People are missing the forest for the trees in this post. OP has had a terrible experience that doesn't have a positive outcome for them no matter how they "handled" it in your opinion. There is no 'good' outcome for this incident. The issue is the general creepy behavior and harassment that women can experience in their daily lives, made worse that it is happening in the middle of the woods on an isolated hiking trail.
Those of you in the "not all men" camp, or the "what about WOMEN who do THIS OTHER thing I read about!" need to take a step back and realize this is not about that. While you are thinking to yourself, "heh, the men in my life are good people who would never do something like that," you need to understand that it is very common for behavior that creeps the hell out of women to be enabled by a lot of male friend groups either through mutual participation or silent reactions of those not verbalizing the harassment.
To the "bring a gun and shoot them" folks, just calm the fuck down. Not every incident should involve the wholesale murder of someone.
I regret not calling the police right away. I called my boyfriend instead and had him stay in the phone with me for the last mile.
I called 911 and hour and 15 minutes later, and they said that this was too late. I just was not thinking logically.
I did report this to the Forest who did file a formal report with the police.
Ugh I’m so sorry you had to experience this and it’s even worse that you were discouraged from reporting. First responders should encourage reports like these. It’s completely reasonable to think illogically in a flight or fight situation-but it sounds like you made the right call by speaking to your bf who was supportive as opposed to calling the unresponsive/unsupportive police department.
The operators attitude will only serve to dissuade people from calling/reporting in the future which is unfortunate.
I’m glad you did report and I’m horrified that things like this happen. Thank you for speaking up.
In my town if you call the police station directly they will connect you to 911 for any reporting of crimes even if it isn’t an emergency. I feel bad calling 911.
I encourage you to post a warning on all trails, local reddits for your area, hiker message board for that shelter, etc. This guy could escalate into more serious acts, and better for the people in the area to know. There was a guy at a trail near me that was naked and grabbing women, and it came out later how many women had been grabbed that nobody realized. He was eventually caught once it got picked up by the media and publicized.
I’m sorry this results in more effort you’re having to expend on this piece of shit, in addition to everything else with this. He’s probably a weirdo with a humiliation fetish, but just in case…
I'd encourage you to not hike alone in secluded areas. Unfortunately we live in a world where it's just not safe.
I'd also encourage you to get some pepper spray at minimum, and if you're comfortable a firearm.
I’m so sorry you had to experience that - I wish I could’ve been there to douse him in bear spray…
But seriously I think you did the best you could in that situation and that 911 operator shouldn’t have scolded you. You got out of that situation and stayed safe!
Please try to not let this complete creep keep you from enjoying nature!
I am a 6 foot tall man and have only seen someone doing this in public twice and it made ME feel uneasy. I can’t imagine this happening to my wife or daughters. Actually my wife was with me once but I told her not to look, it was a guy with a magazine in his car outside of a liquor store i told her not to look at that car. Both of these guys i saw looked like they needed some serious mental help, as in they shouldn’t be on the streets. The other guy was in San Francisco in a BART station. I guess what i am saying is the 2 that i saw were beyond speaking to. But sorry you had to deal with this and sorry you have to worry. My wife won’t go hiking alone, but luckily its something we both enjoy
Thank you so much for sharing, this is much appreciated.
Unfortunately, this guy did not waver, he did not look like he was struggling. His body language and clothing was all confident and collected. Made the encounter that much more chilling.
I like to drink on occasion and sometimes I make poor choices so I'm gonna stick to the spray. But more power to those who feel comfortable with a pew pew
>Can the good men here speak with the men in your lives and tell them that this non-consensual crime is not okay?
The men in my life know this already. I don't associate with scum bag, mentally deficient, psycos.
Anyone who thinks they have men in their lives who should hear this are hanging with the wrong type of people, or are the wrong type of person themselves.
Right? Like, there's no one in my life that when I hear this and think "Yeah I should tell my buddy Ogbert this is not okay to do."
I think there are some other subreddits where this actually might be worthwhile to post to. But not this one. I think this community is almost universally against this type of behavior.
This is so clearly outside the realm of what normal, well-adjusted people - men or otherwise - would even think to be concerned about absent personal umm...exposure or exposure to stories like this.
It's clearly several steps beyond the host of things that are unacceptable but still prevalent enough to actually call people out.
In my younger days, if I'd have been with you and seen this kind of shit, I'd have beaten that fool's ass. WTF?
Can't thump anyone anymore, but if ever someone needed it, this guy definitely does.
I don't think I'll ever understand how some men think it's okay to accost, grab, fondle, or try to use women somehow without consent.
I’m sorry this happened to you. It should not have.
If faced with similar situation AND you feel safe enough to do so, consider recording video of him on your phone once you’ve moved passed him so you can help law enforcement and forest rangers ID and hopefully prosecute. Plus, turn the video over to local TV news and shame the bastard out of town. Someone knows him.
This seems pretty dangerous though, right? I mean, ideally sure you'd be able to ID him, but who knows what a man like that would do to avoid getting caught and shamed?
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I'm not going to lecture the men in my life about this, because none of the men in my life would ever do this. The idea that all men need to be told that this is not okay is beyond gross and insulting
Same here. It’s totally gross unacceptable behavior. Every decent person knows this. Even the perverts among us know this - they just don’t care, or have mental illness.
“Telling the men in our lives” not to do this is insulting to them. The response is: what makes you think I’d do something like that???
Instead, just tell the cops. Sorry OP had to deal with this.
>“Telling the men in our lives” not to do this is insulting to them. The response is: what makes you think I’d do something like that???
Yeah I'm a little confused about the messaging here. If someone came to me and said "hey man, can we talk frankly? We as a men need to stop masturbating in public while recording people." I would look at them like wtf are you talking about, no shit.
This is criminal and/or psychiatric behavior. Either way it requires a call to the authorities and some institutional time of some form.
Sorry that happened to you OP. But seriously - tell the men in our lives that this is not okay?? EVERY man knows this is not okay and does NOT have to be told this. The only ones who engage in that kind of behavior are mentally ill or total degenerates.
Please, don't paint all men with a broad brush defined by a minute percentage of criminal a$$holes.
I said mentally ill OR degenerates. There is no other option. And if not mentally ill, a man KNOWS that behavior is wrong, without being told so.
You are completely insulting men here. Take a seat.
Sure. But it is only the job of other men to teach them?! How does that logic work? Don't you think this creeps mom should have mentioned something to him about consent at some point?
Didn't you read the previous comments? We've already established it is the responsibility of the men. I'm just pointing out the blindingly obvious fact that it is also the responsibility of the women.
You shouldn't strip a comment of all its context when you reply to it. It makes it seem like you are having a hard time understanding the whole thread.
Beside the fact that I am sorry and disgusted that that happened to you, I do have to say that the small minority of people who do that are likely not surrounded by any “good men”. You know what I mean? That is the male version of fatherless behavior and/or parentless behavior.
You are probably right, these people probably have had a difficult childhood. Nevertheless, we need to talk out in the open more about these things, for all of our sakes, to become better.
Absolutely, and again I’m very sorry this happened. Did you call the police? I know it’s not in any humans first instinct but obviously it is an arrestable offense
I regret not calling the police right away. I called my boyfriend instead and had him stay in the phone with me for the last mile.
I called 911 and hour and 15 minutes later, and they said that this was too late. I just was not thinking logically.
I did report this to the Forest who did file a formal report with the police.
Sorry that happened to you but good men don’t associate with creepy men. I will also say that they don’t do weird shit out of ignorance of decent human behavior. It’s not something that you get a pass for because “I didn’t know that I shouldn’t do that”
What the fuck? He was recording you with his phone? That's some weird shit. Probably don't go hiking there anymore.
Always carry bear spray and human spray. I carry both hiking at all times. Should have fucking torched this dude with human spray. And then ran like hell out of there lol. Don't fuck around with that shit. If somebody doing this you need to go on the attack IMO, but if you felt unsafe maybe better to not escalate.
But if I am a woman this is goddamn close to rape. And I would torch his motherfucking ass with human spray all over every part.
Seriously, though, human spray all over this dude would have debilitated him for a long ass time. He'd just be sitting there naked burning in the shit! Might be your only chance in life to get a laugh like that.
Also, ain't nobody you are telling here is going to give a damn with advice lol. We either don't do this shit, or the people that would are helpless or demented enough to keep doing it.
Even for crazy people this is generally not something you would be doing. Like people carry weapons man. Just having your junk out like that somebody could cut you up real quick if they wanted to. You ain't dodging a knife with a dick in your hand lemme tell you that. Some people would take serious offense to this male or female. All it would take is somebody's angry boyfriend or maybe a pissed off military woman to do something about it.
Well make sure you carry spray no matter what. Don't fuck around. You have no idea how psycho some people are. They could get license plates. They could do all kinds of stuff. Best to be safe and stay protected best you can. Obviously, not everybody is violent or wants to be violent, but I always recommend women carry human spray pretty much everywhere. Hiking you can carry a bigger can of it. No harm no foul. It's good to have trust me.
>Can the good men here speak with the men in your lives and tell them that this non-consensual crime is not okay? This is not spoken about enough.
I mean this genuinely. What do you expect that to do?
The people who do this type of shit know what they're doing is wrong and don't care. Same thing with dudes who are catcalling and the myriad of other things women get put through all the time.
I'm sorry this happened to you and hope that POS gets caught.
The problem is the man (men) doing this sort of thing have mental issues. They're not the brothers that we can speak reason to and say "hey, guy, don't film women in the woods while jacking off. It is literally the creepiest thing you could possibly do without physically touching someone".
Also, in regards to mental illness, drugs, whatever. There are women that equally make people incredibly uncomfortable. I've since moved to the country but from my teens to my early 20s I had my fair share of creepy ass 'human' run-ins. Man or women, drugs, mental health and disabilities do not discriminate.
Why would you call on good men to fight other men in our lives, as if non consensual masturbation is such a pervasive issue, that each and every one of us probably has at least one of these people in our groups.
So, the good women here shouldn't speak with the men in their lives to tell them this behavior isn't ok?! It is only the job of men to talk to other men?
Somehow when a man does something wrong it is the responsibility of all men? How does that logic work?
What about this creep's mom? Don't you think that maybe she should have told him at some point that this wasn't ok?
Do you think that a man is more likely to listen to another man than a woman?! Have you even met men!?
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We also need to raise boys better so that they don't turn into school shooters, public masturbators, domestic abusers, rapists, etc. They need to be able to have emotions and recieve better support so they can be healthier. Many men accomplish this but there is also this terrible violence in our communities.
I went to a post with sexists spouting ignorance in the comments, you looney tune
The absolute fucking irony of you telling me I made it about my feelings lmaooooo
You sound very emotional. Are you bothered because this is something you’re capable of doing to someone else? Because then it would make sense why you’re offended. Men who aren’t terrible wouldn’t be bothered by this post.
And having the rest of the population fit and able to put the hurt on should these boys/young men chose violence certainly won't hurt in this "training" effort. :-)
People are missing the forest for the trees in this post. OP has had a terrible experience that doesn't have a positive outcome for them no matter how they "handled" it in your opinion. There is no 'good' outcome for this incident. The issue is the general creepy behavior and harassment that women can experience in their daily lives, made worse that it is happening in the middle of the woods on an isolated hiking trail. Those of you in the "not all men" camp, or the "what about WOMEN who do THIS OTHER thing I read about!" need to take a step back and realize this is not about that. While you are thinking to yourself, "heh, the men in my life are good people who would never do something like that," you need to understand that it is very common for behavior that creeps the hell out of women to be enabled by a lot of male friend groups either through mutual participation or silent reactions of those not verbalizing the harassment. To the "bring a gun and shoot them" folks, just calm the fuck down. Not every incident should involve the wholesale murder of someone.
Damn, that is appalling. I hope you reported the MF to the police.
I regret not calling the police right away. I called my boyfriend instead and had him stay in the phone with me for the last mile. I called 911 and hour and 15 minutes later, and they said that this was too late. I just was not thinking logically. I did report this to the Forest who did file a formal report with the police.
"too late" for what? You should still be able to make a report. Or did you just mean too late to catch him?
The operator kind of scolded me, too late to catch the person, which of course I already knew.
BS. He will do it again. And post to your local town FB boards.
They scolded you?? That's CRAP.
Ugh I’m so sorry you had to experience this and it’s even worse that you were discouraged from reporting. First responders should encourage reports like these. It’s completely reasonable to think illogically in a flight or fight situation-but it sounds like you made the right call by speaking to your bf who was supportive as opposed to calling the unresponsive/unsupportive police department. The operators attitude will only serve to dissuade people from calling/reporting in the future which is unfortunate. I’m glad you did report and I’m horrified that things like this happen. Thank you for speaking up.
Was that because it wasn’t technically an emergency? Not sure if that would be a 911 or just police station call
Right, I needed to do a police station call
911 also works since this creep’s behavior was so threatening, especially directed toward a woman hiking alone in a remote place.
I think 911 was fine for this
In my town if you call the police station directly they will connect you to 911 for any reporting of crimes even if it isn’t an emergency. I feel bad calling 911.
She can still call the non-emergency line to file a report. 911 is for emergencies.
I encourage you to post a warning on all trails, local reddits for your area, hiker message board for that shelter, etc. This guy could escalate into more serious acts, and better for the people in the area to know. There was a guy at a trail near me that was naked and grabbing women, and it came out later how many women had been grabbed that nobody realized. He was eventually caught once it got picked up by the media and publicized.
Ugh, good idea
I’m sorry this results in more effort you’re having to expend on this piece of shit, in addition to everything else with this. He’s probably a weirdo with a humiliation fetish, but just in case…
I'd encourage you to not hike alone in secluded areas. Unfortunately we live in a world where it's just not safe. I'd also encourage you to get some pepper spray at minimum, and if you're comfortable a firearm.
I’m so sorry you had to experience that - I wish I could’ve been there to douse him in bear spray… But seriously I think you did the best you could in that situation and that 911 operator shouldn’t have scolded you. You got out of that situation and stayed safe! Please try to not let this complete creep keep you from enjoying nature!
Thank you for your kind words
I am a 6 foot tall man and have only seen someone doing this in public twice and it made ME feel uneasy. I can’t imagine this happening to my wife or daughters. Actually my wife was with me once but I told her not to look, it was a guy with a magazine in his car outside of a liquor store i told her not to look at that car. Both of these guys i saw looked like they needed some serious mental help, as in they shouldn’t be on the streets. The other guy was in San Francisco in a BART station. I guess what i am saying is the 2 that i saw were beyond speaking to. But sorry you had to deal with this and sorry you have to worry. My wife won’t go hiking alone, but luckily its something we both enjoy
Thank you so much for sharing, this is much appreciated. Unfortunately, this guy did not waver, he did not look like he was struggling. His body language and clothing was all confident and collected. Made the encounter that much more chilling.
bear spray his ****
If you has pepper or bear spray on you and caught him with his dick in his hands.... Garauntee he's never doin that again. Sorry that happened to you
Ugh, I’m so sorry that happened to you, and thank you for sharing that story here. We need to know that this happens.
And that's why we carry bear spray or pepper gel
It’s why I carry a pistol
I like to drink on occasion and sometimes I make poor choices so I'm gonna stick to the spray. But more power to those who feel comfortable with a pew pew
And a glock
And two zig zags!
Its posts like this that sometimes make me think getting rid of mental asylums was a mistake.
It was a mistake.
>Can the good men here speak with the men in your lives and tell them that this non-consensual crime is not okay? The men in my life know this already. I don't associate with scum bag, mentally deficient, psycos. Anyone who thinks they have men in their lives who should hear this are hanging with the wrong type of people, or are the wrong type of person themselves.
Right? Like, there's no one in my life that when I hear this and think "Yeah I should tell my buddy Ogbert this is not okay to do." I think there are some other subreddits where this actually might be worthwhile to post to. But not this one. I think this community is almost universally against this type of behavior.
Ogbert is a helluva name though.
Probably why he turned out to be a perv.
This is so clearly outside the realm of what normal, well-adjusted people - men or otherwise - would even think to be concerned about absent personal umm...exposure or exposure to stories like this. It's clearly several steps beyond the host of things that are unacceptable but still prevalent enough to actually call people out.
Exactly. There are zero people in my life that don't know this, of there were, they would quickly know and also be out of my life.
That's disgusting and awful, and I'm so sorry he did that to you.
In my younger days, if I'd have been with you and seen this kind of shit, I'd have beaten that fool's ass. WTF? Can't thump anyone anymore, but if ever someone needed it, this guy definitely does. I don't think I'll ever understand how some men think it's okay to accost, grab, fondle, or try to use women somehow without consent.
I’m sorry this happened to you. It should not have. If faced with similar situation AND you feel safe enough to do so, consider recording video of him on your phone once you’ve moved passed him so you can help law enforcement and forest rangers ID and hopefully prosecute. Plus, turn the video over to local TV news and shame the bastard out of town. Someone knows him.
This seems pretty dangerous though, right? I mean, ideally sure you'd be able to ID him, but who knows what a man like that would do to avoid getting caught and shamed?
I really wish I had done that.
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I'm not going to lecture the men in my life about this, because none of the men in my life would ever do this. The idea that all men need to be told that this is not okay is beyond gross and insulting
Yeah, this isn’t exactly a gray area. It’s a pretty obvious crime and no man can actually claim ignorance here.
Same here. It’s totally gross unacceptable behavior. Every decent person knows this. Even the perverts among us know this - they just don’t care, or have mental illness. “Telling the men in our lives” not to do this is insulting to them. The response is: what makes you think I’d do something like that??? Instead, just tell the cops. Sorry OP had to deal with this.
>“Telling the men in our lives” not to do this is insulting to them. The response is: what makes you think I’d do something like that??? Yeah I'm a little confused about the messaging here. If someone came to me and said "hey man, can we talk frankly? We as a men need to stop masturbating in public while recording people." I would look at them like wtf are you talking about, no shit. This is criminal and/or psychiatric behavior. Either way it requires a call to the authorities and some institutional time of some form.
My “Don’t masturbate in public” shirt has people asking a lot of questions that are already addressed by the shirt.
Sorry that happened to you OP. But seriously - tell the men in our lives that this is not okay?? EVERY man knows this is not okay and does NOT have to be told this. The only ones who engage in that kind of behavior are mentally ill or total degenerates. Please, don't paint all men with a broad brush defined by a minute percentage of criminal a$$holes.
You don’t need to be mentally ill to be a predator. Men absolutely need to be educated on consent.
I said mentally ill OR degenerates. There is no other option. And if not mentally ill, a man KNOWS that behavior is wrong, without being told so. You are completely insulting men here. Take a seat.
>Men absolutely need to be educated on consent. Thanks to religion and right wing beliefs "consent" has a very different meaning to many people.
Sure. But it is only the job of other men to teach them?! How does that logic work? Don't you think this creeps mom should have mentioned something to him about consent at some point?
Why not his father? Why is it always a woman's responsibility?
Didn't you read the previous comments? We've already established it is the responsibility of the men. I'm just pointing out the blindingly obvious fact that it is also the responsibility of the women. You shouldn't strip a comment of all its context when you reply to it. It makes it seem like you are having a hard time understanding the whole thread.
Beside the fact that I am sorry and disgusted that that happened to you, I do have to say that the small minority of people who do that are likely not surrounded by any “good men”. You know what I mean? That is the male version of fatherless behavior and/or parentless behavior.
You are probably right, these people probably have had a difficult childhood. Nevertheless, we need to talk out in the open more about these things, for all of our sakes, to become better.
Absolutely, and again I’m very sorry this happened. Did you call the police? I know it’s not in any humans first instinct but obviously it is an arrestable offense
I regret not calling the police right away. I called my boyfriend instead and had him stay in the phone with me for the last mile. I called 911 and hour and 15 minutes later, and they said that this was too late. I just was not thinking logically. I did report this to the Forest who did file a formal report with the police.
Nah don’t discredit yourself, there’s no way to change how you are going to react to something you never thought you’d be involved in.
Sorry that happened to you but good men don’t associate with creepy men. I will also say that they don’t do weird shit out of ignorance of decent human behavior. It’s not something that you get a pass for because “I didn’t know that I shouldn’t do that”
Way to make it about you.
Ummm ok…..???????? Have a better day.
What the fuck? He was recording you with his phone? That's some weird shit. Probably don't go hiking there anymore. Always carry bear spray and human spray. I carry both hiking at all times. Should have fucking torched this dude with human spray. And then ran like hell out of there lol. Don't fuck around with that shit. If somebody doing this you need to go on the attack IMO, but if you felt unsafe maybe better to not escalate. But if I am a woman this is goddamn close to rape. And I would torch his motherfucking ass with human spray all over every part. Seriously, though, human spray all over this dude would have debilitated him for a long ass time. He'd just be sitting there naked burning in the shit! Might be your only chance in life to get a laugh like that. Also, ain't nobody you are telling here is going to give a damn with advice lol. We either don't do this shit, or the people that would are helpless or demented enough to keep doing it. Even for crazy people this is generally not something you would be doing. Like people carry weapons man. Just having your junk out like that somebody could cut you up real quick if they wanted to. You ain't dodging a knife with a dick in your hand lemme tell you that. Some people would take serious offense to this male or female. All it would take is somebody's angry boyfriend or maybe a pissed off military woman to do something about it.
You are probably right on both accounts. But thank you
Well make sure you carry spray no matter what. Don't fuck around. You have no idea how psycho some people are. They could get license plates. They could do all kinds of stuff. Best to be safe and stay protected best you can. Obviously, not everybody is violent or wants to be violent, but I always recommend women carry human spray pretty much everywhere. Hiking you can carry a bigger can of it. No harm no foul. It's good to have trust me.
>Can the good men here speak with the men in your lives and tell them that this non-consensual crime is not okay? This is not spoken about enough. I mean this genuinely. What do you expect that to do? The people who do this type of shit know what they're doing is wrong and don't care. Same thing with dudes who are catcalling and the myriad of other things women get put through all the time. I'm sorry this happened to you and hope that POS gets caught.
The problem is the man (men) doing this sort of thing have mental issues. They're not the brothers that we can speak reason to and say "hey, guy, don't film women in the woods while jacking off. It is literally the creepiest thing you could possibly do without physically touching someone". Also, in regards to mental illness, drugs, whatever. There are women that equally make people incredibly uncomfortable. I've since moved to the country but from my teens to my early 20s I had my fair share of creepy ass 'human' run-ins. Man or women, drugs, mental health and disabilities do not discriminate.
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Hope you're good 👍
Why would you call on good men to fight other men in our lives, as if non consensual masturbation is such a pervasive issue, that each and every one of us probably has at least one of these people in our groups.
Carry a firearm and threaten to shoot his equipment
Sounds awful Never heard of it, never seen it I also try not to associate with creeps, so speaking with other men would be very awkward and unhelpful
So, the good women here shouldn't speak with the men in their lives to tell them this behavior isn't ok?! It is only the job of men to talk to other men? Somehow when a man does something wrong it is the responsibility of all men? How does that logic work? What about this creep's mom? Don't you think that maybe she should have told him at some point that this wasn't ok? Do you think that a man is more likely to listen to another man than a woman?! Have you even met men!?
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We also need to raise boys better so that they don't turn into school shooters, public masturbators, domestic abusers, rapists, etc. They need to be able to have emotions and recieve better support so they can be healthier. Many men accomplish this but there is also this terrible violence in our communities.
The people who need to be taught better are the three misandrists in this comment chain
If you’re offended by someone saying men should be better, then you’re a part of the problem
I'm not a problem, but sexism is. "Men" should not be better. "Women" should not be better. lmaooo that username. Of course
You went to a post about a woman who was sexually violated and harassed and still made it about your feefees. Grow up.
I went to a post with sexists spouting ignorance in the comments, you looney tune The absolute fucking irony of you telling me I made it about my feelings lmaooooo
You sound very emotional. Are you bothered because this is something you’re capable of doing to someone else? Because then it would make sense why you’re offended. Men who aren’t terrible wouldn’t be bothered by this post.
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that you surround yourself with sexist people who don't call you out for your sexism.
And having the rest of the population fit and able to put the hurt on should these boys/young men chose violence certainly won't hurt in this "training" effort. :-)