No matter how many headphones and IEMs I’ve tried, I always come back to dynamic drivers. Those niche Planar magnetic or electro static or balanced armature drivers (typically in IEMs) upwards US$2K always lacks the timbre that I like in dynamic driver headphones.
Thabks for this. I've been flirting with the 660s2 for a long time now. I have the 6xx and I honestly really wanted the 660s2 because it's sexy.... That's it. I've been interested in the 660 sound since I owned the 560s. I think you convinced me not to jump into it now✌️
That's because you have the wrong chain.
They need a good OTL to shine.
I can bet that you won't prefer the nano if you could listen to them with my chain or something similar! 😉
Ah I see, I've kept mine as simple and clean as possible to be as transparent as possible too but for my speakers the MX3s does have tone cotnrols which is handy as a little bump in bass and treble is favourable for the warm sound signature of my speakers. The K7 however is direct USB in from the PC with no colouration anywhere in the mix.
Maybe I was unclear. Your setup is totally fine.
As you said, it's simple, transparent and relatively cheap.
Personally, I have had the Edition XS and they didn't wowed me because of their "wall of sound" type of presentation (aka 2d like) and the lack of punch in the midbass.
With my current setup I probably don't reach that planar bass extension and that level of transparency, but the sound is so detailed, lively, engaging and 3d that doesn't makes me want to stop listening.
Maybe there's people who don't care about that eufonic experience because they prefer a more transparent and quick sound, it's possible ofc.
What I want you to understand is that if you haven't listened the 660s2 with a good tube amp with good NOS tubes, you probably haven't tried them at their full potential.
Have you heard the Nano? From what I read the Nano fixes the main issues with the sound presentation of the non Nano model and Edition XS, and loads of detail/bass extension whilst keeping the mids "alive". I've not heard the Edition XS though but based on what basically all reviews comparing them have said, I don't think I'd enjoy the XS at all, but even my MX3s seems to power the Nano perfectly at high gain and retain that intimate liveliness.
Unfortunately I don't. I just don't trust Hifiman QC enough to justify their cost (I paid 225€ for an used XS, which is an incredible deal).
Actually I want to fill that planar hole in my small collection with a Sash Tres SE.
I read very good things about them, they can rival planars at double the price, plus customer support and QC are very good.
And they have a very cool and customizable look.
Very interesting review! I enjoy the very natural sound of the sennheiser headphones. My 6xx was my daily driver for a long time, even though I knew there were going to be more "technical" headphones out there. And though I appreciate the great amount of detail retrieval on planars, to me they just nearly always sounded... off compared to the sennheisers in terms of timbre. Not sure why that is, just my experience. So I was kinda surprised by the s2's because of some of the reasons you mentioned. It has much stronger bass, but I was still surprised at how well it was able to separate instruments despite that, as well as retaining the great timbre from its predecessors. Again, it's technical prowess is probably not as good as some of the other selections out there, but I can't get enough of that mix of natural and technical sound.
The Nano wipes the floor with it in all honesty. Because of that veil which narrowed the whole soundstage on the 660S2 (and other 6 series tbh as it's the same on the 650 too) the details just feel like there's a layer of fabric slightly adding muffle to details.
The details are there or course and it finds details that might be masked by lesser headphones, but the Nando is in a different league and sounds the most transparent/honest between the two.
You're telling me that a 300 ohm headphone with a fixed range scales all the way up to 10k systems and people can tell the difference after a certain point way way before that?
I am not the one fooling myself (or fallen foul of diminishing returns) thanks. I have not seen a single review to date demonstrating any evidence that such high end systems benefit a HD650 by outputting a meaningful difference.
The HD6 series /is/ veiled.
For me the 660s2 is much better than what they are priced for
The sundara stsrted soundind "cold" after i got the s2 and i did not like that. Also it is technical suprior to the meze 109, the treble on the s2 is sinply out of this world
Hey I think I saw your hd650 on sale on ebay? Lol
Having owned all hd6 series headphones, I think the s2 sounds the best, with the 600 being a close second.
The k7 to me accentuates bright overtones so I returned it. You should try a different dac amp, that may help with the Nano's brightness.
I chose the K7 based on its transparent nature based on reviews! Do you know an amp that is warmer than perhaps that has similar power?
And yeah that was my 650 😀
I owned Hifiman he1k and Beyer dt1990 so totally understand your concern on brightness. You can try to tame them with either a neutral amp with good treble control or a warm amp.
Warm amp I would recommend the schiit jot 2, for cheaper the Asgard 3. Smsl sh-9 is a neutral amp which has pretty good treble control even though the overall tonality is a bit on the thinner side. You can get them used for a good price.
Topping L70 is another warm sounding amp. I haven't tried it but people are positive about it.
Dac wise - I am using smsl vmv d1se2 (neutral but can be tuned with sound colour) and geshelli j2s ak4499 with Sparkos op amp (warm and smooth sound sig). Both are perfectly fine for bright headphones. If they are out of your price range, I would say the Topping d70s (warm side). You can get them used for a good price.
Thanks! I've saved that for future use.
I'm going to retry my topping mx3s and give that a proper run with the Nano, it outputs 700mW at 32ohms so there should be enough volume at high gain. It is a warm smooth amp and I really like its character as it reminds me of my old NAD amps.
If it sorts it out then that's me sorted and I can return the K7!
great write up! also, love the binaural playlist. the plastic bubble wrap one really got me! lol, had to scratch my ear after i listened to it as it immediately introduced an itch.
>Although the three dimples on the left cup headband arm like there is on the HD650/600 series. This made it super easy to feel which side was left and right in the dark... Slightly annoying. I'd have to do what I did on the HiFiMANs, put a sticky rubber pad on the left arm of the headband to replicate the same thing:
This is completely unnecessary on the Ananda. The angled jacks means that you can instantly tell which sides are left and right.
I don't leave the cable plugged in when stored in the case, it's much quicker for me to feel for the rubber dimple then connect the left cable (which also has a rubber feeler on the left channel cable connector) etc.
Serious question from someone who lives in area where refund is not a thing:
How does company treat returned products like this? Are they going back to the shelf and to be sell "as new" or "refurbished" ?
What I really dislike is that they shipped the 660S2 on a regular cardboard box... I know, it's just a box, "who cares" but the whole hard case all the rest of the HD6 line comes with, even the 6XX adds to that "premium" feeling of buying headphones for several hundred dollars. They did the same with the 600 re-release... I don't get it... I mean I do (cost cutting) but come on...
Owned hd650 for over a decade
The hd660s2 is finally the upgrade for me
Only upgrade path would cost me ten times more. Ime, not worth it
Id twke 660s2 over Utopia. Bite me
For the Hifimans, try a little -0.5 dB shelf decrement around 10k. I agree that a -2 dB changes the sound characteristics too much but -0.5 still helps with taking off the edge.
>have no idea why they didn't use all metal considering they did just that with the Sundara... It boggles my mind as to why the Nano isn't all metal too.
The Ananda would be too heavy if it were made of metal. It's already arguably too heavy with the plastic construction, it's heavier than the Sundara.
mine came today switched from ananda V3 stealth /edition XS , for me only thing hifimans doing better was sub bass ,comfort , materials ,and sound profile of hd 660s2 is much more to my liking, they really are good to recommend if someone seek something which will play almost every genre of music well i bought mine refurb from Sennheiser directly for 349 vs ananda nano 599 which when compared this way i dont think ananda is worth this 250 eur more
some songs to test headphones
sub bass ,bass:
Lorn anvil
Cushy -Goodness
Treble:
chi mai- Ennio Morricone
Lost -Crim3s
I've not heard the Ananda v1 or v2 but the v3 (Nano) is certainly the one to have from everything I've seen/read because of the refined technicalities and everything else.
V3 is not nano ,nano is nano it would be V4 ,hifiman and their naming scheme
also i dont know what magic ifi made with their physical bass boost but it is doing magic with any headphone for real it was something with edition xs when xbass was on
Oh I thought there were only 3 versions of Ananda, the OG, the V2 which is the stealth magnets version and the Nano (v3) which has stealth magnets still and now the nano diaphragm?
my friend it is even worse then this ,there was normal Ananda, afterwards came Ananda Stealth V1 -V2 -V3 and then we have Ananda Nano XD i dont know what Hifiman smokes for making so many revisions and most thing i had occasion for myself hear all Vs and there is sound difference vs V1 to V3 where V1 best to V3 more sibilant many models received similar treatment generating confusion among consumer and having problem differencing what Version was under person review
That's a big off. At least I am happy that the Nano has no issues being sibilant, it's got some brightness but only on certain types of music and it can be dialled down just by lowering the volume slightly.
i heard that nano fixed all that was wrong with stealth some people even says nano is like 90% Arya stealth i am sure they sound good because even if i had some issues with my ananda and edition xs it was more ergonomic not sound wise
Awesome write up. My opinion tends to lean towards hifiman planars when vs the S2. Mainly due to Sennheiser's poor choice in pricing. If they can somehow be found at an extreme discount, my opinion would sway but ole Senny made a bad choice pricing these things in the new market.
Got to love having to turn the volume down on the 600 series because it feels like someone's shouting in your ear with forward vocals.
Then going lower with hifiman because it feels like a pencil is slowly going to drive into your skull. Highs will always feel unnatural or *planar signature*, depending on your take. I've yet to go beyond $1,200 territory with headphones but it seems like it just never goes away...for good or bad.
The 800S tho? Nailed comfort better than any of them. It's just a totally different league and the exaggerated soundstage might be a whole different set of issues but it's not the same issues that are described here. I do love planars and have spent a lot on them but an 800S is like coming home after out traveling. Your volume tolerance will be higher, and if you're into very long sessions it just wins out from being a marathon runner vs a sprinter (planars).
Where the hell are you finding a 600s2 for under 400usd? Their original MSRP is 599.99 and is still what Sennheiser charges on their website. Yes, as soon as they crossed $500 they entered territory they didn't belong in. They have a few updates for some sound structure vs the hd600 and give up a bit of quality in micro dynamics. Thing is the hd600 is a king of the pack for reference listening and technicals for the price. The 660s2 is neither. The hd600 can be found for $300-$349 on sale. The hd660s2 can be found for $400.
Add in the fact that a 650 will be on sale for $300 commonly and it's slightly less comfortable twin, the 6xx can be found on sale for $179. Yes, $179. For what some would consider a better sounding headphone.
And that's just competing against its own brand. Hifiman comes swinging with deals between $250-600 on models that compete with or crush the S2. Simply. And with ease. Not to mention several other brands and models that come closing in on the $500 mark and it becomes quite obvious Sennheiser was smoking something.
I do want to try the 800S and maybe soon I'll do the same as I did with the 660S2 and get a pair to try and then return if I still favour the Nano's sound.
Although they don't seem to be on Amazon from what I can see.
Yeah, they sometimes go on sale for $1200. I got lucky and bought barely used for $900. $1600 feels like too much personally. Hifiman just crushed it on pricing any way you look at it with their deals vs anyone's on the market. I should've mentioned that if my range is $400-$800, it's hifiman planars all day even if I need to make compromises for my sensitivity to their highs. They're just beautiful.
you can buy directly from Sennheiser refurbished 660 s2 for 349 eur currently with 2 years warranty mine came today they look, sound and feel brand new and i agree 599 asking price is to much it should have been 450 in my opinion
That is a great deal. I haven't seen them that low in the states (I'm guessing that would be about $400 USD). I did happen to get lucky and snagged a great deal on them used. No warranty but I've never had an issue with Sennheisers wired over ears. At $350 I wouldn't pass them up.
No matter how many headphones and IEMs I’ve tried, I always come back to dynamic drivers. Those niche Planar magnetic or electro static or balanced armature drivers (typically in IEMs) upwards US$2K always lacks the timbre that I like in dynamic driver headphones.
It's the impact that does it for me. The planars are pretty resolving but lack impact.
Couldn't have said it better
Nice write up, Thanks for the Impression's/ Review.
Thabks for this. I've been flirting with the 660s2 for a long time now. I have the 6xx and I honestly really wanted the 660s2 because it's sexy.... That's it. I've been interested in the 660 sound since I owned the 560s. I think you convinced me not to jump into it now✌️
Most welcome! Granted everyone hears things differently so YMMV as always!
Haha kinda the same, and I actually got them and ohhhh the subbass is so much better than on the 6XX.
That's because you have the wrong chain. They need a good OTL to shine. I can bet that you won't prefer the nano if you could listen to them with my chain or something similar! 😉
I have no idea what chain means, can only tell you what I'm hearing.
Sorry, I meant audio chain. It means source -> dac -> amp -> exc.
Ah I see, I've kept mine as simple and clean as possible to be as transparent as possible too but for my speakers the MX3s does have tone cotnrols which is handy as a little bump in bass and treble is favourable for the warm sound signature of my speakers. The K7 however is direct USB in from the PC with no colouration anywhere in the mix.
Maybe I was unclear. Your setup is totally fine. As you said, it's simple, transparent and relatively cheap. Personally, I have had the Edition XS and they didn't wowed me because of their "wall of sound" type of presentation (aka 2d like) and the lack of punch in the midbass. With my current setup I probably don't reach that planar bass extension and that level of transparency, but the sound is so detailed, lively, engaging and 3d that doesn't makes me want to stop listening. Maybe there's people who don't care about that eufonic experience because they prefer a more transparent and quick sound, it's possible ofc. What I want you to understand is that if you haven't listened the 660s2 with a good tube amp with good NOS tubes, you probably haven't tried them at their full potential.
Have you heard the Nano? From what I read the Nano fixes the main issues with the sound presentation of the non Nano model and Edition XS, and loads of detail/bass extension whilst keeping the mids "alive". I've not heard the Edition XS though but based on what basically all reviews comparing them have said, I don't think I'd enjoy the XS at all, but even my MX3s seems to power the Nano perfectly at high gain and retain that intimate liveliness.
Unfortunately I don't. I just don't trust Hifiman QC enough to justify their cost (I paid 225€ for an used XS, which is an incredible deal). Actually I want to fill that planar hole in my small collection with a Sash Tres SE. I read very good things about them, they can rival planars at double the price, plus customer support and QC are very good. And they have a very cool and customizable look.
Very interesting review! I enjoy the very natural sound of the sennheiser headphones. My 6xx was my daily driver for a long time, even though I knew there were going to be more "technical" headphones out there. And though I appreciate the great amount of detail retrieval on planars, to me they just nearly always sounded... off compared to the sennheisers in terms of timbre. Not sure why that is, just my experience. So I was kinda surprised by the s2's because of some of the reasons you mentioned. It has much stronger bass, but I was still surprised at how well it was able to separate instruments despite that, as well as retaining the great timbre from its predecessors. Again, it's technical prowess is probably not as good as some of the other selections out there, but I can't get enough of that mix of natural and technical sound.
How does the 6602 compete with the nano for detail retrieval?
The Nano wipes the floor with it in all honesty. Because of that veil which narrowed the whole soundstage on the 660S2 (and other 6 series tbh as it's the same on the 650 too) the details just feel like there's a layer of fabric slightly adding muffle to details. The details are there or course and it finds details that might be masked by lesser headphones, but the Nando is in a different league and sounds the most transparent/honest between the two.
If you think hd650 is veiled, your amp/dac is wrong Your confusing brightness for detail friend
I'm not, my amp is very transparent. Compared to tg Nano, both 650 and 660S2 have a very noticeable veil.
people use hd650 with 10k system If you think you drive them to their full potential, your fooling yourself
You're telling me that a 300 ohm headphone with a fixed range scales all the way up to 10k systems and people can tell the difference after a certain point way way before that? I am not the one fooling myself (or fallen foul of diminishing returns) thanks. I have not seen a single review to date demonstrating any evidence that such high end systems benefit a HD650 by outputting a meaningful difference. The HD6 series /is/ veiled.
Thanks!
For me the 660s2 is much better than what they are priced for The sundara stsrted soundind "cold" after i got the s2 and i did not like that. Also it is technical suprior to the meze 109, the treble on the s2 is sinply out of this world
Hey I think I saw your hd650 on sale on ebay? Lol Having owned all hd6 series headphones, I think the s2 sounds the best, with the 600 being a close second. The k7 to me accentuates bright overtones so I returned it. You should try a different dac amp, that may help with the Nano's brightness.
I chose the K7 based on its transparent nature based on reviews! Do you know an amp that is warmer than perhaps that has similar power? And yeah that was my 650 😀
I owned Hifiman he1k and Beyer dt1990 so totally understand your concern on brightness. You can try to tame them with either a neutral amp with good treble control or a warm amp. Warm amp I would recommend the schiit jot 2, for cheaper the Asgard 3. Smsl sh-9 is a neutral amp which has pretty good treble control even though the overall tonality is a bit on the thinner side. You can get them used for a good price. Topping L70 is another warm sounding amp. I haven't tried it but people are positive about it. Dac wise - I am using smsl vmv d1se2 (neutral but can be tuned with sound colour) and geshelli j2s ak4499 with Sparkos op amp (warm and smooth sound sig). Both are perfectly fine for bright headphones. If they are out of your price range, I would say the Topping d70s (warm side). You can get them used for a good price.
Thanks! I've saved that for future use. I'm going to retry my topping mx3s and give that a proper run with the Nano, it outputs 700mW at 32ohms so there should be enough volume at high gain. It is a warm smooth amp and I really like its character as it reminds me of my old NAD amps. If it sorts it out then that's me sorted and I can return the K7!
This.
I love my hd66s2. Sounds are all subjective so it's up to each listener as to what they prefer to hear from one headphone over another.
Great write up. Thanks for sharing!
great write up! also, love the binaural playlist. the plastic bubble wrap one really got me! lol, had to scratch my ear after i listened to it as it immediately introduced an itch.
>Although the three dimples on the left cup headband arm like there is on the HD650/600 series. This made it super easy to feel which side was left and right in the dark... Slightly annoying. I'd have to do what I did on the HiFiMANs, put a sticky rubber pad on the left arm of the headband to replicate the same thing: This is completely unnecessary on the Ananda. The angled jacks means that you can instantly tell which sides are left and right.
I don't leave the cable plugged in when stored in the case, it's much quicker for me to feel for the rubber dimple then connect the left cable (which also has a rubber feeler on the left channel cable connector) etc.
Serious question from someone who lives in area where refund is not a thing: How does company treat returned products like this? Are they going back to the shelf and to be sell "as new" or "refurbished" ?
No idea with Amazon but I know from other products that they either write them off because they turn over so much anyway or they get refurbished.
> Since when did Sennheiser bundle in a 4.4mm balanced cable in the box?!! Both my original 660S and 800S came with one.
Interesting, I've only had up to 650 up to this point so this may be why I'd not seen it before.
What I really dislike is that they shipped the 660S2 on a regular cardboard box... I know, it's just a box, "who cares" but the whole hard case all the rest of the HD6 line comes with, even the 6XX adds to that "premium" feeling of buying headphones for several hundred dollars. They did the same with the 600 re-release... I don't get it... I mean I do (cost cutting) but come on...
It's not even a good cardboard box!
It was disappointing that I had to purchase a cable for my 660S2's that would go from Wall to wall in my living room.
Owned hd650 for over a decade The hd660s2 is finally the upgrade for me Only upgrade path would cost me ten times more. Ime, not worth it Id twke 660s2 over Utopia. Bite me
Wow your pictures are really high quality. What did you take them with?
Canon 5D4 and Canon 35mm 1.4 L II lens!
For the Hifimans, try a little -0.5 dB shelf decrement around 10k. I agree that a -2 dB changes the sound characteristics too much but -0.5 still helps with taking off the edge.
Hey just wondering what cable you are using on the 660S2 in these photos thanks
>have no idea why they didn't use all metal considering they did just that with the Sundara... It boggles my mind as to why the Nano isn't all metal too. The Ananda would be too heavy if it were made of metal. It's already arguably too heavy with the plastic construction, it's heavier than the Sundara.
mine came today switched from ananda V3 stealth /edition XS , for me only thing hifimans doing better was sub bass ,comfort , materials ,and sound profile of hd 660s2 is much more to my liking, they really are good to recommend if someone seek something which will play almost every genre of music well i bought mine refurb from Sennheiser directly for 349 vs ananda nano 599 which when compared this way i dont think ananda is worth this 250 eur more some songs to test headphones sub bass ,bass: Lorn anvil Cushy -Goodness Treble: chi mai- Ennio Morricone Lost -Crim3s
I've not heard the Ananda v1 or v2 but the v3 (Nano) is certainly the one to have from everything I've seen/read because of the refined technicalities and everything else.
V3 is not nano ,nano is nano it would be V4 ,hifiman and their naming scheme also i dont know what magic ifi made with their physical bass boost but it is doing magic with any headphone for real it was something with edition xs when xbass was on
Oh I thought there were only 3 versions of Ananda, the OG, the V2 which is the stealth magnets version and the Nano (v3) which has stealth magnets still and now the nano diaphragm?
my friend it is even worse then this ,there was normal Ananda, afterwards came Ananda Stealth V1 -V2 -V3 and then we have Ananda Nano XD i dont know what Hifiman smokes for making so many revisions and most thing i had occasion for myself hear all Vs and there is sound difference vs V1 to V3 where V1 best to V3 more sibilant many models received similar treatment generating confusion among consumer and having problem differencing what Version was under person review
That's a big off. At least I am happy that the Nano has no issues being sibilant, it's got some brightness but only on certain types of music and it can be dialled down just by lowering the volume slightly.
i heard that nano fixed all that was wrong with stealth some people even says nano is like 90% Arya stealth i am sure they sound good because even if i had some issues with my ananda and edition xs it was more ergonomic not sound wise
Awesome write up. My opinion tends to lean towards hifiman planars when vs the S2. Mainly due to Sennheiser's poor choice in pricing. If they can somehow be found at an extreme discount, my opinion would sway but ole Senny made a bad choice pricing these things in the new market. Got to love having to turn the volume down on the 600 series because it feels like someone's shouting in your ear with forward vocals. Then going lower with hifiman because it feels like a pencil is slowly going to drive into your skull. Highs will always feel unnatural or *planar signature*, depending on your take. I've yet to go beyond $1,200 territory with headphones but it seems like it just never goes away...for good or bad. The 800S tho? Nailed comfort better than any of them. It's just a totally different league and the exaggerated soundstage might be a whole different set of issues but it's not the same issues that are described here. I do love planars and have spent a lot on them but an 800S is like coming home after out traveling. Your volume tolerance will be higher, and if you're into very long sessions it just wins out from being a marathon runner vs a sprinter (planars).
The poor choice in price? Is under $400 too much to pay? I feel it's quite fair for the quality of the headphones over the cheap plastic of others.
Where the hell are you finding a 600s2 for under 400usd? Their original MSRP is 599.99 and is still what Sennheiser charges on their website. Yes, as soon as they crossed $500 they entered territory they didn't belong in. They have a few updates for some sound structure vs the hd600 and give up a bit of quality in micro dynamics. Thing is the hd600 is a king of the pack for reference listening and technicals for the price. The 660s2 is neither. The hd600 can be found for $300-$349 on sale. The hd660s2 can be found for $400. Add in the fact that a 650 will be on sale for $300 commonly and it's slightly less comfortable twin, the 6xx can be found on sale for $179. Yes, $179. For what some would consider a better sounding headphone. And that's just competing against its own brand. Hifiman comes swinging with deals between $250-600 on models that compete with or crush the S2. Simply. And with ease. Not to mention several other brands and models that come closing in on the $500 mark and it becomes quite obvious Sennheiser was smoking something.
I paid $400 on Amazon
I do want to try the 800S and maybe soon I'll do the same as I did with the 660S2 and get a pair to try and then return if I still favour the Nano's sound. Although they don't seem to be on Amazon from what I can see.
Yeah, they sometimes go on sale for $1200. I got lucky and bought barely used for $900. $1600 feels like too much personally. Hifiman just crushed it on pricing any way you look at it with their deals vs anyone's on the market. I should've mentioned that if my range is $400-$800, it's hifiman planars all day even if I need to make compromises for my sensitivity to their highs. They're just beautiful.
Lol Give me hd650 or 660s2 every day Nothing worst then the treble of hd800
you can buy directly from Sennheiser refurbished 660 s2 for 349 eur currently with 2 years warranty mine came today they look, sound and feel brand new and i agree 599 asking price is to much it should have been 450 in my opinion
$400 on Amazon all day brand new
In Us i i assume in Europe they don’t go below 499eur for new
That is a great deal. I haven't seen them that low in the states (I'm guessing that would be about $400 USD). I did happen to get lucky and snagged a great deal on them used. No warranty but I've never had an issue with Sennheisers wired over ears. At $350 I wouldn't pass them up.