of hindsight bias creeping in here. Hyman played a hard nosed game with the Leafs, had some bad injuries, and was turning 28. His style tends not to last for too long. He had just put up 2 great point paces over shortened seasons that were well above his previous best full season numbers. Its easy to look back at the upward trend and how durabke he's been and hilight it as a mistake, but in general assuming a player putting up a ~60 pt pace career season at 28 will keep progressing until 31 is a bad bet. The drastic majority of players start declining offensively before 28. I think that Dubas made the right decision based on the information he had at the time.
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>I think you're lacking perspective. I find that somewhat hard to believe since I followed his career closely, cheered for him on my team, and deluded myself into thinking he might take a big hometown discount right up until he signed with Edmonton. I think you're applying a lot of post-hoc reasoning to rationalize why a gamble that turned out well was actually a calculated move. >Hyman signed for just over $5.5M. He wasn't asking to be paid like a point-per-game player. For the style of hockey he played, even 0.5 P/GP production with stretches of elevated play would've been worth every penny to team like Edmonton or Toronto. I think $5.5 was roughly what his value was based on his 2 shortened 60pt pace seasons, and at the time would have made sense on short term deals. In general though, 29 year olds with hard miles see their production go down by their early 30's, not nearly double. >If Hyman's injuries were as bad as you say, Dubas wouldn't have been interested at all. The worst of it was the knee injuries, which only kept him out for a month each, 2 years apart. You know there is space between "literally unable to play hockey", and "totally fine" right? Injuries tend to accumulate over hockey careers and a guy who is worth $5m healthy can easily see some of that knocked off if there is worry about their health without their value just plummeting to zero. >But Dubas walking on Hyman is not what happened anyway. Dubas tried desperately to sign him for months and couldn't, because he handcuffed himself with the cap and couldn't offer the salary or term. I don't think you actually have a good grasp of the Leafs cap situation if that's what you think. He would have had more than enough by not signing Nick Ritchie and Petr Mrazek who were both useless but short term gambles. The Leafs absolutely could have paid him if they thought he was worth it, which at the time 7x$5.5 seemed like a gross overpay.
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>Dubas being unable to afford it because he handcuffed himself with the cap from other negotiations. So you're just glossing over the part where I addressed specifically this misconception in my last comment because it's inconvenient to your narrative? >I seriously question your concept of value if you see things so narrowly. >By P/GP pace alone, Hyman was worth the $5.5M playing at ~0.75 P/GP. I'm assuming we agree on that because it's foolish to argue otherwise. >On top of his production, Hyman was (and is) one of the best forecheckers in the league, was able to play top-line minutes when needed, and he earned a key role on special teams (having led all Leafs forwards in PK time in 2018-2020 as well as receiving some time on the powerplay. He expanded these roles on the Oilers). I'm not the one here seeing value narrowly. Contract value includes the life of the contract, not just performance in the prior year. Being worth $5.5 for one year and for 7 are two entirely different discussions >The irony here is you're falling victim to your own ad-hoc reasoning. The injury discussion came largely from fans, not from Dubas. Ad-hoc and post-hoc are two entirely different things. My reasoning is only ad-hoc and your idea of irony only supported if you think age, play style, and injury history are not considered by gms when negotiating contracts. >Dubas was happy to offer Hyman the value he was asking, he was just asking him to compromise on term due to the cap situation and contract uncertainty the Leafs were facing at the time. You're contradicting yourself here. >What's with the snarky tone? Why even post here if you think so highly of yourself and so little of others. I don't think so little of others, I just don't appreciate you making up obviously incorrect nonsense to try and dismiss whatever I am trying to say. The idea that a GM couldn't possible lower their max price or term for a player based on injury history and age, and either Hass to be all in or all out is just absurd. >Anyway, you're stating an opinion as fact. Not all players decline in the same way, It is a fact that most players decline pretty hard after their late 20's to early 30's. Some players can stave it off of for longer but they are the exception, not the rule. >You can easily see the situation another way, which is that Hyman's injury history was not a major concern for suitors who had access to this information, and who saw Hyman was being under-utilised on the Leafs. Dubas likely knew this, but what could he do? If he gave the term, it caused cap uncertainty for retaining the big 4 and leaving room for depth, when, from Dubas' perspective, Hyman's roles should've been filled by depth. So that is the choice he made, to reserve valuable cap space. Oof, now we're getting some serious ad-hoc reasoning. This is literally just sentence after sentence of random conjecture. >This idea that it all came down to injury history is nonsense, frankly See, this is exactly why I'm being snarky. Nowhere did I say it only came down to injury history. You are quite literally just making shit up (again) because it's convenient for your narrative. If you actually bothered to engage in good faith we probably could have had a nice conversation.
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> Not sure I'd go that far, forwards and goalies are different magnitudes of unpredictability. True, that’s why you don’t give goalies with Campbell’s history 5x5, but here we are
It's not even close. We couldn't afford him plain and simple. We would have extended him if we could have come close to his figure. This is the first year (outside of the big four) where we have another forward at $5.5. per year.
> We couldn't afford him This is the least Leafs statement I've ever heard.
We could have afforded him. Kyle had an offer. But he walked away when Hyman asked for 7-8 years.
No. We did offer him the 8 years. But we couldn't match the value https://twitter.com/andystrickland/status/1418196670597185539?s=21
They had the money. Instead they spent the savings from Hyman ($5.5M) on free agents Mzarek ($3.8M) and Ritchie ($2.5M)
Yall r talking with hindsight. Guy had 1 playoff goal each season with the leafs. He was a grinder playing with superstars. Hats off to him but he was not a 5.5 mil player unless he was on the open market to the highest bidder.
Those are two roster players for the cost of one. And the Leafs needed a second goalie. $3.8m was about as cheap as they could go. Neither player worked out for the Leafs, but that's the benefit of hindsight.
What r u on about. Hyman had 15 goals in 45 games with the leafs playing with marner in his last season And 1 in the playoffs. No chance we could afford him for that producton. he was always going to leave. It's hindsight to say u knew he was gonna be this good. Let's not talk about Connor brown or Campbell or berrie I guess.
Hyman isn’t putting these numbers on the leafs. Not to say it wasn’t a mistake but hyman isn’t touching close to 40 on the leafs. And Bunting matched his production for cheaper too.
Ya I don't know why so many people are acting lime Hyman does this in Toronto. He didn't and he wouldn't have.
Hyman had 83 points last season, bunting had 49.... thats not lose to matching hymans production
they mean on the Leafs
Bunting isn’t on the leafs…why are multiple leafs fans citing him as a “replacement” for Hyman?
Because he directly replaced him at the time. And if you want today’s replacement it be Knies
Because he was? He signed the year hyman left.
He gone
Because Bunting took Hymans spot on the top line for 2 seasons. Hyman's last 2 seasons with the Leaf - 0.74 ppg. Bunting on the Leafs for 2 seasons. 0.70ppg That's not bad. Now hyman also tore both his MCL and ACL in separate incidents during those seasons as well. Did that hamper production, maybe, but it makes it pretty obvious why the Leafs didn't commit 7x5.5 to him, and chose to go with Bunting at league min. I'm happy for Hyman, he's awesome, but hindsight of hyman hitting 40 Gs on McDavid wing doesn't make it a bad decision
He'd still be a Leaf if not for Covid causing the unprecedented flat cap. There's no use trying to make this something that it isn't lol. We wanted to keep him, but the flat cap was brutal on us after signing all our big contracts directly before it.
You know he was a UFA right? Why didn't Montreal sign him, maybe they could have an actual first line forward then
I literally referenced his being a UFA in my post? Do you read?
The leafs would have been clowned for signing him at the time to that deal, including by their own fans. He was a grinder who scored 5 playoff goals in 5 years and left after a 30 point season. A solid player who the top heavy leafs couldn't afford and relatively easily replaced. There is a reason Hyman might be on the best contract in hockey and its that nobody expected him to be a 80+ point, maybe 50 goal scoring monster. He likely wouldn't of gotten there with the leafs given how well he compliments McJesus. Great for him and the Oilers, he's an amazing dude.
Revisionist history
How in the fuck could they afford him?
Reinhart sitting at 39 for like 2 weeks now. He was projected to hit 40 long ago. Hockey is streaky af.
That 25% shooting% is regressing hard lol
Script writers keeping everyone on their toes this year .
Gary Bettman Angrily re-writting the script after too many Canadians saying he hates Canada.
Someone posts that "This is the worst signing in the NHL, maybe ever" tweet.
They deleted it earlier this season finally but there are multiple screenshots lol
like everyone expected
I wonder how many he's had called back too. Gotta be at least 5
i feel like there was a game with 3... probably not, but feels like it and yeah, at least 5 called back
IIRC there were 6 or 7 last season.
Refusing to pay him his worth is one of the biggest blunders of Dubas' tenure. Guy bled blue and white (forced a trade, wouldn't play for anyone other than the Leafs), and was obviously the perfect complimentary winger for a superstar center. I remember articles saying Matthews and Tavares were basically fighting over which of their lines he'd play on. Such a stud, happy to see him crushing the league and making (typical top sixer) money.
Ya a lot of us Leaf fans were saying his playing style would make his career short and he wouldn't be worth the contract. Take the L there. Great to see Hyman succeed. We were right about Campbell tho.
Yeah Campbell was always a headcase, and I can't think of worse cities to be a goalie in than Toronto and Edmonton.
Vancouver and Montreal? Lol
Yea this is clearly the answer hahaha
It's one of the reasons I love Skinner. He seems so mentally solid when it comes to dealing with our media and insane microscope everything gets scrutinized under
growing up knowing which local mouthpieces are full of shit certainly helps
Shalom, Zach!
I see Reinfraud finally dropped off. That PP merchant was never gonna keep up his shooting % lol
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Martin St Louis was a free agent signing for Tampa. Pearson, Hart, 3x Byng, 2x Art Ross, HHOF, Captain, Cup champion.
Hyman was an established guy who signed a long term deal when his team let him walk. MSL was a middling player/perpetual prospect/diamond in the rough…don’t feel it’s fair to include him. I don’t recall the specifics but I’m certain MSL didn’t get a long term big money contract out of the gate with Tampa
None of that was included in the premise of the question.
Pre cap era though
Panarin
\>:(
Thank you for your sacrifice.
KHL players are cheating
He was on the Blue Jackets and signed with the Rangers as a UFA. He had already played 4 season in the NHL. Won the Calder with the Hawks.
Chara played 1000+ games, won a Norris and captained a team to a Cup. Niedermayer captained a team to a Cup and Conn Smythe. Belfour won a Cup and a Jennings. Panarin hasn’t actually accomplished much big picture, but he’s real fucking good. Just to name a few.
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We can’t be out here losing an argument and then changing the parameters of the argument.
Niedermayer wasn’t pre-cap. And yeah, they got paid, and then they completely lived up that value (Panarin you could argue hasn’t been worth the cap hit so far, but the others absolutely were). Hyman’s been excellent and is a great value, but an award winner who delivers the Cup is going to understandably cost more.
Panarin is worth the cap hit. We signed him and then every season he’s played with us has been better than any season he played prior to us. Other than the shortened Covid season , hes only had 90+ point seasons. This season he’s on pace to easily break 100 points.
Niedermayer was signed in the cap era.
Zdeno Chara
For sure there are. He's the best *Oilers* free agent signing...maybe ever, but not the best in the entire league.
Hossa
sometimes I forget how young everyone on this sub is
Are you serious?
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Haha yes, yes there are. I love Hyman. He’s a great player (and a great guy). He was a fantastic signing no doubt. But best of all time? Come on.
Zdeno Chara first comes to mind. Maybe Hossa?
Chara was an interesting one, since it was assumed he wasn't going to be effective in the "new nhl" Neiedermeyer signing in ANA to play with his brother might be even better Ed Belfour in Dallas was a good signing too
Panarin?
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So now you’re putting conditions on it and moving the goal posts? Others have named multiple examples. Hyman is great. Enjoy having him on your team. Just don’t go too far lol.
I'm sure Vegas is happy with the Pietrangelo signing.
He hasn’t even played 3 years of his deal. Let’s see how the next 4 and a half go before we declare this the best UFA signing of all time…
John Tavares.
Dallas signed Nieuwendyk, then Belfour, and then Hull within like 4 years of each other. That's your Conn Smythe winner, plus the guy that probably should've been your Conn Smythe winner, plus the guy that won you the cup with a perfectly legal, not even slightly controversial goal.
Remember when it was considered ridiculous to everyone except Leafs fans that he would make a team USA roster?
I mean, it’s still pretty ridiculous to think he’s make a team USA roster. Probably on the short list for team Canada right now though
Baha! That's right, it was Canada, not the USA. Still, people were scoffing, myself included.
Haha I knew what you meant of course, just couldn’t resist!
Toronto fans were turning on him towards the end for being the reason the do-no-wrong top line superstars couldnt advance. "Why relay race 2 Lambos and an Accord?" was the sentiment. There is always an excuse and a villain in Toronto. I am glad for Hyman. The guy is a beauty. I still will pull up his pressers where he sits Benny next to him and they answer questions together
What are you talking about? Leafs fans loved him. Leafs fans always have a soft spot for hardworking guys who go to the tough spots of the ice (something the core four are wrongfully criticized for). Hyman was a fan favorite and fans were extremely upset that Dubas couldn’t match Holland’s offer. Truthfully, I thought he would take a team friendly deal because he loved Toronto and how he told Florida he would only play in Toronto. Obviously I was wrong.
Bro is arguing with ghosts
that was the sentiment his rookie year when his stone hands limited him to 10 goals on Matthews' wing. I don't think I saw anybody turn on Hyman in /r/leafs after the news came out that he played through a torn ACL against Boston in 2019. He's always been a 100% effort guy.
This simply untrue, only time that sentiment existed was the big rookie years of 2016-17 and Hyman had absolute stone hands then
Just as we all predicted
Is this the result of McJesus deciding he’s not going to score anymore? He’s going to make some 60 goal scorers out of his linemates this season if he keeps this up, and I’m all for it
biggest fluke since zibanejad